Mar 01
Man Utd v Tottenham: Carling Cup Final Preview
Roman Pavlyuchenko made some very strange remarks. Very, very strangely timed remarks indeed. Either the import of his remarks may have been lost in translation (the quotes attributed to him clearly seem from someone with a reasonable command of the Queen’s language), or he needs to be coached on the benefits of good PR. Or, perhaps, he’s another victim of, what I call, a feeder-club complex.
‘Now, what is that?’, you may ask. That, gentle reader, is a condition which afflicts players who feel they are too big for their club and aspire to be among a higher level of footballing fraternity. In recent times, it’s become a way of life in Tottenham Hotspur Football Club. They’ve been feeding the likes of Arsenal, Liverpool and, more specifically, Manchester United. We thank them profusely for Michael Carrick and Dimitar Berbatov. But I wouldn’t be too excited over Roman Pavlyuchenko.
Flippancy aside, I would be particularly concerned about the type of comments the Russian had made if I were a Tottenham fan — thank heavens I am not.
“It would be wrong not to dream about this. I have realised that the English Premier League is exactly why you should start playing football in the first place. And Manchester United is the leader of it. Once your first dream comes true you must start dreaming of another target.”
Er, it would never be wrong of you to be dreaming about anything. But opening your mouth ahead of a Carling Cup final feels about as right as George Bush expounding the nuances of quantum physics. He also goes on about how Dimitar Berbatov was arrogant, at which point, I ascertained his head might be well close to his rectal cavities and realised I’d already made up my mind on what I think of him. Twat!
Anyway we must move on to things of greater significance here because, this match, as you must have all by now known, is a must win for us: it’s our door to qualifying for the UEFA Cup (or the Europa Cup). And considering it’s one tournament Fergie’s never entered with this lot, I suppose this game will be like a cup final for us.
Oh.
Tottenham are the defending champions of this trophy, although their squad has seen 1,678,953 changes in personnel ever since. So maybe, there’s our chance in nicking it from their grasp.
I think we’ll start as underdogs, because injury to Rafael and Fergie deciding to give Gibson and Welbeck a chance will surely make Spurs a much stronger side. Surely they’ll teach our side a footballing lesson?
Oh.
Prediction: 2-0 to United.
PS: fingers firmly crossed lest cocky nature of above post jinx our beloved side.
Related items from Red Rants:- Man Utd v Tottenham: Preview
- Man Utd v Stoke: Preview
- Man Utd v Everton: Preview
- Man Utd v Spurs match thread
- Free tickets for United v Villa final
Tags: Game Preview
March 1st, 2009 at 9:08
Has ‘Pav’ even met Berbatov?
Anyway I think it’ll be a 2-1 extra time win for us. Gibson to score the winner
March 1st, 2009 at 9:43
@Liam: Pavlyuchenko was basing his comments on Berbatov based on what his teammates were telling him about the way Dimitar acted in his final months with the club. They were not his direct feelings on the player, just what he had heard.
As for Red Ranter’s opinion of the player, fair enough but I for one believe this lad is one Hell of a striker. The fact he wants to play for us is nothing new. I had reported this before the EUROS last year and begged Fergie at that time to sign both him and Arshavin. He is a more natural goal scorer and poacher than Berbatov but of course he doesn’t have the other elements of Berba’s game which make him special. Would I welcome him as a replacement to Tevez should Carlito leave? In a New York minute. I prefer him more to the rumored Mario Gomez. He’s quicker, has a better shot and is also decent in the air. Above all, he doesn’t miss sitters like Mario has been missing for a year now. Would he be my number one replacement for Tevez? No, but he would be in my top 5. I like him that much and I also like players who make it known they would like to pay for our team.
One of my pet peeves in sports is when a manager always pursues players who have no interest in playing for him (Can you say Benzema). I like player who along with their greatness and perceived potential, have grown up as big fans of our club. It may not guarantee success but being happy playing for your dream team has to give a player that extra spark and sense of pride when he puts on our kit.
I always remember reading about all the actors who loved Star Trek so much that they would have done any of the tv series for scale, but they never got the chance. Instead Star Trek executives would always cast actors who knew very little about the shown and it’s history and who held very little interest and passion for the subject matter. It’s further proof about how cruel and unfair the world is and how it rewards those who are unworthy. So many people are currently in positions in life that they are not suited for or that are holding back others who were born to be in their shoes. I hate this about life and it has always plagued me even when I was an IT recruiter. Seeing companies hire the wrong person for all the wrong reasons while seeing and feeling the disappointment of others who were born for that position and who had a more impressive and more applicable CV. That’s life I guess and we all have to deal with that kind of disappointment. But you don’t have to like it. That’s why I would love to see Manchester United life long supporters like Sergio Aguero, Rene Adler and even Pavlyuchenko wear United red one day. Great players with great taste should have their wishes come true.
March 1st, 2009 at 10:20
Any news about the team?
Also is the match telecasted in india? anyone?
March 1st, 2009 at 11:44
@Liam: Yeah that’s true…he has probably never met Berbatov so I can’t understand why he would make such comments. You shouldn’t really be making comments about people you have never met and/or don’t know very well personally. And Grognard, I heard that Pav still cannot speak any English, even after more than half a season in England…so I wonder how he communicates with his teammates?
Anyway, 2-1 to United AET…and I’ve placed a bet on that scoreline with Tevez to score first. Fingers crossed that I get lucky! (and that we win of course!)
March 1st, 2009 at 12:06
@despicable: Zee Sports.. 8:30
March 1st, 2009 at 12:10
@Grognard: I’d like to see Sergio Aguero as my no 1 replacement for Tevez. On the thing about players wanting to play for United not getting the chance, I think the situation has seen progress with Tevez and Berbatov who both wanted to play for us. May the trend continue, but I have great apprehensions that the slut Benzema will be Fergie’s top priority.
March 1st, 2009 at 12:12
@Rahul: I don’t have Zee sports… taken out of the pack lately.. so seems like i will miss the match.
March 1st, 2009 at 12:13
@Rahul: I think it depends on the last few months if Tevez can shine in the remaining champions league and other opportunities that he gets, we may not need anyone..
March 1st, 2009 at 12:15
@Nino: Pav probably was talking in sign language with his ‘teammate’, and things became lost in translation. I offer one probable transcript:
Teammate (in sign language): “They brought you in for Berbatov!, you’re not good enough to clean his boots!! Here, clean mine!” (throws his boot)
Pavlyuchenko: (interpreting it as he mentioned): “Oh that was so cruel of him!!!”
March 1st, 2009 at 12:17
@despicable: Stick to cable boy, stick to cable!! I’m guessing you’ve got Tata Sky?? if you do, then you could order the sports pack extra and it will be available in no time.
March 1st, 2009 at 12:22
@Rahul: Nope i have got cable only, but they have removed the name of Zee sports from the list itself, i will call them anyways.
March 1st, 2009 at 12:23
@despicable: Weird cable guys!
March 1st, 2009 at 12:25
@Rahul: Neways work on SUnday suck, anyways any news of team today?
March 1st, 2009 at 12:32
@despicable:
Zee Sports is not in the Tata Sky boutique at all unfortunately. Till Carling Cup SF they were showign it on Ten Sports, irritating how they shifted to Zee Sports for the finals.
Any live streams guys?
March 1st, 2009 at 12:33
@despicable: None apart from what Fergie’s confirmed. Ben Foster, Welbeck, Gibson are guarantees to start. Ronaldo looks set to start as well (tho I wish Fergie would rest him). Tevez and Scholes are also high probabilities.
March 1st, 2009 at 13:12
Thank God the cup final is here!!! It wouldnt bother me much if we lost today, at least not as much as losing the FA cup or Champions League. But I do care about this cup. It means a lot to me. It was the last trophy United won before I was born, and the trophy that started the dominance of Manchester United in the English game. This game will mean a lot to the likes of Welbeck and Fabio, because it is their chance to play in a cup final. Im not saying they wont get another chance, but when you are that young every final means a lot. So hopefully we can win this one.
Spurs are gonna be without Defoe, Hutton, Cudicini, Chimbonda, Keane and Palacios today. The latter four have all played CC for their previous teams, so they will not be able to play today. That means its a weakened Spurs side. We do not necasasarilly play with a “bad” team today, because I feel Welbeck is United quality, Evans is almost as good as Rio(considering age), Tevez is a brilliant player, Nani is, when good, as good as any other winger we have in our team(Except for Ronaldo) and if Fabio is 3/4 as good as Rafael we will not be weakened. Anderson is the best player in the world,
, and Gibson can do a fairly good job. Why be afraid to lose? I think we will play this side:
Foster
Neville-Evans-Vidic-Fabio
Ronaldo-Gibson-Anderson-Nani
Tevez-Welbeck
Im delighted about Andy being back. I ve just got the feeling that if Anderson starts, he will score a gola today. Has to happen sometime, right?
Score prediction: 2-0 to United. Welbeck and Anderson to score.
WEMBELEY! WEMBELEY!!! WE ARE THE FAMOUS MAN UNITED AND WE`RE GOING TO WEMBELEY!!! I really hope we win it today, a trophy is a trophy in my eyes.
March 1st, 2009 at 13:19
any links to streams? can i have one? espn aint showing CC games, cunts
March 1st, 2009 at 13:22
@despicable: you have espn-star mate? i have them and they’re not showing CC games..
March 1st, 2009 at 13:30
@john freakin’ o’shea: Ya i do.. Its on Zee sports..
March 1st, 2009 at 13:45
if you google ‘atdhe united spurs’ closer to game time it should be the first result.
March 1st, 2009 at 13:51
@Rahul: I’m surprised if Ronnie plays again today mate
. Especially if Tev plays too. Is Rooney out of favour with Fergie? The mind boggles 
.
March 1st, 2009 at 13:54
I don’t go along with Fergie’s misguided loyalties to players sometimes. In finals to keep our winning edge, we should put our our BEST team, and get a good headstart hopefully, then BRING ON the kids. Just my thoughts though, I know some of you have different opinions. A loss in a cup final, can have a more adverse affect on future games then we might think
.
March 1st, 2009 at 13:58
i will post some link before the game start.
March 1st, 2009 at 14:38
@Craig Mc: Craig me man, how u doin?
Just remembered u moved to geordieland!! 
Where u watchin the CC final? I usually watch the live games at Shearers pub in St James park. Lemme know if ur gonna be there so we can hook up and u can teach me sum terrace chants 
March 1st, 2009 at 14:44
Links:
http://www.iraqgoals.com/en/ch1.html
http://atdhe.net/live-tv-4216.html
March 1st, 2009 at 14:47
@RedDevilEddy: I think Fabio is considered to be a (marginally) better player than Rafael.
March 1st, 2009 at 15:09
@despicable:
Yea…the game’s on Zee sports, Ten Sports is showing some stupid test match instead…and tata sky dont show Zee Sports
March 1st, 2009 at 15:15
foster
oshea evans rio evra
nani scholes gibson ronaldo
tevez welbeck
Wodogate has failed a fitness test for spurs. bent and pavyulchenko both start,
March 1st, 2009 at 15:16
I agree with RedDevil Eddies team selection.
Tevez, Wellbeck, Gibson & Nani are nailed on starters for the way they have performed in this competition.
I expect we will have Rooney, Giggs & Scholes on the bench.
Oh and I think it will be O’Shea not Neville
March 1st, 2009 at 15:16
…. Vida?
… Fabio?
D:
March 1st, 2009 at 15:18
@m34ch: it just shows the west hame game! damn i cant watch!!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 15:20
spurs team :
Gomes
corluka king dawson ekotto
lennon zokora modric jenas
bent pavyulchenko
March 1st, 2009 at 15:20
@m34ch: oh, the game hasnt started yet,… my bad…
March 1st, 2009 at 15:27
Bench?
March 1st, 2009 at 15:29
Subs: Kuszczak, Vidic, Eckersley, Park, Giggs, Anderson, Possebon.
no rooney D:
March 1st, 2009 at 15:32
@john freakin’ o’shea: hehe no worries fella, try it nearer kick-off, if it fails Ill post another link, don’t worry – Thy game shall be seen-eth !
March 1st, 2009 at 15:37
Man Utd: Foster, O’Shea, Evans, Ferdinand, Evra, Ronaldo, Scholes, Gibson, Nani, Tevez, Welbeck. Subs: Kuszczak, Anderson, Giggs, Park, Vidic, Possebon, Eckersley.
Tottenham: Gomes, Corluka, Dawson, King, Assou-Ekotto, Lennon, Jenas, Zokora, Modric, Bent, Pavlyuchenko. Subs: Alnwick, Bale, Bentley, Huddlestone, Gunter, Taarabt, O’Hara.
