Jul 18
Conflicting Reports Cast Cloud Over Fergie-Ronaldo “Meeting”
Everyone has been going on about Fergie holding talks with Ronaldo over the past few hours. The Guardian, for example, report that Fergie held talks with Ronaldo on Monday as he flew to Lisbon.
Here, let me quote:
Sir Alex Ferguson has met Cristiano Ronaldo for the first time in six weeks in an attempt to persuade the winger to forgo his “dream” move to Real Madrid and remain at Manchester United.It is understood the United manager flew to Lisbon for talks with the 23-year-old on Monday, the first face-to-face encounter between the pair since a party at Old Trafford in the days after the club’s Champions League final triumph over Chelsea in May.
Now on the surface, if you are speed reading this on your way to your morning coffee, you would have your spirits up. But consider this report on the very same Monday that Fergie was said to have his meeting with Ronaldo, reported by Times Online:
Sir Alex Ferguson once famously rode pillion on a motorcycle journey across Paris to persuade Eric Cantona not to retire, but it seems that there will be no mercy dash to try to talk some sense into Cristiano Ronaldo. Ferguson had planned to fly to Lisbon today in an attempt to clear the air with the Portugal forward, but instead the Manchester United manager will stay at home to focus on his attempt to sign Dimitar Berbatov from Tottenham Hotspur, raising further doubts about Ronaldo’s future at Old Trafford.
Ok, now both sources acknowledge that there was a plan to hold a meeting with Ronaldo on Monday. But again, both articles seem dubious with very little by way of quotes to give us anything. Consider the first story on the Guardian: if Fergie was to go to Lisbon to meet Ronaldo and Ronaldo was in Los Angeles for the past couple of days (for the ESPYs), and if Fergie was to leave on Thursday to South Africa, it makes Monday a rather narrow window for Fergie to hold talks. There is certainly time for him to hold talks but it still sounds a little far fetched that the Gaffer would have gone all the way to Lisbon and back and gone unnoticed till today. Also it’s written by Daniel Taylor — not one of my favourite journalists.
Similarly Oliver Kay ran the Times Online story. Again, I’ve found his reportage a little dodgy over the last few months. But I could understand that Fergie may have cancelled the meeting, if there was any scheduled, because he may have wanted to concentrate fully on pre-season as well as getting ready for South Africa. It also could be because Ferguson is 100% certain that Ronaldo is not going anywhere and that he alone holds the cards.
I find both stories conflicting and I don’t really buy the Guardian’s version at all.
Update: Fergie did in fact meet Ronaldo. He says it was done last week — I suppose that makes more sense than Monday.
* * *
Meanwhile The Sun reports that Ferguson has stated his interest in Berbatov and that it will be sorted out in time. I am slightly concerned now that, amid the climate of Real publicly pursuing Ronaldo, Fergie has started actually naming his transfer target.
“We have made Tottenham an offer on Berbatov and we have good expectations that this deal will go through. Berbatov has been impressive during a long time and would be a great addition to our attack. I think time will work for us more than against us. We will not stress this situation. We are hoping to have a constructive conversation with Tottenham in the near future.”
Whatever happened to carrying out business discreetly?
* * *
United have left for South Africa for pre-season and will play the Kaizer Chiefs on Saturday. Here’s the full squad for the Africa tour:
Tomasz Kuszczak, Nemanja Vidic, Rio Ferdinand, John O’Shea, Ryan Giggs, Michael Carrick, Wesley Brown, Paul Scholes, Owen Hargreaves, Carlos Tevez, Wayne Rooney, Mikael Silvestre, Gary Neville, Darren Fletcher, Ben Foster, Daniel Simpson, Lee Martin, Fraizer Campbell, Darron Gibson, Jonathan Evans, Ben Amos, Christopher Eagles, Michael Clegg, Andrew Caveney, Gary Walker.
Oh, and don’t rub your eyes in disbelief if you don’t see Owen Hargreaves in there. He’s out doing an impersonation of Louis Saha (desperately knocks on wood) — his problem, a recurrence of tendinitis. Well, I just have one thing to say to Owen about that: Mate, get as injured as you want during the summer, but get your arse as fit as you can for the first game because you are our right winger against Newcastle.
Related items from Red Rants:
- Bolton vs Man Utd: Preview
- Saha’s Injury: Who do we believe?
- Vote for Us! Please!
- The Ultimate Manchester United Stats Page
- Manchester United vs Sporting Lisbon: point to prove for Fergie
Tags: Opinions/Columns
July 18th, 2008 at 10:05
I hope Hargo is fit for the start, I think he will be really important for us next year.
Fergie is keeping tight lipped regarding Ronaldo, either he has said his peace in the fact that he is staying, or it is out of his hands and the Glaziers as reported are negging a deal for his departure, and Fergie like any good employee (like CQ!!) is toeing the company line.
July 18th, 2008 at 10:29
i think fergie has the deal in the bag.both sides are happy just a matter of time
July 18th, 2008 at 10:33
i thought that Mr Cristiano was in America picking up an award from espn or something…. he’s doing a lot of flying about even with that gammy leg.
Berba is in the bag… all but.
July 18th, 2008 at 10:41
RR, Fergie confirmed that they had made a bid on a player, but he refused to name who it was.
The Sun has just assumed that it’s Berbatov Fergie was talking about and added his name and the name of Tottenham in the quotes.
I’ve also checked on many of the other articles that has the same quotes, and every single one of them are quoting the sun.
I think it’s safe to say that we can take these quotes with more than a pinch of salt.
July 18th, 2008 at 10:44
We will sign him I am sure, and think he will be great for us, big game player a real class act, scores goals, creates goals, great touch the new king!!
July 18th, 2008 at 10:50
RR I think most journo’ are second guessing in this saga now, I mean if you ever check up on Marca(spa) or A Bola(por) they are truely obsessive with this story and everyone whats to get that scoop and the ‘I will leave’ exclusive. I remember Fergie’ Frost interview where he said his tolerance for reports concerning him and ManUtd has cooled suggesting the media are under huge pressure from editors and the publics demand for exclusive material. I for one agree though continued lazy journalism hacks me off, I do however believe Oliver Kay to be quite accurate(as he can be) but he too has joined this bandwagon.
I won’t get into what UK paper I find most accurate or trustworthy but I will say the Sun is below par, I think everyone had Berba as odds-on and they ran it as a Fergie interview using loose quotations. Having said that if I’m wrong(likely) why has Fergie talked to this half-ass paper? This simply contradicts ‘Utd reporting Real to the governing bodies’ what a joke! I doubt Utds spokesman/website will inform us of anything new, so I’ll wait on Gus Poyet to talk!
The one thing is that no fee has been agreed that would have been leaked, I just hope that ‘the bid’ is under £23m.
-In 2006 Utd splashed £18m on Micheal Carrick he has been Fergies first choice centre midfielder for the past two seasons. In this time Utd have won back to back titles and a champions league missing out on the FA cup. If anyone has proven that paying the odds for a player its Carrick -HE is no Veron- Please people get over his price tag already! Its like he has to captain San Marino to a world cup final before he can be Man Utd material.
July 18th, 2008 at 11:00
@AGP I was not saying that he was not United material, or that he is not a good player, and I love him for the penalty in Moscow , I was saying he, like some other players we have bought like, for example Rio, who was in my view POY last season, was expensive thats all considering Spurs paid £2.5m 2 years before hand.
July 18th, 2008 at 11:11
Ps actually I have always liked Veron, he just could not settle in our league!!
July 18th, 2008 at 11:49
Sky Sports News is now reporting that after “some detective work”, they can confirm that SAF met with Cristiano on Monday afternoon or evening in Portugal. You have to give Fergie credit for making an incognito dash over to Lisbon. I wonder if he was in disguise.
July 18th, 2008 at 12:04
@Stephen: Okay sorry I thought it was more point the finger at Carrick(sorry mate). The thing with his price is I should of brought up the current market and what Utd ‘will have to pay’ for any footballer these days. RR ran the article on Alexis Sanchez- whose club would have sold him for £7m 3 months back but his agent talked up Utd and his price doubled. It’s the sad state of football these days. p.s Rio was my player of the year as well, Rio for Captain!! nuff said.
@Jak: Yeah Sky sports have said there is a 2PM-3PM news conference as well, they suggest Fergie may talk about Berba and the Ronaldo meeting lets hope so aye!
July 18th, 2008 at 12:37
i don’t think those quotes about berbatov are real, I think they were off some norwegian united site who took the interview down after a while, The Sun must have just picked them up from there and everyone else is just quoting them. Lazy journalism all round.
Anyway, why would SAF talk exclusively to The Sun
July 18th, 2008 at 12:59
@riz:
Did the Norwegian site have those exact quotes though. Its one thing after all for the Sun to pull the usual ‘insiders say’ as thats a get out clause to print anythung but to attribute it to Fergie himeself, especially if the quotes unique to them is taking a risk
July 18th, 2008 at 13:24
I don’t know about delaying things working to our advantage. Reasons???
1. Obviously, Berbatov will find it easier gelling with the team performance wise, and in his case, attitude wise if the deal is done early!
2. The more we hear from Real Madrid now, the less likely the move seems. Holding on for more time definitely does not improve our position 1 bit because Real don’t really need Ronaldo that badly, do they? It’s us who will be stuck with a grumbler who can’t walk for 3 months. While they just buy some of the other best talents in the world. And Ronaldo next season, as well…
3. Barca have joined the fray to get Berbatov and they certainly might be the favourites to get Berbatov if the bids are equal. Afterall, United are the Spurs’ direct opponents in the league. Plus, Berbatov might on 2nd thought realise that he will in all likelihood be the 1st striker of Barca, feeding off talents such as Henry, Messi and Xavi. At OT, he is not exactly a definite starter with Tevez very much in the fray.
4. And lastly, the more we delay the, more other clubs can take advantage of our desperation. Afterall, we can’t go into the next season with a hobbling, disillusioned Ronaldo, injured Hargreaves and no new signing to show. What with the Blues trying to buy their title as usual!!!!!
So, I really really do hope that Fergie decides to plunge into the transfer market at the earliest. And give us fans something to cheer about. It’s been all dark, hazy and depressing since that glorious Wednesday night
July 18th, 2008 at 14:12
@AGP: The price tag has nothing to do with carrick not being united material, it’s his playing ability. He’s not really good enough. Also, veron as a player was lightyears ahead of carrick. He was so much better in terms of sheer ability. It’s a shame he could not adapt to the premiership because he had the potential to be a tremendous signing.
@Anish: Signing berbatov a week or so earlier will not have a noticeable difference on his performances at the start of the season. Someone else argued this point giving tevez last year as an example, but i attribute tevez’s uninspiring early performances to the fact rooney got injured and he was playing lone striker, a role which is not his game.
I doubt barcelona are in for berbatov. He wouldn’t be first choice striker there as henry has already been assured he is the main striker this season.
July 18th, 2008 at 14:14
@ Anish, United are playing the waiting game mate, Jol has already come out and stated that Berba has always wanted to sign for us, and we have probably already agreed personel terms with his agent, so we would have commitment there.
So I think good on us for not being held to ransom, Spurs know they have to sell as they have no or little chance of keeping the player. Ramos would have looked at replacements already, because ever since he has been manager he knew that the player wants to go.
July 18th, 2008 at 14:17
@ Tevez, Carlito was also playing in the Coppa America, which went on until mid July.
July 18th, 2008 at 15:11
http://www.manutd.com/default.sps?pagegid={F9E570E6-407E-44BC-800F-4A3110258114}&newsid=6614082
I love fergie!! “he put his points accross I put mines accross and at the end of it:he’s staying”
I think you can’t get a blunter manager than fergie!
July 18th, 2008 at 15:14
Manutd.com:
Boss: Ronaldo’s staying putSir Alex Ferguson has confirmed he met with Cristiano Ronaldo to discuss the player’s future and insists the winger will not be sold to Real Madrid.
The 23-year-old has been openly coveted by Real Madrid over the last few months with the player himself reported to be keen on a switch to the Bernabeu.
However, at a press conference in South Africa to mark the start of United’s pre-season trip, the Reds’ boss confirmed Ronaldo is going nowhere.
“The meeting went well – I think we both put across our points of view – where we stand and where the player stands,” explained Sir Alex.
“I can say he’ll be a Manchester United player next season. That’s our stance – he won’t be sold.”
More to follow…
July 18th, 2008 at 15:15
@Viresh: You beat me to it.
