Pre-Order the new Manchester United home kit

Manchester United’s 09-10 home kit (the last one to bear the AIG logo) is now available for pre-order.

From initial images it seems to be a plain red top with the white shorts bearing a red stripe down the sides. The white V-neck collar that some leaked images showed earlier this summer is missing, but there does seem to be a ‘V’ across the shirt, either in a darker shade of red or in white (with the color blacked out for the promotional images).

The kit will be revealed on 1st July and launched on 16th July.

man-utd-09-10-home-kit

If you’re not into buying team kits, then feel free to ignore this post. On the other hand if you want to buy the new Manchester United home shirt, buy it from us and help support this community.

536 comments on this post.
  1. Monkwahhdo:

    AFTER BRIGHTENING THE IMAGE UP IT APPEARS THE V STRIPE ACROSS THE FRONT OF THE SHIRT IS ACTUALLY BLACK INCORPORATING THE WHITE NIKE TICK.
    SORRY FOR THE CAPS! :oops:

  2. Akers:

    “there does seem to be a ‘V’ across the shirt, either in a darker shade of red or in white”

    I think it’s black.

  3. swede:

    http://www.footy-boots.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/man-utd-home-kit-2009-2011.jpg

    It is that shirt and we’ve known about it for many weeks now!

  4. Traverse:

    Apparently we are interested in Akinfeev. I’m sure Grog is off changing his underwear the the news. :mrgreen:

  5. jos:

    @Traverse: any links???
    we were also reportedly interested in Villareal keeper (forgot his name), Ochoa (the Mexican prodigy), Asenjo, etc apart from shit names like Victor Valdes (thank God he signed that new contract with Barca)

  6. Andrei:

    @Traverse: So am I :oops:

    Where did you hear the news? Please tell :mrgreen:

  7. Andrei:

    @jos: His name is Diego Lopez – he’s quite good.

    Foster, better than Casillas :lol:

  8. Traverse:

    @jos: http://www.mosnews.com/sports/2009/06/23/abramovitchzhirkov/

    CSKA are buying Helton from Porto to replace him.

  9. Onkar:

    Chelsea Star Michael Essien Is Open To Real Madrid & Barcelona Offers – Agent…..

    It will be a blockbuster… break your bank and buy this beast… He is unstoppable…..
    No matter how excited i am sure its another tabloids cooked story… But, if its true then???

  10. Onkar:

    Link for the Essien story…

    http://www.goal.com/en/news/9/england/2009/06/23/1341920/chelsea-star-michael-essien-is-open-to-real-madrid-barcelona

  11. despicable:

    Foster has signed a new contract, doubling his salary,

  12. despicable:

    See it in
    Fosters new contract
    dailyexress,http://www.dailyexpress.co.uk/posts/view/109389/Foster-in-new-deal

  13. Nafooy:

    I just wanted to throw a suggestion in here on the much debated subject of us needing a DM. And just to fend off any violent rants against myself or my suggestion, I hate his gutts as much as anyone on here too. BUT, how about Maschfuckingrano filling this gap for us?!. It looks like he’s declared himself available. He is also on a “mere” 30K a week. He’s also a fighter. On the down side he might also act like a headless chicken, but hey he kinda reminds me of Makalele in some sort of weird way!

    Not to mention that he also has a good grasp of the EPL.

    Also, just imagine the look on Rafa’s ugly fucking face if we do sign him :twisted:

    I can’t wait for Craig’s and Grog’s replies on this.

    Here goes then :wink:

  14. Beachryan:

    If it were an option I’d take every penny of that £80m and sign Essien. I don’t even know how he’d fit in our team, but it would be worth it. Just awesome.

    I really doubt these keeper rumours given Foster just signed up big time…

  15. Traverse:

    @Beachryan: Doesn’t it make sense to get Foster on a longer deal while he thinks he’ll be number one? VDS is gone at the end of this season. I say bring in Akinfeev and let the best man win between him and Foster!

  16. tevez:

    @Beachryan: A move to madrid or barca would be considered for essien, but not us.

    Foster is to be our long-term back-up keeper.

  17. Stephen:

    @tevez: I agree it is a total non starter, by the way mate are you going to change your name!????!!?? :lol: :lol:

  18. tevez:

    Wasn’t planning on. Love little carlos tevez. Should i? :lol:

  19. Stephen:

    @tevez: It’s your choice bro, we should have a poll :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

  20. ROOOOONEY:

    cool, cant wait for the new kit hopefully with few new faces by the time its released.

  21. RedDevilEddy:

    The pics were quite difficult to see from the various sources its been from, but I found a site that showed the kit in full bloom! :grin:

    http://blogs.mirror.co.uk/football-banter/2009/06/new-manchester-united-kit.html

    Looks sooooooooooo awsome, Im gonna buy one with Anderson on the back! :mrgreen:

  22. sig:

    looks like a superb effort… basically covers my one gripe with the last one… that being it was toooo red… I had Busby Babes 58 on the back of my last. Any anniversarys coming up that I should be awre of to commemorate on the back of this seasons?

  23. sig:

    btw I already bought my Gremio shirt ordered but I’m still in hope that I can put Costa on the back of this new United shirt…

  24. michael:

    I know the whole Douglas Costa thing has been talked to death over the last year but does anyone know why the telegraph is saying we can’t afford him?

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/leagues/premierleague/manutd/5610082/Manchester-United-priced-out-of-deal-for-Cristiano-Ronaldos-replacement.html

    If we had the £25 million for Tevez then surely we can just take 13 or 14 of that and splash it on him, he really does look as though he’ll grow up to be something special.

  25. Andrei:

    @michael: Not that we can’t afford him – that we are unwilling to pay 14 mil for an unproven 18 year old from Brazil (Like we did for Tosic, Lliajic, Anderson, Ronaldo, etc.). It is just bullshit made up by The Telegraph to sell papers.

  26. Man-U-cho:

    Sorry RR I have to go offtopic but couldn’t resist this one. Fine, I know the bloke is a muppet but for once I agree with Septic Blatter and I quote “Vuvuzelas make the South African game come alive. Banning Vuvuzelas (at WC2010) is NOT an option-in fact I will blow one myself”. :grin: There you have it, hopefully that puts this whole thing to bed now.

  27. michael:

    @Andrei: I’m inclined to think that except the Telegraph seems to not make up that much stuff where we are concerned. Perhaps we’re putting out noises that we won’t pay just to drive the price down?

  28. Liam:

    Unfortunately for Rio the kit doesn’t come with a bra strap :wink:

  29. Traverse:

    Tim Vickery, talksports man in South America says that Costa 49 times out of 50 will do something stupid and loose the ball, and he doesn’t get a game for Gremio and is on their bench. Also says that he is very immature, and gets sent off for persistent silly fouls. No wonder we are only offering £7m not the £13.5m they want

  30. Dan:

    http://www.redcafe.net/f6/new-kit-232142/index20.html

    If you want a clear image. I saw the kit months ago on that thread so im a bit used to it.

  31. phoenix red:

    I’ve kinda got used(from leaked previews) to the old school kit with the chevron, glad its black though. I’m sure it’ll be smart enough.

  32. sig:

    so Citeh seem to buy someone every day… my question is this…

    if we didnt win the league would you rather Citeh or Liverpool win it if you had to choose out of the two?

  33. Andrei:

    @sig: Shity, so that the fucking Scousers don’t get ahead of us again!

  34. sig:

    I’m with you on that… plus I just think it would be ammusing to see… still think we’ll do it though

  35. Andrei:

    @Traverse: Do you remember which other 18 year old lost the ball for stupid things 49 times out of 50 and got sent off because of idiotic infractions? All I’m hoping for is that this one does not dream white…

    @michael: Could be. Or maybe we really are unwilling to pay the 14m for the guy… who knows?

  36. Man-U-cho:

    @sig: Citeh for me, Cant stand the dippers, wish they were relegated :lol:

  37. michael:

    @Traverse: Wow yeah I’ve just looked him up on Wikipedia and he’s yet to play 10 league games in a season. And he’s only scored once. He still looks to be a talent but I guess that also means that most of the videos of him are against players his own age.

  38. Stephen:

    What happened with our interested in Fabian Delph, I know he had a few off field issues but he looks a top prospect?

  39. Andrei:

    @sig: It might be too early to tell, but I think it’ll be Chelsea’s year… Liverpool is Liverpool, Arsenal is the same old (though I would rather them over every other title rival), City is far, far away from PL Challenge (you’re not gonna win anything with Santa Cruz) and Chelsea can be good if they have a manager of some quality.

    As for us, we need to wait and see who we will sign.

  40. Andrei:

    @michael: He has started 3 out of 7 games for his team this season (the Brasileiro runs from March to October – or something like that).

  41. RedDevilEddy:

    @sig: Shitty, cause I cant stand the ego of the dippers. Just think about all the bullshit they have been throwing around by just getting second, and then imagine how it would be if they actually won! :shock: :roll: City for sure, at least the trophy will stay in the best city in the world then… :smile:

  42. Traverse:

    @Andrei: Yeah but he played for Sporting, didn’t warm their bench. And he did it against United, which is proof to Fergie that you can do it anywhere. And he only cost us £12mil.

    I’m not saying he isn’t worth it, I’d love him to come here and develop, but everyone labasts Nani for not being the best player in the world already, when it took 3 seasons for Ronaldo to bed in properly, and Nani has the same Goals and Assists that Ronaldo had in his first 2 seasons from half the games.

    I’m just saying that if he comes, it could be 2 or 3 years before he starts doing it. I’d rather sign Silva who could do it now, sign Costa but leave him in Brazil for a year, and give Nani more of a chance.

  43. Madschester United:

    THe shirt is so ugly. Looks like a Star Trek shirt:

    http://www.veronicabelmont.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/star-trek-tng1.jpg

    I will not buy this shirt this year. I hope they get something better next year.

  44. Dan:

    @Madschester United: it looks nothing like a star trek shirt!

    What exacly is wrong with it?

  45. gator:

    @Traverse: +1

  46. Traverse:

    @Dan: white shorts, thats what’s wrong with it. Too many colours. Black shorts with a red stripe and we’re cooking.

    I hope it has a black stripe on the back, like the current white stripe.

  47. johnsom33:

    @Andrei: Ronaldo was a star already on a quality european team, and as pointed out earlier he only cost 12m.

    Costa isnt a regular starter on a S.American team and they want upwards of 20m for him.

    Keep in mind how much we paid for Nani and Anderson. Like Ronaldo they were both Starters on their teams, and they both were already in Europe(Anderson played in the champions league for christ sake.) yet Gremio still want more than both of them.

    8-12m for costa… OK. but aything over that… thanks but no thanks.

  48. Dan:

    @Traverse: Ok, but whats wrong with the actual top?

  49. Dan:

    @johnsom33: I agree, the money talked is mad!

    We should put a £20mil bid in for rodwell i think, hes a big talent, and with the 6+5 rule coming in soon, it would be worth it!

  50. Andrei:

    @Dan: Yea, Rodwell’s a real gem. Seen him in some Everton matches this year (against Arsenal, for example) and yesterday for England and he could become a very classy centre-mid or centre-back.

  51. Traverse:

    @Dan: The aig logo? dunno. Seems alright to me.

  52. ROOOOONEY:

    why are they adding the rule 6+5 again? to develop more local talent for…?

  53. Grognard:

    @Traverse: Then again, who aren’t we chasing? Question is, are we ever going to actually catch any of these stars we are supposedly chasing? They seem to run faster than both Gill and Fergie combined. :grin:

  54. Traverse:

    @Grognard: We haven’t started running yet…..

    I’m sure we’ll have our business done within the next two weeks, now that Fergie is back from the wine lodge, and before he head to asia to sell some new shirts…. I mean prepare for the new season.

  55. Grognard:

    @Nafooy: Mate, it just won’t happen. Two things. United and Liverpool never do business. Last week I went off the reservation by suggesting they just might consider it for Torres only because Liverpool are in a world of hurt financially. Now it looks like one of their owners Gillette has just sold the Montreal Canadiens hockey team and the other owner Hicks is about to sell his hockey and baseball teams in Texas so that may not be a problem for them any longer.

    Anyway, the two teams have had a rich and volatile history of not doing business with each other. Secondly and most importantly, the reason Mashcerano wants to leave Liverpool is because of his wife disliking life their (can you blame her). She hates in England in general and wants to live in a Spanish speaking country. This has caused the player great stress and so if he does end up leaving the Scousers, it will be for Spain. Even if he were being offered for a bag of balls, we wouldn’t get him.

  56. Grognard:

    @Beachryan: I agree. Sign Essien and make every attempt to woo him and convince him to come to United. I said a few months ago that his contract was coming to an end and that we should make the effort to get him because he is the best box to box midfielder in the world bar none. All the money and talk about anybody else is meaningless compared to the acquisition of a Michael Essien. Would Chelsea sell to us? Perhaps. If the player could honestly see the positives of coming to play for us. But like so many, he has been seduced by the evil that is Barca and Madrid. Do I want to be just one of many big fish in a saturated and polluted pond or do I want to be a big fish in a clean pond with plenty of food? Essien needs to ask himself the question, where can he be better used and more appreciated?

  57. Grognard:

    @Traverse: That’s not even a contest. Akinfeev would win that battle, trust me. Tremendous shot stopping skills and reflexes will get him noticed. He also has better positional sense and won’t end up in a hospital bed by injuring himself while watching tv. Foster just needs to think of an injury and it will happen to him.

  58. Dan:

    @Grognard: i wouldnt want a scouser anyway :roll:

  59. Grognard:

    @RedDevilEddy: That V makes the kit suck so badly. What the hell are they thinking? V’s were added to kits back in pre war days or in the 50′s. They look ugly and tacky compared to many high tech looking kits out there today. I would have loved the kit as just plain red with no frills. A classic look like we wore to commemorate the the Munich Disaster two season’s ago. Now that was a great throwback style kit. What’s next, baggy shorts that come down to the knees?

  60. Dan:

    @Grognard: Well im glad to inform you that no matter how much you hate foster, hes still gonna be our future No.1, and that was all but confirmed with his contract signing today.

    Hope that helps :mrgreen:

  61. Grognard:

    @michael: He’s a teenager mate and 25 million on any teenager is a massive risk. He may not pan out or he may not blend in well with the team or the English game. Too many things, mostly negative can happen and derail him. For me a fair price is no more than 12 million because he has shown or proven nothing yet really. Gremio is trying to milk us for all they can get because they know we have money. And even if we don’t play their bluff and tell them to go sod off, they’ll say fine because they know all this publicity will have awoken the Spanish giants with the cash who will pay 20 to 25 million to bring the kid to Spain. We cannot win this battle so we need to just give up and go for a more proven player who at least we know can cut the mustard.

  62. Dan:

    @Grognard: Well you hit the nail on the head, thats the whole point o the “v!”

    its in memory of our first FA cup win, the oldest cup competition in the world.

  63. Grognard:

    @Man-U-cho: FIFA has already said they plan on banning it from the games so Septic Blatter has had to give in to the FIFA board or council on this one. Sorry to burst your bubble but then again, you probably enjoyed the sound. :wink:

  64. Grognard:

    @Liam: Classic! :lol: :lol: And don’t they make hot pants in that style? :grin:

  65. Grognard:

    @Traverse: If that’s the case, then why are we even trying to sign him? :roll:

  66. m34ch:

    My photoshop of Rooney in the new kit.
    http://img221.imageshack.us/i/rooneykitnewtweaked.jpg/
    I still a V neck would have been nicer in tandem with the V chest, seems round-necks are in this year, as seen on a lot on the Nike shirts. That Villa away one is nice though.

  67. Traverse:

    @Grognard: His buyout clause is $20mil, not £20mil. Works out at about £13.5mil. Still a little steep. Maybe we’ve gone in with a low offer (£6mi) and ‘let’ them bargain us up to about £9.5mil, the sort of price we’d actually be willing to pay.

  68. Grognard:

    @Andrei: Oh please, for every two mistakes Ronaldo made he made 6 great plays. The first ten minutes I saw of Ronaldo in his United debut I was in a lounge with my friend and told him that one day that would be the best player in the world. He so wowed me by his skill and inventiveness. Lets not place Costa in that same class quite yet shall we. Ronaldo was a very special case. Remember when Nani showed up last year he showed us a lot of skill but he also had moments of utter stupidity and selfishness and those moment s basically landed him on the bench this season. Unlike Nani and Costa, Ronaldo was willing to learn and take council from his manager, coaches and teammates. He wasn’t completely oblivious to their teachings and demands. Costa strikes out and is childish about it and we compare him to Ronaldo who had the perseverance and determination to learn and adapt because he knew the Boss was good a molding good players into great players. So lets leave Ronny out of this one for he is and was one special talent and one mighty exception to the rule.

  69. Traverse:

    @Grognard: Because he has promise. We need to be careful of turning into Arsenal and constantly buying promise and not letting our old promise actually come to anything!

  70. Grognard:

    @Andrei: Arsenal are rumored to be going after Huntelaar and Sneijder along with Spurs. If they get those two for a reported 30 million, I wouldn’t right of the Arse yet. I still don’t think they will win it until Wenger realizes once and for all that he has the worst keeper in history playing and starting for him. If he was smart he’d buy a keeper before anything else and then go after a Felipe Melo and he would walk away with the EPL title.

  71. Grognard:

    @Madschester United: Good one mate. A Star Trek shirt. Classic! :lol: :lol: Well said.

  72. Grognard:

    @Dan: It looks dated, unimaginative and senile. Oh yes, and it’s butt ugly too. Hows that for a description? :grin: Put a ten year old in front of a PC with Photoshop and he could come up with more creativity than that.

  73. Grognard:

    @Traverse: Just remember when when we signed Berbatov last year? It was a game or two into the season. Fortunately he wanted to come and play for us. Benzema isn’t so enthusiastic.

  74. Grognard:

    @Dan: I’d take Torres or Gerrard any day of the week mate. Other than those two, I agree. Although I know that deep down the Danmeister has a peculiar love relationship for none other than Dirk Kuyt. Come on mate, admit it. :)

  75. Grognard:

    @Dan: Wanna bet? Pig’s on his way out and we needed to secure the backup.

  76. Grognard:

    @Dan: Then we should wear it only during FA Cup matches and spare us all the eye sore from a long EPL campaign. :grin:

  77. Grognard:

    @Traverse: I agree with that. I like prospects but you have to balance it with good purchases of sound and quality veterans who add instant quality, experience and leadership to your team and who can mentor the younger players. Wenger has missed the point of this for a while now. It’s almost as if he is bored by managing and would prefer being a teacher. I say he should quit Arsenal and start up the Wenger Football Academy. Titles are not one on the backs of kids

  78. Traverse:

    @Grognard: That was because his club didn’t want to sell, and wanted more money.

    I remember the season before that, where we went out and got Hargreaves, Anderson, Nani and Tevez real early.

  79. Dan:

    @Grognard: Foster wouldnt agree to the deal if he was just “back-up,” further more doubled wages suggest hes going to be given a chance this season.

    No one knows if pigs going to out, its tabloid rumours, nothing more.

  80. Traverse:

    @Grognard: Our problem is going to come at the end of next season when we lose Scholes, Giggs, Neville and VDS. Then we’ll be lacking in the experience stakes.

    Arsenal had this with an ageing squad and bought young, and no experience… they’ve won nothing for years.

    Chelsea have real problems coming up with ELEVEN players over 30 in the squad. Lampard, Drogba, Carvalho, Deco, Ballack, Pizarro, Ferreira, Anelka, Mineiro, Hilário and Belletti. Eight of those are first team or bench.