March 1st, 2009 at 15:40
@Gabriel: No Gabriel mate, I am back in not so sunny Salford for the weekend
. I will watch the game in one of the local pubs with rugby mates. I wish I was at Wembley, but not now cos I just saw the team 
. I hope they do us proud though, because I am worried. You enjoy the game wherever you are Gabriel.
March 1st, 2009 at 15:47
@Craig Mc: speaking of rugby, get the score yesterday?
March 1st, 2009 at 15:53
Hey all you guys in India…Zee Sports is showin the WI-Eng test match too..WTF! Both channels showing cricket and no footie?????
March 1st, 2009 at 15:56
http://www.ustream.tv/videoplayerpopup/channel/533068
Setanta US link. English commentary
March 1st, 2009 at 15:59
if anyone is using sopcast the channel is 6816
March 1st, 2009 at 16:00
In the council flat i live in, i can see wembley stadium from the window. Do you know how frustrating it is to know your team is about 50 odd miles away from you and you cant even see them! still fun looking at the stadium, on tv and out your window!
March 1st, 2009 at 16:01
Come on Foster lad, clean sheet please!!! Fingers crossed.
March 1st, 2009 at 16:02
COME ON UNITED!
March 1st, 2009 at 16:08
@ebrahim: If you want Villa and Stoke
March 1st, 2009 at 16:13
@Liam: it says off air..
March 1st, 2009 at 16:19
Links?
March 1st, 2009 at 16:20
yeah it went off at the start of the game
I got one on Sopcast but if you’re still in need try some of the Media Player links here
http://myp2p.eu/broadcast.php?matchid=31348&part=sports
March 1st, 2009 at 16:26
great pic – non english comms.
http://www.veetle.com/viewChannel.php?cid=490f5c4425d80
March 1st, 2009 at 16:30
Strike that — Veetle channels just went down.
March 1st, 2009 at 16:36
damnit these fking cunt Indian tv ops showing fking cricket highlights so these fuckers can wank off to sachin tenballkar…
not to mention hull v blackeye highlights…
why the hell did zee sports win the contract for the carling cup?
March 1st, 2009 at 16:40
Fucking Scouse ref is shit
March 1st, 2009 at 16:42
Clear Handball blind cunt.
March 1st, 2009 at 16:47
sopcast channel 26342 setanta us showing cup final.
March 1st, 2009 at 16:48
Come on Evra! Stop Playing shit!
March 1st, 2009 at 16:52
This match is dire
March 1st, 2009 at 16:53
HT.
Come on Fergie, get the hairdryer out, get these boys in shape.
March 1st, 2009 at 16:54
Been looking for a link for ages but have found 1 in the last 5 mins and its here for all who want it. Its working with me so here it is:
http://www.plstreams.com/channel1.php
March 1st, 2009 at 16:58
Those cunts of misery at Zee Sports are showing a test fucking match!!
March 1st, 2009 at 16:58
What a rubbish first half. I am convinced Evra is carrying some kind of leg injury because he looks slow, out of shape and is getting his shorts handed to him by Aaron Lennon. Not one full scoring chance in the first half. Nothing but half chances and no desire or sense of purpose. The boys have to pick up the pace and start showing some energy and desire. Gibson has been terrible other than his one good long crack at goal and Tevez has completely lost his first touch and looks like a clown out there. Welbeck just isn’t getting the service and Nani is always standing when he get s the ball. How about trying to get the ball at Nani and Ronaldo’s feet when then they are a full speed?
Positives? No many. Rio has been solid defensively and almost scored the goal of the year. Everybody other than him looks to be playing the game a gear lower than normal. We are not putting any pressure on these guys and Gibson and Scholes are playing far too back. Scholes has not taken part in this game and his distribution has been very dull and conservative. Not impressed at all as they are making Spurs look much better than they are defensively. Why are we showing this bunch so much respect? This team is not Chelsea. Take it to them and they will crack. Just put on Park to take Lennon out of the game as Nani isn’t tracking back enough to help an out of form Evra.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:02
@Grognard: Carling cup! why put on park? who cares if we lose? give nani the game, he needs games, park doesnt.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:02
@Rahul:
I can understand mate…the f***king TV ops guys in India all think we are all cricket maniacs
March 1st, 2009 at 17:03
@Craig Mc: He’s got to be fair to the players who got him to the final. Tevez has been strong in this cup competition as has Welbeck. Remember, this competition is more for are bench players and some reserves. But Ronaldo is a special case because he has this remote control that controls Fergie and he gets whatever he wants.
If it was me I would never start Foster and Gibson in a final. But clearly, Fergie is on a different wave length and he does also have to rest players. Lets not forget, this is not a a priority. Still, I think we will see some players in the second half who might inject some life into the game.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:05
@Craig Mc: That’s hardly fair mate considering the young players and subs got the team to the final. You have to maintain fairness and team unity and by benching all those players for our “A” Team, would be a negative decision and a black mark for creating unity and contentment in the dressing room.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:05
there’s a real lack of energy out there. Expect Fergie will sort that out… we need to score early this half, a distinct lack of strikers on the bench
March 1st, 2009 at 17:06
An eye-opener of a match? That first half has not been good for some supposed prospects.
Gibson has been all over the place. against which team was he supposedly world-class? Derby? He’s been overrun by the spurs midfield plus making some poor decisions. I say loan him to our test-bed team Sunderland. Fletch was never more missed.
Also, once again Welbeck shows suspicious levels of energy. I understand certain players are languid but even Berbatov has proven people wrong with tireless running on top of his natural talent.
Evra is being ripped apart by Lennon. I think this is more a result of a lack of being tested directly against true wingers. Has to pick up his game.
Man of the Match of the first half: Rio. He’s holding the house. (ex-aequo with Ronaldo)
March 1st, 2009 at 17:07
@Dan: Because Evra is incapable of marking Lennon out of the game. And he has been menacing and dangerous in the first half.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:07
@Rahul: Seriously man! I can’t believe they aren’t showing a fckin final for a Test match which is heading to a boring draw… They better switch it now, cos the SA-Aus match just got over…or else…arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrghhh!!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:07
@Vivek: It’s absolutely useless man.. why did they even bother paying for the Carling Cup rights! They should have left it to ESPN-Star. They’re the only ones who know the value of football matches in India.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:08
@antsBoy: Its over??? Lord have mercy on them if they dont show the match now!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:10
wonder how much spurs had to pay the ref!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:12
I can’t believe it… they are now showing some I-league football match! What fucking wankers!
Someone pls check if you’ve got Sony PIX and see if they’re showing the match there.. I don’t get the channel, but some of you may be lucky! Just lemme know if they are showing it there!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:14
Some one pls tell us unlucky ones what’s happening!!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:15
They’re showing Gigli on sony pix. heh heh
March 1st, 2009 at 17:15
ando ando ando
March 1st, 2009 at 17:16
Andy coming on. Cmon Andy score a goal.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:18
Come on Anderson! Good to have u back fella!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:19
@Shami: Brilliant. I guess I won’t be seeing anything but the highlights on Sportscenter.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:19
Tevez’ movement decision making and positioning at times has been just awful. So what does Fergie do? He takes off Welbeck who has made great runs all game but received no service. Bring in Anderson, but for Gibson and bring Rooney on for Tevez.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:21
@Grognard: Grog tell me what happening!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:25
O’Shea should’ve been sent off
March 1st, 2009 at 17:29
clear penalty. fucking ref
March 1st, 2009 at 17:29
http://www.mitrovica.ucoz.de/watchset_E.html – another in-browser link if ur still struggling peeps.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:29
Atrocious decision. Ledley King stomped on Ronaldo’s foot as Ronaldo touched the ball- promptly booked for diving.
March 1st, 2009 at 17:30
Support Liverpool much ref? Should’ve been a penalty, instead he books Ronaldo
March 1st, 2009 at 17:37
these guys at setanta are spking right out of their arses…commentary at its worst
March 1st, 2009 at 17:37
i do not understand how tevez is employed as our lone striker. do we not want to score?
March 1st, 2009 at 17:37
JOS off, Vida on.
COME ON UNITED!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:48
Fosters been good today, well so far… Good on ya lad.
Really hope Anderson wins it for us lol ! Come on !
March 1st, 2009 at 17:49
Modric OR Gibson to win it for their respective teams!
You heard it here first!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:51
Lost the stream. Still 0-0 is it???
March 1st, 2009 at 17:52
what a run by ando should have got something out of it
March 1st, 2009 at 17:53
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
DAMN IT RONALDO!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:54
ff sake get in
March 1st, 2009 at 17:54
andy is pullin the old school gigs runs
March 1st, 2009 at 17:55
Why is Nani so stupid? I could’ve scored there!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:56
Id fu**ing love Andy to get his goal today, he really has looked wicked sharp since he came on, go on lad. Ander-son-son-son! lol
March 1st, 2009 at 17:57
shit! tell me Setanta aren’t cutting the match?!?! I already saw the 6 nations!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:57
Why on earth hasn’t Ando had more game time this season?
March 1st, 2009 at 17:58
What a bad break for Ronaldo. That would have been a real Hollywood finish. You get the feeling that it’s just not in the cards for us as we have no luck. Ronny should have had a penalty call earlier although in fairness, we should have been down to ten men because O’Shea dodged a real bullet. But did he deserve the yellow card he got to put him in that precarious situation? I don’t think so.
Tevez has just signed, sealed and stamped his passport out of OT with this useless and passionless performance. Where were the terrier like runs and pestering of defenders. He seemed very calm and overly subdued as if he didn’t care and then he did not get himself into strong positions in the box nor did his first touches benefit us. Hopefully he can wake up from his slumber in extra time. Too bad Rooney is sick. Did Berba even dress for the game?
March 1st, 2009 at 17:58
Ok. Scratch that…..
Ando OR Modric to win it for their respective teams!!!
You Heard it here FIRST!
March 1st, 2009 at 17:58
Phew, false alarm
March 1st, 2009 at 17:59
ronny’s shot was close!!!! m34ch thanks for the links btw!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:00
Giggs will tear them apart again!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:00
@Grognard: Sorry Groggy..I dint see the same game as you…Welbeck was awful today…but so was our midfield…i dont know how many times Gibson played balls to a United player surrounded by white shirts when he had better options elsewhere…n what about Nani??..cant believe he is the same Nani played for us last season…
March 1st, 2009 at 18:07
I have never known a UTD side so bereft of goals. Tevez as lone striker is a fucking joke seeing as he can’t hit a barn door. If Rooney is so ill why was he seen having a laugh with Giggsy on the bench? Looked alright to me. We can only hope Giggs will tear them apart again.
March 1st, 2009 at 18:09
yesss. Lennon’s injured. (its not very nice but i dont care)
March 1st, 2009 at 18:15
so bored…
March 1st, 2009 at 18:17
Come on UTD I want the quintuplet. Greedy I know but I want us to be able to sing ‘Come all without/Come all within?you’ll not see nothing like the mighty quin’.
March 1st, 2009 at 18:18
this has pens clearly written all over it
March 1st, 2009 at 18:18
foster is having a good game
March 1st, 2009 at 18:19
@john freakin’ o’shea: No worries chief, come on the lads! tis a close one this…
March 1st, 2009 at 18:21
i have a bad feeling when it’ll go to pens
March 1st, 2009 at 18:23
faker
March 1st, 2009 at 18:23
the bastards are playing for pens. wankers
March 1st, 2009 at 18:24
get the stretcher out there
March 1st, 2009 at 18:25
fucking wanker
March 1st, 2009 at 18:25
If there is any such thing as poetic justice we’ll win on penalties cos Ron hit the post and had a clear penalty denied.
It will be a long journey home for utd fans if we lose. Those Spurs twats only live ’round the fuckin’ corner!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:25
ffs get in boys
March 1st, 2009 at 18:28
foster!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:29
oooohhhh Pat!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:30
nani is not running anymore, he’s more like jogging, not chasing those through balls
March 1st, 2009 at 18:33
anderfuckingson
March 1st, 2009 at 18:33
ah fuck fuck fuck its pens.
March 1st, 2009 at 18:34
fuck im bored
March 1st, 2009 at 18:34
poor ando wish he would hav hit that
March 1st, 2009 at 18:35
Memories of Ronaldo in European cup final anyone?
March 1st, 2009 at 18:35
aaaaaaaannnnnnnnndddddoooo!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:35
pens…
Foster > Huerlho
March 1st, 2009 at 18:37
where’s JT when you need him!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:37
Grognard will still have a go at foster lol
March 1st, 2009 at 18:38
@john freakin’ o’shea: Have you seen the size of Gomez
March 1st, 2009 at 18:38
Damn I got a nasty feeling about this. The quadruple might not be on anymore lads…
March 1st, 2009 at 18:39
ok it’s on. come on frosty!!!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:40
yes giggsy!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:40
who do you think would miss first? my bet is on bentley
March 1st, 2009 at 18:40
YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!
