Mar 24
Man Utd 3-0 Liverpool: Threasy Peasy, Innit?
A lot of pages were spent over the past week discussing tactics, formations, players, attitudes, form, referees. All that came to yesterday as the so-called Big Four clashed with the nation holding it’s collective breaths — according to Sky — for the ‘closest title race in history’. I am sure that was a hyperbole, only short-memoried TV blokes would have you think, as I am fairly certain that such a superlative wouldn’t even apply to the history of the Premier League.
But we are here to talk about yesterday’s game, regardless of the flashlights associated with Easter Sunday.
The formation was more or less expected from either side — keeping the occasion in mind, both managers went for a 4-3-3 in a safety first measure. It was the composition of the sides that had a tale to tell; Benitez’s lineup was the more predictable of the two, which itself was interesting.
Fergie chose a midfield trio of Anderson, Scholes and Carrick. Rooney, Ronaldo and Giggs formed the attacking three while Rio Ferdinand returned from injury to give our back four a more familiar look after two games of constant shuffling. And a return of Edwin van der Sar was also welcome.
I wouldn’t go into how our goals were scored, because I am sure countless match reports, the Match of the Day (Link1 or Link2) and short clips would have given you a good enough idea. What I am interested to talk more about — and what would have a bearing on our season from now — is in the performance, or should we say, my opinion on the team’s performance.
So how good were we? We were outstanding, but, to be fair, the red card took the stuffing out of the ‘dippers. Speaking of which, Mascherano — someone, whom Benitez had the nerve to compare with our own (and only) Roy Keane — showed how one could foolishly laugh ones way out of the pitch and for an early shower. He looked like the village idiot who cheerfully chops at a branch with an axe, not realising that he is sitting on the wrong side of the very branch. To be fair though, I thought the yellow card on Torres that led to Mascherano’s protests was harsh. The referee had a nervy match, overall.
But while things were even before the sending off, United did create more chances. And the goal came when it was 11 v 11. Now fans can be fickle, so I’ll take the advantage of that and say, “Come on now, hand Wesley a fucking contract!” It’s lads like these who rise up to the occasion in such games and Sir Alex’s selection mirrored that sentiment. And it’s needless questioning whether his personnel rose to the occasion.
Let’s do the low down, then, shall we?
Wayne Rooney shrugged his indifferent form in front of goal to give a performance that would make everyone proud. His vision, movement, work-rate — things that we do know about Rooney — was there to the fore. We know what Rooney’s best at, don’t we? He may not be banging the goals in, but for movement, intelligence and spirit to stand up in the games that matter he gets full marks. But for brief moments in the first half, he showed the first touch of a seductress — remember when he plucked VDS’s long punt like the ball was magnetically attracted to his boot? That was the Rooney we all know and love. Now if he could also calm himself down in front of goal…
Ronaldo, the supposed big game bottler who ‘only scores against lesser clubs’, killed it and settled nerves when it began to get a little tight for us. A shout should be given to Nani for another top class delivery from corners. Ronnie could have scored another when he was denied by Reina only for the ball to go on to hit the cross bar.
Michael Carrick once again showed what he can do if he was afforded the space that he had. His range of passing showed that, at the moment, he’s the only player (eligible for England duty) who has the kind of range and composure that can dictate the tempo of a game. While England midfielders are known for their rampaging, all action style, he represents serenity — minimum fuss with maximum damage. Give him space and he can destroy you. And I am not being over the top here. He can have off days, especially when not allowed the space, but on his day he can rival the very best in the business. Yesterday he wasn’t outstanding, but did what was essential — keeping possession of the ball.
And then there was Paul Scholes. He, along with Carrick, reminded us why we won the title last season. It’s a strange situation for us United fans. Just when dissenting voices about certain players gather steam, they respond with a riposte that knock us off our self-styled ivory towers and remind us that — think what we may — at times, we must leave the football to the masters. We may not see too many great servants of our beloved club, so we may as well cherish days like these, just as the Ginger Prince himself conceded in a recent interview; that he knew he has to enjoy every moment because he doesn’t have too much time left.