July 18th, 2008 at 15:16
well its breaking news on skysports that ronldo wont be sold and he is staying, spainnish media and real madrid will still not stop this summer, we need more info on what ronaldo said.
July 18th, 2008 at 15:22
Yea, I dont really know what that means for next year, but in all honesty, I would love for him to stay on for a couple more years. I dont really respect him as a person anymore, but there is no denying he makes our team better. Add that to the possible signing of Berbatov, and you cant help but think of all the silverware we could win in the next couple of years. I wonder if continuing to win here coupled with RM continuing to be a circus, if Ronaldo wont have a change of heart in a year or two? Maybe I’m dreaming, but this news that he will play for us this season makes me excited. Now I just have to prepare for the shitstorm that will be next season. Hopefully by then we have bought or will by someone by the name of Kun.
July 18th, 2008 at 15:26
Listen this is the point as much as we probably hate the debt that has been put on our club if ronaldo is sold over fergie’s head then we’re gonna see a backlash however if he’s stays and fergie can brainwash him again then we’re good! i’m licking my lips as we speak berba, tevez, rooney, ronaldo and one of saha manucho and campbell!! what an group of strikers!!this is gonna be a good season if everything goes our way again!
July 18th, 2008 at 15:34
I have mixed feelings, I am glad it is resolved but personally I think he has dragged the clubs name through the mud over the past couple of months. He wants to go and is only staying because he has to, which to me ( and I know I am being negative!) is not good enough.
He has taken the gloss off the double and its all as usual all about him on and off the pitch. If Real paid us lets say £70-£80m for a player who has showed the club, management, players and fans no respect then that to me is good business.
He is a great player no doubt, but to me the club is bigger, and probably he should have been sold. I know he may come back in October and be his wonderful footballing self, but we should be beyond that.
July 18th, 2008 at 15:42
Yeah, I have mixed feelings too.
But look at it this way – now there is an awesome oppurtunity for the boys to show us that even if Ronaldo had gone, he would not have been missed. He’ll be back only in Oct and Aug-Sep has some very tough matches. What better way to prove a point than to get off the blocks in brilliant fashion, win our matches with style and show him that we could have done without him too. That’ll put him right back in his place and he’ll probably come back a humbler person. I’d really like him to fight for his starting place…
Ofcourse, it could be bad too…we could be struggling by Oct and he’d be like “Oh..see! I have to come back and rescue you guys!”. But I seriously hope its the former rather than the latter.
July 18th, 2008 at 15:43
@ antsBoy, spot on mate totally agree.
July 18th, 2008 at 16:01
Im not sure. I think the Media has done too much out of this case. They have done more damage than Ronaldo has done himself. Maybe he just has said one thing while the others say 100 that are supposed to be from him. I think he will be an important player for us nedxt season and an important player in the future. Hopefully United will be flying when he comes back, but the sooner the better.
July 18th, 2008 at 16:02
if you look at last seasons stats, we managed a few cracking results without CR7, everything indicates that having rooney in the team is the catalyst for our successes. And i wouldnt worry about another poor start to the season, if anything we only go onto succeed in europe and in the league after such ‘terrible’ openings, it was rooneys absence at the beginning of 07/08 that was our big problem. Sure ronny smashed in 42 goals but how many of these were penalties hargo might have taken or even a 3rd or 4th goal in a game we already wrapped up?. With berba in the side we could realistically play a 4-3-3 with rooney, tevez and berba in the front 3 and hargo, scholes and park making up a highly flexible and interchangeable midfield
July 18th, 2008 at 16:03
So if Ronaldo stays, do u think we are still in the market for players other than Brebatov? And what about Ronaldo’s future in ManUtd ? Has Fergie just put off the inevitable or has he changed Ron’s mind? Opinions please
July 18th, 2008 at 16:03
@antsBoy: Great point mate, well said. If he does stay(which is looking more than likely)i think and hope he will want to prove a point to the fans. Its the least we deserve after having to put up wit a summuer full of bullshit!
July 18th, 2008 at 16:09
@ Elsammio99 What Park instead of Carrick or Anderson are you sure?!
July 18th, 2008 at 16:10
@RedRanter – Just to let you and everyone else know who might be unaware that the official premier league fantasy football tournament for the 08/09 season is open, hopefully we’ll get another league set up for all the loyal redrants readers soon, just a shame as always that until august we wont get a look at one anothers teams, but im feeling confident about mine, just hope the rules on too many players from a certain team wont screw me over if and when my star striker Berbatov decides to throw on the red of united
July 18th, 2008 at 16:16
@Stephen – Well besides being a big fan of oll parky i did just throw him in ther as a possibility in a big flexible midfield that could easily include nani or anderson
Fantasy football signup at http://fantasy.premierleague.com/
July 18th, 2008 at 16:27
@Elsammio99: Easy mate. We are working on a fantasy league and details will be out in some days.
July 18th, 2008 at 16:51
Well well, looks like CR7 is gracing us with his presence for one more year. And what an interesting year it will be. Fergie has stuck to his guns, and credit to him, though I guess we really shouldn’t have expected anything less. So what does it mean?
For the team?
a. Sends the message that Fergie is serious about getting this squad to stay and grow together, and that he cares enough to fight for someone. That is good.
b. Might have built some resentment towards the great winking one, but if Rooney and he could get over the summer before last, hopefully a few jokes in practice will smooth it over. I’m not convinced though.
For Ronaldo
Well it’s now a big test for him. He should be reigning player of the year, will not get a preseason to speak of and will be expected to be at his very best. And will have to prove to United fans that he is still playing with his all, because they will rightly be skeptical. If he can come back in November and still be performing at similar levels to last year, then he will go a long way to getting him towards great status. But if he comes back, has lost a step and scores half as many goals, people will view him as dissapointing.
For Fergie
Smart, smart man. This way he forces CR7 to spend the next 9 months in Manchester, with his teammates, hopefully watching the best team in Europe. That’s 9 months to get over his ‘dream’, 9 months to get over his woman, 9 months to forge better relationships with the players around him. About 7 months of playing in a front 4 with 3 of Rooney, Berbatov, Tevez, Nani, Giggs and Saha. Not bad.
For Real Madrid/Calderon/Marca,
Absolute failure. F*ck you, you lying tw*ts.
July 18th, 2008 at 17:00
@Stephen: Yeah tevez aint had a break for a good few years. That’s why this is his season.
@Elsammio99: 4-3-3 with rooney, tevez and berba doesn’t work because of either a lack of width for giving rooney and tevez freedom to drift around and do their thing, or because forcing them to stay wide will take them out the game and they would be ineffective. Also, the midfield would be a tight midfield three, so no park or nani in there as they are wide men. The formation does not suit the players at all in my opinion.
July 18th, 2008 at 17:01
Yeah on a positive note it does show that we will not be bullied by other so called big clubs, we have maintained our dignity thoughout this process unlike Real.
Fergie made me laugh when he said,
Asked why he had not commented on the matter until now, Ferguson replied: “It’s not a difficult position. I was on my holiday and I was not going to interrupt my holiday, believe me.
You got love the man he is a genius!!!
July 18th, 2008 at 17:05
Tevez, spot on mate he will be fit and rareing to go this season, as he has said he is desperate to sign permanent deal with us, and will work his bollox off to prove he is worth it.
July 18th, 2008 at 17:13
er, whos Michael Clegg and Andrew Caveney
…
July 18th, 2008 at 17:14
@dan(u-ol): Next time give us some context with your comments. Don’t ask questions out of the blue.
July 18th, 2008 at 17:15
I do recall that Michael Clegg is an ex-United player. But why you ask?
July 18th, 2008 at 17:16
Cleggy have retired think he is a fitness coach at Sunderland but don’t quote me!!
July 18th, 2008 at 17:20
Nice random quote dan…
July 18th, 2008 at 17:24
I do have mixed feelings too. I am very angry that after such a great season, we couldn’t properly enjoy it, because of this saga, but I am one of those that believes that Ronaldo is more important to us then Rooney. Don’t get me wrong commitment wise and loyalty Rooney is our man and I believ a real red, but team wise I think there shouldn’t be any arguement. As proof I can point the fact that while Ronney’s game improved a lot in the past winning seasons, the improvment that made the change was Ronaldo’s. He bailed us so many times last year, that I lost the account.
Will I sing his songs?No, but I will not blame anyone who does, however I will hate any ManUtd supporter who boos him for the summer shit. Let’s make one thing clear. Most of the players this days are mercenary scum and players like Giggs are dying breed. Also Ronaldo only screw up is that he never said that he stays and only talked about dream and staff, but he never insulted the club and the Blatter comment was logical. The old fool supported players and most of the players would have said they agree with him. Ok, I know that I am deffending him and I know that he is a cunt, but I would hate to see the best player in world, who playes in my team 1st time in my life, be bood by our own supporters.
July 18th, 2008 at 17:43
Well Fergie’s long silence is over as he finally has shed light on the situation between himself and Ronaldo and their infamous meeting last week. Man what I wouldn’t give to have George Bush’s KGB style surveillance apparatus in play here so I could listen to every juicy word coming out of each other’s mouths. So Fergie is adamant that Ronaldo goes no place. Well for some of you that may be good news but for me it is very sad news if indeed Fergie plans to carry out his promise. For me it’s more of a threat. To force the thousands, if not millions of supporters like myself to have to stomach Cristiano Ronaldo after what he has done, is just more than I can take. When did the feelings of the supporters ever come in to play here? Most of us don’t want the cunt here. It’s funny how the majority of fans seem to have the best interest and care for the club in mind and not the manager or ownership of the team. Why should we be the only ones left in charge of watching over the team’s integrity, culture and team history, when the people hired to do the job snub their red noses as at us and tell us that our feelings are not welcome and our opinions are not respected? Still, we all collectively pay their salaries with our loyalty.
I am not a lone voice in the wilderness here. Go around, check the media, go to all the other United or generic footy blogs. The majority of our fans who voice their feelings don’t want him back. Why is our requests……..,Hell our demands not being heard? We’re not demanding that a certain player be bought, we’re not asking for a certain formation or lineup be played we are not barking down a path where we have no right or no place to be. We are simply demanding the transfer of a player who has crapped all over us and has insulted the social fabric, conscience and loyalty of an entire city and footballing community (Obviously City fans don’t matter). Above all he has insulted the manager and players we support. Why? Why is the team not taking this blatant slap in it’s collective face in a more predictable way? I knew Fergie was stubborn but this is beyond ridiculous. When does stubbornness morph itself in to arrogance and stupidity? There I said it! How on Earth can he and his cronies honestly feel that keeping the player is not going to damage the team and it’s prospects in the future? The boy does not want to be here. I don’t know how some of you react at such a scenario but most people leave a place they don’t want to be at, especially if their is a place where they dream to go and have the means and the invitation to do so. Ronaldo wants to be in Madrid. Right or wrong, he has made his mind up and trying to force him to stay even if legally the law is on your side may actually be wrong. You know slavery is not an issue here so lets not even think about it. I don’t care how upset he is if he is sitting in the stands or at home collecting his millions and sulking, that is not slavery. But keeping him against his will and especially the will of the majority of fans that support this club is wrong and it is a slap in our collective faces. I’m sorry but I cannot and will not see it any other way. On top of that, Ronaldo will be out 3 fucking months and this team is doing nothing to find a quality player to fill the gap and possibly take over if things become untenable. What if Ronaldo re injures the ankle upon his return, or if he decides he doesn’t want to play, or if he plays like a shite on purpose? What’s our backup plan? Ryan Giggs, Nani, JS Park? Please, we already have them and we barely won the Double by the skin of our noses with them and Ronaldo playing all the time anyway. Berbatov is not the answer. He fills the void we had anyway even with Ronaldo. But he is not Ronaldo’s replacement.
I feel this team is banking on unrealistic expectations and playing by a code and chivalry that is ancient and does not connect with today’s mercenary mindset. Fergie is showing his age and stubbornness by honestly feeling he can turn a switch and this will all be forgotten and that Ronaldo will make his triumphant return in a blaze of glory and his attitude, desire and heart will be devoted to United 100%. Wake up and smell that spiked coffee you are drinking Fergie. Don’t be so fucking naive Boss. The boy called you slave driver, he has treated you, his teammates, the team and supporters with no respect and he’s obviously set his mind on a move. So as I see it he has backed you in to a corner and you only have two choices, and playing him is not one of them. You can sell him, or you can make him rot in the stands and only play him a few minutes in ten games to keep FIFA off your back. At least if you sell him and before the transfer deadline, you can take that big wad of cash and go buy a player or two who will adequately replace him. That’s of course if that wad of cash is ever going to be intended for player purchases to begin with.
