Apr 27
Chelsea 2-1 Man Utd: So, Is This harakiri In Progress?
I’ve been trying my best to write a match report for the past hour or so. I bet this is going to be a bad one. It’s going to be incoherent, but it has to be done. So here goes…
Manchester United look set to gifting the title to Chelsea after being in the lead all this while. Sure, we still are in control of our destiny realistically. But we have to beat West Ham and Wigan to ensure we win the title. Also there is the small matter of a Barcelona side that needs to be seen off at OT on Tuesday; not too much time to recover one suspects, considering the Spanish giants rested six of the players in their weekend loss to Deportivo.
We, ran around for 90 minutes on Wednesday in Camp Nou and did an equal amount of running around yesterday. Trust me, to win on Tuesday — and next weekend — would require a little more than a grit of the teeth. It’s not going to be easy, but, to use a cliche, when have we done things the easy way?
Chelsea were the first to get off the blocks today. A midfield of Ballack and Essien went on a rampage, but we weren’t unduly troubled as Vidic and Rio along with Silvestre — who was deputising for Evra — and Brown kept the Chavs at bay. But I think, Vidic’s injury had some part to play in the bigger scheme of things for the rest of the game. Drogba’s knee knocked him off and Fergie had to reshuffle his back four, bringing on Hargreaves at RB and pushing Brown to the centre.
While Chelsea were on the ascendancy it appeared that the reds had done just about enough to keep the score level before half time, only for Ballack to head home in injury time.
The second half was much better though and some urgency kicked in to United. But I could never really see how they were going to score as Nani continued to frustrate and Giggs, well, he just doesn’t have the pace to break on the counter, anymore. It was a blunder by Carvalho that gifted us the goal as Rooney, for once, put a one on one into the net.
We continued to press, although Avram Grant — to his credit — did look to attack by sending on the right subs. However, despite all of Chelsea’s efforts, they didn’t look like scoring until the penalty. I thought it was harsh, but I guess we have been having a strange relationship with penalties over the past couple of weeks haven’t we? Two weren’t given against Boro, one (I think) at Ewood Park, Ronaldo’s failure to convert one at the Nou Camp, Marquez bundling Ron over inside the area and today Ballack wrestling Ronaldo in the penalty area, rugby style. The Carrick one is not something I’d want to whine over — it’s just that the word penalty isn’t ringing anything positive for us at the moment. It was unfortunate. Ballack scoring the penalty was as certain as the sun rising in the east tomorrow.
Fans have blamed Fergie for showing too little respect for Chelsea. Some have called his side selection as baffling. OK let’s get some perspective.
I know, it may have seemed a little arrogant of Fergie to not start Ronaldo. But I thought either of Ronaldo or Rooney was going to be rested. They have been running at full tilt for many weeks now and they seem like they are on their last legs. Perhaps Ronaldo starting upfront instead of Rooney might not have been a bad idea either. But I really can’t fault the gaffer too much on this count. I also thought he got his back four right.
The main point of contention is central midfield. Anderson, Carrick and Fletcher have all shown the stomach for the biggest games this season. In fact Fletch was among the better players yesterday. Scholes, on current form, doesn’t have the legs to play two games in a week. And the same could be said of Hargo. So I don’t know what our alternatives could have been, really.
You see, it’s easy to blame the manager’s team selection for these things but I think there has been a bigger problem that has been swept under the rug since we were already on top of the league till now. The rot was evident to me in Camp Nou where we failed to keep the ball for more than 30% of the time. United are a different team when they start to respect their opponents. They seem unsure, almost confused, in this unfamiliar role where hanging on to a lead or settling for a draw is the sole aim. Fergie’s mentality has been questionable more than his selections. Clearly he was willing to settle for a draw in Camp Nou as well as at the Bridge. While we escaped from Barcelona with a draw — although it was reasonably justifiable in Europe — we weren’t quite so lucky yesterday. And that, I think, is what could cost all the good work we’ve done till now.
Arsenal went through a horror week where they faced Liverpool, us and Liverpool, again, and effectively ended their dreams of winning any trophy. We are going through a tough couple of weeks ourselves: Blackburn, Barca, Chelsea and Barca. If we get through Barca with a win and manage to beat West Ham next weekend, we can hope to smile. And for a start, let’s practice “hold onto the feckin’ ball for 1 minute at a stretch while passing inside the opposition half.”
But till then I will be biting chunks off my nails.
PS: I am still positive that we’ll retain the title despite the negativity. It’s just that it’s been a while since we won a game over the past couple of weeks.
Related items from Red Rants:- Featured Video: Ronaldo - A Mini-Documentary
- Did Fergie Bottle It?
- Barcelona 0-0 Manchester United - Much better than last season
- Rossi Scores Two in Two Games
- Links of the Day
Tags: Match Reports
April 27th, 2008 at 10:20
squad selection was right but negative football was our undoing.hope fergie realises his mistakes
April 27th, 2008 at 10:23
The thing is, our lads have run out of steam and to be honest, it’s 3 games too early. I thought our tactics at the Nou Camp were spot on and Fergie’s logic is that if Barcelona can’t score against us, then what chance do Chelsea have?
The game at OT will be very different to the Nou Camp and I’m sure we will go all guns blazing…
The game at Stamford was disappointing to say the least and not only are we not keeping the ball for more than a minute, we’re content to see Chelsea to keep it for 20 minutes. We can moan all we want, but it wasn’t just the team selection….it was also the tactics. Our team wasn’t wired to play negative football and we’re used to having the ball for most of the game, not sitting back and letting them have a go.
April 27th, 2008 at 11:18
The same thing happened this time last year. Sure the lads ran out of steam, and substitutes, but against both Milan and Chelsea in the Cup Final, we saw United playing the Chelsea way - Fergie’s current away strategy, it seems. That style just does not sit comfortably with the attacking nature of our squad. How many of us at those two games thought ‘I rather lose 3-1 playing the United way than meekly surrendering with a whimper’.
Too much respect for the opposition implies lack of belief in our own attacking ability in my eyes.
April 27th, 2008 at 11:33
Red Ranter:
Look at the results of the last 5 games. Escaping with a lucky win against Arsenal, scraping a draw at Middlesbro’, scraping a draw at Blackburn, being made to look inept by Barcelona as United could hardly string 2 passes together (I heard it described as United being “unable to pass wind”, and now being outgunned and outpowered by Chelsea.