    They are going to be in the market soon for a whole team of experienced players. For Neville we have Rafael. For Scholes we have Anderson (whether or not it’s right, that’s how Fergie sees it). VDS we have Foster, but we need to buy another keeper regardless.

    Who do we have for Giggs? Silva would be ideal as he is good and experienced but only 23. Having him would allow for people like Costa or Sanchez to develop and it not being such a necessity for them to be rushed.

  81. Stephen:

    @Traverse: Tosic or Nani?

  82. Traverse:

    @Stephen: Nani might get his chance next season, but nothing I’ve seen of Tosic fills me with hope. Not in the reserves, not for Serbia u21′s. I’d be more than happy to be surprised.

  83. Stephen:

    @Traverse: I agree on both counts but we spent a reasonable amount of money on the ld and maybe give him a chance, but signs don’t look great must say.

  84. NicoQB:

    @Traverse: If Vickery says it, then it must be true. Shame as he really looks to be a natural dribbler like Messi or old Giggs.

    Maybe we should go fetch C.Queiroz back and have him coach the lad…

  85. Stephen:

    @NicoQB: Er he woked wonders with Anderson :roll: :roll:

  86. Red Ranter:

    Vickery’s had good things to say about Hernanes in his latest Q&A column.

  87. Traverse:

    @NicoQB: He didn’t write the kid off completely, but he says he needs to grow up and that anyone who thinks he’s going to waltz in and be Ronaldo has another thing coming.

  88. Stephen:

    @Traverse: If we are looking at another left sided midfield player it does make a mockery of spending £8m on Tosic, what was the point of signing him if we have no intention of giving the lad a run??

  89. ROOOOONEY:

    grog, this may not be true but you can piss your pants
    http://www.goal.com/en/news/9/england/2009/06/23/1343061/manchester-united-ready-to-pay-60-million-for-sergio-aguero

  90. Fred The Red:

    @Grognard: Tim Vickery also said that the boy had loads of potential, he never said that he was a bad player, what he did say was that at the minute he was to inconsistent and immature to be a direct replacement for Ronaldo, which is stating the obvious mate, coz no 18 year in world football is capable of replacing Ronaldo, just in the same way that Ronaldo did not replace what Beckham provided when he left. Im not saying that Costs is better than Ronaldo or that Ronaldo was better than costa, but the fact is that Ronaldo, despite being blatantly talented, did not really start to become the player that we wanted until he was into his 20s, so I for one would not condemn Costa for being something that all 18 year players are, immature and inconsistent.
    The kids a proper unpolished diamond mate and I would be delighted if we sign him.

  91. Fred The Red:

    @Red Ranter: have we been linked with Hernanes or is it just a fans fantasy signing

  92. Stephen:

    @Fred The Red: If we sign this lad and the inevitable signing of Valencia, one which I cannot understand, what happens to Nani? We spent all that money on him and he is just going to continue and rot in the reserves and play in the Carling Cup, seems pointless when we might already have the answer already.

  93. NicoQB:

    @Dan: @Andrei: I’d rather Rodwell stay at Everton and get regular opportunities to play.

    If indeed he’s the real mccoy. then we fork out 30 – 35 millions and we’re sure to get a world class CM.

    Right now at Unietd, despite our CM being weak, there’s too much competition among youngsters even to get into the squad, let alone in the eleven.

  94. Fred The Red:

    @Stephen: give Nani and Valencia a run in the team mate and let Costa be an understudy, let him grow and mature, hes only 18 and theres enough games to do this and if he developes into the player that I think he is then we can cross that bridge in 2 years time coz by the end of next season we will know whether Nani is going to make it or not.

  95. NicoQB:

    @Stephen: I think Anderson played better when CQ was here. His form, which was not so great to start with at the end of last season, dipped again this season.

    Maybe its some kind of Rookie block (common in US sports I think) where the expectations of the good rookie first season, causes lads to underperform under the weight of expectations. Even Ronaldo had it.

  96. Stephen:

    @Fred The Red: I hope he and anderson do make it mate, but you are right also Tosic may have to rotated in also, I hope if and when we sign Valencia it is no more than £17m, which for me is all the money for him.

  97. Stephen:

    @NicoQB: It could also be second season syndrome, touch wood, because last season he was poor, but hopefully next season he will kick. His performances last season had nothing to do with CQ, he simply lost form I do wonder what a goal would do for his confidence, would it settle him down, who knows!

  98. NicoQB:

    Question:
    Do young latin players ever mature?

    I would argue that Ronaldo didn’t so much mature as change some elements to his game.

    I get the impression that level-headed latin players were actually so to start with.

    Maybe I’m wrong. Just an impression.

  99. Fred The Red:

    @Stephen: I have a hunch that the United fans are going to be pleasantly surprised by Valencia, he is a good all round player who could blossom by playing with better players, like Paddy Crerand said, football is an easy game, but its made even easier when you are surrounded by good players.

  100. Fred The Red:

    @NicoQB: there is an element of truth to what you are saying mate, but I think its down to the football culture that you are brought up in, remember the fuss that was made when Nani and Ronaldo were accused of showboating and being disrespecful towards opponents for basically just being skilfull, Latin players are encouraged to express themselves and this hinders them learning the team aspect of the game, British players have the team aspect drummed into them from a young age which in my opinion hinders their individual progress, so I will leave it up to you to decide who produces the better players.

  101. Stephen:

    @Fred The Red: I feel we have too many bodies and not enough World class performers.
    We should go out and get a top draw player rather spending big money on non proven quality, we could get Van Der Vaart, Sneijder or Drenthe who all obviously don’t play in the positions talked about, for the same money?
    Fergie always tries to buy young and make stars, Wenger buys obvious quality like Veira, Henry and Rosicky who have lost there way but have obvious ability, I am not saying Wenger is a better manager than Fergie but maybe a change of philosophy this season would be a better option.
    We already have Tosic, Nani, Park, Anderson who have something to prove to the club and fans, why not go out and buy someone of proven quaility as we have a massive squad already.

  102. Traverse:

    @Stephen: I think we bought Tosic mainly to make it easier for Ljajic when we comes over. Ljajic was being talked about by many as a future world superstar since before we bought him. If everything everyone has said is true, then spending £8mil on someone who’ll help him bed in, some one from his own country he can talk to, hang out with, and it makes his life in England a whoel lot easier for him then it may well be the best £8mil we ever spend!

  103. Traverse:

    @ROOOOONEY: That’s super crazy, both crazy talk and crazy money. I;d imagine we are going to negotiate for him, but I very much doubt we’ll pay his £50mil buy out clause.

  104. Stephen:

    @Traverse: It is putting quite a bit of pressure on Ljajic!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:
    I thought Vida would have been the father figure option, but maybe someone his own age might be sensible, and you never know with Tosic he might work out well.
    All I am saying with Tosic bro, we have Tosic, Park, Nani lets say Valencia and maybe we take a punt at Costa, there is a lot of promise but no real proven quility in there, maybe I am being too cynical :lol:

  105. gator:

    @ROOOOONEY: bring it on

  106. Grognard:

    @Dan: What, do you think United are stupid enough to tell him he’s guaranteed the #1 starter position? Get real. Like all players he is told he can compete for that spot. Fergie knows he needs a dependable backup for EVDS this season and then next year he will bring in another keeper to compete with Foster for #1. That is when Foster will become the official #2, whether he likes it or not.

  107. Grognard:

    @Traverse: That’s why you buy players now to rectify the situation. And Scholes, Giggs, Neville and EVDS retiring is not a problem for me mate. They have been playing for far too long as it is and keeping younger players back. It’s time for them to step aside or these young players will never get the necessary experience they lack due to the old farts holding them back.

  108. Grognard:

    @ROOOOONEY: It will be a sad day in Hell I ever believe anything that comes out of Marca or even Goal. Lies lies lies. I wish but Fergie will not pay that kind of money to get Ronaldo back. It’s just not going to happen.

  109. Stephen:

    @Grognard: Next season for the Golden Generation even for me is at least a season too far, I will never slate them but Fergie ten years ago would never allow them to continue next season.
    I am not sure whether Anderson, Possebon and Gibson are the right heirs to the throne, but time waits for no man I am afriad.

  110. NicoQB:

    @Fred The Red: True, true!

    Maybe that’s why world class CMs are produced in greater numbers in non-latin Europe, while latin countries tend to produce wingers in greater quantities.

    Maybe its for the best.

  111. Grognard:

    @Fred The Red: True but I still think Ronaldo was pretty special even in his first year. By his third year he was in the top five players in the world and in my opinion has been the top player in the world the past three years despite the year Messi had. Messi never dealt with all the BS and the injury problems this year that Ronaldo had. Costa would have to be something amazing to come close to Ronny and I don’t think his attitude or temperament will allow him to do so. I hope I’m wrong.

  112. Grognard:

    @NicoQB: Christ all mighty, the lad scores a freaking goal for the under 21′s and all of a sudden he is the second coming of Nemanja Vidic. Get real. I saw the lad play and he does nothing for me. Not a bad player but nothing to get all worked up over. Seriously guys, he’s a defender. They are a dime a dozen and all look good at that age playing against kids their own age.

  113. Grognard:

    @Stephen: That’s why Fergie should sign a Hernanes, a van der Vaart, a Melo , a Toure or a Sneijder. I would keep Giggs as a backup because he can still play well for 20 minutes at a time. But as for the rest, it’s time to stamp them “past expiry date”.

  114. Stephen:

    @Grognard: I agree Giggs still has something to offer but Gary Neville God bless him really needs to hold his hands up, Scholes posibley can still play but not at the highest level consistantly, so the option of a plyer coach role at Stoke would probably be a better option for him, as I am not sure simply playing in the league cup would float his boat, which for me is hard to say.

  115. Dan:

    @Grognard: How many times have you seen melo play?

  116. Red Ranter:

    I have reservations about Aguero. Not because of his ability, but our history with Argie players. They tend to fuck us over. Now people will throw the ‘but he’s claimed to be a United fan’ argument, but then, even Tevez turned up at a Corinthians press conference in a United shirt.

    I am probably being paranoid, but that’s how I’m feeling about this at present.

  117. Red Ranter:

    @Man-U-cho: You don’t have to apologize to me for going off topic. How many threads have you seen here that actually stick to topics. I do allow a more than fair amount of freestyle debating here. :)

  118. Red Ranter:

    @Traverse: It is £21m mate. Here

  119. Fred The Red:

    @Grognard: Yes Ronaldo showed big potential in his first three years mate, but he was far from special and like I said, I dont want to turn this into whose the better of the two, I was just pointing out the similarities in the situations of the arrivals, an immature highly talented but erratic Ronaldo replacing a club legend who was one of our most effective players at the time in Beckham, and an immature highly talented but erratic Costa replacing the current world player of the year.

    I think this statement from the clubs official website sums up Ronnys contribution in the first three seasons well

    “His second term didn’t quite live up to his first, but late season form saw him end 2004/05 with nine goals in 50 appearances. In 2005/06 Ronny again reserved his best form for the latter stages, but the inconsistencies of a developing young player were being ironed”

  120. Fred The Red:

    @Stephen: you may be right mate, that shouldnt stop us addiing talented young players for the future as well, AC Milan still signed experienced players at the same time they signed Kaka, its not an either or situation, why not get rid of some of the dead wood and then sign young players and experienced players.

  121. Grognard:

    @Dan: About 20 times why? 20 times with Fiorentina and Brazil combined.

  122. Andrei:

    @Grognard: Nah, Ronaldo’s first season was half-decent, but in his second one, he was atrocious. He would dribble, and dribble and dribble and not pass, and dribble and shoot. Not saying that he did not become a good player after that, but in his second season, he hardly did anything constructive. Rooney was the driving force those days, then Ronaldo caught up to him.

  123. johnsom33:

    @Fred The Red: Your missing the point about costas. No one is disputing the kids talent. He just isnt worth 20m. he is worth no more than 12m, and thats pushing it. 8-10 is a fair price.

  124. Andrei:

    @Grognard: Yea, I sorta like Melo too. Not the best midfielder you will ever see, but he is the kind who just keeps on quietly ploughing away at the task until it is done.

  125. johnsom33:

    @Andrei: I thought Rooney was better than Ronaldo :lol: :lol:

  126. Grognard:

    @Red Ranter: Is it possible however that they aren’t fucking us over as much as Fergie has fucked them over. I don’t think he was fair to Veron playing him out of his natural position and he certainly was not fair to Heinze who was returning after a bad injury but who had been the club’s MVP before his injury. And really, without getting on the pro Carlito bandwagon, was he fair with Tevz? I don’t think he was at all. So perhaps the problem isn’t with the Argentines but with Fergie’s unfair treatment of them. Don’t blame them if their pride and passion get the better of them and they bolt due to conditions becoming worse than they can handle. Argies are highly emotional individuals and they need to be treated with a bit more respect and kid gloves. Clearly Fergie does not like doing this with them, so you are right, getting Aguero despite his allegiance to our club, may be a big mistake. But then again, I wouldn’t worry about it happening. That’s just a bunch of Marca BS.

  127. Grognard:

    @johnsom33: Good for you mate. You win a cookie. And you enjoy that Rooney is better than Ronaldo party with the other three people on the planet who agree with you and who aren’t related to to Wayne. :wink: :lol:

  128. Grognard:

    @Fred The Red: I’m sorry mate because I just can’t see things from your point of view. You see Ronaldo looked very special to me and I thought he was fantastic from day one. He went from very good to excellent in three years and then afterwards, he went from excellent to God status for the next three. So I just don’t buy your appraisal of his early years. He was a gem from day one. It wasn’t just about the goals either. He had presence and style on the pitch.

  129. Grognard:

    @Andrei: Far from it. He was going through a bit of a sophomore jinx but he rebounded and had a great second half. I always enjoyed watching him play and I especially remember his FA Cup performance at the end of that second season which I feel was truly world class. At that point he might have been a rough diamond, but he was a diamond nonetheless.

  130. Fred The Red:

    @Grognard: About this Hernanes boy, are we being linked with him or is he just a player that you admire.

  131. tevez:

    @Red Ranter: None of the argie’s fucked us over really. Veron wasn’t right for the league, heinze found himself playing second fiddle to evra and tevez found himself playing second fiddle to berbatov and rooney. They were right to leave the club.

  132. Grognard:

    @Andrei: He’s fearless and he is an intimidator. A no nonsense player who gives no ground and doesn’t do it gently like a Hargreaves but steps into a player like a Keane, Makalele or Vieira. I think he’s just too frakken good to not be going after. Especially for a team that lacks grit and physicality in the middle of the park. We have Melo for the Champions League final and trust me, Xavi and Iniesta think twice about holding on to the ball for that little bit extra.

  133. Grognard:

    @Fred The Red: Just a player I admire and to be honest a player who is so good at his age that I am amazed that Fergie hasn’t taken to him. 22 years old and already playing the box to box role with skill and composure like a 28 year old. And he’s Brazilian which makes me wonder how the heck we are missing him considering that is the major region of our scouting focus? He would be ideal for our needs.

  134. Andrei:

    @johnsom33: Just slightly :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

  135. johnsom33:

    @Grognard: You have me confused with the president of Rooneys fan club(@Andrei: ). Rooney isnt on the same level as Ronaldo.

  136. Fred The Red:

    @Grognard: we are saying the sme things but in different ways my friend, before the Arsenal game at Highbury when he scored twice I was speaking to a Liverpool supporting work colleague who was having a poke at me about our team I remember telling him that despite opinions to the contrary that it was actually exciting times at OT because we were seeing the emergence of two of the best young players in Europe in Rooney and Ronaldo, this game made him sit up and take notice of my words coz before this he was unconvinced about Ronny, and the reason he was unconvinced was because he was so inconsistent and that was the opinion of most people and they were right.
    The Ronaldo of the first three was light years away from the Ronaldo of the last three, but thats perfectly normal for a young player. thats all Im saying mate, he showed signs of a player that could become special, but to say that he was special at the time is overstating his effectiveness.

  137. Fred The Red:

    @Grognard: I would be very surprised if SAF is not aware of Hernanes mate, theres not many players that he is not aware of. His problem is that he is not ruthless enough with his more average players, players like Butt, P Neville, Park, Fletcher, mcclair, and to a certain degree Carrick, all these players had serious linitations as players and could have been easily replaced with players of more quality.

  138. tevez:

    @Grognard: Xavi and iniesta are courageous players who cannot be kicked out of a football match. The champions league final was men against boys and the addition of a player in midfield who can kick people would not have made a difference. We were lacking in all areas of the pitch and in centre midfield we were completely inept in all aspects, both in attack and defense. A physical, aggressive player isn’t going to make a great difference against a team of barcelona’s class, at least not with what he would have had alongside him. All melo would have done was get frustrated at not being able to get close enough to put in a tackle.

  139. Fred The Red:

    @Grognard: If I was in charge mate, I would have no hesitation in letting Carrick and Fletcher leave and replacing them with Hernanes and Pastore, its an absolute no brainer mate, hes far too loyal to players who are no better than Tottenham, Everton or Villa class, in fact the day he retires, whoever takes over will wield the axe on about 4 or 5 players at least.

  140. Jay wire:

    A lot of debate about the value of Douglas Costa is going on here.I have to agree with those who say Ronaldo was highly inconsistent and showed only glimpses of promise. He was probably the worst decision maker in the EPL.Everytime he lined up a shot we all knew he was going to drag it wide or bless the stands.He was totally outshone by Rooney who was incredible for someone at that age.But he began to develop and was developed by the coaching staff to become the player he is today.

    I don’t know much about Costa except for a few YouTube clips where he seems to be playing against young players or reserves.Either way I don’t think anything is guaranteed and that includes him becoming a world class player.Remember that Milan bought Kaka after only 5 appearances for his club and look at where he is now.One Graeme Souness thought Deco was the most useless player in Portugal when he was a youngster in his Benfica team.Porto reaped the rewards of his poor judgement.However for the sums being mentioned I wouldn’t waste my time but if a reasonable fee can be agreed he could be worth the risk.But we should still get a world class midfielder and striker to fill the void left by Ronaldo and Tevez.And I believe the answer could be found in Valencia. The team that is. David (Villa and Silva). Valencia the player doesn’t seem to cut it for me.

  141. Traverse:

    @Red Ranter: I beg to differ. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/leagues/premierleague/manutd/5610082/Manchester-United-priced-out-of-deal-for-Cristiano-Ronaldos-replacement.html

  142. Traverse:

    @tevez: But it’s the manner in which Heinze and Tevez did it, with such contempt, that I cannot abide.

    And it’s not like Veron or Heinze went on to prove Fergie wrong…..

  143. Traverse:

    @tevez: They did fuck all against Chelsea in 2 matches with Essien sorting both of them out at the same time, or us last season with Hargreaves.

  144. Traverse:

    @Jay wire: Until he had the 42 goal season, me and my friends took bets when he lined up for a free kick on whether it was going to go into row Z or straight into the wall. He was a frustrating player until he hit his form.

  145. Fred The Red:

    @johnsom33: Im not missing the point mate, I never said Costs was worth 20 million, but hes worth more than our rumoured initial bid, I think 10 to 12 would be a fair price for the boy.