COME ON BEN!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:41
ok giggs, make your momma proud!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:42
frosty!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:42
Well done foster, giggs N tevez
March 1st, 2009 at 18:42
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFRRROOOOSSSTTTYYYYY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:42
Ronaldo to score????
March 1st, 2009 at 18:43
Ronaldo to score!!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:43
YYYYYYEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!
GET OUT BENTLEY YOU FUCKA HAHAHAHA!
CHAMPIONS!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:44
David cunt Bentley!!!! Well done to Bentley!!! What a miss!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:44
FOSTER YOU LEGEND!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:44
We win!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:44
vds looks sad.
March 1st, 2009 at 18:44
Ando has won it!!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:44
Played andy!!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:44
bentley thank you!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:45
JUSTICE! DESERVED!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:45
CHAMPIONS!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:45
@Dan: Wouldn’t go that far, he had a good game though.
March 1st, 2009 at 18:45
is dancing!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:45
o’hara is tonights JT ladies and gents!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:45
ander son son son yeaaaaaaaaaaaa
March 1st, 2009 at 18:46
Foster! Played ace today – good lad
get in there !
March 1st, 2009 at 18:48
wow the croud is singing the ando song to celabrate the cup wow good for andy he is class
March 1st, 2009 at 18:49
Thank you Ben and Ando! Third trophy this season!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:50
next is the league, then the cl, then the fa.
March 1st, 2009 at 18:53
my link died, who will lift the cup?
March 1st, 2009 at 18:54
AND THE REDS GO MARCHING ON ON ON!
Evening all!
March 1st, 2009 at 18:59
2 down, 3 to go lads! What a stressing game… Result is key to our confidence though. It sets us up to push on.
March 1st, 2009 at 19:00
http://www.iraqgoals.com/en/ch1.html
March 1st, 2009 at 19:01
@john freakin’ o’shea: I think it was Ferdinand.
March 1st, 2009 at 19:02
@john freakin’ o’shea: Rio did.
I was little annoyed by the “milk” cup, due to it resulting on another missed game, but it felt good to win. I hope in encourages guys to work harder to win more important trophies this season
March 1st, 2009 at 19:02
Well I guess we’ll take it any way we can get it. A gutsy if flawed performance by our Carling Cup champions. Ice water in their veins come penalty time and that will serve us with a major confidence boost should we have to perform that function again this season.
I’ll give my ratings later as I am going out for breakfast with friends but let me say a few words before I depart. This was a classic example of my “winning ugly” theory. They can’t always be pretty but as long as we just win baby, that’s all that matters at this stage.
I was impressed by a few guys today who I thought stood up and made a statement. Congratulations first of all to Ben Foster. Nobody and I mean nobody has been harder on this lad this season than I have, and for good reason, he has sucked. But today he showed the promise and decision making prowess that won over Fergie in the first place. I give him hi due today as he was great when called upon. Strong presence in the box , especially on corners and crosses. Good distribution of the ball, especially with his long throws (a very German trait that I like), and his shot stopping was excellent when called upon. If not Rio, he would have been my man of the match. But that award must go to Rio who showed his 07-08 form and totally ran the show out there. Some great saving tackles and steals and strong in the air. He was awesome. Also, I must give praise to Mr. Anderson. Not only for scoring again in the penalty shootout but for making some great runs and showing the drive and determination many others lacked in this game. More later. Now it’s time to rejoice. One down and three to go.
March 1st, 2009 at 19:05
@Grognard: Yes my life is complete! you finally seen what ive seen in foster!
March 1st, 2009 at 19:07
@Grognard: Eat well grog!
March 1st, 2009 at 19:21
Well done to us, we deserved to win because of redknapps boring sit back all half tactics. Well actually maybe thats not entirely correct for the whole game, in the 1st half so it seems they were pretty good, but i dont know cos i didnt see that half but definitely in the 2nd half they sat back all the time and again in extra time. Just wanna give praise to foster and anderson, they really were excellent today. I have been saying for a year foster is our next no.1 in the making and he today proved why he should take over from edwin. As a keeper myself i feel he has excellent qualities, with the only thing he needs to work on his authority and marhsalling his defence but that will come. He doesnt seem nervous all the time when he touches the ball like pig does. If ferguson needed any reminder of his quality he saw it today, he just needs games and then you will all see he will go on to be our next GK for the next 10 years, im sure of it. As for ando, well what a player, it feels like we needed him for today i think we have missed him to be honest. He was making forward runs and not afraid to shoot, could have scored on another day which would have been excellent. I hope ferguson puts him in the 1st team for the game against milan, whilst fletcher is a decent player, ando outclasses him and he should defo play over fletcher and next to carrick. Just my opinion but thats what i feel anyway. Another player i feel deserves huge credit not just today but all season long is our excellent jonny evans. This kid just looks class every time ive seen him, i think he could be our captain in the next few years hes that good. Been brilliant every time ive seen him and today was no different. Anyway im glad we won today, its still a trophy and we will always be happy when you win a trophy. Well done lads, 2 down now just 3 to go, lets take it game by game and we can achieve our goals. Come on united.
March 1st, 2009 at 19:42
Does anyone have a clip of the Foster save? Or a picture?
March 1st, 2009 at 19:46
Lol, We’ve completed a micky mouse treble! Charity shield, club world cup, carling cup.
It IS a treble none the less, even it doesnt mean much.
March 1st, 2009 at 19:51
A trophy is a trophy is a trophy! We had to play 6 cup games to win it!
March 1st, 2009 at 20:03
@john freakin’ o’shea: Nani wasn’t running anymore because he is not game fit mate, doesn’t play enough games. If Anderson had played the full game and extra time, he would have wilted too
. But all those fantastic SHOTS of Nani, hit the post how many times, and so many NEAR misses. HOT HOT HOT, sizzled the lad. He surely was the Man Of the Match 
. Either that, or I defianately had too many lagar pints bought me from the rugby lads – hahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. Don’t argue with me you lot, because I’ve been amongst the fighting Irish today, and they taught me how to SLUG, and not just to slug lagar 
.
March 1st, 2009 at 20:07
Not over enamoured with the three trophies won so far, as Dan the man said, 3 mickey mousers. We have got to win at least two of the other three to gain some respectability. Great for the youngsters though. I am worried again, because out great ineptitude to score from open play has crept back in again.
.
March 1st, 2009 at 20:09
The referee once again WRONGLY booked Ronnie for diving, it was a penalty, King caught him, crushed his foot. Hope United appeal that yellow. You can appeal yellow – right?
March 1st, 2009 at 20:24
My internet connection went down!
.
.
.
Never trust a sister to reboot the “livebox” thingy when she forgot to switch on the wi-fi on her laptop!
Result: 45min with no internet access, with me needing my redrants fix!
March 1st, 2009 at 20:41
Back to more important things…
Ben FUCKING Foster!!!
At the end of the penalties, I thought “Well, if that doesn’t open grog’s eyes, nothing will ever!”
Glad you’ve finally seen the light though, grog!
Other than that I was especially pleased to see Rooney’s happiness for the lads winning it. It seemed to me he was happier than many of the players actually on the pitch!
As for my humble observations from the match:
1. Gibson and Welbeck still have some way to go to reach the standard required for week-in week out football (at least at United). Disappointing tonight, unlike
2. Jonny Evans – Just how good can this lad turn out to be? Not only played valiantly through injury, but he had a more than adequate 35 or so minutes at right back. From this showing, and from his previous assured defensive performances, I can say that if Rio and Vidic are fit at CB, he’s one of my preferred right backs, ahead of Rafael (lacking defensively) and O’shea (well he’s O’shea after all
). Looked totally at ease playing at RB.
3. I’ve been saying it several times but now I want to engage in a little bit of “I told you so” gloating: Ronaldo’s Best position is on the the Right. Right now when he plays on the left he’s half as good as the right sided Ronaldo.
4. Hmm, not much else except that I thought that even though we had the more dangerous opportunities, Tottenham have bossed the game. And JOS clearly was very, very lucky to stay on the pitch.
March 1st, 2009 at 20:45
And may I add that Foster’s showing on the penalties were near flawless: he always dived in the right direction, waiting at the last minute to dive and still managing good dives with very good reflexes.
Clearly tonight, he’s basically made the no.2 goalie position his own.
March 1st, 2009 at 20:46
Where’s everyone gone?
March 1st, 2009 at 20:49
the reason evans is so good at right back is his positional sense. For such a young guy, a lot of defenders in the league would kill to have the positional sense of this lad. Any defensive position and i guarantee you, jonny can make it his own. Definitely prefer him at right-back to o’shea.
March 1st, 2009 at 20:58
@Dan: O’Shea>Evans at RB. How quickly people forget
March 1st, 2009 at 21:12
Boys, I’ve just seen Barca play Atletico and despite leading 2-1 at half time, Barca lost 3-4. And there were two reasons – Forlan and Kun Aguero. Forlan’s first goal was magical, and from then on Atletico were a force of nature driven by the sheer will and skill of Sergio Aguero.
It was a game that had Forlan Vs Henry and Messi Vs Aguero all the way. And if there is anything such a successor to Maradona, Aguero is the one. By the second half, Messi was nondescript while Aguero was doing everything possible and beyond. He was like Maradona possessed. God I so badly want him on our team.
March 1st, 2009 at 21:41
@Liam: *cough* excuse me.. *cough*
.
.
.*takes breath in…*
Waaaaahahahahahahahaha!!!!!
[I hope I've not hurt your feelings, I don't want to sound rude, but that was funny!]
Btw: Who are the “people” you are referring to?
March 1st, 2009 at 21:47
@Dan: As he acknowledged himself, he’s certainly benefited from that loan spell at sunderland. Maybe he was naturallly gifted, but playing against premier league opposition have contributed to making him better. I guess when he started his first game for united he didn’t have the “deer caught in the headlights” look that Chester had when he started.
March 1st, 2009 at 21:50
@Rahul: And I who thought he had regressed after his first two or three blistering seasons… I don’t know I’ve never been impressed by his stats – or lack of thereof, since nobody talks about that… assissts? goals?
Anyway, I would only consider him as a replacement for Ronaldo. For a striker I would root for a more traditional “goalscoring but also creative” type – basically a fit Saha.
March 1st, 2009 at 21:53
Rahul, gotta say i havent seen much of aguero to be honest. I saw bits of him last year and his 1st year and he looked good but this season i havent seen many spanish games so cant really give a view on him. From what ive read though on various forums they are raving about the kid, quite a few saying he is better than messi. Dont know how true that statement is but nonetheless he sounds good. Problem with him coming here is his cost and playing time. I keep hearing we want this player and that player, rossi and benzema being mentioned. The only problem is the playing time they will get. Tevez is too good to be a sub and his price is high, this is why we havent made his transfer permanent. So why will the likes of benzema and aguero, maybe less so rossi, want to join us to be subs. I dont understand why also we would spend £30+ million on these players if they are to be subs. This is why i feel aguero would not join us and why to be honest we should not be looking at him. From his point of view, less playing time, from ours a huge sum of money for in effect a sub. I cant see where aguero would fit in. If anything we need a real goal poacher should tevez leave. 1 who will be happy to not be 1st team all the time, and 1 who will not cost an absolute fortune. There arent many players like this around which is why we have a tough decision to make in the summer. Should tevez leave who should we replace him with? some1 who is the right fit. So to summarise what im saying is aguero sounds a good player, but for me he sounds expensive to be a sub player in my opinion. I would rather give wellbeck a chance.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:10
@NicoQB: 27 goals, 9 assists in 2007-08 (all competetions); 17 goals, 8 assists in 2008-09 – those are the stats. Pretty decent to say the least. And not many score 2 past Barcelona and drive the game against them.
And yes a traditional “goalscoring but also creative” type striker is the ideal one, but methinks a fit ‘Saha’ does not exist!!
@Matt: Welbeck needs to be farmed out to another Prem league club I think. You make a good point about most desirable strikers coming in to be an expensive sub. And you’re right that right fit who wouldn’t cost a fortune are few and far between. The goal-poacher who’d fit in is gone – Huntelaar; and there won’t be another RVN type player for a good time to come (unless Rooney takes the spot
).
Personally I think we should be fine without a goal-poacher.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:14
Also I think Aguero closely fits the bill for a ‘goal-poacher’. I know this statement could attract a lot of debate, but then nothing really defines a ‘goal-poacher’ apart from names of players who have been one!
