Sep 03
Possebon Loan ‘Cancelled’; Returns to United?
If reports in the Portuguese media are to be believed Rodrigo Possebon, who was loaned out to SC Braga, has returned to Manchester. Google translate is not the best, but according to this link, he’s been axed because of a squad trimming exercise by the coach.
I also saw it mentioned on the United Youth site in its roundup of our loanees. It’s a bit surprising it hasn’t been mentioned in the main United website.
Anyone who has any updates on this, do share in the comments.
Related items from Red Rants:
- Should Dong Go on Loan?
- What Will Sir Alex Do With Rodrigo Possebon?
- The United footballers who stood up to the FA
- On the Kaizer Chiefs Friendly + Rodrigo Possebon
- Nani’s Medical | Rossi’s Loan | Anderson’s Permit
Tags: News Snippets
September 3rd, 2009 at 9:41
I read it on the Youth site too. He is not in any of the squads for nor, maybe go out on loan here? The way we are going we could use him too!
September 3rd, 2009 at 10:09
I think Dan called this one in saying he simply isn’t good enough, looks like he was spot on.
September 3rd, 2009 at 10:26
@Stephen: I suppose, the patience you expect from those writing off Foster is called for here, eh?
September 3rd, 2009 at 10:43
He hasnt been the same since that horror tackle from Pogatetz!!!Looked brilliant before that!!
September 3rd, 2009 at 10:43
@Red Ranter: There is somewhat of a difference in saying he sounds like he is not good enough and constantly picking holes and calling the player names regardless of what he does, also I am not one for getting on players backs.
September 3rd, 2009 at 10:49
@Stephen: I know my youth prospects
Its a shame really, but if im honest, hes a poor mans carrick, with good shot on him.
If he was english, he wouldnt have been hyped up as much as he was.
September 3rd, 2009 at 10:52
And thanks btw.
September 3rd, 2009 at 11:02
Check out the Sun! Fergie comments on our three young signings Ljajic, Obertan and Mame Diouf. You can tell he expects big things from them especially Obertan! Apparentely Obertan has been carrying a back injury the last eighteen months which might explain his dip in form. Granted all those players are a year or two away from breaking into the first team but it makes the future a bit more exciting.
September 3rd, 2009 at 12:09
@Dan: He may be a poor man’s Carrick (he does has better technique on the ball), but he’s still way better than present-day Carrick!
AND he’s much more a complete player than a certain Darron Gibson, he who defines the term “one trick pony”
September 3rd, 2009 at 12:22
@NicoQB: No, no and no.
Possebon isnt good enough to lace carricks boots, and im talking about the carrick of today. Hes amazingly average.
Hes not a complete player in the slightest either, he cant defend for shit, hes a side ways passer, and has a decent shot on him, gibson is a much better attacker, defender, and has the best shot at the club let alone possebon. Gibson is far more a complete player then possebon.
September 3rd, 2009 at 12:33
@Dan: Just take your comment and reverse Possebon for Gibson, and you get the actual truth!
Ok, fair enough for Gibbo’s shot, but
Stat: Gibson – Possebon
Shooting 10 – 8
Playmaking 5 – 7
Presence 5 – 6 (they both should take stock from Fletch)
Defensive Mid 6 – 6
So that’s basically my opinion of both players. Room for improvement for both, but Possebon actualy looks the better Central Midfielder.
But I do agree that Possebon did not regain the form of before his injury, but then again, he did not have much game time.
September 3rd, 2009 at 12:43
@Dan: I’ll gladly hold up my hands and admit defeat when I see those famed “other parts of Gibson’s game” that you’ve been talking about.
But until now, and I think I’m not alone in my view, I think that Gibson is the one who is amazingly average except for his golden shot.
September 3rd, 2009 at 12:47
@NicoQB: Mate, you way off the mark.
Stat: Gibson – Possebon
Shooting 10 – 7
Playmaking 6 – 4
Presence 7 – 3
Defensive Mid 6 – 4
Honestly, Possebon is a poor mans carrick, he cant defend, he doenst pass forward, theres so many things wrong with him.
If his name was poilet, and was english, he would not be rated as highly.
September 3rd, 2009 at 12:49
@NicoQB: And you think possebons better?
Possebons loan move has been cancelled for a reason, hes not good enough. End of…
September 3rd, 2009 at 12:50
Apparently, according to SAF, Gabby is going to be a star for us… I sure hope so.
September 3rd, 2009 at 12:58
On manutd.com:
“Do the players read what you write about them on ManUtd.com, United Review and Inside United and have any of them ever been unhappy with something you’ve written?”
Good question. The players read the programme on matchdays and copies of the magazine get sent to the training ground. Darren Fletcher asked me once how my fitness work was going after we’d done a feature in there with United’s fitness coaches. So they do read what we write…”
So they read that biased, partisan and soft-soft stuff on the official media outlets? Maybe a few of them do read more daring and challenging opinions on the web. Why not?
September 3rd, 2009 at 13:38
Errrrr and why is Possebon worth a whole thread RedRanter
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 13:44
To quote Skysports:
On the Possebon issue, I believe he has no future with us! Gibson is deginitely better and ahead of him in the Q.
September 3rd, 2009 at 13:47
Gosh, Chelsea have just been banned by Fifa from signing anymore players until Jan 2011.
September 3rd, 2009 at 13:51
@Cyclops-Red: I was just about to post this! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. And since all their players are 32, they are FUCKED.
September 3rd, 2009 at 13:55
Ouch
I dunno if i should be happy about that or not, to say its harsh is an understatement.
September 3rd, 2009 at 13:55
@Dan: Loan players are always the odd wheel in a chariot – to quote a well known french expression.
They are always deemed surplus, as would attest Rossi and Campbell, and often clubs having a certain stature will be reluctant to give them game time at the expense of more established players.
That’s why loans should only be made with “small” clubs.
I would reserve judgement as to what happened to him during his loan spell for now.
Also, I find it disappointing how many here seem to have short and selective memories. When Possebon got game time, he performed wll and showed promise. Now we’ve not heard of him for a while and he’s suddenly turned crap. Reminds me of the stories of many other United players who are deemed as crap when they have not got the chance to show their worth – Nani, Foster…
September 3rd, 2009 at 13:58
The kid is still only 20 so lets give him time, plus he has one of the best chants at the club, I wouldn’t want him to go simply on that reason
September 3rd, 2009 at 13:58
@Cyclops-Red: @Traverse: WTF???
September 3rd, 2009 at 13:59
Gibson in my opinion is better than Possebon and you will see very soon he will be in Fergie’s plans more and more.. and soon to be ahead of Carrick (which isn’t dificult, given his form of late).. Fletcher is the main man in midfield now.. Anderson needs to do more but obviously has the talent to be one of the best in the world.. And Hargreaves will be back soon and in my opinon our best midfielder by a mile!! Hope he stays fit though because he could help us win honours this season and also grab a few goals from free kicks!
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:00
@NicoQB: Lil Man was NEVER considered CRAP – so no nonsense eh Mr Nico
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:01
@NicoQB: Mate you are the aficionado on all things French, is this Eden Hazard worth all the hype from what I have seem he looks superb?
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:03
@NicoQB: Braga are a small club!
The difference mate, spurs and newcastle are bigger then braga, but they never cancelled their respective loan deals, braga did.
Possebon has been average from more or less day one. Maybe he just never settled in england, or maybe the scouts just got it wrong.
Id go with the later.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:04
@NicoQB: Chelsea have been convicted of tapping up this kid Kakuta, a really good young French striker, and getting him to break his contract in France. Kakuta himself is banned for 4 months, and fined £140,000 and Chelsea are BANNED from registering players for the next 2 transfer windows and fined £700,000. I’m kinda liking this new hardline FIFA. First Eduardo, now this!
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:05
If Chelsea are banned from signing players, and such a RIDICULOUS amount of time of the Ban, then I wonder once again if this is a FIFA against the English premiership again.
. WTF can R Madrid get away with it, and what will happen now with the Everton and other clubs where Man City breaking of rules is concerned. Nearly every new City player apart from CARLA, have been induced to BREAK AN ESTABLISHED CONTRACT!
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:07
@Craig Mc: Spot on, nobody hates Chelsea more than me but is that worse than what the facists did with regards to Ronaldo, or City with Lescott?
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:09
Thankfully we do all transfers in the proper way, never contact the player or agent…….
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:10
@Stephen: Everton have made a complaint, and I can only imagine if it is proven Citeh will get the same treatment.
Chelsea will probably appeal under the European ‘restraint of trade’ laws.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:12
They will appeal and FIFA will reduce the fine and the imbargo, to £5k and they can’t sign anyone until er Jan, that is what usually happens.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:13
@Traverse: That would make my day!!
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:16
Lets all laugh at CSKA London..!
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:18
@Craig Mc: Revisionism from the craigneister?
Sure, we two never considered him crap, but do I need to remind you of the repeated jousting we had to endure (not that we didn’t enjoy it) for the sake of Nani?
The waters are calm for now, but I’m pretty sure that after 3 subdues games the Nani-hate brigade will be back in full force!
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:22
@webcrawler: Well they are going to loose Michael Essien, Didier Drogba, Salomon Kalou, Jon Obi Mikel to the ACN in January, and can’t bring anyone in.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:25
@Traverse: Im ruling them out the title race just because of that.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:28
@Dan: They will appeal and FIFA will reduce the embargo I am sure of it.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:36
@Traverse: The league is ours than..! I knew it! God is Manchester United Fan…
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:44
@webcrawler: Truthfully I would rather they get away with just a massive fine, and we win it off our own play we would never hear the end of it!!
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:45
@Traverse: Nah it won’t be the same Trav, because it will be dealt with by the English FA
. Chelsea were in fact the last team to be hit by the English FA weren’t they?, and were fined heavily and deducted 3 points. I hope that City is dealt with in exactly the same way. Everton should push for a judgement on the way City tapped and TRAPPED Lescott so publically, and the same with all the players, except for CARLA funnily enough, because they knew they would get a hammering from UNited, who have always said that they will NOT do their business transactions thru the media.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:46
Who will they appeal against if you dont mind my ignorance? Fifa issued the ban, they are top dick, who could overrule this?
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:50
Chelsea were talking about reporting City for tapping up Terry so ferociously, and talking publically about their player. I guess they decided not too when Terry decided to stay, and obviously they knew they would be seen as hypocrites. Shame really, because that shower in Stockport would have been docked 6 points
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:51
@Dan: CAS, the Court of Arbitration for Sport. If they uphold the decision then Chelsea can go through the normal legal courts which could end up in the European Court which is the highest. However this could take years to resolve so realisticaly it will depend on the decision by CAS.
September 3rd, 2009 at 14:53
@Dan: They will appeal to FIFA mate you surely have the right to appeal any decsion?
September 3rd, 2009 at 15:04
Anyone seen this video of Ruud??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGhK_sNtC40&feature=related#movie_player
Greatest finisher to ever grace Old Trafford, if not the world!!
Simply Amazing!!! They should play this vid to our current crop of strikers, show ‘em how it’s done!! 
September 3rd, 2009 at 15:08
Fergie really has a way of dealing with youth that should send a message to youngstars that united is not a place for them anymore.Last season,Nani was always on the bench and fans thought it was because of his decision making and poor play,this season he plays and he has been good and people look at him and say he has improved but what they ignore is that the stats have been constant.
This season,the indication is that Anderson has gone backwards and thats why he is on the bench and his displays have been average.What they forget is that these two havent starsted playing at United,they were actually stars in their teams and were scouted over a long period hence the huge transfer fees paid.
The simple fact is no player however great can play in spats and perform very well whenever called upon once in a blue moon.Fans talk about the midfield of becks,scholes,giggs,keane and butt as one of the best in the world at the time but ignore the fact that much as they dominated england,they were mediocre in Europe apart from 99 they had no o0ther highlight to talk about.
The Possebon ,De leat,Tossic scenario pops in mind.Either our scouting network is so poor,or we are ruining yuongstars’ future by buying them keeping them in reserves with no hope of ever playing for this club however hard they try. What does a person like De leat have to do to get respect from all involved at OT?
September 3rd, 2009 at 15:12
aargh, watching that video has made me fall in love with United even more!!
Anyone know where I can download United games?? Just wanna watch our classic matches over and over again!!! 
Why oh why, don’t we play with that flair and recklesness anymore?? I miss it, I really do !!
September 3rd, 2009 at 15:25
@Gabriel: He was class…i like how he just used to smash the ball past keepers without a second thought. Brilliant player, Berba should try it a bit. If Macheda develops good he should become a sort of Ruud. They have the same sort of build.
Nice to hear about Obertan…cant wait to see him to play.
September 3rd, 2009 at 15:32
I see why were stocking up on our young foreigners. Fifa are about to shut that door. The ban on Chelsea seems a bit harsh but yea if tapping up is to be done away with they have to. Mikel was clearly tapped up so its been coming but wow no signings for till 2011 damn that long!
September 3rd, 2009 at 15:37
@donibrasco: Im looking forward to the time giggs,scholes and neville retire. The the likes of nani will play more. Giggs was playing consistenly at bout 18 or 19. All the great players were played most games…Ronaldo at 18, Rooney etc. Nani anderson etc just dont have the time
September 3rd, 2009 at 16:08
AWESOME! haha this might be old news to people, but chealsea cant sign anyone else for two transfer windows! that would be great considering the old age of their squad =)
September 3rd, 2009 at 16:19
Whilst I am pleased that two of our rivals are being exposed for what they are;cheats and crooks I’m becoming extremely worried by the behaviour of Blattini. Their behavaviour is becoming more and more sinister and is a systematic attack on the Premier League. Far more iregularities occur in Italy and Spain and even the Germans are no angels.
September 3rd, 2009 at 16:45
@donibrasco: We give more youth players the chance compared to Liverpool, chelsea and Real.
Welbeck, De Laet, The Twins, Macheda ect are all under 21 they will get their chance, but I have to say this is a typical post by you, anti Ferguson and United rubbish.
September 3rd, 2009 at 17:28
@Stephen: Spot on mate!! It’s always a case of the grass is always greener with a lot of folks on here. I mean, our youth recruitment and utilisation is way better than 90% of all the other top teams in the world. Look at madrid, both milan clubs, chelsea, liverpool etc, none have a youth policy as big and effective as ours. Which other team had a youth player literally guarantee them their league title with two crucial match-winning strikes as Macheda did? Which other team had a youth team win the Carling cup and reach the FA cup semi’s only to be unfairly beaten on penalties??
Not to mention our various current and former youth/academy products plying their trade all over the different levels of the league and abroad!! Some folks would find an axe to grind no matter what, eh?
September 3rd, 2009 at 17:46
Spot on Gabriel, some people just to find fault with club for the sake of it and he is the worst.
September 3rd, 2009 at 17:47
@Craig Mc: They won’t do anything about Citeh, because that’s not what they are doing Chelsea for. Reading deeper into the ruling, they have been done for signing the kid while he was 15. He signed a full contract with Chelsea and broke his academy contract at Lens while he was 15, and it is completely illegal to sign a 15 year old on a professional contract. Roma got done for the same thing a while back, and had the same punishment.
The funniest part of this is the fat prick Jason Cundy loosing his shit live on national radio. Witch hunt on Chelsea blah blah blah. You broke the rules, you get punished. They should be complaining about the people running their club, not the people running FIFA.
September 3rd, 2009 at 17:53
@Gabriel: They should bring Ruud back for a season to teach them how it is done
. But then some things are just NATURAL and not taught 
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 17:57
@Traverse: haha.. ‘fat prick’
he really is a twunt, that jason cundy!! 
It’ll be interesting to see how this all pans out though. UEFA and FIFA have been geting quite strict and disciplinary lately. I won’t rush to say it is an anti-English agenda, but it is funny seeing how Madrid blatantly tapped up Ronnie for two years, also urging him to break his contract with us and all they had to say were words of encouragement to Madrid, Blatter even accusing us of treating Ronnie as a slave!! At least we can all laugh at CSKA london for now!!
September 3rd, 2009 at 18:12
@Dan: I give you credit for your knowledge of the youth prospects mate because I know you study them long and hard. But you know diddly squat about goalkeepers.
Just had to have a friendly little dig at you for that one mate.
September 3rd, 2009 at 18:25
@Gabriel: I have a different take on it. I actually sympathize with Chelsea because I hate the Spanish clubs who break the rules far more than i could hate Chelsea. Real Madrid are like the Teflon Team of the World because nothing ever sticks when it comes to them breaking rules. They get away with murder and then get praised for it by UEFA and FIFA. So although I am not a Chelsea fan, I do feel sympathy for them because I hate the idea of English sides getting screwed over like this and being the targets of incredibly unfair double standards and tow faced practices by the governing bodies of the game who seem to pick and choose their favorites and their ludicrous form of justice.