In terms of performances, it’s as if the team is on a downward curve. The quality of performances have become progressively poorer culminating in the defeat against Chelsea. But let’s not forget that having to play the 3 most important games of the season in just 6 days would have stretched even United’s greatest teams - which this United team is not.
But there is no reason to despair (at least, not yet). It will all rest on one game on Tuesday night. Knock out Barcelona and the boys will have positive vibes and lose some of the nerves which have been apparent as they come within touching distance of the prizes. Lose, and well…
I think the team has been confused, caught up in a tactical fog of Fergie’s making. Nobody likes to lose, but what has been so disappointing has been the poor quality of United’s performances. It’s baffling that United famed for their ability to keep the ball made Barcelona, and Chelsea in the first half, look like footballing Gods. For that matter Arsenal also passed United off the park in the first half at Old Trafford. What the hell is going on? Has Ferguson now got a team of bottlers or is Ferguson producing a tactical fog? Why all of a sudden has the way the team play been changed? Or is it that this team is not nearly as good as we all believed?
Too often over the last 3 years in the really big end-of-season games against the big sides away from Old Trafford, United have disappointed. Arsenal FA Cup final (2005); Chelsea FA cup final (2007); Chelsea at Stamford Bridge (2006, 2008); Milan (2007); and I would put that performance against Barcelona in the same category. I maintain that 0-0 at the Nou Camp was a bad result, when we have a United team which could play so much better. It’s the same as a 2-1 defeat.
Whatever happens, in the summer Ferguson must get a couple of forwards. Louis Saha is finished. United had to improvise up front against both Barcelona and Chelsea and did so to very poor effect. They needed the option of a central striker (any central striker would have done) to hold the ball up and bring the midfield into play. They had none.
April 27th, 2008 at 11:35
its time for united players and fans to stand up and be counted our destiny is still in our hands whats done is done move on keep the faith
April 27th, 2008 at 11:58
The next 3 results will define our season 3 wins we’re in for an historic season anything less and we really need something to change maybe a little rotation in the defence we’re at a little loss with vidic in and out if we’ve got the players lets use em, definitely need a striker and maybe a winger, giggs nani and park are ok but we need a ronaldo standard winger i know there are not many around but definitely someone who can change the game off the bench. Next year with 7 subs that should make the team a lot stronger, out of which we need 2 strikers, 2 defenders, 2 midfielders and not 2 defenders, 4 midfielders on the bench! Watch on tuesday it’ll be tevez and rooney ronaldo on the pitch with giggs nani oshea fletcher pique and anderson on the bench we need a benzema or someone like that!
April 27th, 2008 at 12:09
I think the game against barca needs a change in formation!
VDS
Brown, Ferdinand, Pique/Vidic, Evra
Ronaldo, Hargreaves, Scholes/Anderson, Carrick, Nani/Park
Tevez
I know you’re thinking why tevez and not rooney we seen rooney this weekend was injured & tired he needs to come on as a impact sub tevez was rested and ronaldo needs to go back to midfield he’s scored the majority of his goals from there let him attack messi! also this formation can double up from a 451 to a 433 or even a 442 with ronaldo up front with tevez and hargo on the right and nani/park on the left we need to attack for 20 mins to set the pace of this game i really wanna see the double and i can only see this formation really working. dominate the midfield with pace and skill and barca will be ours for the taking!
April 27th, 2008 at 12:30
I think the problem is exhaustion. We seem to have lost the ability to counter attack effectively, which used to be our main strength. In the last two games we win possession, it is in our instincts to look for a forward ball, but all we have is an isolated Rooney or Ronaldo up front.
Having said that defensively we are still strong.
In many ways Man U are beginning to remind me of England, becoming a long ball team with no real attacking impetus or creativity. We just seem to have lost that spark and are developing a siege mentality instead of playing free flowing football.
Also with Ronaldo shunted to the centre we have stopped attacking down the wings, which always used to be fertile for us, as our full backs can overlap. We just play through the centre, which does not work as teams like Barca and Chelsea play three men in the middle.
Man U have ALWAYS attacked in numbers, which is why a safety first approach does not work for us.
April 27th, 2008 at 13:00
how long is saha out for?
April 27th, 2008 at 13:31
Ive gotta say that id prefer Chelseas fixtures over ours right now, a wednesday fixture against a liverpool team we really shouldnt ever be losing to, especially with their European ‘Fortress Anfield’ already overcome , an away fixture at Newcastle, who despite a recent run of form are just one of those teams who when they look like putting in a blinder of a performance end up folding to teams like chelsea and finally an easy (if were honest) match against a desperate bolton side. Sure there are some potential stumbling blocks for chelsea but consider that we have to play West Ham at the end of season YET AGAIN and we all know what they did to us in 94/95 and what theyve been doing to us in recent times.
April 27th, 2008 at 13:38
all fears will be extinguished when Chelsea draw at newcastle
April 27th, 2008 at 14:14
newcastle on form could nick a point against chelsea and bolton fighting for survival
April 27th, 2008 at 15:34
Pictures from the post game fight which the FA will now be looking into. Sky sports news had a video of it but it hasn’t appeared on the internet.
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/article1095143.ece?slideshowPopup=true&articleId=1095143
April 27th, 2008 at 16:11
Great article, summed up my feelings perfectly. I still don’t think that Ronaldo should have been left on the bench though. Like it or not, when we lose him we lose a huge part of our threat. And not bringing on Tevez was a mistake. It was not Fergie’s best game, to say the least.
I’d be surprised if we didn’t win next weekend, especially if we beat Barca, which I expect us to. You make agood point about respect though. I feel that that’s why we lost so heavily at the San Siro. But yesterday Fergie should have set us up to go out and play very fast, very pressing football. Hassle Chelsea, because we’re still not capable of dominating big away games.
April 27th, 2008 at 16:16
park should have gone in there and jackie chan’ed them all, tekken style
April 27th, 2008 at 16:36
Good post dude. The difference being that you aren’t whining like some of the stupid red devil friends of mine.