In what was a collectively mature effort from everyone, there was one player who was towering in his presence: Rio Ferdinand. My preview expressed a worry for United because I felt we wouldn’t be able to cope with Liverpool’s in form forward line if Rio didn’t make it. His surprise return showed us what we missed against Bolton and Derby — despite the clean sheets. Clearly Rio Ferdinand is in the form of his fucking life. And I can’t emphasise how much important he has been to our side more. I think I drew the yin-yang analogy earlier about his partnership with Vidic. But as a ball playing defender, whose reading of the game these days sees little parallel, at least in the premier league, the money we spent on him some years ago is worth every penny.
He hasn’t been popular with fans because of his contract wrangles, and his tendencies towards the flash lifestyle. But on the pitch, this season and last, he has been nothing less than a colossus, albeit a quiet one. John Terry in his prime and Jamie Carragher in that Champions’ League winning side grabbed the headlines because they made so many last ditch tackles that made pretty picture postcards. But Ferdinand moves like liquid, renders the last ditch tackles redundant. Today was his second yellow card of the season, and that too, for God knows why. The value of an excellent defender is at times felt by his absence. And I’d make Rio our joint best player of the season so far. And I am not saying this just based on our performance today. I’ve said it in earlier articles, as well as when asked by Scott in his interview, on my choice for the player of the season.
Rio, sign the contract, and we’ll sing your praises till death.
All in all, it was a performance of extreme maturity and composure, more than being flashily brilliant — and that is also encouraging for such a young side as ours. (Yes, Arsenal aren’t the only young side.)
And away from the emotion and onto what the game holds for our season — the weekend wasn’t ideal because we’d have preferred a Chelsea-Arsenal draw but, being five points ahead of Chelsea and six ahead of Arsenal, we are in control of our own destiny to retaining our title. Let’s not get carried away though. While we cannot emphasise the importance of beating the top teams on the way to the title, more often than not, it’s the lesser sides that tend to decide which way the title goes. So while we can feast on the euphoria that accompanies beating the ‘dippers, let’s hope the players have the prior knowledge, of having done it before, to call upon in the lead up to what is still an exciting title race.
Related items from Red Rants:
- Who Should Be United’s Captain Next Season?
- Rooney Out For A Month
- Porto it is then…
- Man Utd Blog 2007/2008 Home Kit
- Heinze loses arbitration for Liverpool move, what’s next for him and United?
Tags: Match Reports
March 24th, 2008 at 7:47
at half time, Rooney had 5 shots on goal. I’m sure he had several more by the end of the game.
What’s his shots to goals ratio? Anyone?
March 24th, 2008 at 7:54
This season in the league: 75 shots, 8 goals. Do the math. Link
March 24th, 2008 at 10:40
great article, rooney had a great game but until he starts scoring again im still going to say hes off-form and has had a poor overall season. im just wondering, has anyone else noticed that any player we are linnked to, a couple of days later spurs are? bale, nani, hutton, berbatov, Kameni and now fabiano, they even wanted to buy foster from us.
March 24th, 2008 at 10:44
Great result yesterday but i was reminded by a friend l.night that it really aint over yet. GOD FORBID we lose to arsenal we gotta go to the bridge n avoid defeat. WE gotta go undefeated jst to maKE sure!! fingers crossed
March 24th, 2008 at 11:25
I really enjoyed your article, and the interview on ROM. i find there’s alot of sensationalism with some fans\bloggers who jump the gun quite a bit, you are a voice of reason. Thank you for that.
Victory tastes sweeter the morning after the day before, probably because of a more sober recollection of events. I know there are a lot of scousers who are having to deal with the realisation of how far behind united they are. We’re the best team in england, and to prove it we’re gonna have to get a result against arse and chesky.I feel very confident that we can.
Its in europe that i have the most concerns. We simply HAVE to show up against Roma, i’d love to see any remnants from the milan defeat cast aside. We are United, soon to be kings of england, hopefully kings of europe too!
March 24th, 2008 at 12:09
I wonder if Liverpool really played bad or if it was that United made them play bad…
March 24th, 2008 at 12:09
What an article! It made me feel proud of being a United fan. And then I started reading the comments and this sinking feeling overtook me.
Guys, isn’t Rooney’s contribution a little bigger than numbers? I’m sorry to say that you remind me of fans here in Greece, who demand “solutions” after each defeat of their “historic” and “all-conquering” teams.
