Aug 15
United On The Edge Of Greatness
We start this season on the edge of true greatness. Not the fleeting greatness that gets bandied around weekly in the tabloids - proper, timeless greatness. The sort that people who are not born yet will look back on in forty years and rave about.
You can put together “great” teams, you can have “great” players, but what elevates a side into the timeless category is weight of achievement. It’s what makes Ferguson the best British manager ever, and Wenger just a worthy sideshow; it’s what makes Giggs one of the best players of all time, and Gerrard a footnote in comparison. It’s why everyone knows exactly what you mean when you say the Treble, why everyone (however grudgingly) acknowledges that as a seminal footballing achievement; it’s why names like Solskjaer and Sheringham appear alongside Schmeichel and Keane in everyone’s dictionary of footballing legends.
This season we can complete a hat-trick of Premiership titles and retain the European Cup. To do either would put this team into that timeless bracket. To do both would make them the best English club side ever.
The Premiership is harder to win than the top division has ever been. The points tallies required for victory demand relentless excellence over the entire season, starting from game one - the second half of the season push for which we became renowned is not good enough any more. Our main rivals have nearly unlimited money to spend, a squad which regularly sits £25m players on the bench and haven’t lost a match at home for two years. The chasing pack contains two teams who would have been good enough to win the league five years ago, featuring some star players who are coveted by every other club in Europe, including ourselves.
The next tier of clubs are more intimidating than ever before, as a combination of TV money, foreign ownership and the availability of cheap overseas talent allows them to build impressive squads of their own, packed with internationals. Anyone who claims that games against Spurs, Portsmouth, Villa, Everton, Man City or Blackburn will be easy is deluded. Even lower down, we are only too well aware of the surprises teams like Middlesbrough can spring.
We’ve won a hat-trick of titles before, but then we were by far the best team, with more money and more pulling power than anyone else, in leagues with ten teams of comparative deadwood who our reserves could and did beat. Whatever the talk of the “Big Four”, it’s the level of competition that would make this our greatest domestic achievement.
The Champions League has never been retained. Not in its current punishing format, with the leagues followed by a rock-hard knockout phase. The Bayern machine couldn’t do it, the galacticos couldn’t do it, the Treble-winners couldn’t do it. There are so many chances to slip up, so many hurdles to fall at. One bad day can be impossible to recover from. Real and Barca are stronger than last season, and as champions everyone will be gunning for us.
We can do it. We can do both of these things. We can be that team. We have a rock-solid defence, a flexible and resourceful central midfield, the world’s best player, two sensational support strikers, (almost certainly) a hyper-talented new centre forward, a deep and well-rounded squad which is both experienced and hungry, with both old heads and young blood.
But the line is thin. Ronaldo is injured to start with, and surely can’t be as good again. Rooney needs to climb again from his plateau, Berbatov needs to settle quickly to give us enough firepower going forward. Nani may be a season away from turning his talent into end product, and age is catching up with Giggs. Our central midfielders need to discover where the net is, and we have no top class cover for Evra. What if Rio or Vidic gets injured, or van der Saar really can’t last another whole season?
After one of the most boring and frustrating summers on record, we are about to leap headlong into our chance to surpass anything our rivals have ever done in their history. Hold your breath, and hope we smiling next May - if we are, history will smile on us.
[Ed's Note: There has been an assumption in the article that Berbatov's expected to join United. So excuse us if that deal falls through -- heaven forbid.]
Related items from Red Rants:- United* 1-1 Chelsea: First Blood to the Reds
- On Manchester United’s ‘Greatest Ever’ Squad
- United On The Brink Of Greatness, Again
- Today’s Videos: Heinze’s Goal | Beckham Mania
- FA Cup Preview: Man Utd v Arsenal
Tags: Opinions/Columns
August 15th, 2008 at 10:31
hahah penguin i love your optimism and I’d love to believe that we can do the double or even treble this year! but i think your penultimate paragraph says it all!
August 15th, 2008 at 10:35
U do feel we maybe 1 or 2 signings away from having not only a world class side but a side thats feared all round europe jus hope rooney can raise to the world class level brfor ronaldo leaves
August 15th, 2008 at 11:00
Chelsea will be very hungry this year after what happened last season. It is imperative we get get off to a good start, as I believe all the other big three will, if we don’t I think it will be tough for us.
We do need to look elsewhere for a striker this Berbatov situation is getting stupid, we need to teach Spurs a lesson, and by going after Huntelaar, or another, will do that. We can’t be held to ransom as we always tend to, and Spurs will have to deal with a very unhappy player for sometime to come, we need to rise above Levy.
Big seasons are need no more so than from Rooney, he is our talisman and he needs to have his best season ever, if not then Tevez could get an extended run, if we get a striker in. It will be interesting to see how Nani, who looks good pre season and Anderson will get on in their second season, will they kick on or will the get the second season blues, as I hope Torres will!!
But a good start is needed, and then we wll just have to strap ourselves in for another rollacoster ride!