April 27th, 2008 at 17:05
Sorry, I disagree. Fergie should have played his strongest side at Chelsea. How pleased Avram & co were to see Ronaldo on the bench. It gave them an immedate boost. The point is, we were so close to the title (and of course we may still win it) so seeing off Chelsea should ahve been the first priority. Let the Barca game take care of itself. We won the treble in 1999 by taking each game as it comes. Tinkering with the side wikth nobody really sure who they will be playing next to in each game is over doing the rotation bit. With four games to go (including yesterday) - maybe five the players must see it through. Resting key players for key matches won’t help the cause. We now neeed a morale and a confidence boosting win against Barca to get us back on track.
April 27th, 2008 at 17:17
Red Ranter; I know how you feel. I thought about doing player reviews but I am just to gutted and upset to be objective and fair. I also don’t need the grief from others about why I was so harsh to some of the lads. Actually as a team I didn’t think we played that badly but I will go over some of my major concerns if just to spark some debate.
1. Why does it seem that over the past three weeks we only play our attacking and inventive game when we are behind or trying to win the game after the 75th minute? We generally sit back and sleep walk through the first half of every game. Where is the urgency and hunger with this team? Have the tactics totally taken the zing out of the team or are we just tired beyond belief.
2. It took 30 games for our defense to give up just 15 goals in league play and now we have given up 6 goals in the last 6 games. Not an alarming increase but still one goal a game as opposed to a half goal a game.
3. How can we be rotating so many players when there are so few games left, all of them so vital and all of them requiring our very best players? I’d rather field my very best possible team and if they lose because of exhaustion, I can use fatigue and only fatigue for my excuse. Although he played well, players like Fletcher and others like Silvestre, Park, and O’Shea should not be starting games of such importance.
4. Other than the Barcelona game which I tolerated and even understood, we need to start playing Manchester United style football and start taking it to our BPL opposition. My God! Is there anything more depressing than watching the best team in the league conform to playing in to the hands of the opposition? Why has Fergie become such an incredible chicken shit? Blackburn, Middlesbrough and even Chelsea should not be dictating the pace and the style of play. If we are better, then we should prove it. Instead we wait until we are behind to mount a real attack with urgency to break down the opponent who by that time is playing ten men behind the ball. And yet we still score goals that late and create incredible opportunities. This only tells me one thing. That if we played with our regular style, flair and pace from the opening whistle, we would knock teams out completely because they could not cope against that kind of relentless blitzkrieg. Unrealistic? Perhaps but I do believe that Fergie has gone too far in showing the opposition too much respect. The reason for this I believe is that he does not have the full confidence in Rooney and Tevez to finish chances off and by attacking so, we may leave ourselves open to counters.
5. It is clear that Fergie has become gun shy and his team is trying hard to recover their eye of the tiger. They have lost the drive to kill off opponents early. It’s usually us who score late in the first half. Instead, Blackburn and Chelsea did it to us. That’s a typical breakdown in concentration and discipline that our opponents usually suffer from. I can’t even say we are cautious either because we are giving up more goals than when we were aggressive.
6. Fergie has gone soft and too mellow in his old age. Instead of yelling at players, using hair dryers and kicking boots around, he now takes his wrath out on referees who guilty or not, are not going to take to his verbal abuse kindly. And over the last month it has shown. We rarely get a 50/50 call and our stars are being mauled with no justice to be had. Stop bitching about the refs and start telling players like Ronaldo to stop being so annoying and animated after he gets fouled. This only works to enrage referees more. Stop making childish excuses when you should have gone out there yesterday and given an overrated and highly unimaginative team a good thumping. If ever Chelsea were ripe for the picking, it was yesterday. I’d rather lose 4-3 to them knowing that I came out and tried to outscore them than in the manner we actually did lose to them. We let let there best player beat us with a header when everyone on the planet knows Ballack is the best heading midfielder in the world if not the best header period. How could we let him get a chance like that? How come we let a team that had difficulty scoring a goal if their life depended on it beat us? We were a team that has score way more goals and shown much more flair style and attacking prowess all season despite being thin at striker and having no Ballack-like midfielder that could score.
It’s clear that the wheels are coming off and now I am worried about Tuesday too because unlike us, Barca was able to rest 6 starters this weekend. We couldn’t because we lacked the killer instinct to take out far inferior opposition like Middlesbrough, Man City at home and Blackburn. People talk about the points that Chelsea and Liverpool have dropped to the other big three teams. I say better to look at the points United have dropped this season to the Bolton’s, Middlesbrough’s, West Hams etc. This race should have been over weeks ago. In fairness, Arsenal should have been our only concern. For all our greatness, we still have lost more games than Chelsea and only lately have we been settling for draws. I said it early in the season. You should not lose more than three games a year in the highly competitive BPL. Arsenal and Chelsea have had recent seasons where they lost zero and just one game respectively. So Fergie thinks we can lose 5 or 6 and win this thing? Man that’s tough to do. There is so little room for error. I also remember saying that our shitty start to the season where we were giving away points to tosser teams could come back and really haunt us. So ask me then why we start and finish a season so poorly? I’m at a loss to understand and even more so, I just don’t accept it or tolerate it. It’s bloody well unacceptable. But then again, after we blow the season and hang our heads in shame, will we finally realize the reason for our demise was the problem I yelled about all season and got slagged for because many of you felt I was overreacting. That we never had a true striker who could make the difference. And in January, Fergie like Wenger did nothing about it. And they call those two wise men and experienced managers. Anybody with half a brain could see that our lack of depth up front was going to kill us at the end. If we end up losing the league as well as the Champions League, this will go down as the worst Summer for Man United and it’s supporters in recent memory. It will be a very hard pill to swallow.
Yes I am being a fatalist because I know how hard a time we have against West Ham and I do not look forward to going to the JJB and playing on that horrible pitch against a good defensive team that will be hungry to kill us off while making their season. Sure we are more than capable of winning our last two games but on our present lack of form, I seriously have my doubts. Not with Barcelona getting in our way. Hopefully Liverpool will take the spunk out of Chelsea enough to have them drop points at Newcastle but I rather doubt it. One thing that Chelsea are masters of is winning games ugly and by 1-0. So is the BIG CHOKE on or am I ranting about nothing?