March 1st, 2009 at 22:17
@Dan: The game is played tobe won Dan, not to be fair. Nani wasn’t playing terribly but his tracking back was poor and Evra was struggling to contain Lennon. Once Lennon came off I was no longer concerned but at the point when Evra was getting skinned all the time, I fel we need a LMF who would help him out a bit. That as we know is not Nani’s game. I don’t take the Carling Cup seriously but since we are in the final and in prime position for a quad, do what you need to do to secure the win. Simple as that and not the mind boggling puzzle you make it out to be. I too prefer Nani out there but not against teams that have strong wingers. I have said this so many times, I’m truly getting tired repeating it.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:19
Well we won the Carling Cup, we didn’t play particularly well, but still we did come through at the end. I guess it was a mediocre performance for a mediocre competition against a mediocre team. I’m happy for the kids to see some success at the early stages of their careers, although a more solid all round showing would have me more excited!!
Too bad about Rooney’s illness because the front men just didn’t have what it takes to stick ‘em away. Wellbeck seemed awe struck by the occasion (The Carling Cup Final) and never really got his motor running and Tevez….,,, well what more is left to say!! An impotent performance from a fading star!! I know this might be harsh, but I just didn’t see anything positive that he added to our performance today. To be specific, his first touch again put him at a disadvantage almost all the time, he was never able to separate from his defender when the ball came his way, and his decision making on the ball was poor making him run around alot and not taking the more direct approach. I’m beginning to feel sorry and somewhat embarrassed for him now. Hopefully his end is nigh!!
March 1st, 2009 at 22:24
If I field a team and certain things aren’t working, then I make changes. You know I love Nani but it was clear that Evra was not in good form and he needed some help. Nani just doesn’t do that having learned everything about tracking back and defending from his buddy Ronaldo. As for Gibson, and Foster, fair enough, but why take out Welbeck and not Gibson. Welbeck was ineffective the way Berbatov was on Tuesday. All forwards need service and he wasn’t getting it. It was Tevez who should have been taken off. That was far an away the worse and most passionless performance I have ever seen from Carlito. He looked jet lagged and completely disinterested and his first touch was amateur at best. He has no concept on how to position himself for a pass from a wide player. He is always level when he should fall back a bit. He just sucked. But kudos to Foster who definitely got me off his case for the time being. He’s still not the answer for EVDS, but he just may have proven himself to be the future #2 over PIG.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:27
@Rahul:
Oops! My bad!
Impressive stats I have to say and if he fits in well those stats are bound to improve considering he will be surrounded by better players.
But, and that’s a big but, would you tempt fate after what has vbasically been a debacle (well a half debacle for Tevez) for most of our argentine players?
Also I watched bits of the one argentina match against france and Aguero looked subdued while it was clear that Messi was the boss.
And by the way a fit Saha does exist, or rather existed and we benifited from a few of them – Larsson(god how I wished that he signed with us at the peak of his powers), Cole, Yorke… But true, right now I can’t see anyone on the market with those attributes… well Benzema but this subject matter has been flogged to death, has it.
@Matt: About Welbeck I have to say that he’s got to do a bit more to convince me. Having good, dependable players is ok at defensive positions (O’shea) and to bring something else in midfield (Fletcher). But for offensive positions I tend to think that the players should be at least very, very good; if not world class. As I said previously his energy levels are a bit suspect for such a young player and while he’s got good technique, his striker’s instincts are not sharp as, say, one Frazier Campbell.
If we could morph Campbell an Welbeck into one player, we could get the real deal – Fraznny Wellbell!
March 1st, 2009 at 22:28
@Babyface: I think a real problem about energy was the midweek CL game and travel as well as that God awful pitch. That pitch and it’s lack of traction is a true disgrace. It’s been like that ever since Wembley opened and they still haven’t corrected it. Anyone who is familiar with London please tell me, is that new stadium build on what used to be a swamp or marshland? Just an engineering joke that they cannot make that surface better suited for football. One day a star is going to blow out a knee or Achilles playing on that shit.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:32
@Dan: Dan is there anyone on this blog more responsible for building my reputation than you? Read my comments on Foster’s game before you comment like that. I never go at a player unless he deserves. I don’t take joy or special pleasure from it.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:32
AAAAANNDDEEEERSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!
*cough* *cough*
Oh, come on!! Who seriously didnt expect me to do that? 
This was a really tough game. If you search for the meaning of “winning ugly” in the dictionary, this game will show up. That is if you have the new, high tec dictonary from Panasonic. Well played by the lads, and winning a trophy is great nontheless. I was actually more nervous and exited about this game that I actually thought I would be. Feels great winning a trophy again. Been a long time now! What is it, 2 months?
Congratulations to the kids, I thought they all played well. Except for Tevez and Nani, they were horrible. Sorry Craig… Nani was brilliant in the first half, but seemed slower and less interested in the second. And in extra time we might as well had the pope play there! Rio showed glimpses of last season, and he was one of the best on the pitch today. And I am really surprised about Ronaldo. He goes 6 months without managing to play a good game when he doesnt score, and suddenly he gets two in one week. He didnt score against Inter, but was great then. He didnt score today either, but he was our best attacking player. Even though Evra got skinned lots of times, there was always one man to save us. I want to thank a certain Ben Foster, who today reminded me of why he is my favorite English keeper. And he is definately better than PIG! Not only did he make two brilliant saves from Lennon and Bent, which showed reflexes even Schmeicel would have been proud of, but he was commanding and talked to his defense. If this is what Ben can do when he plays more games and gets to know his defense, then he is my favorite to become the heir of Edwin Van Der Sar. Great performance, my Man of the match.
And finally, I would want to talk about Anderson. Does this surpries you? If so, then you dont know me.
For those saying he doesnt have composure in front of goal, the penalty today must have proven them wrong. His finishing isnt exactly that bad, he is jsut unlucky. When he came on today he showed the speed, the detemination and the will to win that makes him a fan favorite, and why I wish him to be starting most of our games. After he came on we had more speed and flair in our play, and his Giggs-like runs were great. He was unlucky not to score today, but… Oh wait! He did score!!! Luved the dance Andy, luved the dance. Keep it up! I finally know how Anderson would react when he scored a goal! My life is complete! 
I hope this injury have given hima kind of rest so he can play with this standard for the rest of the season. That would only do us great.
CHAMPIONS!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 22:33
@Rahul: For me the stereotypical goal poacher does practically nothing for an entire match, then pops up at a crucial time and wins the match. Michael Owen at his peak was a prime example. But I wouldn’t like this kind of player at united. I want a player who can score 15+ goals in a season and be able of smart interplay between other players, able to keep the game flowing.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:34
@Dan: I haven’t exactly elevated Foster to heir apparent mate. He had a great game and deserves accolades but I still don’t think he is the chosen one. For me it will always be either Adler or Boruc. It was very encouraging though and should be a big confidence boost for the lad. And for keepers that’s 50% of the battle.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:36
@Grognard: You seem to know a thing or two about goal keeping. How do you rate Foster and PIG? I think out of the 2 Foster is the better keeper, but neither of them is fit to be the #1 when vds leaves. PIG scares me more than ALmunia in goal.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:36
@Dan: It would mean even less if we hadn’t won it though, wouldn’t it? Congrats to the boys. The Penalty Kings.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:37
yea that’s the problem. they existed, but i dont see anyone right now who is that type mate!
March 1st, 2009 at 22:38
@Craig Mc: Did you happen to spike your lagers with a shot of something stronger Bro? My God you just past the 3rd planet to the Sun.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:38
@Grognard: The reason the pitch is so bad is because the stadium is too big. The roof is huge, but because the stadium is so big it doesnt get enough sunlight so the grass can become fresh and always soft. Instead it gets lots of rain, sun only on various places, and it gets removed if someone only blows on it. They should have thought more about the important thing that is THE SUN. If the grass doesnt get enough of it, then it gets ruined. Tell me: When have you ever watched a game at New Wembley when the whole pitch was covered with sun. Answer: Never. The opening in the roof is too small, and the pitch too big.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:40
@RedDevilEddy: I’m quoting you here: “He goes 6 months without managing to play a good game when he doesnt score, and suddenly he gets two in one week…”
Now for my explanation – a bit simple but its sooo blooby obvious: For six months he’s been playing mostly on the left, for the last two games he played on the right.
From my recollections of last season I always remember him to be at his very beast on the right. Let’s face it: Ronaldo can play on the left, but he owns the right wing!
March 1st, 2009 at 22:40
@Craig Mc: I remember four years ago when we won the Carling Cup how elated we were because that was going to be the team’s only silverware for the year. Truthfully, the last couple of years have spoilt us rotten. Mickey Mouse? Hell, we’re 3-0 and I’m going to Disneyland.
Just keep bringing them on. When it’s all said and done i want six for six.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:43
@NicoQB: Mate, tisk! tisk!
I never saw the light, Foster did. He woke up from his confused slumber and actually showed his potential for once. Great, but one game does not make a career and he has a long way to go before I concede defeat and anoint him the chosen one.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:43
NicoQB, in my opinion what we need is an ole gunnar solskjaer. A player who wont strop when on the bench, a player who is a good finisher and who wont cost a fortune. Only problem is, is there a player in the world like this? Maybe we will have to start scouting and buy an unknown much like how ole was when we got him. I know there never will be another ole but a player like him in my opinion is exactly what we need.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:44
Penalty shootout
March 1st, 2009 at 22:45
@Rahul: God is it possible Real could steal La Liga? Barca is certainly going into a slump. Boy would I love for Lyon to pull off the miracle in the CL.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:45
@NicoQB: That might be the reason… Either that, or just that he now has fully recovered from his injury.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:48
@Grognard: Barca are playing really bad at the moment. Valdes is screwing up their season. Even though Juninhos free-kick was great, a keeper like VDS or Casillias would have saved it. He shouldnt have concede the first goal from Forlan today either. A grea shot, but bad positioning screwed it up.
And about Real stealing it, how it looks in the Premiership right now that might happen. Remember the stats that Real win every time United win, Barca win every time Chelski win and Valencia win when Arsenal win?
March 1st, 2009 at 22:50
We have won three trophies, and we can win 3 more. How great is this?! We can finish the season with two trebles!!!
March 1st, 2009 at 22:51
@RedDevilEddy: What a surprise.
I’m happy for you mate. The lad played well and he deserved to put the game on ice for us.
March 1st, 2009 at 22:54
Player Ratings:
Foster – A couple of excellent saves apart his command of his area and kicking was excellent. Has one of the key hallmarks of a United keeper, an eye for a quick throw to set us on a counter attack. The game will probably cement him to second place keeper at United as I really don’t think PIG has a performance like that in his armoury. Critical he stays clear from injuries now. 8
O’Shea – Decent performance but didn’t offer much offensively and his distribution was careless at times. Walking a bit of a tightrope with the yellow card and could easily have got himself sent off. 6.5
Ferdinand – Excellent performance, arguably his best since his return from injury. Dominant in the air and on the ground, neither Tottenham striker got any change out of him. Commanded the backline and team well and was unfortunate to see his volley go over the bar in the first half. Good distribution when in possession. 8.5 and MOM
Evans – Solid display at both CB and RB and made some excellent tackles. Looked to be tiring badly as the game wore on. Still has the annoying habit of getting himself penned in near the touchline too often when in possession and having the hoof the ball clear as a result. 7.5
Evra – Got shredded by Lennon for a large part of the first half and this isn’t the first time he has had bother with him. Stabilised the situation in the second half and offered good attacking support. Unlucky not to win the match in extra time with a real rocket of a shot. 6
Ronaldo – Not really his day but put in a good display. Was the most potent looking attacker throughout the match and really should have had the cup won in regulation time. Unlucky to be booked for diving but I have to say on first look I though it was a dive, the nature of his fall didn’t do him any favours. 7.5
Scholes – Calm and composed as usual and his passing was excellent. In particular he fired a number of long range passes out wide right onto Ronaldo’s foot. Didn’t dominant but held his own against a hard working Spurs midfield. 7
Gibson – A solid if unspectacular performance. Started the game well but looked like he was being overawed by the occasion as the half wore on. Improved in the second half but still has someway to go to securely establish his place in the first team squad. 6.5
Nani – occasionally dangerous, frequently wasteful. Expected more from him given the supply of ball he received and number of one on ones he found himself in with his full back. Possibly could have done more to help out defensively when it became obvious that Evra was struggling to handle Lennon. 6
Welbeck – Largely anonymous. Mitigating circumstances in the form of lack of good service and his age but his performance was really not good enough today. Should have done better with Scholes defence splitter in the first half. 5.5
Tevez – Like Welbeck he was largely anonymous. Unlike Welbeck he does not have the excuse of age to blame. Same flaws as usual, such as control and failure to pass the ball quickly enough were present. Says a lot about his season when I don’t really care anymore if we keep him or not. 5.5
Subs:
Anderson – Injected pace and drive into the midfield and made a number of good runs. Slightly suspect decision making and poor execution of some passes let him down thought. Good return after injury lay-off. 7
Vidic – Solid performance when he came on although Spurs attack had been significantly blunted by that point. 7
Giggs – Some good touches and passes when he came on. Difficult for him to make an impact when the majority of his team mates were playing at walking pace by the time he came on. 7
March 1st, 2009 at 22:57
@johnsom33: I’m surprised you don’t already know how I rate the two keepers as I have been a very vocal critic of both but especially of Foster in the past. To be fair, Foster needs a longer trial and more opportunities to see what he really has. Is he the heir to EVDS? Not in my opinion but today’s performance went a long way in altering my thoughts on him. I don’t rate PIG at all. Send him back to the Polish pork farm where we found him. Keep Foster as number two and sign Adler or Boruc or Neuer. That’s what I want. However, if Foster can turn in another two or three performances like this in, then perhaps I will have to look at him far more seriously. Today he impressed me with his shot stopping but I thought his distribution was excellent as well as his command of the box. He handled crosses with more confidence and aggressiveness. That’s what I like to see. In the EPL, there are a lot of great shot stoppers. Gomes is a great shot stopper. But he and others are horrible at handling high balls into the box and at distributing the ball and communicating to their defense.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:05
@Matt: Those Ole type strikers exist but in my book they are not very famous and basically are the star players for mid-table teams in france, italy, spain and the like.