Then again, if this had happened to Liverpool, well then I would have had a party. But then again, Liverpool really aren’t an English team anyway and further more, they wouldn’t be buying any players in the first place because they haven’t caught to pence to rub together.
September 3rd, 2009 at 18:27
@Taehr: @Craig Mc: Ruud was truly a natural!!! If you watch the video, you can see he has a one-track mind, put the ball in the net!!! All his runs, dribbles and tackles where aimed at that single goal. He wasn’t interested in passing to a team mate when he had a chance (read Berbatov), he just lived to score!! I wish our strikers can just adopt that mentality, although I know it can be hard when they have to support a non-creative midfield.
Btw Taehr, I feel Obertan woud be a revelation!! He is 20 and has all the attributes (at first glance at least) to be a successful attacker. All he needs is some decent mentoring and as Fergie is already speaking highly of him, that shouldn’t be a problem.
September 3rd, 2009 at 18:31
@Grognard: haha… it would have been dead funny if it happened to Liverpool instead. At least, Rafa would have had an excuse to assemble another dossier of his so called ‘FACHTS’
That man is just too comical!! 
September 3rd, 2009 at 18:45
@Traverse: I hate that cunt Cundy, wish I heard it.
September 3rd, 2009 at 18:54
Mmmmmm – Anderson, Neville, and Fabio are in the reserves team just about to kick off, so it will be good to see if Andi puts any effort in, because no doubt Fergie will be watching the games as norm. Young Fabian Brandy is back from injury, so good to see how he does tonight, with cup games etc coming up. Right I’m off to watch the game! See how the kids do. I don’t think they have lost yet. Lets hope they can bring that in to the 1st team when they get their shot soon.
September 3rd, 2009 at 18:58
@Grognard: But i know what is to be expected of a young goalkeeper, like foster
September 3rd, 2009 at 18:59
@Craig Mc: It’s truly amazing what injury can do to you. Previously Anderson was a regular on the Brazil squad. Now he’s here playing for the reserves. I hope that’s good in a way, because since there’s no Tevez – no South Americans going out on international breaks to deal with.
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:04
@Dan: Then the million dollar question will be, when is a ‘keeper not young and “middle-aged”.
He’s 26 now isn’t he?
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:10
@Red Ranter:
For an outfield player, hed be hitting his prime, for a keeper, he is in his early days.
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:12
@Taehr: This isn’t a direct pop but saying things like ” Im looking forward to the time giggs,scholes and neville retire” is disrectful, I understand that that their days have probably gone by but they have given our club legacy and many fans who are young and from other countries would not have supported our club if it wasn’t from what this boys did for us.
They have been loyal to the club when many havn’t they been model pro’s at a time when booze culture was rampant in the English football, been ambassadors for the club and for the club and Manchester in general, play through injuries and put United first rather than even their country.
I am not saying they time and Neville especially hasn’t come but these lads deserve respect, at the very least.
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:16
@Craig Mc: Mark my words… Fergie seriously had a Big brawl with Andy… He’s taken Nani’s place in the doghouse now!
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:20
@Darth Red Diablo: But Nani NEVER played for the reserves though last season when he was in the OT siberia freeze zone! Richie DeLaet isn’t playing tonight and Wigan are one up already.
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:32
@Craig Mc: Well… Nani kept shut… that’s why Fergie softened!
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:41
@Traverse: Good news for us all round, but with this new hardline fifa, I wouldn’t be surprised if they actually dig up some dodgy dealings of our own.
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:42
Anderson just Scored!!!
Apparently a very good strike 
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:46
@Red Ranter: Link!!!!
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:48
@Stephen: I can just see that happen.
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:50
@Darth Red Diablo:
http://www.fromsport.com/video-67984.html
half time score 1-1
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:50
@Red Ranter: Well RR he is charging round the pitch, he’s sorted a Wigan player who tried to do him, and he HAS JUST SCORED!
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:53
this boy Ikrem looks good…
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:54
@t_reason: Thank Bro….
@Craig Mc: Wow… And we question why Fergie relegates people!
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:54
OH MY FUCKING GOD!!!
I go to school, think its gonna be a regular day and have some banter with my mates. Like I said, regular day. But when I come home these two things have happend:
1. Anderson has scored from open play!
Im a United fan, born and bred. But that is too harsh. Just way too harsh! Real Madrid and City get away with murder and Chlelsea arent allowed to buy a player because of a young lad from France. Its fucked up, so… Well, just fucked up by FIFA. 
2. Chelsea get a 2 year transfer ban.
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:55
@Red Ranter: I SAW IT, I SAW IT, IS JIZZED MY PANTS!
More of that please Andy!
Had another great striker as well, unlucky he didnt score.
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:56
@Red Ranter: Oh and I don’t think it has anything to do with injury, that he is not in the team right now. Something has put Andi in SAF the hitman’s range, and onto the mortuary slab. He is head and shoulder’s above everyone on the reserve team tonight, I mean its humiliating for him. He is all over the pitch, doing a single man job of bossing the MF. All I am saying is he is showing he shouldn’t be there really. It is demeaning for him.
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:56
@Stephen: I’ve not watched that much of Lille to be honest but, at this point in time Azard’s just like the maghreb trio of Ben Arfa, Nasri and Benzema were three years ago. He can end up world class like Benzema, good enough but not great like Nasri, or a major disappointment like Ben Arfa. (for info, I do realise I just stated the obvious!
)
If anything Bastos was the major star at Lille – just two steps from being world-class. But as usual the moment a player in ligue 1 starts to make himself noticed on the pitch Lyon just nicks them…
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:58
Why is MUTV playing an Oasis track?
September 3rd, 2009 at 19:59
@Craig Mc: Still, it is just the reserves.
Andy will have to do well in the games against top opposition in the Premier League to prove his doubters wrong. Some great performances in the reserves doesnt prove anything, even if he scoresa hat-trick.
Yeah, this is coming from me!
Its because I really want Anderson to do well and improve, and for him I only expect the best. Im honest, he will have to perform a lot better in the big games to make a real difference. The goal was great, but proves me nothing…
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:04
Its annoying watching Andy tonight… Why? Because he is playing well? No, its not that. I love it when he plays well, and he is owning Wigan. But for fucks sake this must be the first time in years I have seen him being used properly. Yeah, Wigan reserves midfield may sucks, but he is still dominating them more than a footaller should be allowed to. He is being used as the box-to-box midfielder he is, not a DM. Actually he is more attacking minded that Ive seen him at United! Fergie, I bet you!!! Please, please take note. Because it seems Ole knows how to use Andy better than you right now… Embarrasing…
THATS MY MATE MAGNUS!!!
Well done Josh, well done.
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:10
Anderson is killing Wigan…
Fergie, take note!
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:12
Anybody else thinks Andy looks like a combo of Ronaldinho and Scholesy in their prime tonight?
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:18
@Footy4Eddy:
he sure knows how to pick a pass. already had 2 more assists but for King, who missed easy chances….
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:18
@Stephen: Been thinking the same thing…
@donibrasco: I agree – partly. But the fact is that Utd cannot always afford the gamble of playing 3 or 4 untested players especially at the same time, even though they are very, very promising.
Hence the need for loans, or carling cup outings. I do think that we have one of the best, if not the best scouting network of the whole EPL for that matter.
A player like Tosic at Arsenal would be rotated regularly – Bendtner being quite average manages to get games…
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:20
@Footy4Eddy: Did you just look at the pass to a player where he was looking somewhere else? CLASS mate! Solskjaer For Manager!
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:21
@Darth Red Diablo: Could have had at least 4 assists today, if not for some inept finishing. His cross for Josh was pure quality!
Seriously, Solskjaer must take over for Ferguson! He sure know how to play his players!
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:26
Ive never, and I mean I have NEVER seen Anderson this focused in a football game!
He really is making an effort today, I seriously this is a sign of things to come… Even though its only a reserve match!
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:34
I’ve said it before. Only Ferguson has no idea how to play a player in his position of all the top managers and coaches. I’ve been vindicated. Even if it’s only a reserves match. I mean he admitted that he didn’t know how to use Berbatov throughout the whole of last season. What did we expect? I hope Ole can knock some sense into him. I’m so happy for Andy. Hope when he returns to the 1st team he’ll be played in his natural position. Thank u Ole. I’m now even more convinced he’s the successor we need. Great attacking football
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:36
Brady looks very promising…
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:39
I’m so desperate for some dude called Grognard to eat humble pie. He’s been on Andy’s case for a millenium now. Saying he’s crap and utterly useless. Saying his hair is the root cause for his stupidity and saying black men should revise their dread lock culture. Go Andy.
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:40
Just in about Possebon – he’s been judged to be poor after 34 minutes played!
Does he have a brother of sorts working for stoke city?
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:42
Anyone got a link for the reserve game not through justin.tv? I get a message saying things like capacity has been exceed for my country…
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:46
Gary Neville= Used as CB
Patrice Evra= Used as LM and RB
Owen Hargreaves= Used as RB and RM
Rio Ferdinand= Used as CDM
Anderson= Used as CDM and LM
Dimitar Berbatov= Used as CAM
Wayne Rooney= Used as LW
Ryan Giggs= Used as CM
Park Ji Sung= Used as RW
Danny Welbeck= Used as LW
John Oshea= Used as LB, CDM, GK, ST and CM
Darren Fletcher= Used as RW
Darren Gibson= Used as RW
He has also played with positions of former players as well, such as Veron, Solskjær and Phil Neville. He has gotten incredibly stubborn in this area the last few years, as you can see fromour current squad. Worst thing is, when these guys are playing out of position they are not as good as we know they can be. Rooney, Anderson and Fletcher are proof.
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:47
@Jay wire: Fucks sake mate, its only a reserve game.
Even I am not getting carried away with this, why the fuck should Grog do?
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:47
@Jay wire: Mate, whilst even I have been a little underwhelmed with Anderson of late, if you think a performance over Wigan reserves is going to sway Grognard, you’re grossly mistaken.
And no one should.
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:51
@Footy4Eddy: you’re joking right?
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:56
I’m don’t overly advocate for the youth to be played like Wenger but I think donni brasco is talking some sense. Real Madrid actually have a good youth structure. Chelsea’s youth destroyed us last season so let’s not say things without facts. As much as we give youth a chance we have regressed in that dept significantly from our excellent past. These young players will not remain 18 and 20 year olds forever. Anderson should take over from Scholes now if he’s to develop into that role. That means Scholes becomes reserve. Nani should completely take over from Giggs. No excuses there. Giggs becomes the reserve. We’ve done enough blooding in already otherwise they may end up as transfusion centres. Ferguson has gone very negative and is becoming more and more timid by the day as shown in all our games against Barca and more recently Arsenal. We’ve heard enough of this “they’ve got potential” rubbish. Play them and play them correctly for once without interruptions. If Nani turns out to be a star winger this season then we lost the CL because of the manager who would have wasted him and played Rooney in his stead
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:57
Anderson was so SUPERIOR to anybody else on the pitch, he was just playing with THE SCOUSE GITS on the Wigan team. Most Wigan players were scousers trying to DO him, kicking him trying to dispossess him but failing miserably
. No other than it should be though playing those beneath him!
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:58
@NicoQB: By he, I meant the Braga coach…
September 3rd, 2009 at 20:59
@Dan: Kinda…
You cant deny he was making some brilliant passes tonight, and his burst of speed was great to watch. His goal was Ronaldinho esque, in the sense that he brushed off two men and hammered it into the net. Of cource he only played against Wigan reserves, and he is still very young. But compared to his lastest performances, from last season as well, it was great to watch! Go on Andy!
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:02
@Footy4Eddy: Have to agree there. SAF’s tinkering with players’ natural positions is at times utterly frustrating.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:03
@Dan: And so far he hasn’t met any expectations now, has he?
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:04
I didn’t say this performance would sway him. I said I’m desperate for him to prove his worth. Otherwise I’d ve said he’s already eaten pie. It’s only a reserves game but if Ole had played him like our manager ie as a DM then everyone watching would have been saying Andy is really crap. All I’m excited about is he is being played in his natural place and has done well. Everytime he’s been played right he does well. I remember when he came back from the Beijing Olympics and was played as the link between attack and mid and he played well. Just put him where he should be and problem solved. That’s why I’m excited. Maybe they’ll let the manager know very politely how he should play the boy
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:09
@Dan: Take a look at young keepers like Adler and Neuer who are both under 23 and ask yourself again if you think Foster is meeting his scheduled target date for arriving with the complete package?
My God, Neuer is only 21 and is already the third best keeper on the planet behind Casillas and Buffon. Does Manchester United not deserve that kind of player manning their goal, instead of a 26 year old slow learner who has more question marks than has questions answered? If he was 21 I’d still be down on him because I have never seen a keeper on a big team like ours with such poor mechanics and fundamentals. It’s his shot stopping ability at close range that is keeping him on the team and that’s all. It’s only a matter of time before Fergie realizes this also.
Fergie’s no fool (I think). He never went after Neuer or Adler this season because he knows he will be getting EVDS back in a few weeks. But I will be more than shocked and upset if he does not make a move on one of these two keepers next summer.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:13
@Grognard: But I will be more than shocked and upset if he does not make a move on one of these two keepers next summer.
Why would you be shocked and upset. Considering how Ferguson’s disappointed you this summer, nothing should shock you anymore.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:14
@Stephen: Sorry mate but I too am counting the days Neville and Scholes retire. I’ll hold a party then. I still love Giggs and in small doses he can still deliver but the other two are washed up and done like dinner. Respect is such an overused word and sentiment. Respect who? I don’t know these player’s personally and as a fan the only thing I respect is winning. When they were good (although I never ever felt Neville was good) I respected them and appreciated them. But now they have long passed their expiration date and like milk they have soured on me. They have disrespected us the fans and the team by not knowing when to do the right thing and hang their boots up. They have kept better younger players from having their opportunity because they count on Fergie’s love and loyalty for them and their past service. It’s wrong and it’s sad. Sometimes you get more love and respect by knowing when to let go and say goodbye. In their case, they have overstayed their welcome and in the case of me and others like me, have taken love and respect and turned it in to anger and impatience.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:17
@Footy4Eddy: It proved a lot to me tonight Eddi mi man. I was never the biggest Andi fan, but in the position Ole played Andie in tonight, he displayed some innate talent which you either have or you don’t. What he showed cannot be learned. Those thru passes, no one could have detected putting players thru who were heavily marked, straight into packed box. The looking as if to play a ball one way, only to fool the opposition with a pass the other way without looking. That showed a perception of where players are around him. He linked up play with complete ease, but even when heavily marked he was just mauling, and sparring with the Wigan players, taking the complete piss I’d say
. Anyway, he gave an education in football to both teams MF’s tonight. I like what I saw. I can see why he doesn’t want to be arsed in training, he thinks he doesn’t need too, pretentious little GIT, but I was impressed with some things he has in his armoury that I haven’t SEEN BEFORE. Can our Staff bring it out of him in the 1st team? There’s the question eh? Andi could be fucking fantastic for us, IF he applied himself, and IF like Ole did tonight he was used rightly. I could be moved from non Andi fan to true Andi fan IF he knuckled down and honed all the innate talent I saw tonight 
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:18
Ando did play well, at least from the bit of the game that I saw (2nd half), however, it is the reserves!!
One thing I noticed was that his positioning in this game wasn’t very different from that in which he plays in the 1st team. The only difference was he was willing to move forward a bit more. Something I think has to do with confidence. You could see that he was confident here and had that strutt, hence his willingness to dictate play and move forward. If he can translate this into the 1st team, SAF won’t have a problem playing him.