April 27th, 2008 at 18:01
Grognard, to address your many points:
1. I completely agree.
2. Ditto.
3. Our squad has been vaunted as our “best ever”. To not have faith in them at the times in the season when squad players truely can be the difference would be foolish in the extreme. If you look at the game yesterday, Fletcher and Silvestre were two of our best players, and it wasn’t O’Shea’s fault that he was the wrong man to bring on. The point of a good squad is to use it.
4. We were playing Chelsea at a ground where they have not been beaten since early 2004. Although I wouldhave liked to see us go at it more positively, SAF’s caution was understandable. It was his unwillingness to go for the win late on that truly cost us.
5. Completely agree with you. Something has gone mentally from our squad. Perhaps the proximity to greatness, and the real chances at the Premiership and Champions League has thrown something in their collective consciousness.
6. Hmm. I’m don’t really know whether to agree with you or not on this. If I’m honest I’m not entirely sure what your point is. Has Fergie gone soft? Do we need a goalscoring midfielder? Why was Ballack unmarked? Why did we set up defensively? So I’ll answer all four: No, badly, he lost Flethcer and Brown failed to pick him up, becuase Chelsea are very, very good at home.
And to your point about a January striker. How many players bought in January have an impact that season? Very few. Only at the midtable clubs where quality is more evident can a player have such instant impact without getting settled. Look at Evra and Vidic, two of our best plyaers. They were shite when we bought them. So, in conclusion I think you have some valid points but you’re getting a little too negative. We’re still top of the table, and the Premiership is still in our hands: two wins and it’s ours. Chelsea still have Newcastle and Bolton, which look to be tougher games than ours. And as for Barcelona, they are a good team, as they showed on Wednesday, but they will have to perform a miracle to get through at the Theatre of Dreams. We still hold all the cards, and if anyone can win us these competitions, it’s Sir Alex Ferguson.
April 27th, 2008 at 18:14
Just some own comments wanted to express. I believe ManU will win the coming games unless Sir Ferguson decides to keep using Giggs and Scholes in the lineup. He should realize that ManU was having tough times after Scholes was back or Giggs was in the starting lineup. I do respect them, but these two men are getting old and their responses are slower than before. On the other hand, Sir Ferguson should also realize that Ronald’s scoring power has been stopped for several games and this implies that ManU’s winning power is getting weaker. The current midfielders are definitely having problem although they have many players including Carrick, Hargeaves, Anderson, Scholes, Nani, Fletcher, Giggs and Scholes. None of them is a proper player for midfield especially Giggs and Scholes. They cannot playe for 90mins. Anyway, let’s looking forward to see Sir Ferguson’s decision.
April 27th, 2008 at 18:21
I think the reason for this situation is that for the past few weeks before the dip, we were on a roll - we were solid, we got the lucky breaks, our passing was unstoppable, people were thinking it was a foregone conclusion that we would win the league and maybe do the double (us fans included). This led to complacency and I believe that’s the sole reason we’re in this mess now. That is why Fergie supported the team even when we played shite against Boro and Bburn, believing that we were good enough to pull of a win when needed.
Well, the time has come, it’s now or never. Do we have the balls to show we’re as good as we think we are? This tuesday at OT is judgement day for our season. I still believe that we can go ahead and win it. But the way our luck has been recently, I wouldn’t be surprised if we battered them the first half but they still nicked a goal at 44min and went ahead 0-1 into the break. What then?
April 27th, 2008 at 18:50
http://tinyurl.com/633n85
I feel the same - Fergie’s going negative on us at a very bad time. This is not a risk worth taking at this stage.
April 27th, 2008 at 19:10
I give up! I just do not understand why giggs is still in that team. Fergie has lost the plot… I don’t get this mentality of going away in europe and soaking up all the pressure. I mean if Barcelona come to Old trafford and score we might as well kiss the champions league bye bye.
Why he took off Anderson and left Fletcher on is hard to comprehend.Playing against your main rivals their is no justifiable reason for you not to play your strongest team(especially when you are only 3 points ahead of them). It is very hard to be optimistic.. ihate to say this but i don’t see things getting better. What a horrible week.
April 27th, 2008 at 19:26
I’m usually optimistic even when things are bleak.That is if I feel we are playing our game.However,optimism deserted me these past 3 weeks.Why?We threw our game in the bin and are trying 2 play like Lazio or Liverpool.It is embarrassing 2 be dominated by Arsenal at OT and act as if we are the away team.Then we are sloppy against Boro always passing backwards and sideways.We do even worse vs Blackburn.But I have 2 say the most disappointing was the game at Barca.Others say it was a good defensive performance and great result.Really?Can anyone explain 2 me how a 0-0 at the Nou Camp is a good result.Especially considering that the Nou camp is the easiest place 2 score as an away team.Then yesterday.It was set 2 happen.We simply deserved 2 lose.Saf’s negative tactics have put us in this position so don’t blame the players who must be as confused as we are.
April 27th, 2008 at 19:35
Grognard-It is interesting that u think we should be playing our style.You called the “perfomance”at Barca a “defensive masterclass” and u thought 0-0 was a good result.Was it not then logical 2 apply such a strategy against Chelsea were we lost hence u are ranting?Please enlighten if possible.
April 27th, 2008 at 19:52
Michael-The fact that Chelsea have not lost at SB 4 a century has nothing 2 do with us.So how do we break that record?By being overly cautious?Those facts are constantly thrown 2 scare and obviously because Saf is a big game coward the tactic works on him
April 27th, 2008 at 19:54
antsBoy: Nail, head, bang! Summed it up perfectly.
April 27th, 2008 at 20:24
April 27th, 2008 at 21:15
Oh isn’t the PFA awards tonight? Funny eh, most likely our golden boy will sweep the awards, but who cares for awards if you have a trophyless season.
April 27th, 2008 at 22:04
It looks like that son of a bitch groundsman at stamford bridge has provoked and then punched Evra.It is very much evident in the pictures that SKY have.I hope that the FA charge chelski and deduct 3 points and the title will be ours….But the assholes at the FA hate manchester united and i don’t expect any favors from them..Moreover I think we’ll get a fine…
Does anybody else thinks that there is some foul play involved seeing the number of decisions that have gone against us recently? That mother fucker Abramovic has a lot of money to waste and i seriously want some bank accounts to be scrutinised properly.He may use any means to win back the title.We were denied clear cut penalty appeals at BORO,B’BURN and CHELSEA..the one given against us was harsh to say the least and moreover it was given by the linesman who somehow seemed hellbent on depriving us scoring oppurtunities by previously giving some dodgy offside decisions against us.