What else should the boy do yesterday? So many things said about his first touch, but nobody said anything about the way he controlled EVDS’ clearance yesterday. Well, let me point you towards another Premier League statistic: who is the United player with the most assists this year?
March 24th, 2008 at 12:30
Well said, James. If we look at Rooney’s only major chances, one he was completely off balance because he’d just been fouled, one he brought down simply exquisitely but was a bit close to reina, and one he was offside anyway so we’ll excuse him. He was outstanding yesterday.
Also, whilst Scholes is showing his class in some games, giggs is most certainly not, and nani’s goal and assist from 20 minutes compared to giggs’ miniscule contribution emphasised that
March 24th, 2008 at 12:39
Rooney wasn’t clinical with his finishing. He created a lot of chances for his team mates as well. If i am not mistaken, Rooney hasn’t scored in OT for a long time already right?
March 24th, 2008 at 12:44
giggs has lost what he was famous for, SPEED. last season we were wondering how he stays so quick being a mature player should i say. but now he has finally lost it, all he can do is cross the ball. but even if he does that, theres nobody to head it in!
March 24th, 2008 at 12:59
i think, James, that many fans want to see goals from Rooney, and it adds to their general frustration esp when games are tight. I for one, will wait patiently while Wayne gets his head sorted as far as killer instinct in front of goal.
Nobody can argue with his work rate, his perfomances usually motivate everyone around him. Number crunchers obviously dont see this, his use of space is second to none, not to mention his distribution/passing and tackling back. One of the reasons Ronaldo has scored so much is because Wazza has taken two defenders out with a mazy run into space. I’m not a stats man but i’d be interested to find out our win/loss ratio with/without Rooney.In pre match blogs i expected alot from my fav scouse and he didn’t dissapoint even without a goal.All this talk about first touch is bollox, the lad just needs a confidence boost and he’ll be away, back to the ruthless perveyor of goals which we all know he can be.
“met a lad the other day, said he met the white Pele,
i said to him, who was that?
he goes by the name Wayne Rooney,
Wayne Rooney, Wayne Rooney,
he goes by the name Wayne Rooney”
March 24th, 2008 at 13:01
giggs has lost his pace, but still has a lot to give, maybe he should think about changing his position, striker, second striker maybe even a roaming centre mid.
March 24th, 2008 at 13:20
hes already played there before to no effect
March 24th, 2008 at 13:27
Chris: Lets be honest though, Giggs is not really any slower than last year is he? The electric burst of pace went a couple of years ago. Look at him against Roma last year, that was one of his best performances and it was as a result of a combination of excellent movement, passing and crossing. His biggest problem at the minute is that he is constantly messing up simple, routine passes. That’s why I still have some hope for him. I don’t regard his biggest problem being physical rather I still view it as a form/confidence issue.
March 24th, 2008 at 13:44
Captaincy could have been a burden for him, perhaps?
March 24th, 2008 at 14:20
I think Giggsy’s age catching up with him, and keeping him from being selected as often as he might
be used to, is affecting his form. Last season, due to Park’s injury and the lack of a suitable
replacement for him, Giggsy was ALWAYS in the starting 11. Now, with the emergence of Nani, as
well as SAF resting him as much as possible, he just seems a little rusty to me. During the next
few weeks I would expect Giggs to get back in the flow of things, once he gets some games behind
him with our busy schedual. I still feel as though we will see the Giggs of old at some point this
season. Let me ask you this, if he were for sale, how many other teams in the Prem would snatch
him up? Sometimes we United Fans are more spoiled than we realize.
March 24th, 2008 at 14:25
As much as I love giggsy, he really is beginning to show his age. Everytime he tried to run at the liverpool defence he ended up getting closed down cause he was taking too much time..the reason why nani and ronaldo are so good at taking defenders on are because they use pure pace…anyhow, giggs starting and nani coming on as a supersub when the opponents legs are tired is always a good option imo..also, Anderson played SHITE yesterday..poor crosses, poor shooting and generally wasteful..ALL HAIL SCHOLESY!
March 24th, 2008 at 14:43
great article… yesterday is yet another day that SAF showed why he’s the manager and we are mere fans or maybe supporters. Majority of us never wanted to see Paul on the pitch even our own RR but to our surprise, the guy competes for the MOTM award.