But what Ole had, and proved to be his one in a million asset was that he could come midway into a game fresh and focused. Most players have to get a number of games to be physically fit, plus have to get their confidence back. Just look at poor Nani…
Anyway my point was if we get a new “bench” striker, in ano way will he be a big name – or maybe he may be a proved striker on his last years in the game looking for some silverware – a bit like Boston Celtics wanted Reggie Miller for one last season.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:06
@NicoQB: I wouldn’t put Evans anywhere near RB unless were are really short of manpower. A couple of decent 30 minute cameos in the position isn’t enough to sell me on it and I’m not sold that he gives enough offensively to play in the position. How bad is O’Shea really, just look at the number of clean sheets we have kept when he has been in the team.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:06
I’d like to say one thing about Tevez. Today he is receiving a right good bollocking from all of us who thought he stunk the park out. But let me say this. I still think he is a quality player with a lot of desire and heart. I just have a feeling that when it’s all said and done he will do things for us the rest of the way that is going to play a major role in us winning more silverware. I just have the feeling that he is going to go from hero to goat and by the end of the season, all of us who are say “goodbye Carlos and don’t let the door hit you on the way out”, will be begging United to sign him up. Just a feeling.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:09
@RedDevilEddy: There are many stadiums in the United States mate that are just as big if not bigger and some have grass as well as retractile roofs, and that is not a problem. The problem is underneath the turf. Something is not right with the foundation because grass and it’s root system is not being allowed to grow long and grab.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:11
@Grognard: I don’t think Foster has the time to prove himself for the #1 slot before VDS either retires or his form fails him. Seems to me signing a future starting goalie will be a priority this off season.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:17
@JB: As usual spot on ratings and comments. Though I thought Ronaldo would have deserved an 8 and that often the CMs were overrun for a large part of the match resulting in spurs having (in my eyes) much possession.
Btw what are your thoughts about Evans’ possibility to play at RB (while Gaz and Brown are not fit)? Like I said I would start him ahead of the poor marker Rafael and O’shea being O’shea…
March 1st, 2009 at 23:17
@NicoQB: Fuck off! what has Evans done in his half game at RB in the Carling Cup that makes you think he is better than O’Shea who was one of the best players on the pitch in the CL second round? Come on tell me? O’Shea links up with Ronaldo better than most of our other RBs and pretty much shuts down most offensive threats on the side that he plays. What did Evans do that justifies you laughing when I say O’Shea is better at RB than Evans. Fuck off and join the rest of the ‘I only rate Latin players’ club.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:18
@Grognard: Well I hope your right about Tevez, but I have seem nothing in his performances to even give us a glimpse of the kind of front man we need. There’s no sense of improvement in his play, no getting back to the basics approach that an out of form player tends to have and not even the slightest whiff of an impending burst of goal scoring.
Stick a fork in him Grog, he’s done!!
March 1st, 2009 at 23:21
@Liam: To be fair to Nico he was advocating Evans in front of Da Silva, a Latin player.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:21
@JB: Oops didn’t see that comment!
Yeah, i’m probably a bit too harsh on O’shea so apologies, my bad.
But I still think that Evans has got more natural defending skills than Rafael (easily) and O’shea (probably). O’shea’s to his credit has got experience and is dependable, but he can still be dodgy in his passing when he’s in the mood.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:23
@Liam: Err, Liam, your reference to peoples bias towards Latin players seems sort of shallow coming from an Irishman backing an Irishman!!
March 1st, 2009 at 23:24
@JB: Sorry I only read this comment: @NicoQB: in which he laughed because I said O’Shea is better at RB than Evans and decided to skip the rest of his comments
March 1st, 2009 at 23:26
@NicoQB: True, but the full back role requires attacking and defending skills. Evans hasn’t shown anything in his camoes to suggest he would offer much offensively. O’Shea, while a lax passer at times, still gets up and down the wings well.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:28
@Liam: Probably makes more sense if you read 180, presumably that is why Dan commented on it in the first place.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:32
@Redrich: maybe but do you watch Ireland matches? O’Shea starts CB in every one of them and the one against Montenegro totally changed my opinion of him. Before that I thought he was dodgy defensively but he put in a great performance and made many great interceptions/tackles and since then he has been playing at a good level whenever he’s played for United and all I hear is how he’s the weak link in our DEFENSE but when Rafael plays he is excused from defending well because he’s up the pitch attacking when the other team have it. Look at how many times Rio has to cover in a game for O’Shea compared to Rafael. O’Shea gets forward too and has played in Ronaldo for some of our best chances today and against Inter.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:36
@Liam: Hey, keep cool man, that was meant in jest, though I can see that I hurt your feelings. So you rate O’shea more than Evans at RB, well to each his own, and I welcome your difference in opinion.
The thing with O’shea is that I ‘m so used to him being crap (I think his midfield years traumatised me) that even when he plays decently (and I should stress decently as the equivalent of what Park does) I’m negatively biased.
But in no way can I see O’shea being a starter at any position – at either full back positions he would have to improve his passing and wing play and any other position he doesn’t have enough experience. Funny as aearly in his career I rooted for him to start more at CB which he never truly did on a sustained period of time.
But don’t get me wrong I clearly think he’s an important squad player, the kind of which makes all the difference when looking at, say, Arsenal’s defensive fiasco. So cheers mate.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:36
@JB: I think that thats a side of Evans’ game needs to developed. He has slotted in well for Vidic, in fact, he’s been amazing considering he came out of nowhere to fill such an important job, but to achieve maximum flexibility from the back 4, they do need to be somewhat interchangable.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:36
OK here are my player rating finally. Good job by JB on his.
FOSTER – 8.5/10 Second best player in the game and a breakout performance by a player who needed to make a statement. Good saves when needed, excellent distribution, especially his long throws and great aggressive presence on high balls in the box. More of this and I might forget Adler and Boruc. But I still doubt it.
O’SHEA – 7/10 Played well and showed way more enterprise going forward than Evra. Slipped a few times because of the turf and Spurs best chance in the game came from it. Nevertheless, a solid game and lucky not to be sent off.
RIO – 9/10 A master class of defending and saving the bacon of others in the process. The man of the match and clearly a player who plays great when he is captain in a final. Made some game saving tackles, headers and blocks.
EVANS – 7/10 A gutsy gritty effort from a player who was clearly hurting but who gutted it out and played very well. Showed adaptability by being forced to play RB near the end and never hurt us a bit.
EVRA – 5/10 The worst game I have seen the little Frenchman play since his first season with us. Looked slow, lethargic and lacking in ambition to move forward and overlap. He really looked tired and out of shape and I’m wondering if he wasn’t carrying an injury or still fighting his fitness after that four game layoff. Also a shame he missed that great volley at the end.
RONALDO – 7/10 Had his moments but was not as much an impact as he was in Milan. Unlucky not to get a penalty on the play he was given a useless yellow for diving. The last second shot that hit the goalpost was vintage Ronny and it spoke volumes for his season, NO FUCKING LUCK.
GIBSON – 5/10 I just didn’t care for the kid’s performance. He looked over matched and out of his element. His one moment was that great long shot he narrowly missed on. Made some poor passes and was indecisive on tackles allowing players too much room.
SCHOLES – 6/10 Just a bland and uneventful performance. Never got a lot wrong but never imposed himself on the game. Very conservative and pedestrian. The boring Scholee I have grown to be indifferent towards.
NANI – 6/10 Looked a little tired and lazy on the ball. Where has this boy’s quickness and speed gone? Where is his inventive dribbling and skinning of opponents. These days he likes to stand and look at defenders or wait for them to pounce on him before he drives a cross off of them and out of bounds. And his tracking back to help Evra was terrible and this gave Lennon all kinds of opportunities. Fortunately Lennon is a muppet and he never took advantage of them.
WELBECK – 5/10 I really cannot blame him too much because service to him was non existent but he also looked overwhelmed by the event and clearly intimidated. Nothing more games and a little maturing can’t repair.
TEVEZ – 4/10 Just the worst performance I have ever seen from Carlito. No drive, no terrier, pest like presence, no determination, terrible first touch display and lacking focus and energy to make any kind of positive contribution. I would have sat him down at half time. Fine Fergie, don’t start Berba, but to not have him dress and be available as a sub was a big mistake.
ANDERSON – 8/10 Was great and showed the energy that the whole game was lacking. Made some great runs that were destroyed by poor runs and touches by guess who? Carlos Tevez. Haf a good chance to score on a very good shot and came through for us in the penalty shootout. Just a bloody goal machine waiting to break out, right Eddy?
VIDIC – 8/10 Boy for the limited time he was in there he had a lot do and was a rock in the process. Was beaten once by Bent who got a good shot in but other than that was a savior on many occasions. I just love Nemanja and his presence. He truly intimidates opponents because they almost give up when he confronts them.
GIGGS – 6.5/10 Did a decent job and could have benefited more had we had two forwards to feed rather than one. Mad some decent runs but nothing really came of it.
FERGIE – 7/10 I never liked the tactics or the palyer selection and I hated the bench. We played a very slow and boring game and we looked tired and out of ideas. Not necessarily his fault but I have to blame somebody. Should have had Bebratov dressed and on the bench because we had no forwards to count on.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:38
@Redrich: You could be right but I still have this feeling he will deliver gold for us before it’s all said and done.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:43
@Liam: So you see, we can agree on some points.
I also think that Rafael has been more often than not poor and could do with a crash course in man-marking.
Ok, I’m off to sleep guys, its nearly 4 in the morning here in Mauritius.
Talk about living a healthy life… 
March 1st, 2009 at 23:45
@Liam: Don’t get me wrong mate, I love Mr. Versatility. I tend to excuse some of his lapses in concentration because of his overall value to us and because he plays, without complaint, wherever he’s told to. I do think you comparing him with the very young Rafael is a dead-end argument. They are different types of players and Rafael is still way too green to access much critique in his game.
March 1st, 2009 at 23:50
@Redrich: I’m all for flexibility in our backline but I think we are well enough covered in that respect. We have Brown, Rafeal, Neville and O’Shea who can play RB (with Hargreaves next season if we are stuck). Evra, Fabio and O’Shea can play LB so we seem well covered in both slots. I don’t see any particular need to be training Evans up as a full back but if we were to do it I would rather see it at LB given he is a naturally left sided player.
March 2nd, 2009 at 0:14
@JB: Yeah but you can’t play all of them at the same time. Evans will be a better player with some attacking prowess and it will give us an additional threat and cover.
March 2nd, 2009 at 0:30
@Redrich: Well we haven’t played Ferdinand or Vidic out wide to gain attacking prowess. As you say you can’t play all of the aforementioned players at once, so why play a CB in positions that are already so heavily stocked?
March 2nd, 2009 at 0:46
I found this kind of interesting and amusing.
Ruud van Nistelrooy wants to make peace with Sir Alex Ferguson.
“The Dutchman left Manchester United for Real Madrid in 2006 after a bitter fall-out which saw him miss the Carling Cup Final.
Striker Van Nistelrooy, who is recovering from a major knee operation, said: “I’m so looking forward to see him again. I want to talk and make up, clear the air between us.
“After all this time I can’t believe or understand what it was really all about. Why did it have to be such a big thing?
“I think we were both to blame. It just exploded between us.
“Because we had such a smashing relationship, I just thought, ‘What on earth are you doing to me?’
“I was so upset. As a professional player you never get so attached to your club or manager that a clash will hurt you that much.
“But in this case it did. It got very personal.”
March 2nd, 2009 at 0:58
The idiotic ratings from the Manchester City News. Check out the grade for Tevez.