It happens in ITALY and maybe now in the EPL too…{just my thoughts more than anything else}
Any news on Vidic’ and Rooney’s injury status?Will they be fit enough to start on tuesday? It’s a massive game and we could do without any major setbacks on the injury front…..
April 27th, 2008 at 22:08
Panks, it seems like you are looking for excuses e.g referees but I don’t understand why
We will win the league and there won’t be any need for excuses. We have been screwed over by the referees just as much as everyone else, and probably less than Arsenal in fairness.
April 27th, 2008 at 22:09
United will come through this ‘blip’. Against Barcelona we’ll see the old United. If they are good enough, they’ll win. If they can’t beat a mis-firing Barcelona, then they don’t deserve to contest the final. In football, as in life, quite often you get only what you deserve.
But I think there is one thing we are all forgetting. Physically and mentally it is very difficult to play 3 tough away games across Europe, all in the space of 7 days. With Barcelona to come, that will be 4 games in 10 days. It borders on the inhuman. SAF has been doing his best to husband his resources. Perhaps, on reflection he hasn’t done too badly.
Defeat against Chelsea is far from a disaster. There is a reason why United, Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool are called “the Big Four”. That is because the teams are pretty closely matched in ability, and on any given day any one of the Big Four could beat the other. Let’s put a line under it, and move on. United still have the best head to head record this season of any of the Big Four. They took 6 points from a possible 6 against Liverpool, 4 from 6 against Arsenal, and 3 from 6 against Chelsea although their head to head record against them is superior (scored 3 conceded 2). Those are pretty impressive statistics.
Tuesday night: Barcelona. All I ask, is for United to play with style, energy and panache. I think they will. What they have to do is now simple and clear-cut. Win or die. No room for any more tactical fogs.
Come on Fergie, set our boys free: “Let slip, and unleash the dogs of war”!
April 27th, 2008 at 22:14
Ok.Henry says the atmosphere at OT is poor and says Anfield is incredible.I know he is just winding us up but there may be some truth in it.So this is an open invitation 2 anyone who may find their way 2 OT on Tuesday.Pliz scream your lungs out until you feel nuclear atomic vibrations in the city of Manchester.The team needs u at your catastrophic best.Pass the word around.I’ll do my bit from my part of the planet
April 27th, 2008 at 22:15
United should just play a 4-4-2
April 27th, 2008 at 22:15
Yes Conor u may be right but don’t u think that we have got more decisions against us than for in recent times specially when those russian bastards have come back in the championship race…Something fishy i think?
April 27th, 2008 at 22:16
Michael; To clarify a few points I made that you brought up. First I am all for squad depth and playing all the lads because it gives them the chance to contribute as well as keeps our starters fresh. However, crunch time at the end of the season is not the time to do it. He should have sat Ronaldo, Rooney, Scholes and others down over month ago for a game or two so that they would be fresher right now.
Chelsea are despite their record a shadow of their former selves and although they may be unbeaten at home, they have had tough times against far easier competition than us at home as well, they play like a collection of stars, not like a team. They have flow, pace or specific approach to their game. Bottom line is they are poorly managed. Unlike Barcelona and who I have tremendous respect for Chelsea at home at this present time should have been a 2-0 win for us. They are hard to score on but we should never have conceded such an easy goal to Ballack. The penalty is also debatable too but it still counts. These guys had a hard time breaking down the worst teams in the league all season. Why now of all times to they play the game of the season for themselves? Frank Lampard’s mother? I think not. I think it’s because Fergie has gone soft and he doesn’t manage and motivate the troops like he used too. to be honest I think he enjoys the game now more than he used to. The days of screaming and punishing players extremely for poor play or insubordination seems to be a thing odf the past. I could be wrong but that’s how it is looking to me from where i stand.
Finally, regarding the striker controversy from January. I was not expecting Fergie to buy an Anelka, or even a Gomez or Huntelaar. I would have settled for a number 3 or 4 striker in quality for the purposes of depth. No depth at that position has really killed off the club’s mojo. Buying a player like Manucho who was ineligible to play for us was nice but I would much have preferred a Henrik Larrson type. Look what a difference he made to our title chances last year, even if it was a short time. It allowed us to rest Rooney and Ronaldo a little more.
April 27th, 2008 at 22:26
PFA Team of the Year:
GK: James
RB: Sagna
CB: Ferdinand
CB: Vidic
LB: Clichy
RM: Ronaldo
CM: Fabregas
CM: Gerrard
LM: Young
CF: Adebayor
CF: Torres
April 27th, 2008 at 22:31
Regardless of what happens against Barca, caution will be well and truely thrown to the wind for the last two fixtures…that is Fergie’s way…I don’t expect too many back passes and slow , slow, slow build up play against West Ham or Wigan.
Lets hope for a little luck and no flukey early goals from the opposition…and no holding on to 1-0 leads!
And please no Carrick and Scholes in a 2 man midfield…if I see that in starting lineup in these last two fixtures I will cry
I want to see wide play with Nani and Ronaldo, cross the ball in, shoot, get deflections, make them nervous…none of this getting 2/3 of the way down the pitch then slowly passing it back to the VDS, just cross the thing…who cares if the forwards are short, pick up the knock downs, get corners…..
Rant over
April 27th, 2008 at 22:35
I’m a neutral guys and I have to say that Chelsea bullied United out of the three points. Forget about the penalties. Think about: the “accidental” Drogba knee which concussed Vidic; Drogba taking a swing at Carrick; Carvalho elbowing Rooney in the head long before the ball arrived…Chelsea has recently used the same kind of fouling football with success against Arsenal and Liverpool. The only thing I have to say about Saturday’s match is: Roy Keane. That’s what was missing. As I said, I’m a neutral and I’m committed to the “beautiful game” but it’s beginning to look like Zidane had it right. And Keane had it right: talent needs to be protected with force if necessary. Because teams like Chelsea are just gratuitously using force - and they’re stealing games where perhaps they wouldn’t if refs were doing their jobs. And btw, I now officially hate Chelsea.