Once again i defend rooney, goals coming or not i still want him in the team. his work rate and the pressure he inserts on opponents liberates the other players to have scoring chances. take a look at yesterday’s game whenever he got the ball, 3 dippers would come close to him meaning there are two united players unattended to at that time. and to you phoenix reds, united hasn’t lost in any game in the epl in which rooney has played infact the only game rooney has suffered a loss while on the pitch for united this season is the FA Cup exist at the hands of the ref but not Pompey.
Red Ranter? who is that idiot who said Ronaldo should make him eat his words by bagging a tap in against the dippers. The boy bagged in a fantastic header not a tap in as he requested. That idiot should piss off and resign from his job. How dare you call Ronaldo a pretender. these are the guys who call the spurs, everton. blackburn and villas of this world big teams and advocate for players in these team to be on the english squard and when the boy turns them in and out, the same people open they stinking mouth that he only turns up against small teams. ok is arsenal, milan, lyon, looserpool, roma all small teams. A part from chelsea which he’s yet to put one past which other big team has united player against the lad hasnt scored against. I bet he will have to put two past the blues come April 26th.
All in all the boys where marvelous on Le grande sunday.
March 24th, 2008 at 14:48
im sorry kai, when were CM meant to be crossers, last time i checked they were suppose to be either protecting the defence or making play, not crossing, and its not a CM job to score its a striking job, soooo…
March 24th, 2008 at 14:57
Yesterday we saw why Tevez/Rooney kind of a striker is better than the target man Torres for Utd..Tevez/Rooney mesmerized the Liverpool defence with their movement and work-rate while Torres was completely marked out of the game by Vidic..May be the service was never there but if you imagine Tevez or Rooney up there i would say they would have created some problems to Rio/Vidic with their pace, intelligence and movement….They are really capable of unlocking defences..if they can find where they left their shooting boots…Utd will rock for next 2-3 years even without a 30-goal a season striker (Manucho can serve as the impact striker i assume)
Do anyone agree?
March 24th, 2008 at 15:05
I still think the midfield that played against L’pool will not cut it in the big european games – sorry!, but time will reveal all. If I’m proved wrong, I will be first on this forum to apologise, besides being ecstatic of course. I guess you all know by now, that I am a Hargreaves fan, which I will not apologise for.
March 24th, 2008 at 15:15
Shyam: It would be harsh to be very critical of Torres yesterday. He was left heavily isolated yesterday and never got anything resembling decent service from his team mates. Don’t however underestimate either his intelligence or movement. At any rate you could count the number of the strikers in world football, who could cause an inform Rio/Vidic axis much trouble, on one hand.
Craig mc: I suppose that is, in theory, what we bought Hargreaves for, to ensure we don’t get overrun in the big European games.
March 24th, 2008 at 15:19
If Cristiano Ronaldo didn’t exist you would all have a different impression of Wayne Rooney. Rooney is allowed to be so horribly profligate in front of goal because of the unbelievable productivity of Cristiano. Rooney has 8 league goals, almost none of which came in games of any consequence. We praise him for his “workrate, vision, movement” and such, but he is a striker. He must score goals. He has had more than a couple of games in which he has squandered over a hat trick worth of opportunities. You better have pretty great vision and workrate if you are blowing chances at that kind of a clip.
Just ask yourselves this: how strong would this side be if we actually had a dependable striker who netted goals? We are lucky to have the Portuguese, but I do wonder where this side would be without him. If we were without his game changing abilities, where would the goals come from? Would Rooney necessarily score more goals because of Ronaldo’s absence? Probably not. We would be a team that can’t score. 19 goals from your strikers isn’t nearly enough when you have almost no goals from your midfield.
I hate to sound so negative in the wake of a 3-0 win over Liverpool, but I can’t help but to get the feeling that you can’t get away with this forever. Eventually Rooney’s horrific form in front of goal will haunt the side. He is bailed out time and time again by himself and others, but sooner or later he will cost United a match of great importance.
