Sep 17
SAF reckons this isn’t Scholsey’s last season; but should it?
It took a Paul Scholes header to get us past Besiktas the other day, in what was otherwise, a mind-numbingly stodgy match. Passes went astray, Rooney left isolated — frustrated, even — wingers failing to provide a cutting edge consistently; all in all, a classic away European performance from the runners-up.
United’s performances, despite their superior results in comparison to the last two seasons, have been schizophrenic, for want of a better word. But a relative constant, in all of Ferguson’s methodical(?) madness of rotation, has been Paul Scholes.
Scholes has actually been surprisingly good for all talk of his advancing years. However, ‘goodness’ is relative; I have lowered expectations from our old guard, and Scholes has performed above the bar I’ve set for him. [Had he been 29, I'd have different expectations of him.]
As I recovered from narcolepsy a good many hours following our win against Besiktas, I read Ferguson’s comments on his plans for Paul Scholes: “I don’t think this is Paul’s last season,” said Fergie. “What else has he got? He’s a football man.”
Scholsey would argue he’s a committed family man and he’d settle down nicely in a heartbeat if given the chance, but that is besides the point. [I love Scholes precisely for this reason; he's a throwback to a different era as a model professional.] Ferguson goes on to add, “He’ll miss more than he plays, but if I can get 25 games out of him at the level we saw against Spurs and Besiktas, we’ll be delighted with that. I don’t think this will be his last season, not the way he plays. He’s not the type that bursts into the penalty box these days, is he?”
For the sake of argument, 25 games at the level we saw against Spurs is acceptable, but at the level we saw at Besiktas is not. The obvious question would be to ask if he really should carry on in a United shirt.
But a more pertinent question, subtly different, gets lost in the process, which is, why should United be in a situation where they have to rely on a 34 year old midfielder or another 35 year old (Ryan Giggs) to make up the numbers?
Loyalty is a beautiful thing, especially when it’s a two-way street; we’ve all witnessed that with Ferguson’s soft corner for Giggs, Neville and Scholes. But it appears the players don’t seem to have a feel for calling it quits when they are obviously past it. [I'll make an exception on Ryan Giggs.] Neither does Ferguson realise it.
There is far too much respect for Scholes and Neville from both manager and fans alike — and deservedly so — that even if someone stood up, gathering all the respect they could muster, and tell Scholes and Neville to call it a day, that person would only face abuse.
Ferguson is known for making tough decisions. But on his favourite men from the golden generation, he’s dithered. Ferguson may think Scholes is good for another season, but I hope he’s just saying this publicly in a manner of traditional ‘manager-speak’.
Scholes and Neville are United legends without doubt, which is why I’d rather keep those good times in my mind than watch them over-extend themselves in their twilight years. Trust me — especially in the case of Neville — it’s not always a pleasant sight.
Note: In case you want tickets to the Man City game, don’t forget to take part in our competition in association with Betfair. Details here. Tonight (Thursday midnight GMT) is the latest you can enroll.
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Tags: Opinions/Columns
September 17th, 2009 at 7:24
I think u r bang on with this assessment…Scholes and Giggs are such wonderful players that when they play for 90 minutes, they are bound to create a couple of good chances especially against lesser teams but against top notch sides the age does show up invariably.
One reason for SAF still using them is the lack of growth in players such as Nani, Ando, Carrick n Park.
But then in the same vein, the question does arise why he did not bid for someone like Sneijder n Robben!!!
September 17th, 2009 at 7:44
I feel it should be his last years. I mean can use analogy with the Great Cricket Player from India WC winning captain Kapil Dev. Arguably one of the best all rounder. But, towards the end of his career he just stretched it so much that, we fans felt that, we want him out but, how to tell him that you are not required any more because you are not competent anymore!!!!
I hope we Man UTD fan wouldn’t face something like this. And Scholesey and Red Nev should really go into sun set with all the calm and pride.
I may like to Giggsy playing if he wants (may be not more 15 games next season) but with all due respect other two should call it a day no matter what gaffer says!!!!
September 17th, 2009 at 8:44
Can’t he just make them player-coaches but not play them.
September 17th, 2009 at 8:56
Goood point Cyclops Red, have them around in a player coach capacity and use them if we realy need them after this season.
Great article by the way. It does make you think when we are setting out on a campaign to win 4 leagues in a row and make three champions league finals on the bounce and retain a league cup with 2 players (all be it legends) as a focal point of our central midfield for the season.