Christ am I pissed off. I heard of standing pat and not panicking but this is ridiculous. Fergie reminds me of the general who in the middle of the battle is standing and giving orders and not even flinching as bullets fly past him and explosions are happening all around him while everybody else is ducking in foxholes. Too many of his troops he looks brave and heroic, the model of leadership under fire. But to others he looks like and arrogant, conceded gas bag who cares as little for his open safety as he does for his troops. To those observers, he looks like a fool and a man that has no qualms about getting the whole platoon killed. So is Fergie a hero or a fool? I love the man believe me. But I can not and will not tolerate his latest decision. It’s just bloody well wrong and could lead to disaster. I feelings are meaningless as they will never be heard by those who matter, but still, one must rant to their heart’s content. Especially when things are looking bleak.
July 18th, 2008 at 17:48
@Stephen: Ronaldo has proven there is no such thing as commitment. Contracts and promises mean shite in todays game.
July 18th, 2008 at 17:51
@Stephen: Beautifully said mate. And right too.
July 18th, 2008 at 17:52
@ Orez, well put mate and I won’t boo him, and I think our supporters and more intelligent than that, anyone who wears the shirt should be supported, but he will never be a legend in my eyes with the likes of Best, Law, Charlton, Giggs, Scholes, G Nev, with his selfish behaviour this summer, which is a shame.
July 18th, 2008 at 17:57
@RedDevil: Mate, don’t go excusing him and getting him off the hook just because he didn’t say anything much. Sometimes one’s silence is more deafening than a big mouth like mine. His inability or unwillingness to follow up on promises to speak and tell everyone his stand and to explain himself was agitating and incredibly frustrating. It also spoke volumes to me. He was being manipulated by others and it showed just how crass and stupid he is. There is no excuse for his actions or lack of. The media was absolutely terrible and totally unethical and irresponsible in all of this but then again, we have come to expect that from them. What we never expected was the silence and and disrespect Ronaldo showed all of us and especially Fergie. And then when he did open up his mouth all he did was confuse us more and then leave us with his coup de grace, agreeing with Septic Bladder over the slavery comment. That was not the media, that was Ronaldo. And that is unforgivable.
July 18th, 2008 at 18:02
The club will be more successful next season, win silverware that too in style. Ronaldo is just a little cog in our success, no more no less, if somebody wants to be fixated on him then um.. good luck. To me good news, things are looking up, cant wait for next season.
July 18th, 2008 at 18:09
I agree with Grog, he has behaved like a girl that you love but she does not love you the same way back but doesn’t want to tell you.
If he said he wanted to leave because he has achieved everthing he could @ United then fair enough it would have been hard but Ok we could deal with that, or sat down with the manager after the ECF and asked if he would be allowed to move on, that is how a man should deal with such things. But silly little comments were not right and messed with the fans emotions which certainly not on. He has come across as an attention seeking little girl throughout this drama, but if the cap fits!!
July 18th, 2008 at 18:17
@Orez: Booing him sends a message not only to him but to the manager that the fans were disrespected and pissed on not only by Ronaldo but by the team in this saga. He is not a United player just because he wears the jersey. Why? Because he clearly chooses to not be one and only his contract obligates him to do so. People should not get caught up in symbolic ballyhoo and support him just because he wears our colors. Both he and Fergie have stuck their middle fingers up at us and flipped us all off. Does this make me hate United or Fergie? Of course not but I am disappointed as Hell in him and the stance he has taken. As for Ronaldo, the shit bag deserves to hear it from us at least once. We need to feel some satisfaction too. We need to voice our contempt and disgust with him and there is no logical reason to tell loyal fans that they should not show their displeasure for this player’s blatant disrespect and disregard for the millions of supporters who loved him and chanted his name. Boo him until his ear drums can’t take it. Let him have it. Greater people and far more loyal player have been booed off the pitch over the decades simply for not playing well. So tell me then, it’s OK to boo a loyal player who simply may not have had a good day or is just not good enough a player, but not a traitor who has shown disrespect and disloyalty to an entire team, it’s manager and it’s millions of supporters? I’m sorry but I don’t get it. It reminds me of the half of America that blindly turns an eye to the crimes and treason committed by the Bush administration on a daily basis and defends their stance on the basis of being Republican party members. Just horrific.
July 18th, 2008 at 18:17
Actually Grognard, I tend to think that CR7 conducted himself quite respectfully during this whole situation, and because of which I, for one, can accept him back into the squad. Honestly though, he could have been far more of a bitch during this summer, demanding moves and crying about us not letting him go. But he didnt, he didnt say anything which is all you can ask for when he obviously wanted to go. And I cant blame him for that, its his dream. And by the way Fergie is talking about it, it seems like Ronaldo has accepted that he wont get a move this summer, and he’s not striking, or refusing to play.
Just because a player doesnt come out and tell you exactly what he wants and is feeling doesnt mean hes a twat. You knowing exactly what he wants does nothing except give you justification to hate him, and why would he want that?
And I dont really know what all this “We are simply demanding the transfer of a player who has crapped all over us and has insulted the social fabric, conscience and loyalty of an entire city and footballing community (Obviously City fans don’t matter). Above all he has insulted the manager and players we support” comes from, but I think it couldn’t be farther from the truth. He’s actually been respectful for not coming out and being a media whore like those fags in Madrid.
I’m not saying the guys a saint, but he certainly deserves more respect than what he’s getting.
July 18th, 2008 at 18:19
@R…: “Ronaldo is just a little cog in our success, no more no less,”. At this point I am tempted to say something rude and distasteful but out of respect for you and in order to avoid Red Ranters wrath I will only say one word. WHAT?
July 18th, 2008 at 18:21
@ Comma I couldn’t disagree with you more, he has handled the entire saga terribly like a coward, not having the guts to say what he really wants as he is probably scared or he is violating his contract and will either be find or will not get a ahem loyalty bonus when he leaves.
July 18th, 2008 at 18:28
@Stephen: I understand your point actually, and its hard not to think that way, but what if Quiroz was in his ear telling him to shut his mouth? Or Fergie? I think it was no secret as to what he wanted (a move to Madrid), but he didnt go the Gareth Barry route and cry and bitch. I think he wanted too, and thats why he made those ‘in 2 or 3 days’ claims, but someone got in his ear or maybe even he thought better of it. Going public does nothing for the transfer itself, just for your own peace of mind. You wouldnt respect him more if he was talking every day like Calderon, mostly because you dont respect calderon for doing it now.
July 18th, 2008 at 18:34
@Stephen: BINGO! You hit the nail on the head mate. He should have acted like a man and had the courage to confront Fergie right after the CL final and demand his move. I would have disliked his decision but I would have respected his manner of going about things. Truthfully, in the age of the mercenary he has achieved all he could want to with our club and so his desire to move on is not an unrealistic one. Again, this is the age of the mercenary and these players are not to be and should not be expected to act like Neville, Scholes and Giggs. Some bloody respect and and consideration for all the team, Fergie and the supporters have done for him would have been greatly appreciated. Instead, Fergie is referred to as a slave driver, and we are all symbolically given the middle finger from this asshole who is only concerned about one thing and thats Cristiano Ronaldo. He just makes me want to puke. He can fuck off to Hell.
But what can I do being a powerless supporter living in Canada? Well, I will never buy anything with his number or image on it again, nor will I ever cheer for any of his exploits. And my own little form of childish rebellion is that he will never be part of any team roster I play with ever again on FIFA 08 or Football Manager. Yes indeed, he has been sold in those fictional environments and good riddance to bad rubbish. And welcome to Kun Aguero. What you all laugh? Am I clown? Do I amuse you? Well I had to get my revenge somehow. Grant me that one little moment of childish rebellion.
July 18th, 2008 at 18:57
@Wakey: I’m pretty these are the exact quotes off the internet. The site was “united.no”, it said on the site that they were taken down after the english media started contacting them.
July 18th, 2008 at 19:02
The only thing that ronaldo’s said which was wrong was when he agreed with blatter. What a stupid thing to say. Apart from that, i feel you are really overreacting. He doesn’t owe us, the fans, anything. If he is here next season, be happy that our best player is still with us. He will move on eventually anyway, whether it be this season, the next or further on. He is best friends with nani and anderson. Having him at the club another season can only benefit the team. Him leaving is more likely to unsettle them than anything else. Fans who threaten to boo him are not helping anyone but themselves. Preach about how he doesn’t give a shit about the team or any of it’s players, then on match day coming out and focusing all your energy on booing one of your own players instead of getting behind the team. Sending a message to fergie that the fans are displeased with him managing to hold on the best player. That’s stupid! If he comes back into the team, doesn’t give a shit, looks completely disinterested, doesn’t score and generally plays shite just for the sake of it then you can get on his back. If he is forced to stay he should be given a break by us. A chance. As long as he is still here i believe he will continue to perform, and if he does then fans should be happy with that.
July 18th, 2008 at 19:27
Fucking Hell!!!
Lee Martin, Darron Gibson, Jonathan Evans, Ben Amos, Michael Clegg, Andrew Caveney, Gary Walker.. Chris Eagles!! For god’s sake!!
Where the hell is Rodrigo??!!! The South Africa tour would have been an ideal opportunity to blood him! Would have shown the gooners that we’ve got the real mccoy when it comes to promising young CMs!
Now we’re going to have to wait for what, the worthington/ coca-cola whatsisname cup…
July 18th, 2008 at 19:36
@tevez: Disagreeing with me is fine and I can accept criticism. What I cannot accept is being called STUPID. And as far as me overreacting, that is my right thanks. I’ll react the way I feel like reacting. It’s OK for Ronaldo to only think of himself but a poor hurt and betrayed fan who has no say cannot help himself. Get off your self righteous high horse and don’t preach to me how I should react. I offered my opinion and right or wrong you should respect it even if you don’t agree with it. Who made you King Righteous anyway? What makes you feel your view is the correct one and mine is not. It’s all subjective and people can choose to react any way that makes them deal with this situation best. How dare you criticize me as a devoted and loyal fan of this club who is only upset because he has the balls to call out the boss and challenge his decision making. You can respect a man and love him and still disagree and be disappointed with him. It’s not like you or I have always been in agreement with our parents. Does that make us hate them? NO! Just remember that if Ronaldo stays he is doing so unwillingly. To expect him to act maturely and respectful of the team then when he has shown none of that in the last two months is being awfully optimistic indeed. And to not want to take that chance for fear it could backfire on us is not stupid, it’s cautious. I suggest you watch your mouth when you start calling fellow bloggers stupid not once but twice in one reply. I for one am not greatly offended at your disagreement but at your disrespect and attitude towards me. And it’s certainly not the first time you have gone down this road with me in the past. Smarten your act up and mind your manners if you want to converse with me in the future.
July 18th, 2008 at 19:39
@Grognard: Im not defending him. You know that I am one of those that hate him for this, but since he will be a United player I cannot hate him. Thats just how I am! What I meant was that the press kept asking him these questions with him sayin anything at the star. It was “Ronaldo will you leave?” and “Do you want to play for Real?”. He said yes and sometimes he just went around. He was a stupid shit, but if he has a good season and United win some trophies then I will forgive him. Until this shit starts again next summer! ButWe all know that Calderon actually started this whole thing. Had he not started talking of Ronaldo like he was a Real Madrid player and acting like Real had agreed a fee with United, then this wouldnt have gone so far. I am 110% sure of that! Well, in the end hte most importaant thing is that United win. That will happen with and without Ronaldo! GO UNITED!
July 18th, 2008 at 19:40
@tevez: I can’t agree with the part where you said that agreeing with Blatter was the stupidest thing he said. I could think of stuff like I’ll make my decision in 2 weeks/2 days and generally teasing the fans and media about it. I could think of ambiguous quotes, one where he talked about liking to play in the whites but then backtracking after realising what a stupid thing he said. And generally acting like he was the know all whenever he had interviews with the media.
That said, I doubt Ronaldo will play shit when he comes back. He’s got far too much pride for that. His return will only help our club do well, it’s a pity that he’s going to take months to come back by when we might be struggling having played Pool Chelsea and a host of away games.
But I can’t see myself ever enjoy when he gets the ball. If he scores for us, thanks but no thanks from me. That’s all.