Eddy, you say he is a box-to-box midfielder, well he should be roaming from box-to-box shouldn’t he?? No one orders him to sit in our half. He was playing the same role as he does for the 1st team but here he decided to actually perform as his given role requires; move from box-to-box. His problem seems to be consistency, which comes back to being match-fit and sharp, which again comes back to his rumored laziness to work his arse off in training to be match-fit and sharp. He might be in Fergie’s dog-house at the mo, but it is for good reason and as with Nani, it might help him discover that motivation to improve on his talent and not settle because he is already playing for United.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:19
@Stephen: Giggs is my favourite player!…what I mean is that I look forward to a time when Fergie will be forced to play players like nani to help them develop and not play the old guys due to sentiment because I think thats y he does…esp giggs and scholes…They were supposed to be played less this year but scholes is still playing more than andy
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:21
@Footy4Eddy: Real Madrid is also known as FIFA FC and UEFA United. They get a break and the benefit of the doubt 99.999% of the time. They can do no wrong in the eyes of Platini and Blatter. It’s such BS and the faster the world body of football realizes the corruption in these governing bodies for the game, the better the game will be. Wouldn’t it be nice if the English game and others seceded from FIFA and UEFA? Just left and said up yours to them. Really, what could they do about it? It’s times like this that I like the rebel idea of a European Super League that does not answer to these ass clowns.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:25
@Footy4Eddy: Ah jeez mate, it’s the reserves. It has nothing to do with Ole knowing how to use him. It’s because Anderson is playing at a skill level on the reserves that he can handle and excel at. It’s when he goes up to the main team he struggles because the skill level of the opponents is much better. Keep this in mind, Wigan’s main team was total shite against us. Can you imagine what a walk in the park their reserves should be for a player like Anderson? Quit being so fickle and looking for reasons to jump on his band wagon and express your Andy love when he still has done very little to earn any kind of love in my opinion.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:26
@Jay wire: This Anderson performance has done a lot to sway me Jaywire, he has things in his basic armoury that cannot be learned. Still will need to convince SAF of his work ethic credentials if he wants off the bench. That seems to be what SAF has a problem with. Anderson worked his bollocks off tonight, although he didn’t need to do too much, because he was so bloody superior (as he should be to all others on the pitch) that he made the ball do all the work
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:27
@Footy4Eddy: Consider playing for United like having FIFA 09 set at the hardest level. Then consider playing for the reserves equivalent to playing the FIFA 09 game at Semi-Pro. That’s the difference in class and quality and that’s why Anderson is looking so good.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:30
@NicoQB: I have to disagree mate. Even though he still has a lot to learn, I personally think Bendtner is a lot better than you think. There was a reason many top European teams were interested in him. He is strong in the air and has a quality about him. What he lacks is consistency and that is because he is young. You might laugh at this but I would keep him over Adebayor any day of the week.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:31
@Gabriel: As usual – funny how different eyes see a game of football differently
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:31
@Footy4Eddy: I’ll try to ignore you said that. Seriously, you cannot be that fickle or that stupid. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt on that.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:35
@Jay wire: Don’t be an idiot mate. If you think I will eat humble pie because Anderson has played well against WIGAN’S reserves, well all I can say is you need to get your head examined. Grab a reality pill. Today he is playing against boys. Against men he sucks farts from bedsheets. Grab a dose of reality and stop being so fickle and such a bandwagon jumper. Until Anderson puts together a nice string of excellent performances for the main team, he will be locked away in my dungeon of a doghouse with only bread and water.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:36
@NicoQB: That’s because he never is given the chance to play a lot and to play a full game. United have not worked hard enough on the field and in the training room to build up his stamina and endurance. That’s something that can easily be remedied with a personal trainer and a little special attention.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:42
I think I might go down the Old Trafford store, and ask them to put Andi’s name under Lil man Nani’s on my shirt
. Anything to try and encourage the lad. Then I will get the Salford lads to aim to get tiickets right where Fergie is positioned, turn my back to him, and SHOW HIM NANI AND ANDI – get them in there SAF!
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:45
@Footy4Eddy: Gary Neville originally started out his career as a CB. Evra was originally a LM/LW, Hargreaves has played nearly every position on the pitch except keeper and striker for Bayern and excelled there. Rio started out as a forward and had also played midfield in his early days in the West Ham system etc etc. I may be very critical of Fergie but the old man generally knows what he is doing. The one time I have disagreed with his playing a player out of position and actually hurting that player’s development would be with Wayne Rooney. Why? Because frankly, Rooney was to frakken good to be messed with. Anderson on the other hand was not good or fast enough nor could he cross as a LM/LW so Fergie saw moving him in the middle as a smarter move. It hasn’t worked out but I put more of the blame on Anderson then I do on Fergie.
Where I question Fergie is not so much where he plays players, but who he plays and the tactics he uses. The fact that he continues to count on the geriatrics brigade of the team and the continued use of the completely useless JS Park is more an issue with me as well as his negative and overly cautious tactics. If players are good or even great, they should be able to adapt to other positions. So lets stop making excuses for players like Anderson and come up with the realization, that perhaps, just perhaps, he’s not good enough. Against Burnley, he was played on the left side. That was his original position. Tell me, did he have a great game? No, he stunk the joint out. Take the hint mate.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:47
@Footy4Eddy: Now there we are definitely in agreement. A little perspective goes a long way. Good for Andy today and hopefully he can transfer the positives from today towards his play for the big club. But at the risk of being negative, I wouldn’t bet my savings on it.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:47
@Red Ranter: You know me so well.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:50
@Grognard: It doesn’t take someone with a post-graduate education to work that one out.
(Although I do have a post-graduate degree.
)
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:51
@Footy4Eddy: Which reminds me, I’d love it if FIFA 10 + would include the reserves sides and their league so that Andy can be the true star that he is.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:51
@Red Ranter: Touche. Very true.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:54
Anyway, I watched the second half, and I must say Anderson played like a dream. Unfortunately it doesn’t count because it was with the reserves. However, he seemed committed and focused on the job, and looked up to make a pass rather than keep his head down. Most of his long passes connected and he was able to pick out runs — and these things show he has ability. Question is, will he develop consistency, and will he perform when it counts for the senior team?
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:56
@Red Ranter: Very true but the knowledge that they were looking seriously at Neuer and the supposed fact (not verified) that Adler is interested in playing for us and even has a stipulation in his contract that allows him to leave if United comes a calling, make me think that he will seriously pursue a top keeper next season when EVDS retires. Unless Foster does a complete 180 in his play, I do not see him being our first team keeper. I see PIG being let go and us going for a big name keeper to replace EVDS. Just a feeling I have. And the cost of a good keeper will not break the bank for even the Glazer’s. Obviously I could be wrong, but I have gut feeling about this one.
September 3rd, 2009 at 21:59
@Grognard: With Blatter being a Honorary Member of Real and Platini publicly supporting Barca in last season’s CL final is it any wonder why supporters’ of the PL get a little tetchy? Both these clubs are hardly the paragon of virtue and decency.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:00
@Craig Mc: I’d be interested to know what those things in his basic armory are that supposedly cannot be learned? I for one have seen very little in his armory. He can dribble at pace and can swing his big fat ass around in order to protect the ball. That’s about it and i seriously doubt those qualities cannot be learned. The odd long distance worm killing through ball is not that big a deal. It just means he is more willing to risk it. Please tell me?
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:04
@Grognard: @Grognard:
’stunk the joint out’ haha.. Ando’s getting an absolute ribbing from you today!! 
eddy won’t be too pleased!! 
Anyhoot, I thought he did okay but like RR says, needs to show some consistency. Last season, he played more games than Nani, yet Nani was more effective in games than he was. The boy simply needs to step his game up, which unfortunately he didn’t last year. Here’s hoping a stint in Fergie’s dog-house would do him sum good like it seems to have done lil’ man Nani. 
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:05
@Red Ranter: We’ll never know RR until he gets a consistent run in the 1st team!
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:06
@Red Ranter: Encouraging news but I have seen far too much of this player to believe one game against the Wigan reserves has transformed Andy into the player we all are hoping he was going to be two years ago. As for playing him in a position that suits him more, I think that’s what the reserves are for. To tinker with players and see if they can discover the missing pieces to his game or the position that brings out the best in them. Some have given Ole credit for this but I wouldn’t be surprised if moving him positionally was not a directive from Fergie to see if he could solve the enigma that is Mr. Anderson.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:07
@Gabriel: Aaaah Lil Man Nani, the terror of United’s left wing.
. Mad Pat and Lil man are becoming quite a potentially lethal double act 
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:09
@Grognard: Fucks sake mate, read all my comments from the start and you will see that I quite often pointed out the fact that this was a reserves games and he would have to do a lot more work in the real competitive games to convince me about him becoming a real star. You know I love Ando mate, but lately I have been in my behavior and thought of trying to spur him on and look more at his improvement than his ability. And even though it was a reserves game tonight, I saw some massive improvement in his game. More focused, more aware and hungrier than I have seen him for a while. It was a fucking shit game, considering the opposition, but he was immense! Hoping for more, and nothing you will say can make me look at Andy in a bad or good way.
That is his job, and you know that pretty well! 
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:10
@Cyclops-Red: I don’t have too much of a problem with Barca as they seem to follow the rules. I can’t knock them for their spending. If you have it, spend it. But unlike Real, I cannot recall them playing dirty tricks, using the Spanish media for their purposes and tapping up players like Real do. I could be wrong but I just don’t remember an example of that. If anything, they are idiots having been taken for a lot in the Eto’o for Ibrahmiovich swap. Eto’o and 45 million for the Bitch was just robbery by Inter and good business. Still, Barcelona are favored along with Madrid by Platini and Blatter because those tow clowns believe everything begins and ends in either Spain or Italy.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:11
Also, in all honesty, I am slowly coming round to Grog’s reasoning when it comes to Foster. He does seem to lack some basic technical footwork and key fundamentals that all ‘great’ keepers have and at 26, he should possess them already. However, he is a great shot-stopper, brave and distributes the ball quite well, three vital qualities a top keeper should have. I hope VDS stays out for an even longer period of time, so we can see if Foster is the real deal. If he’s not, it’ll be a shame cuz it would have been nice to have a solid British spine to our team.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:11
@Craig Mc:
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:13
@Gabriel: I’m not down on his performance today. I am encouraged. But I also take with a grain of salt and see it through the proper perspective rather than jump on the bandwagon so hard that I flatten the tires. He has an incredibly long road to go before he impresses me. He needs to show what he did today for the big club, and to do it consistently for 90- minutes and for more than 5 or 6 games in a row. Above all, he needs to show up big against top clubs, not just the Wigan reserves.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:15
@Craig Mc: The Lil Man is truly special and I think he is going to be great, but as for Evra, I would prefer to refer to him as Sad Pat or Just Bad Pat. Nice runs but no end product and his defense has been awful for a year now.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:17
@Footy4Eddy: I read everything mate but you just went on and on about how this was going to be a wake up call and a revelation and that Ole is a genius etc etc. And I’m sorry but that is just overreacting for one game against frakken Wigan’s reserve shitbags. No offense to you mate, just disagree with all this bandwagon fodder is all.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:19
@Footy4Eddy:
, Well you know what I’m like Eddy! If a player touches my heart, like Lil man did, and amazingly as Andi did tonight, I go all out to get on the same BUS and travel with them. Something about Andi tonight just touched my heart, and I felt for the lad. With me on board now Eddy, you just WATCH and take note! I am like a dog with a bone when I take a liking to a player – remember with Nani against all the odds!
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:20
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/article6820875.ece
If we get a similar ban like Chelsea that would seriously mean Fifa are out to get English clubs
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:21
@Grognard: I understand that mate, Im not getting my hopes up too much either.
But when Andy does well, I am going to be encorouged by it. And you know that perfectly well. Andy did well tonight and even though Im not getting my hopes up I saw improvement in his game, which I am of cource going to be happy for! 
It was not only about the oppoition, but I saw more concentration and hunger in his game. As Borat would say… VERY NAICE!!! 
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:23
@Craig Mc: Mate, they truly are!!! I just hope both don’t get burnt out playing for their respective countries during the break as both France and Portugal are facing must-win qualifiers and they are both key players for their countries. We need them fresh for Tottenham and Man Shitty.
I believe Nani is now mature and knows what he can achieve if he hones his talent and moreso, what is expected of him. Sometimes, it takes the seperation of a clique to see the individuals shine. He was definitely in Ronnie’s shadow, no matter what anyone says and I feel he now knows, this is his time. It definitely shows in his recent displays like that against Arsenal; he was tracking back and released the ball at the right times in attack. Him and Evra (formerly known as skinned sausage
) would terrorise defences this season, i’m sure of that! 
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:25
@Craig Mc: Glad that you tonight saw the things I see in Andy.
Ive seen them for some time, and when you see the flair and ability he has it only warms my heart. But as Ive said, it was only a reserve game. But tonight I saw the Anderson who played against the proper Wigan team in October 2007, the one that took over my heart. 
Ive seen him perform like this before, at the top level. Its been a while since Ive seen this Anderson Abreu, and even though it was a reserve game it warmed my heart! If he only could do this at the top level now, it would be immense! 
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:26
@Gabriel: Gabriel Gabriel. Although I appreciate the vote of confidence you lost me when you said that he was brave and a good distributor of the ball. He is bloody terrible at both those. And as far as shot stopping, he is great at close range stops that require reflexes and instinct. When he is forced to stop a long distance missile like the one Arshavin let go, he is found to be a little slow, flat footed and his positioning is often suspect. That ball didn’t get by him as much as it went through him. That happens because he is poorly positioned and on his heels when he makes his dive and so the weight of his momentum is not centered in front and therefore makes his hands stronger and more able to handle the impact. It’s the same principle as catching a ball in American football or swing a tennis racket. If you are caught on your heels and with your weight not forward, your arms and hands do not have the proper strength to catch a hard thrown pass or hit a tennis ball with full force and velocity. Foster’s fundamentals and his physical mechanics in attempting these things and others are incredibly poor for a player at this level. And they are incredibly obvious.
I have gone on for a number of years now about how poor I have found Manuel Almunia of Arsenal to be. He’s so poor that Capello didn’t even want him for England. Considering England’s major Achilles heel is goalkeeping, I find that sort of funny. But even Almunia is a better keeper all round than Foster. Foster is still a superior shot stopper but at least Almunia is braver and fundamentally superior. He’s just still useless because sometimes you can do everything properly and it’s still not good enough because you frankly just haven’t got the talent. Foster has some talent but he is so raw in his skill set that at 26, i do not think he can drastically improve on his bad habits. Just my opinion.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:27
@Grognard: I think Mad Pat has done okay these last few games, well Ever since he got Nani to partner him on the left. I do agree about his lack of end product though! He did chas the ball from Nani right to the byeline and kept it in, and put the ball on a plate for Fletch against Le Arse, but which Fletch once again messed up
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:31
@Gabriel:
Evra, the man formerly known as the skinned sausage.
Thats truly tickled me.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:31
@Craig Mc: I agree that he has looked better but there are still instances that he gets beaten on far post headers because he is naturally out jumped but often it’s just poor positioning or ball watching that gets him in trouble. His ball to Fletch was great but he needs to do that kind of stuff more than once a game and more consistently. If so, then i can forgive some of his grievous defensive errors and then think of him as a Daniel Alves type. A player who is a defensive liability but invaluable offensively.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:32
@Footy4Eddy: You should get your hopes up cos you and me Eddy, are gonna WILL the best out of Andi. BELIEVE – I’m going too
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:34
@Cyclops-Red: Actually that’s a good point. What’s with this Mad Pat shite their Craig? You coined the name “Skinned Sausage” and I’ll be damned if Pat is ever referred to anything but the Skinned Sausage. Skinned Sausage FOR LIFE.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:36
@Craig Mc: Im gonna believe, but when I heard he didnt give a shit in training it was a kick in the crotch and a bitchslap to me.
I was always wondering why Andy hadnt improved, but I would never think it would be something as stupid and low as not being willing to train. I see 13 year olds stay after practice to improve their skill, not professional footballers! 
It was a real wake up call for me, and from now on I will look closely at the developement of Anderson- not only the player, as I did. He means a lot to me, and I BELIEVE he will become great. But he will have to improve and, most importantly, WANT to do so. Believe is the word mate! 
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:37
@Grognard: I think he needs to guage his runs more succinctly Grog. Instead of going forward every time, he needs to trust his winger/wingers to take the ball forward by letting them have the ball. He would be less tired out, and more able to defend properly if he didn’t tire himself out to much to leap when required in defense. Then when he did go forward he would also have the energy to make accurate passes into the box
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:43
@Footy4Eddy: Andi needs to knuckle down in training mate, for stamina purposes. We just had reported back that possebon has been sent back to OT because he couldn’t maintain his performance over a whole game. That points to a stamina problem. I think Andi does tire, and will tire in important FAST paced big games, like the Arsenal one. This is where really pushing yourself in training will cure that little malady. So here’s hoping that we don’t hear he is slacking in training again. He says he doesn’t want to leave United, and understand that SAF requires more effort from him, so lets hope he means it, and we see a change of training attitudes.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:46
@Grognard: I don’t think he deserves that title over the last few games though Grog.
September 3rd, 2009 at 22:57
@Taehr: Yes, Le Havre have been bitching about this for a while now, and I wouldn’t be surprised if FIFA do slap a ban on us. The FIFA have been far too trigger happy with English clubs lately anyway.
September 3rd, 2009 at 23:00
Bloody hell, according to latest pap news, Le Havre have said they are so thrilled with the judgement against Chelsea, because they are pressing on with their case against Man United over Pogba. Man United siad there is no case, because they did everything by FIFA rules, and made NO illicit payments etc to Pogba’s family. Le Havre say that they had pre contract agreement with the lad, but he walked to come to United. They say that United told him he would get 3,700 quid a week when he signed forms at 17 yr old. What was illegal about that, United tell all their apprentices what they will receive when aged 17 and sign contracts???
September 3rd, 2009 at 23:02
Anybody know what the deal is with all these pre contract aggreements. ARE THEY LEGAL!!!