Foster: The hero of the hour who was out to impress… and he certainly did with a commanding performance. Was seen taking advice from Edwin van der Sar before the shoot-out and at 25 is ready to start as first choice next season. Wonderful to see how sporting he was with the naturally disappointed Spurs keeper Gomes who himself had done so much to answer his critics … 9.
O’Shea: Won his starting berth as a reward for his great loyalty to the cause. Did little wrong but in truth had so little to do as United totally dominated the first half. Was replaced by Vidic to allow a defensive reshuffle … 6.
Ferdinand: Got his public wish to start and was in cruise control before the interval with Tottenham offering few threats. Stepped up his game when he had to and had Darren Bent in his pocket. Was furious with Evra after Lennon again showed his pace and trickery to get the better of the Premier League’s top left back. Midway through the first half he found the time to support the attack and was close with a spectacular 30-yard effort … 8.
Evans: This new kid on the block can be proud of his performance under the additional pressure of a final. On the hour he had perhaps United’s best chance but his shot was off target and Tevez on the post couldn’t turn it in. Looked even more comfortable when he switched to full back … 7.
Evra: For such an accomplished player well used to taking on the best in the world, he toiled all afternoon against Lennon. Time and again Lennon turned the Frenchman who has been in such brilliant form inside out … 5.
Ronaldo: A surprise choice to start but proved to all that United were determined to lift their second trophy of the season. Played deeper at first but still was a constant threat and in one delightful moment managed a chested cross. His free kicks around the box did not trouble Gomes in the Tottenham goal. Treated harshly but for what the ref thought was a dive was more of a desperate lunge having lost the ball. It was almost Ronaldo’s afternoon when he hit the post after a brilliant run in the last minute of normal time … 8.
Gibson: The Ulster-born but Republic international was promised a starting berth and Fergie was true to his word. He was solid enough and showed boldness to try to make the 13th minute lucky when he shot just wide from 35 yards. But he will need in this superstar company to add more to his game if he is to pin down a regular first team place. Was replaced for extra time by Giggs and that instilled more guile into United’s midfield …6.
Scholes: Masterful performance from the Saddleworth based superstar. His passes both in choice and direction were exquisite. Totally dominated the midfield. One through ball set up Welbeck as early as the seventh minute but the youngster fluffed the chance. Was the last man back after a lung-busting run by Spurs sub Bale to clear the danger showing he has the engine to keep on accelerating as late as the 104th minute …8.
Nani: Still suffering second season syndrome and failed to grab the opportunity to write himself into United folklore with an under par Wembley performance. Had his chances but was overshadowed. Fergie tried to get him to use his pace to target Tottenham’s weakened defence after the Londoners had gone down to ten men but to no avail … 6.
Welbeck: What a great shame the Longsight-born 18-year-old striker who was the first British striker to come through the ranks at Old Trafford since Hughes and Whiteside could not make this a dream come true with a performance that matches his great potential. He will for sure have learnt from this high-pressure game. Was withdrawn soon after the interval with Brazilian Anderson introduced to add flair to midfield allowing Ronaldo to get more forward … 6.
Tevez: The eager beaver was everywhere desperate to make an impact. His work rate was magnificent and he was so unlucky not to be on the score-sheet. It was almost as if he was trying too hard as he almost single-handedly harassed Spurs’ back line. He was tenacious in his tackling in midfield too, consistently racing back to win possession … 8.
Subs: United: Anderson for Welbeck 56; O’Shea for Vidic 74; Giggs for Gibson 90. Subs not used: Kuskczak, Eckersley, Park, Possebon.
Tottenham: Gomes 7, Borluka 7, King 7, Dawson 6, Assou-Ekotto 5, Lennon 8, Jenas 6, Zokora 6, Modric 7, Bent 5, Pavlyuchenko 4. Subs: O’Hara for Pavlyuchenko 64, Bale for Jenas 98, Bentley for Lennon 101.
March 2nd, 2009 at 1:03
@Rahul: I just saw that too. 12 point became 4 in just 3 weeks. That’s how fast it can change. I still think there is a long way for Real to catch up, cause while Barca plays their hard games, Real plays the easier ones. I just hope our guys see this and understand that they need to finish this ASAP.
March 2nd, 2009 at 1:40
I see no reason whatsoever to play Evans at right-back except when our natural right backs are out. It is better he specialises at centre back and reaches his potential in that position. We’ve already seen this season he gets plenty of games even though he hasn’t yet surpassed Vidic or Rio. With three quality central defenders we are guaranteed a strong core to our defence and it would take a really extreme injury crisis (like last week) to put our defence at any real danger (and even then Evans and O’Shea rose to the occasion carrying injuries).
Evra did seem a bit tired. We need him fresh for the Inter game (not that they have any width..so he won’t get found out defensively, but we need his attacking thrust on the flanks. I forget who we are playing before Inter but Id take a chance playing Fabio on the left so we have Evra fresh for Inter and can rest O’Shea and play Neville on the right (if fit).
O’Shea has really impressed me this season. I think even his passing has improved and he is definitely no liability in defence. Rafael will get lots of chances to develop against the teams who stick 11 men in front of the goal. For the big games when we cannot afford defensive errors Im happy with O’Shea or Brown.
With Tevez I think last season Rooney made him look better than he actually is. Without Rooney his main strength is really his defensive abilities and his running. We don’t really need those in the majority of games we play when scoring goals rather than conceding is the problem. And Tevez just hasn’t looked at all like a goal threat this season.
Im not sure I buy the RVN stuff. I still think he has a lot to offer as a player and remember his great performances in the Euro championships as a lone striker and his poachers goals. He’d be a useful role player to have. BUT aside from the fact Fergie would never have him back, Real wouldn’t sell….I think he’d be bad for the team harmony and I doubt he’d accept a primarily bench role.
But we do need a third striker if Tevez goes because Welbeck is still very raw, Campbell only has a season in the Championship under his belt and after a few good early performancces is rotting on Spurs bench. AND there are games when we have a very real need for someone to give us a plan B in those games where the ball just won’t go into the net. Either a target man to give us the option of a different route to goal….or a goal poacher who will convert more of the chances. But this player would have to be happy with a third striker role
March 2nd, 2009 at 1:59
@JB: Today’s game should be proof enough that an additional talent at wing back could well have proved to be cover for injuries and an under performing Evra. The possibility of Evans learning that position would surely be up to him and his abilities but the reasons for not trying to expand his playing repertoire alludes me!!
March 2nd, 2009 at 2:08
@Grognard: Whoever wrote those ratings did not see the game!! That or someone at the club has a hand in their editorial department.
SAF, you wouldn’t, would you???????!!!!!!!!
March 2nd, 2009 at 2:37
@Grognard: As far RVN regretting his falling out with SAF. Well SAF doesn’t cry over spilt milk! – or RVN, Beckham, Veron, Staam, Heinze and anyone else he’s run out of town. Look elsewhere Ruud, sorry about the career, and er, with regrets, goodbye!
March 2nd, 2009 at 7:32
Grognard, Thanks mate for finally admitting that Foster looks like a great Keeper and he will be great if he continuously plays.
March 2nd, 2009 at 7:38
@Grognard: It just might be possible but it’s mighty difficult. Barca have done a Liverpool of late and just screwed themselves with silly losses (I dont mean to demean them by the Liverpool analogy), although last night was more a case of Atletico winning it than Barca losing it.
@Orez: I hope they finish it asap. No time to lose, this is the time to press pedal to the metal and push the NOS button all the way to the finish line.
March 2nd, 2009 at 8:15
@Martin: Jeez! Some of you guys are putting words into my mouth. All I said was that the lad played a great game and showed more promise. But for me at least, the jury was still out. Where in my words did I admit that he looked like a great keeper? He’s have to play like that on a more consistent basis for me to make that claim. But yes, he did play great yesterday. Bay steps.
March 2nd, 2009 at 8:31
In the words of someone last week:
Tevez sacrificed himself for the team…
Seriously, Tevez had a poor performance yesterday. It seems like all his first touches were bad during the game…pity…I still believe there’s a place for him in our team though. But, I wonder if he’s already resigned to leaving and just don’t give a shit? Then again, it was a bad performance by almost everyone (especially our midfield).
Mr. Anderson… pity his goalscoring is so poor…2 goals = 2 cups. Imagine if he start scoring regularly? I sincerely hope that this goal will kick-start his career. I really hope so. Extremely glad ‘The One’ is back.
I’m not going to complain much about the performance because at this point, the most important thing is, WE WON THE CUP!
Well done Manchester United!!!
March 2nd, 2009 at 11:01
@Redrich: Listen Mate RUUD is a legend, was Man Utd thru and thru, and didn’t deserve the shabby treatment he got by the Ferg. Sorry but I will never agree with Fergie over the Stam, Ruud, or Becks treatment. Peace out.
March 2nd, 2009 at 11:03
@Redrich: I agree with you, Evra was made to look VERY ordinary by Aaron Lennon yesterday. In butchers terms, Evra was skinned aplenty.
March 2nd, 2009 at 11:05
@Grognard: Ruud – Man Utd LEGEND forever – end of.
March 2nd, 2009 at 12:21
@Redrich: Fergie didn’t fall out with Veron, he just didn’t settle.
March 2nd, 2009 at 14:20
Stephen, yeah your right, but Veron’s take on it was that Fergie sold him on to Chelsea without really giving him time to come good at OT. See what I mean about different players/clubs having different take on things
.
March 2nd, 2009 at 18:43
@Craig Mc: I loved RVN too Bro until he spent the last three seasons bad mouthing Fergie and the team and trying through the media to convince his arch nemesis Ronaldo to turn his back on United and join Real Madrid. It was sleazy and wreaked of no class. He was a great player for us but those days are over and I’ll remember him fondly for his contributions. As for forgiveness and all, I don’t think so. I was 100% on his side through the whole affair (the fact that I hated Saha helped) and I felt betrayed by Fergie when he did what he did. But I have learned over the years not through wisdom or logic but just from experience and awareness, that trusting da man, Sir Alex Ferguson and showing loyalty, trust and faith in him is all that we need concern ourselves with.
Players come and go, but we will never ever ever find a leader for our team like the one we have now. And although I have questioned his decisions and his attitude towards Beckham, RVN, Stam, Keane and others who found themselves outsiders looking in, I know and believe that he acted on behalf of the team’s best interest and on a code that he believes to be correct and virtuous. And based on his success and the loyalty that many have shown him, who am I to argue with that? Like I said, I may criticize him a bit but I did the same towards my father. We had titanic arguments but I loved him nonetheless. And I love the great Fergie in the same manner. RVN be damned with your two faced stab in the back attitude. There is no mending of burned bridges when RVN crawled into bed with Real Madrid and decided to operate this campaign of bitterness and duplicate betrayal, that was his Waterloo when it comes to ever being forgiven and considered on of us ever again. In history, traitors and turncoats are shot.
March 2nd, 2009 at 18:47
@Stephen: That’s right. And if some of you are not aware Veron has come out and said very complimentary things about Fergie, Man Utd and his time here. He was very disappointed in himself and cannot understand why he failed and let us all down. He holds no grudge or animosity towards the Boss and has nothing but the highest respect for him and cannot blame him for his decision to sell him. Now that’s class. RVN could stand to learn from Juan Sebastian Veron.
March 2nd, 2009 at 19:11
@Craig Mc: I absolutely agree that RVN is a United legend in our time. At his peak he was a goal scoring machine to the likes of which we haven’t seen since or likely to see in the foreseeable future.
My point, though, is that if he thinks he can make a comeback here, he is very much mistaken. Even if his skills were that of 3 years ago, SAF would not allow it. Maybe because of pride or steely resolve or whatever, SAF just doesn’t do 180’s.
March 2nd, 2009 at 19:22
@Grognard: Spot on mate, I saw him play at home against Everton and he was superb, totally ran the game, class player wish he worked out, but not to be.
March 2nd, 2009 at 19:54
Reading an earlier comment i hear about veron and that he couldnt settle and thats why he left which is completely correct. Just thinking though about veron as a player and i gotta say how do you think we would have been for us, had he joined us now, obviously when he was his age back then and at his peak. The way we played back then we were really a very british team. We had keane as the enforcer, scholes who was basically like a second striker and giggs and beckham on the wings. I think had he come now he would have fitted into our team brilliantly. Our team now would suit him well and i feel his only problem back then was he never got to play in his natural position because we had a sort of undroppable set of players. In the champs league however we saw him play more in the CM role and he looked excellent. I remember him running the show against juve at their yard back in 2003, and a beautiful chip over the keeper in some game. He looked world class in the champs league. I still rate him as a player and hate it when i hear others saying he was a terrible signing because he wasnt, he was just unlucky. He had undoubted class but maybe we just werent the right style team for him, now adays though we play more like a foreign team so i think he would have fitten into this team easy.