August 15th, 2008 at 11:07
good to have some optimism at the start of the season - everyone’s so negative (apart from those who’ve won nought recently…).
August 15th, 2008 at 12:12
To win the Premier League AND Champions League again will be a mammoth task, but you are right in saying if we do then we will be up there with the very greatest of club sides.
I think another very important aspect which could go against us is the loss of CQ and the fact that SAF has still not brought in a replacement.
August 15th, 2008 at 12:14
Good Optimism!
Lets GO FOR THE TREBLE!
But I dont think that Berba would be signed before the Newcastle game!
And I dont think that he will play against Pompey either!
@Ahmed Bilal:
Do You reside in Pakistan?
August 15th, 2008 at 12:15
@Red Diablo: He needed to sign by lunchtime GMT to play on Sunday matey.
August 15th, 2008 at 12:17
“it’s what makes Ferguson the best British manager ever, and Wenger just a worthy sideshow”…
well redranter shuln u guys wait for another decade or so before u say that??..
August 15th, 2008 at 12:22
@Stephen: Oh yeah! I forgot Sorry!
Still this news about Barca being in for Berba is bollocks!
Spurs are only doing this to Hasten United into paying them the money they want!
That Levy is seriously an all time cunt!
And I think that Berba’s debut will be at the Uefa Super Cup!
Looks like it is upto the Roon and Tevez to score the goals at pompey and newcastle!
Or how about that Man U have signed Berba and even registered him!
But they are still keeping it a secret?
Anything is possible!
As Ronaldo says, GOD ONLY KNOWS!
August 15th, 2008 at 12:39
@Red Diablo: I agree in the immortal words of one cristiano ronaldo God only knows!
Spurs are just playing the game to try an panic us into parting with our well mortgaged money thats all!
August 15th, 2008 at 12:40
I admire your optimism however there seems to be a weakness in our central midfield. For a team of the stature of Manchester United the goal return from our central midfielders is extrememly dissappointing to say the least.
I believe the start of this season will show we did have an over realiance on Ronaldo since he is out for a few games!
Where will our goals come from hey?!
August 15th, 2008 at 12:41
forget the price,just pay whatever they want and we move on.to say we can expect rooney to move into the central role and star is plain stupid.we have to admit that he is at a level where his talent has taken him.my bet on the next star is on tevez.good close control,strong,holds the ball,and a good shooter.
pay the money and we say bye to saha.
August 15th, 2008 at 12:43
Ahmed, I don’t understand your post mate!. Everyone’s so negative, apart from those who have won nought lately. Are you talking about opposing teams, or having a go at United fans concerns?. Just wondering like!.
August 15th, 2008 at 12:49
Penguin, I’m with you. I do believe we are a very good striker short of greatness. Otherwise I think we have the personnel to get the trophies again and make history. We have to find out who is going to be our playmaker though. Is it Scholesy again?. Tevez or the Roon?. Carrick further forward, or Anderson. No doubt Berbatov could do the job if we got him, but IF is a very long word, even though it comprises only 2 letters, if you know what I mean!.
August 15th, 2008 at 12:54
@Craig Mc: I agree matey, a top striker then we a superb balanced squad, I can’t wait for Sunday, now!
August 15th, 2008 at 13:08
Yea guys, it looks like we wont be signing a striker this summer, if you where to read into the squad numbers.
1.Van der Sar, 2.Neville, 3.Evra, 4.Hargreaves, 5.Ferdinand, 6.Brown, 7.Ronaldo, 8.Anderson, 9.Saha, 10.Rooney, 11.Giggs, 12.Foster, 13.Park, 15.Vidic, 16.Carrick, 17.Nani, 18.Scholes, 19.Welbeck, 20.Fabio, 21.Rafael, 22.O’Shea, 23.Evans, 24.Fletcher, 26.Manucho, 27.Silvestre, 28.Gibson, 29.Kuszczak, 31.Campbell, 32.Tevez, 33.Hewson, 34.Possebon, 35.Cleverley, 36.Gray, 37.Cathcart, 38.Zieler, 39.Chester, 40.Amos, 41.Macheda
welbeck, no.19, well done to him looks like he will be used this season, we all know about campbell, but what we didnt know, was manucho, he has been handed 26 which must mean, we got the permit. macheda has also got a squad number. so all together, we have, 7 strikers. i think the berbatov deal looks off in my honest opinion.
on a side note, heres hoping fabio becomes another no.20 star.
August 15th, 2008 at 13:11
@dan(u-ol): Fab20!
August 15th, 2008 at 13:25
@dan(u-ol): Must have taken you some time to write down all the squad numbers and names. Good job, havent seen those. But what numbers have Dong got now? Dont care really, but just wonder weather he is sold or not. Berba can become nr 25! Or if he needs a number 9 shirt, lets give him nr 99!
August 15th, 2008 at 13:34
@Stephen: Actually we have until 5 for him to be able to play on sunday because he needs clearance from the Bulgarian FA which means we could have another 5 hours.