September 3rd, 2009 at 23:03
@Craig Mc: I think the problem is about the fact that there was a pre-agreed contract between the lad and Le Havre. They have been bitching about it for quite sometime now, and the Chelsea ruling will give them more encouragement.
September 3rd, 2009 at 23:04
@Taehr:
sorry Bro, I didn’t realise you had already posted this Pogba thing 
.
September 3rd, 2009 at 23:07
@Red Ranter: As I said though RR, pre contract agreements only seem to exist in France, Spain etc don’t they? Or am I wrong about this? Also are they really LEGAL! Can clubs sign such an agreement like Madrid supposedly did with Ronnie, without the agreement of Manchester United, or any club a player is contracted too!
September 3rd, 2009 at 23:23
@Craig Mc: If you are madrid, yes. If you are a PL team, no. I rest my case mi’lord.
September 3rd, 2009 at 23:27
Chelsea signing this player is completely different to the United case. In the Chelsea case, they signed a player to a contract at 15 while he still on an academy contract at Lens. United have signed the guy (or are trying to) after his academy contract expires (16th birthday) and before he signs a full contract with the team. This, while not leaving a particularly nice taste in the mouth, is completely legal within the current rules of the eagues and the countries. In England you can sign at a full contract at 16, and in Europe it’s 18.
It’s the same way we got Macheda and co, and is completely legal.
September 3rd, 2009 at 23:35
@Traverse: But will they try and come up with some some sort of retrospective decision. Normally this is reserved for Totalitarian states but Uefa and Fifa sem to be a law unto themselves.
September 3rd, 2009 at 23:57
Pogba anyone?
September 4th, 2009 at 0:24
@Cyclops-Red: But we haven’t broken any laws. They can’t retrospectively introduce laws, FIFA don’t have enough money to pay what United would win from them in a court of law!
This is Le Harve being chancers.
September 4th, 2009 at 0:32
@Grognard: Lets hope Lennon doesn’t revive the name next WE!
September 4th, 2009 at 0:50
@Grognard: If Foster doesn’t improve dramatically and swiftly, you could be seeing a move in January.
Even if VDS comes back in good form, he’s fragile at his age and SAF wont want to have an unimproved Foster between the posts in the Spring!!
September 4th, 2009 at 1:12
@Craig Mc: You gave him the name and the name stuck. He could go on to win European Player of the Year and he will still be known by all on Red Rants as Skinned Sausage.
September 4th, 2009 at 1:13
@Redrich: Too true. Lennon is in great form and has a lot of confidence. I’m sure he will have a go at our little sausage.
September 4th, 2009 at 1:16
@Redrich: I honestly don’t think he will because my feeling will be by January, we will be out of contention in both the League and perhaps even Europe. I’m sorry but I just have no confidence in this team and the luck will eventually run out. I cannot see him spending the money when we are not in the thick of things. And even if we are, I think he has always had confidence in EVDS.
September 4th, 2009 at 1:52
@Grognard: Speak for yourself on that.
I will call him Patrice Evra.
September 4th, 2009 at 2:28
So will Possebon continue to play for Man Utd reserves with number 34?
The loan was cancelled just before the deadline?
I wasn’t aware that loan deals could be cancelled like that.
If a loaned out player has the deal cancelled by the club outside a transfer window, I wonder if the club can get into trouble for doing that, or can loan deals be extended or cancelled or shortened at any time?
September 4th, 2009 at 2:56
@Grognard: I actually do! If we stink up the place, there will be a knee jerk reaction to quiet the natives, and SAF uses goalies as a scapegoat. They’re cheap and expendable and easy to fit in because they don’t have outfield responsibilities!!
I think SAF’s goal for the season, and one that cuts the mustard with the ownership, is to compete in the PL until late in the season, and to reach the quarters in the CL.
Anything less will put pressure on this current administration and force some kind of change!
I like the idea of blooding some up-and-comers, but there is a hesitance to this as we see with our team selections so far. If we were to sit down all our geri’s and put in the likes of De Silva, DeLaet, Gibson, Macheda, it would move this team in a direction we could follow. Instead, SAF has to waffle back and forth in order to win games and win fan/owner approval! He wants the goose and the gander too!!
As much as I love the man, he doesn’t seem to be able to move us forward now. The constant bristling with players annoys me. He does state what he wants, but there comes a point when you just cant make a square out of a circle (or visa versa) and with him it always becomes an issue, regardless of the players talent.
He’s done so well for us though, and it would be hard to imagine anyone putting in a better term. But the time is now and the odds are great and I want to see us win this year, not as they say in Filthland, ….soon!!
September 4th, 2009 at 3:08
: @cam: I think the party in trouble here, is Possebon himself.
If you send someone out on loan you expect him to develop some. You certainly don’t expect him to get canned!!
September 4th, 2009 at 5:04
@Redrich: I know, but still I wouldn’t have thought it was possible to alter a loan deal like that, and obviously there are certain rules regarding loan deals that allow things like this to happen, if indeed he is on his way back to United.
September 4th, 2009 at 6:41
@Redrich: Well put. And to add to all that Fergie may have to contend with the expected wrath from FIFA and UEFA. We probaly will be next to get the big ban Chelsea got and it will be because of how we handled the poaching of one Paul Pogba. I’ve always felt this stealing from the crib that we have been doing was going to eventually come back to haunt us. If this kid was indeed under contract with Le Havre, then we could indeed be truly screwed. Makes me even more mad that we never spent the 80 million from the Ronaldo sale, if it indeed leads to us getting banned from buying players too. Make no mistake, Chelsea and us are looking like deer and FIFA and UEFA are this big massive truck that’s just dying to place us within their headlights and then run us down. There is a campaign being constructed right now to go after the English clubs and we could get screwed over royally.
September 4th, 2009 at 8:00
@Grognard: I’m no expert on the Pogba scenario or on the exact rules of buying and approaching players, but I’ve heard many people say that Pogba was a legit deal and that he had ended his academy stint with his club at the time, so it seems like a different situation to Chelsea. I am absolutely stunned at how big the penalty is that FIFA dealt out to Chelsea and it will obviously put an end to similar incidents as clubs will not want to get the same penalty as Chelsea.
In terms of Possebon if anyone knows the exact rules on how loan deals work in terms of can either club cancel, extend or shorten a loan deal at any time wether it is inside or outside a transfer window please let us know. Thanks.
September 4th, 2009 at 8:49
Anderson hasnt just shown this in reserves.He is a very fantastic attacker as seen from porto and gremio.It is just that fergie uses players to perform like robots performing roles.Only at united do we have a defensive striker and wingers are credited for how they defend and not their creativity.The central midfielders are basically positioned far back that it is even very hard to talk about an attacking midfielder.The tactics alone would cripple Zidane himself he wouldnt even be on the bench.This is the reason we find fletcher being our best player and be happy instead of asking questions about our manager without being disrespectful.
With arguably the best defence i wonder why everyone has to defend,and people still blame strikers for not being too much around the box.They are performing duties in defence with the midfielders who are supposed to supply them.
September 4th, 2009 at 9:01
Also some of the comments made by some fans border on racism.Evra has been a fantastic player for united and i would invite anyone to name better leftbacks in the world and then decide what to call the rest.
Adebayor,gets alot of abuse from people which is hard to take considering he is one of the top three strikers in the world today,and yes,shead of both rooney and berba.Just look at his scoring rate for clubs he has played for.They go ahead and say he misses many chances without knowing that he creates his space which is the first sign of a good player.He still manages to score 25 a season and i imagine if as the fans want he puts away every chance,he would score 100 goals?Maldini the great once said Adebayor was the toughest attacker he met in all his long career and he was honest.Vidic said it too.
September 4th, 2009 at 9:09
Why has the news of Possebons return not been on the United website?
September 4th, 2009 at 9:27
Anderson and Fletcher in the middle, every game! Until Hargo comes back…
Carrick is plaing fucking shite these days, Scholesy is just being Scholesy, Giggs was shite against Arsenal but would be effective as a sub and Gibson is not yet fully ready for regular Premier League action. Fletcher is playing immensly well, and Andy needs a chance to prove himself. Play Fletch as the DM and Andy as a more free-flowing attacking midfielder with Nani and Valencia on the wings and there is the beautiful football we all deserves and crave!
September 4th, 2009 at 9:34
Grog, I do to a level understand your points but we are two fans who support the same club but dwell on different towers. You have said that they should retire, well if the manager informs them that they are still part of his plans and with them at the club they could help the younger players which he has done, then why should they?
Also you have said they are holding back the youth, well you have been saying all summer we should sign players who are in their mid twenties so the youth would certainly not get a chance then would they, that seems to be the stock answer when people say the old guard should retire, but demand signings.
Hopefully at the end and with 19 league championships under our belt they will hand the baton over to the younger lads who have gained already some game time and are ready to be first team regulars and have learned what it is to be Manchester United player, I have typed this off my BlackBerry so grammar is probably awful!
September 4th, 2009 at 9:43
Why no news of the Possebon return at manutd site, Sky or BBC?
September 4th, 2009 at 9:47
If anyone knows the exact rules on how loan deals work in terms of the Possebon scenario please let us know or post a link. Thank you.
September 4th, 2009 at 10:39
The Possebon scenario sounds a bit weird. But then there does seem to be a sort of prejudice against loan signings. We’ve always struggled to get teams to play our players. I mean Newcastle were too dumb to play Rossi.
I think we should have the Spanish system where we have a B team in a lower division. Reserve matches are a waste of time for youngsters, they need real competitive football.
It doesn’t surprise me at all that Anderson can tear it up at youth level and against Wigan reserves. But he wouldn’t be the first player who couldn’t make the step up to top level football.
September 4th, 2009 at 11:24
@cam: If we are smart, which we pay expensive lawyers to be, we had a recall clause in his loan contract, allowing us to call him back should we need to ie: in event of 10 midfield injuries…. He is our player, and we hold his registration, and I’m pretty certain he can just come back in and play for us.
The Pogba deal is legit. As far as I am aware he didn’t sign a ‘pre-contract’ which is the problem with Chelsea’s signing. We waited for his academy deal to expire, and then rather than signing professional forms with Le Harve he has indicated he would like to sign for us instead. We have applied for work permit, but because of Le Harve’s complaint this has yet to be accepted. He hasn’t signed a contract with us yet. As long as no pre-contract exists then there is no case to answer. Same as Macheda and Petrucci.
The other clubs are pissed because of how the UK classifies a minor. In Europe it is anyone under 18. In the UK it is anyone under 16, meaning you can’t sign a professional contract in Europe till you are 18, while in the UK it is 16. Most academys in Europe will sign players on an academy contract till they are 16, and then assess them and sign them to a further deal that would take them up to 18 if they are any good (as far as I can attain from my limited knowledge of French). Obviously if the player is any good they don’t sign on for the French 2nd division team and their agents orchestrate a move elsewhere. All the big teams will have scouted them already.
The problem lies with mainland Europes law and the Academys only signing players till 16. There are no laws broken in what United have done.
This is not to say I am totally for this system. I would much prefer a system where players aren’t allowed to be transferred or move across borders till the season of their 18th birthday. This way the smaller clubs can raise revenue by selling their better kids at 18, rather than having a panel work out compensation, and United’s academy is full of the best English talent that will be more likely to come through. Obviously this would involve the stupid 2 hour ruling being removed from within the UK academy system.
September 4th, 2009 at 11:37
@Traverse: Thanks for your response. So obviously a loan can have a recall to the parent club at any time if its in the deal? Sounds like what has happened with Possebon, but wether he is coming back for sure is still to be confirmed but sounds likely.
I agree with all you say about Pogba, and I can’t see United having anything to answer for. It appears alot of people are making too much out of the Pogba scenario after what happened to Chelsea.
September 4th, 2009 at 12:12
@Traverse: Le Havre insist they do have a pre contract agreement signed by the player and his parents. They insist they contacted Man United and spoke to Brian McClair academy director. So what info you got Trav to the contrary of this. United are insisting they went by FIFA rules, and have no case to answer???
September 4th, 2009 at 12:29
@Footy4Eddy: I don’t really understand why everybody have this impression that Anderson don’t work hard in training. I mean, it was newspaper rumours, nothing’s been confirmed. As far as I know, there were 2 sides to the story floating around, but people stick the the “Anderson don’t want to work hard” one.
Regardless, I say, use him properly, show confidence in him and he WILL work hard for you. It’s a no-brainer really.
It’s a pity I missed the reserves match, but I’m glad some other people could start to see what we noticed in Andy. He just has that something in him. Something dying to get out. Sure he’s still a very rough diamond, but a diamond he is nonetheless. (Trust me, I see more in him than what I saw in Ronaldo when I defended him from being a ‘one-trick-pony’). If I were Fergie, I would actually consider building my team around him.
Btw, Stephen… no matter how you try to defend it, our youth development system is currently lacking. Youngsters don’t get enough of a chance. At least not for United. I think they are now more seen as a production line for more quick pennies. “Promote a guy to the first team by giving him the odd game or two, speak highly of him, and then sell him off.” Management is using Fergie’s apparent ‘good at developing youngsters’ tag to sell off the youngsters at good prices. Nothing more than marketing. I mean, you have gifted youngsters like Nani, Anderson, Fabio, Rafael and they can’t even get enough confidence to become regulars. Nevermind the fact that NO player have really graduated from our youth teams to an established first-teamer since the Scholes/Beckham/Neville era. (That was in the early nineties mind you. Almost 20 years ago). This is a scary truth for a club supposedly developing youngsters.
(And no, Fletch, O’Shea and Brown are not yet regular first teamers.)
September 4th, 2009 at 12:45
@Traverse: This talk about pre-contracts makes me wonder. What will happen to Real and the Ronaldo pre-contract?
Surely they have unsettled the player and should also be fined?
September 4th, 2009 at 12:46
@Traverse: Also posted a question for you on the previous thread.
September 4th, 2009 at 12:57
@Karl: Karl a very good question you pose about Ronaldo.
September 4th, 2009 at 14:19
@Karl: There was no pre-contract between madrid and ronaldo.
September 4th, 2009 at 14:19
Wow. Donnibrasco you talk a whole lot of sense from the comments I’ve read so far. Finally someone who sees what I’ve been saying all along. I’ve always supported Anderson and will continue doing so. The manager is the root cause of some of our players’ development. I remember some weeks ago when I was stating the case for Andy as I always do and I highlighted how the manager is a serial destroyer of careers and i got the beating of my life. Suddenly Fletcher is gr8. Well had he been played in the middle all along he’d have been a star 2 seasons ago. Rooney would’ve been untouchable by now. Nani might have won us the CL in Rome as one of the best left wingers around. Berbatov would’ve been the league’s top scorer had he not been played as a CAM by Fergie’s admission. All we see is players failing and calling them crap and fail to look at the whole picture. I’m pretty sure everyone here would fail dismally if we employed you as the head scientist at NASA. You Can’t do what is not natural to you.
September 4th, 2009 at 14:27
@Karl: Spot on about our reserve system. Everyone at the club credits fergie for giving youth a chance and it being our tradition but its actually false.We have become big spenders and as much as we laugh at city,we are no different.
Scenario one,we have Rossi sell him for a sweet,bring in Tevez,nd splash 30 mil on a 27 year old on his last contract.
The Nani and Anderson story is evident.These should be starters but what excuse do we get?They are still young so we must persist with scholes and giggs.Like i said,no player however great can perform well being used in spats.consistency comes with confidence and the other way round but first,one must be given an extended run of games.
Some might argue that we do better than the rest of the top teams in giving youth a chance,but they dont claim to do.we do.
September 4th, 2009 at 14:40
@Karl: Another one who talks sense. I like people who can take a bird’s eye view and actually consider all the factors and then draw a conclusion. Most ppl here are just knee-jerk specialists. Carrick is not United material. Really? The same Carrick who balanced our midfield and was absolutely and undeniably instrumental in our regaining the title and even reaching the semis of the CL in great style. He doesn’t score as much as players like Gerrard. How stupid can one be to wait for someone to point out the obvious that he isn’t the Gerrard type. He plays more like Alonso or Pirlo and I don’t c those tearing the nets regularly.
I hate it when ppl just rant pages and pages of poetic and eloquent melodramatic nonsense. Empty. All the ppl who are bashing our current crop can’t see that the only reason why we’re failing to perform consistently is the fact that our manager is not a competent tactician. I’m not saying he should be sacked. Far from it. I’m saying he should have the support of a competent tactician. Someone who has in depth knowledge of football techniques and tactics. Someone who knows how to make the best use of a player and play him correctly. And give Mike Phelan 20 million pounds and assk him to never return to OT. Politely of course. We are currently like a choir of all the most talented vocalists with sopranos singing as tenors and altos singing baritone. We need a competent conductor to support the boss like CQ did and Mr Phelan is the first to disqualify
September 4th, 2009 at 14:41
@donibrasco: I’m with 100% on this.