March 24th, 2008 at 15:47
Patrick – Wow mate, how feckin brave are you?. Hope you got good protective armour against some of the responses you are likely to get on here re. the Ronnie/Rooney debate. I agree with most of your comments though, and I think you make your points quite eloquently. If Ronnie wasn’t scoring almost every game, then yes, Wayne’s form would probably be even more of an issue than it is now with some posters on here at least. However I don’t think the Roon is an out and out striker!. If we did have a fox in the box high goal scoring striker, then Wayne’s role for the team would be immense, because it is immense now in the amount of assists he makes. His all round game apart from goal scoring in huge amounts is colossal. I still see a problem with Roo’s 1st touch, because a couple of good receiving touches (as his majestic one in yesterdays match), are not the norm in quite a lot of the games. If Ronnie got injured though (God forbid), I do like you Patrick wonder how we would fare. But often in these situations, other players could step up and make a name for themselves.
JB – That is what Hargo was bought for I agree, but one game in 3 is not exactly keeping him up to the kind of sharpness needed in big European games. He played in the L’Pool match away, and did nothing wrong, yet not a sniff in this match – I think we might lose him. He joined to play the big matches, not the pocksie games like Fulham, B’Hams etc of the football world. And he has his England place to think about, where no one can deny HE WAS ENGLANDS BEST PLAYER IN THE LAST WORLD CUP. I think you know what I mean JB!.
March 24th, 2008 at 16:11
[JB]
About Giggs, last season more than pace, he had a bit of the close control that helped him get past players. He was more consistent with his crosses last season. I think the way to look at it is he had fewer bad games last season than this one. He seems to have lost a bit of the close control, but then that’s age and it’s a natural decline.
March 24th, 2008 at 16:19
[Patrick]
I think it is a fair point about Rooney’s profligacy and there has been a fair bit of debate about it over the past several weeks. Ronaldo has carried us, no doubt, but as an attacking force we are still better off with Rooney on the pitch rather than him off it. His understanding with Ronaldo is vital. I won’t expect 30 goals from him every season — he scored 23 goals last season when it was supposed to be a bad season for him — and I still think his best position is behind the target man.
But I think your fears and frustrations about Rooney stem from the fact that SAF made him the number 10 this season and expected him to lead the forward line. For someone leading the line 8 goals is a poor return. But, leaving the cliched theme of his work-rate aside, Rooney still brings much of our creative spark along with Ronaldo.
About his profligacy costing us, it already has, hasn’t it? Portsmouth in the FA Cup, for example. I am still of the opinion that Rooney’s had a mental block like Grognard suggested sometime earlier, and he will score. If not this season, then the next.
March 24th, 2008 at 16:26
Guys, just read that both Nani and Ronaldo got injured yesterday! Hope it aint anything serious, but they cant play against Greece on wednesday. Rooney is one of the worlds best players by the way, just so you know.
March 24th, 2008 at 16:31
RedDevil: Rooney’s one of the worlds best players, but not one of the world’s best strikers. I’m sure he’s the best at whatever position his skillset is built for, it’s just not the position he currently plays for United.
March 24th, 2008 at 16:42
If United score goals and win games, I will be happy whoever score! Rooneys job is to score goals, I know that. But he is not that clinical 1-on-1 as a striker should be. Just needs to get more calm and not try to chip the keeper that much. He should be playing behind a player or with a player next to him. Either way, he should not play up front by himself. Its a long time since Ive seen Rooney play with a real striker next to him. He hasnt played with Tevez next to him since the Newcastle game, and then he scored 2! Fergie has played Saha and Tevez, Ronaldo and Rooney, and Rooney up front in the other games, so it is not wierd that he has had trouble scoring goals. Even though he got many chances yesterday he didnt score. That was dissapointin, but if he had been given chances like that against teams like Bolton, Villa, Blackburn or Boro he would have scored. He seems to be back to form now, only needs to score.
March 24th, 2008 at 16:53
Would Rooney necessarily score more goals because of Ronaldo’s absence?
Yes, assuming that he’d be a more focal point of attack in Ronaldo’s absence than he is in his presence. Even allowing for his 1 goal in every 10 shots, which isn’t a pretty statistic tbh.
March 24th, 2008 at 16:54
Craig mc: You are right one game in three will hardly keep Hargreaves happy or suitably match sharp. But then we do not really need the additional defensive cover he provides in the vast majority of games. Carrick contributes enough defensively most of the time and comes with a superior range of passing to boost our attacking firepower. I’m sure Hargreaves was bought to ensure a Kaka did not run amok against us again, but £18m is a lot of money to spend on someone we only really need in a handful of games. At the minute I am wondering what Hargreaves role at the club really is, but if his contributions in the next dozen or so games help bring CL glory then I won’t be complaining.