August 15th, 2008 at 13:35
HAHAHA craig, copied and pasted mate, look on the united website, 25 is simmos shirt, even though he is on loan. and right now, dong doesnt have shirt lol, i think saf forgot about him.
little known fact, the premier league is against high numbers like that, we would never be allowed to hand out a no.99 shirt.
August 15th, 2008 at 13:40
I think if we do sign a striker he’s gonna be number 14.
Le Va Va Vooom Henry!
August 15th, 2008 at 13:40
I take it he, if and a big if we sign him would get 14.
August 15th, 2008 at 13:44
ahh sorry there, its RD, dunno why i thought it was craig, welcome back mate!
August 15th, 2008 at 13:47
Dan(u)ol lol. It was Red Devil not me that congratulated you about posting the squad shirt numbers. I think you might find that Dong doesn’t have a shirt number to be registered, because obviously he must’nt be part of this seasons 1st team squad. Maybe there’s a limit on the number of players that can be registered for the 1st team.
August 15th, 2008 at 13:49
@OllieY: Cheers for clearing that up I read that I think in the Telegraph!
Does anyone know or have seen anything of Macheda, I know we got him from Lazio, but is he any good?
August 15th, 2008 at 13:54
yeah, as stated above 14 is free. Also, does anyone think welbeck’s number is a little low? surely he is behind Campbell in the pecking order? Maybe he’s just looking after the shirt till Berba gets here, and then he’ll go to 42 or something, which sounds more like the number he should be wearing!
August 15th, 2008 at 13:55
I take it you can’t change squad numbers once they have been submitted?
August 15th, 2008 at 13:57
14, 25 and 30 are all vacant…
August 15th, 2008 at 14:01
14 fair enough, 25 is simmos number 30 is not a berbatov number, nor a starting strikers number(bar tevez).
August 15th, 2008 at 14:26
i dont want to get peoples hopes up, but their are rumours flying around saying berbatov is in manchester… i guess he’s signing for city.
August 15th, 2008 at 14:41
This team is already great. Winning your domestic league title AND European Cup is virtually unheard of in the modern era and we managed to do that. If we retain the European Cup we will quite simply be the best club team ever.
Here’s Martin Samuel’s take on it, after Rio suggested we’d only be great if we retained the European Cup:
Retaining the European Cup would make United more than just great, Rio
Sometimes footballers are so busy playing that the details pass them by. Take Rio Ferdinand. Outstanding defender, probably the long-term captaincy choice for England and Manchester United, but not so hot on football history.
Ferdinand said that if this Manchester United team are to be regarded as great they must retain the European Cup. A tall order, that. Ferdinand, understandably, is too busy starring in record books to read them.
Keeping club football’s greatest prize in its modern incarnation would not mark United as great, but as the greatest. No team have managed it since the Champions League format was introduced in 1993 and the last team to win the competition in consecutive seasons was AC Milan in 1989 and 1990. Real Madrid won three Champions League titles in five seasons between 1998 and 2002, but none was retained, while Milan, Ajax and Juventus returned to the final a year after winning the trophy, without success.
The previous four defending champions (Milan, Barcelona, Liverpool and FC Porto), far from conquering all, were each knocked out in the last 16. There is nothing wrong in Ferdinand reaching for the stars, but unifying the European and domestic titles in one season already puts United among the greats; to do so again would afford them a unique place in sport’s firmament.
August 15th, 2008 at 14:51
Stephen, Macheda is a great player. He is not gangly, and doesn’t fall over the ball as much as Welbeck who is gangly and not having proper balance when bearing down on goal. Well IMO anyway, others may beg to differ. If I had to choose between the two, I would go for Macheda, because he is a good and consistent goal scorer for the reserves.
August 15th, 2008 at 15:04
@donibrasco: Even if rooney doesn’t improve at all in the future he will still be a regular starter for united, because he is good enough right now to warrant that place, and he will still be a better player than tevez. Keep in mind tevez is my favourite player and i fully expect him to have a fantastic season, given he has had a summer’s rest. He has been off form for two years now, the lack of a break took its toll, and yet he did his part last year and he kept west ham up. He is a great player, but rooney will always have more about him.
August 15th, 2008 at 15:11
1 hour 50 minutes and counting … I hope.
August 15th, 2008 at 15:38
i think we all have a right to be optamistic we have a great side i agree with penguin brilliant post by the way. In terms of goals yes we maybe over reliant with ronaldo however as stats have shown we have the best goals scored and conceded records in the premiership with this we have the 2 most productive players in the league with Berba being on the way also being a heavily productive player i beleive we will have a groundbreaking season be ready we are on the verge of greatness CMON UNITED
August 15th, 2008 at 15:40
@tevez: but the thing is mate, he is not good enough to warrant a starting place, do you really think, that is rooney was on form, all this talk about strikers coming in would happen, no, the whole reason we are buying a stiker is because rooney is off form. i said this before and got negative feed back and i will say it again, THE ONLY REASON ROONEY STARTS FOR US IS A) WE LACKED STRIKERS LAST SEASON AND B)HE’S ENGLISH, if rooney where from anywhere else, he would be on the bench this season(assuming we get berbatov) but no, because of his PAST brilliance and his nationality he starts. Tevez right now(and much of last season) is better then rooney, more on-form, and thats why i want tevez and not rooney for the newcastle game(assuming we get berbatov).