What also bugs me somewhat is why we never have a player ‘good enough’ to progress. There’s always the claim ‘he just wasn’t good enough’. Ok, I can accept that, but why can’t we scout kids that are indeed good enough? I can understand the 50mile radius rule, but that should not be seen as a deterent for international kids? Surely, how come everybody always poach a ‘gifted’ player from Barca, or Italy, but no one ever seem to want to poach our youngsters???
I’m not saying it is, but the impression I get from the United youth policy is:
‘Get youngsters that are above average so that we can sell them off and make a profit. The really gifted ones we can leave at their respective clubs until “the time is right”. We’ll then buy them. They will develop better there because we are fighting for all trophies and don’t have time to integrate youngsters into our team properly’.
September 4th, 2009 at 14:50
@Karl: prove first that there was a pre-contract! All we have is unsubstantiated reports of the same… Does anyone has hard copy of the real contract if there was any?
September 4th, 2009 at 14:53
@Jay wire: Who knows, CQ may come back to OT if Portugal don’t make the World Cup.
September 4th, 2009 at 15:02
@Jay wire: I could not agree more with your statements. To me you hit the nail on the head wrt the tactics.
I also get a lot of stick for my ‘negative’ views (whenever you mention something bad about the ‘establishment’ it’s negative), but I don’t really care anymore. It takes all kinds of people to make the world go round, including ‘our’ kind.
September 4th, 2009 at 15:04
Still no news from any of the major English websites regarding Possebon.
September 4th, 2009 at 15:07
@jos: I’m not that interested in Ronaldo to go out and ‘prove’ it.
I Just want mention that I admire Ronaldo for his intuition. The way he ‘just knew’ that Real will make an offer for him and that he would get No.9 is simply amazing. What a visionary. I wish I had that ability
September 4th, 2009 at 15:12
@Grognard: And please don’t rush to call others idiots esp since you usually say empty stuff. Your selective amnesia is unbelievable. Wow. I remember you are the same guy I had an arguement with about Wayne Rooney and you wouldn’t give him the time of day some while ago. “He’s a striker and it’s his job to score. Don’t tell me about his playmaking abilities. Huntelaar is what we need. ” Thank goodness for Capello. I believe if he hadn’t been around and put Rooney where he is now you’ll still be singing the same song coz I’m convinced he is the one who convinced SAF that Rooney is not the new Giggs. You paint Anderson and Carrick and Foster as the most “useless” players you’ve ever seen.. The same useless player who found himself in the most difficult national team to get into. The same player who was a star for Gremio and Porto and his country’s youth team all under the age of 17. Same player who was tipped as the next big thing to come out of Brazilian football and was heavily courted by Barca with Rikjaard’s own admission. Don’t get me started on Carrick.
First start making sense yourself before you can qualify to call others names. Try by looking at the history and chronological events and I don’t mean your famous rants on World War 2. Not that way back
September 4th, 2009 at 15:21
@Karl: I believe the reason we loaned him back to Partizan till January 2010 is that we can’t bring him over till he’s 18 (same happened with Da Silvas.. they we’re stuck training in Brazil for a year ). I think it’s to do with work permit applications and lack of senior national team appearances. His 18th birthday is the 27th of this month, meaning he can come over in the next transfer window.
September 4th, 2009 at 15:22
@Karl: If we have the evidence of a pre-contract existing on paper with his signature, not just Real cawing through the press then we would have a case. As no complaint has been made I’d imagine it was all paper talk.
September 4th, 2009 at 15:28
@Craig Mc: The quote coming out of United “It is complete nonsense, everything has been done within UEFA guidelines.” is what leads me to believe they don’t have a case.
We have signed many many young players from clubs who don’t want them to leave, so I’d imagine we know the relevant rules and regulations intrinsically.
September 4th, 2009 at 15:28
@Craig Mc: The quote coming out of United “It is complete nonsense, everything has been done within UEFA guidelines.” is what leads me to believe they don’t have a case. We wouldn’t make such a bold claim without having looked in to it..
We have signed many many young players from clubs who don’t want them to leave, so I’d imagine we know the relevant rules and regulations intrinsically. If we have circumvented the rules then we deserve what’s coming, frankly.
It would be a note that this Chelsea case took 2 years to come to fruition, so next summer I’d stock up if I were Fergie!
September 4th, 2009 at 15:35
FIFA confirm today no complaint has ever been made by the French club over Pogba.
Also CAS confirm any Chelsea appeal will be heard and decided upon by Christmas.
September 4th, 2009 at 15:37
@cam: “There has been no receipt of any complaint by Le Havre regarding this player as of today.”
I think they are just chancing it after the Chelsea case. United are pretty confident there is no case.
September 4th, 2009 at 15:42
@Traverse: Yeah if Le Havre were to make a big case about it now they would just be jumping on the bandwagon, along with maybe some other clubs who feel like they may have been wronged in the past.
Surely all transfers should just be ratified by FIFA as legit at the very time they are done to ensure problems and distractions like this can’t crop up months or years later.
September 4th, 2009 at 16:12
@NicoQB: just coz he’s British. we all know the favours the british lads get from SAF. i know this will offend many but let’s face it. Its a fact, when the Gibbos start to seem to be better than Ando not by what they do on the pitch but by what we are told and read.
I guess you all have realised that ever since Ronaldo left, when Fletch isn’t on the pitch, no midfileder does those bust runs with the ball to bridge the gap between our strikers and the midfield except Ando, and that’s why you always see Rooney and Berba dropping deep to pick them balls.
September 4th, 2009 at 16:16
I personally feel we have been watched far too closely for far too long by FIFA and UEFA to do something so fundamentally stupid as chelsea did. They have been after us for years and are only looking for the slightest excuse to give us a good kicking so the club uses lawyers that are the best in the business because we know Sepp and his homies are just waiting in the shadows.
September 4th, 2009 at 16:18
@Traverse: Thanks. It explains a lot. BUT, how does it work for United to sign a 16y/o Italian striker? Same with Fabregas (Arsenal). What about Macheda, Petrucci, Ekram, Possenbon, and the other mulit-nationals in the academy? Most of which were signed before turning 18.
September 4th, 2009 at 16:33
@Karl: Karl I have a feeling one reason quality players are bought that early is so that they can hopefully come into the CL B List or additional list before they turn 21 and been at the club at least 2 years freeing up other spots for more experienced players in the A list. All clubs have to have at least 8 club/association trained players in their A list as well. Also I’m sure the younger a player is that may mean a lesser transfer cost, and that is where the scouts really earn their money.
September 4th, 2009 at 16:51
@Stephen: It’s one thing for them to be with the club in coaching capacities, it’s yet another thing to have them still playing and taking away valuable playing time from the younger players. As for coaching, it amazes me how little Nani and Anderson especially have learned from the likes of Scholes and Giggs. It’s taken Nani forever to figure out what Fergie wants from him and Anderson still doesn’t get it. If Giggs and Scholes were so good in coaching and mentoring young players, I really feel these young players would be way ahead of the curve.
I especially point to the poor finishing and lack of composure shown by Anderson. Scholes in his hey day was a terrific striker and finisher of the ball and he always did this with great composure, never panicking. So is he useless at teaching these traits to others or is Anderson just that frakken stupid? Either way, these old players have stood in the way of the young players on this club for way too long and it’s time for them to say goodbye. In my comments I am only performing a function Fergie should have performed in real life two years ago.
September 4th, 2009 at 16:51
@Jay wire: I was the head scientist at NASA you know – I was very good at the ole quote – “Houston we have a problem.”
.
September 4th, 2009 at 17:07
@Traverse: It really does not matter what has occurred or even if United has done everything above board. FIFA and UEFA are going on a witch hunt and are intentionally trying to make some big clubs in England pay for their raiding of young players.
I firmly believe this is nothing more than a calculated ploy by them to force clubs like us to stop raiding and raping other countries of their teenage talent. The governing bodies are doing this by manufacturing mysterious case against Chelsea and thus starting the hunt by getting all teams that have been done in by big clubs to formally file complaints. It costs them nothing to ban teams and base it on accusations and spotty evidence. They will come after United too over Pogba and I wouldn’t be surprised if Lazio also file regarding Macheda etc.
The worst that can happen is that it will cost Chelsea and possibly us millions to go fight them in court. The teams could win in court because I personally feel that UEFA is playing a game here trying to force clubs to cease doing this kind of business. They know they haven’t got the legal power to stop a club from going after teens in other countries as it is not breaking any international labor laws or laws regarding ethics. My God, they are offering these kids jobs with pay, which is what Lazio and Le Havre etc are not able to do because of their countries protection rights when it comes to kids under 17.
UEFA is willing to see these clubs spend a pretty penny fighting these charges in court. It gets them pissed off and it inconveniences them. And they also feel probably that these clubs are stupid enough to just sit and take a punishment or banning without putting up a fight.
As for Chelsea, I am not so sure they are smart enough to fight this setup. Even if they broke rules, I’d like to see what those rules are and see the evidence. I seriously do not trust anything FIFA or UEFA do as I feel with all my heart that it is part of a specific agenda by these governing bodies to damage the British game and to destroy the monopoly of the big 5 teams in England. Trust me, they have just begun with Chelsea. We are next as are Shitty, Arsenal and others. The question is, do they really have a legally binding case that could stick in a court in the Hague? A seriously doubt it. So it’s up to the teams to either sit and take their upcoming punishments, or be aggressive and fight them. I say fight.
September 4th, 2009 at 17:10
@Karl: Rio Ferdinand when being interviewed by MUTV also said that Anderson was the team’s worst practice player as he never worked hard and always used the excuse he was saving it for game day. So it comes from one of our senior players as well. I think that’s proof enough.
September 4th, 2009 at 17:17
@Karl: That IS BLATENTLY NOT TRUE MATE! Rio confirmed on Red Cafe MUTV that Andi messed about and was the worst trainer of the 1st team. Anderson himself admitted that SAF was not happy and wanted more effort from him. Andi said that in PERSONAL interview he gave to Daily Mail. So its def true mate
.
September 4th, 2009 at 17:18
@Grognard: Well, it kinda does matter. If we HAVE broken the rules regarding transfers, we get a 2 year ban and all that goes with it. If we HAVEN’T (which the evidence of our comments and Le Harve’s inability to bring a case to FIFA suggests) then FIFA can accuse and levy all they like, but it will get fought to the bitter end, and won’t cost us a penny cause FIFA will have to pick up court costs
Also, our head lawyers is the guy who won the Bosman case. I think we are in safe hands.
September 4th, 2009 at 17:26
@Karl: You are not getting it mate. Like I wrote earlier, this is a well directed witch hunt. This is not about laws and rules being broken, this is not about fair play and ethics. This is about destroying the financially monopoly of teams like Man City, Chelsea and Man Utd as well as teams like Arsenal too who have an allure for young players and who the governing bodies would like to stifle.
UEFA and FIFA have always preferred the best of the best young players to play in Spain and Italy and if they won’t play there, then to stay in their own countries. They do no like nor do they want to tolerate the policies of the elite British clubs that are mostly foreign owned and who work and operate on a massive debt. They want to basically destroy those team’s way of operating and looking for little violations or trying to concoct violations to slow them down is what they are all about.
It’s not about guilt or wrong doing by Chelsea, it’s the start of a campaign to stop our clubs from raiding Italy, France, Spain and Brazil of it’s under 18’s because those countries laws do not allow those players to sign financial contracts with clubs. It’s easier for UEFA and FIFA to go after specified teams and charge them with this and that than it is for those bodies to try to get entire nations to alter their labor laws to accommodate teenage boys in football.
I honestly believe that if Chelsea were to take this to the international courts in the Hague, they would probably be exonerated and found innocent of wrong doing. The same would go for United and Arsenal for the way they have gone after young players from abroad. But this is a calculated game and gamble concocted by Sir’s Blatter and Platini to force these teams to stop their plundering of young foreign talent. UEFA and FIFA are not exclusive societies that do not have to abide by labor laws. They do, but they will still try to make up their own rules and it depends on the clubs to either adhere to them or spend millions to fight them in court. This is a bluff that may work for UEFA because Chelsea are run by idiots and DP’s who have no concept of law and and how to fight it. I firmly believe that and that is why they were the first target and not United. United is much smarter and far more savvy an organization and i think they would be a harder beast to tame and to beat should they be forced into a court. I mean seriously, would any of us trust a black market mafioso like Roman Abramovich or a snake like Peter Kenyon? And yet my gut tells me they are innocent of any wrong doing here because I feel they are being set up and being made an example of to stop other clubs from these practices.
So you can bring up questions about Madrid and Ronaldo, but it’s really not about them and the rules they break. They are immune. It’s about destroying the English teams that work with a debt hanging over them.
September 4th, 2009 at 17:33
@Jay wire: I feel it is you who is acting like a knee jerk specialist mate and who is jumping to conclusions. Although I like Carrick, I have said for two years now that he leaves a lot to be desired and although he does a credible job for us, he does not offer us the kind of player we need at that position and in a consistent enough manner.
I hardly feel saying this over and over for two years falls into the category of knee jerk. I also know of others on this site who feel the same way and I cannot say that they are all following me as they see what I see as well. It’s fine to disagree with people on this site but labeling them or accusing of something that is wrong and unfair is hardly debating. So you disagree with us, that is your prerogative, but to accuse others who do not agree with you as being knee jerk specialists is showing them a great disrespect and basically accusing them of no intelligence or ability to judge player talent. I think you are being very unfair indeed.
September 4th, 2009 at 17:48
@Karl: First of all, our scouting isn’t that great. Al ot of the great players wh have had were bought after we played against them and Fergie saw them first hand. Examples of that, Cantona, Keane and Ronaldo. Our scouting has improved greatly over the past couple of years and has actually branched out more. But money has a lot to do with our success. We are trying to create a presence in South America where clubs like Madrid and Barcelona as well as other clubs from Spain, Portugal and Italy have had a long roots planted fro many years. It’s hard to beat the big Spanish clubs to super talents because of their tentacles running long and their connections not to mention their money.
Still, we are improving. I think we have presently added some very strong talent to our stable from Brazil, Serbia and other countries like Italy. How these players progress after we have bought them has everything to do with our coaches. So far Ole Gunnar Solksjaer has done a fantastic job bringing out the best on the reserve team. But when some of these players make it to the big club, that doesn’t always happen. Certainly Rafael has been great and I love what I am seeing from De Laet, Fabio, Gibson, Macheda and a few others. I have very little confidence in Mike Phelan and Fergie is pretty removed from the day to day workouts so I would lay any blame on Phelan and on the players themselves not handling the pressure well. Some just need to mature and many need to mature as well as be given more of an opportunity to perform at the highest level. Players like Welbeck will never amount to anything unless they get a long run out with the big club. But I just don’t see that happening now because Macheda has caught Fergie’s eye and his big goal has glamorized him and made him a very popular player with both the Boss and the fans.
Make no mistake, it’s tough for young talent to break in with a big club. If I was the son of a great young player I would never let him sign with a big club. Why? It’s about getting playing time at the highest level. Players like Ronaldo, Nani and Obertan at least got to play with smaller clubs before they came to United. They were bloodied before they showed up at OT and that helped in their progress. But for kids like Gibson, Macheda, the Da Silva twins, Poseebon, Petrucci etc, it is tough because they never have had the time to play with a lesser club at a high level and to learn from that. Therefore I’d say to my son, sign with Wolves or with Borussia Moenchengladbach and get a chance to play and then when you have shown something, trust me, the big teams will come a calling and you will have a choice as to who you want to play for.
September 4th, 2009 at 18:02
@Jay wire: You had an argument with me about Rooney?
Seriously, I have no recollection of such an argument. I have always advocated that we buy a striker like Huntelaar but not so that Rooney ends up on the bench. He is a true CF where Huntelaar is a striker. It would be a great partnership.
As for the idiot comment, sorry about that but your comment left me shaking my head. Secondly, I am not getting into any argument mate because frankly you aren’t worth the effort. You are trying to pigeonhole me and accuse me of utter nonsense while calling me an idiot yourself when most everyone on this blog knows what I offer is usually very intelligent albeit controversial. You aren’t capable of getting in a debate with me over players like Anderson, Carrick and Foster because you lack the skill and the knowledge to defeat me, so stop barking up a tree you can’t climb. Now get back on your little pony and piss off. I may have started this little fracas because I called you an idiot but then again, what you had to say fit the crime. If you want to get into it with me, next time replace the butter knife you have and come prepared to a gunfight.
You aren’t debating me, you are just antagonizing. Typical banter for unarmed men. Ammunition man, come with ammunition, not insults.
September 4th, 2009 at 18:07
@Jay Jay: Yet more BS. How about Ronaldo, Rafael, Nani and others who have gotten more than a fair shot at making the team. Hell, if anyone got favorable treatment on this club it was Ronaldo. As for our Brits, Beckham and Keano could tell you some not to favorable stories about unfair treatment by the boss. He has his favorites but i seriously doubt it has ever been race motivated. He favors those who excel. Ferguson is not a racist and to accuse him of it is ludicrous.