March 2nd, 2009 at 20:52
@Matt: Agreed. Added to the fact that the latin contingent was nowhere near what it is now. That would have greatly helped him in settling.
I should mention that at the time Veron was probably my favourite player fro any other tream but I was baffled by the signing as, so you said, we had a perfect four man midfield. A player of his quality just couldn’t a settle fo the bench.
And by the way should I also mention that at his peak Beckham also played quite similar to Veron – it always bugs me that people tend to forget Becks’ technical game in his vintage years and was much more than what he finally turned out to be – a caricature of himself, i.e. a crossing machine..
March 2nd, 2009 at 21:55
http://www.viewlondon.co.uk/news/agent-claims-united-want-ribery-19053389.html
what do you guys think?
March 2nd, 2009 at 22:21
@Matt: I think that goal was against Olympiakos at home. My favorite moments from him weren’t any of his goals but two of his passes. The first was a sweeping pass down the middle of the pitch with the outside of his boot to set Beckham free to chip the keeper from 25 yards against Birmingham. The other was the pinpoint long range pass onto Forlan’s boot to score the winner against Chelsea in 2002.
Unfortunately Veron was the victim of circumstance, the wrong man at the wrong time. The transfer pot available that summer was never intended for him, but for Patrick Vieira. When that particular transfer collapsed, SAF with left with a pile of money burning a hole in his pocket and an itch to spend. As a result you get a transfer that maybe wasn’t as well though out as it should have been. Not that it mattered to most fans at the time who were over the moon with the signing.
I never though he was as big a flop as some of the media and other clubs supporters like to make out. I still feel that it was a mistake to sell him in 2003 after Beckham had left and I though we was showing signs of adapting properly to the league before his ankle/ligament injuries earlier that year.
March 2nd, 2009 at 23:27
@JB: Didn’t Keane admit (in his autobiography I think) that he was the main culprit in ensuring that Veron did not settle in the team?
March 3rd, 2009 at 0:17
@Karl: I read his autobiography some time ago, but I don’t remember any specific reference about Veron adapting to the club in it. Certainly though I would consider Roy a factor, if Veron was going to be a success I believe he had to be made the team’s playmaker however the role remained with Keane. In retrospect he was a signing that didn’t have enough thought put into how he would fit into the team.
March 3rd, 2009 at 0:44
I think its fair to say veron was an excellent player, just for mainly settling in reasons, he never adapted to us. As Nico says though today the large latin contingent would have helped him settle in so i feel sorry for him thinking back that he had no one to help him back then. If we had seen his best he could have been a great for us but i feel very strongly when i hear he was a terrible signing and 1 of the worst by ferguson. He was a real talent, potentially world great, kleberson and djemba werent so how he can be put in those 2 categories is madness.
JB, the summer we signed veron and ruud i didnt know we were so serious of signing of viera. I was like 11 back then so i cant remember too well, i remember hearing we weree interested in him but were we really interested in him or just like on a wishlist. Were arsenal willing to sell or was it viera who didnt want to leave. Just wondering had viera joined where the hell would he have fitted in. We already had roy keane so why the need for patrick. Sorry for all the questions but i never knew much about the viera chase because i was so young.
ROOOOONEY, if ronaldo does leave the only player i do want is ribery, he is class so yes if ronaldo does leave i hope his agent is speaking the truth cos he is the only player who we can realistically get who can replace ronnie. Dont think however ronaldo will leave til fergie does which may be some time so this agent talk may not matter anyway.
March 3rd, 2009 at 1:11
@Matt: As I remember it Arsenal made a statement confirming we had officially contacted them with regards to a transfer, confirmed by Kenyon at the time. In addition I believe Wenger accused us of tapping Viera up that year. It was much further down the line than the usual wishlisting that goes on every summer.
Arsenal’s stance was that he was not for sale at any price however it looked like they would have no other choice but to let him go. Viera came out and openly attacked the ambition, financial situation and transfer policy of Arsenal and Wenger himself. The consensus in the media at the time was that he had burned all bridges and it was a matter of where he would go (be it United, Real or Juve) rather than if. You would need to ask an Arsenal fan for more details on it but Wenger obviously managed to talk him round someway or another.
March 3rd, 2009 at 12:11
Where is everyone?
March 3rd, 2009 at 13:22
@JB: I think I read it about 2 years ago, after his stint at Celtic. In that article he mentioned that he did not really want Veron to succeed and that he and the lads were a bit tough with him because he came with a huge reputation.
I dont mean that he is the reason for Veron’s failure, but I believe it contributed a lot).
I googled this portion at least:
http://www.joinmust.org/forum/showthread.php?t=29169
extract…
“While in that Edinburgh hotel, travelling to and from training, missing his Manchester-based family, he thought about Sebastian Veron, his one-time Argentinian teammate at United. “Celtic couldn’t have done enough for me, but it was a lonely life and I wish now I had been a bit easier on some of the foreign lads who came to United. I always thought, ‘You’re on the pitch now, do it.’ I regret that now. I was very hard on Seba, and I was wrong. When he came, I was expecting miracles. When they didn’t happen, I was always homing in on him, and I now know it takes time.”
March 3rd, 2009 at 15:21
Liverpool could trip up further tonight as Sunderland have openly said they are going there to park the bus. Liverpool will be without Torres, and Gerrard will play injured. Portsmouth’ll do the same at home to Chelsea, Rooney is fit to face Newcastle tomorrow, and it looks like he’ll start upfront with Berbatov.
March 3rd, 2009 at 17:29
@Traverse: It shall be interesting to see……….
March 3rd, 2009 at 17:35
RR post a new thread!
March 3rd, 2009 at 17:41
@Karl: Very enlightening. Added to the fact that Keane moved from a British town to another. Now, Veron had to make the move from one entirely different culture to another.
Wonder what he’s doing now?
March 3rd, 2009 at 17:46
@NicoQB: He’s playin in the Argentine league for Estudiantes!
March 3rd, 2009 at 17:51
@Rahul: Yeah, god bless wikipedia:
“…In early 2008, several football personalities chose Verón as the best player in the Argentine league [8] [9]. In December 2008, Verón was elected South American Footballer of the Year by Uruguayan diary El País, a title that is cited worldwide..”
It seems he finally found his feet again, though I pity him as even in his homeland of Argentina, the population resent his disappointing international showings…
March 3rd, 2009 at 18:00
@NicoQB: Actually I knew from Fifa 09, I had recently taken him on loan cuz I didnt wanna sell or buy anyone.
March 3rd, 2009 at 18:01
@Rahul: Its Argentina, they always (almost) base a player on how he plays for the national team.
March 3rd, 2009 at 18:04
or maybe it was Fifa 08!
March 3rd, 2009 at 18:27
So, any thoughts on tomorrow’s game? A midweek game coming after an exhausting Carling Cup Final. Many of our boys could very well be exhausted. Seriously though, don’t look for Ronaldo to start. If he does, then Fergie has completely lost it has no common sense when it comest to keeping our star asset fresh and healthy.
Obviously we will see the return of Berbatov and Rooney as well as Carrick, Park and EVDS. All rested and ready to go. But our back four may be stretched again and this time they are coming of 120 minutes on a soft and unstable pitch. Fatigue could be the key.
Tomorrow is such a big game for us. It’s nail in the coffin time lads. There is a possibility we could be ten points up on both Liverpool and Chelsea but seeing as they are playing today, the most probable scenario will still be a chance to stay seven points in front with a game in hand.
These next 14 days will be the make or break period of our season. If we come out of fairly unblemished, then the league is definitely ours and it will be ours in a cake walk. However, if we suffer any kind of Barcelona style hiccup here, then we open the door to two incredibly undeserving teams to could be right back in this the race. What a time to have so many games in such a short period of time and to have our Champions League future also hang in the balance. Balancing and juggling our squad will be so key for us and there is nobody better at this than Fergie. But injuries and fatigue to some key players like O’Shea, Neville, Evans, Rafael, Evra and Tevez may cause us problems. Evra and Tevez looked very tired and way off their game on Sunday. They need to rebound.
I have to be honest, I am super nervous about the next few weeks. Inter Milan is crap in my eyes but that return leg scares me because we look so lethargic and tired in so many areas and we now have gone 210 minutes plus injury time without scoring a goal. No we aren’t Arsenal but I am concerned nonetheless. We need some players to step up and be big for us and we also need some luck. Like Ronaldo not hitting a post with seconds left in a game. Fingers crossed chaps.
March 3rd, 2009 at 18:31
@Grognard: ronaldo hasnt been that great this season, certainly not good enough to be called our “star asset” The more games he has the better to be honest, he needs to find his form.
March 3rd, 2009 at 19:54
We can forget Liverpool. A Chelsea side led by Hiddink is going to give us some problems. After all he has a real talent for getting the best out of mediocre teams hehe
Im also getting a bit nervous about the Inter game. There have been very few games this season when we’ve managed to score more than two goals. So if Inter get a lucky goal we are really going to struggle. People rave about how we dominated the first leg. But the fact is we got very few if any shots on target from open play.
Also our defensive line looks sorely tested. Evans had to have another injection, Evra was uncharacteristically crap and O’Shea is probably still carrying that injury.
We are comfortably ahead of the chasing pack. So I reckon we should make use of our squad depth and field this line up
EVDS, Neville, Vidic, Rio, Fabio, Park, Carrick, Fletcher, Nani, Berbatov, Rooney
Evra, O’Shea, Evans and Ronaldo definitely need a rest. Id also give Anderson thirty minutes to see if he can build on the impressive showing against Tottenham, and Tevez half an hour if Rooney starts to tire….he’s short on match fitness and back from the flu.
EVDS,
March 3rd, 2009 at 20:52
L’Arse finally scored.
March 3rd, 2009 at 20:57
@Dan: Get of your soap box mate. Sometimes I just wonder if you argue with me for the sake of arguing. What you just said is as lame as it gets. The player at 50% is better than any other player we have and it hasn’t been two months since he was voted world’s best player. Even when hi is off form, he’s better than most out there. So enough. Who are you going to nominate above him, Welbeck, Possebon, Campbell, Eckersley or are you going to be brave and actually pick a first squad player? Sorry mate, but if you said that kind of rubbish on any other site, that community would laugh you right off it. Please, don’t insult my intelligence by trying to tell me that Ronaldo is not our best player. Honestly mate, sometimes you can frustrate me so.
Still, I love ya. 
March 3rd, 2009 at 21:19
@Dan: If not Ronaldo, Who has been then???
March 3rd, 2009 at 21:49
Form is temporary, class is permanent. Forget the subjective aspect. As a financial asset….Ronaldo is worth at least £80 million. That is twice the value of any other player we have. His goals are also worth their weight in gold because quite frankly none of our strikers can be relied upon. It is telling that he has still scored twice as many as any of our other players despite coming back from an injury and being in bad form. He also looks worse than he really is this season because every time he gets the ball the opposition players cynically foul him. He singlehandedly wins us at least five free kicks each match. If only he did not insist on shooting everytime.
If referees actually gave him some protection and punished these cynical fouls with cards, then it would be much more obvious how good he is. Also think about all the penalties he wins us, and the clear penalties that refs don’t give just because it is Ronaldo.
I would say Ronaldo is the only player we have who is irreplaceable.
Having said that I do feel that our defence doesn’t get the praise it deserves. Rio and Vidic are the best central defensive pairing in the world by quite some distance. I remember the years when we had a dodgy defence and it always cost us especially in Europe. Our attack is only able to get away with being so wasteful because of the quality of our defence.
March 3rd, 2009 at 23:05
@colver: No player is worth £80m. That’s a lot of tabloid BS imo, looking for transfer sagas to fill column inches. If somebody is stupid enough to pay that much for him I wouldn’t be opposed to selling him and buying Ribery/Aguero or both to fill the void and maybe even have change leftover.
March 3rd, 2009 at 23:25
@colver: Ronnie is still by far the biggest threat on goal – less so from free kicks! We miss Rooney when he doesn’t play and the pair still have by far the strongest chemistry going forward. Ronaldo is obviously being told to stay more on the touchline this season which spreads our shape but he seems less inclined to take on his opposite number as a winger might. Lennon played much more like an orthodox winger but his end product was poor.
The midfield and attack is still at an ‘under construction’ stage and yet we’re poor odds on winning the lot. This season is weird but without question, our defence is beyond awesome.
I was very encouraged by Andy’s showing on sunday and feel he is on the brink of a significant breakthrough. The injection of pace he offers is a vital ingredient. I think that is one of the reasons Giggs is getting a lot of game time as he also has that sudden change of pace and the dribbling skill to get clear.