September 17th, 2009 at 9:07
In all fairness, I think it is a pretty nice article. But then the thought of telling them to retire and not continue is sort of difficult. But then, if you take out the fact that they are absolute legends and assume that they are just 34-35 year old players, what would you expect of them? And are they meeting your expectations?
I think if Scholes can deliver his Spurs type performances than it is okay. But I honestly feel 25 games is slightly over doing it. But then Fergie can’t really come out and say that this should be their last season can he? That would be disastrous. No manager can do that.
Relying on 35 year olds to do a job isn’t something that we should ashamed of. I think it only serves as a testimony to the fact that these players are so damn good. We all think Giggsy or Scholesy have been such disappointments because we have been expecting them to be of the same consistent level that we have been used to seeing from them. Now, their roles have changed. Scholes lies back and passes around and is intended to unleash the men ahead of him. Giggsy has been re invented into something of an enigma.
September 17th, 2009 at 9:09
Garbage. Giggs and Scholes have been along with Rooney our best players so far this season. Agree its time for Nev to move upstairs though. Looks like he is past it and the legs are starting to go. Sad to see as hes been a wonderful servant but at least he should stay at the club in some capacity.
September 17th, 2009 at 9:21
Let me tell you why. At the moment he is more consistent than some of our players and if they carry on, it will only be good as it brings maturity to our club and if you were to buy more inexperience players, we could be like Arsenal. 25 games is enough for him. You can’t expect to have many superstar players in your team. At the moment, all we can do is prolong the career of our own players and who say asking them to quit is good for the team? Let me tell you why i support United and not other clubs. I like the club as i feel this is a big family and not like other clubs which buys superstars and ditch their players like city. I would not like it if we were to become like them.
September 17th, 2009 at 9:53
Scholes has had an excellent start to the season and I fail to see why you should find it surprising.
Scholes is 34 now and his game has changed since he was 24. Trouble is people think that he should be doing the same things. He no longer gets forward as often to win headers in the box and release his trademark thunderbolts. If you have watched him so far this season he has become the hub in the centre. His awarenes of what is happening around him, his positioning and the way he always makes himself available for a pass and his distribution has been excellent.
Scholes can carry on fulfilling this role for another season, no problem and Ferguson realises this.
September 17th, 2009 at 9:55
@kel: Well put m8
September 17th, 2009 at 10:44
You tend to overlook the influence of Giggs,Scholes and Neville off the field.Fergie expects his younger/new players to behave in a certain way on and off the field, and there can be no better role models than this trio. And don’t forget that they are winners, and to instill that winning mentality in the squad is vital.
September 17th, 2009 at 11:18
RR-Maldini played for 24 years for Milan,from the age of 16 till he was 40.As Sir Matt once said,”If they’re good enough,they’re young enough.”He said the same for youngsters too.
Scholes and Giggs are good enough for us,as is Neville.
September 17th, 2009 at 11:41
I thought I was done with the washed up paul scholes after this year, Now the old geriatric comes up and tells me I have to suffer through more years of ginger head. His performance against spurs was one in more than 10. Respect is all well and good, but I lost respect for paul scholes many weeks ago, his goal against besiktas not withstanding. The player just doesn’t know when he’s a liability more than an asset, he is keeping our young players off the pitch and hogging all the action. When are the young players who are supposed to lead united in the next coming years ever going to develop if we keep playing these over the hill senile players like giggs and scholes?
Personally I have no problem with him being a member of the squad, but I’d rather see him come in as a substitute and watch fletcher and anderson command our midfield, with carrick and gibbo in the bench and scholes a further 5 option, but to see him week in week out, in every competitive game, is just a pain I’m finding too much to bear. I swear one of these days I’ll see the line up and just choose to not watch the game.
September 17th, 2009 at 11:48
@Saim4mMancunia: I think the lack of growth in players like Anderson and Nani is down to the fact we still have players who are 34 and 35 getting game time ahead of them. I fear that Gibson won’t progress because he needs game time, and Fergie is turning to Scholes instead. If this were Fergie 10 years ago he’d have culled Scholes and Neville already, and this would be Giggs’ last season for sure.
I fear that we are stagnating. We’ve got a golden opportunity to build and blood a good young team, and with Chelsea banned from the transfer market we have a great opportunity to cement our place above them, but the reason we didn’t go and buy players like Silva and Snjeider or play Anderson or Gibson is because we have Giggs and Scholes.