Redranter: As we have seen with Rooney, poor control and a lack of form/confidence can be correlated. That is why I still retain some hope (unfortunately it is diminishing) for Giggs. If his dip was clearly applicable to a loss of pace then there isn’t much chance of a turnaround. However his problems may still be due to a lack of form and if that is the case he may yet be able to offer something in the future.
Patrick: That may be true but it is not Rooney’s fault he is playing as the line leader, it was the manager’s call. Our squad this season has 5 central midfielders and 2.5 strikers, something I consider to be either a bit of an oversight or carelessness.
March 24th, 2008 at 17:01
[RedDevil]
I also heard about Rooney being sent for a scan after the match. Let’s hope it rules him out of England and keeps him fit for next weekend.
March 24th, 2008 at 17:01
Hi all,
If Rooney needs Ronaldo’s absense(?!?) to score goals, then for me at least, Rooney need not score this season. Coz, I think Ronaldo’s conversion ratio atm is far greater than Rooney’s.
March 24th, 2008 at 17:15
Patrick, I applaud you for having the courage to say what very few true fans of United are willing to. Too many fans of the club feel it is blasphemy to ever question anything about the team, especially if we win. They don’t understand that like life, football is about winning and always striving to improve.
Yesterday, Rooney gave a strong performance that warranted man of the match consideration by many. Well to many that means he was perfection and that as long as he worked hard, his vision was high and that he moved well, then nothing negative should be said about his game. And even if he had scored then most of the fickle supporters would hail the return of the conquering hero and would claim all is well again.
The fact is that you are right that all the positives quite often don’t out weigh the negatives in Wayne Rooney’s game and contribution. The bottom line is he is a striker and 8 league goals is just not cutting it. Now having said that, I will go farther. His finishing is bad right now but he is not the one we should be pointing at when we talk about the majority of the blame in all this. The real culprit for most of the season has been his striking partner Carlos Tevez.
Tevez has also been largely ineffective at scoring a lot of league goals this season. The myth that Tevez and Rooney play well together because over a long season they were able to combine for a handful of beautiful goals is a big reason there has been a veil over the problem. Quite often we love style over substance. Is one beautiful goal worth more than two garbage goals? Some out there believe it, even if it’s only subconscious.
The bottom line is that Patrick is right that we need a true goal scoring striker. At this stage I really don’t care who it is, as long as he consistently places himself in the right place, at the right time, and above all he sticks the ball in to the back of the old onion bag. So does that mean get rid of Rooney or bench him? NO! NO! NO! Wayne’s value to this team far transcends his goal scoring. But the focus and the expectation for him to provide close to or more than 20 goals a league season is unrealistic at best. Unless of course the pressure and the expectations are lifted off his shoulders. Wayne is an outstanding second striker who plays well behind the main striker. He is the man who creates a lot of space and opportunity for the striker and for Ronaldo by making those probing runs, working his socks off to steal a ball and always making that killer pass or cross when it’s needed most. But don’t expect him to be your go to striker where you can expect RVN return in goals. Remember, he was a pretty decent goal scorer when he played just behind RVN and when less attention was being paid to him. Ronaldo is winger and thus he won’t change up defenders feelings about stopping Rooney in the box. But a striker unlike Tevez will. Tevez will also benefit as a spot starter and as a sub playing the same position as Wayne.
Finally, a goal poaching striker will not make us more predictable and less attractive to watch. How could a team with Ronaldo, Rooney, Nani, Carrick etc ever be unattractive to watch? A goal poacher would have given us at least ten more league goals than Saha and Tevez have given us. I’m fine with Rooney netting around 12 to 15 goals a season. He will get that with an increase to his confidence, improvement in his finishing and less pressure playing as a second striker. What this all means is that United can score between 85 to 100 goals in a season and 70-85 goals. That should guarantee that Arsenal and chelsea don’t challenge us so closely in the future. After all, they can’t match our goal scoring prowess right now. Imagine if we had another RVN to net those goals Rooney and Tevez have missed. Always strive to improve and never settle for the present, even if it is positive.
