Comments on: Reaction to the Chelsea defeat http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/ Manchester United Blog Sat, 13 Mar 2010 17:46:56 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.1 hourly 1 By: gator http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92562 gator Wed, 11 Nov 2009 22:51:41 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92562 @<a href="#comment-92345" rel="nofollow">Onkar</a>: you are still speculating that the ronaldo money is NOT available. The only "official statements" that i have seen say that 60 of the 80 were made available to saf along with our normal 25 for the summer transfer window, and that all unused funds roll over to the next transfer window. Even Sir Alex has said that the money was available but he didnt use it so the kids could get a chance to step up and i agree with this idea. macheda, wellbeck, da silvas, obertan, nani, anderson, and others all have a chance to save United lots of money by becoming united class. All of these kids could come good if given the chance/if they take it. If not i expect like every other united fan to see close to 100m pounds spent next year and some that arent cutting it to be sold. This is when we will know if we have the money or not. I have seen no evidence or statement that states differently yet. @Onkar: you are still speculating that the ronaldo money is NOT available.

The only “official statements” that i have seen say that 60 of the 80 were made available to saf along with our normal 25 for the summer transfer window, and that all unused funds roll over to the next transfer window.

Even Sir Alex has said that the money was available but he didnt use it so the kids could get a chance to step up and i agree with this idea. macheda, wellbeck, da silvas, obertan, nani, anderson, and others all have a chance to save United lots of money by becoming united class.

All of these kids could come good if given the chance/if they take it. If not i expect like every other united fan to see close to 100m pounds spent next year and some that arent cutting it to be sold.

This is when we will know if we have the money or not. I have seen no evidence or statement that states differently yet.

]]> By: Sam Davis http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92411 Sam Davis Wed, 11 Nov 2009 15:39:37 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92411 A bit off-topic but how do you guys here normally keep up with the comments section of different posts? Do you just periodically come back to the site to see if new comments have been added or is it possible to subscribe to an RSS feed of sorts specifically for the comments, drop it in Google Reader, for instance, and follow it that way? I see the "notify me of followup comments via e-mail" box below but is there another way that won't clog up your inbox? A bit off-topic but how do you guys here normally keep up with the comments section of different posts? Do you just periodically come back to the site to see if new comments have been added or is it possible to subscribe to an RSS feed of sorts specifically for the comments, drop it in Google Reader, for instance, and follow it that way?

I see the “notify me of followup comments via e-mail” box below but is there another way that won’t clog up your inbox?

]]> By: Onkar http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92345 Onkar Wed, 11 Nov 2009 11:43:22 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92345 @<a href="#comment-92332" rel="nofollow">rysho</a>: And further more I don't agree that banks won't be interested in the land that has been mortgage with them. They won't take any action until two events... We are servicing debts (at least interest component on time) and the current valuation of that is lower than what they have valued while mortgaging the same... But some day if both things reveres then they may opt to take charge of that land for the money that they need to recover.... I think things might be clearer for you now then they were.... All in all in Short <strong> "Financial Leveraging as whole is not bad but in case of Man UTD it is definitely hurting us big time. We have tried chewing more than what we can swallow that's all"</strong> @rysho: And further more I don’t agree that banks won’t be interested in the land that has been mortgage with them. They won’t take any action until two events…
We are servicing debts (at least interest component on time) and the current valuation of that is lower than what they have valued while mortgaging the same…
But some day if both things reveres then they may opt to take charge of that land for the money that they need to recover….
I think things might be clearer for you now then they were….
All in all in Short
“Financial Leveraging as whole is not bad but in case of Man UTD it is definitely hurting us big time. We have tried chewing more than what we can swallow that’s all”