April 27th, 2008 at 22:36
I hope we play all front 4 against Barca in free roles. That will destroy them! I am not too worried about the Premier League, we will surely win against West Ham and Wigan. West Ham is our bogey side away from Old Trafford, last season we had nothing to play for. If United try to win, they will! And Wigan is in the bottom 7, we should manage to win there. I am confident that Chelsea will lose points against Newcastle and maybe against Bolton too, so if we just win against Barca(mantal boost) and West Ham, I think we will be Champions!
April 27th, 2008 at 22:38
antsBoy; I agree about complacency. But what is to blame the most for our complacent attitude is Fergie and Queiroz having gone soft on the training ground and in the dressing room. Fergie from 1994 would never have blamed refs for our demise. He would have brought out the hair dryer. Like I said earlier He’s having too much fun nurturing his pet projects namely Ronaldo, Anderson and Nani and paying honor and homage to his old guard in Giggs and Scholes that he has forgotten about aggressive and decisive strategy. He also is to blame because he know he dropped the ball big time in January. Right now we are a team without real strikers. We are playing 4-6-0 for crying out loud. It’s a bloody disgrace.
Conor; Let me be clear about this. The Barcelona game was a master class in defense. But I was not happy he chose to play that style. It is against the team’s nature to do so but he also realized that we are presently not strong up front to put together a winning attack, while opening up our defense for the likes of Eto, Iniesta, Bojan and the great Messi to exploit. We had to play it tight at the Nou Camp and then go all out at OT. Now Chelsea on the other hand is a completely different kettle of fish. They may possess a lot of talent but they are disorganized, fighting amongst themselves, lacking quality form and are manged by a complete muppet. Now why should Fergie pay those misfits any kind of respect. No we should have rolled in to the Bridge like we did at Highbury two years ago when we attacked the Arse and took it to them 4-2. That was a team that attacked and handled an early deficit with calm. We showed them far less respect than what Fergie showed the Chelsea clown act on Saturday. No way should we have come out of that game as losers. No fucking way. Today United players and coaches should hang their collective heads in shame because for me the Chelsea game wasn’t just the season, but the Super Bowl.
The satisfaction of watching the Blue’s supporter sulking and booing Grant while we do a victory lap was something I was looking forward to much more than the CL. Why, because beating those guys at their park after four seasons undefeated would have been the “SPECIAL ONE”. Fergie’s caution and ibn this case cowardice went a game too far in my opinion. And now fully expect it to cost us the season. We will lay an egg against either West Ham or Chelsea. A win and a tie will not be good enough. Chelsea will win at Newcastle despite what many think. They can now finally smell it. We might get by West Ham our bogey team but then again we might not. I also do not look forward to meeting Stevie Bruce’s much improved and very good defensive side at the lumpy JJB. On the other hand, I will be shocked if we lose to Barcelona. Another team that’s ripe for the picking with us playing as the home side. Despite everything I have said about our domestic prospects I think we can win the game. Ronaldo is key and of course a healthier Rooney is vital. So yes, negative Grognard is back. But I can only be honest to my self and call it as I see it and as it makes me feel.
April 27th, 2008 at 22:52
Regarding the PFA Team of the Year that JB posted. Does anybody iout there really feel that Clichy as good as he is had a better year than Evra? And why is a 3rd place club have more players than either of the co leaders combined?
My GFA Team of the Year would be;
JAMES
SAGNA
RIO
VIDIC
EVRA
RONALDO
FABREGAS
BALLACK
TORRES
ADEBAYOR
Ballack may be a surprise to many of you but he is the main reason why Chelsea are where they are. Once he came back and was played regularly, the team managed to do better despite themselves. And for a midfielder, he scored a lot of big goals and showed proper leadership unlike Gerrard who is overrated as a leader and who scored most of his goals in blowout games. To also clear what may be a controversy here. I am not showing bias. Ballack is my favorite player along with Riquleme. Yes I love him but I hate the fact he left my beloved Bayern for that shit heap in London. He has been in my doghouse ever since. Regardless of my love for Team Germany, United is my club team of choice and he burned us yesterday and me personally with his two goals. He will have some explaining to do when the season’s up. How dare he! Then again we had a chance to sign him and blew it because we never offered as much as Chelsea. How good do you all think we would have been with his prowling in the box and quality passing and free kicks?
April 27th, 2008 at 23:02
Our boy gets the PFA award again. No surprise there. (Fabregas gets young PFA player)
http://www.teamtalk.com/football/story/0,16368,1765_3486070,00.html
April 27th, 2008 at 23:05
Grognard: Keep in mind that the team was voted for back in January/February and that Ballack missed a large part of the season prior to Christmas. I agree with Evra/Clichy but overall the team seems a reasonable enough selection.
I have also heard Ronaldo has won POTY with Fabregas as YPOTY, but there is no confirmation on that as yet.
April 27th, 2008 at 23:09
JB; I wasn’t aware that the voting goes back that far so thanks for clearing that up for me. But that brings up the question why? With March, April and May still to come I think that the voting is premature for such an honor. Also, How can Ronaldo win the POTY and not win the YPOTY award too if he is still eligible for it? It seems rather ridiculous don’t you think?
April 27th, 2008 at 23:26
Grognard: The honest answer is that I don’t know. IMHO the system has just been carried on from sometime ago when it was more difficult to collate the votes from all the clubs. IIRC the POTY/YPOTY vote is open to any player so voting is across all the divisions, making gathering the results a large enough undrtaking. However in this day and age you would have expected the PFA to setup some kind of online voting system. Incidentally the football writer’s award is voted for much later in the year.
As for the Ronaldo issue I presume the logic from players is that they don’t like voting for the same player for both awards, particulary when it is two years running. Also I would say many people don’t regard Ronaldo as a young plaer anymore.
April 28th, 2008 at 0:09
Tell me, if ronaldo is considered better than Fabregas in PFA POTY… then how is he not better than Fabregas in the young POTY, if both are nominated?
Obviously its done not to gives the same player 2 awards…
April 28th, 2008 at 0:17
Yup, it’s almost laughable
They CANNOT have a proper excuse for this!