March 24th, 2008 at 17:23
At the bottom of my last post I meant to say that with a goal poaching striker United should be able to score between 85 to 100 goals a league season RATHER than 70 to 85 which is what they will net this season.
March 24th, 2008 at 18:02
have to agree with Patrick. something that upsets me is that we payed 12mil for a TEENAGE 34goals WINGER and near 30 mil for a TEENAGE 13 goal STRIKER, that doesn’t sound right at all.
March 24th, 2008 at 20:16
[Dan]
Now that’s a poor way of putting it, actually bad memory. However it must be said that Rooney was English — so his price was obviously high.
That said, he was our top scorer in 04/05, second to Ruud in 05/06 and joint top scorer in 06/07. While he ought to have been scoring goals more than he has done this season, he isn’t the poacher that RvN was.
Ronaldo is an exception to the rule, and I am not really willing to classify him as a winger. He’s got more of a Francesco Totti role for us, slipping in forward, drifting wide, getting a little deep and scoring goals with alarming regularity. His is a role of its own, and he’s not a winger in the classic sense of the word.
March 24th, 2008 at 21:45
To all those guys that think Mascherano shouldnt be sent off: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8YQSmkB5XWg
March 24th, 2008 at 22:12
RD
it was a sending off period, he was mouthing of to the ref for the whole game and the ref got tired of it and sent him of, the ref had a strict no nonsense game, thats all it was, he made only 2 bad decisions, the one where ronaldo, anderson and i think giggs was mouthing of to the ref, but none got cards, and the blatant dive by torres, oh and thee penalty decision as well(rooney stayed on his feet and i think thats what swayed, had it been ronaldo, he would of gone down and probably gotten an unfair card.
RR
i dont think ronaldo has got hi own position, he is just versatile in the attacking area.
March 24th, 2008 at 22:14
Ok so what happens if you compare Rooney to drogba (last seasons best striker in the world) who has this season scored around 13 goals after his 2 yesterday it shows the difference a season can make. People will point to the ANC but Roon was out for a long time with injury. When Rooney gets going he can be a prolific striker as it was around October when he scored something like 9 goals in 8 games. Injuries disrupted that and led to a dip in goalscoring form. Everyone was just expecting him to carry on as he did before his injury but that just doesn’t happen. Give him time and he’ll start scoring again.
March 24th, 2008 at 22:34
give him time liam? your joking right, last time he scored was the toon match, and before the toon match it was before the injury, hes had time. and drogba was not last seasons best stiker.
March 24th, 2008 at 22:43
[Dan]
To be fair, Drogba was last season’s best striker. Ronaldo was a winger who scored goals last season. He was in a less advanced position than he’s been this season.
March 24th, 2008 at 23:05
this whole Wayne Rooney debate seems to being going round in circles week after week and I think its about time we reslised that its not going to get better until next season.
The bottom line is this, Rooney never was and never will be a goalscoring no9 and the sooner people realise that its SAFs fault and not Rooneys the better. Playing as a no9 is completely different to playing in the position just behind the striker and to criticize Rooney for not fulfilling the role of a no9 is simply unjustified.
In case anybody is starting to have doubts about him let me tell you this, Wayne Rooney IS WORLD CLASS when he plays in the hole between midfield and attack but he is average when he plays as a no9, in one position he is functional in the other he is inspirational and this situation must be rectified by SAF in the summer.
When he first burst onto the scene I was amazed at his vision. creativity and intelligence and nothing he done in the following 3 years made me feel any different. But this year SAF has used him in a position were his natural abilities have been partially stifled and for this the manager must take 100 percent responsibility, not Wayne Rooney.
Even those people who have been Rooneys biggest critics this season have admitted that he still shows flashes of creativity and vision that merit his inclusion despite being wasteful in front of goal so my question is this, why criticize someone who is sacrificing his own personal performances for the good of the team.
Yes his wastefulness in front of goal is frustrating at times but I remember a year or so ago, one on one with the keeper Rooney would have finished 8 times out of 10, and its simply down to the fact that hes feeling the pressure a bit but remember this lads, form is temporary but class is permanent, and make no mistake about it, Wazza is class
March 24th, 2008 at 23:45
totally 100% agree with you Fred The Red. Alot of you are bashing him which is ridiculous, he is NEVER gonna be a goalscorer like Ruud and the sooner you lot realise that the better. Look at last season, playing behind Saha, he was class – thats his position and Fergie needs to sign a striker to play ahead of him to get the best out of him. I dont care who gets the goals to be honest, we’re 5 points clear in the toughest premier league season so far with a great goal difference, hardly cause for concern!!!!