PS: Buying Berbatov will ease the hurt. That’s for sure.
July 18th, 2008 at 19:43
Since we’re talking a bit about Veron, I’d like to add my bit:
That was Fergie’s screw up.. Veron was simply much too similar to Beckham: Look at it, had there been no Beckham he would have taken most free kicks and would have scored a fair few.. THat would have helped him settle down most probably. Also the overarching pinpoint passes were the trademark of Becks. Fans were used to it by then… Also Seba was a range scorer much like the Spice boy. Which means that for all of his supposed strentghs, there awas already a settled player down his stuff week in week out. He didnt stand a chance.
Plus added to that he clearly couldn’t cope with the price tag… On the other hand I’m sure he would have done great had CQ been there to guide him at the time..
July 18th, 2008 at 19:46
Oh and I was a Veron fan from his time at Lazio, way before United showed any sign of interest in him. God at the time he was on the same level as Zidane, he was that good…
July 18th, 2008 at 19:49
Grognard,
I think the cog in the wheel reference of Ronaldo to United is right in the overall scheme of things of United as a club. He was more than a cog last two seasons, but I think R… refers to him being a cog in the success of United as a club (the overall history). Correct me if I’m wrong R…
July 18th, 2008 at 19:50
@Nico QB: I asked about Rodders before, but having thought about it Ole might have asked for him to stay. He will be hugely important for Ole’ setup both as the key player and in intergrating the twins to the god aweful British climate. Clegg and Walker were old school players I think Dan and RR pointed that out!
@Grognard: ‘Man what I wouldn’t give to have George Bush’s KGB style surveillance apparatus in play here so I could listen to every juicy word coming out of each other’s mouths.’ -lol Wouldn’t we all mate, Ronaldo fending him off with his crutches whilst Fergie throws scorching hot tea at the ’silent winker’.
Off topic-sorry ranters- How on fucks name does the FA go about charging Patrice Evra for standing up against rasism, when they waist year after year convicing the fans they have stamped rasism out?!? This after they ignore the ‘BIG CHIEF’ hail Blatter! double standards.
I swear if the FA collect money or god forbid ban Evra whilst letting Luton Town rot(my cousin played there), they will lose all respect.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:00
Deja vu concerning spurs reporting Man utd! I can only forsee Dimi running back to his homeland becoming a mute and fending off Paris Hilton whilst proclaiming himself slave of the century!
July 18th, 2008 at 20:02
this will be our test season without ronaldo..if we succsede to show our team caracter and spirit playing good football without him in the first three months of the campagn….we will send huge message to the cunt, to real madrid and to media…that WE ARE MAN UNITED….and they can fuck off…and that is what I`m expacting from our heroes…Buy Berba and show them who are man utd…and leave the cunt on the beanch till november or december…that would be another story…After that there is gonna be completly different ronaldo….saying around how he loves us and other bullshits with that…
July 18th, 2008 at 20:07
Apperently United has been reported to the FA by Spurs for ‘tapping up’ Berbatov. Fuck spurs! They said it was the same as the Ronaldo situation. Is it really worth all this? And I didnt see the press conference with SAF, but did he actually say anything about Berbatov specifically, or just reference that we made a bid for someone who will imporove our team greatly?
July 18th, 2008 at 20:10
@Grog: Good for you.
Its no good bashing/booing someone who is a part of your team, sentiments are alright but deep rooted hatred is not. I like Christiano but i do not trust him, so anything he does of the field doesnt bother me. As long as he stays true to his service, which is to give his m**f**ng all on the field,and doesnt utters something against united, i have no personal vendetta against him. He is ambitious, We can live with that.
Now show me the goals kid.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:21
@Red Ranter: Right on R.R. Exactly.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:23
Well played AGP, probably shouldnt take a piss break in the middle of posting very important news because then ill look like an ass for posting it second. Awesome!
July 18th, 2008 at 20:29
In my opinion Berbatov can be a little lazy sometimes. Well, at least during some of the Spurs games i’ve seen in the last couple of seasons. There’s no question he can score a lot of goals for the club he plays for but i’m not totally convinced with his working attitude yet. But one thing’s for certain, he can’t afford to lazy if ever he comes to OT.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:34
I really want to place a serious question here: you are working in a company with a decent pay, say there is another company ready to offer you double of what you are getting and it is located in a better place – won’t you be tempted to join. Well, we are all human and we tend to go where we get more money or sophistication as we have our own personal responsibility like family, kids, future etc…. I did a similar thing and I can never point my finger at CR7 for what he has done. He is only (what?) 23 or 24 and he is from a different culture – you cannot expect him to react the way you wanted when times like these. Yes he acted like a girl/coward/whatever.. That must be acceptable. I could be wrong but this is my opinion – Forgive/Forget and accept him, just remember what he has done to us in the past couple of seasons.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:34
How is it tapping up when you’ve tabled an official bid? Do they have proof that contact with the player was made prior to approaching Spurs? I don’t even recall Fergie mentioning Berbatov by name until today’s news. Perhaps I missed it.
Can’t wait to see what Blatter comes out with in response to this news.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:34
@RedDevil: I see where you are coming from and I respect it. But here is analogy that best supports my feelings. I am married to a girl I love to death for five years. She then drops a bomb on me and says she doesn’t feel love for me anymore and that she loves and is having an affair with a handsome and rather pretentious Spaniard. So how do I react? I tell her that she must forget her relationship and stay. She says to me that I don’t love you anymore and that you can’t make me stay as I am not your slave. I tell her that she is legally and ethically married to me and in the eyes of God and the law, I do not have to give her a divorce. In fact, I will do one better. I will lock her up in my home where she will not be allowed to have any further contact with that bloody Spaniard and she must now please me and make me feel like she used to. And that means hard core shagging.
Now correct me if I’m wrong but if you look at things from that point of view, one can see how I doubt very much the girl will show me the love and devotion I expect and as far as shagging goes (game day) she comes up cold and totally lacking passion and emotion. It’s like having sex with a blowup doll (I’m not talking from experience here
). This is a satirical analogy but I see the situation being similar.
I will say this, if and when Ronaldo returns and he can prove to me and the millions of United fans that he has put this Real business behind him and he is totally devoted to United, then I may reconsider my position. Ronaldo has to show me he loves United and is devoted to the team. And there is no better way than seeing him show passion and effort on the field. And I feel I am a good judge if I see a player not giving 100% or just going through the motions (look under Berbatov 2007-08). Frankly I seriously doubt that he will come through for us. He has shown us the two faces of his character and that potential to be a tremendous distraction and cancer on a team when he sulks or when he isn’t getting his way.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:39
@Red Ranter: Sorry RR I don’t interpret what he says in that way. It sounds to me that he is referring to the team’s recent success. Only he can answer that question for us though.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:44
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/teams/t/tottenham_hotspur/7514933.stm
what now then?
July 18th, 2008 at 20:44
@Comma: Now honestly, if FIFA said that we had no proof of Ronaldo being tapped up by Madrid which is so bloody obviously false, then how on Earth can the FA find anything wrong with United’s conduct in regards to Berbatov? Mind boggling reaction from Spurs and possibly a deal killer for Berby. How ion Earth can you sit down after this and do business with the cunts when they accuse of this. But I guess that wouldn’t stop Real if Ronaldo were made available.
By the way, where did you read this?
July 18th, 2008 at 20:48
@R…: You are mistaking hatred for a feeling of bitter betrayal. I don’t hate my ex, but as far as my life goes, she’s dead to me. That’s the way I feel about Ronaldo. He has betrayed my love and trust in him and for that I just don’t forgive easily. If you do that’s fine, but please don’t expect everyone to just accept this prick back with open arms. Some of us just don’t have that kind of forgiveness or fickleness in our nature. He hasn’t even come out an apologized to Man Utd, Fergie or the supporters yet. Should he do so, I’ll reconsider my stance. Unitle then, he is dead to me.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:51
@samphraim: Were you under a contract when you bolted for the better job? Better yet, were you a spoilt multi millionaire who hasn’t had to really work a day in his life out there in the regular rat race? If not, then I don’t see the comparison, sorry.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:53
@Red Ranter: er RR, those 2 names are apart of the squad traveling to Africa, the same squad you put in your post, i guess you copied and pasted it
. can someone explain to me what we have done wrong in putting a bid in for berba? fergie never said it was berbatov(even though everyone knew) and it looks like the only evidence they have is the sun, well done levy you prat, you just made your self look stupid.
July 18th, 2008 at 20:57
link
July 18th, 2008 at 20:58
@Grognard: I read it on sky, link here. And I completely agree with you on the whole wtf were they thinking thing. The thing that worries me is, we seem to have worse luck with things like this, since we arent exactly in bed with the FA like Madrid is with FIFA and UEFA.
In all fairness, at the end of the statement Daniel Levy all but resigned the fact that they (Berbatov and Keane) were on their way out. It seems, if I read correctly, that what set them off was SAF’s comments from today, which is why I asked if he actually said Berbatov’s name in the press conference or just the standard, “We’ve made a bid.” line. I dont really care about those scouser fuckers.
July 18th, 2008 at 22:33
Have I ever loved Ronaldo? NO! Why? Coz he loved REAL. Will I be happy and thankful when he scores, yes why not. Yes he behaved like a cunt, but I really dont care as long as he bangs in the goals. He always loved real and that will never change, and for him it was when he will leave not how.
SO, I am glad he is staying and I can stick it up my scouser friends.
but as you all know he is no saviour and we have a better chance with him.
July 18th, 2008 at 22:45
@Grognard:
Why should he have demanded a transfer? I mean put yourself in his shoes, you are playing for Real Madrid and you have just been part of a team that’s won a bunch of trophies. United then express an interest through the media and while its a club in the same world bracket as Real they have been less successful. Your heart tells you you should demand a move, your head however is telling you that your at the right club. Now do you walk up and demand a move, do you go out and tell the press you want to move especially when no actual offers been made. Well you would id imagine as with comments like ‘lets boo our own players’ it seems your heart shouts over your head but i’m sure most people would be somewhat torn. Ultimately your heart will generally win out in the battle as long as the two clubs are of a similar level as they are in this case but its never going to be clear cut enough for you to make any grand gestures like demanding a transfer but more the kind of decision you make when you have to as the offers there and then have your head telling your heart it was a mistake after signing.
The simple fact of the matter is some people, you included ask way too much of players. You expect them to rewrite their dreams the minute they sign which is asking too much. Its just unrealistic. Most players are not at their dream club, and they could be at the other club all their life and grow to love the club but their dream will still be there and they will have a desire to fulfil it. We should actually be pleased that Ronaldos always been honest about his dream unlike so many other players (Currently we have Lampard who since joining chelsea has continually claimed its his club and his dream)
July 18th, 2008 at 22:49
As far as I’m concerned Ronaldo should be sold for a few reasons. One is he has no loyalty, another is the £70m in question – Imagine what you could buy with it. Another is the simple fact that no man is bigger than the team and Ronaldo thinks he is. As regards his replacement it has to be an out and out striker. My first choice would be very ambitious – Drogba. he would be an absolute revolation at United. His strength, aggression and ability to hold up the ball would make him perfect. he would make chances for Tevez and Rooney by holding the ball and they would make chances for him. you’d be guaranteed 30 goals a season by him. The obvious stumbling block is Chelsea’s willingness to sell to a rival o I doubt it would happen but it’s a thought
July 18th, 2008 at 22:55
@southroy:
If the quotes are from Fergie and United have had their offer rejected and told that he isn’t for sale then quite frankly we deserve any punishment we get as its extremely hypocritical. Its not quite as bad as Real as we have tabled an offer but its not far from it.
However if the quotes are lifted from the Norwegian site by the sun and all Fergie has officially said is that we have tabled an offer for a player we have done nothing wrong. Its just a case once again of lazy journalism
July 18th, 2008 at 23:08
If Ronaldo stays, I don’t know how happy I am about him having the magical number 7 jersey. That shirt is the epitome of everything great about Man United.
July 18th, 2008 at 23:14
@Paddy:
Should we sell Rooney too then, after all look at the lack of loyalty he has shown when he left Everton to join us
What about Rio. Where was his loyalty to West Ham
ect ect
I’m sure loyalty is a factor when any footballer makes a decision but you cant let a sense of loyalty be the overiding factor. That is after all a career killer. Look at Wes Brown for example, due to loyalty and injuries he has wasted so much of his career and the likes of Oshea and Fletcher seem to be following suit. Its good to see as a fan but its also potentially a major mistake on their parts.