April 28th, 2008 at 1:53
Yeah, ridiculous about Fabregas for young player. But he is three years younger, I guess. How Evra isn’t in that team I have no idea. And Rooney! I understand that Adebayor and Torres have had good seasons, but Torres has only scored 3 away goals in the league! And Adebayor hasn’t scoreda legitimate goal for months. Rooney, even while notscoring, puts them both to shame and brings a lot more to a team than either of them. Hopefully his exclusion from the PFA team will spur him on.
April 28th, 2008 at 2:00
As a supporter of United I look at Chelsea’s fixtures and think “they’ll easily win their last 2 league games” and then worry about ours. We have West Ham at home and Wigan away, Chelsea have Newcastle away and Bolton at home last day of the season. So in reality it’s fairly even between us. Newcastle are a better team than West Ham and Bolton are battling just above the drop.
We have some things to be really positive about. The game against Barca is on Tuesday which gives us an extra day than if we were playing on Wednesday again (though Newcastle v Chelsea at 4pm on Monday is a confusing fixture!!!). Although we have dropped points over the last week or so, we were also behind Arsenal at one stage. We should be able to beat the Hammers and if we can’t beat a side close to but safe from relegation when we really need to, why do we deserve it?
This is what we wait a whole season for, the old cliche of asking if we’d like to have been here at the start of the season, we’d all say yes! I hope the Scousers beat Chelsea, We win the League and then beat the Scousers in Moscow.. yes I am allowed a fantasy!
April 28th, 2008 at 3:23
I fully agree beautifulgamer. Ronaldo and United as a whole are being kicked around around the park. We could use a hard man in the middle. I was hoping Hargo would provide more “protection” for our players.
April 28th, 2008 at 4:50
When I suggested and hoped the rumors of Gennaro Gattuso showing up next season were true, many said they never wanted him. That hard man ManUtd9Titles refers to comes no better than Gattuso. Lets put it this way, Essien, Joe Cole and Ballack would not have had so easy just outside our box yesterday had he been on the pitch. And perhaps they would think twice about careless tackles on Ronaldo or others because once again, Gattuso is known for protecting his teammates by sending stiff and painful messages back to the opponent. This team needs a RWB and a striker most of all however, some grit and hard physical play in the midfield would also be a godsend. Hargreaves for all his great defensive skills, pace and marking ability god love him, is not a physical player. Move him slightly to the right and let him open up his game and bring in Gattuso to enforce the midfield Keane style.
One more thing about the midfield. Early in the season I was getting Michael Carrick as well as Scholes for their poor and unspectacular play. They then went on a good run and both improved and began to play really well for a few months. Since then Scholes has been hot and cold but overall, he has played well enough. I cannot say the same about Carrick. To be honest, I cannot remember the last great game Carrick has played. And yet I don’t dislike the lad. In fact he’s always on my mind as a certain starter but that kind of thinking is starting to leave me. Right now I cannot justify his place in the starting eleven over Hargreaves, Anderson, Scholes and even Fletcher. He’s just been invisible of late. And his underrated defense is starting to show cracks as well. He was never one with great pace but now he looks really slow and indecisive at times and teaming him with Scholes in Barcelona had much to do with our slow and poor performance trying to counter over there.
I listen to some footy podcasts that are strong favorites of mine. Perhaps some of you have heard of Red Devil Radio as well as North America’s top footy podcast World Soccer Daily. These shows are hosted by people from England Ireland as well as Scotland. They each have two hosts and in each case the guys all think Carrick is just total shite. On Red Rants there are many more supporters of Carrick than there are critics. But I’m starting to wonder whether Carrick has a long future in the starting eleven for us or if he is going to end up like Fletcher? Our free flowing fast paced attack is dependent on solid and quick passes as well as quick and decisive decision making by our central midfielders. Right now Carrick looks slower and older than Scholes. I’m glad we resigned him because I see his potential but unless he taps in to his potential and unleashes that ability on a consistent basis, we may have to look for a game breaking attacking midfielder as well. The bottom line, is Michael Carrick good enough to be running the midfiled for Manchester United? What do many of you think. I’d be interested to know what you all think of Carricks short term effect as well as his long term prospects.
April 28th, 2008 at 5:03
Since last wednessday, I’m feeling embarrassed with the way Man U playing.
I’m worried,we may end up this season empty handed.
If really, I’ll be shocked.
Player and Manager got their pay check regularly,
but the fans like me will only receive the shock shock and shock
April 28th, 2008 at 6:02
Owen Hargreaves, Michael Carrick and Anderson are all we need in defensive midfield, I don’t think Gattuso would have made the result any different on Saturday. Anderson is young but based on the way he has played against Top players like Fabregas and Gerrard he is more than capable of quickly growing into a ‘hard man’. We have him already, a player who fears nobody and don’t need to sign any other player in midfield.
Players in the mould of Keane and Gattuso, “hard men” are not what today’s style of play is going towards, you can hardly breathe on a player without a free-kick being given so for the ability and pace that Andy and Hargo have we are heading in the right direction, unlike John Arne Riise last week.
IMO.
April 28th, 2008 at 7:31
Regarding Riise, I heard a traffic cop pulled him aside and gave him a ticket the other night. Apparently he was HEADING in the wrong direction.
April 28th, 2008 at 7:53
much less utd players in the team this season. the only reason fabregas won is because he’s younger and it voted by players. ronaldo really isnt young, he’s pre-prime.
but enough of this, we need to look forward to the barca game, us ranting about how we played in past wont make us win anything in the future. Bring on barca.
April 28th, 2008 at 8:38
Carrick is a luxury….if he is given time and space his passing can unlock defences. But defensively he can be suspect and he’s a bit lightweight and can be hustled. He is great to have in the league against the weaker teams, and good in a three man central midfield in europe but i would not play him in a two man central midfield in europe or against the big premier league teams.
I do not think he is a big game players…in the way that Fletcher and Anderson are. I think he is a confidence player.
April 28th, 2008 at 8:45
Oh yeah my team for Barca would be
EVDS
Brown Vidic Rio Evra
Hargreaves Scholes Anderson Giggs/Park
Ronaldo Tevez/Rooney
Reasoning:
Barca are strong on the wings so we need players who will track back and provide defensive as well as offensive capabilities. We do not have the luxury of letting Ronaldo and Nani bomb down the wings leaving us exposed.
Ronaldo in a free role up front does work so long as he has the support from Rooney or Tevez. Tevez did not do his job last Tuesday but I expect improvements.