September 4th, 2009 at 18:09
See part ‘X’ (part 10) in this CL file – Player Regulations:-
http://www.uefa.com/MultimediaFiles/Download/Regulations/competitions/UCL/84/52/77/845277_DOWNLOAD.pdf
The CL player A and B lists rules are a big factor in the CL clubs going after such young talent so relentlessly on a regular basis.
September 4th, 2009 at 18:13
@Traverse: Picking up court costs doesn’t really apply to big international labor cases as such. Yes they would pick up somethingbut trust me, it would still cost the team a lot and frankly, UEFA nad FIFA are playing a bluff and seeing who blinks. They literally have no ground to stand on and so they are playing the roll of the bully, hoping that Chelsea blink and take the punishment. If they do, it sends the message and creates a precedent. Trust me, there is a reason they went after Chelsea first. That club is littered with incompetency in it’s front office as well as corruption. Peter Kenyon!!!! Enough said. And Roman never made his billions in Russia by honorable hard working means, if you get my meaning. If there is a team with something to hide, it is them and so UEFA knew exactly who to target to get their precedent.
September 4th, 2009 at 19:24
@Jay Jay: Calling Fergie a racist is a fucking disgrace, call yourself a fan you should be ashamed.
September 4th, 2009 at 19:39
@Karl: Mate I really like you bro but you view every post with Anderson tinted glasses, everyone knows how Anderson trains, his love for nightlife and his love for woman of the night, which do him no favours.
September 4th, 2009 at 19:39
@Jay Jay: Gibbo’s Irish first of all. Secondly, that argument makes no sense considering the amount of foreigners we are stockpiling these days.
September 4th, 2009 at 19:46
@Jay Jay: I stopped reading after “just coz hes british.”
I didnt know france was apart of britain
September 4th, 2009 at 19:48
@Red Ranter: And he is Scottish, any true Scotsman would never play an Englishman, never mind sign one, that comment was an embarrassment, by the way we are a British club by the way..
September 4th, 2009 at 19:51
@Dan: He is a mug, I find comments like that fucking stupid and having no idea what our club is about.
September 4th, 2009 at 19:54
@Stephen: Meh, i just tell them what i think of them most of the time. You should try it, its fun
September 4th, 2009 at 20:07
@Dan: Spot on bro
September 4th, 2009 at 21:04
haha… some folks on here never cease to amaze!!
Now Fergie is racially motivated in his squad selection/recruitment!? Well, that might explain the mass influx of foreign youth into our club or the fact that of all our youngsters, it’s the foreign ones that are getting more of a chance (Rafael, Fabio, Macheda).
Btw Dan, that was just priceless calling jay jay out on the “cuz he’s british” mumbo jumbo.
Just shows there was no reasoning to his/her argument. 
Also, all those talking about our poor youth development/recruitment, please mention three other ‘Top’ clubs apart from Arsenal and Barca that do it better!! Always a case of ‘the grass is greener elsewhere’ for plenty of the cynicists on here.. don’t know why they don’t support those teams
September 4th, 2009 at 21:30
Btw Karl, i’m sure almost everyone on here (apart from Groggy
) loves Anderson and want to see him succeed, including Fergie, believe it or not 
. The facts about his poor training and life outside OT are not complete bullshit as there is never smoke without fire. I’m sure you know this even if your love for him will prevent you from admitting it. 
I believe Andy’s positioning is not his problem, it’s his application and game intelligence. For Brazil in the Olympics last year he played in central midfield, believe it or not, as a box-to-box midfielder, like he does for United and even scored a goal!! The difference was his willingness to move forward and engage in play, something which he did in the game last night but he never does for the first team. I believe it is a confidence thing. He was confident on the pitch last night and at the olympics, maybe because he knew he was superior or maybe it was because the spotlights of OT were not on him, who knows, but he shirks whenever he plays for the 1st team.
However, if he practiced hard in training, he should be confident in his ability because he mentally knows he has worked hard on them and maybe even improved on them and will be keen to show them off. This is something I think Fergie has picked up on and criticised him for. Like it or not, his positioning is perfect for his physical as well as technical ability. It’s up to him to get that conditioning needed for a box-to-box midfielder instead of tiring out on the 60-min mark everytime. Plus, he needs to learn how to control the tempo of a game, when to slow it down and when to speed it up. Also, he shouldn’t be afraid of venturing into the box from time to time; I mean, Fletch plays deeper than him but he is regularly in and around the penalty area and has got some vital goals for us doing just that.
At the end of the day, I would say his success/failure is in his own hands. Last season he even got more crucial and important game time than lil’ man Nani, so it’s not a case of Fergie being biased against him. He needs to adapt and step up. United is not a team where you rest on your laurels. Ferguson loves hard-workers, something which Nani has learned and the reason he loved Ronaldo so much, because, if not for Ronnie’s dedication to the improvement of his game, Fergie would have kicked him out long time ago for all his negative media-inducing antics.
We all love Ando matey and want to see him succeed but blaming Fergie and whoever else for Ando lack of improvement is futile when the player is the one we should be looking at. Maybe a stint in Fergie’s dog-house would do him good as it seemed to have done lil’ man Nani
September 4th, 2009 at 21:49
@Gabriel: Mate I hope all fans want every player to succeed and Grog is no different he wants him to be a top United player, but be honest boys he HAS NOT PLAYED WELL ENOUGH!!!
The issue with Anderson it is not the managers fault, United’s it is the the players fault, simple.
September 4th, 2009 at 21:59
@Grognard: But Chelsea seem to have broken the rules where we have not. Chelsea probably did it expecting a fine, which they could afford 10 fold. I am extremely confident that nothing will come of the Pogba deal, or any of our other dealings for that matter. Chelsea seem to have acted like the school bully, going around taking what they want and to hell with the consequences. We can not afford (literally do not have the money) to make these mistakes.
That being said, UEFA/FIFA have a raging hardon for going after the Premier League.
September 4th, 2009 at 22:18
@Stephen:
I know Grog means well towards andy, it’s just the constant ribbing he gives the lad is too hilarious!! 
I was in stitches earlier when he said something about andy ’swingin his big arse round’ 
too funny!! 
I share your sentiments on Andy a bit mate, he does need to mentally get in the zone and realise this is his career and he needs to take control. All these talk about his lax training and wild social life won’t have bothered me if he even showed any significant improvement in his shooting and general composure. That just proves he is not dedicated enough to improving his game.
The good thing is Fergie is concerned enough to criticise him and punish him for it. If he didn’t care, he would just sell the lad. That’s why all these talk about Fergie mistreating him is bull. Look at how Fergie speaks of Nani now, who would have thought it was the same Nani that was in his ‘Leper Colony’ (©Craig Mc
) last season?? Ando has a lot to prove to himself, Fergie and his fans this season. I’m just happy he took a step in the right direction by performing excellently last night, be it in the reserves. 
September 4th, 2009 at 22:35
@Gabriel: Difference is though, Nani did nothing wrong in his 1st season to warrant being left out last season. When he was in the team he contributed, and anybody who watches the end of season review cd dvd for that season, AND IS HONEST, will not be able to deny that! So I do blame the club for leper colonising where leper colonising was NOT DUE in Nani’s case.
As for Andi, he has the same amount of Craigmeister backing now, as Nani, and that means plenty of fight and attitude in support for him
. From what I saw last night he has it in him in ABUNDANCE, and I think with knuckling down he will prove it! 
.
September 4th, 2009 at 22:43
@Grognard: I think FIFA do have grounds for this punishment after having read the rules. Chelsea seem to have clearly broken rules specified in the rulebook. I’ll quote :
4. In addition to the obligation to pay compensation, sporting sanctions shall be imposed on any club found to be in breach of contract or found to be inducing a breach of contract during the protected period. It shall be presumed, unless established to the contrary, that any club signing a professional who has terminated his contract without just cause has induced that professional to commit a breach. The club shall be banned from registering any new players, either nationally or internationally, for two registration periods.
Those of you who have the time, and I’m sure a lot of you do, read this pdf [Pages 17 and 18 -- it's not too bad, unlike many other rulebooks.]
September 4th, 2009 at 22:43
@Stephen: Ando has a regular GF now though Stephen
September 4th, 2009 at 22:46
@Red Ranter: So WTF does this leave Man Pity and all the muppets they have blatantly induced to break contract???
September 4th, 2009 at 22:48
@Craig Mc: Mate, I was surprised at his constant bench-warming too mate but you have to admit there must have been something that turned Fergie off him for a bit. The harsh treatment seemed to have worked a bit tho because all those negative aspects of his game from even season one seemed to have disappeared. What this means is that Nani has worked hard in training/gym on improving his game, something he wasn’t doing in his first year or thru the games he played last year.
However you look at it, Nani has become a better player now that he seems more mature and aware of his responsibility towards the team. The lad was providing cover for skinned sausage for pete’s sake. I am looking forward to the pair of them terrorising right back’s the league over this season.
September 4th, 2009 at 22:49
@Stephen: Fergie being a racist working in England and favoring Scots is about as absurd as Jews working at Gestapo Headquarters. One does not take a job in football with a racist heart. If he hates English, he would have stayed in Scotland, and if he favors Brits over the rest of the world, I would never guess it from the enthusiasm he shows and the chances he gives those from other countries. It’s me who’s partially racist who would never give and Italian the time of day in football and who would make sure no black players were ever allowed to wear braids, corn rows or whatever that abomination is on top of Anderson’s head.
September 4th, 2009 at 22:51
@Gabriel: There is no reasoning with those who can’t reason mate. It’s a futile hope.
September 4th, 2009 at 22:54
@Gabriel: WHOA THERE MATE!
Hang on there. I may not be an Anderson fan because of what he has and hasn’t done for us up to now but I don hate him and I as much as anyone on here wants to see him succeed because if he does, it helps the team. I would think after the hundreds and hundreds if not thousands of posts I have written on this site, you and others would know that I am harsh but I am fair and I only wish the best for the team and all it’s players………………….Except Foster. 
Hey look, I’m not perfect. 
September 4th, 2009 at 22:55
@Stephen: Well said mate, well said.
September 4th, 2009 at 23:02
@Traverse: All rules that are broken are defined and have specific penalties predetermined. Therefore, if Chelsea knew they were breaking a rule, they should also then know the punishment for breaking it. To throw a stiff penalty on them without warning them or giving them some kind of caution is not playing fair and it’s baiting in a the most classic of cases. This is a case of entrapment which of course in law is not permissible. How is someone supposed to know he or she is breaking the law unless the law is clearly written in the rule book and an explanation is given for punishment in such cases.
In Major league Baseball players know the rules about steroid use. They also know the penalty for breaking the rules. Did Chelsea know they were breaking a law? I don’t know. Did they know that if caught they would get such a ban? I seriously doubt it. Therefore, in a court of law, it would be thrown out as entrapment and a league or association not clearly indicating their rules and laws to their members and not sufficiently explaining the penalties for such breaches in the rules. I have taken enough legal courses in my day to know that Chelsea have a strong case to fight this in the courts and if they do not appeal, it’s not because they are guilty, it’s because they are stupid. And i do not think they are stupid….except for Peter Kenyon of course.
September 4th, 2009 at 23:04
@Craig Mc: Players like Gareth Barry, Lescott haven’t broken a contract. They were paid transfer fees for it agreed mutually between clubs. Completely different things.
September 4th, 2009 at 23:07
@Gabriel: I’m glad you see the humor in some of the things I write. I’m often taken so seriously and made to come across as an old grouch or ogre which I am, but I still don’t like being told I am.
Next time you watch Anderson when he has the ball, watch how he goes about protecting it from opponents. H spreads his arms out and sticks his butt out….way out and then turns clockwise or counter clockwise using his ass for protection. It’s hilarious. It reminds me of basketball centers in the key who get the ball and who have to protect and so they stick their butts out and pivot on one foot. He also looks like a center preparing for a rebound. Just sticks that big toilet out and getting by him is not that easy because he is a wide body for a footballer.
September 4th, 2009 at 23:11
@Red Ranter: Fair enough. Thanks for the info there RR. Very clear and a description of the penalty is also part of the rule. Now it makes me ask the question, was Chelsea aware that the player had broken his contract with the other club? Why any team should be seen as guilty if a player unbeknown to them decides to break a contract is beyond me. It’s the player who is at fault here and the people or family that are representing him. Confusing but still, I think Chelsea should fight this because I think there is a little gray area here that isn’t very clear. Thanks for that information though. It helped a lot.
And thanks for the pdf link too. Should be interesting reading.
September 4th, 2009 at 23:15
@Grognard: If Chelsea claim innocence over this rule they don’t have a chance. It will be plain stupidity. However, I will ask only one question: how does Lens (the club that complained) have an evidence that Chelsea clearly induced Kakuta from breaking his contract and moving to Chelsea; was it an email Chelsea sent to Kakuta; was it a pill they injected into Kakuta causing him to change his mind; or did Chelsea call Merlin the magician to cast a spell on Kakuta, and crucially, did Lens get this act on tape or something.
I have a couple more concerns, and I think I will be better if I articulate them in a separate article.
September 4th, 2009 at 23:24
I just noticed i didnt say anything about the anderson goal yestergame(that could be a word you know!):
It pissed me off that when anderson scores and has a great performance, everyone makes a big deal out of it(Im talking united fans in general, not just rants).
When lads like james or eikrem have great games on a consistent bases for the reserves, nothing.
If you want to look at blatant favouritism to foreign lads, look no further then yesterday.
September 4th, 2009 at 23:26
@Gabriel: Okay here’s what I think, and if folk get injured from not wearing a flak jacket – then please remember I am not attacking anybody personally!
Nani was one of a group of ONLY FOUR players who stayed behind every day to work on his game, with Ronaldo being obviously another one. So he did work hard even in his first season Gabriel! I know that is A FACT, because SAF said so on MUTV.
I do not go along with SUBSTITUTING hard graft for TALENT & DYNAMIC FLAIR. When Nani did his SHOWBOATING against Le Arse, now I was enchanted, I call that feckin entertainment to the highest degree mate. That it was discouraged out of his game, because well, he was embarrassing the opposition with his artistry, is a diabolical shame to my mind. Players need to get themselves in prime condition by right work ethic for one reason as far as I am concerned, and that is to keep up their LEVEL of performance for 90 minutes, or extra half hour! It should never be to sacrifice their great inate artistry with a football. However I would agree that the artistry has its place, but should only be used to benefit the team, and not to the teams detriment. I was very turned on by Nani’s showboating, because we were like 3 goals up or something at the time, if my memory serves me right! Deny this kind of wonderful flair and ability from a players game, and we have a team of UNIFIT robots!
Now the really controversial part of this comment. You all know how much I support SAF, but I will offer this as the reason that Nani was left out in the leper colony last year. Nani was made the scapegoat, because he is a lad that will not backmouth and rock the boat. He loves Man Utd and didn’t want to leave, but it HURT THE LAD being frozen out. The reason he became scapegoat was nothing to do with performance, because he was bloody great in all the cup games, the only games that SAF played him in really. SAF did this FOR ONE REASON. HE HAD BOUGHT BERBA, and having paid so much dough, he had to play him. However though Berba was a great player, he did not fit in as part of the jigsaw, and to fit him in, SAF had to put other parts of the jigsaw in unnatural position, where they too didn’t fit. He couldn’t leave out Rooney, Berba or Ronnie, even though they didn’t fit together without displacing one of them – square peg round hole. To do that he had to leave some poor patsy out, and Lil man was that patsy. To me it was grossly unfair, but that was the only reason Nani was left out, and nobody will ever convince me otherwise.
Nani should never have been discouraged to express his natural flair for great football, AND NEITHER SHOULD ANDI. I saw that last night.
Viva Nani, Viva Andi –
.
September 4th, 2009 at 23:27
@Grognard: C
ane rows grog, cane rows, not corn!September 4th, 2009 at 23:35
@Dan: I watch and support the reserves and youth regularly Dan. But not a single one of them has ever stood out has been so totally SUPERIOR and OUTCLASSING the opposition than Anderson did last night! Eikrem etc etc etc are going to be good players, but they cannot, and did not do what Anderson did and was able to excel in doing last night. Andi stood out like a MAGICIAN, a WIZARD against lesser mortals. Yet I believe many of our youth will develop to have similar effect and quality in time as they continue to develop!
September 4th, 2009 at 23:53
@Dan: But Eikrem is also foreign. And actually apart from recent opinion, Ben Foster was hailed the next great thing by the media and fans alike during his time at Watford and before he kept injuring himself.
Secondly, Anderson is a first teamer and hence, he is in the spotlight. The fact that he scored a goal became news says a lot about him than anything.