  146. Jay wire:

    @tevez: Tbh I think a certain Hargreaves would have been a great help in that match.Whenever you play teams like Barca and Arsenal(in their glory days) you need an enforcer.Otherwise you’ll get passed to death and get embarrassed. Like what happened against Milan in 2007 and again in Rome this year.Teams like these are passing teams who always have eleven technically brilliant players and at least one outstanding passing midfielder. Clearly we lack in that department and our game plan depends largely on individual brilliance at moments of magic. So an enforcer helps in disrupting the fluidity of passing teams and will calmly pass the ball back to teammates.You can’t expect Carrick to win the ball when it’s in the possession of Xavi,Iniesta or a drifting Messi.If Hargreaves is going to continue his injury issues then we should look at getting Essien or someone like that

  147. Jay wire:

    While I’m at it I think I should add that we need to get that archaic English game out of our system.LONG BALLS. Please get rid of it. I thoroughly hate it and it always screws us over in the Champions League.That’s why we get embarrassed by the likes of Barca and Milan.It’s time that the British begin to apply more technically relevant training methods and allow players to skillfully express themselves.I can tell you one thing honestly;were it not for United I won’t even bother watching the EPL.I mean which other league would you hear words like showboating and showpony.It is not compulsory for a fullback to always dash down the wing and cross the ball into the box even when there is noone to get on the end of it. It is not a crime to calmly pass the ball on the ground and work your way towards goal and that means it is also not the primary function of a centre forward to receive aerial balls from the centre back or central midfielder who simply hopes he is accurate enough and the opposing players marking the said CF don’t jump higher and also the CF can bring the ball down successfully.Are you listening Nemanja Vidic and Michael Carrick

  148. tevez:

    @Traverse: If you’re not in the team then you have good reason to leave. I can understand why fergie couldn’t find a place in his team for these three players at the times they wished to leave. Veron wasn’t right for the team. Fergie could not accomodate him. Fair enough, but why buy him then? He could not adapt and parting ways was best for both club and player.
    With heinze, when he played regularly there was no problem but when he wasn’t in the team and he was fit he wasn’t happy. I can understand that. I can also understand that fergie had an able player in evra who was a far better attacking asset to the team. Ultimately, fergie favoured evra which is fair enough but i can’t find fault with heinze wanting to leave.
    Tevez is the same. Manchester united is tevez’s favourite club outside of argentina and he would have been very happy to play out his career here until he went back to boca. Only if he was getting a game though. I really don’t understand how people can hold that against him.
    I personally love the attitude that these players have, where playing regular football is the most important thing. I would much rather get a regular game for man city than play a bit-part role for man united.

  149. Craig Mc:

    @tevez: Essien is such a player, and he did keep the Barca MF in uselessness in both games, and NO WAY should Barca have been in Rome, and everyone knows it. Chelsea were mugged by THE REFEREE!

  150. Craig Mc:

    @tevez: I hope he does get a regular game for Man Pity mate, because he wont be winning anything else except his 1st team place. The PL will be won by one of the top 4, of whom Man Pity will not be one of :smile: .

  151. Craig Mc:

    @Fred The Red: I think about 8 million Fred, but WITH GOOD ENHANCEMENTS depending on whether he makes it or not. This used to be common practice didn’t it?

  152. Andrei:

    Drifting off-topic here, but I just saw Serbia-Sweden and I have two things to say about that match:

    1. Tosic has real potential. His dribbling is very good in small spaces and I am now quite convinced that if he had decent players around him, he would have be able to be more creative and productive.

    2. Marcus Berg. He is young, he is big, he is strong, he knows how to finish. His numbers are very good (almost Huntelaar-like) and he adds a good deal of skill on top of a player that aspires to imitate the likes of Inzaghi, RvN, Crespo, etc.

    I think he has excellent movement and decision making and, unlike our strikers (Rooney, Berbatov), he knows when to stay in the middle and when to drop back/drift wide. Just wondering (if anybody else saw the game or saw this guy before) if he would make a good third choice striker for us.
    :?:

  153. tevez:

    @Traverse: Chelsea played well and were very unlucky. They have a strong central midfield who turned up on the night, no doubt. Plus michael essien is out of melo’s league. What i’m saying is, chelsea needed all three central midfield players, nah in fact they needed the entire team to really put in top performances and they did. We do not have a strong collective group to play in central midfield which is why having melo in the team would have made little difference. The players around him were not up to the job which would have stifled his effectiveness.

  154. tevez:

    @Traverse: Against us the season before last barca were the better team by a clear mile. They had control of the game and xavi and iniesta put in good performances, especially xavi who just doesn’t have bad games. Also, messi was the best player on the pitch, completely outshining ronaldo.

  155. tevez:

    @Craig Mc: I honestly would rather be playing week-in, week-out for man city finishing 5th in the league rather than play back-up to rooney and berbatov all season and winning the treble.

  156. Craig Mc:

    @Stephen: You are being far too cynical where Nani is concerned, you nasty GIT Stephen :wink: :wink: :lol: . I’m coming to your house to kick your arse :evil: :grin: .

    What day are you taking the big leap with that Missus of yours eh?

  157. NicoQB:

    @Fred The Red: To be honest, personally I thought the criticism towards Ronaldo was highly exagerrated. I always thought he was an outrageously good player, even in his first and second season. I’m siding with Grognard here (See Grog! It can happen :smile: ).

    @Grognard: Hey I agree. Re-read my comment. If Rodwell does turn out to be as good as some claim him to be I’d rather he join us after gaining experience at Everton, rather than join us and warm the benches.

  158. Fred The Red:

    @Craig Mc: I will go for that deal mate, pack your bags, your heading to Brasil to start the negotiations

  159. tevez:

    @Andrei: Tosic has been the best player in that serbia team by some distance. Unfortunately, that serbia team are probably the most boring and unimaginative side i have ever seen. Tosic has some skill and a nice left foot. He’s not very quick and has no strength or dig. He loses the ball all the time. I would give him credit for at least trying to make things happen and dribbling often and showing that he is prepared to try things out, but when he had his debut for us he cowered away so i won’t.

  160. Fred The Red:

    @NicoQB: I thought the citicism of Ronny was exaggerated too mate, but to call him special in his first three years is exagerating as well

  161. Craig Mc:

    @Fred The Red: :lol: :lol: :lol: .

  162. Craig Mc:

    @tevez: Well then, that’s exactly what he will get, so why all the tears eh?

  163. tevez:

    @Fred The Red: He was good enough to come to united and feature in the team right away and play regularly quickly, and in his first three seasons he was still an important player for us and a player who we looked too to create something. He was special just like rooney was. Is douglas costa that good?

  164. Craig Mc:

    Red Ranter, could you PLEASE start a Ronnie/Tevez FREE thread, for those of us who are fucking nauseated with talking about these two long after they have gone. THEY ARE GONE. I want to talk with those who want to discuss Man United, and the players we still have :smile: . So have one thread for the boring sentimentalists who want to keeo talking RON/TEv, and another free from RON/TEV for anybody who wants to change the fucking subject :roll: :lol: :lol: . Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeese boss :lol: .

  165. tevez:

    @Craig Mc: Tears mate? Over what? Tevez leaving is best for the player i have no complaints about that. I also feel that rooney and berbatov are both superior players to tevez and offer more as a partnership. I would not have bought tevez in the first place, and I certainly would have understood when he decided he didn’t want to sign permanently for the club.

  166. Grognard:

    @Fred The Red: In that case we agree. Like I said, the Ronaldo of today is a God while he was only very good when he started. But even with his mistakes early on, he still had a way of getting you off your seat and howl even if you were all by yourself in your own living room. You just knew he was going to be the best.

  167. Fred The Red:

    @tevez: would you people who are arguing with me about Ronnys first three years please go back and read my comments, I never said he was poor, I never said he didnt contribute, I never said he wasnt important, I SAID HE WAS TOO INCONSISTENT TO BE CALLED SPECIAL.

  168. Grognard:

    @Fred The Red: You know you are right. But it amazes me, no it totally shocks me that he can be pleased and even content with the pedestrian brigade he presently has manning those positions. There are not that many good central midfielders available these days. You have to go after the best ones when all you can brag about is how your best midfielder is Darren Fletcher. Has it really come to this with the old man?

  169. Grognard:

    @tevez: Like Hell they can’t. I watch Barca quite a bit and they can be easily intimidated with some physical play. Especially that little puffder Iniesta. Chelsea had those guys screaming at shadows but they were lucky enough to get a lucky goal at the end of the second leg to advance. So I definitely disagree with you on that. They are quality players but they have their limits.

  170. Grognard:

    @Fred The Red: He’s far too loyal to players from the UK. I’ve noticed that. It’s a bigotry or bias that is quite evident really. My combination right now would be Hernanes and Melo. But I wouldn’t mind Schneijder replacing Hernanes or Toure replacing Melo either.

  171. Fred The Red:

    @Craig Mc: I agree mate, I posted a comment earlier stating certain similarities in the circumstances Ronnys arrival and the potential arrival of Costa, but I stated that I was not comparing the two players, only the circumstances of thier arrivals, but since then I have attacked me for things I didnt even say, so Im with you mate, Im not getting into any more debates about players who have left the club, only current players or potential recriuts.

  172. Grognard:

    @Jay wire: Actually mate, I have always thought Deco to be an overrated and highly useless bag of fear. He cowers in a little ball if the game is physical and I was certain he would end up a major failure in the physical EPL and I was right. He’s as soft as they get.

  173. Grognard:

    @Traverse: Nobody’s condoning their methods but understand that they were hurt and felt betrayed. If your employer treated you like crap I seriously doubt you would leave the job and wish him a nice day and good luck with the business. :grin:

  174. tevez:

    @Fred The Red: I’m arguing that he was special in his first three years, because he, like rooney, came into the team right away and had much of the attacking burden placed on his shoulders. They were focal points of the attack, given great creative responsibility and when they got the ball they always looked like being capable of doing something with it. They didn’t have the frequent crap and uninspiring games that nani and anderson have, where they just don’t look the part. They stood out in the team right from the off.

  175. Fred The Red:

    @tevez: I really dont want to carry this debate on mate, but my final word on it is this, they stood out in a team that won practically nothing and was light years behind United teams of the past and present, when they did BECOME special players after 3 years we started to win major honours again, theres a difference between special young talents and special mature players.

  176. tevez:

    @Grognard: Against chelsea, iniesta was barca’s best player and he was certainly not afraid to pick up the ball and dribble with it and try to express himself. He looked real scared and intimidated by the four towering chelsea players closing in on him when he stroked the ball into the top corner in the last minute eh. I watch barcelona as much as i can and they cannot be bullied out of games. Rough tactics never stop them from expressing themselves. Especially messi. He gets fouled time after time, which is to be expected given his playing style, and yet he just gets up and gets on with it. He doesn’t sulk and throw a hissy fit like ronaldo.

  177. Fred The Red:

    @tevez: was that the game were Chesea had by far the better of the chances, is that the game were the Ref could have awarded at least 3 penalties to Chelses or is that the game when Barca only had one shot on target in 94 miniutes of football, Iniesta probably was Barcas best player, but that would not have been hard coz they were all rubbish.
    The point Grog is making is not stopping completley Barcas attacking play for ninety mins, its about having players that make it more awkward for them to control games in the midfield, good defensive mids can do this.

  178. tevez:

    @Fred The Red: Yes, a good defensive midfielder helps, but if barca have three central midfielders passing in triangles one good defensive midfielder can’t do fuck all about it if his midfield teammates are not at the races. We have an entirely weak midfield, so getting that quality defensive midfielder in or hargreaves back is a good step forward, but not the last piece of the centre midfield puzzle.

  179. Redrich:

    @tevez: We didn’t have enough players in CMF, end of story! If SAF had the balls to play Rafael we could have had O’Shea sweeping up behind Carrick and Anderson. It would have made a massive difference, kept us very compact going forward and kept the Barca attack very honest.
    The game against Barca doesn’t define our team for better or for worse. Tacticaly SAF felt hamstrung when Fletcher was suspended and he just didn’t trust the youngsters to play in such a big game!!
    It was a mistake, and poor judgement on SAF’s part, but that don’t happen too often, and so I say, fuck it, lets move on!! :wink:

  180. johnsom33:

    @Craig Mc: Are you serious? every day I come up here, you are up to your ears in a debate about how much you could care less about Ron/tev leaving. :lol: :lol: :lol:

  181. Redrich:

    @Grognard: You might, if you really need another job!! :lol: :lol:

  182. Redrich:

    @Craig Mc: Just a gentle reminder, that your legacy on this site, as far as you’re concerned, is that you predicted the Ronaldo departure. That, and your reckoning that Nani is the second coming. :lol: :lol:

  183. Red Ranter:

    @Craig Mc: Ronnie and Tevez will be glossed over not just this summer, but for the rest of next season. Everytime we draw or lose, someone will come up with, “that’s why we shouldn’t have sold Ronnie/Tevez” and the rest of the thread will be spent discussing why Berbatov is not the answer, blah blah blah. It’s unavoidable. Just close your eyes the moment you see Ronaldo or Tevez get mentioned. :grin:

  184. Madschester United:

    @Grognard: You stole the words out of my mouth. Unimaginative. Ugly V-line across the chest, containing the logo along with the nike symbol. Disgusting.

  185. Dan:

    @Red Ranter: you got it in one!

  186. donibrasco:

    @Jay wire: No truer words have ever been said about the EPL.I too have failed to understand the whole show pony thing,fans appreciate huff and puff rather than skill and still call football entertainment.
    I remember the days of Keane,Becks,Scholes,and Giggs in midfield.Fans still rave about them but aside from the treble,we used to gethumiliated in Europe by the Virrareals,Leverkusens,and all small sides in Europe and that was especially down to lack of individual skill because they had all the work rate.
    You might say we dominated the EPL,but just like Porto,or Lyon,we had the financial muscle to.
    The influx of foreigners has contributed a lot but some fans are still stuck in their ways.We can now attack with flair,not crossing at any time like it is in the SPL,no leg breaking tacles and shouting captains,but when you see the output,we are better than we were.Only thing lacking is the manager allowing players to express themselves and take off the shackles off attacking and skillful players

  187. Craig Mc:

    @donibrasco: Well if that isn’t ironic, I don’t know what is. You a ‘HUFF AND PUFF’ Tevez fan, criticising the EPL fans, forgive us if we don’t take your comments seriously. :roll:

  188. Craig Mc:

    @Red Ranter: :lol: :lol: :lol: .

  189. Craig Mc:

    @Redrich: AND??????????? :smile: .

  190. Craig Mc:

    @johnsom33: Yeah that’s because that is the only fucking subject being discussed mate :roll: :grin: .

  191. Craig Mc:

    @Redrich: Errrr Red Rich, he didn’t need to take a chance on Rafael, Wes Brown was FIT and could have played right back with great effect in that game. Then like you say, Sheasy could have moved to mop up behind Carrick :lol: . If you and I were managing the team that day, we would have WON hands down :wink: , if not we certainly would have put on a performance to be more proud of, instead of the limp arsed one given!

  192. Craig Mc:

    @tevez: Aaaaah all is revealed then, we see that you are a SECRET Barca supporter :lol: .

  193. Stephen:

    @Craig Mc: Ha ha I have been banging the play Nani drum mate so I am innocent!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
    April 10th next year, is the biggish day :lol: :lol: :lol:

  194. Craig Mc:

    @Fred The Red: Good on you Fred. It will be interesting to see IF anybody actually does come in this summer or not now. Everybody is scrambling for the top few players, which isn’t easy for all the clubs involved. Look at the lad Villa, he is out of his mind with all the pressure he is under from the clubs chasing him. We don’t think of it that way do we, what effect it has on a player who is settled, and has a young family to consider. Selling clubs see the bounty on the players head, and want to cash in, whether the player wants to move or not. Villa has always said that he wants to stay in Spain, and his young family/pregnant wife are settled and don’t need the upheaval of a move at this particular inconvenient time – shame! So it is not all hearts and roses for some of these young footballers.

  195. Craig Mc:

    @Grognard: They were lucky enough indeed to get that jammy goal, although it was a beauty that came from nowhere. Chelski were unlucky though not to get any of the 3 penalty shouts :roll:

  196. Craig Mc:

    @Fred The Red: Fred Bro, what you say, and the way it is misinterpreted by others, well it is wide as the Persian gulf. That is the thing, what we ACTUALLY say, and what the other person hears, are two different things :lol: . Yet we are all prone to that, its humanity mate!

  197. Craig Mc:

    Rumour has it that Birmingham are after signing Fabio as they are desperate for a left back. It says they want to buy him, but surely SAF wont allow that, even though the B’ham manager is SAF’s buddy! It would be a big mistake, as we are not the strongest on the left side of the field, AND that would not help Rafael, because he is very close to his brother. Hope SAF wises up over this, and the most he agrees is short term LOAN only. I don’t think SAF has realised yet what he has got with Fabio!

  198. Wink:

    @Stephen: Maybe to lure Llajic or to make Vidic happier at OT? the more and more i think about it, it seems like he is another Dong Fang Zhou, a ‘sweetener’ type player for another purpose

  199. Stephen:

    @Wink: Dong was brought into the club to sell shirts, Tosic might be the “buddy” for Llajic if the lad is htat good, and be a bit of a bpunt at the same time.
    People seem to be getting excited by Llajic but realistic nobody actually know if he will live up to expectations, we all hope he will but could be either another Ronaldo or Feddie Adu(about nothing) :lol:
    Tosic looks Ok but nothing more, but maybe a few games he might work out to be Ok.

  200. Traverse:

    @tevez: He wasn’t good enough so he took his ball and went home. Rather than play better he cries like a little girl and goes to anyone who’ll play him. To me, those are the traits of a coward.

  201. Traverse:

    @Grognard: I don’t think being second best to better players is a legitimate reason. Veron I have no problems with, he was ahead of his time. We could use a 25yrold Veron right now!

  202. Traverse:

    @tevez: If it wasn’t for the referee in that game it would have been a 4-1 crushing defeat, and everyone would be talking about Barca needing to rebuild. Instead they are every Brazilian world cup team and Hollands total football team rolled into one.

  203. tevez:

    @Traverse: There’s nothing wrong with wanting to play football mate, or just wanting a fair crack of the whip. He didn’t get that.

  204. tevez:

    @Traverse: That’s the way football is mate. No-one here payed much attention to our centre midfield until after the final. We were going to win 3-0 in a comfortable triumph against a team of overrated softies. They wouldn’t be able to get the ball to the front three, let alone break our rock solid defense. Our swift counter-attacking would be devastating against their patched up and useless back four.
    None of those penalty claims were clear cut. Chelsea were unlucky but not cheated. The referee wasn’t that bad.

  205. Traverse:

    @tevez: He did. I can’t expect you to Understand, you have Tevez as your name on here! But I deal with FACHTS.

    Premier League + Champions League Stats 08/09, ordered by top goalscorer

    Ronaldo : 45 Games, 22 Goals, 8 Assists
    Rooney : 43 Games, 16 Goals, 10 Assists
    Berbatov : 40 Games, 13 Goals, 9 Assists
    Tevez : 38 Games, 7 Goals, 4 Assists
    Carrick : 37 Games, 4 Goals, 5 Assists
    Vidic : 43 Games, 5 Goals, 1 Assist

    Of our 4 strikers, he ranks 4th. Why should he start? He’s the 4th best striker in our team. Our 3rd place striker has double the goals and double the assists from 2 more games. It’s nothing personal, he’s just not that good.

  206. Traverse:

    @tevez: Now I know you’re a Barca supporter! I hate the southern scumbags as much as the next man, but I was furious!

  207. colver:

    We can’t make excuses about Barcelona not deserving to beat Chelsea. If you want to be champions of Europe you have to beat whatever team you come up against.

    In the past three years we have been brutally exposed by Milan and Barcelona. The common denominator was our weak midfield coming up against a midfield in their prime (Kaka, Pirlo, Gattuso and Iniesta, Xavi with Messi floating in the hole).

    I also think if we had come up against Liverpool in Europe this season they would have destroyed us just like they did in the league. Again strong midfield (Masch, Alonso, Gerrard).

    Midfield is never going to be our strong area like it was in the 90s. But we need to try to do something to improve it. As a bare minimum we need another defensive midfielder because with Hargreaves out we are too reliant on Fletcher. But with Giggs and Scholes close to retirement a playmaker would be useful as well-Carrick just doesn’t have the confidence or presence to control a game.