Scholes is undroppable because of his experience and performance last tuesday and anderson is needed for this game. Carrick was disappointing against barca and is a luxury we cannot afford in a must win game.
I would rather play Rooney as an impact sub as presumabely tevez is the fitter of the two after being rested on saturday
April 28th, 2008 at 8:52
Actually, Colver I’d go for the following
Brown Vidic Ferdinand Evra
ronaldo Carrick Anderson Giggs
Tevez Rooney
although i’m pretty sure, SAF will start with a 4-5-1 and with Scholes
April 28th, 2008 at 8:56
**************This is a Barcelona fan********************
Have to say quite astonished by the way people are criticizing Ferguson. Isn’t it normal that he left Ronaldo on the bench, when you consider that ManU have to win against Barcelona. may be Alex wasn’t daring enough, but boy he is sensible. The only problem for him was that he have to bring on Ronaldo much earlier than he wanted.
April 28th, 2008 at 9:02
Die hard ManU fan: Get a grip will you! What exactly is it about a 0-0 draw and a narrow 2-1 defeat away from home against two of the best teams in Europe you find embarassing? Also, if you really were a die hard Utd fan you would 1) not be making fickle, glory hunting comments like that and 2) not be using the term ManU in your name, which if you knew your club history you would know is derogatory due to Munich connotations. Sorry to get personal, but I felt I had to make a stand. RR, if you read this, I hope you understand where I am coming from (I suspect this poster may be a WUM).
Grognard: With regard to your long post, point #2, would the fact that we have conceded six goals in the last six games have anything to do with the on-off absence of a certain Nemanja Vidic perhaps?
April 28th, 2008 at 9:07
Nino: There weren’t that many people on here who were aware of the history behind the term ManU until RR commented on his dislike of it.
On the defence, losing Vidic is a factor but the best form of defence is possession. If you have the ball the opposition can’t score and in recent weeks our passing by both the forwards and midfielders has been poor.
April 28th, 2008 at 9:22
JB, to be honest, when have we ever played possession football? Against the weaker teams in the Prem and CL, yes, but whenever we play Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea and any big team in Europe, home or away, generally we always concede the majority of possession to them. Could you tell me of any recent examples to the contrary? I do agree, however, that our passing in recent weeks has either been exceptionally sloppy (the Arsenal game in particular springs to mind) or practically non-existent (Barca).
April 28th, 2008 at 12:45
I was at the game on saturday and I have to say we sung our hearts out for the lads - only stopping once when ballack scored. I have some points to add having seen it in the flesh…
(1) Rooney is not fit and wasnt fit on saturday (I have my doubts in sarting him tomorrow night.
(2) Carrick, Giggs and Anderson did not take control or stand up to the fight/bullying of the Chelski - we were overrun!
(3) Giggs should only ever be used as a sub again - he has lost pace, passing & form
(4) Fletch was one of the few players to stand up & fight except when he lost ballack for the goal but I blame Ferdinand more.
(5) SAF must now go for it in all remaining games - no more of this looking for a draw crap - we are United we do not know how to play that game - its win by attacking!
(6) My Team for Barca - Normal back 5 if all fit and then Scholes, Carrick and Hargreaves, Rooney, Ronaldo & Tevez up front. Bring Anderson on later on in the game as he is better at impact sub.
April 28th, 2008 at 12:54
Tom, you’re right: “you can hardly breathe on a player without a free-kick being given” - and that in some ways is not bad given the highly skilled team United have. Referees also have to protect United. What I’m saying about Chelsea refers to the subtleties of the game or the game within the game. Along with Keane’s ability to inflict pain, it was more Keane’s ability to suss out when things were going against United (Ferguson is also excellent at this) and then sorting out the opposition. I thought it was more psychological than physical with Roy. He intimidated the hell out of most players in the league. My position on Chelsea is that they are pack of cheaters and no one is sorting them out. They could steal the Premiership. I don’t know if they can do it in Europe though since the refereeing is different. Back to Fergie: he’s probably still trying to piece together what happened in the Chelsea match. One thing is for sure: he wasn’t out-managed by Avramgrantovich. He was undone by a renegade team willing to do whatever it takes to win. I’m not a Liverpool fan but I hope that they and the referee pull the plug on Chelsea.
April 28th, 2008 at 13:22
I think/hope/pray we will beat Barcelona 2-0. Being at home is a huge confidence boost, and in the words of Owen Hargreaves: “Lets show those Barca boys how its done!”
April 29th, 2008 at 9:15
nice report..
i would howeevr like to elaborate more on Mentality part. At the outset this is in no manner a bashing towards SAF coz i truly respect the man and cant think of a united without him but just the expression of dissapointment of a fan.
I remember last week (barcalona v. Man utd)… tired and exhausted from the day’s work at 11 in the nite, i forced myself to bathe and sit to watch the match. it started here at 12 30. I remembered the 1999 games and how much i rued having missed them and promised this wont be the same.
Not to my surprise though we played the 4-5-1 and i have really hated that formation when we play it.. i put up with it evertytime just coz SAF must haev a better plan and i saw that we are getting better at it. However, the formation is not the problem, the MENTALITY is.
During the years i started watichin and supportin united, we were winning nothin (2001 or 2002) and ppl were saying we have lost the edge.. the only thing that used to inspire me to watch united was the football and the desire to win every game. Remember the Leverkusen semi final, we attacked attacked and attacked. I was proud but disaapointed when we lost the game. WE NEVER WOULD HAVE SETTLED FOR A DRAW.
It was this all or nothin mentality that made me fall in live with the club.
Not that we don’t wanna win now or that we are not the best in the World, but i hate the fact that instead of scaring teams that will play us, we encourage them to treat us as another one of the good teams but not the greatest. When barca won the champs leage 2 years back, there was an air of inevitability coz they did not change their tactics based on the opponent but made the opponent do that.
We are doin exactly the opposite and i have got frustrated with seein united play the big teams and/or european away games without any imagination. We settle happily for draws when we should be beatin teams there. Its not the formatin that does not work, its the dissappointment of knowing that United played for a draw at CHELSEA and BARCA. I would have been less dissapointed if we played to win and got a draw or for that matter even got beat but i have enough faith in the team to know that if we had played to win, we would have.
But football is not the game of if’s and would’s is it.