]]> By: Onkar http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92344 Onkar Wed, 11 Nov 2009 11:37:12 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92344 @<a href="#comment-92332" rel="nofollow">rysho</a>: First of all debts are only good when they can be repaid regularly along with the compulsory interest payment. Moreover I don't buy into your argument of having debts is some time better than not having it. I think leveraging (specially financial leveraging) only helps when you have scope to earn super normal or I should say above normal profits. Where your IRR is far and I repeat FAR more than your cost of borrowed funds. But in united's case it doesn't look like that way (at least prima facie). As when you are barely paying your interest and after doing record Operating profits if you are booking Per tax losses then you can safely say that you have tried to chew more than what you can swallow. This is typical case where more often than not you go for liquidity burst as you go insolvent in short run. Please take note of word short run. This means that you are not able to pay of your revenue expd as well as interest and current liab from your Revenue+ Current assets. This push you to use your long term debt funds for revenue purpose rather than capital purpose which eventually end up in insolvency of the organization. Now, I am trying to say that this how Man UTD will end all I am saying is having debt won't always help definitely not in this case. Moreover, I wuld like to point out that how not having debt would have helped us. If we were debt free company like we originally was then all proceeds of Ronaldo money would have got reinvested in the system and players. Now, all of us almost have an idea where that money has gone. Now, (I am not sure about the accounting treatment) my understanding says that what ever profit we made on the sale of Ronaldo was capital gains for which was earned over a period of time. So, this should have got interested in potential assets for the business be it players, stadium, academy etc.. Has it happened??? Answer is big NO. This is clear sign that we are using the proceeds from the sale of an assets to pay of just the interest which clearly suggest that our capital structure what is commonly known as Debt Equity Ratio is already stressed. Moreover, the one should answer the simple question that why after having the best three year period in recent time our debts have actually increased rather than other way around. Which clearly point out towards one thing that we have revalued our debt. Why??? May be because the lenders are not sure about the creditworthiness of the company and they wanted to cover there risk by increasing the cost of funds which resulted in higher debts!!! All these signs show you one thing Leveraging can be good fine but it purely depends on which industry you are a part of. And the kind of leveraging we are forced into is definitely not helping us for sure. @rysho: First of all debts are only good when they can be repaid regularly along with the compulsory interest payment. Moreover I don’t buy into your argument of having debts is some time better than not having it. I think leveraging (specially financial leveraging) only helps when you have scope to earn super normal or I should say above normal profits. Where your IRR is far and I repeat FAR more than your cost of borrowed funds. But in united’s case it doesn’t look like that way (at least prima facie). As when you are barely paying your interest and after doing record Operating profits if you are booking Per tax losses then you can safely say that you have tried to chew more than what you can swallow. This is typical case where more often than not you go for liquidity burst as you go insolvent in short run. Please take note of word short run. This means that you are not able to pay of your revenue expd as well as interest and current liab from your Revenue+ Current assets. This push you to use your long term debt funds for revenue purpose rather than capital purpose which eventually end up in insolvency of the organization.
Now, I am trying to say that this how Man UTD will end all I am saying is having debt won’t always help definitely not in this case. Moreover, I wuld like to point out that how not having debt would have helped us. If we were debt free company like we originally was then all proceeds of Ronaldo money would have got reinvested in the system and players. Now, all of us almost have an idea where that money has gone. Now, (I am not sure about the accounting treatment) my understanding says that what ever profit we made on the sale of Ronaldo was capital gains for which was earned over a period of time. So, this should have got interested in potential assets for the business be it players, stadium, academy etc.. Has it happened??? Answer is big NO. This is clear sign that we are using the proceeds from the sale of an assets to pay of just the interest which clearly suggest that our capital structure what is commonly known as Debt Equity Ratio is already stressed. Moreover, the one should answer the simple question that why after having the best three year period in recent time our debts have actually increased rather than other way around. Which clearly point out towards one thing that we have revalued our debt. Why??? May be because the lenders are not sure about the creditworthiness of the company and they wanted to cover there risk by increasing the cost of funds which resulted in higher debts!!! All these signs show you one thing Leveraging can be good fine but it purely depends on which industry you are a part of. And the kind of leveraging we are forced into is definitely not helping us for sure.