  208. NicoQB:

    @Traverse: Definitely. Veron was class.
    The one argie I’ll always have a fondness for.

  209. Stephen:

    @NicoQB: Fergie did not use him well enough, he tried to adapt him in a 4-4-2 and still wanted to play Scholes and Keane, at times he played off a striker or even wide right. I watched him live against Everton at home and he was superb.

  210. Johnsom33:

    @Traverse: Those stats don’t include f.a. Cup or league cup which would bring tevez up to 15 goals. And this has already been discussed to death, those stats only account for appearances and not starts.

  211. donibrasco:

    @Traverse: Those stats do not include minutes played,sub appearances and you know they all matter

  212. Andrei:

    SkySports average ratings 2008-2009 season, United players:

    Rooney – 7.0
    Rafael – 6.9
    Tevez – 6.8
    Vidic – 6.7
    Ronaldo – 6.7
    Carrick – 6.7
    Ferdinand – 6.7
    Evra – 6.5

  213. Stephen:

    This Tevez debate is now going on far too long :mad: :mad: :grin:

    The simple fact that he gave us his all for two seasons, we got good value out of the £9m loan agreement, but at one point felt paying the extra £25.5m was far too much due to economic situation and the amount of games he was starting.

    We changed our mind, or called his bluff which ever way you see it, he felt unwanted due to not being offered a contract, or the conclusion of the full transfer and decided he wanted to move elsewhere.

    He has moved on and so should we.

  214. Beachryan:

    So one of the things we loved to harp on about last season was our squad strength. That we could effectively field two very competitive first XIs, that would do well enough in any given match. I know we’ve only lost two players, but somehow that’s really thrown my estimation of this. Particularly if Hargreaves is our third loss. I believe our first XI, for next year will be:

    —————vds—————
    –Brown—Rio-Vida—Evra
    —–Carrick-Fletcher——-
    -Valencia————Nani—
    ——Berbatov-Rooney—–

    Now that’s not a bad team by any stretch, but does it really stack up against Chelsea?
    ————–Cech—————
    –Bosw—JT—Alex—Cole—
    ———Essien-Ballack——-
    -Malouda—Lampard—Cole-
    ————-Drogba————–
    I don’t think so.

    But like I said, our second XI was the impressive thing, and this year…(with O’Shea and Scholes wherever)
    ———-Foster————
    -Rafa-Evans-?—Fabio-
    —-Ando—Gibbo———
    -Park————–Tosic–
    ———–Giggs————
    ———-Welbeck———-

    To me that looks seriously like a ‘second XI’. Not all that impressive, filled with potential but little proven quality. I don’t think it’s good enough.

    Anyway, this is a really long way of saying, I believe we still really need another ‘premiership ready’ striker for back up, and a ‘world class’ midfielder for slotting into our first XI, moving Fletcher to backup. I also fear that we’re just not that strong. Fletcher has improved, but he’s not someone who should be starting in one of the best teams in the world, week in/week out.

  215. NicoQB:

    @Stephen: Yep.

    To be honest, I was a fan of Veron 2 years before he joined us back at Parma I think, but I thought that the move to sign him was surprising. We had the perfect midfield four and that meant someone had to settle for the bench.
    Turns out I was right. We certainly could use the Veron of back then today.

  216. Stephen:

    @NicoQB: Fergie signed him simply because of the lack of joy we were having in Europe since 99, I think it was a bold signing and probably as you said mate would be more suitable now, how things have moved on so quickly I am getting old!! :sad: :sad: :sad:

  217. Madschester United:

    While I rarely enjoy FOX soccer channel’s website, I did find this article interesting on CR7′s replacement:

    Link

    Enjoy!

  218. Traverse:

    @Andrei: As voted for by fans on the website. Completely useless stats.

    @Johnsom33: Because those competitions do not matter on the whole to us. The FA Cup don’t have the stats handy, but claiming 4 goals against Blackburn Reserves counts for anything is desperate.

    Tevez is gone, I’m glad he’s gone, and we aren’t going to miss him.

  219. Andrei:

    @Traverse: Nope, as voted by the Sky Sports ‘experts’. It would mean much more if they were voted by the fans because it would mean that Rooney made more of an impression on us than the rest of the players did – Vidic included.

  220. Wink:

    @Traverse: i was hoping he would fill in the void that Ole left us with when his retirement/injury came about. the needed booster shot that we could hope for to deliver that last min goal for us.

    but yeah, his attitude in the closing stages of his time with us irked me. i can agree with you that we wont miss him as much as many people here reckon… Again, another player that we can say:

    “Good bye, and Thank you for all the fish!” (now, if someone can remind me where this phrase came from, i would be most appreciative :wink: )

  221. Andrei:

    @Wink: That would be from a book by Dougals Adams, The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy. It is what the dolphins sing just before the leave earth.

  222. Traverse:

    @Andrei: Really? I thought those came from the web poll they have accompanying every match.

  223. Traverse:

    @Wink: That man will cost £4m, and is called Eidur Gudjohnsen.

  224. johnsom33:

    @Traverse: Blackburn reserves? sorry but that was far from there reserve team. only the top teams field reserves for the carling cup. And you said it yourself, those cups dont matter yet those were the competitions Tevez was featured in regulary. Which fuels his argument about not being valued.

  225. johnsom33:

    @Traverse: BTW I love how you tried to turn scoring 4 goals in a game into a negative stat :lol:

  226. Red Ranter:

    @Andrei: Now that’s one hell of a book. It still manages to make me smile. This is one of the outstanding passages in the novel: (I know it’s off topic, but couldn’t resist this one)

    “It is of course well known that careless talk costs lives, but the full scale of the problem is not always appreciated.

    For instance, at the very moment that Arthur said “I seem to be having tremendous difficulty with my lifestyle,” a freak wormhole opened up in the fabric of the space-time continuum and carried his words far far back in time across almost infinite reaches of space to a distant Galaxy where strange and warlike beings were poised on the brink of frightful interstellar battle.

    The two opposing leaders were meeting for the last time.

    A dreadful silence fell across the conference table as the commander of the Vl’hurgs, resplendent in his black jewelled battle shorts, gazed levelly at the G’Gugvuntt leader squatting opposite him in a cloud of green sweet-smelling steam, and, with a million sleek and horribly beweaponed star cruisers poised to unleash electric death at his single word of command, challenged the vile creature to take back what it had said about his mother.

    The creature stirred in his sickly broiling vapour, and at that very moment the words I seem to be having tremendous difficulty with my lifestyle drifted across the conference table.

    Unfortunately, in the Vl’hurg tongue this was the most dreadful insult imaginable, and there was nothing for it but to wage terrible war for centuries.

    Eventually of course, after their Galaxy had been decimated over a few thousand years, it was realized that the whole thing had been a ghastly mistake, and so the two opposing battle fleets settled their few remaining differences in order to launch a joint attack on our own Galaxy — now positively identified as the source of the offending remark.

    For thousands more years the mighty ships tore across the empty wastes of space and finally dived screaming on to the first planet they came across — which happened to be the Earth — where due to a terrible miscalculation of scale the entire battle fleet was accidentally swallowed by a small dog.”

  227. johnsom33:

    @Stephen: “This Tevez debate is now going on far too long

    The simple fact that he gave us his all for two seasons, we got good value out of the £9m loan agreement, but at one point felt paying the extra £25.5m was far too much due to economic situation and the amount of games he was starting.

    We changed our mind, or called his bluff which ever way you see it, he felt unwanted due to not being offered a contract, or the conclusion of the full transfer and decided he wanted to move elsewhere.

    He has moved on and so should we.

    Agreed, lets all just move on.

  228. Grognard:

    @NicoQB: We’ve a;ready got the next Rio. His name is Jonny Evans.

  229. Grognard:

    @Craig Mc: You might find this hard to believe mate, but I am with you on this. I’m plum tuckered out with all this Ronny and Tevez crap. To quote Bones McCoy, “He’s dead Jim”. Lets move on.

  230. Grognard:

    @tevez: You make a mountain over a moment of inspiration and a breakdown in concentration by Chelsea, which could have been brought on by sheer fatigue. Iniesta was at 50% for both of those games and so was Xavi. Any fan with two eyes and a brain could see what wonderful job Ballack Essien, Mikel and Lampard were doing on both of them. The forwards were getting no service whatsoever because all that supply was being cut off because of Chelsea’s dogged determination and tactics of shutting down the Barca engine room. So cheer on your boys if it gives you joy but trust me, you aren’t having a legion jump on your bandwagon over this one mate. Chelsea was the blueprint on how to beat Barcelona, and when you look at the tie closely and subtract the corruption or just incompetence of the Norwegian official, you will know that Chelsea was the real winner of that two leg battle and by quite a margin. Lets just say life isn’t fair.

  231. gator:

    @Wink: hitchhikers guide to the galaxy. dont loose your towel

  232. johnsom33:

    @Grognard: Yeah chelseas midfield completely choked out Barcas attack. Everyone who says thats bullshit about “football won out” or “Chelsea didnt come to play” didnt watch both legs. I agree that the first leg mirrored our efforts aginst them at the nou camp. But the second leg game I saw was pretty much one way traffic. Drogba uncharacteristically wasted a few good chances, and of course the 2-3 stonewall penalty claims.

    The way I see it, whether we played chelsea or barca in the final we were gonna lose. We simply didnt have the midfield to beat those teams. Our only hope would have been to jump on them early, like we almost did in the final.

  233. Stephen:

    @johnsom33: We in fairness beat Chelsea 3 nil with the midfield of Giggs and Fletcher, but could they do it again in the Final? Probably not.
    I would say that in the final if we had scored first in the game when we were on top early on, would the result been different, who knows!

  234. NicoQB:

    @Grognard: Is he a CB or A DM? Effectively we don’t need another CB. But if he’s a DM…

  235. Grognard:

    @Fred The Red: The point I was making is pointing out that Chelsea had the components in place to give Barca a real beating or at least make thing as tough for them. They had as a good a central midfield as Barcelona. Sure, none of their players have the flair or finesse that Xavi and Iniesta but they have power football and physical strength that can overcome any team. Barcelona for all their style and skill are a smallish side while Chelsea is a very big and physical side. Mikel, Ballack and Essien made life miserable for those two Spanish lads and Lampard was allowed more freedom to latch on to take aways or through balls and given the job to link to Drogba. Who was going to do that kind of three man yeoman’s style work for United? Only Fletcher and Hargreaves were qualified and both were not avaialable. It was a recipe for disaster. And although I have great faith in Hargo and like Fletcher a lot, I don’t think they are physical enough or imposing enough to get Iniesta and Xavi off of their game. Now a player combination of Hernanes, Hargreaves and Melo would be masterful in my opinion One is physical and intimidating, the other hustles and harasses without getting physical and the other is th link between offense and defense due to his ability to go box to box like an Essien. Sometimes I honestly wished I pushed the buttons at OT.

    Melo and Hernanes for 15 million each, add Valencia for 16 and then you have 55 million of the 100 allotted to Fergie to go get Aguero. And then your business is done. Only thing left to do then would be to buy a world class keeper for next season.

  236. Grognard:

    @Madschester United: Isn’t it? We are going to be the laughing stock of modern day football with that ugly joke. A blast form the past and a sinking feeling in United’s sales of new kits I bloody guarantee it. I expect the sale of that new kit will drop at least 30% by the end of it’s run. I wouldn’t take one if they offered it for free. :roll:

  237. johnsom33:

    @Stephen: That was against scolari, Hiddink transformed that team into a different animal.

  238. Dan:

    @NicoQB: Nico, where has evans been playing for the entire season? tell me the one time you saw him play at CDM? I really am confused! What made you think he was a DM :???:

  239. NicoQB:

    @Red Ranter: LOL! You just convinced me to go get this book. :smile:

  240. NicoQB:

    @Dan: Haha, no we weren’t talking about Evans. :wink:

    Jack Rodwell is the name of the boy. Grog was telling me that we already have a CB in Evans. Was asking him if Rodwell was really a CB or a DM…

  241. Grognard:

    @Johnsom33: Who cares about what he did in those competitions. If it was up to me a starter wouldn’t even show his face for games of that nature. We should refuse to play the League Cup out of sheer boredom and the FA Cup has clearly become third banana. So what if Tevez scored in those games against useless opponents or EPL teams that also had watered down their squads. He was a third rate striker who couldn’t score or pass well enough to start regularly and all the hard work and desire means shite in the end if you don’t put the ball in the back of the net.

  242. Grognard:

    @Stephen: I agree. It’s sad that we are talking about a player who has left and who the majority of fans don’t even want at OT. Let the few hard core blue collar types and their utilitarian mentalities sob for a while. They’ll get over it. Tevez was a pedestrian player with very little skill and finesse and for that reason, he was not United quality. But as for me, he will always be remembered fondly for his hard work and desire. Even if it amounted to jack shit most of the time.

  243. Grognard:

    @Beachryan: I’d take Tosic out of that second 11 mate and move in Macheda to partner up front with Welbeck. Hell, Tosic sat on the bench for most of his time with the reserves.

  244. NicoQB:

    @Madschester United: Entertaining! But not accurate imho. 82 for CR’s heading? Underrated.
    97 for dribbling? Overrated.

    Ribery. 72 for finishing? Underrated.

    I could go on and on!

  245. Craig Mc:

    @Grognard: So pleased to hear that Grog :lol: . Up and away I’d say :grin: .

  246. Traverse:

    @johnsom33: I scored 5 in an under 14′s match. Fergie, sign me up.

  247. Craig Mc:

    @johnsom33: Mate – so he wasn’t valued, he pissed off to City to find the Mark Hughes, and Robi with the thumb in his mouth LOVE. End of. I just want United fans, to TALK about United players, and he isn’t one of them anymore Bro :roll: .

  248. Traverse:

    @NicoQB: It’s a trilogy, in five parts….

  249. Grognard:

    @Madschester United: My God, Jeremy St. Louis the author of that article and the anchor for Fox Soccer Report is grasping at straws from the worst place possible.

    In the past I think I have mentioned that I live a stones throw away from EA Canada here in Burnaby, BC. (Although I am planning to move soon). Before I went on Disability Insurance, I worked as an IT consultant and IT Recruiter in the Greater Vancouver region. I was directly responsible for having placed a number of the core developers and programmers for the FIFA franchise at EA. A company that hires and fires so quickly that turnover is too slow a word to describe their burnout of talent and how they continually deal with immense turnover of staff. Not the best company in the world to work for. In fact, I’d advise any young man to think twice about a career in producing video games. It’s a volatile market that uses you up and spits you out. I have seen the carnage first hand and my best friend was also a victim of this industry one time. Fortunately, he’s better now.

    Anyway, let me get to my main point finally. I put absolutely no validity or any intelligent significance to the ratings that are concocted by EA for any of their games but mostly for FIFA. At least in hockey, US football, baseball and basketball their are concrete statistics that can be used to get a more accurate judgment of a player’s capabilities. It’s not just goals and assists or touchdowns. Those leagues write everything down. They have concise data and files on every player and they offer these goldmines of information to EA both in Canada and in the US so that they can accurately portray their players in games. EA gets none of this from FIFA. What they get is a little paragraph on a player and his vitals. This is why we don’t even have Tosic and Ljalic in the last FIFA game. Notice how very few players actually look like their real life counterpart when you get past England and Spain? Oh sure they’ll take care of the major clubs from Italy and Germany too but as for being accurate representation and statistical giants for cold hard facts, they are not. EA has hired a lot of snot nosed kids to work and program this game. They are overworked, underpaid and most of them don’t even like or know anything about the game of football unless it’s the American version.

    The bottom line is they are very inaccurate in many of their renderings and statistical creations of player and teams for that matter. Don’t be fooled by the l;avish look and great graphics, the game designers for this franchise have been lazy as hell for over five years now. They just add a few new things and tweak the engine a little here and a little there and really, most of the changes they make, were already part of the plan back in FIFA 2005 but rather than throw all of them into one game, that would not give people incentive enough to buy future versions so they hold back on features and content. But as for accuracy, well they aren’t terrible but they are far from accurate representations of players skills. And Jeremy St.Louis should have been a smarter journalist than that and should have contacted Sports Interactive in England the makers of the far superior and immensely more accurate Football Manager 09 franchise. Now there is a game that takes the time to get all the facts and figures about every player alive. I’m more concerned about what they think of Antonio Valencia and Franck Ribery than the brat pack at EA.

  250. Grognard:

    @Traverse: I’d rather play Welbeck and Macheda than waste a plug nickel on Eider Gudjohnsen. How often is this overrated bag of shite mentioned every week? It amazes me for a player who has never accomplished fuck all, that he is somehow regarded in the same breath by many as another Ole Gunnar Solksjaer. Get real. He’s a total waste product and he belongs in the Turkish League, not up here and certainly not with United. :roll:

  251. Traverse:

    @Grognard: Tosic is a beast a few seasons into FM. Keeps Ribery out of my side!

  252. Craig Mc:

    @Stephen: Bro I get your meaning. I thought Fabian Brandy at 12, 13, 15 years old was going to be a world beater, but he FLOPPED badly so far!

  253. Grognard:

    @johnsom33: We might have had a chance against Chelsea because of our familiarity with them and the fact they have bottled it against us for a few years now. But you are right, based on their form and their new manager Hiddink, they probably would have beaten us too. You cannot win in Europe without a world class midfield. Fergie better wake up to that fact.

  254. Grognard:

    @Stephen: That Chelsea team didn’t have Hiddink in charge and the Hiddink Chelsea team was a more driven and finely functioning machine. I think you don’t give them the credit they deserved at the end of the season.

  255. johnsom33:

    @Craig Mc: So stop talking about them, easy as that. You CLAIM you are bored about talking about them, yet you are the chief person who keeps the discussion raging on. We get it that you dont like Tevez or Ronaldo, and ww get it you could care less about them. So shut the fuck up about them, End of!

  256. Grognard:

    @NicoQB: He’s a CB, otherwise why would he be compared to Rio?

  257. Grognard:

    @NicoQB: It’s a game designed by snot nosed geeks who know shite about footy. Trust me.

  258. Traverse:

    @johnsom33: Who?

    @Grognard: Cause Rio started as a defensive midfielder when he was that age, and then moved into defence, which is why he is cool on the ball. Traits that Rodwell shares.

  259. Grognard:

    @Traverse: Some programmer at Sports Interactive is a hard core United supporter it seems. :grin:

  260. Dan:

    @Traverse: tosic is better then ronaldo in my FM team! im a bit annoyed to be honest because in my first 2 seasons, he was hot and cold, sometimes a world beater, sometimes pedestrian. So i bought ribery for £47mil(bayern asked for £65mil, top negotiating skills by me :cool: ) but now, im struggling to find a reason to start ribery over tosic other then the money spent!

  261. Andrei:

    @NicoQB: Don’t buy it. Read it off the net – Douglas Adams would have liked it that way. :smile: :smile:

  262. Andrei:

    @NicoQB: Don’t buy it. Read it off the net – Douglas Adams would have liked it that way. :smile: :smile:

    @Red Ranter: I had completely forgotten about the galaxy-saving dog. Still my favourite passage is in the introduction:

    Far out in the uncharted backwaters of the unfashionable end of the western spiral arm of the Galaxy lies a small unregarded yellow sun.

    Orbiting this at a distance of roughly ninety-two million miles is an utterly insignificant little blue green planet whose ape-descended life forms are so amazingly primitive that they still think digital watches are a pretty neat idea.