August 15th, 2008 at 15:44
Penguin- That is a very optimistic outlook. Let’s dissect the League first. Chelsea are the clear threat to our title defence. What with the additions they have made. Bosingwa,Deco and possibly Robinho. Its clear they have an eye 4 the jugular this season. Scolari is a top top coach. Very inventive. Dont be fooled into thinking Chelsea will not be creative this term. Being a Barca fan I shrieked when Deco chose London. The man is a creative genius and im tipping him 2 make the squad fast. Great and capable defence. Carvalho is the business. Joe Cole will be unleashed from the Mourinho shackles of pragmatic football. Scolari loves to play with adventurous wingers. Arsenal will miss Flamini big time. But i think offensively they will the most menacing team. Eduardo is due to return,Adebayor will do his job,Walcott looks ready to shine,Sagna impressed last term,Nasri from what ive seen in the French League will be a great addition to their mid. Their main problem is they are very thin ito numbers. And they possess too many key unhealthy players. Rosicky,van Persie and an exhausted Fabregas. Liverpool? Torres and Keane will be their only season highlight provided Rafa refrains from his illogical rotation programme.
August 15th, 2008 at 15:49
@dan(u-ol): Rooney IS good enough to warrant a starting place now. I don’t see rooney as being off-form last season but if he was then he still played to a very high standard even though it wasn’t his best. In all honesty, if that was an off-form rooney then he can be off-form for the rest of his career and he will still be a great player and he will still get a game week-in, week-out. Also, no matter how good rooney had been last season, we would still be talking about bringing in a striker because we only have two.
August 15th, 2008 at 15:49
“Real Madrid won three Champions League titles in five seasons between 1998 and 2002″
A quote from the Samuelson article. This is the measure of greatness we need to match. Our most recent history in Europe is group stages, semis, winners. Not good enough. Our current team is fairly stable barring the inevitable departure of Ronaldo. To build on the Champions League title we need to win a few more over the next five years. Retaining our title would be an excellent start.
Hell Liverpool have a better European record than us in recent years with winners, finalists, semifinalists.
Berbatov is built for the Premiership, Im not so sure about Europe. I think Tevez could be our secret weapon in Europe next season and Hargreaves could be very useful as well. Our tactics are getting better and our defensive stability is a major plus when fixtures are decided by a single goal.
August 15th, 2008 at 15:55
@tevez:
Wayne rooney
carlos tevez
louis saha
fraizer campbell
manucho
danny welbeck
macheda
ronaldo
giggs
febian brandy.
we only have 2 RECOGNISED strikers, when in fact we have 10, 9 as brandy is away loan.
August 15th, 2008 at 15:55
Newcastle, prepared to be blown away! no owen, no viduka… they got no chance.
August 15th, 2008 at 15:56
@Eric the Red: what’s meant to happen and where did you get your timing from?
August 15th, 2008 at 15:56
@dan(u-ol): Yes you have your opinion on Rooney and ofcourse he isn’t playing to his top potential but I think your being a bit harsh on him. He is still one of our best players, his work ethic is unquestionable, his pace and strength is better than most think and his vision is second to none. Yes he might not be banging in the goals left right and centre but he is still young and will improve. He hasn’t been playing in the right position and SAF has said that this year he will try to get the best out of him by putting him in his best position. So if this year he is a total flop then, and only then, will I believe in what your saying.
August 15th, 2008 at 15:58
@benjd: We have until 5 today to hand over all the papers of Berba being our player to the FA for him to be legible to play on Sunday.
August 15th, 2008 at 16:07
@OllieY: Ah right. Cheers. Doesn’t look good then
August 15th, 2008 at 16:13
@benjd: You never know, we could have already sent them off, we don’t have to unveil him just have all the official paper work done. I live in hope
August 15th, 2008 at 16:14
I have he is having a medical!!
August 15th, 2008 at 16:16
unless spurs are lying, berbatov was no where near manchesteer this afternoon.
http://www.tottenhamhotspur.com/news/articles/juandewereready150808.html
August 15th, 2008 at 16:22
Our team- Well i think consistency will reign ultimately. But i dont think we can get to May with only 4 defeats this time. This season the rest of the teams outside the Top Four will be extremely tough to overcome. Our defence is quite simply the best in Europe. Our midfield needs to join the party ito goals. Carrick will not score that many because of his deep playmaking role. Hargreaves will score more if Judas07 shares deadball duties and i think now in his absence is his chance. Nani looks really good and should increase his goal tally. Anderson needs to be played with a grafter like Hargreaves to allow him offensive freedom. Strikers. Clearly Tevez will be the main man this time. He really looks possessed. I think a hyper active midfield will help him with that. Andy and Hargo,will make it illogical 4 him to constantly track back and he could focus his attacking skills up front more constantly. Same goes 4 Rooney. And Rooney shines when the burden is loaded on him. When u allow him 2 drive the team forward. Both him and Hargreaves would do well to stamp their authority in Ronaldo’s absence. Much also depends on the participation of Manucho,Saha and Frazier to give us another dimension. And possibly the signing of another striker to ease the load off Ronaldo. Overall,I think if our main players step up their game then we will retain our League title
August 15th, 2008 at 16:24
35 minutes….