Also the bar of expectations for English players is significantly lower because, let’s face it, you see great defenders and grafters coming out of academies in England and not too many technically gifted ones. I would be hard pressed to find an English central midfielder as technically gifted and elegant as Paul Scholes produced in the last ten years.
Whenever we sign foreign players it enchants the hell out of fans because they are in the, often misguided, notion that they are going to see the next Francesco Totti, or Ronaldinho. Although it may not be true. However, a lot of them, more likely than not, have the basic technical superiority but not the physicality.
September 5th, 2009 at 0:33
Since I’m pretty sure you’re all bored…
Zidane Junior
moves just like his dad
And this… great technique, though looks a tad less direct than our own Rhain Davis…
How old is Rhain again?
September 5th, 2009 at 1:30
@Red Ranter: The contract he signed for Chelsea is dated at a time he would have been 15. His contract with the French side ran until he was 16. The two contracts are the evidence.
September 5th, 2009 at 1:32
@Grognard: The rule book is there. This is why clubs hire teams of very expensive lawyers, to go through the rule books and find loopholes for things they want to circumvent, and to cover their own asses with other things.
Ignorance of the law does not excuse you from it.
Further more on our problem with Le Harve, United are yet to sign the player to any contract, meaning it is impossible for Le Hrave to have or prove a case.
September 5th, 2009 at 1:43
@Craig Mc: Craig, there’s no doubting that Nani is a wonderful talent, but talent alone doesn’t make for a successful pro-player.
You can tell, when you watch the lad, that he just oozes the potential to be one the greats, and when you look up and down his game, there’s really not that many flaws. But the problem is, that overall, he hasn’t added up to the sum of his individual parts. In a nut-shell his impact upon a game doesn’t do his talent credit!
We’ve all seen him score great goals, and make some mind-boggling runs, but in next instance he makes a bonehead decision, or gives the ball away needlessly, or dives theatrically (usually at the feet of the ref) and then all the good/great becomes negated by the poor/bad.
IF SAF froze him out last year it was to make a firm point to him that he needs to round out his performances and to not expect a starting role until he does.
With that said, we did have Ronaldo last year, and SAF could afford the luxury of that form of discipline!!
September 5th, 2009 at 1:56
@Traverse: It’s just incredible that Chelsea could do such a blatantly stupid act. If this holds up, some heads are gonna roll, namely Kenyon!!
September 5th, 2009 at 2:08
@Craig Mc: I’ve always thought you needed an Avatar mate. And seeings it’s Friday night and I expect you’re in good humor, I thought you might be able to use this one
September 5th, 2009 at 2:47
So now Ronaldo has gone, SAF deems fit to condemn the act of diving!! What the F***.
Last season Ronnie was snorkeling about as bad as I’ve seen in recent years – with SAF defending each feint and swoon, but now the “matchstick man” gets himself a penalty, he’s calling for tough measures to combat such unfairness!
Sometimes I just wonder what all this banter is about – surely not a genuine gesture to rid the game of such scandalous cheating – and surely not to align himself with the governing parties – and please, surely not to aggrieve the likes of “Le Pousseur” over again
Could it be that he just wants to divert attention to himself, away from other matters?? Being the chrysalis of unselfish management, allowing the crosshairs of the English Press to focus more acutely on his folly and not the obvious questions being asked about the team?
September 5th, 2009 at 6:55
Chelsea will lose the case at CAS and so Roman Ab will have to waste his money on something else for the next year or so.
United will be OK.
September 5th, 2009 at 9:14
Actually the point about foreign players being hyped over the English is baseless,and need i say its the other way round?When you hear the hype sorrounding Rooney and you actually watch him play,its different.A good player but nothing special compared to the Drogbas,Adebayors and Torres in no particular order.Not saying they are far better but he gets more hype yet for a top four striker who has been at the club for 5 years playing 90 mins whenever fit,has never challenged for the top scorer’s boot and when you talk about his other attributes these others posess in abundance.Move on to David becks.need i say more?
Theo walcott at Arsenal,has got to be the biggest of all.Eboue has more end product than him but when you look at the hype,i mean bar the pace what does theo posess? and so many more
September 5th, 2009 at 9:19
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKww5s_o4pY Ljajic can hit a good strike. Good physique aswell.
September 5th, 2009 at 11:00
@Redrich:
, I am so much more younger Bro, and that Ugly mutt seems more yours or Grogs age. You should have put the baby chimp up if you wanted to be more accurate – cos that Papa ape IS TOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OLD! Course you being old and all Rich, your eyesight must be poor – right? 
September 5th, 2009 at 11:06
@Redrich: Quoting Grog’s words – Your wrong mate, you are always wrong, you always will be about lil man!
. What I said about the reasons he was left out were true 
. Nothing to do with discipline, more to do with Berba, and shuffling the jig saw pieces to save Fergie’s red facedness about his misfit 30 million buy.
September 5th, 2009 at 11:06
@donibrasco:
1st, drogbas stats is comparable to rooneys
2nd, adebayor only had 1 good season with arsenal
3rd, torres is the best striker in the world, you cant put him in that list.
You really, really dont like rooney.
Fact is, possebon is an excellent example of foreign players getting hyped up more then english players. When he came, people thought he was the next big thing, a “mouth watering prospect” ive heard him be called.
Look where he is now, and look where, say, gibson is now.
September 5th, 2009 at 11:15
@Taehr: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ymn6s5ncEx8
Thats from a few days ago.
He looks excellent towards the end.
September 5th, 2009 at 11:57
Dan your general point about overhyping foreigners does hold. But the Possebon example doesn’t stand up.
No-one on here or even in the papers has ever tipped Possebon for the big time. His transfer barely got a mention. The papers rarely mention his name. Even on here where there is a tendency to make a fuss every time a youngster makes a substitute appearance, people just said that Possebon is a tidy player good in possession. Nothing more. I do not think anyone is at all surprised Possebon is still a fringe player.
September 5th, 2009 at 13:48
@colver: Im talking about united fans in general, not just redrants. And ive heard many tip him for big things as if he is the next big thing.
Im just going by what i have personally seen.
September 5th, 2009 at 14:44
I hope VDS comes back fully fit in Oct.
I wonder if Foster will be the definate long term replacement for him when VDS retires or if Sir Alex might try and sign another keeper?
September 5th, 2009 at 15:11
We hav been replorted…
September 5th, 2009 at 18:16
Well – Mr “I don’t dive” Rooney just made a feckin spectacle of himself at Wembley. I am sorry, but that was simulation of the highest degree. Lets see if FIFA are consistent and Rooney is banned for 2 international games – because from what I saw he CONNED the ref, and the ref fell for it. Unless the ref saw something I didn’t see. All the pundits are saying it was never a pen, and Rooney if anything should have been booked, for sticking his foot out to try and make contact with the defender for a pen. Rooney I hope is not becoming Ron No2. That was diabolical – sorry but it was
.
September 5th, 2009 at 18:29
@AndyCR7:
, don’t know about being reported mate – Rooney should be deported from the next two England games, and justice will be done! Rooney deliberately stuck his foot out nowhere near the ball, and did the oppo defender as he really caught him. I think after Fergie’s outbursts about PUNISHING the cheats, SAF will be embarrassed by Rooney who has made SAF look a fool speaking out about dealing with cheats. Rooney cheated today, and I am not going to support that – sorry! It was worse than Eduardo’s.
September 5th, 2009 at 18:51
@Redrich: Sometimes the man’s skewed view of the world does border on hypocrisy. Ronaldo was a compulsive diver but in fairness to him, he was also quite often ignored when he was legitimately fouled. But that’s what you get when you build a reputation for yourself as a diver. For Fergie to condemn others and not his own is nothing new for the Gaffer. It’s just who he is. Lying through his teeth is something I have become very accustomed to.
September 5th, 2009 at 18:57
@Dan: You take the word of fans on the Internet mate? Lets face it, the word of fans and their skill level in judging quality is equal to what they have for intellect. Shit for brains. 90% of the fans out there are shit for brains. Speak to me as I am solidly in that elite 10% who are truly wise and well informed.
September 5th, 2009 at 19:01
@Craig Mc:
I didn’t see it but that is too priceless. Real egg on Fergies face too. It’ll teach both of the hypocrites to better shutup or face a good egging on their faces. 
September 5th, 2009 at 19:14
@Grognard: Yeah Grog, SAF talking about Eduardo saying his two match ban will send out a message
. I am hoping he says the same about his own player, because wait until you see it Grog, it was CHAMPION CON ARTIST and Rooney did the oppo defender in the process and was rewarded with a penalty. If Rooney gets the same as Eduardo, and has to miss 2 important world cup games, and it hurts England, then perhaps someone will tell Rooney in no uncertain terms what a cheat he was today! What’s the betting that the British press won’t make the same hullaballoo because it is Rooney, as they did about Eduardo. Frankly I am appalled. Great player but taking on the Ronaldo role today!!!
September 5th, 2009 at 19:28
@Craig Mc: Right Craig, that’s why I miss all that Nani stuff mate!
Save the pic, though, because it’s you in 20 years.
September 5th, 2009 at 19:55
@Redrich:
, the Missus says to tell you, the day I ever have hair on my body, is the day SHE BELIEVES IN MIRACLES 
. Honestly, I am getting shot at from all angles today 
.
September 5th, 2009 at 20:35
@Grognard: But surely the 90% think they are in the 10%
September 5th, 2009 at 21:28
The Berbatov show – apparently – Scored one and got two assists
. Be good when/if he starts doing the same for Man United!
Ole says that Anderson VOLUNTEERED to play for the reserves. Ole also reckons that Anderson is going to be a big player for United, and he is encouraging him to STAKE his claim when he gets his next 1st team start, making it hard for SAF to keep him out. He says Andi has everything needed to be an important player for us, and he believes in him it seems.
.
September 5th, 2009 at 22:19
Anderson <3
September 5th, 2009 at 22:37
@Craig Mc: He didnt dive. They were tugging away at eachother, rooney got pissed, lunged at the defender.
He heard the whistle go thinking hes the one being punished, was pissed as he thought they were both at fault, then got the penalty.
It was a poor ref decision, but rooney didnt dive.
And as for saf coming out backing the eduardo dive ban, why shouldnt he after whiner AKA wenger says we play “anti-football?”
September 5th, 2009 at 22:38
@Grognard: I never metioned the internet
September 5th, 2009 at 23:01
@Dan: Dan I didn’t say he dived mate, I said it was simulation and cheating, which by the way Rooney slid down, tried to do the defender, and then raising him arms posturing that he had been done – sorry Dan but any honest onlooker who watched his behaviour and doesn’t call it cheating and play acting, I will lose respect for them too!
September 5th, 2009 at 23:02
@Dan: It’s quotes and comments you are reading on all the sites by fans that say these things. Correct em if I’m wrong but I do believe all these sites are part of something called the INTERNET, correct?
September 5th, 2009 at 23:06
@Craig Mc: I certainly agree with that. And although I have not seen the incident, I can just imagine how Ferguson will say he believed Rooney was fouled and that he never dove. It’s really hard to respect managers and players today because gamesmanship and simulation are so much a part of the game that severe measures will have to be brought in to curb it. Managers are just as responsible as the players because they support and protect their own players when they are guilty of simulation. Until they stop being hypocrites, it’s going to be hard to combat this problem.
September 5th, 2009 at 23:10
@Craig Mc: By the way, I watched the Portugal game today and I am trying to understand how that over the hill muppet Simao gets a start over Nani and sucks all game until he is replaced by Nani who played quite well in his 20 minutes? I am so pissed off with Queiroz because his team is on the ropes and he still counts on all the old and washed up players who got him in this position to get him out. Instead he should have more confidence in a player like Nani and start him as he was quite energetic and difficult to mark when he came into the game. Had he started, I am sure Portugal would have won the game. All though they aren’t eliminated yet, the idea of a World Cup without Ronaldo and Nani is really unattractive to me.
September 5th, 2009 at 23:13
@Traverse: You cannot put a cap on stupidity, that’s for sure. Sure they think they are right but so many fans are just emotional morons, who do not think or really understand the game for that matter. I personally think Possebon has some outstanding skill sets but he has developed slowly and has been overtaken in the pecking order by Gibson. He needs to up his game and he needs to work on his stamina as he runs out of energy far too easily and to soon. But I do like his Scholes like distribution and his great shot.
September 5th, 2009 at 23:16
@Dan: We do play anti-football. I am trying to understand what we are playing of late but I do know this, it isn’t football. Its a mixture of rubbish and crap mixed with a pinch of Italian seasoning.
September 5th, 2009 at 23:32
@Grognard: Grog check on News now, some of the websites are showing the video of Rooney’s playacting, and deliberate sticking out his leg and putting the defender out of the next world cup game as a result. If the situation was reversed and the defender had done that to Rooney, we would have all been crying blue bloody murder! I give it large to the Chelsea players when they cheat, so I sure as hell am not going to excuse our own players. Rooney didn’t dive, but he did playact (simulation) etc. Watch the video Grog, because that way I will get another opinion, Yet I don’t believe I am misrepresenting it at all
.
September 5th, 2009 at 23:37
@Grognard: I saw the Portugal game too
. Ronaldo was just feckin woeful mate, very ineffective. I know Nani should have been on from the start. He is the only Portugal winger who can get the ball into the box and find one of his team mates with it. However before Denmark scored, I thought Portugal were the team on top, and missed sooooooooooooooooo many very good opportunities to go 2-3 up 
. Nani scored in their last game, and he was only on for 20 minutes then – so Quiroz should have known better. Still his loss, and the fans dismay. Could understand if Nani wasn’t in form but he is!
September 6th, 2009 at 4:18
@Craig Mc: I saw it Craig and not only is it a dive, but it’s awkward and completely desperate one too. The only difference between a normal dive and that is that most dives are head first. His dive was leg first and in the process he actually trips the defender which for me is a foul if not a yellow card offense as well. It’s so cut and dry I just can’t wait to see what Ferguson says to throw chocolate all over it and dismiss it. I bet you he will say that Rooney lost his footing and slipped and it was an unfortunate bad break for Slovenia but Wayne his beloved did nothing wrong or intentional. BOLLOCKS! A disgrace coming from Rooney as well as any English player. I always assume that in the world game, England are still the only team that play like real men. I guess I am wrong.
September 6th, 2009 at 4:26
@Craig Mc: There was one play when Nani took to the end line and it looked to me like he just kept it from going over and delivered a cross to a player who could have scored easily but they blew the whistle and called the ball out. It was that kind of game. Ronaldo was trying to hard and actually I thought he looked good but nobody on that team was on the same page as him. He would zig, they would zag.
Queiroz along with Maradona should hang for what they have done to top ten footballing nations this year. Both look to be eliminated from the World Cup and it’s because they both have uninspiring, tactically inept managers who have no clue how to pick a starting squad and to apply a system and tactics that brings out noty only their best but allows their best players to shine. Maradona has allowed personal issues to cloud his judgment. No Riquelme means Argentina hasn’t got the creator and maestro in the middle of the park and benching Aguero because there are problems with him and Maradona’s daughter is the epitome of classlessness and pettiness. I hate Maradona to death but starting Tevez over Aguero vs Brazil and once again excluding Riquelme is the the sign and signature of a true moron. Go take some drugs you pathetic little fat man. As for Queiroz………..He’s a great #2.
September 6th, 2009 at 4:32
Fergie should just shutup and keep his trap shut when it comes to issues like diving and simulation. It never fails, he will make some holier than thou statement and suck up to the officials and UEFA as well as FIFA and it will always come back like a cream pie and splatter all over his face. Now he has to stand up and condemn his own Wayne Rooney for acting like a total pratt and and diving and costing Slovenia a goal yesterday. So how manyt of you think he will agree with the video proof and everyone out there with common sense and admit Rooney was wrong? And how many of you think he will not take the high road but will weasel out by saying he never saw the incident? And still more, how many of you think he will support and defend Rooney and claim that Rooney either slipped or was pulled down? I know he took a dive and I am pretty sure Fergie will feel he was pulled down or slipped. Testing time for the Boss to see if he is yet again a class “A” hypocrite like I say he is.
September 6th, 2009 at 4:35
My God, can you imagine a World Cup without Argentina and Portugal? At a time when they both have tremendous talent pool and should never have been a doubt to qualify? Disgraceful. Heads will most definitely roll. And the first that needs to get sacked is the muppet or group of muppets who felt hiring the inexperienced and criminally idiotic muppet by the name of Maradona to head up one of the great footballing nations in the world. Diabolical.
September 6th, 2009 at 4:44
I am reading some rubbish rumors about both Madrid and Barcelona looking to buy Rio Ferdinand. Well this might shock many but you know what I say? Put a nice price tag on him and sell him. I love Rio but he is close to 30 and he has been suffering from back problems that have plagued him for two years now. Add to that his latest injury and it’s clear to me that he is beginning to break down. Now is the time to get a lot of money for him and it is Jonny Evans turn to shine. I love Rio but personally, selling him after this season is good sound business because of his age and injury problems of late. Still, we would not consider it if we never had a quality young player to take over his spot in Evans. Evans is no Rio yet, but he has all the makeup and ability to become one and he needs to play regularly for that to happen. Of course the one thing that would make make me think twice about selling Rio would be not knowing the future intentions of Vidic due to his wife’s supposed bitchiness and dissatisfaction. If that can be ironed out, sell Rio.