    This planet has — or rather had — a problem, which was this: most of the people on it were unhappy for pretty much of the time. Many solutions were suggested for this problem, but most of these were largely concerned with the movements of small green pieces of paper, which is odd because on the whole it wasn’t the small green pieces of paper that were unhappy.

    And so the problem remained; lots of the people were mean, and most of them were miserable, even the ones with digital watches.

    Many were increasingly of the opinion that they’d all made a big mistake in coming down from the trees in the first place. And some said that even the trees had been a bad move, and that no one should ever have left the oceans.

    And then, one Thursday, nearly two thousand years after one man had been nailed to a tree for saying how great it would be to be nice to people for a change, one girl sitting on her own in a small cafe in Rickmansworth suddenly realized what it was that had been going wrong all this time, and she finally knew how the world could be made a good and happy place. This time it was right, it would work, and no one would have to get nailed to anything.

    Digital watches :lol: … classic!

  263. tevez:

    @Traverse: Facts don’t tell the whole story mate.

    Champions League Final Stats; Man United – Barcelona

    Possession; 48%-52%
    Shots off target; 7-4
    Shots on target; 2-7
    Tackles; 21-18
    Corners; 7-4
    Successful Passes; 82%-87%

    Semi-final second leg stats; chelsea – barcelona

    Possession; 29%-71%
    Shots off target; 5-8
    Shots on target; 4-1
    Tackles; 23-18
    Corners; 6-6
    Successful passes; 69%-87%

    Do these fact really reflect the way the games went? Does it show barcelona to be the dominant team in the final? Or chelsea in the semi-final?

  264. Andrei:

    @Dan: Which FM are you playing? In FM09 I have Ronaldo on the right, Silva on the left and Saivet as a back-up. I wanted to buy Ribery and my scouts told me that both Silva and Ronaldo are better than him. Then I wanted to buy Tosic (like a good fan that I am) and Rene Meulesteen said I should only buy him as a last resort…

  265. tevez:

    @Grognard: I’m not disagreeing with you here. Ballack, essien, lampard and mikel done a fantastic job in that game and chelsea were very good. That’s my point. They needed them all to turn up. Essien needed his supporting cast to stop the barca midfield, he couldn’t do it if the players alongside him were just passengers.

  266. Grognard:

    It appears that Real Madrid may be doing us a big favor. Now that they have officially given up on David Villa, they are focusing their attention on Karim Benzema. I can accurately forecast that we now are officially off the hook. Forget Benzema, he’s history. No way will he turn down a chance to go to Real and instead choose United. Fergie’s delusions are dashed and that’s fine with me. He would have been a malcontent moody cancer in our backs anyway.

    So now where do we go from here? Well need I say it, Sergio Aguero. We have the money to get it done, the player is open to a move to OT and all it takes is for Fergie to cough up enough cash mixed with courage and make the plunge. Will he do it? I seriously doubt it. In fact I am going out on a line guaranteeing that he won’t do it. Why? because he doesn’t fancy Aguero and he especially doesn’t fancy having to play against the political machinations of Kun’s father in law the Anti-Christ Diego Maradona. I just don’t see Fergie wanting to get into a shit storm every week with Diego.

    United need to take a big plunge and buy players but buying a really big name may not be in the cards. In case none of you have noticed, United have lost what little allure they had for signing big names. All the big names want to go to Spain or Italy. We are stuck with kids and the second tier in world talent. So when a true tier one talent is available and is interested in wearing the red, whatis United and Fergie going to do? Ignore him of course. That’s just normal. Ignore the Pogrebnyak’s, Aguero’s, Adler’s and others who have dreamt of wering the red of United. Why would we want to sing players who love our team? It’s insane. Instead, lets waste our time being linked with every malcontent or Madrid loving loser in world football. Lets start the season with only Antonio Valencia as our lone signing. Why, because our boss has his head so stuck up his own ass he can taste his ribs. Sounds harsh, I know, but I call it as I see it. Sign some truly significant impact players Fergie or we are destined for fifth. Believe it. You have ignored my cries for Huntelaar, Sneijder, Hernanes, Marin, Adler, Neuer, Akinfeev, Boruc, Arshavin, Pogrebnyak, Melo, Sanchez, Silva, Essien, Toure, Keita and Titus Bramble. OK, I was only joking about Bramble. But just do something for Christs sake. Enough drinking and sun tanning. Get back to work and make the changes needed.

  267. Grognard:

    @tevez: Stats are for losers. That phrase was coined for a reason mate. Because it’s true. Anybody with an IQ over that of a chocolate covered raisin knows Chelsea was the better team over two legs and they completely manhandled Barca on the counter attack in the second leg. How easily you dismiss Drogba’s sure goal misses and 4 sure fire penalties that were not given. If Chelsea gets one of those, Barca are gone. So go on with your pro Barca BS as if anybody with eyes and a brain cannot see you are full of it. Barca were fully deserving of their CL victory but they were tainted champions in my mind because of what I feel was not just a poor referees game at Stamford Bridge, I would call that more of a conspiracy from where I stand. And you try telling me that Barca were the better team because of useless statistics. Back when United were winning everything they rarely had the possession superiority in games. Why? Because they killed teams on the counter attack. That is why stats are for losers.

  268. Dan:

    @Andrei: FM 09 on the latest update :eek:

    Mike phelan is a muppet in the game also. His sacking is a season or two overdue to be honest, im grooming Mclair(the better manager) to be my new assistant manager.

  269. johnsom33:

    @Grognard: Statistics are like mini-skirts. They give u good ideas but hide the most important things…

  270. Red Ranter:

    Rgearding the kit, I don’t know why anyone in the post-recession era would dare to sport an AIG shirt, and be bold enough to face the vast majority of people at least in the US. I am not saying United should pull out of the deal as has been mooted by many angry american fans, but I would’nt buy a kit that has the AIG logo anymore. I can’t wait for next season’s kit.

  271. Red Ranter:

    @Dan: I don’t select United. I select crappy teams and work my way up.

  272. johnsom33:

    @Grognard: Your a big fan of the bundesliga. Have you seen a lot of michael bradley? if so how do you rate him. And i just mean in general, not as a potential United player.

  273. Stephen:

    @johnsom33: You are judging football as black and white, Fergie isn’t a bad manager also mate :wink:

  274. Stephen:

    @Grognard: Maybe I give Fergie credit to mate, Chelsea are a super side with experienced Internationals regardless of who is in charge. I think Hiddink is a superb manager but a squad with Terry, Cole, Lampard, Essien, Ballack, Drogba, Cech, Carvalho, Alex, Bosingwa, J Cole, Malouda, Anelka was simply not performing, that squad is more than capable of winning every competion they enter.

  275. johnsom33:

    @Stephen: I never said he was, my point is that we didnt have the midfield to cope with chelseas midfields which is the best in the world IMO. Scolari was an epic failure, he made avram grant look like a decent coach.

  276. Dan:

    @Red Ranter: Really, like who.

  277. NicoQB:

    @Andrei: Hah!
    But I don;t like reading books off the net. I like the feeling of “owning” the book and sitting in bed with your dimmed table lamp!

  278. NicoQB:

    @Dan: I agree with RR here. Much more gratifying to select a complete minnow. Preferably a conference side. I once won the Champions Leaue with Chester.
    But that was 10 years ago. No way will I touch this game again.

  279. gator:

    US is all over spain :shock:

  280. Traverse:

    @tevez: No, but they do reveal you are a Barcelona fan, with a Man City player for a name. Very odd.

  281. NicoQB:

    @Craig Mc: To be fair, from what Ive heard, Brandy hardly got starting opportunities to prove himself. A bit like some guy called Luis… :wink:

  282. johnsom33:

    @gator: hush your mouth, we are already looking like west brom aka clinging on for dear life. as we all know this tactic fails 99.9% of the time. I will be happy if we make it to halftime 1-1.

  283. Stephen:

    @johnsom33: Wasn’t much different mate to the one that faced Chelsea in the league, regradless of manager the players would have been the same, Scolari simply lost the dressing room, there is far too much player power at Chelsea for my likening.

  284. johnsom33:

    I tell you what, If I were a bottom tier EPL team I would be all over Michael Bradley.

  285. Grognard:

    Boys, I’m walking on air as of right now. This has nothing to do with United but over that fact that I just received confirmation that I have won the competitive lottery over 150 other applicants to move into a lavish and upper scale apartment in the ritzy and very trendy Kitsilano district of Vancouver. I will have an apartment facing the beach which is fully 90% subsidized by the government due to my disability. This apartment if rented normally would fetch over $2000.00 a month or if sold would be close to half a million dollars. It’s smallish but gorgeous and in such a great neighborhood. I am walking on air. It’s like winning the lottery for a person like me on Disability because all I have to pay out is $300.00 a month for rent. I live in a place now that I hate where I pay three times that. So I have hit the mother lode. I just wanted to share that with all my friends here at Red Rants and also let them know that I will be fairly quiet in July as I will be spending most of my time packing, throwing away things and moving. You guys need a rest from me anyway. Party on.! :grin: :grin:

  286. Dan:

    @NicoQB: i didnt disagree with him…

  287. tevez:

    @Grognard: What the fuck are you talking about. Stats are for losers, i completely agree. They are misleading and just crap. I was trying to show traverse that the statistics for those two games do not reflect the way the games went. Chelsea were the better team but the stats don’t show it. In the final barca were the better team but the stats don’t show it. Chelsea were excellent, very compact and hardworking in defense and very effective on the counter. I agree. They had more and better chances. Drogba missed at least one great opportunity. I still disagree about the penalty claims. There was maybe one strong claim, and the rest would have been harsh. Sure, chelsea were unlucky not to get even just one of them, but none of them were stonewall pens.
    The point i tried to make to you was that just having a melo or an essien in our midfield in the final would not have led to a chelsea-esque performance from us because the players alongside him would not have been up to the job like lampard, ballack and mikel were. We need more than just an aggressive player in there.

  288. UnitedUnited:

    @Grognard: Kun’s marriage is on the rocks apparently and Maradona is hence, sitting him on the bench and playing Riquelme’s brother. Can it get anymore unproffesional? Seems Kun Aguero is looking at other fish in the sea apart from Maradona’s daughter.

  289. NicoQB:

    @Dan: Neither did I tell you that you did. I just felt that selecting United for FM offers little challenge…

    Fifa on the other hand I used to select United, but again back when I could afford the time…

    Those two games are just too addictive for me. :razz:

  290. UnitedUnited:

    @Grognard: Oh my! Congratulations!!!!

  291. gator:

    oh yea and FUCK THESE HORNS!!! :mad:

  292. NicoQB:

    @Grognard: Congrats, mate! :smile: Make sure you do pop in once in a while in case of major signings, urgent need for WOGs awards, etc..

  293. RedDevilEddy:

    @Grognard: Congrats mate, wish you well. :grin: :wink:

  294. gator:

    they should just put the field ambiance on the left or right audio channel, so you can adjust to your preference.

  295. gator:

    what a fng game :shock:

  296. johnsom33:

    @tevez: now I know your a barca fan. Pique himself admitted that he handled the ball in the box. that one was indisputable. the other handball against eto’o was debatable, but I think he moved his arm to get in the way.

  297. Dan:

    this usa match is INTENSE!

  298. Craig Mc:

    @Grognard: Your new apartment, yeah, yeah, yeah, :lol: :lol: . Your not being on the blog for whole of JUly, I will believe that when I see it – Mr Addiction :wink: :grin: . What about all your lambasting in the pre season games in July eh eh???? Semms like you got a great deal with the new apartment, so I am very pleased for you. Does this mean you will be getting one of those long telescopes to eye all the bikini clad babes, seeing you are overlooking the beach now??? :evil: :smile: .

  299. Dan:

    Demerit, the american vidic :shock:

  300. Dan:

    USA TWO FUCKING NIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  301. Stephen:

    @Grognard: Well done you lucky bastard! :lol: :lol: :lol:

  302. gator:

    @johnsom33: west brom ftw :shock:

  303. Dan:

    ramos just showed the world how much of a crap defender he is!

  304. johnsom33:

    @Dan: his face was priceless, when dempsey scored that. he had no clue he was behind him.

  305. johnsom33:

    damnit! the US is starting to get my hopes up

  306. gator:

    all those united linked with players made to look human today…

  307. Dan:

    US fucking A! they dont even like football apparently!

  308. Traverse:

    @Grognard: Brilliant news!

  309. gator:

    that wasnt off side ?

  310. Dan:

    @Grognard: thats great! you leaving us for a while that is :wink:

  311. Traverse:

    @tevez: Isn’t their a village just outside of Barcelona missing it’s idiot?

  312. gator:

    @Grognard: nice! enjoy your good fortune mate

  313. Traverse:

    @UnitedUnited: This is good news, means he is unlikely to listen to Maradona telling him not to go to big bad Manchester, the fat cheating scumbag drug addict.

  314. Dan:

    The usa player values are going up by the minute!

  315. Dan:

    Red card!

  316. gator:

    thats no red

  317. gator:

    donovan the american torrez

  318. michael:

    hell yeah USA

  319. Dan:

    USA WIN :lol: :lol: :lol:

  320. gator:

    wow USA

  321. gator:

    good luck in the final without bradly ffs

  322. johnsom33:

    no way in hell was that a red. 50-50 ball and bradleys legs were on the grass. I thought it was a harsh foul, yellow at the most extreme, but not red in a million years. it better get over turned.

    We only have a hope and a prayer to beat Brazil, but without bradley hope flies out of the equation.

  323. Red Ranter:

    @Dan: I was managing Bristol City a couple of years back.

  324. Traverse:

    Could you imagine if Rooney gets sent off for that in the semi finals of the World Cup? There would be riots!

  325. sig:

    Don’t know if this has been linked before but its a bloody good read!

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/205809-manchester-united-no-big-signings-no-problem

  326. tevez:

    @johnsom33: I’m not questioning that it hit his hand, but was it intentional? I may have given that one even though i don’t think it was deliberate, but the other three for me would have been very soft. That was the only legitimate claim in my opinion, but still certainly not a stonewaller.

  327. Andrei:

    @Dan: Well, then I’d better get Tosic. As for the assistant manager, I like Di Salvo (he’s at Real Madrid) or Meulensteen. Also, Phelan accepts a downgrade job as a coach and he’s decent at that.

    @NicoQB: Yea, nothing beats laying down and reading until you can’t hold the book any longer. Aaah, good times…

    @Grognard: That is absolutely amazing! Congratulations and enjoy it!

    @Traverse: Love your take on Maradona. God, I hate that fucking prick!

  328. Dan:

    @Red Ranter: cool. I found it fun to shape my club team into the team i want, after i finally win the CL(i always bow out in the semi-final :roll: ), i might quit and take on a new challenge with a lower premier league side.

  329. Dan:

    @Andrei: he dont for me!

  330. johnsom33:

    @tevez: Intent doesnt come into play when giving a penalty. it was a denial of clear goal scoring opportunity so it should have been a penalty kick. If the ref saw it was intentional then it would have been a sending off.

  331. Traverse:

    @Dan: I did stints as Wolves and Spurs manager and got bored eventually (might go back to them eventually). I started a new one with United, got offered the England job in 4 months and led them to the World Cup Final, beating France 2 – 1 (goals from Agbonlahor and a freekick from Bentley). Rooney was injured in the semis.

    My United team for the 2010/11 season is this:

    Assenjo
    Richards Ferdinand Vidic Lahm
    Ronaldo Carrick Hargreaves Ribery
    Rooney Benzema

    Bench : Foster, Fabio, Evans, Anderson, Tosic, Ljajic, Zarate

  332. Andrei:

    @johnsom33: Yea, that was a clear penalty. Plus hand-balls are no awarded on ‘is it intentional or not’ they are awarded on weather ‘the committing party gained unfair advantage’ and Pique did. That said, if the player had no possibility of getting his hand out of the way, then it might not be a penalty. I read the rule book :mrgreen:

  333. johnsom33:

    @Andrei: if Pique had his arm at his side then I would say he had no choice, but his arm was clearly away from his body, and it struck his hand. Sorrytevez but that is as stonewall as it gets.

  334. ROOOOONEY:

    what do you guys think about juan mata?

  335. johnsom33:

    @ROOOOONEY: there is a reason he plays behind Riera.

  336. RedDevilEddy:

    To be honest, Im kinda starting to like the idea of not having to buy a very expensive player… Fuck Benzema, Ribery, Torres and Silva, I am starting to feel that one winger is all we need! I have massive faith in Nani, and Welbeck, Macheda and Fabio have impressed me a lot when playing. Of cource I would be delighted if we got a top-notch player like Aguero or Silva, but I dont really thint its absolutely nessecary. This team looks good to me:

    VDS
    Brown Rio Vidic Evra
    Valencia Carrick Anderson Nani
    Rooney Berbatov

    subs: Foster, Rafael, Oshea, Fletcher, Giggs, Welbeck, Macheda

    Nani is a world beater in the making, he just needs to sort his consitency. Same for Anderson, but he needs to fix his finishing. A LOT! :lol: Foster may prove to be one of the best goalies in Europe in a few years, and Rafael and Evans have shown massive potential. For their age, they are on cource to become better than Maicon and Terry! Macheda and Welbeck are young striker, but somehow they seem to have that spark we may need on top in close games. They want to play, they want to impress, but first of all they want to score! Welbeck can also play as a winger, so he might be a good back-up there. As for Brown, I consider him the best right back in England. LaSagna, Arbeloa, Richards and Bosingwa can fuck off, Brown beats them all! :smile:

    Our squad has massive potensial, something I really like. Its a young team, with experienced players who can still do a good job. I still think we should get one more signing than Valencia, but it wouldnt be the end of the world if we didnt. Still hope Frazier Campbell stays, he is a monster for me on FIFA 09! :twisted:

  337. RedDevilEddy:

    Congrats to USA for beating Spain, those cunts were becoming annoying! :evil: A team with Torres, Ramos, Puyol and Mata just doesnt do it for me. Glad on behalf of USA, they did great! :grin: Good luck against Brasil!

  338. RedDevilEddy:

    You know who we should get? We should get Pikachu, that fucker is fast!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

  339. Matt:

    @RedDevilEddy: The team you posted is not a bad team, not at bad team at all, its probably perfectly good enough to win the premier league but i would worry for our chances in europe. In 2 or 3 years it could be a great team, theres a lot of youngsters you have there who i think could be world beaters. Nani i agree could definitely be world class, fabio, rafael, evans, foster, welbeck and macheda also and i do want to see them all along with tosic getting alot of chances. Only thing is for the next 2 or so years would we be happy waiting for these kids to come good, im not sure especially with fergie calling it a day soon and wanting to go out with as money trophies as possible.
    I do however feel that while ronaldo has gone and will be a big miss we do not need to replace him directly, just replace his goals. Sounds pretty obvious when you say it like that but even if we replaced ronaldo with a nani or tosic or valencia, as long as the rooneys and berbatovs chipped in to take the share of what would be ronaldos goals were set to go so i agree with you a world class direct replacement is not a necessity. Would prefer someone over valencia, i just dont rate him but if we sign him i will give him a chance, i just hope to see a good lot of youngsters being given a good chance cos they look quality.
    God that sounds like arsenals policy lol, but seriously though in this climate and with all this 6+5 rule promoting youth is the future.

  340. Craig Mc:

    @Traverse: What a fuck team Trav, it hasn’t got Nani in it :wink: :lol: .

  341. Craig Mc:

    :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: , Torres – happy days you tosser! Good ole US of A, you did those Spanish gloaters, you did ‘em PROPER. Love it, Love it, Love it. Cocky bastards not beaten for 35 games and strutting like peacocks, BUT USA DOWNED ‘EM – :shock: :evil: , doesn’t get any better than that for me. Those boasting Spanish bastards, DOWNED by the minnows, and sob sob sobbing all the way home – MAGIC! Well done you Americans!