August 15th, 2008 at 16:27
@Jay wire: I agree mate bar Ronaldo our midfield only scored 13 goals last season, which I think was a blip. I see Anderson getting his 1st under his belt then scoring @ will, Hargo could be the Robson type to break into the box.
Nani looks like he could get a goal and Giggsy will chip in, and Carrick and Scholes sit more, so not so many from them.
We need more goals from Rooney, with Carlito it will depend if he is deployed as a super sub or a starter, if Ronaldo, Berba, Rooney start.
August 15th, 2008 at 16:32
We wont have Berba in time to play this weekend… Fergie said that we are down to our bare bones in attack and hopfully we’ll have enough to get us past the first hurdle, Newcastle.
August 15th, 2008 at 16:46
@dan(u-ol): Manucho, campbell, welbeck etc. don’t count, unless manucho is good enough to be in the first-team squad but i’ll need to see some evidence of that. He may not get a work permit anyway. I would say if saha stayed fit then we wouldn’t be talking about a new striker but he doesn’t so we are. Ronaldo and giggs aren’t strikers. Tevez and rooney are the only first-team strikers we have.
@OllieY: Fergie hasn’t said he played rooney in the wrong position or that he will be played in a different position this year.
August 15th, 2008 at 16:48
@Stephen: Hargo is nothing like robson. Nae chance of that lol
August 15th, 2008 at 16:55
bloody hell you amaze, how can you they dont count? they are strikers in the first team squad? of course they count, say they are not proven, say they are not good enough but dont say they dont count, thats such a silly thing to say. and the chances are manucho does have a permit since he was given a squad number today. honestly what as silly thing to say, they dont count. and FYI, saf doesnt feel giggs can play on the wing anymore hence why all preseason we have seen him play upfront and not on the wing, and ronaldo play(ed/s) as striker more often then not, a lot of his goals where scored when he was playing as our no.9.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:00
well its 5:00, berbatov can still sign today, but he wont be playing at the toon.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:00
@tevez: Well he tackles and likes to get forward, and players for united!! Only an analogy really, but he could score goals from midfield, and in my view he is a good player.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:01
@dan(u-ol): To be honest if he signed even earlier today he probably would not played anyway.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:07
On the whole Berba thing, if theres nothing announced before 5pm it doesn’t mean we haven’t signed him in time. I’m not holding my breath but as others have said its only the paper work that needs submitted by 5pm. We don’t have to officially announce it by then, as we see on transfer deadline days it can be the next day before some of them get announced, even some of the ones which were tied up fairly early
@dan(u-ol):
I don’t think Manucho getting a squad number means he has a work permit. I think if he had been given one it would be on the official site atleast. I just think it means that they are confident that the resubmission will be successful.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:10
@wakey: it IS on the official site, thats where i copied and pasted it from, and the numbers and players are registered to the premier league, i dont think we are allowed to register him with out the permit.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:11
I do agree that Rooney needs 2 improve his goal tally and be a little more consistent in front of goal. And i also think Tevez is proving a better player. But lets look @ his Utd career so far. Im not a big stats man but his debut season was nothing short of phenomenal with around 16 goals total. He played well so consistently,mesmerising all defenders that dared 2 oppose his attacking fluency. Why? He was constantly played in his favoure position. Also he was given the responsibility to drive the team. Next season,Ruud returned and they played a telepathic form of football in front of goal. His season tally slightly improved. Young player of the year 4 two successive seasons. During this season,Saf began to toy with him. Playing him as a left winger at times because Rooney would “play at right back if u asked him to”. Ruud left and Saha came into the picture. Completely different partnership from the mainly static RVN. Saf increased his toying frequency. Still he put 23 behind goalies. By this time CR7 had made himself a serious goal partaker. Load lessened on R10 and he was playing everywhere upfront. Last season he was injured 4 a considerable amount of time. 1 nils became the norm. He returned towards the end of 2007 to begin a non-stop goal scoring streak and superb partnership with Tevez. Then Ronaldo became increasingly adventurous and took up CF positions constantly. Probably why he didnt get along with Ruud. That left gaps in mid and crowded out Roovez from the box. Obviously goals and confidence hit a low. Coupled with stupid positioning by Saf. He should take the most blame 4 messing with Rooney’s consistency. I bet u if Rooney is played in his position this time around, he will explode. The case for WR10,by Jay Wire
August 15th, 2008 at 17:12
I don’t see why were talking about Berbatov like it’s a given he’s coming, especially w/ the way Spurs are playing it. I wouldn’t be surprised at all if we don’t get him.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:13
Nice writeup Penguin. Very optimistic indeed but also very realistic. With Berbatov we can do all this. Without him, I seriously doubt it. We need him to be the final puzzle in building a truly awesome footballing outfit that will be the envy of the world and will be regarded in history with the Bayern clubs of the 70’s, The Ajax clubs of the early 70’s, the Real Madrid side with Di Stefano and Puskas and the Liverpool side with Kuyt and Hyppia. OK, I was joking about the last one.