]]> By: rysho http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92332 rysho Wed, 11 Nov 2009 10:48:25 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92332 @<a href="#comment-92089" rel="nofollow">Grognard</a>: I dont think we should be too worried about our debt. Yes, Glazers dont buy this club becouse they are fans of United, but they bought it as a investition. Without own money, only with loans. When they pay back loans, they got a moneymachine. We are not yet in the best shape to produce money, but commercialy we have progressed very well. You could see it. We have got a lot of sponsor deals in Asia, Middle East and Afrika. They try to use United brand for commercial deals across the world and that brings a lot of money and it will bring even more money in future. Back to the loans. Today its better to have debts, than dont. Because the money value is very low and it will be worse. I dont know the structure of loans, but i bet the most of them are in USD. It will be great, because in next few years will be european economic much stronger than american. Europe has the possibility to grow, because of new EU members. So the value of USD loans falls in GBP or EUR. I think this is good for us. Next think is our collateral for loans are estates. These estates you cant sell today. Banks dont take estates instead of money. Carrington training ground, who would buy this. So its in interest of bank to pay back loans. They would rather negotiate with you how to pay it, and they are able to wait a little bit longer. The worst thing for us is when we have to pay the debt and dont have enough money to buy better players. Transfer politics to buy only under 26 and foreign youngsters its becouse of this i think. You could find answer for this problem in academy. @Grognard: I dont think we should be too worried about our debt. Yes, Glazers dont buy this club becouse they are fans of United, but they bought it as a investition. Without own money, only with loans. When they pay back loans, they got a moneymachine. We are not yet in the best shape to produce money, but commercialy we have progressed very well. You could see it. We have got a lot of sponsor deals in Asia, Middle East and Afrika. They try to use United brand for commercial deals across the world and that brings a lot of money and it will bring even more money in future.
Back to the loans. Today its better to have debts, than dont. Because the money value is very low and it will be worse. I dont know the structure of loans, but i bet the most of them are in USD. It will be great, because in next few years will be european economic much stronger than american. Europe has the possibility to grow, because of new EU members. So the value of USD loans falls in GBP or EUR. I think this is good for us.
Next think is our collateral for loans are estates. These estates you cant sell today. Banks dont take estates instead of money. Carrington training ground, who would buy this. So its in interest of bank to pay back loans. They would rather negotiate with you how to pay it, and they are able to wait a little bit longer.
The worst thing for us is when we have to pay the debt and dont have enough money to buy better players. Transfer politics to buy only under 26 and foreign youngsters its becouse of this i think. You could find answer for this problem in academy.

]]> By: gator http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92188 gator Wed, 11 Nov 2009 00:11:14 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92188 Barcelona cant afford <a href="http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=696974&sec=transfers&cc=5901" rel="nofollow">robinho :shock: Barcelona cant afford robinho :shock:

]]> By: gator http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92187 gator Wed, 11 Nov 2009 00:08:23 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92187 @<a href="#comment-92131" rel="nofollow">[OPTI]Madschester United</a>: haha thats pretty funny mate :twisted: @[OPTI]Madschester United: haha thats pretty funny mate :twisted:

]]> By: gator http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92186 gator Wed, 11 Nov 2009 00:05:34 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92186 @<a href="#comment-92122" rel="nofollow">Red Ranter</a>: dont tell anyone i was a finance major ;-) @Red Ranter: dont tell anyone i was a finance major ;-)

]]> By: Grognard http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92148 Grognard Tue, 10 Nov 2009 21:21:41 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92148 On a very sad note regarding German goalkeepers, Robert Enke has died in what is believed to have been a suicide. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091110/ap_on_sp_so_ne/soc_obit_enke On a very sad note regarding German goalkeepers, Robert Enke has died in what is believed to have been a suicide.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091110/ap_on_sp_so_ne/soc_obit_enke

]]> By: Grognard http://redrants.com/reaction-to-the-chelsea-defeat/comment-page-3/#comment-92146 Grognard Tue, 10 Nov 2009 21:11:55 +0000 http://redrants.com/?p=2366#comment-92146 @<a href="#comment-92137" rel="nofollow">ROOOOONEY</a>: Truly amazing skill on the ball. Name one United midfielder that has not only that kind of touch, dribbling skill, finesse and vision, but the ability to score goals too? The answer...........NOBODY! @ROOOOONEY: Truly amazing skill on the ball. Name one United midfielder that has not only that kind of touch, dribbling skill, finesse and vision, but the ability to score goals too? The answer………..NOBODY!

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