  342. Craig Mc:

    United will get a BIG name signing, AFTER ALL they gotta sell shirts, so bigger the name etc………………………

  343. johnsom33:

    @Craig Mc: I wouldnt buy that hideous chevron shirt even if we signed Pele. :lol:

  344. Grognard:

    I’m not American but today I am a proud American. Fucking Aye! :lol: :lol: I love it that the US beat those fucking A-holes Spain. I hate Spain with a passion and this just makes my day on top of my other good news. Life is looking up. Now if Fergie would sign either Aguero or Huntelaar, I may actually start going to church again to say thanks. :grin: :grin:

  345. Grognard:

    @Craig Mc: Fucking Awesome mate. We are of the same mind. Wasn’t that great? Knock those little c#$#%s of their little perch. They have an ego now and they think they are Gods gift to the game. Only thing that would have been better for me is if Germany or England gave them a good sound beating. But perhaps that’s coming. :lol: :lol: :lol:

  346. Grognard:

    @Andrei: Thanks mate. Now hopefully I survive the packing and moving to actually settle in and enjoy it. I have so many books and dvd’s to take with me. I never throw books away. :grin:

  347. Grognard:

    @gator: Thanks Gator. Just picked up the NCAA football preview. Looks like a big year coming for Tebow and the Gators. Should make you happy. :grin:

  348. Grognard:

    @Dan: No I’ll be in and around but starting in a few days, I will be busy packing, throwing things out and moving as well as doing a lot of things like making sure my mail address is changed, my cable and Internet are changed as well as other things. Lots of things to do so I will not be spending as much time on the site as I usually do. Come the beginning of August after I have unpacked and settled in, then I will be around for longer periods. Until then, I’m sure you, RR and others will appreciate a little less venom from the likes of Grognard.

    But don’t get to comfy, I’ll showing up a bit and to quote Arnie…………………I’LL BE BACK! :cool:

  349. Grognard:

    @Traverse: Yes sometimes good things even happen to Grognards. Thanks mate.

  350. Grognard:

    @Stephen: Speaking of luck, before today I was challenging myself on even spelling the word because it was so far away from my vicinity. Go figure. I so wanted this place I was literally physically sick with anxiety from waiting for their decision. And when i found out it was a go, I honestly like 150 lbs were lifted off my shoulders. An enormous relief as well, I am so looking forward to living in that area with all the cool restaurants, bistro’s, shops and the beach a couple of blocks away. Bloody Utopia mate. Good things like this don’t generally happen to me. I wouldn’t say I am cursed but until today, I never had the feeling of being blessed with some good fortune. It is a great day for me and Spain gets thumped by the US to boot. YES! :grin:

  351. Grognard:

    @Craig Mc: I didn’t say I wouldn’t be on the blog. I said I would have to curtail the amount of time I would be on by quite a bit because I have a big house to pack and move and a disaster to clean. Unless you want to fly down to Vancouver for a few days and help your fellow Nani ally? :wink: I will be around but there will be a few days near the end of the month where I will be away totally because of the move and making sure the cable and Internet are hooked up in the new place. :smile:

  352. Grognard:

    @RedDevilEddy: Thanks Eddy. By the way, noe that you are finished school, the same goes to you. Big changes for a young man of your age coming up. Just make sure you end up at OT or I’ll be pissed.

  353. Grognard:

    @NicoQB: Will do mate. Thanks a lot. :smile:

  354. Grognard:

    @UnitedUnited: Thank you kindly. Greatly appreciated.

  355. Grognard:

    This move promises to make me a gentler and kinder Grognard……………………………..YEAH RIGHT! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

  356. Traverse:

    @Craig Mc: I needed the £17mil. Thanks Inter Milan :mrgreen:

  357. Grognard:

    @UnitedUnited: Good for him. I hope that goes bad for him and he will be prime pickings for Sir Alex and we won’t ever have to worry about the bloody Maradona factor.

  358. Grognard:

    @tevez: And I’m just trying to point out that the use of stats for comparison is not a strong and winning argument. Stats are for losers is a phrase coined many years ago because it really is quite accurate. So I’m not trying to argue as much as point out that to anyone who thinks Barcelona deserved to get by Chelsea because of the misleading stats, that they are wrong. Stats do not tell the answer unless we count how many poor decisions the ref made against Chelsea as opposed to Barca. Then stats are for winners. :wink: :grin:

  359. Craig Mc:

    @johnsom33: :lol: :lol: :lol: , I know just what you mean! The kids will buy it though, and moreso with a big name on it :roll: .

  360. Craig Mc:

    @Traverse: Sooooooooooooo, now ytour showing your true colours eh Trav? You would leave Nani out, just to keep a measly 17 Million, how the fuck could you :sad: :arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :arrow:, and there’s the door :lol:

  361. Craig Mc:

    @Grognard: A gentler kinder Grognard – we all know you will become the leech of the beach – watch out ladies, Grogs on the loose now in your neighbourhood :grin: . I think your gentleness and kindness will last about all of 5 minutes, before somebody pisses you off, and the HORNS and flashing red eyes will come out again :evil: :wink: .

  362. tevez:

    @Grognard: That’s what i was trying to point out too.

    Ovrebo only made one big mistake the entire game :wink:

  363. Red Ranter:

    Grognard, congratulations mate. That must put you over the moon I guess. Canada does stuff that would make Americans only look in disbelief. I guess that’s the plus point of a state that’s more liberal leaning.

    Good luck on the new life… oh wait, what am I saying, you are already lucky. How much more luck can I possibly pile on you?

  364. Red Ranter:

    Meanwhile, LSU Tigers are leading 4-0 over the Longhorns in the NCAA Baseball finals. I am firmly in the ABU camp on this (Anyone But UT) — being an Aggie alumnus. Go Tigers!

  365. Fred The Red:

    @Grognard: what friends here on redrants, you haven’t got any :lol: :lol: , just kidding mate, congratulations.

  366. Andrei:

    @ROOOOONEY: Love him. He would be crappy in the Prem though because he has soft bones, so I don’t see any possibility…

    @All: Also, what is with the Spain hate? They play beautiful football – the best on the international stage since Argetina in the 2007 Copa Sudamericana… ah well, the underdog love… :grin: :grin:

  367. Andrei:

    I don’t have much hope about this (since it’s from The Sun), but here is to hoping:

    WIGAN’S Antonio Valencia will decide his future when he gets back from holiday this weekend.
    Manchester United and Real Madrid both want the Ecuador ace.

    United are offering Nani to sweeten the deal. But Latics chairman Dave Whelan said: “Where Antonio goes is entirely up to him.”

  368. Redrich:

    @Grognard: How many bedrooms mate, the wife and I visit BC all the time. :lol: :lol:
    Seriously, I’m very happy for you!!

  369. Fred The Red:

    Thats it decided then, its all over to Grognards new apartment next year for the RedRants convention

  370. Grognard:

    @Craig Mc: I’m surprised you are giving me five minutes before I go ballistic. I myself am being realistic and giving myself a minute and a half. :grin: I am looking forward to taking a book and walking to the beach and reading. Who knows, some babe may be impressed with my literary tastes and take notice of a poor old Grognard. Either that or I am going to hit on the building manager who is this 35 year old tall blond Russian milf. Christ is she hot. It’s time for Glasnost. :cool:

  371. Grognard:

    @tevez: I don’t think so mate. He made a half dozen mistakes and three in the box that were blatant and heres the thing mate, he admitted to them afterwards. So if he agrees he was wrong, then who exactly are you defending? :???: :???:

  372. Grognard:

    @Red Ranter: Thanks a lot RR. That means a lot. There will be a significant life change now especially because my mother will be in a retirement home and I will once again after so many years, be a single person with nothing holding me back. Hope to make the best of things and get more involved in my community than I have been of late. That neighborhood I am moving to just makes you want to go out and enjoy life. :smile:

  373. Grognard:

    @Fred The Red: Good one mate. :lol: :lol: :lol: You miserable #$#%#$^*&^ :wink:

  374. Grognard:

    @Redrich: Only one bedroom mate but you are always welcome to come over for a glass or two of wine and a chat and walk over to the beach. :smile:

  375. Grognard:

    @Fred The Red: Done. And then it’s off to the beach for some old fashioned Brazilian style beach footy. :grin: :grin:

  376. Andrei:

    @Grognard: Mate, from experience, Russian girls are the easiest (Ukrainians are a close second) :d .

    As for impressing girls with literature, I have been desperately trying to do that for about five years and there is only one result – they don’t notice much. Finally one takes notice, but she’s my lit teacher :(

    Oh well, at least I learned the value of Steinbeck, Hemingway, Orwell and the likes while failing to impress girls.

  377. Cantona's_Seagulls:

    Hey Guys… been reading the blog for awhile and thought i’d pitch in.
    @ Reddevileddy

    The starting eleven for that squad looks alright but can we afford to put our faith in unproven players like kiko and welbeck. Nani deserves his chance, i’ll agree with you on that but what about injuries!! God forbid, if berba, the roon, or a first team winger goes down for the season what then. Can we expect to challenge with kiko and berba or welbeck and rooney? I honestly hope so but think not, our strength over the last few seasons has been squad depth. We’ve got rid of one world class player and one excellent sub for rooney. We all now Roon will have some sort of injury next season, but who can step up! If we want to rebuild for a season or two then your team is fine, but if we wish to continue to at the peak of english and european football we will need some signings. Whether they are aguero, benzema, etc… if welbeck, kiko, jonny, and the twins are world class they will get the call above high priced imports. And one more thing, from Jonny Evans and i Quote “If your British and can do the job, your in the squad.” Fergie will always choose a british player if he is world class over a foreign player.

  378. Cantona's_Seagulls:

    @ andrei
    pick up a book called the mystery method. no more female issues. :lol:

  379. Dan:

    @Traverse:

    My team:

    Asenjo
    brown/rafael ferdinand vidic evra
    ronaldo Camacho anderson ribery/tosic
    aguero/guilherme/rooney

    Thats just the standard 4-4-2, i have the likes of mascherano and hargreaves on the bench :cool:

  380. Alex:

    @Grognard: hey congrats grog peaople shall miss your wrath :grin:

  381. Craig Mc:

    @Andrei: :shock: :shock: , the day that happens is the day I start praying in earnest that something happens to remove Fergie from OT, and I mean that. Nani should take matters into his own hands, tell SAF to f*** off, and take up the offers he has in Italy. SAF please RETIRE, I am not impressed with your judgement anymore – sorry!

  382. Grognard:

    @Alex: I’m not going anywhere, I’m just not going to be as active for a month. It will give me some quality time to build up my wrath and fury. :)

  383. RedDevilEddy:

    @Cantona’s_Seagulls: Welcome to this site man! :smile:

    You are right about that team not having that much debth. But I feel that is only in the wing-area, we are perfectly good on top. If either Valencia or Nani gets injured it means Park or Tosic will have to play. Or maybe even Giggsy, but that doesnt scare opponents at all! That is why I feel we should still go for a Costa, Young or Silva. As for the striking departement, Rooney will be injured. He always gets injured at least twice during the season. But when I think back over the season, Welbeck and Macheda proved real wonders for our team! We could buy a Benzema or Aguero, but can you realy picture either of them being happy as subs? Cause I cant. Maybe Berba could be subbed for the majority of games, but somehow I doubt it. However, when I think of the Villa, Sunderland and Hull game, Kiko and Danny really showed something that only Rooney did before. Against Villa Kiko had the best centre forward type of game that any of our strikers had had the whole campaign! He was aggressive, he wanted to score, he stayed in the box and he was fired up. Even when Danny came on, he nearly scored and created a few chances! Against Hull Kiko showed that fire again, even though he didnt score. As for Welbeck, he played on the wing but he showed glimpses of briliance. And agaisnt Sunderland, Kiko showed the kind of luck that only true goalscorers have! :smile: They say being a striker is something you are born with… And Macheda is just that. Of cource I wouldnt trust him as much as Benzema or Etoo when it comes to goalscoring, but remember this- When we played Porto in the Champions League quarter final, people wanted Macheda to start over Tevez. For me, that says something… :cool:

  384. RedDevilEddy:

    @Grognard: :lol: Mate, I will do my best. :cool: :wink:

  385. RedDevilEddy:

    @Matt: Yeah, that team might suffer in Europe. That is my main worry… :sad: Its a young team, but Uniteds policy have always been to give youngesters chances! Which we have done, and we should keep doing. What puts us in a difficult sitation is people want us to buy another striker, but they fear that will hampen the progress of Danny and Kiko. But they also fear giving them so much faith that they are 3rd and 4th strikers. A real pickle that is! :roll: But that team has 4 of 5 very important aspects of a winning team.

    1. A strong and compact defense.
    2. Dangerous and goalscoring attackers.
    3. A midfield that is creative and compact.
    4. A mix of youth and experience

    The one thing we do lack is strength in debth, but the saying “If you are good enough, you are old enough” should be considered here. Welbeck and Kiko may be young, but they have showed glimpses of brilliance everytime they have played. They are very young, so experience will only be good for them. Our defense is strong, Evans, Rafael and Oshea can very well replace Rio, Evra and Brown if they get injured. And we always change the midfield, the fact that we are regretting that Fletcher didnt start the Champiosn League final speaks for itself! Anderson, Carrick, Fletcher, Giggs and possibly also Hargreaves, Scholes and Gibson. We are well covered there. Anderson will iprove each year, he is the youngest midfielder we have. Carrick and Fletcher form a compact combo, and Giggs as we know has only one year left on his contract. Gibson is highly rated by Fergie, and Scholes is one of his favorites. Now if only Hargreaves could return to full fitness, I believe we would have one of the strongest midfields in Europe in one or two years time.

    Nani and Valencia are two real wingers in my opinion. Fast, creative, powerful, good crossers and unpredictable. I think those two can be world beaters in a few years, possibly even become legends. I rate them both very high, even though Valencia havent set the world alight with some United fans, there is somethign you have to remeber about wingers- They are only as good as the strikers they are playing with. If they dont get enough assists, its because the strikers miss them. If they lose the ball easily, it might be because of bad movement up front. Thats how it goes, and I feel that Tony could become a really great player here. But as I said, we miss replacements on the wings. If Nani or Tony gets injured, it means we are gonna play either Park or Tosic. Park, who I still dont rate, and Tosic, who now seems like the second coming of Djembe-Djemba. Weak, predictable, unconfident and does not have a big arsenal. A crosser, but easy to stop. Wont do anythign at United until he gets stronger and learns how to do more than crossing with the ball. Or else he is gonna become a total fuck up! :neutral: I still think we need a Young or Silva, but thats up to the manager. Maybe he could even play Welbeck as a winger… :?:

    As for the striking departement, Ive said what I needed to say about Kiko and Welbeck. But Berbatov and Rooney could still make an impressive combo, and even though my belief in Berba is getting weaker and weaker by the minute, I still believe Rooney could be the answer to all our problems. If he just gets that little bit of luck on his side, I believe he can be a candidate to the Ballon dOr in a few years time. Wazza will make us shine! :grin: :twisted:

  386. RedDevilEddy:

    United bid for Costa rejected! :sad:

  387. RedDevilEddy:

    Guys, I know it might be difficult snatching Fabregas from the Gunners, but his latest statements is practically a transfer request! He is the next Xavi in my opinion, his control of the ball is exellent. He is good enough for our team, and if we ever want to have a Xavi-type of player in our team this is it! He is youngers than Carrick, and better going forward. Maybe worth a bid? :smile:

    Link

  388. RedDevilEddy:

    Hello? Anybody here? :???:

  389. Karl:

    @RedDevilEddy: If we think Adnerson took a step back in his development this season, then by the same measure I would say Fabregas took a few steps back this past season.

    As much as what I like Fabregas, and trust me I do, I think he will severly hamper Anderson’s development.

  390. Onkar:

    @tevez: Lies, Damn Lies and Statistics … :mrgreen:

  391. RedDevilEddy:

    @Karl: I think both Nani and Anderson underachieved this season, but that may just be the second seasno syndrom. For young players especially, that tends to be the case for foreigners. And since they both performed so well in the first season, its no wonder people think bad of them now…

  392. Beachryan:

    That Costa thing urks me a little. I mean, either our scouts are good enough and have seen him enough for us to make a decent offer, or he’s not worth it and we shouldn’t bother. I don’t get how we suddenyl feel the need to trial him – transfers of ‘good’ players never work like that. Slightly insulting too.

    I officially have no idea what our transfer plans are this summer. Maybe there aren’t any.

  393. Stephen:

    @Beachryan: Well he has only played 9 games for Gremio, and 11 at Brazil under 20, so we don’t know if he is a £good” player mate. We have made what sounds like a decent offer and they want £21m for him which seems stupid, so I can see the point.
    Our plan seem obvious mate, we have made an offer for him, we will sign Valencia probably next week, we have made enquiries about Benzema and Aguero as we need a strker, the window only opens on the 1st mate, be realistic.

  394. RichmondRed:

    Can anyone tell me how it is that clubs are allowed to do transfers and the like before the transfer window opens? It seems to me that clubs have been doing business since the end of May, yet the transfer window does not open until 1 July. :roll:

  395. Onkar:

    @Grognard: Ooohhhh… Great Congrats…. :grin: :grin: :grin:

  396. RedDevilEddy:

    Benzema= £35 million
    Aguero= £55 million
    Rossi= £18 million

    Id take Rossi, cause I dont think he would moan too much about being on the bench. And we know he is good enough, no doubt! Wouldnt mind that Italian to be honest, not too expensive either…

  397. Karl:

    @Grognard: Congratulations!
    True we need a break from you, but this is tansfer-window time. You sure you can take a break from us? :lol:
    Once again, congratulations on your new home. I sincerely hope it lives up to your expectations and that you’re happy there.

  398. Karl:

    Amen! The Almighty works in mysterious ways.

    Now you might have an extra $600 p/m to invest in a state of the art suround sound system to block out the vuvuzela’s frequency during next year’s world cup. :-) :-) :-)

  399. Vivek:

    Now that the greasy one is gone, can we get Ruuuuuud back? :twisted:

  400. RichmondRed:

    Can anyone tell me how it is that clubs are allowed to do transfers and the like before the transfer window opens? It seems to me that clubs have been doing business since the end of May, yet the transfer window does not open until 1 July.

  401. Onkar:

    @RichmondRed: Technically clubs are only discussing the transfer currently and what ever terms will be agreed like in case of RONALDO will be put on the paper and signed only on or after 1st July. So, even though the deal is agreed Ronaldo is still a MAN UTD player as of now. But, only till 1st July….

  402. Onkar:

    @RedDevilEddy: Spot on mate… I think ROSSI is worth a shot at GBP 18 million…

  403. Stephen:

    @Vivek: He has the movement of Stephen Hawking mate.

  404. Onkar:

    @Vivek: Yup… I mean RUUUUUD will be available for cut back price. I mean I read price of as low as 1.25 million pounds. I mean common its a great bargain at that price. He is just Rudd in his goal scoring i mean do i need to tell what he brings to table.
    Moreover given his age as well as his injury problems he won’t even moan about being on bench…
    I mean why not use him like we used Larson few years back just as a stop gap arrangement till we are having fully grown Macheda and Welback….

  405. Vivek:

    @Onkar:

    Exactly my point. If Fergie can settle the ghosts between him and Van the Man, we could have a bragain of a backup striker..

  406. Vivek:

    @Stephen:

    If Stephen Hawking can score 20 goals for us, I will gladly welcome him to Old Trafford…. :smile:

  407. Onkar:

    @Vivek: :smile: :grin: :lol: :lol:

  408. Stephen:

    @Onkar: @Vivek: Ruud is 33 boys, that ship has well and truly sailed, no point discussing simply it will never happen.