The team needs Berbatov because of our obvious thin front line. With him, we have the depth but also an additional dose of quality and panache that only Cantona offered us previously. If we can avoid major injuries with this lineup, we not only should win the EPL, we should take it in a walk. The CL is a tough nut to crack but lets face it, it has never been more easier to win. None of the European leagues can offer the depth in quality and class anymore. Italy is going through a period of Hell and their form and quality from all their top sides in Europe has been appalling. Spain is overrated too. Nobody is going to convince me that Barcelona or Real are that much better off now than they were a year ago.
Our only real test comes from Chelsea and Bayern Munich. Two teams that are stacked with talent and who know how to win. Bayern will scare a lot of people. Strong back four, very competent midfield and a forward line that is awesome. They have grit and style and they have Franck Ribery who may not be Ronaldo, but is also an incredible talent. Three forwards like Toni, Klose and Podolski should be able to put up a fight with anyone. Don’t look at there upset loss to Zenit and think they will be an easy team to crack. They took Zenit lightly and that was a big mistake as that Russian side would have given United a run in the CL final if they were in it. They were outstanding. But they will lose Arshavin and that will do them in. Bayern also have a much more energetic and upbeat outlook and style of play now that Klinsmann is in charge. I think he will up the pace with them and they will respond with dazzling football once Ribery and Toni return from injuries. Their one Achilles heel is in goal. I’m not won on Rensing and I so wished that Kahn would have played one more season. They are my second favorite team and so many can accuse me of bias here, but I also think the proof is in the pudding and all one needs to do is see their lineup. They do look very good. As for Chelsea, they are Chelsea. They win despite playing a terrible brand of football and they win despite being total cunts and poor sportsmen. Money can it seems by you a lot but it won’t buy them the EPL or the CL. Not his year at least. For me they look older, not better. If they were to sign Robinho and Kaka, maybe my estimation of them might change, but for right now, they are quality shit.
United can win it all because they have so much depth. I actually think it is easier for them to win the CL than it is for them to win the FA Cup or League Cup. The reasoning is simple. They will play many subs and reserves in those games while the opposition put there best 11 against us.
Our success in the EPL is based on getting Berbatov signed quickly and Ronaldo returning quickly. And today there were news items that showed optimism on both fronts.
From the BBC;
“Manchester United hope to unveil striker Dimitar Berbatov before Sunday’s Premier League opener against Newcastle after agreeing a deal in principle with Tottenham. (Daily Star)
They also claim that Berbatov is having a medical done today with united.
Add to this the fact that Zenit has dropped their asking price for Arshavin and what we have here are events that show a clear case of Berbatov being readied to be shown off by Fergie as our newest acquisition.
And the Barcelona rumors are just garbage. Why would Barcelona need a Berbatov when they have Etoo, Messi, Bojan and Henry? And don’t they still have Gudjohnson too? Also, Berbatov has to agree to a deal to go to Barcelona. From what I have read, he is determined to go to United.
So, perhaps that soap opera will finally end to our liking and we can get on with defending what is rightfully ours…..and then some. My biggest goal for the season? Obviously repeating the double but nothing and I mean nothing would be sweeter than finally walking into Stamford Bridge and taking it to the Blue Man Group. I want us to finally break that streak of theirs and I want us to laugh all the way to the dressing room.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:16
@dan(u-ol): Giggs and Ronaldo are not strikers mate and Saha is just a walking hospital bed. And I wouldn’t be so bold as to place reserves up there with Rooney and Tevez, even though I know you value them a Hell of a lot more than any of us do. But yes, they are strikers too…….I guess, in the liberal sense of the word.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:18
@colver: He may be built for the Premiership but trust me, he will be used more in Europe because that is his entire motivation for wanting a move away from Spurs. If Fergie truly wants him at his best and happy, he will be compelled to play him in the CL. Look for Tevez to take the back seat in Europe and more of a starting role in the EPL.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:20
@Grognard: I believe you took the BBC thing from their gossip column. That column has as much credibility of newsnow and it gives them licence to post excerpts from the media at large. That said I think Berba will move but won’t make it for Newcastle. Even if he does, we can’t expect him to bed in straightaway. I don’t know why people haven’t considered that. But give him a week and he’ll be golden come Portsmouth.