March 4th, 2009 at 0:27
Does anyone know if there is any truth to these Ribery rumours? If so is there any chance we could get him before Real Madrid sign him up? We could sell Nani to raise some transfer funds. With Ronaldo on the right and Ribery on the left we would be unstoppable.
March 4th, 2009 at 1:04
@colver: i saw the Lyon v Bayern game re-run from before Christmas. Ribery was absolutely fantastic, he’s some player, tenacious, skillfull, intelligent and driven, got to say i immediately saw him as a Red Devil. This is the first player i’ve seen in a long time thats excited me like this, i know Grog has been going on about him for awhile now, but there’s nothing like seeing it for yourself! Buy him buy him buy him BUY HIM!
March 4th, 2009 at 2:42
@colver: The rumors of Ribery coming to United have heated up bit only if we lose Ronaldo to Madrid. Supposedly, he would be Fergie’s hand picked replacement for Ronny. This is just BS rumors. Other rumors that are flying is that Ribery has already agreed to terms with Barcelona provided Barca agree to terms with Bayern.
Now I would like to say that the rumors of Ribery leaving Bayern are generally BS but lately, Franck has been leaving a bad taste in the mouths of Bayern’s brass, namely Herr’s Beckenbauer, Rummenigge and Hoeness. They all love this player and don’t want to part with such an asset but he has been opening his mouth more and more this season bitching about Bayern not spending the kind of money on players he thinks is necessary for Bayern’s success in the Champions League. Ribery is obsessed with the Champions League. What really pisses me off is that Bayern has looked like the best team in the competition this season. Just last week they destroyed Sporting in Lisbon 5-0, with Ribery scoring twice and assisting on two. The thing that gets under my skin is that the team has spent plenty in the last two years to become Champions League competitive. They bought Ribery, Toni, Klose, Altintop, Ze Roberto, Borowski and got Oddo on loan for the purpose of being very competitive. What else does Ribery want? Apparently he wants the world.
Last season he was quiet and content and was the best player in Germany and should have been a finalist for the Balon D’Or. This year, he started off injured came back, took a while to get in shape and at times has looked great but other times has bitched and moaned about this and that and has struggled to find his consistency. Sound like anybody else we know? I think he is suffering from Ronny Egoitis. Some players just have it in them to think they are bigger and better than their team. In some cases they are right and Ribery as well as Ronaldo can make a case about their greatness. But here is the thing Franck, like Ronaldo, you signed a long contract. Ribery’s contract is up in 2011. So until then, I suggest he shut’s his ugly pie hole and settles in and continues his German lessons because it will take a lot of money to get him.
Certainly United will not pay the money Bayern will be demanding to part with this super player but flaky ego. Barca on the other hand may have the money and the motivation. Look for a Ribery move to Barca after the season is over for about 40 million. As for United, yes Ribery on the left and Ronaldo on the right is a great fantasy, but that is all it is. I think we can look forward to United coming up with the package that will guarantee Ronaldo stays here with us until say 2014. In order for that kind of deal to be be made, we will have to sacrifice a lot of future purchases. So the real question is, Does Ronaldo merit that kind of money and is he worth that much to us that we miss out on players like Ribery?
I love Ribery but Ronaldo is better than him and only has one other player on the planet that can be compared to him. That’s Leo Messi. So for me it’s simple, keep Ronaldo and tell Ribery to stay in Bayern where he is loved and appreciated. Now if he would show the Bayern faithful the same sentiment and spirit……
March 4th, 2009 at 2:48
Ribery is another classic example of a player we could have gotten had Fergie fancied him before his price escalated skywards. Frankly, this is a part of Ferguson’s transfer policies that I cannot stand. Going after player s a year or two too late. Why spend 32 million on a Berbatov when you could have gotten him for ten two years earlier? Why go after Ribery now when he will be at the very least worth 40 million when just last year they could have gotten him for under 20 million? Bottom line is that sometimes the Boss jumps on the bandwagon a bit too late. Mark my words the same thing will happen with Sergio Aguero and has already happened with Benzema. He can get a Rene Adler or Artur Boruc for a decent price right now but watch their price escalate once EVDS officially announces his retirement. United always end up paying much more for a player and it’s because Fergie procrastinates. It’s exasperating.
March 4th, 2009 at 4:01
@Grognard: Well I’m not sure Ribery is fancied by SAF. The idea of Ronaldo leaving this summer is pure speculation and from what I’ve heard he’s due to have a renegotiated contract in the effort to secure his future at United for years to come.
I think its fair to say that we generally do overpay for our immediate needs but there are plenty of examples where we have paid a reasonable or below market price. Evra, Vidic, and Park, are all terrific value when you consider their combined cost was around 17mil.
SAF tends to court players he admires (soft tapping) and then moves on them if his team needs are not met. I thought he overpaid for Berbatov and seemed to be over the barrel by Levy, but considering our anemic goal scoring this year that 32mil could well deliver us an epic season!!
March 4th, 2009 at 4:30
@Grognard: Fergie did try to sign berbatov before he went to spurs, he chose tottenham over united.
Fergie will be going nowhere near boruc, he is a mess.
March 4th, 2009 at 5:32
Not much going on here, is there??
Have to say the game against the Toons is pivotal to me. A decisive victory will send a message to Chelsea and Liverpool that, regardless of their strongest efforts, we will prevail. On the other hand if we drop points, it will fuel their fires and at the same time put a little doubt in the heads of our young squad!!
March 4th, 2009 at 8:55
Preview up, lads
March 4th, 2009 at 8:57
@Grognard: Wow, so somehow i insulted you? wow, maybe i should just leave if you cant stomach another guys opinion. that was low, and the fact that you tried to turn it around to make me look like the bad guy was even lower.
March 4th, 2009 at 9:22
@Grognard: I am actually with Dan on this one. It’s not unreasonable for someone to say that Ronaldo hasn’t been our star asset this season when the real star for us has been Vidic. If you asked for a player from our squad he is one.
You asked for views, and Dan responded with his opinion on Ronaldo. And I beg to disagree with him being laughed off forums for suggesting that Ronaldo hasn’t been our best player this season. He’s very good, but I’ve encountered countless people who haven’t viewed Ronnie in glowing terms on the pitch this season — and a lot of them are not viewing him from the prism of his summer antics.
There’s been a disagreement here, no insult to intelligence. Nothing more.
March 4th, 2009 at 10:50
@Red Ranter: Vidic has been our best player this season. Not even in question.
March 4th, 2009 at 10:51
@Dan: “Honestly mate, sometimes you can frustrate me so.
Still, I love ya. 
”
Now does that sound like a man who has felt greatly insulted? Mildly frustrated yes, insulted hardly. I just couldn’t see your point and I still don’t. Vidic has been good this season but he’s also a limited one dimensional defender with 1/10 the skill that Ronaldo has. Nobody and I mean nobody on the team is in the same universe as Ronaldo and to think there is just ain’t so. Sorry. And like RR said, this is more a disagreement. Where do you get off assuming that was insulted? Jeez Dan you are impossible to debate with without getting hot under the collar. You make wide eyed and quite often outrageous statements that are designed to get a negative response and then you get all upset if somebody challenges you on it and basically destroys your argument. No one said you are the bad guy, I just said you were wrong. Big difference. Calling you wrong does not mean I don’t like you or don’t respect you. It means that I believe you are WRONG and that I can prove it. With a player like Ronaldo and his record, I feel that I can defend him as being the best against anybody but Messi. Even this year when he is half of what he was last year. If we were having this conversation this time last year then my argument would be even stronger and even Messi wouldn’t be able to compete with Ronny. No defender as good as he may be would ever rate as highly in my books with the great skills of an attacking player. Much more is demanded of the attacker. As if there is anyone on our squad right now that is better than Ronaldo. Hell only Cantona and Best are better than Ronaldo in the history of United. And that is my not so humble opinion. So don’t get so hot and bothered over a little debate. Can we learn to disagree without getting so bent out of shape? PEACE AND LOVE BRO!
March 4th, 2009 at 11:25
@Grognard:
The fact that you told Dan to get out of his “soap box” alludes to him being delusional. I’m sure, in my time here, I’ve seen you get hot under the collar if you’re called deluded. It’s easy to say those things and try to balance it out with “a still love ya”. But sometimes people don’t take kindly to their statements being labelled “rubbish” and “lame”.
I’m sure Dan does at times succumb to personal biases, like we all do. But when you wouldn’t personally appreciate being called deluded/constructor of lame arguments (presumably because you take yourself seriously) so do others take themselves seriously here. I’m pretty sure it’s what made Dan go berserk.
And regarding the insult, I suppose he meant when you said: “don’t insult my intelligence…”
March 4th, 2009 at 18:21
@Red Ranter: Yes I said all those things but in a friendly and joking manner. That is why I highlighted a quote from me that shows my intent was never to insult but more to poke a little fun at a fellow ranter that I have had many many debates with and many debates in which we have gotten frustrated with each others stubborn ways.
Much too much has been made over comments I made in the friendliest of moods. The fact that Dan and yourself could not pick out the intentions of my words despite my attempts to show that I was only having some fun making a point to Dan is unfortunate. Despite this unfortunate occurrence, I will take the responsibility of not making my intentions clearer.
The problem however, is this has blown into another wrist slapping session where I get chastised over absolutely nothing. Look around RR, I have more than behaved myself for months now and have gotten into no trouble. And any time there has been any minor trouble, I have calmed the waters and cleared up any misunderstandings. Dan and I quite often get under each other’s collars because we are both stubborn and and have our severe biases, but we are also two ranters who tend to let bygones be bygones and we generally get along and even have the occasional joke between us.
I’m not going to accuse Dan of getting overly emotional and touchy over what I said because that would make me a hypocrite, but I will say that both you and he misunderstood the intentions of my comment and the nature in which it was made. Sorry for that but honestly, when you jokingly tell somebody that he frustrates you but you still love him, that should cause one to think before they retaliate with anger or bitterness.
If one of the regulars who I have respect and familiarity with tells me to get off my soap box, I’d think twice before I took that badly. If it was a newbie on the other hand, perhaps I would feel insulted. I was just trying to strike home a point where I felt my frustration with the subject needed a little more expression. It was very early in the morning and I was tired and perhaps with more sleep I would have thought a different ways to phrase the statement. But still, I really hate being brought into the Principals office and given the strap for this. To be honest, I don’t feel it’s justified and I don’t feel I deserve it after all this time.
Honestly RR it makes me feel disrespected and under appreciated because I have noticed some other stuff that has gone on over the past several months that went unpunished and unnoticed but the first sign of me misbehaving and Hawaii Five-O comes out in full force to make an arrest. It’s just making me think and wonder about what’s going on? Sorry for feeling this way but that’s to be expected considering that there has been no real reason to police this site for a long time.
I take some credit for the relative peace on this site because of the great relations I have with the members of this site and my strong effort to mend some of my past relationships with a few individuals. Something that was never forced on me but something I felt was necessary for the betterment of this blog. So forgive me if I am trying to understand why I needed to be scolded in public like this? Perhaps I am being overly sensitive but then again, when you feel you are being targeted for something due to a misunderstanding, then it’s necessary to stand up for yourself and express your feelings of frustration.
To Dan my buddy, I apologize if my comments were taken in the wrong way. That was never the intention but as we know form some of our past debates, we do occasionally get under each others collar. The good thing is that we both get over it and I for one have never harbored any bitterness or animosity towards Dan, but his view frustrate me quite often as I’, sure mine do with him. So poking some fun at each other is part of whole process.
March 4th, 2009 at 18:57
@Grognard: I didn’t try to knuckle-rap you. I was trying to clarify what I thought might have provoked said reaction from Dan.
And over the past few months I’ve seen several transgressions from everyone including you but I kept quiet because I have a sense of an increased trust in you all to settle your disputes like adults. Even this is not said in bad taste. I was just trying to say what might have caused the disagreement.
I have been mostly appreciative of you, if you recall, so I don’t even count this occasion as me trying to police things here. I have tried to stay away from that aspect as much as possible lately. It takes far too much of my energy to be invested in quarrels as long as it doesn’t spiral out of control. I have placed more trust on you all. So you’ll have to give me credit for not generally choking your creative expression on the blog. I was trying to take part in the debate, and somehow pointed out the reason for the difference in opinion.
Peace out.
March 4th, 2009 at 22:52
@Red Ranter: Fair enough RR but please tell me in the past several months the so called transgressions that I committed? I am kind of shocked by that statement because I think I have been more than peaceful for quite a while now and i have gotten along well with everyone. I remember three months a go a guy who decided to troll onto the site and get under my skin but as far as regular contributors, I can’t recall getting into any scraps. And anytime there has been a disagreement you are right, we have all done a fine job policing each other and keeping things happy and mellow. Anyway, I thank you for your response and explanation. Now hopefully Dan will contact me to let me know if things are OK between us because causing friction was not my intent. Cheers.