Being attracted by the interest shown by his dream club isn’t enough to make lack of loyalty a trait of his, just like it doesn’t make Rooney disloyal that he left dream club for one that was better suited to take his career forward
As for the 70mill. What 70mill? Real don’t want to pay 70mill as even marca are conceding. Infact it seems they would like to get him for less than they want to seel Robinho to chelsea
July 18th, 2008 at 23:20
@Comma: I don’t see how mentioning the name of the player is wrong or tapping up if you have put a bid in for him. Levy and Spurs are stirring an unjustified shit storm to cover their asses because they know they will be selling both Berbatov and Keane. Why aren’t they accusing Liverpool of the same over Keane? For whatever reason United seems to be a team that’s very unpopular with other teams, the FA, FIFA and UEFA, and I don’t really know why.
July 18th, 2008 at 23:29
@Grognard: They have reported Liverpool also to the FA. Link
July 18th, 2008 at 23:53
@Wakey: Look, I don’t really get this mentality in football about demanding or wanting to play for my dream club. Having been brought up in Canada and having gotten used the way sports organizations and athletes act here in North America is way way different. Players are drafted by clubs and they don’t have the option to go to their dream club unless they are traded or until their contract is up and they are free agents. Most players in fact never play for their dream club. So Ronaldo’s love for Real breaks my fucking heart. He should grow the fuck up and be a true professional and show the respect and allegiance to the team that gave him his big opportunity and that made him the millionaire egotistical cunt he is today.
I’ll put myself in his shoes. If I had been granted this rare and prestigious opportunity to play for one of the greatest club teams of all time, I’d say WOW! What an honor. What does it mean to be a professional? My friend grew up with a former NHL (hockey) superstar named Cam Neely. Neely got drafted by his home town Vancouver Canucks but was soon traded to the Boston Bruins where he played the rest of his career and became a Hall of Fame player. But here’s the thing, Cam grew up hating the Boston Bruins and was actually a die hard Montreal Canadiens fan. For those who don’t know, Boston and Montreal are one of the great rivalries in the sport. I for one am a die hard Boston fan and I was a big Neely fan despite his childhood love for Montreal. Still, the player never ever asked to be traded to Montreal. When his contracts would expire, did he bolt and go to the Candiens? No, he stayed and retired a Boston Bruins player and respected the team that took a chance on him and helped make him a star. He showed loyalty and love for a team that he never supported as a child. Today he is an executive working with the Bruins General Manager. Wayne Rooney would be an example of what I’m talking about in the EPL. And if you think it’s a foreign thing, I can give you a list of hundreds of European players who came over to North America and stayed with one team for all or most of their careers and didn’t demand to move to LA or New York because they paid the most money or because they were glamor cities. Ronaldo has no excuse for his actions and I find it sickening after reading for two months how much many of you hated his guts that some of you now are changing your tune and forgiving him or accepting him back in the fold without him having come out and apologized. And as for why he didn’t come out and ask for a transfer? It’s because he would stand to lose something like 15% of his contract if he demanded a move. Therefore he left it up to Real Madrid to do his bidding for him like a typical snake in the grass.
Don’t mistake my passion and stubbornness for stupidity. Their is nothing stupid about what I am feeling or thinking. It’s plain and simple, he’s dead to me until he apologizes to all of us. Scoring a goal upon his return is not an apology and it sickens me the way some of you will sell out for a fucking goal or a thrill. For all I know he could be a released child molester or rapist but if he scores for us, that’s OK. It’s an inability for people to take a brave stand and fight for something that’s right and honorable that makes our society such a morally bankrupt place to live in. Nothing affects people as long as they get their bloody fix. Well hurrah! You all will get a fresh supply of the drug you are addicted to. A nice shot of Ronaldo wearing United red and prancing his candy ass all over OT and all is well with the world. Bloody pathetic!
To quote Doctor Evil, “You just don’t get it do ya?”
July 18th, 2008 at 23:56
@RedAddict: It’s the name above the number that counts.
July 18th, 2008 at 23:57
I agree Tottenham are just kicking up a fuss to take the heat off the board when they sell two of their best players. If anything Manchester United are one of the more discreet clubs when it comes to conducting transfer business.
Ferguson only confirmed his interest after a bid was made.
That is completely different from Real/Ronaldo and Liverpool/Barry where the clubs expressed their interest unsettling the player before making a bid, or in the case of Real not even making a bid
July 19th, 2008 at 0:00
@Red Ranter: Well I guess that proves that they are total ass clowns and drama queens. Whose next Sunderland for being interested in four of their players? Levy is obviously missing something upstairs. He’s using this Ronaldo and Real mess to make his case to the fans of Tottenham so that when he finally sells, he won’t look like the villain. It’s a smart, sinister and highly unethical move on his part but that’s what you do to save face after you have been embarrassed. Fergie on the other hand is risking the security and harmony of the team in order to not feel that kind of embarrassment to his ego.
July 19th, 2008 at 0:10
Read up to 62 comment and wanted to reply. Seems to me that many people forgot that day that our legendary captain was talking shit about our own team, when boro trashed us. Well I haven’t and I I will eat my pride, if I have to, not to ever have a day like that. So to put it into simple words, as long as Ronaldo wins us games and trophies, I will take anything, and I believe he will, just because of his ego and pride. If I was able to deffend Beckhams antics (like waring his wifes underware and so on) I can surely stomach everything from this scumbag. I mean it, and I know I might be massacred for this comment,but I would rather see mercenaries winning everything for our team, then loyal players loosing. I felt very sad right after I typed that, but I learned my lesson from Chelski domination and even though I knew they bought the titles, it didn’t ease the pain I felt. “Nobody judges winners” and Ronaldo is one, but if he fails I will gladly join you and we can get our revenge for what he put us through.
P.S. Someone said that this is like love affair when you love the girl dearly, but she doesn’t love you and the author said that the right thing to do would be to get reed of her, which I agree with, however , I don’t know about you, but I am not sure that I could have done the “right thing”. I don’t love Ronaldo, but I love what he doesn for our team.
July 19th, 2008 at 0:26
@Grognard: I have opinions on it, will do it in a post shortly.
July 19th, 2008 at 0:46
@Grognard:
I understand the emotion involved in this. Belive me I do as I would have been very happy to se the “slave” f**k of to Real. Also I am as pissed off at the f**ker as you are, but I think you let your emotions get the better of you here.
Emotions aside, there is several very good reasons behind Fergies decition to not sell, all solid footballing reasons.
The most important reason is the message it sends to Real, that United is not a team to bully into anything. Think about it. Real has spent their whole transfer window chasing Ronaldo and in the end they screwed up. They didn’t get their target. Do they have a backup plan? I seriously doubt it. Maybe next time around they think twice before they try to bully United?
On the other hand if United had backtracked and sold Ronaldo to Real this summer, then the message is that United is a team that can be bullied to sell and they can apply the very same tactic when Anderson is the best player in the world.
Ronaldo is also our best player. We can’t deny that. Selling our best player with no one to replace him is suicide. And lets be honest. There is no one out there today that can fill his boots. Not that are available that is. Look at the dippers. They have tried to get a decent winger for years without success. If we sold off the ingrate who should replace him? Sneijder? Robben? No way. Sneijder has ruled out a move to us, and Robben is always injured. (Besides I would not want him at United either, very similar character to that of our own personal favourite slave), Ribery? Not happening as he is very happy in Bayern. Queresma? Not good enough, same goes for Simao and Van Der Vaart. In short there is no one to replace him.
The third reason is strongly linked to reason number two. Since there is no replacement available today, it buys us time to find one. One year from now we will know how Nani has developed so maybe he is the replacement we need. Today Nani is neither mature enough or good enough to replace Ronaldo. Also a year from now some of the targets that are unavailable today can be available, and some new talent might have emerged that might be able to replace him.
Fourth, is strongly linked to reason 1. If United sell now they send out a message to other clubs that we can be bullied into selling our best players. Next AC Milan or Barcelona can try the same tactics with Anderson or Nani? You never know. Again this sends out a message that we are not to be bullied with.
I also agree that there are footballing reasons why we should sell him as well I strongly feel that the pro sale reasons are not as good as to con sale reasons.
The first reason to sell is that the team spirit might suffer because of this. Whilst I agree that that might be an issiue I can’t see it as so big an obstacle that it can’t be handled with the correct man management. And we all know that man management is fergies biggest strenght. The english players will probably be a little crossed, but remember that United is not a side consisting of all english players anymore. Players like Tevez, Nani, Anderson understand where Ronaldo comes from. To them United is not the pinacle, Real is. Furthermore Ferdinand and Carrick have both stated that they want Ronaldo to stay. I doubt that that has changed.
Ronaldo might play poor on purpose or his comitment might not be there. I say bullshit! Remember that Ronaldo cares about one thing only and thats himself. His ego can’t take being second best. Therefor he will continue to work just as hard for us as he has done in the past, because he needs to be the best. He needs the attention that being the best brings.
So to sum it all up. I feel that the con sale reason is greater than the pro, and the feelings of the fans is not a reason. We as fans are not bigger than the club either. Fergie has made his decition on footballing reasons and not feelings. Fergie always makes his decitions based on footballing reasons. You know as well as I that if Fergie thought that Ronaldo was hurting the team spirit then our “favourite slave” would be out the door before he knew what hit him. Van Nistelrooy hurt the team spirit and hindered our game. Poof he was gone, and on hindsight we have seen that it was the right move, the same would happend to Ronaldo if that were the case. And you know it as well as I do.
And to wrap it all up. NEVER EVER WILL I BOOO A PLAYER THAT PLAYS FOR UNITED. It is the worst behaviour of fans that I can think of and should never happend almost no matter what. The only reason is if a player looks disinterested and clearly shows signs that his head is not in it. I think booing is disgracefull and it dosen’t help anyone. During the match we should focus on our team and after the match we can slag of the players as much as we want to. but NEVER, and I do mean NEVER (!!!) during a match.
If we start booing the assh**e now he will never change his mind, he will never have the attitude change that I hope he will get (But I probably will never get to see that wish come true). If we start to boo him we just prove to him that he was right in wanting away. In his head he gets the justification he needs, and next summer he’s of to madrid.
Now I’m not saying that we should cheer him on either. Just treat him with silence. Sometimes silence is worth more than a thousands boos. Especially in the case of CR7.
And no I’m not forgiving him. He needs to stay with us for the next 7-8 years for that. Playing his ass off every seasons and at the same time he needs an attitude change ala Ferdinand. Then I might forgive.
Shit this became a very long post. Im of to bed now. Good night!
July 19th, 2008 at 0:51
@dan(u-ol): Sigh…the media backlash over this is gonna be pouring in by tomorrow. I really wonder where the quotes came from, because i doubt Fergie would change his stance and mention the players when he said he wouldn’t less than a day before.
July 19th, 2008 at 0:55
“NEVER EVER WILL I BOOO A PLAYER THAT PLAYS FOR UNITED” NorwegianDevil
You are a proper supporter son.
July 19th, 2008 at 1:03
@SHANNON:
We all are. That why we are posting here. I’m not more of a supporter than Groggy, nor less.
We are all united in our love of red devils.
July 19th, 2008 at 1:04
@Grognard:
Its bullshit to say it doesn’t happen in North American Sport. People who play sports are almost always fans of that sport and have teams they follow. Playing for a club you follow is always going to be a dream to play for that team. As Ronaldo said himself “sometimes dreams don’t come true” and you may end up playing for another club long term and you may also choose not to play for your dream club (See scholes for example who would love to play for oldham) because the club cant offer the required level of football BUT that doest stop it being a dream move.
Ronaldo hasnt handed a transfer request in (and he wouldnt lose out if he did, he would still be getting paid and if United sold him he would be inline for a signing on fee and new wages) so he has really done nothing wrong except find himself stuck between two clubs, one tugging at his heart, the other his head. I for one don’t envy him being in that situation especially with Real playing silly buggers and not even making it a real situation
July 19th, 2008 at 1:12
NorwegianDevil good post, with really good points.
Rd agreed and I am not looking for it. Not that I agree and all I mean, even if SAF said his name, we made an offer, so it should be fine, but then again if Spurs said that Berba is not for sale, it might be troublsome, not from FA, but from scum and arse fans. They were waiting for an excuse like this.
July 19th, 2008 at 2:11
Fuckin’ hell! Kaka to Chelsea for £80m?