  409. RichmondRed:

    Wasn’t Ruud’s bust up with Fergie over Ronaldo anyway? Perhaps since Ronaldo is going the other way Ruud and Fergie could patch things up and get a deal done. Ruud said he had no desire to play for Spurs, but given the chance to come back to United and play for the fans he really loved and never gave a proper goodbye to seems ideal to me; that is as long as he would not mind the rotation system Fergie has used.

  410. Stephen:

    @RichmondRed: He is 33 there is no chance Fergie would bring him back.

  411. Onkar:

    @Stephen: Henry will be 32 this August and playing regular 1st team football. Which i am not expecting from RUUD. So, I think my comparison might be wrong but the point is age can never be the only criteria. It can be one of the criterion of decision making. And all i am saying is we can use him very selectively more often of the as a third striker only. Because, for doubts are about his age and fitness may be if everything turns out right then no doubting his ability and quality on the pitch.
    And at this price i feel worth a gamble. Common bro talking about only 1.25 million pounds. Is it hell lot???

  412. RichmondRed:

    @Stephen: I too feel that Fergie would not bring him back, however, given the history of the Larson transfer a few years ago, I could never say that i would be surprised if the idea was atleast an option. maybe not this summer, but a January transfer…if Ruud is still with Los Blancos. I suppose I still just miss Van the Man a little still…here’s to wishful thinking. :wink:

  413. jos:

    @Stephen: you never know… Fergie brought Sheringham (at 31) and Larsson (at 35!)
    Good thing wud be he can act as a buffer for this yr as transfer prices are just over the roof.. i mean an unproven 17 yr old youngster at 25m!!! Its idiotic!

  414. Stephen:

    @Onkar: They are different players mate and are both at different fitness levels, Giggs is 35 Neville is 34, age simply isn’t a gage, also being 33 with Ruud’s injuries are going to be a factor, he was sold obviosly because of Ronnie but also he has lost a yard and his movement then was poor.

  415. Traverse:

    @RedDevilEddy: I think it was smart for us to have him on a trial for 3 weeks. He argues with coaches, gets sent off stupidly and is a bit immature. It makes sense to have a proper close look at him and how he handles being in and around United.

  416. Stephen:

    @jos: I agree mate about the transfer system, I thought we were all in reccession!! but Fergie will never bring Ruud back, too much history the prem will be far too fast for him.

  417. RichmondRed:

    @RedDevilEddy: I don’t really think that Rossi would want to come back to United…on second thought, maybe he would, however, I really think he has his heart set on playing for a big club in Italy (Juventus I hope). chances are Rossi would get more first-team football in Italy. Plus he has made the national team which has probably made him even more patriotic and created an even larger desire to play in Italia. Still, a bid for him by United might make him think a little.

  418. Onkar:

    @Stephen: You said it mate… As i said in the same post age can’t be a factor so that takes care of your own point of his age is 33 kind…
    Given the injury and all… The point is simple mate.. All i am saying that at given price if that price is true then its worth a shot. Because, simply i am not saying that use for all the matches or use him as a starter as well. All i am saying is he can be a great back up addition to the team….
    And definitely a bargain at given price (if that price is correct)….
    One thing for sure mate i would be devastated if some other PL team takes him and he will end up scoring 10 goals a season. Because, the 10 goals for 1.25 million GBP is worth.
    I mean try and understand where i am coming its not only about players ability, his age, speed and injury record its about the finding the trade off between what you pay and what you get in exchange…
    Simple as that….
    @RichmondRed: Even i miss him bro a little….

  419. Stephen:

    @Onkar: Why bring in someoen who is pretty much a has bee, why not play Macheda, Welbeck or even Campbell?
    Also you are not taking into account his wages on your figure, he would no longer cut it in the prem at the highest level, he is too slow, doesn’t move this would be a problem for us.

  420. Anthony Los:

    Ruud shld come back as a coach to macheda and welbeck to really bring out their raw talent and make them as good as he was (on his day). And maybe just come on for 10 mins a game to try and nick a goal, like sherringham did during the end of his career.

    GOOD RIDDANCE TO RONNY although he brought us goals and glamour he caused a lot of problems, i mean the whole rooney thing with the Euro cup and the whole i want to go to real madrid shit every bloody year, was a pain. When Henry left the arse, every1 though they wld be shite but it brought out talent that wasnt expected. I mean macheda or welbeck/gibbo wld have never shone in united with ronny it it, he would have snatched all the glamour 4 christ sakes. WE NEED A GOOD QUALITY YOUNG EUROPEAN STRIKER, benzema is our man. Pace, power, goals, ect. All the attributes we want however he could try and take the future spotlight off our youngsters which isn’t great but i think everyone is willing to take that risk because we are in a desperate situation.
    I have always been a nani admirer, even through his horrible performances. We should put our faith in him because he is a carbon copy of ronaldo a couple years back. I dont understand after spending 17.5 mil on him, we r throwing him in the bin to be replaced by some1 WHO IS EXACTLY LIKE HIM EXCEPT A WORSE (VERSION valencia) fergie shdl stop throwing this extra cash around and actually pay some good money for benzi and aguero.

  421. Andrei:

    I know it is only Goal.com, but apparently we are looking to make a €15m bid for Rossi:

    Link

  422. Andrei:

    @Craig Mc: I dunno about that – seems like a pretty good deal to me – give them an indisciplined flop to shave off the price of a target and save money to buy other targets. I like that. Then again, I don’t really like Nani.

  423. Andrei:

    @Red Ranter: Sorry to bother mate, but d’you think that you can disable the Ronaldo header for the site? I mean, the fucker’s been gone a couple of weeks already and we’re starting to get sick of his pompous face.

    Again, sorry to bother.

  424. Stephen:

    @Andrei: I like him but is he too short? All the top premiership strikers are in the classic number 9 mould tall, Drogba, Anelka, Adebeyor, Torres ect maybe this is just me, I suppose if he plays him up with Berba then Ok, but with Rooney we are back to the hobbit fest.

  425. Craig Mc:

    @Andrei: Keep this up mate, and I’ll give you plenty of Rooney weaknesses STICK. I don’t suppose Nani gives a fuck whether you like him or not. You are never on the OT terraces to banter him down with abuse are you? :roll: .

  426. Craig Mc:

    @Anthony Los: Aaaaah Anthony, someone with eyesight where Nani is concerned!

  427. Andrei:

    @Craig Mc: I don’t abuse United players; I always cheer them on (even Nani) but when the transfer window comes around, I say what I think. Besides I’ve never seen United at OT – I live part-time in Canada and part-time in the Midlands and I’ve never been within 100 miles of Manchester.

    But when it comes to Nani, I have a few of problems with the guy:

    1. He is as inconsistent as a weather report.
    2. He thinks he is the biggest thing since Prophet Mohammed.
    3. He knows not when to pass and when to shoot.
    4. He is as indisciplined as hell – remember the head-butt in the game against West Ham?

    Apart from that, I have no problems with the lad, but those are problems enough and if he can overcome at least two of them and become a decent player for us, good. If not then we should not waste our time with him.

  428. Craig Mc:

    @RedDevilEddy: Not so much underachieved, as Fergie didn’t play them! :roll:

  429. Anthony Los:

    hahahaahahah craig, i think nani is bloody class and all he needs is 10-15 games to build his confidence, when we give him that he will produce. PLZ FERGIE !!!!

  430. Stephen:

    @Andrei: Mate he has been sent off once, not exactly Roy Keane is he? Ronaldo has been sent of numerous times is he indisciplined as hell?
    Wingers are inconsistant it is what they are, simply because it is out to them to do something, Giggs over the years has been called the same thing, and what is wrong with a bit of confidence it never did Ronaldo any harm?
    Also he needs a run of lets say 10 games then we can really judge him, not bits here and there.

  431. Anthony Los:

    i couldnt agree with u more stephen, nani isn’t that indisciplined he got sent off once

  432. RedDevilEddy:

    @Andrei: How can you think that Nani is indiciplined and has the ego of Ronaldo. I dont see wnythign wrong with either of those two “problems”. One red card and 6 yellows in two years is not bad. Its actually great for a winger! Ronaldo got sent off at least 5 times during his United career, but he wasnt a dirty player by any means. As for him having big thoughts of himself, that is a good thing. Winger needs confidence to play well, and it annoys me when people mix confidence with arrogance… :roll: He needs confidence, if he acted like Ronaldo on the pitch that would be great. Coming out in the press saying he can be the next Ronaldo is brilliant to hear, he needs that. And Nani is a brilliant player, he can become a world beater if fiven more opportunities. He is the kind of player that can play bad for 90 minutes, but still create a moment of brilliance that gives us a win or a goal. That is what “great” players are all about. Nani has that! THRILLER!!! :lol:

  433. UnitedUnited:

    @Stephen: I am a Nani admirer too. I simply think he looks class on the ball. It’s quite a sight watching him run. I don’t know if others see this, but whatever sails my boat right?

    But I think the reason Nani has been in Fergie’s leper colony is because he head butted some player in the final game of the 07-08 season. That match was our title decider and he endangered United’s title chances because of a moment of stupidity. And hence, fergie might have benched him for a good season to show him the enormity of his mistake. Just my guess, but maybe just maybe.

  434. Stephen:

    @UnitedUnited: I doubt that to be honest mate, but last season he really did not get much of a chance.
    I personally believe we set our sides up too much not to loose, rather to go and and win the game, knowing we had enough fire power to score regardless of the oppersition.
    To quantify this the European Cup final is case in point we went all out at he start and could have nicked one, then we all know we would of tried to sit on that one goal lead, when we went a goal down we had to change the set up of the side, to try and win the game.
    I believe or hope with Ronaldo now gone, we will be more fluid, rather base our entire side around the greasy prick it will allow Nani, Rooney and Berba to express themselves more and welcome back to more free flowing united of old.
    With Nani and what Craig said was right, United have a tradition of skillful wingers from Billy Meredith to Best, Coppell, Giggs, Kancelskis ect the fans who go do not get on the back of these players as they are in our blood.

  435. Andrei:

    @RedDevilEddy, @Anthony Los, @Stephen: The head-butt and the diving and the reitalliation and always fighting with referees. He does all of this and it makes him an undisciplined player. It made Ronaldo the same thing. Just because he was good does not mean that he was disciplined (talking about Ronaldo here).

    That said, other great players, like Keane in the past and Vidic and Rooney are also undisciplined, but they have the skill to back their hot-headedness up.

    So yea, it might not be a problem if he had some skill, but given that he has been an absolute waste so far, it is far from a good thing. I mean, what would you say if Park was undisciplined? Would you tolerate him then? I suppose not because then he would longer bring much to the squad.

    So, yea indiscipline is not the worst thing a football player can suffer of, but it does not help if he has other problems.

  436. Beachryan:

    Ruud would be the perfect signing for us – if his knee gets better. I personally have no idea when he’ll be back, or if. If he was 100% healthy we wouldn’t be having this discussion, because he would have scored 25+ goals in La Liga last season and Real wouldn’t want to sell. He is a goal machine, simple as. Our youngsters could learn so much from him about movement, antipciation and composure (i’m looking at you Rooney!). Then again, we have Ole at training everyday, and that doesn’t seem to have helped.

    Given how crocked he is, I wouldn’t risk Ruud. But I don’t agree that we should rely on Welbeck and Macheda solely. If Rooney breaks a metatarsal (it is world cup year!) then we have to start them, week in week out. And they’re not ready. Two seasons away minimum. So we need at least one decent covering option.

  437. Andrei:

    @RedDevilEddy: Just an example here – in the final game of the season (against Hull), we had a free kick at around Ronaldo-range. Instead of letting Gibson (who has an amazing shot) try his luck from his preferred range, Nani said that he will take it himself. He arranged his ball and lined up like Ronaldo does. He then tried to hit it the same as our no 7. What happened? Well, it must have gone over the stadium.

    You might say that there is nothing wrong with a young lad fancying his chances from that range, but if he continues to try to do things that he cannot do, it will hurt the team more than it will help it.

    Don’t think that RvN always had the confidence that he could beat the keeper 9 times out of 10. At first he did the easy thing and the ball went in. Eventually, as he realized he was good at it, he started chipping and rounding and curling and going for top corners.

    With Nani, extreme confidence is the problem because he is sure he can do things that he cannot do. Sorry.

  438. Stephen:

    @Andrei: Mate, you cannot say he has no skill that is is plain wrong mate, his disciplinery record this season is only 2 yellow cards one in the league and one in the Champions league, last season he has one red and two yellows in the league and two in the champions league.
    His record in total is 71 games for us with only one red and 6 yellow cards, not too bad is it?

  439. Andrei:

    @Beachryan: Nah, not sure Ole’s job is to teach Rooney about his movement. I think he focuses more on Macheda and Wellbeck (and it shows).

  440. Anthony Los:

    Look Andrei i cant believe youre’ turning the attribute of confidence into a bad one, cockiness is a bad attribute which you must be confusing with. His confidence suits him, however confidence on phil neville doesn’t. Nani is a class player and thats why Fergie dished out 17.5 mil on him. How many times has Ronny taken a free kick in his old days and at present when its gone miles over the bar but we dont blame him because 10 of those 1 million shots have been screamers but the thing is maybe if nani got to take more of those free kicks then maybe some wld be screamers but he hasnt got the chance thats my point. Youre being way to synical on some1 who hasnt got that much of a chance to prove himself, it’s demoralising when people like park and welbeck get chosen ahead of you.

  441. Anthony Los:

    Stephen is correct nani has got skill. 100% agreeement!!

  442. Andrei:

    @Anthony Los: He has had 71 first team appearances for United (Wikipedia says so).

  443. ROOOOONEY:

    http://www.goal.com/en/news/9/england/2009/06/25/1346580/manchester-united-want-huntelaar-from-real-madrid-report hmmmmmmmmmm

  444. Andrei:

    No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no!!!

    Fucking Huntelaar

    Sorry Grog

  445. Anthony Los:

    in a lot of those games he was subbed at half time to let others prosper

  446. Anthony Los:

    and a lot of those appearances count for say the last 10 mins of a game that not nearly enough time to make a difference, so just give me that stat because 1 app could count for 5 minutes in a game

  447. Anthony Los:

    thats where my point of confidence is valid because if you come on for the last 10 mins it makes u feel that ure not good enough to have played the whole game. Dont respond “well he started in the carling cup” because the PL and CL is what matters the most

  448. Grognard:

    @RedDevilEddy: But he wants to go to Spain mate. That is his prime motivation. The problem that occurs with many players when the season is over and they go on international duty is they meet up with their counterparts (in this case players from Barca and Madrid). The Barca players start talking Cesc up and tell him how great it would be if he joined them, after all just look at us they would say, we are walking on air. It’s the very same way I lost my fiancee to the dreams and delusions of a Hollywood career. She goes down there to go to school and then is seduced by the town’s charm and it’s promises of dreams fulfilled. Well she ended up on Hollywood’s bench of broken dreams, which will always give me a certain sense of satisfaction.

    For Cesc the seduction is very strong. What Spanish kid wouldn’t want to go to Barcelona? And all he has to do is look at what Wenger is doing, or not doing to be sickened and to feel like he is ripe for betraying his team. These mercenaries all care about only one thing, themselves. They are driven by greed through personal success. They want trophies as if it somehow defines their greatness. Today’s footballer is a sad and tasteless little parasite and to be honest, if I ever wanted to put a hit on anyone in my life, it would be one Johnny Bosman because it was his greed for his right to play wherever he wanted that has made the game so unbearable today. Loyalty means shite unless you are winning, and even then, you aren’t guaranteed anything. Just look at Ronaldo.

    Cesc does not want to just leave Arsenal because they aren’t winning, he want s to go back to Spain. Spain is the IT destination now with all their success and England is past tense. No way does he betray Arsenal to sign for Man Utd or Liverpool or Chelsea. That’s not what it’s about. He wants silverware, but he wants it with Barcelona.

  449. Grognard:

    @Vivek: He’ll be able to discover the black hole in every team’s defense. :wink:

  450. Grognard:

    @RichmondRed: It doesn’t matter. Once you have crossed the Boss, there is no coming back.

  451. Grognard:

    @Onkar: Are we looking to get better and replace Ronaldo or go back in time and have a triva contest? Fergie does not go after 30+ year old players and lets not forget their new prime directive. Nobody over 26 so why are we debating this?

  452. Beachryan:

    Hunter = good idea. Simple. If he’s willing to be a third striker, and an impact sub. He’s clinical, and our style next year is going to have to be more about crossing one would have thought…

  453. Grognard:

    @Andrei: I take it you’re not a fan then? :grin: Don’t worry about it. It’s a Goal.com report and they are full of shite. Fergie will never go for Huntelaar because he knows I want him for United more than anyone. He will do it to spite me. He won’t even go for Aguero because he is the second most wanted player on my want list. But he also won’t get Benzema who is #1 on my most unwanted list, so I guess that kind of makes us even. Benzema will break his heart and in the end, we will settle for a Geo Rossi or some second tier talent unworthy of being a replacement for the best player in the world. United don’t only have to worry about winning, but also selling merchandise like kits. They have lost a big money maker in Ronaldo and Aguero would be a good money maker for them world wide. But Fergie just drags his ass and treats that fucking money like it’s coming out of his own pocket. Is he not Scottish enough for crying out loud. Pay the 52 million for Kun and lets get on with it. Enough already. Starting in July I will be away from my computer for a while and when I am fully back in August, I will read and still nothing will have happened. AMAZING! :roll:

  454. Grognard:

    @Beachryan: If Hunter would show up to OT, he would not take too long before he bumped Berbatov to #33 striker, believe me. He is too damned good and prolific to end up or settle for third wheel.

  455. Traverse:

    @Beachryan: I wouldn’t be upset if Huntelaar came to us. He obviously itching to prove himself after being frozen out at Madrid after only 6 months. He’d be hungry, and his record speaks for itself. Madrid will end up shooting themselves in the foot. Good.

  456. ROOOOONEY:

    Huntelaar wont bench berbatov with out current very very very creative midfield

  457. Dan:

    i wouldnt be upset if huntelaar came to us, granted it wasnt over £15mil, but i wouldnt be glad either.

    Its not that i dont think hes good or bad. I think hes a prolific DUTCH striker. Im just going by what ive seen in recent history, and dutch strikers seem to flop in england. Sorry grognard.

    That said, if he were to come, and scored 15-20 goals in 30-35 appearances, ill be quite happy to say i was wrong and bask in hunters greatness.

  458. Craig Mc:

    @Andrei: And this coming from a Rooney supporter, who is the OT champion at hitting the ball well into the crowd 8 times out of 10 :roll: .

  459. Craig Mc:

    @Andrei: Oh and your man Rooney’s discipline is 100% – NOT! Nani is no where near as ill disciplined as Rooney, so I think you see what you want to see mate!

  460. Craig Mc:

    @UnitedUnited: Mate that head butt thing was total fucking FAKE. I was there at the game. Nani just putt his head close to the defenders, who then fell down like a fucking bulldozer had hit him, and rolled all over the place, like he was SERIOUSLY injured. But if you watch the replay of the incident you see that the player did worse to Nani that provoked his reaction. That player got Nani sent off, because Nani was skinning him all the game to that point. Also mate, the reason SAF put Nani in the leper colony, was because UNLIKE Mard Arse Tevez, Ronaldo etc Nani doesn’t cry and complain and badmouth the boss to the press when he is for NO REASON left out. Perhaps he should give the boss some welly, like Grog says, the boss might think twice about leaving him out then.

  461. Craig Mc:

    @RedDevilEddy: Eddi mi man, you are up there mate in my estimation. Although I am somewhat surprised at the Nani love by quite a few of you on the blog. :shock: :smile: .