September 6th, 2009 at 5:11
@Grognard: Grog, I don’t think Rooney dived in the game today. I thought he actually looked genuinely surprised by the refs decision.
Also saw the US v El Salvador game, and a major faux pas by the official in this game too. Altidor clearly scored a legal goal and the pricks got it wrong here as well.
Heck, if the refs are that incompetent, why not try a little scam here or there??
My point is though, that until the officiating improves dramatically, the governing bodies cant expect the moral high road from the players!
We have a fourth official already, but he’s stuck on the sideline making sure the managers don’t use bad language!! Why isn’t he on the field of play making sure a goal is a goal, or an offside is an offside, or a dive is a dive??
If I watch a WE of Football, I’ll see more more refereeing errors than I would in a whole season of Rugby, Cricket, Baseball, NFL, etc…..
It’s time to move forward here!!
September 6th, 2009 at 5:31
@Grognard: I agree with the sentiment here, however how many players are we gonna ship out and not replace them with true and tried talent?
We cant just get rid of the foundation of this team, and just plug in the reserves to fill their very large shoes!
Rio has more of an influence than just his abilities, he’s a true leader in this club. Who you gonna bring on to replace him, that could calm and stabilize the defense as he has?
Unless SAF allow the moths to migrate to a different wallet, the loss of more key players seems dire to me!!
September 6th, 2009 at 9:30
What the fuck Rooney did not dive. Thats crazy he was trying to hurt the defender…you dont dive in that position, the ref was an idiot for giving it. Its not even worth talking about…dive? fucking hell
September 6th, 2009 at 9:33
@Grognard: I dont think Fergie will give a shit about Rooney ‘diving’ whatever you call it in an ENGLAND game against Slovenia, and a friendly at that.
September 6th, 2009 at 10:48
@Craig Mc: Simulation is diving!
Im not saying rooney never dives, but im certain that wasnt a dive.
September 6th, 2009 at 10:49
@Taehr: Thank you!
September 6th, 2009 at 12:20
@Grognard: I can… 2 of the teams that continually put England out in the quarters not there*? Couldn’t be happier
*we’ll just get knocked out in the semis by Germany on pens instead
September 6th, 2009 at 12:30
look what the lack of club football has reduced us to… arguing about international friendlies… bring back the premiership Asap!
September 6th, 2009 at 12:39
Grognard, I agree it is good business to sell Rio if we can get £20 million for him. But our defence even without Rio is so injury prone we’d need to buy someone to replace him with. And unfortunately there are very few quality defenders available for a fair price.
I also have no desire to further strengthen Barcelona’s defence. How will we ever win another Champions League trophy if we sell our best players, even when they are supposedly past their prime? We have already lost a lot of ground to our rivals by selling Ronaldo.
Why are we turning into a selling club? I had a look at our transfer data and including the Ronaldo deal we’ve been breaking even over the last few years.
September 6th, 2009 at 12:57
@Dan: Simulation is a term used for diving yes I agree, but it is also a term that explains any kind of feigning or pretence. Playacting, and Rooney was definately doing that – he cheated end of!
September 6th, 2009 at 12:59
@Taehr: It doesn’t matter whether it was a friendly or not. Rooney cheated to obtain a penalty he did not deserve. If SAF doesn’t care then SAF is a HYPOCRITE – end of!
September 6th, 2009 at 13:05
@Taehr: Rooney the cheat – not even worth talking about? Yeah course its Man United, and its Rooney, lets not talk about it eh, because he just might get banned and hurt England – boo bloody hoo – he cheated, and the whole world knows it! He won’t admit it though, just like you and other United fans who are in denial. I support my team thru thick and thin, but I hated Ronnie when he playacted and cheated, and I have ZERO RESPECT for Rooney after that episode yesterday. I call black – black – where cheating is concerned, I detest cheating whoever is doing the cheating! Yeah Taehr it was a meaningless match, but if Rooney gets away with it, he will do it again in a MEANINGFUL match
.
September 6th, 2009 at 13:11
I don’t think he was cheating for a penalty. He was kicking out at the player (who’d been all over him for the time leading up to it), and then having ago at the other guy for it (possibly to avoid getting a card), and the referee bafflingly saw the incident as a penalty!
In the same game a linesman looking straight at Rob Green managed to miss him picking up the ball 2 yards outside his box, so I would have to question the level of officials used for friendlies!
September 6th, 2009 at 13:28
Did the Argies loose to Brazil then? If so can anybody tell me the score please! If Tevez misses out on the world cup with the Argies, couldn’t happen to a better person after all his MOUTHING OFF about how great he is, and how United would have won CL with him in team in Rome
.
September 6th, 2009 at 13:33
@Traverse: Trav if you look carefully mate at the incident again, the defender had won out against Rooney. Rooney didn’t like it and kicked the guy hard enough to put him out of the world cup qualifier on Wednesday. That’s when the play acting/cheating came! Rooney being the aggressor, then lifted his arms up in pleading mode that he had been downed – PLAYACTING/CHEATING. I cannot support Rooney in behaviour like that. Trav it is once again Rooney petulance and hitting out when things don’t go his way. He hasn’t changed or grown up yet!
September 6th, 2009 at 14:13
@Craig Mc: craig, fouling a player is not simulation or play acting. Who ever told you so is wrong.
Kicking out at a player is fouling, not “playacting,” “playacting” would be diving, which he didnt do.
September 6th, 2009 at 14:25
@Craig Mc: You seem to be confusing cheating and being a bit of a dick.
September 6th, 2009 at 14:34
Today seems to be the day for Italian teams to lash out at United over approaching young players…. however the Italians have done it with much more class, saying that it isn’t a problem with Manchester United (legally I mean), it’s a problem with Italian Law and that FIFA need to regulate it fully.
September 6th, 2009 at 14:42
@Craig Mc: Rooney didnt even look for a penalty, Yea Rooney tried to hurt the other guy but he always does that its nothing new but to call that a ‘DIVE’ thats just completely off the mark. I dint watch the game because England usually bore me to the death but I was interested to see what was this ‘dive incident that was on the news was about and when I saw it I laughed! The ref was just stupid
September 6th, 2009 at 14:48
@Dan: Dan you are not getting it mate – I am not talking about fouling a player, I am talking about the PLAYACTING Rooney did AFTER fouling a player, because he lost out and got nasty fouling the player has nothing to do with it. Following the petulant foul, Rooney turned to the ref, raised his arms up like he was the one fouled, instead of the fouler. That was the cheating mate – he was the guilty not the innocent party. He cheated – no other word for it! Every other fan in the land, and MOST HONEST UNited fans know he duped the ref. Duped is cheating – how much more obvious does it have to be. His petulancy also put another player out of a world cup qualifier, you may find that acceptable Dan – I don’t
.
September 6th, 2009 at 14:52
@Taehr: Read my comment to Dan mate. I never called it a foul, but I did call it playacting, duping the ref, he did raise his arms and appealed to the ref AFTER he was the one to hurt another player DELIBERATELY. That may stand well with you Taehr – it doesn’t with me, and I don’t care how great a player he is at United. He is NASTY when things don’t roll for him! I appreciate so much about Rooney, but I don’t appreciate or respect that part of his game – sorry Taehr mate!
September 6th, 2009 at 15:27
@Redrich: Mate there are so many errors made by NFL refs it’s not funny. But coaches their have the two challenge options (one each half) to call for instant replay and that keeps most games from being too controversial. But they still can’t challenge a penalty call like a wrongful pass interference.
If you ask me the best referees are in hockey and in basketball. Two very fast sports but they all do an excellent job. Why? Because it is a full time job for them and it is treated like a career to be an official in those sports. They are usually fairly young men who are in top condition and have their eyes checked regularly.
My point is that footy has a problem with referees because all you have to do is look at some of them. Some are too old and others look out of shape. All of them look at the job as a part time job while they work at their regular jobs during the week. Not exactly a glowing review or description of their jobs and peformance based on the way their work is structured. Many need to get the sack because they do not do a good job and the whole group need to be paid properly and hired on as full time officials with strong training and performance regiments within their schedule. It’s time for them to look at football as a full time job and to concentrate 100% on that job. Above all, assist them by bringing video replays to help them out with certain parts of the game like if the ball crossed the line and off sides. We live in the 21st century. The age of digital video and the Internet. There is no longer an excuse to be operating a multi billion dollar league like it’s back in the 1940’s. It’s time for the game, FIFA, UEFA and the FA to wake up and smell the coffee. Above all, it’s time to get consistent and take no prisoners when it comes to dives. Any player simulating or diving gets an automatic ban of two games with no pay when he does it. A similar offense in the same season again makes it 3 games and a third offense 5 games. Just watch how quickly diving ends. It’s also time to shut managers up once and for all. Any criticism of officials post game is a strong fine and a 2 game ban. And during the game is an automatic ejection from the proceedings and a subsequent one game ban.
I personally hate referees as I see the present crop in England as being nothing more than bloody ass clowns. But after they clean house and restructure the way referees are hired, trained paid and maintained, then it is vital that with the help of video replay, they be respected and their decisions accepted. But this can only happen with a strong and decisive directive from FIFA, UEFA and then of course the FA and the Premier League. The nonsense has to stop and players and managers have got to start to treat the game with more respect as well, they need to start acting like responsible adults and stop acting like girls in skirts.
September 6th, 2009 at 15:39
@Craig Mc: Craig your digging a hole. He didnt turn to the ref at all, he turned to the linesman and asked what he did wrong. The linesman didnt even give a penalty, so at that point rooney definitely new nothing, then the ref gave the penalty.
He didnt cheat, or play act, or dive, he lunged out and asked the linesman what he did wrong. It was a poor ref decision. You are making a way to big a deal out of this, it doesnt matter if your honest or not, im looking at the facts, and the fact is, it was the refs fault, no one cheated him, he made a poor decision.
September 6th, 2009 at 15:40
@Redrich: Rio may be a true leader but then again so was Ince, Keane, Pallister, Robson, Bruce etc etc. They all reached a time when they had to go because they were not good enough or there were younger players who were as good or better waiting in the wings.
Rio is still great but he is near 30 (the age where players start to decline rapidly) and he has been dealing with back problems for a while now.
Leadership is important but performing at a high level and being healthy is too. Above all, if another team is willing to offer a lot of money for him, a team should consider it because with that money they can buy more good players. This is a young man’s game, make no bones about it. Leadership is important but youth and energy is the most important criteria in building a great team. Have a blend of experience and youth and you will do well. I like Rio but I also see a quality young player like Evans who needs the opportunity to play. When Rio was Evans age he was not being hampered buy some veteran player keeping him out of the first team at West Ham or Leeds. Evans isn’t just a decent or good backup. He is a star waiting to happen. At least that is my assessment of him. If we never had him, then I would think twice of selling a player like Rio. But keep in mind, that when Beckham and van Nistelrooy all neared the 30 year mark, Fergie shipped them of like a crate of bananas. He did the same with Yorke, Cole, Bruce and man many more. As much as he likes experience, he knows that youth is vital to success. All the more reason why I cannot and will not understand the extended stays of Neville, Scholes and Giggs. These players have a special place in Fergie’s heart and have played far too long for this club and in comparison, Rio is a young man. Anyway, that’s how I see it.
September 6th, 2009 at 15:43
@Grognard: Rio is 30
September 6th, 2009 at 15:44
@Taehr: You can call it what you want mate, it was a dive. Whether it’s head first or feet first is not important. He simulated going down to get a penalty. He was not touched or fouled and did not have to go down and even actually ended up fouling the defender, but that’s how awkward it was because he never had the time or the sense to simulate it properly. Blind yourself all you want, that’s what bias fans do. I love Rooney and respect him but he dove and that for me is the bottom line.
September 6th, 2009 at 15:47
@Taehr: Of course Fergie won’t give a shit, unless Rooney is given a ban that would affect him at United. As that won’t happen he won’t worry about it. But I will be interested to hear what his reaction is to the incident considering his condemnation of Eduardo this week. You don’t see it as a dive yet the entire media and two of my friends who I have talked to all see it as a dive. The only people who do not see it as a dive are United fans. So there you go. Now lets see how much of a hypocrite Fergie can be?
September 6th, 2009 at 15:47
@Grognard: You’re joking right?
You are the only one calling it a dive now. He lunged out, end of.
If every lunge was a dive, roy keane is the biggest diver united has ever seen.
September 6th, 2009 at 15:50
@Dan: A classic dive it wasn’t but it was simulating being brought down which he wasn’t. This caused the ref to give a penalty. What else is it Dan or are you so blinded by your own bias and loyalty that you can no longer call a spade a spade? He went to ground like he was fouled and he was not touched. Enough said. To argue this fact is ludicrous.
September 6th, 2009 at 15:52
@Traverse: That would be fine by me. I of course couldn’t care less about England in the World Cup. Sorry, no offense to all my England mates on this board but I am and always will be a supporter of Germany. Still, I’d like to see England do well. But I still think it would be a shame to have such a great tournament without the great Argentina in it or the world’s best player.
September 6th, 2009 at 15:57
@Craig Mc: You tell em Craig. It wasn’t a classic dive but he went down in simulating that he was fouled and end up getting a penalty out of it. Now nobody would expect him to then get up and be a true sportsmen and tell the ref he slipped or was not fouled, because had he done that, Capello would have killed him. And that is at the root of the problem here. Not enough managers play fairly themselves and many encourage this sort of thing. I would be bloody amazed and impressed if any player who went down and got up and told a ref that he was not fouled. I’d even be more impressed if that player’s manager praised the player for his honesty and didn’t have him banished from the team for his act of fair play. But that is stuff out of a fantasy novel now isn’t it bro?
September 6th, 2009 at 16:00
@Craig Mc: Beautifully said mate, beautifully said. Hypocrisy is running rampant in our sport and it’s time like minded supporters like you and I stood up for what is right despite our allegiance to a team or a player. If Fergie stands up for Rooney on this one and calls his infraction a foul, he should then call himself a king sized hypocrite of the first order and then come out and officially apologize to both Eduardo and Wenger for his comments of last week.
September 6th, 2009 at 16:02
@Traverse: Nonsense. He went to the ground at a time when he was in a position to score a goal. Players do not lash out at opponents when they have a scoring chance. It just ended up being a foul because frankly Rooney made a mess of the dive because sometimes when you ad lib something with little time to think about it, it comes off looking awkward. And lets face it, the lad comes from Liverpool so common sense and intelligence never played a role in the incident.
September 6th, 2009 at 16:03
@Grognard: He didnt say ANYTHING to the referee ffs
He turned to the linesman asking what he did wrong. It wasnt a dive it was an idiotic lunge.
Its not me looking at things with red tinted glasses on, its you trying to be so unbiased that you would rather attack the player then defend him.
Rooney had fuck all to do with the refs decision, the ref made the decision not rooney, rooney said nothing to the ref, he complained to the linesman because he felt he did nothing wrong. He thought it was a free kick to slovenia and complained.
September 6th, 2009 at 16:04
@Craig Mc: 3-1 Brazil. And it wasn’t even that close. Maradona has gone from hero to zero in his country and the sooner he gets the sack, the sooner that great footballing nation can resurrect their chances at making the World Cup.
September 6th, 2009 at 16:09
@Dan: He never intentionally fouled the defender. It just happened because his slide of a dive eventually led him to get under the defender. Christ man, open your bloody eyes and wake up. He simulated a dive and gets a 1.5/10 for style and he now is being protected from the likes of you and every other biased English fan out there. Call it as it happened. A player who went down in the box because he was not in the position to score so he simulated a badly conceived ad lib dive to get a penalty and because the ref was a muppet, he got it. To see it in any other way just speaks of bias and poor eyesight. No wonder you think Foster is good. Christ Dan, seriously, I expect more from you of all people. The whole world sees this as simulation but you and the die hards don’t because of course our players are fucking saints. Enough already.
September 6th, 2009 at 16:09
@Dan: It was a blatant free kick to the opposition though Dan – which they should have got and didn’t. The defender was injured by Rooney’s deliberate foul tackle! Your usually very fair with your assessments Dan, don’t understand why you are not on this occasion!
September 6th, 2009 at 16:10
@Traverse: Actually Rooney was cheating and being a king sized dick all in one. And those who are protecting him and not admitting his crime are being dicks too.
September 6th, 2009 at 16:12
@Traverse: I predicted this. As soon as Pandora’s box was opened I knew all those teams that lost a teenage talent to United would find their mojo and start filing complaints. It was all so predictable.