July 19th, 2008 at 2:19
I am torn. Ronaldo has never really been one of my favourite players but I have been cheering him on for 5 years hoping that he would cut the shit out his game and becoming the player that I know that he can be (he came a long way this season but still loses the ball way too often). I suppose that I have come to take him (along with Rooney) for granted. These were talked up as the future of this team for years to come and kept me optimistic about the future when we weren’t winning anything 3 or 4 years ago. After Ronaldo-Rooney-gate at the WC I just knew Ronaldo would stay. After he signed that contract last year I thought that that would be the end of it and he would stay long-term. Now I don’t know what to think.
July 19th, 2008 at 2:30
@Red Ranter: Well that’s a bit out of the blue.
That said Kaka is overrated IMO. He is too inconsistant for my liking. And this is getting ridiculous they already have Lampard, Ballack and Deco. This must be BS
July 19th, 2008 at 2:52
I am hoping this season rooney can be our ronaldo of last season.
July 19th, 2008 at 3:25
@Red Ranter:
If thats true thank god the likes of Grog arent running United. Real would have got a real bargin at the 60-70mill people alot of people wanted him sold for. The going rate based on that must be atleast 90mill, maybe even more as AC Milan are in a position of needing to sell more than we are
July 19th, 2008 at 3:29
Actually we should do what Chelsea keep doing to us and hijack the deal. He has expressed a liking for united so would surely been interested and it would signal our intentions if we could get Kaka and Keep ronaldo
July 19th, 2008 at 5:29
@NorwegianDevil: You bring up some very strong and well thought arguments and you know, I really cannot disagree with much of it. I’m not the emotional basket case that some may think I am and I am capable of seeing the merits to not booing the player even though his lack of loyalty and inability to apologize makes me feel he deserves a major bitch slapping. So contrary to what many may think I am not going to battle you on this one. You bring up solid and well supported reasons for your position. In fact, two months ago when this all started my original position was to not give in to Real Madrid and teach them a lesson. This of course is before Ronaldo himself got involved and before he made his “I am a slave” comment. So I thank you for your perspective and I do see another angle at this.
July 19th, 2008 at 5:40
@Wakey: It’s not bullshit. PLayers in North America may have the dream but very few ever manage to live it and 99% of them accept it and find a love and loyalty for the teams they play for. If you are from North America you would know this. If not kindly shut the fuck up and stop calling somebody’s theory bullshit. Learn to disagree in a more dignified manner or don’t bother to at all.
And there is a FIFA rule in place that makes a player lose either 10% or 15% of their contract if they demand a transfer before a certain period of time.
And finally, “If thats true thank god the likes of Grog arent running United.” What a polite and friendly thing to say about a fellow blogger. In fact, you are showing me the same venom and I am showing for Ronaldo and I am the one who is defending you and other fans with my stance. Perhaps I don’t play for the team but do I not deserve the same consideration and courtesy according to my loyalty and allegiance? Instead I get insulted and made a mockery of by fellow blogger. And trust me, I am really struggling showing some politeness here. Wakey up!
July 19th, 2008 at 5:43
@Wakey: And you say thank God I am not running United. The same goes for you mate. Kaka is an overrated piece of shit and has also become more and more injury prone. Chelsea don’t even need him but even if they get him, we should still be better if we can grab Berbatov. The only reson he is going to Chelsea is because of Scolari, a manger who is completely unproven in in club football in Europe and especially at this level. Lets see how he deals with all the egos and all the different nationalities.
July 19th, 2008 at 6:47
Kaka to Chelsea makes perfect sense. They have a replacement already in the form of Ronaldinho who they obviously believe they can rehabiliate. They also need the money. Knowing Milan they might even try to get Shevshenko to be part of the deal.
We have nothing to worry about next season. Deco and Kaka will take time to adapt and will require a big change in the way Chelsea play that will take time to translate into results. Neither player offers much defensively and Chelsea teams have always been built on defence first. I also think that Chelsea will lack width next season as they would be crazy to keep playing Malouda and Cole was never a winger in the first place.
As for us we have pretty much the same team as last season and Berbatov would complete us and help us win many of the matches we drew or lost last season because we were overreliant on Ronaldo as our only consistent finisher.
July 19th, 2008 at 6:50
@Red Ranter:
‘kaka to chelsea’
How can we sieve this from all the other B.S transfer rumors being hurled around? I am not familiar with UK newspapers…does the Guardian usually get things right?
if true then maybe lampard is moving on
July 19th, 2008 at 6:50
@Grognard: Believe me when I tell you that I understand where you are coming from! More than you think. Tho never my favourite, you have to work very hard not to acknowledge “Kunta Kintes” (For the unknowing, one of the slaves in the book Roots) contribution to our team the last two years. I loved him for that contribution and thankfully I was very sceptical about his personality of the pitch, making this a bit easier to swallow since I saw it comming a mile away.
Having said that my love for him died this summer. I will never sing his name again if his attitude doesen’t change. And we all know that the chances of that happening is as big as snow in hell. But hey, miracles has happened before and will happend again.
That last post I wrote was very hard to write because I really struggled to get my emotions in check, but belive you me that if I ever got a one-to-one with two-face. No footballing reasons could ever keep me from going ballistic on his ass.
My primary concern tho is the well being of United. And hence I acknowledge that our team is better off with him on it. For now.
July 19th, 2008 at 6:57
@Kal: The guardian is one of the more serious ones in my opinion, along with The times. The ones to be vary about is the likes of the sun and the mirror as they are just full of shit!
Having said that, even the broadsheets have their amount of transfer bullshit so I don’t know if I believe it. But as has been pointed out earlier, the transfer makes perfect sense.
July 19th, 2008 at 8:17
@Wakey: Mate are you looking to wind people up here? Get the hell out if that’s the case. Stop this nonsense of taking cheap pot shots at people. “Thank God the likes of Grog are not running United?” Was that even necessary? Do you understand the term “agree to disagree in a civilised manner”?
If you want to take pot shots or make sarcastic jibes there are tons of other forums around the place.
July 19th, 2008 at 11:16
@Red Ranter:
It wasn’t a dig at him. Some people here are just too over sensitive. It was an observation that people, with grog being the worst of them, have been demanding we sell Ronaldo for the last few months for deals in the 60-70mill range and that if we had people like this who are letting their emotions rule them were running the club we would now be kicking ourselves as we would have got between 9 and 19 million less for the best player in the world than Chelsea are paying for a player whos currently not as good and who is at a club that financially really need to sell. Its a valid point in counter again to the likes of Grog who seem to think that Fans emotions should be forcing Gill and Fergie’s decisions at the club rather than a step back being taken and a level head kept. If people are going to post wild emotion fuelled views that border on hatred then when it is shown that they were in the wrong they will be referenced back just as I did with Grog
July 19th, 2008 at 11:35
Just on the topic of Berba, Ive always been of the opinion that we’ve never needed him, reminded me too much of van nistlerooy with a tad more flair. Obviously everyones seen the way we’ve played last season without a focal point, however if it wasn’t for ronaldo’s clinical finishing, we could’ve just as easily not won the league or the champs. Fergie knows best however, this probably means saha is leaving.
July 19th, 2008 at 11:44
@Grognard:
I called it bullshit because its what it is. Americans aren’t some kind of shining light for ‘loyalty’. In Europe most players aren’t at the club they would dream of playing and never have the chance to join the their dream club. They buckle down and play as well as they can to win things. You see players like Alan Smith playing for a team that he would have hated and doing so full of commitment. No-one had a problem with Keane continually going on about wanting to play for Celtic, or Tevez of going back to Boca and playing in spain. Even with Ronaldo until Real became interested no-one had a problem. And I highly doubt that in America that players in the us sports don’t sometimes express a dream of playing for a certain team. You are simply manufacturing a situation and ignoring facts to keep up you hate campaign
July 19th, 2008 at 12:10
This Kaka stuff LOOKS real but surely it can’t have legs, I mean Chelski are begging Lampard to stay and yet buying another centre midfielder. This is crazy to me cos I know Makalele is of to PSG but which 3 CMs do Chelski start? The player I rate most at Chelski is Essien but the ‘big’ names are gonna bully him out, infact as one dimensional as Lampard is if he isn’t in a Chelsea lineup the Drogba doesn’t tick.
LAMPARD
BALLACK
DECO
KAKA? (if rumours have substance)
ESSIEN
OBI MIKEL (hehe no starts for you obi wan)
On paper this is good in practice this will burn Chelski out, most of these players are 26 or above internationals they’re not gonna ‘play sub’ for no money!
That moron Wayne Bridge is staying at Chelski if Sidwell would have stayed I think his role would have been head groundsman!
July 19th, 2008 at 12:57
@Grognard: So you don’t want to be called stupid, but you don’t mind calling people pathetic?
Don’t be so sensitive, if you act the same way. Hypocrizy isn’t well received these days.
July 19th, 2008 at 12:57
@AGP:
I would assume they will play Kaka as one of the 3 uptop tbh. Even if they scolari switches to a 2 up top formation Kaka could and probally would be played off the target man.
Assuming lampard goes it will probably end up being something like
Kaka ——- Drogba —— Cole
Deco — Ballack — Essien
or in a 4-4-2
Drogba
Kaka
Cole — Deco — Essien — SWP
Ofc Drogba may well be off, but I would assume a targetman will be drafted in to replace him. Obi Mikel (and Ballack in a 4-4-2 would be rotated with the others) and Joe Cole would be roatated with the likes of Malouda, SWP (who in a 4-4-2 would potentially get more games but would be rotated you feel), Kalou, and maybe Shevchenko if he is still there
July 19th, 2008 at 13:35
Whya re we taling about Chelski here? Okey, Kaka may move to them but really who cares?
July 19th, 2008 at 13:46
you know guys, we are kinda playing in 15 minutes…
July 19th, 2008 at 13:53
Can anyone please explain why we need Berbatov? Brings back memories of Van Nistelrooy. We changed out whole system!
I can’t see how Man U can justify spending £25 Million on a player of that age.
We should be concentrating on developing our youth system and bidding for younger players.
July 19th, 2008 at 13:58
oh shit i forgot…
July 19th, 2008 at 14:21
http://www.justin.tv/widgets/jtv_live.r8165.swf?channel=mstv_1
link to see the match
July 19th, 2008 at 15:10
Neville fucking retire
July 19th, 2008 at 15:11
Neville is finished
July 19th, 2008 at 15:21
Well given that more or less a first XI are out there, we’ev been awful. Tevez in particular looks well off his game. Oh well, just a friendly. Neville was pretty stupid to stikc a leg in there, the guy was always going to go down. Anyway, 1-0 at the half…
July 19th, 2008 at 15:25
is there any site, which gives live comments of the game, this streaming thing doesnt work here (university firewall
)
July 19th, 2008 at 15:27
theres no real creativity in the team thats out there…eagles and fletch on the wing will never give you anything…anyway fitness…
July 19th, 2008 at 15:45
can anyone post the lineup? its the 60th minute now.. is there a link where I can follow the text commentary?
July 19th, 2008 at 15:48
1-1 eagles header off a tevez cross
July 19th, 2008 at 15:54
Rooney needs to be careful he’s on a yellow now
July 19th, 2008 at 16:16
Neville is done. He wasn’t very good against Aberdeen, and he has been woeful against the 6th best team in South Africa. I’d love to be proven wrong, but there is no way he is keeping Brown out of the team next season.
July 19th, 2008 at 16:40
@Wakey: Exactly my point. You don’t have to take names. I didn’t stop you from calling his theory bullshit, mind, because you made a fist of an argument. But just because you don’t see eye to eye with his opinion does not mean you can take the moral high ground of some sort. Hate campaign or whatever it is, it’s his opinion, and just because you don’t agree with it does not give you licence to pass judgements on him. In my eyes, that thank God statement was a clear case of a dig that was not necessary. Agree with me or stay away.
State your opinions, but stay away from passing judgements or taking cheap digs. Regarding over-sensitivity, sorry, doesn’t justify the dig. You clearly came across as doing that so stay away from that.
Grognard,
Don’t make too much of it if someone calls your opinion BS and backs that up with a cogent argument. He’s attacking your opinion, so that’s fair play. Again, as I said, agree and move on. I don’t want any more responses regarding this issue from both parties here. Or I’ll delete them.
July 19th, 2008 at 16:43
@Wakey: And about American sports, Grognard is dead right. Players may express their dream but north American sport is a socialist system where players have absolutely no power. They are either released as free agents after contracts or traded for another player.