  462. Craig Mc:

    @Stephen: Well judge him off his 1st season when he played regularly, he was bloody brilliant mate!

  463. Craig Mc:

    @Anthony Los: You know I agree with you, don’t you mate? :grin: .

  464. Craig Mc:

    @Andrei: As a true Manc speaking to a NON Manc, this is my answer to your Nani comments.

    1. Obvious you haven’t watched closely enough. Inconsistent you say! He was both very consistent and ENTERTAINING his 1st season when he was played regularly. 2nd highest in assists, one less than your beloved Rooney :roll: .
    2. He IS the biggest thing since the prophet Mohammed – so get used to it!
    3. He wouldn’t be 2nd highest assists if he DIDN’T as you say know when to pass.
    4. He didn’t have a bad ratio of goals for the games he managed to get on the pitch for last season.
    5. Indisciplined – :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: , Try Rooney, Ronaldo, Scholesy (bad tackling always) for indiscipline and sendings off and bookings. Nani is a fucking saint in comparison.

    I think the Nani fan club is building up nicely thankyou, so sorry to disappoint you eh?

  465. Craig Mc:

    Anyway, the all important Grognard has joined the Nani sabre rattling brigade, so watch out all you dissenters. Just because Grog is moving locality right now, doesn’t me he wont be coming on here, hunting down Nani haters with a ruddy GREAT RATTLING SWORD. And where’s your Nani support Red Ranter eh? :evil: :smile: .

  466. Anthony Los:

    ABSOLUTELY FUCKING RINSED ANDREI!!!! (by craig)
    no offence andrei but your not a true manc if u hate nani

  467. Fred The Red:

    @Craig Mc: my opinion on Nani mate, good skill and close control, can be a good crosser of a ball and has good pace, in other words, he has everything you want from a winger, but my biggest gripe against him is this, he does not play with enough speed of thought or urgency. Now Im not saying that he is lazy coz hes not, what I mean is that he tends to take to long to decide what he wants to do and takes too many touches on the ball, allowing the defenders to get set, which is not good mate considering that he has the weapons to play quickly and put the defence on the backfoot with his pace, he should be using it far more than he does.
    It is something that I spotted in his game the first time that I saw him playing for Portugal under 21s 2 years ago and it is an area that SAF could help him with, no doubt hes got the ability mate, but this season is a big one for him.

  468. Anthony Los:

    I LOVE NANI!!!!!!! HE IS SICK AND ALWAYS HAS BEEN!!

  469. Anthony Los:

    He has been outshone by ronny but as u said fred the red this season is a biggy for him

  470. NicoQB:

    I knew there had to be some kind of argument for the regulars and commentors to be staying on the old thread.
    :smile:

  471. NicoQB:

    @Fred The Red: Well spotted mate. Never thought of that but effectively, you’re right about Nani.
    But don’t worry Craig I’m still pro-Nani! (For now at least :wink: )

  472. RedDevilEddy:

    @Craig Mc: Nani is Jesus and Anderson is God! Then Rafael is Mother Mary, just because of those SEXY curls! :lol: :wink:

    But thats just my opinion… :grin:

  473. RedDevilEddy:

    @Craig Mc: You said it bro! Nani will be the worlds best winger in two years time, remember that. Better than Ronaldo, better than Silva and Ribery!!! Because Luis is a WINGER, he can cross the ball like Beckham, burn past an opponent like Usain Bolt and skin a man like Lennon vs Evra. :lol: :lol: :lol: Go on Nani!

  474. Fred The Red:

    @NicoQB: Hes like a 5 gear sports car that is happy to stay in third gear, the extra gears are there, he needs to start using them more.

  475. Fred The Red:

    @RedDevilEddy: go easy on the blasphemy chum.

  476. Anthony Los:

    HAHAHAHAHAHA U GUYS ARE HILARIOUS

  477. Dan:

    Im sorry, i thought id take the time to say that i, Dan/kaka, have finally, gotten into the CL final after 3 seasons of trying, on FM :mrgreen:

    First season, lost to arsenal on pens, second season, lost to barca by 3 goals, this season, lost to barca 3-2 in the first leg, and beat them 4-0 in the second :cool:

    Im quite chuffed(and a geek) about this!

  478. RedDevilEddy:

    @Fred The Red: There is no wrong telling the truth… :wink: :lol:

  479. RedDevilEddy:

    @Dan: Congrats Dan! Well done, you must be proud. :grin:

  480. RedDevilEddy:

    Foster
    Rafael Rio Vidic Evra
    Nani Carrick Anderson Welbeck
    Berbatov Rooney

    subs: VDS, Brown, Evans, Hargreaves, Fletcher, Giggs, Macheda

    I dare anyone, absolutely ANYONE! to try to beat me and that team on FIFA 09. When you cruice past Barca and Inter winning 7-0 on aggregate on legendary difficulty with 5 minute halves, you really do seem confident.

    Barca, 3-0. Carrick, Rooney, Nani
    Inter, 4-0. Anderson, Rooney, Anderson, Nani

    I fucking dare you!!! :twisted: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :twisted:

  481. Andrei:

    @Craig Mc: Yea mate, but Rooney’s got skills. Massive skills.

    @Anthony Los: Right. You’ve uncovered me. I am an Arsenal supporter who spends his time on an United forum to spy on the all important opinion of the Manc fans.

    @Craig Mc: Man, he has had 10 goals in 71 appearances and I am guessing about 15 assists in all. Besides, if he was better Ferguson would have played him. But he isn’t. Ferguson decided that he is not worthy of a starting berth and he is not because the one thing that our coach does not do is persist with flops. Nani was okay the first season – he looked like a real talent in the making – but every time he got the ball in his second season at the club, it was either a bad pass, a scuffed shot, a crappy cross or a failed dribble.

    If he becomes a good player, I will hold my hand up and admit to a mistake, but I think that it is time for him to go.

  482. Andrei:

    @Dan: Well done mate, well done.

  483. Andrei:

    @Craig Mc: Rooney has a shot:sot ratio almost equal to Cristiano Ronaldo:

    Luis Nani 4:15 (about 1 shot on target every 4 shots)
    C Ronaldo 57:181 (about 1 shot on target every 3.2 shots)
    Carlos Tevez 21:66 (about 1 shot on target every 3.1 shots)
    Wayne Rooney 40:123 (about 1 shot on target every 3 shots)
    Berbatov 24:56 (about 1 shot on target every 2.3 shots)

    Furthermore, goals to shots on target:

    Carlos Tevez 5:21 (about 1 goal every 4 sot)
    Luis Nani 1:4 (exactly 1 goal every 4 sot)
    Wayne Rooney 12:40 (about 1 goal every 3.3 sot)
    C Ronaldo 18:57 (about 1 goal on 3.2 sot)
    Berbatov 9:24 (about 1 goal every 2.6 sot)

    I know that these are stats – just illustarting a point here to all of you Nani lovers who claim that he did not have the time to do his shit. Well, when he was given time, his numbers worse than any other attacker of ours. Berbatov’s were the best. By far.

    Disclaimer: Stats taken from ESPN. Only Premier League numbers considered.

  484. Craig Mc:

    @RedDevilEddy: :lol: :lol: :lol: , you should be the man united manager mate, because your team seems to be thrashing the big boys :grin: . Also Nani scored as many goals as Rooney :grin: .

  485. Craig Mc:

    @Andrei: And what you are missing is that Nani made most of those fucking goals for your beloved Rooney and the others with his inswinging corners etc. Also, if said beloved strikers hadn’t been so fucking inept, with the great balls into the area Nani put in, they would have had a lot more goals to there name, and Nani many more assists. So you know what to do with your stats, don’t you? Always nice to put them where the sun don’t shine.

  486. Craig Mc:

    Oh and Andrei, if you haven’t already done so, watch Nanis 1st season at OT on that seasons end of review. You will get a bit more educated at what the lad put in. He is not Ronaldo, and he is not there to score goals, but to provide for the strikers from the wings/corners, which to my mind he did. We are never going to agree about this, so let it fucking go eh!

  487. Craig Mc:

    @RedDevilEddy: :lol: :lol: – I wouldn’t go anywhere near that far Eddi mi man, but I get your point!

  488. Craig Mc:

    What I am going to like about next season, is that we are really going to see what Rooney is made of, now that he is to be relied upon to get the goals on his little toddy! We will see what he is made of, and I am open to be surprised. He will be playing in his preferred position for sure, so no excuses from the Rooney fans if he doesn’t cut the mustard – eh Andrei?????

  489. Anthony Los:

    EXACTLY SHOT:SHOT RATIO IS .8 AWAY FROM RONALDO SO WHAT R U TLKING BOUT!!!!!!
    AND SHOT:GOALS RATIO IS .8 AWAY FROM RONALD0 HOW IS THAT BAD, he hasn’t got as much of a chance and the chance he has got its so near to ronaldo
    ANDREI I DONT KNOW WHAT URE DOING BY GIVING STATS THAT WLD PROVE U WRONG and as craig says he has set up rooney for a lot of goals

  490. Craig Mc:

    @Anthony Los: He isn’t a Manc though Anthony, he is from the Midlands, and then Canada. You can’t be a true Manc unless your a Manc mate :lol: . Grognard is an adopted Manc, cos most of the Mancs love him, even though he is a Greek/Canadian, he has the passion and fury of the Mancs who frequent the OT terraces, same with Fred the Red and Eddi, and a good few others. They are Red Devil fans til they die, so Mancs at heart, whether they love Lil man Nani or not :grin: . You sound like a true Manc Anthony :lol: . And yes, this Blog is renowned for its spanking vitriol and massive arguements. Which nobody ever wins, because Red Ranter the blog boss, come in with the big baton when things go a bit OTT. Its great fun until RR comes in though :evil: :grin: .

  491. Craig Mc:

    @Fred The Red: Fred mi man, if Ireland has specsavers stores, get down there mate, your Nani vision is off Bro :wink: :lol: :lol: .

  492. Craig Mc:

    @Anthony Los: Hey Anthony, you need to cut out writing in Capital letters mate, or Red Ranter will censor you. I only use the for the odd words to stress a point, and because I cant get the highlighter to work on my computer for some mad reason :lol: .

    Also mate, you see the little blue arrow next to each persons name, well when you want to reply to their post comments, click on the arrow, and it will bring up the name of the person in red that you are responding to. It will be easier for you mate, and for others to see what you are responding to :grin: .

  493. Craig Mc:

    @Anthony Los: Not to mention that most of Ronaldo’s goals were from penalties and free kicks or set pieces! As he manipulated those penalties and set pieces, nobody else really had a chance to get a sniff in, let alone practice for when Ronaldo wasn’t there. Problem is, Ronaldo was always there, he was NEVER rested, or he would have cried us a river up to the top stanchions of Old Trafford, as poor wee mite Tevez did :lol: .

  494. Craig Mc:

    Oh dear, sorry everyone for moaning, and then bringing those two names up again :roll: .

  495. Anthony Los:

    @Craig Mc: cheers craig for u tru united comment and the advise bout censoring i will try and cut it down
    safe

  496. Andrei:

    @Anthony Los: A differential of .8 is really, really bad. Study your quantitative methods.

    @Craig Mc: For fuck’s sake Craig, I have already said that he was all right in his first season!!! Read the above.

    @Craig Mc: Sure, he will get tons of excuses just as Nani is getting excuses despite having been absolutely shit this season. But at least Rooney has been good in the past. Consistently good.

  497. Anthony Los:

    @Craig Mc: Who do u want united to get?

  498. Anthony Los:

    @Andrei: ha andrei honestly mate with the difference in games played between those to, no its not a lot :!:

  499. Fred The Red:

    @Craig Mc: hes a good player mate but I think he has a lot more to give, and its not down to laziness. A bit of good coahing and a decent run in the team could help, coz on raw talent alone hes got the lot, but he defo needs to mature mentally mate.

  500. Anthony Los:

    craig??

  501. Andrei:

    @Anthony Los: It has nothing to do with the games played. It has to do with the following:

    Ronaldo had 57 sot in 31 starts and 2 substitute appearances. That means that he had less than 2 sot per game. Given that he converted roughly 1 in 3, that gives him about two goals every 3 games.

    Now, Nani has 0.8 less in the sot:shots ratio. Suppose that he would have the same number of shots/game in a season (even though he won’t) as Ronaldo, that means that he would have 48 sot for every 181 shots.

    Fourty-eight shots in 31 starts and 2 sub appearances would mean exactly 1.5 sot/game (on average). Now, given that he has converts 1 shot in 4, he will have a bit more that 1 goal every three matches. This means that in a season with 31 starts and two sub appearances, he would have about 11 goals to Ronaldo’s 18.

    So, yea 0.8 is a lot in these kinds of statistics.

    Note: I am NOT comparing Ronaldo to Nani. I am NOT saying that Nani should do as well as Ronaldo. I am just showing that Nani’s deficit in the statistics above actually signify a difference.

  502. Anthony Los:

    Andrei your point is valid but these are meaningless stats that are broken a lot at OT and say nani takes 100 shots in 1 game (not possible but for arguments sake) all those stats you just game me (credit to you for doing the math) will count for shit. Andrei you are taking a literal perspective but stats show a lot of things that are technically correct but in a regarding a real game situation they are not as considered that much it just makes you sound smart saying them. However you are 100% correct in all the points given

  503. Fred The Red:

    I know this is completely of topic but Michael Jackson has died of a heart attack.

  504. Anthony Los:

    i also meant to say and scores 20 goals out of the 100 shots (impossible, but again for arguments sake)

  505. Anthony Los:

    @Fred The Red: i know its really sad
    r.i.p m.j

  506. NicoQB:

    Craig.

    Michael.

    Jackson.

    Dead.

    Cue the cascade of Nani jokes.

  507. Andrei:

    @Anthony Los: I know what you mean – I absolutely hate stats for the most part. Anyway, as one great philosopher said, what I think of Nani is immaterial. Whether he will play at OT next season and whether he will do well depends solely on him and SAF.

  508. Andrei:

    @NicoQB: In the words of Setanta’s Special One:

    Nani, are you OK, are you OK, Nani (to the beat of Smooth Criminal)

    Also, really sad to hear about Michael Jackson – he was good albeit eccentric.

  509. Anthony Los:

    lads im sooo worried bout who fergie is gonna sign, some1 cheers me up but with real rumors

  510. Red Ranter:

    @Anthony Los: We’re getting Ronaldo back. And Messi too.

  511. Anthony Los:

    hahah cheers all better

  512. Craig Mc:

    @Andrei: And whether you will still be a Man Utd fan next season depends SOLELY on you too!

  513. Craig Mc:

    @NicoQB: Errrr Nico, Craig is not dead yet mate, as of now, still very much alive, and bantering with the numpties of this blog :wink: :lol: .

  514. Anthony Los:

    lol rinsed
    no offense andrei

  515. Craig Mc:

    @Anthony Los: I love the ‘Will count for shit’ comment very much Anthony :lol: :lol: :lol: .

  516. Craig Mc:

    @Fred The Red: Maybe a new Manager might help him mentally. A manager that isn’t Cry Baby biased, if you get my meaning. Oh well, the mard arses are out of here, they went that way :arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :arrow: :lol: .

  517. Craig Mc:

    @Anthony Los: I wanted Anelka Bro, when Fergie was offered him for 8-10 million, but he arsed about and Chelski snapped him up. He was top scorer in the prem last year, and that says something. I wanted Essien, but again United dithered and slithered, where Chelski didn’t. I wanted Joe Cole when he was going for peanuts, but Chelski……… I could go on mate, but I would be here all bloody night :wink: :grin: .

  518. Traverse:

    http://store.manutd.com/product_images/maxzoom/prd_maxzoom_mufc-55671.jpg

    and

    http://www.manutd.com/default.sps?pagegid={48C41513-A376-4D1F-981D-660FC5BB193E}&newsid=6635120

    seems to have gone up a few days early

  519. Craig Mc:

    @Andrei: Errrr when was Rooney CONSISTENTLY good then?????? I must have been in a coma at the time and missed it. I know Ronney is good in spurts, but consistently good Nooooooooooooo. Was he on the pitch in Rome, or in Moscow then? If so he wasn’t noticeable! I would love to see a consistent Rooney, but I havent seen it yet. We will see how good he is this year though, because we have to rely on HIS CONSISTENCY and to see if he can supply the goals to win us anything. That goes for Count Berba too.

  520. NicoQB:

    You guys should really move to the next thread… For the sake of convenience..

  521. Anthony Los:

    @Craig Mc: haha cheers. i wanted the exact same players they wld be perfect 4 the squad! but look mate we have to pray fergie will bring in new blood to revitalize the team. But ye ure right bout roons inconsistency

  522. Craig Mc:

    @Anthony Los: Fergie will bring in new blood Anthony, but unfortunately, whats the betting that it will be ANAEMIC! :smile: .

  523. Craig Mc:

    @NicoQB: But we like it in here, away from blog numptee :wink: :lol: .

  524. NicoQB:

    @Craig Mc: Sincere condolences, mate… :sad: :sad: :sad:

  525. Anthony Los:

    hahahahahah mate craig im proper lolling (laughing out loud)

  526. Grognard:

    @Dan: Football Manager is a way of life mate. Congrats.

  527. Grognard:

    @Craig Mc: Amen Bro. United for life and no ocean can keep my heart and soul from being spiritually seated in the Salford end at OT at all times. :smile: Manc to the death.

  528. Grognard:

    @NicoQB: Just what I was thinking of……sadly.

  529. Anthony Los:

    @Grognard: haha i love the “spiritually seated Salford end”
    safe

  530. Andrei:

    @Craig Mc: I wasn’t talking about game-to-game consistency, I was talking about season-to-season and since he came to United, Rooney has had incredible consistency from one season to another. If you look at his numbers, they are almost the same every season (and they are always good – not excellent, but good).

  531. Anthony Los:

    @Andrei: Mate just leave it he is always gonna prove you wrong so just forget it

  532. Andrei:

    @Craig Mc: Hehe :lol: Don’t worry I can take a ‘rinsing’.

    @Craig Mc: It does and you can be sure that I will support the best team in the world. Right. I’m off to the Real Madrid blog now. Ciao! I’ll be back when they start losing.

    [...]

    I’b back.

    By the way, me defending Nani:

    http://soccerlens.com/forum/topic/fact/page/2 (fourth post)

  533. Anthony Los:

    By the way andrei “ciao” is italian. adios is “spanish”

  534. Hannoodi:

    @Craig Mc: Im a huge fan of Nanis BUT no, Manchester United will not ever change their manager to fit with Nanis progress or playing time, changing the manager that won everything for us over 22 years because he doesnt let a player with less then a dozen goals and just a little more assists in 2 whole seasons is just insane.

    I hope you understand I like Nani a lot, he is my 3rd favorite player at United at the moment after Berbatov and Evra respectivly, an yes I would say the same for any other player including Ronaldo, Rooney or anyone else for that matter.

    Sir Alex Furgosun is old enough to be a father to most of us if not even grandfather, he is the best thing that ever happened to Manchester United and you are not a true manc if you dont agree with that.

  535. Andrei:

    @Anthony Los: Hehe, I know, I used to speak Spanish. I just said ‘ciao’ out of reflex (it is in my daily repertoire).

  536. Karl:

    @Anthony Los: Not to defend any player, just want to point out that Ronaldo’s shot:goal ratio is not exactly an ideal criteria to gauge a striker’s performance. Imo, he took a helluva lot of shots. The fact that he had the confidence to take those shots one can perhaps admire because our Strikers seemed goal-shy, but, thinking back, not all his shots were ‘in the best interest of the team’.

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