But it looks likely that Spurs will capture Arshavin which would definitely make them sell off Berbatov.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:21
@dan(u-ol): Fine, they are young, not really good enough and unproven, therefore they don’t count. It’s not stupid at all. I’m not counting our reserve and youth players. If anything it’s stupid and unrealistic if you expect them to play a big part in the season. It makes sense that giggs plays as a second striker but i saw him play out wide a lot more than i saw him play up front last year. Ronaldo played and scored a lot more goals when in his free role last year. He did not play up front often, he is more effective from deep and i would bank on ronaldo scoring more from this position rather than as a striker.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:22
@dan(u-ol): Rooney is the talisman of our club along with Ronaldo. We are shite without him. He offers so much more than goals and he is Fergie’s favorite by far. Fergie always plays him and that will not change. And if he plays him where he is supposed to play him for a change, then he will be even better. You seem to be mistaken if you think Fergie agrees with you mate. He doesn’t, and sorry but neither do I. I like Tevez a lot but I’d rather see him sit than Rooney.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:24
@Red Ranter: I do realize that it is just gossip but I have monitored the BBC for a while now and they tend to avoid the really blatantly bad rumors for the seemingly more reasonable and plausible ones.
I still think there is 50/50 chance we don’t get him at all because of Levy. We’ll have to wait and see.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:25
Tevez-I will say this again. Manucho is a very good player. I watched him in 2 major competitions ie ACN(scored more than Drogba and i think Eto’o) and the WC. He was very impressive. He is one of the reasons im not concerned with the striker debate. Adapting to the Epl,should not take him long. Why? He is stronger than either Saha or Rooney. Very mobile. Very useful with his head. He is a good playmaker ie creates opportunities and is relatively quick for centre forward duties. Imo this whole “he hasnt been proved” talk is outta line with reality.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:25
@Red Ranter: I thought he was more of a replacement for Keane than Berbatov, but if you are saying they need the money then I 100% agree!!
August 15th, 2008 at 17:26
@Jay wire: I sort of agree with Tevez if Manucho is so good why is he 25 and know one has signed him until now?
August 15th, 2008 at 17:34
@Jay wire: Ronaldo never took up CF positions last year at all.
@Grognard: The spanish league is better than the english one. Barcelona completely outplayed us last year and messi was the best player on the pitch by a mile. They showed that they are a better team than united.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:36
@tevez: He played up front against Barca away.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:39
Grognard- Utd taking the Epl title doesnt hinge on the acquisition of Berbatov,Huntelaar or any other striker. I know im going against the grain but i can see more midfield goals coming. Nani looks good on that front,so does the returning sooner than envisaged Ronaldo. Tevez is at one with our system now and Rooney will hopefully find more joy in positioning. Manucho is a player i rate highly and when he gets legal he will play an important role. Epl title depends on our midfield being more offensive and courageous in front of goal
August 15th, 2008 at 17:40
@Jay wire: I saw manucho at the ANC too and he looked good, but i don’t think he was even at the WC. I also know that he went to greece and certainly did not set the world alight, so his ability is definitely in question.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:43
@Stephen: That’s one game mate. I didn’t say he has never played up front.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:47
Tevez-Ronaldo played as CF against Bolton at home. And when i say he took up CF positions, i mean when he runs in with the ball from the wing into the box and shoots. A traditional winger would normally try 2 find the Cfwds. Plus how many penalties has he won? U dont win penalties outside the box but inside. And that is CF territory.
August 15th, 2008 at 17:49
@dan(u-ol):
I meant the news of him getting his work permit. On the 3rd United hadnt submitted an application for a work permit for him and work permit applications are exactly renowned for being dealt with quickly. And as I don’t believe he actually fulfils the requirements for automatic qualification it will have to be done on appeal (In the same way as Anderson) anyway which will take it longer.
Now I’m not sure how the registration rules work but I would guess that you can maybe pre register players based on them getting a work permit or that Work permits aren’t part of the premier league registration requirements
August 15th, 2008 at 17:58
@Grognard:
One the whole they do just report actual news. The Gossip section though is clearly marked as Gossip and quotes the sources of the gossip. Its certainly not meant as a serious piece of news reporting but just a section of the site that brings together the basics of what other media are reporting
August 15th, 2008 at 18:00
@Jay wire: That’s one game. He played up front a few times but not very often when you consider how many games he played over the whole season. If he is picking up the ball in a wide position then that is hardly CF position. I don’t see why him cutting inside and shooting means he is taking up a CF position. He scores a lot of goals making well-timed runs into the box and at the back post. This is a wide man’s position, not a centre-forwards. A good wide man will score shitloads at the back post as this is the ‘Position of Most Opportunity’. Ronaldo is a good wide man. He busts a gut to get in the box and it pays off. The box is not exclusively for strikers lol.