July 19th, 2008 at 16:56
what is really starting to annoy me as a united fan is some of you lot paddy sums on how ironic some of you are, you say ronaldo as no loyalty but let’s be serious he was never a united fan growing up so grow up. How does sporting Lisbon feel when ronaldo nani figo queresma and many of their home-grown players are sold shouldn’t they be loyal, what about Everton who made wayne rooney shouldn’t he be loyal to Everton.
roy keane is totally right football has no loyalty if ronaldo comes back despite what he has said, I have a phew grudges against the guy but I will be cheering him on. I would take christiano ronaldo no matter what he has done over that moody hopeless overrated slouch in berbertov no good to old waste of money and that is a fact and would completely ruin our shape and formation just as veron and van nistelrooy done.
July 19th, 2008 at 17:23
Steve, what most of us are angry about is not Ronaldo wanting to go to Madrid (we always knew he wanted to go to Spain someday) but how he never made his intentions clear when constantly asked by the media. He instead chose to play games with them, and as a result of that, us. This has basically ruined our summer where we should have been basking in our Double Glory, instead the whole summer has been the “does he want to stay or go?” story which has been lapped up by the media.
I, for one, would of had no problem with him coming out with a statement saying: “I feel that it is time for me to move on now, I have won everything I can with the club, and I feel that it is the right time for me to fulfill my dream of playing for Real. I would like to thank the club and all the fans for all the support they have given me and I wish them well for the future.”
This would be very similar to what Queiroz and Pique said, and nobody can really begrudge them their moves as their reasons were fair. Instead Ronaldo played games, and we still don’t know what he wants! We have an idea, but we can’t be completely sure.
PS: The Rooney situation is a little different as Rooney was an Everton fan, but decided that for his career, a move to us would be a huge step up. Ronaldo has never been a Madrid fan, his boyhood club was Benfica (who’s fans hate him for betraying his club loyalties and signing for their rivals Sporting as a youngster, a little like Ramsey signed for Arsenal despite being a United fan), also, Madrid, in a footballing sense, is not a step up from a team that has just won back to back Premiership titles and are Champions of Europe, however to mediterranian lads liike him they are seen as the pinacle of football. Loyalty these days is a thing of the past, players care for themselves and their careers, like Roy Keane said, in football these days, it’s every man for himself.
July 19th, 2008 at 17:39
Rooney needs to cool his temper!
July 19th, 2008 at 18:01
@steve: Loyalty has nothing to do do with the team you grew up supporting. That is a child’s perspective and of course they will carry that in their hearts when they grow up. What they will also carry in their hearts when they are adults is the the knowledge of what reality is. Reality is that if you want to play the game at the highest level you must go and play for the teams that show the biggest interest in you. Sporting Lisbon showed interest in him first but were willing to sell him to United. United then showed tremendous interest in him having committed their future in him and then handsomely rewarding him financially. He signed a contract and by doing so, he entered a partnership that clearly indicates to anybody with an IQ that childhood loyalties matter not in the world of big business. Manchester has honored his service and he now must honor their commitment and faith in him by living up to his contractual obligations.
Bottom line is that if professional sports were ruled by players choosing to only play for their favorite teams their would be leagues with three teams carrying 50 players and 17 teams having to scrape around to find 11 players to field. RR was correct in referring to American and Canadian sports leagues as socialist in nature. They are. Why? Because there would be anarchy if not. Because the New York Yankees would own every great player in baseball because of their deep wallets and because drafting players is not a territorial thing. A boy brought up in Chicago is not guaranteed he will grow up to become a Chicago Bears player. And nor should he. He is put in a socialist pool of draft picks and the teams who did worst the previous season picks first in that order. This is called fairness. And when they are drafted they are welcomed with open arms and great respect by their new clubs who are building their future dreams based on players like this.
Respecting an organization that believes in you and that banks it’s future on you is far more important and far more adult and mature than holding on to childish dreams of playing for your boyhood team. No it is not I who needs to grow up. It is Ronaldo, Berbatov, and all the other primadonna’s who feel they can go against the grain and destroy decades of business and legal structures designed to protect both player and club from the grubby hands of deceit, greed and tampering. It is fans who hold on to childish loyalties and expect players to act like teenagers, that need to grow up. We are not talking about a playground with young children or an amateur league. We are talking about professional sports and in it’s name (professional) is a clue on how clubs and players need to act in order to conform to it’s rules and regulations. It’s about being a professional and being an adult and leaving childish dreams where they belong, in your subconscious. No, it is not I who needs to grow up. Not by a long shot.
This is not meant as just a reply to Steve but to the many who just don’t get it. Who seem to think that I am an emotional basket case when it comes to Ronaldo and that there is no basis for my argument. I say to you all, BOLLOCKS. What I expected and bloody well demanded of Ronaldo is that he flush his childish ambitions down the toilet and act like a bloody professional who is tied to a contract. This requires total and uninhibited loyalty to the team he is currently contracted to play for. And that’s for the next four years. If he had allusions of playing for his childhood team, he shouldn’t have signed a lucrative contract with United last season. If none of you can see the brutal betrayal in his actions, then I feel nothing more than pity for you all. Like I said earlier, YOU JUST DON’T GET IT!
July 19th, 2008 at 18:13
you know what grognard what he as done is help us win back to back titles and a european cup he as done everything I have expected from him and I would like more. he as been a bigger influence on the team then cantano had on when he wa here, AlexOfMancunia I did not defende him you are right but the reasons I have given are a reality.
July 19th, 2008 at 18:16
@Grognard: I absolutely agree with you that he should act more professionally. He should realise what kind of world he lives in, that’s for sure.
July 19th, 2008 at 18:35
@AlexOfMancunia: Boss, if Ronaldo had come out in open and declared he wanted to leave, his transfer value would drop drastically! Right now the onus is on the club to be willing to sell him to realise his dream. If utd dont sell him, I dont think he would have any grudges. He will continue performing and would hope for his dream to be realised next year or the year after. Why do we think him asking for a transfer is a good thing??? Prob him not saying anything is the best thing (from utd perspective) we (meaning Sir Alex) can always claim he is happy here
July 19th, 2008 at 18:42
Thoughts on the South Africa trip…
I thought I had noticed a Sunderland ruse when I ran past the name Clegg on the flight list, although from what I understand it is the father and not the son, who currently works as the S&C trainer at Sunderland. Does anyone have info on Caveney or Gary Walker. My guess is they are talent evaluators for the youth set-up, but I can’t find any info.
Guesses on the futures of the youth fringe players…
GK
Amos is lucky to be on that trip. Enjoy the reserves me boy
Defense
Evans isn’t going anywhere this season. Silvestre, Brown, and Jonny provide the minimal amount of back-up needed to mount a serious challenge for, if I remember correctly, 7 trophies. Let’s say that again, 7! With Neville and Brown duking it out for RB, I think Simmo will be loaned out until January. Depending on injury/suspensions, it could be for the entire year. If he has to go to Championship to be guaranteed a starting spot, so be it. The boy needs reps and the chance to prove he can handle it, and the Championship ain’t no stroll in the park.
Midfield
Eagles must surely be on his way out. Unless they are recuperating, no one at his age plays in the reserves. We are in need of a solid back-up winger, but I expect Lee Martin to also be loaned for the first 6 months. I would just as soon sell him as well and put the money from both sales towards a adequate backup winger. I wouldn’t be opposed to someone a bit older who doesn’t mind riding the pines in hopes of being on a trophy winning side. Of all the younger player on the trip, I know the least about Darron Gibson. Based on his age, my guess is he will also be loaned.
Forwards
Frazier Campbell has what it takes. I think he needs to stay and challenge for the fourth spot, assuming we get Berbs. However, I get the feeling he is going back to Hull, hopefully only on loan. I’d love to see him hit 10 or so for Hull and maybe put a dent in some of our competition. Hull will need all the help they can get, and even if he’s just on loan, Campbell would be a godsend.
…
I think Simmo and Campbell have the bet chances of breaking into the first team squad. If Fergie doesn’t think they are ready quite yet, I hope they get some valuable first team experience somewhere this year. Bye bye Chris, we’ll miss the boy band haircuts.
July 19th, 2008 at 20:14
Fegie hits back at Levy:
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11667_3839332,00.html
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1036531/Sir-Alex-threat-sue-Spurs-chief-Levy.html
July 19th, 2008 at 20:21
@IBleedRed: Campbell is overrated, and he’ll never break in to the team. His touch isn’t good enough, and he’s no where near strong enough. Defenders in the EPL will just brush him aside like he wasn’t there.
Simmo – maybe, I don’t know. He looks to have most of the attributes needed, but it takes a lot to go from there and into the team.
July 19th, 2008 at 20:49
@Tomas
I think you are being harsh on Campbell. I certainly don’t think Hull supporters would agree with your evaluation that he is overrated. I agree that his touch isn’t the greatest, but his speed is excellent and in the Premiership that goes a long ways. I am not going to argue that Championship defenders are on par with their Premiership equivalents in terms of skill. However, the Championship must rank as one of the more brutal leagues and being able to pop 15 goals at the age of 20 says a lot. Despite that, I don’t Campbell will ever make the grade for United and I hope when we decide to sell him is value is at its peak.
July 19th, 2008 at 23:02
@Grognard:
Yeah lets compare Ronaldo with a bunch of no bodies coming out of college, it is after all the same situation now isnt it? The draft picks are not the same, you have to compare like for like and if you don’t believe the same thing goes on with the top names in American sports then you are deluded. Loyalty only goes so far before its a negative issue, clubs cant keep players on their books for loyalty alone and players cant be expected to give up their dreams and ambitions alone. If that happened then players would never leave a club/team and you complacency would creep into sport (Why try doing well for a team who will always be midtable if you arent going to interest others or in trophies)
You simply cant have a problem with this so called lack of loyalty because its a positive thing to want to be happier and to strive to fulfil your dreams.
And you and others have stated you are annoyed by the way he ‘messed fans around’ but ever thought his dancing around could be uncertainty. He has his dream pulling him towards real and loyalty pulling him to united. People are after all complex and all sorts of factors go into making decisions and more often than not making a decision is very tough as its never clear cut. Expecting him to make a decision based on media reports only and no firm offer when the decision is no doubt a tough one between his heart and his head is asking an awful lot
July 19th, 2008 at 23:27
@Shreyas: I’m glad he’s finally come out to say what i’ve been thinking all along…he never said those quotes. I hope he’s really serious about taking action on The Sun, cr@p papers like that i’ve been printing rubbish for too long and it needs to stop. Levy will end up looking like an idiot for saying all he said based on what a paper printed.
July 20th, 2008 at 1:06
would be funny if fergi wasnt even talking abt berba all this time and had bid on benzema or huntelar or somone and levy is just freaking out.
July 20th, 2008 at 2:32
@steve: So if he was a child molester would you still support him because he brought us back to back championships and the CL? How far does player loyalty go when that player has blatantly spit in your face and called you a rube?
Seriously, blindly supporting a man just because he brought you championships despite the fact his disloyal and morally bankrupt makes me question your priorities mate. In this I am fully in agreement with Fergie. There are more important things than just short term team success. One has to consider long term ramifications. Fergie made his stand and it was firm. I respect it even though I would have preferred a sale. No move, no raise no nothing. But does that mean I have to forget this players snub at me and to the millions of loyal and devoted fans? It’s a personal decision Steve. If you cheer him on I may disagree with you but that is your right. If I jeer him and curse his name that’s my right. But I wouldn’t worry to much about my jeering and booing. I doubt Ronny can hear me cursing his existence all the way from Canada.
July 20th, 2008 at 3:04
@Wakey: That may very well be the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Do you honestly think I was referring to American soccer players? God give me strength. I was referring to real professional sports leagues, not bush league pretenders like MLS. I was referring to the NFL, NBA, Major League Baseball and the NHL. Michael Jordan, Joe Montana, Tom Brady, Bobby Orr, Barry Bonds, Roger Clemens, Alex Pujols, Koby Bryant, Wayne Gretzky, Larry Bird, Sidney Crosby and thousands more over decades. Superstar athletes in those sports every bit as good as Ronaldo is in his and all drafted. Not fucking MLS, a two bit 3rd rate gopher league for soccers, misfits. How do you think they find athletes for North American sports? Do you think they send a scout into a shanty town in Rio looking for the next best thing kicking a can around? There is structure and organization in North American sports and above all, there is far less exploitation of athletes under the age of 18 and strict rules for tampering with athletes who are in College. The interest of the individual’s rights and not those of Real Madrid’s comes first. And a draft procedure and league rules are set in place to prevent a Real from raping a small team over a given period of time after a prospect has been drafted. Safeguards, checks and balances designed to protect players and teams from the sharks that infest the waters. Wouldn’t it be nice if FIFA protected teams and players in the same way instead of letting them be used and exploited and played with?