I look forward to seeing all you Rooney bashers eat your words like you have with so many other players this season……
March 25th, 2008 at 1:26
Wow, how can people still doubt Fergie?
March 25th, 2008 at 2:40
Rooney is played out of position all the time. He is never going to be an out-and-out striker or a winger. He was much more effective last season when he had Saha in front of him allowing him to slot into the hole.
Having said that he tends to shine in the big games because we are forced to play a more counter-attacking style which suits his game, as it means he is able to play deeper and burst forward with cute one-twos and surging runs. Last season it was Rooney not Ronaldo who was scoring in Europe and that was in large part because of this factor.
Having said that even when he is sacrificed by being played out of position, he still offers a lot to the team. Would Ronaldo score as many without Rooney playing alongside him? No! If we still had RVN would Ronaldo score as many? No!
Tevez I do not think was the greatest signing. At best he is an impact sub and while his finishing is better than Rooney he does not offer nearly as much to the team.
March 25th, 2008 at 4:02
i guess people here are questioning rooneys finishing rather than his other attributes of the game, given that he is a striker (whether 2nd or main or whatever). This season rooney must have had at least a dozen 1-on-1s with keepers and I dont remember him scoring in ANY of those!!! Thats pretty bad for any player not just striker! Its ridiculus to blame SAF for rooneys inability to convert 1-on-1s (even if he cud have converted half of those he cud have had 6-7 more goals).
March 25th, 2008 at 4:24
damn colver I was going to use that line about ronaldo not scoring as many without Rooney but you beat me to it
anyway, dan, if Rooney is involved in goals is it not as good as scoring? Even if Rooney is not scoring you can bet he will be setting up goals for other players. We are the highest scoring team in the league and how many of the 4-0 scorlines that contribute to this were without Rooney? All of those times when Rooney was injured and I heard people say “Ronaldo bailed us out” seemed to have 1 thing in common and that was there was no Rooney.
March 25th, 2008 at 5:15
can we please stop with the rubbish that Rooney is the reason Ronaldo is scoring. That is a joke! Ronaldo is always the focus of the opposition. Look we all agree that Rooney is a much better footballer than he is a striker, But im tired of people trying to gloss over the fact that 8 league goals is far from world class.
Having said that, we must all keep in mind that when judging rooney we are harsh because players of his calibre are judged at a higher standard than others. Putting on United shirt comes with a lot of pressure and Rooney knows that as much as anybody(we have all seen others crumble from the pressure Veron Forlan…) so when people are critical of Rooney, they arent saying he is rubbish, its just that we all know what he is capable of. and aside from not scoring yesterday I think everyone can agree he had a fantastic game.
One last thing, I cant tell you how it good it feels to see all the Gooners start talking about “next season, and the young gunners”. They are so delusional about Wenger and their team. I say keep looking to the next season and United will keep looking to the current season.
March 25th, 2008 at 11:03
Good tactics and a nice win.
This team is still being (re)built,it’s the best it has been in many a year. Better than last year’s. Nothing will ever be perfect, that is football. Just ask Madrid fans.
Having a team of 20 super heroes would be pretty boring, 5-0 wins every week
Keeping the soul of the team is very important, which means having British players in the team.
Rooney sets the right’tone’, the spirit. Mixed with latin flair and arrogance/confidence from players like Ronaldo and Nani, you have a deadly mix. This explains why Ferguson keeps O’Shea and Fletcher: the spirit.
Shopping list:
1 big striker who isn’t going to whinge if left on the bench and ruin the team spirit(Manucho might fit this spot)
1 RB who can cross, is crafty and fast too (Wes Brown is a bit too timid, keep him for back-up though), height would be good, not enough height in the team (defending).
Rooney could be more deadly in front of goal, I’m talking more about running at the keeper and lobbing, rather than Sunday’s chances where he had very little space to aim at.
I hope Anderson is praticing his long range shooting as I type
He can only improve 
Brilliant player though, still adapting, but has a good attitude
Very good weekend but still lots of exciting football to look forward to!