August 15th, 2008 at 18:05
Tevez- U are actually right about him not being at the WC. I had him mixed up with Flavio. He wasnt signed earlier by anyone because he only broke into his club side when Flavio left since he was keeping him out. Think Casillas when Cesar was Real and Spain’s number 1. It took a Cesar injury in the CL 4 the world 2 know Casillas. He went to Greece in after the ACN and had little time to break into a new team and score more than once. If Manucho didnt impress u during the ACN then noone there did. Everyone across the media was raving about him. He stole the show. Played better than the Eto’os and Drogbas according 2 most. I think he is capable to handle the Epl and he knows where the back of the net is
August 15th, 2008 at 18:06
@wakey: I too am not holding my breath and don’t really think it’s a done deal yet. However, after the whole Ramsey fiasco and can see Utd not officially announcing anything until all of the ‘i’s have been dotted and the ‘t’s crossed.
@Grognard: Not criticizing, but just curious mate: why do you spell like an American?
Given some of the things you’ve said before this surprises me.
August 15th, 2008 at 18:13
from BBC Gossip column:
Tottenham striker Dimitar Berbatov is currently in Manchester to undergo a medical before joining Manchester United in deal worth £28 million. (Daily Mail 1525 BST)
August 15th, 2008 at 18:17
Also from Daily Mail:
Some good news finally emerging in the media… welcome booost just before the season starts…
August 15th, 2008 at 18:17
@Jay wire: He did impress me at the ANC, the problem is that if he is good enough to be a useful first-team striker (where the back-up needs to be of higher quality than in other positions because they are rotated more often) then he would have made an impression in greece. Also, i’m not going to base how good he is on just the ANC as there’s no guarantee that is a true measure of his talent. For example, as you said he was better than drogba and eto’o, but lets face it, he is not better than these players.
August 15th, 2008 at 18:17
Tevez- I never said its exclusively CF territory. He cuts in in the same way as Henry. In order to shoot and hopefully score. How many times have u seen Ronaldo in the box? Plenty if u watch Utd’s games. If he gets into the box so constantly,how do u expect the likes of Roovez to be there against the run of play without seriously leaving gaps in midfield. Besides the penalties he has won ,how many times have we seen him appealing 4 penalties when fouled in the box. Thats why Roovez is forced to play him in sometimes because his pace and selfishness give him licence to get into spaces they would otherwise had been. Thats what i mean
August 15th, 2008 at 18:22
@tevez:
From Wiki about Manucho regarding his time in Greece:
Manucho scored on his league debut for Panathinaikos in a 2–0 home win over Larissa.[10] Panathanaikos finished the Super League Greece 2007-08 season in 3rd place, qualifying the team for a play-off for the remaining European places. Manucho scored three goals in this six-game mini tournament, helping Panathinaikos to top the play-off group and qualify for the second qualifying round of the 2008–09 UEFA Champions League.
Doesnt seem so bad does it?
August 15th, 2008 at 18:31
@Jay wire: The more players in the box the better. Midfielders should be encouraged to break into the box. All you need is one central midfielder to be disciplined enough to hold their position. The other players should have the freedom to get in the box and the energy to get up and down the pitch. Ronaldo is constantly in the box, but he doesn’t stand around in it. He times his runs and arrives late. He is always looking to gamble and take chances. This is good midfield play. It is not selfish at all, and it doesn’t hamper a striker one bit.
August 15th, 2008 at 18:33
@jos: Doesn’t seem brilliant.
August 15th, 2008 at 18:44
@tevez: well fergie seems to think they are good enough to challenge for a first team spot and who said anything about a big part? we are arguing about the number of strikers we have, not their effectiveness, your changing the subject. fergie has already come out and said campbell will be staying with us this season, challenging for a first team spot, whether or not they get it, is up to them and fergie. Buy you can not just dismiss them as if they dont exist. By the way, you sound like you watch them often, what do you think is so bad about them? as you say they are not good enough yet fergie sees something in them, what is so bad about?
August 15th, 2008 at 19:34
@dan(u-ol): I think their level of contribution is valid. Ideally, we would have four strikers who are all good enough to play a big part in the season, because striker is the position where there is the most rotation. The standard of the back-up/supersub/spot-starter needs to be at a high level, which i don’t think campbell or welbeck are at. In a years time i see one of them being a useful member of the squad, but not this season. Mind you, if a striker comes in and manucho proves useful it becomes even harder for them and sooner rather than later they will move on. In truth, i don’t think either of them have the ability to be a regular starter. If things go well for them (ie. if, when they are ready, a space in the squad is available) then they could establish themselves as a good squad player like brown, o’shea and fletcher, but i don’t even see that happening. The young players who impress me are possebon and macheda, and the twins look good. I have a soft spot for a good attacking full back so i’m very eager to see more of them. Apart from that, i can’t see any other reserve/youth player at the moment making the grade. Macheda, for me, has more potential than campbell or welbeck but it still doesn’t mean i want to see him get a chance in the first team this year.
August 15th, 2008 at 19:54
For god’s sake. Opened up the Guardians football home page: big picture of Fergie there. Heart stopped for a second, hope went sky high…but it’s just nothing more than a picture to preface some stupid non related article.