And I do have a problem with loyalty. I have a problem with loyalty when you sign a contract which in itself is a pledge to give the next five years of your life to the club that has purchased your rights and which has helped you grow and nurtured you. The club that has made you the player you are today. Where is the respect, the gratitude? What happened to honor and living by your word and signature? Happiness and dreams. What a bunch of childish and silly notions knowing we are talking about a multi millionaire kid who has had everything handed to him on a silver platter and where the world is his oyster. Oh yes I am going to bleed over him not living out his dreams in his perfect environment.
No, actually I’d rather feel sorry for a bloke like me who has had his career cut short because of a chronic and degenerative back ailment and who is receiving a disability allowance that is nothing more than poverty wages until and when and if he is able to have surgery and get back on his feet and work. I feel sorry for the poor bastard who works 12 hour days to feed five kids and a wife and can’t make ends meet because his job requires him driving a rig a lot and he can no longer afford the price of gasoline. I feel sorry for the waitress and single mother trying to make ends meet and barely surviving 8-10 hours a day in a stress environment standing and walking on tired feet. But instead you want me to feel for a fucking cunt spoilt rich boy who has everything and wants more. Who has his cake and wants to eat it. I say let him have his cake and I hope he chokes on it because in the bigger scheme of things, his poor problems pale in comparison to mine and billions of other poor souls who would die to have a portion of his poor miserable existence. And shame on you for not seeing it for what it is. God how superficial many of us have become over a bloody sport and our desire to live our own dreams through the endevours of a select few millionaires who don’t even know we exist. Have you ever felt like you were the worthless pawn in a chess game? NO? Well you should. Because like a lot of us, we are all being played.
July 20th, 2008 at 12:29
@Grognard:
Do you even bother reading others comments, after all where did I say anything about MLS. Again you are just inventing things to save your losing argument. You were holding the draft system up as being the same situation as Ronaldo. And it simply isnt, these are relativity unknowns in various sports that have recently left high school or college (depending on sport and the drafting rules) . However even then these players arent just sitting there waiting to picked by a random team. The draft choices are manipuated by the players and their agents to ensure they end up where they want so actually even players in the draft are somewhat similar. And players already at teams will through their agents try and broker trades if an interesting move is in the pipeline, if they are in the NFL, NBA, HHL or MLB it does go on.
What you want from players isnt loyalty, its blind loyalty. You expect them to forget all their dreams and desires as well as their happiness to stay at a club until the end of their contract. You can be interested by a move in the pipeline without being disloyal and as such theres nothing wrong with players wanting to move before the end of their contract as long as they do nothing to force the move (in the way that Gallas for example did). If you force a move through threats your disloyal, if you express an intrest but leave the clubs to decide the outcome and dont start threats and will abide by the outcome then your still loyal. And at this moment we have nothing to suggest Ronaldo isn’t willing to honour his contract.
Also tbh its pretty hypocritical from you to think Ronaldo shouldnt even be considering moving while under contract yet you are all for United selling some players who are under contract and also buying others who are under contract with their clubs. Surely the clubs after all under your belief should be honouring contracts they signed not trying to offload players for profit.
As for feeling like a worthless pawn, thats your own doing. Your so wrapped up in emotion and you have read so much into a situation without any evidence just so you can rant your head off. He hasn’t demanded a move, he hasn’t threatened to score own goals if he doesn’t get a move like Gallas did. All he has done is say its his dream to play for real and then shown some uncertainty on what way he favours. The uncertainty could be him messing everyone about but it could be real uncertainty about if a real bids coming and if his head or his heart is the right option to follow. Until theres firm evidence he is messing people around then he should have the benefit of eh doubt rather than people like you demanding he gets booed. You arent in his head, you dont know what he is thinking or how divided he feels over the situation so what right do you have to condemn him for not being clear about what he wants when he may not be clear himself
Oh and one last thing, since when did the American sport system protect youngsters? At the draft stage teams will do everything they can to ensure that the player and their agent want to join them so the draft is being manipulated in the favour of that team. While its generally against the rules players in the draft are bribed with gifts left right and centre, the same with their family.They are also made lots of promises for the future. Thats hardly protecting them.
The same goes on when it comes to college sports, high school kids despite it being against the rules openly get bribes to choose that college by the colleges recruiters. And lets not get started on the circus surrounding not only college sport but high school sport that heaps as much pressure on kids as they will face professionally. And at that age they arent ready for that pressure. After all even alot of High school games get higher average attendance numbers than the likes of Wigan and Bolton and Boro get. Most of these players will never even make it to the college game, let alone pros yet and will find themselves with a sacrificed education and going from being one of the stars of the town to a nobody overnight
July 20th, 2008 at 13:34
@Wakey:
And it simply isnt, these are relativity unknowns in various sports that have recently left high school or college (depending on sport and the drafting rules) . However even then these players arent just sitting there waiting to picked by a random team. The draft choices are manipuated by the players and their agents to ensure they end up where they want so actually even players in the draft are somewhat similar.
Are you even aware of how the draft system works? Let me give you an example. Not too long ago Vince Young was on the lips of every college football fan. He had led his college UT- Austin to a BCS Championship and finished second to Reggie Bush in the Heisman trophy stakes (which is the college football version for the Player of the year) and he got drafted into Tennessee titans — a wank team. Similarly, Reggie Bush got drafter into New Orleans Saints, who again aren’t the best team in the country — they are decent but that’s all you can say about them. The fact is they continue to play for those clubs. Another thing is, the NFL draft for instance works like this: the worst teams get the first pick and they choose players accordingly. Players have absolutely no say in which club they want to join in professional sport in north america. In college football they do.
The American leagues are socialist leagues and cannot really be compared at all to the free market economics that govern soccer in the rest of the world. In that regard I agree. But you have your facts regarding manipulation wrong. Especially in the NFL and NBA that sort of thing is hard. Which is perhaps what Grognard is trying to drive at. And contracts are usually respected in North America, the clubs do have more power, and so do sporting bodies like the NFL and NBA. At the end of the day most player image rights etc are part owned by clubs, part by the govening bodies, AND part by players.
Regarding College and high school football, yes, there are plenty of cases of broken dreams — but then 80% of the people realise that they are not going to make it.
Note: The word football in this post refers to American Football. Not soccer.
July 20th, 2008 at 16:43
@Red Ranter:
I know how the draft system works but if you really believe it to be fair and none manipulated your deluded. You can be the worst team, have the first pick and choose the best player available but does that mean the player will be playing for your team next year. No it doesnt. Picking the player doesnt mean they will sign a contract with you, if they don’t sign a contract you have wasted your draft pick. In baseball especially Agents price draft picks out of the range of some teams so that the less appealing teams were more likely to go for a safe choice who they know will sign rather than the best choice who they dont think will sign or be able to afford to sign.
In the NFL you also have cases like Eli Manning who told the Chargers there was no way he would play for them. So while the drafted him the immediately traded him to the Giants meaning Manning got his top dollar for being #1 draft, got the team he wanted and the chargers got a good player in return and by all accounts other incentives for the trade.
Its also not uncommon for top players to miss the open try out days put on to help recruiters for the teams decide their picks. Instead they host private ones for the selected teams which are scripted to engineer the right move.
And as for contracts being respected in America, they generally are here. You don’t see many actually break contracts or even threatening to. The clubs choose to cash in rather than risk losing a big transfer fee, where as thats not present in American sports as players are traded for another or draft picks. If in Europe clubs wanted to they could hold out and 99% of the players would respect their contract like in American sports
July 20th, 2008 at 16:57
@Wakey: The day I lose a debate, (because unlike you I am trying not to argue and I am trying not to be rude) to the likes of you will be the day I realize they are shoveling dirt over my dead body. I’m no longer going to waste my time trying to converse with an individual whose aim is nothing more than to antagonize me but who cannot offer a valid and powerful enough argument because of his closed minded narrow view of the world of sports. Some advice, KNOW YOUR BATTLEGROUND. Red Ranter seems to get the connection because he has an open mind to accept outside information that may change his opinion of something. And even though there are sharks surrounding college athletes today offering them bribes, very few take them because should they do so, they are banned from college sports for the rest of their careers. The penalty is severe. Such penalties don’t exist in football for the most part although I have to commend Italy on trying to protect Under 17 year olds from the clutches of their own league. Problem is, there is nothing in place to protect them from Manchester United from coming in to seduce them. The footy system is broken and FIFA is morally and ethically bankrupt. The number of high school kids is high because some sports leagues like baseball and hockey chooses to allow themselves to negotiate with players who are not in college. The difference is that these kids still have hired agents to negotiate on their behalf and who understand the rules of the system. All they can do is to negotiate with teams and tell them how they feel. At the end of the day they are still powerless when it comes to the the draft. The draft protects lesser teams from the Yankees actually stealing a prospect despite your pointless argument. Who cares about bribes and gifts when at the end of the day, the players still has to go through a draft system. If a player passes several rounds of the draft and is still around when a team which bribed is up for a pick, then and only then can their seduction possibly win the day.
And the reason I brought up MLS is because your argument was so weak and unfounded that I honestly thought when you said “Yeah lets compare Ronaldo with a bunch of no bodies coming out of college” that you could only be talking about MLS because then and only then would your weak argument have and legs to walk on. I decided to cover my defense by quickly eliminating that from the fight.
Organized, professional and socially conscious sports organizations (see Canada and USA) may operate in a socialist manner but that is to protect players as well as teams from the meat market and unethical conduct that prevails in world football today. The fact you cannot see this and even more so, when you can’t accept it when strong evidence is placed in front of you just proves to me that you don’t get it and that I am no longer going to bother conversing with a blogger who is not open to anything except what comes out of his own mind. And besides, who really needs the anger and rudeness that you use to deliver your message. Clearly you have anger problems and I am not going to bother with you as all you do is get my anger up to. So, kindly give it a rest.
July 20th, 2008 at 18:01
@Grognard:
1) Stop calling yourself a blogger. You are not blogging.
2) I don’t have anger problems but people like you piss me off as you want to start unwarranted hate campaigns and will spew as much shit as you can till you achieve that. You are no better than the idiots who tried to ruin beckhams life after he was sent off in the world cup or who tried to drive Ronaldo out of the country for actions he didn’t do in the Rooney indecent. Like them your using small things that bear no real relevance and turning it into a grand conspiracy
3) Quite clearly you dont know your own sports as well as you do. As i said to RR one of the NFL’s biggest stars Eli Manning manipulated the draft to get his own choice, MLB is rife with agents pricing teams out of making real draft picks and such like.
4) The youth system in football is no worse than the American system. Its just different. They can poach i football but football academies provide a much more ‘relaxed’ enviorment outside the spotlight which the American system doesnt. From high school on American sports are designed to create a circus around the players with immense pressure put on them. Its all done to help the media and agents make money, so is as corrupt as the Football system
July 20th, 2008 at 21:51
You know you are blatantly rude and fascist individual who is incapable of debating a point without using rude and crass words and statements. Fine you don’t agree with me. That’s OK. But to make statements like “people like you piss me off” and “and will spew their shit”, you are no better than the idiots” etc etc. You are the hate monger in this debate. I have refrained from insulting you by calling you names and referring to you as a simple minded one dimensional idiot which is clearly what you are. Despite the fact I clearly dislike you as much as you dislike me, I at least had the class and good manners up to now to try to keep the argument civil. Did I expect you to give me an intelligent well thought out argument? Of course not. That would require something you are in short supply of, intelligence. Bullshit and venom is something you have a lot of and really you should bottle and go into business. You don’t deserve an intelligent and dignified reply because it’s like talking to rabble. There, I’ve thrown back a little of what I have received and it will be the last time I ever reply to anything you ever say. You are really a piece of work let me tell you. I may not be a blogger but you are bugger.
RR, I have only given back what I received and I felt highly compelled to do so. I will never respond to this clown ever again so I will kindly appreciate you letting me get the opportunity to reply to his insults. as I don’t plan on continuing this, I would appreciate you letting me vent my venom this once.