September 17th, 2009 at 12:24
I think that sir Alex ferguson is having a fucking joke here, what next recall cantona, that man seriously needs his head examined. The only way that I could accept pauls scoles to stay on is to fill in as a sub in the later part of games when no-one else out of the youngsters are available. We all can now see the improvement in Andersons play and that is who I want to be playing week in and week out. I wonder what message this is sending out to anderson if this happens I can see anderson leaving in the summer if not in the January transfer winow, come on sir Alex get freakin real here. Do not get me wrong on his day he can be just as good as anyone but not over a period of ninety minutes noris he consistant enough. I say Thanks scholes you were a good servant over the years but just follow your heart and now call it a day at old trafford and make room for the younger energetic players.
September 17th, 2009 at 12:35
Silva seems to be suggesting he would be open to coming to United. No chance we will buy him.
Seven central mids competing for two places and six wingers competing for two places. I would prefer more quality than quantity.
September 17th, 2009 at 12:37
@Traverse: The slave was ever present last year. To accommodate him we needed to have Park on the other wing. Also, Nani wasn’t given many oppurtunities last time because he didn’t show enough to fulfill the vast potential that he has. He is being played now and we have had ourselves another winger too. Nani is showing his potential now and if he could improve upon his decision making, he can truly turn out to be a world class winger. Anderson is already showing signs of improvement. Asking to play in the reserves, scoring
when everyone including myself thought that that day would never dawn upon us.
If we had asked Scholes and Giggs to step down last year along with Tevez and Ronaldo leaving, where would the experience come from. Also, these players are generally not as bad as they being made out to be. Only, SAF is using them in a way that most would disagree. But then, the success is right there for everyone to see isn’t it?
Regarding the opportunity to build a team, isn’t that what we are doing now? We can’t blood in Rafael and Fabio because they are far too suspect defensively. Macheda can’t become a world class striker. Gibson clearly isn’t in the same bracket as the Scholes of yore, all these players might develop if given ample game time, but then in giving them game time we might squander our title winning hopes, like Arsenal, which is self detrimental.
All that Fergie has done, right or wrong in people’s opinions has always been in the best interests of the team. If he had gone on to buy a world class striker/midfielder then our youth would have had to take a back seat right? The fact that he hasn’t bought many is to utilize the youth that we have and hence to build a young, good team. Scholes and Giggs along with Neville play and guide and I think just doing away with them would be detrimental to this philosophy.
September 17th, 2009 at 12:47
@UnitedUnited: Holding on to them past their sell by date is just as detrimental as any psychological loss. Scholes came through because we sold Paul Ince, Andrei Kanchelskis and Mark Hughes while they were all still good enough to play for United, and better than Scholes and Neville have been for the last two seasons and a half! Scholes became the player he is because he played every week in the first team. He knew he’d be playing most games. If Anderson plays well one week, he’ll probably be out the next week regardless because we have 8 players for 2 positions on the pitch. More often than not Fergie will play one up front to accommodate 3 of them.
It not surprising that nobody has come through as a leader, because nobody has had to. Rio should have been given the captaincy 3 years ago, and now it looks like he’ll be 32 before Neville retires.
September 17th, 2009 at 12:49
Also, quotes from David Silva
“It’s an honour for any player that a club of the prestige of Manchester United should follow them and that in itself is enormous praise. I know that the Premier League is a big competition and hard to resist.”
Then he pulls a bit of a Ronaldo, “I am committed to Valencia and my dream is to win the title but in the future anything is possible.”
Fergie, sign him up.
September 17th, 2009 at 13:09
SAF has the bad weed blues, no one disputes scholes contribution to the team but 25 games past your expiry date, thats way to much. Scholes should retire by his own will since fergy wont do it,this will let players like Ando, gibson get more chances to mature in the game.
September 17th, 2009 at 13:23
@Traverse: if this is true mate, i still dont understand why we haven’t yet sigened him up. he is the creative brain we need to unlock defences esp of teams that will come park the bus.
Also to give our strikers that final ball.
September 17th, 2009 at 15:01
@Ondii Oketchii: Because he’d rather hang on to Scholes and Giggs than sign the next Scholes or Giggs.
September 17th, 2009 at 15:27
The truth is that Fergie plays it safe. Scholes and Giggs play ok and occasionally have a good game. Anderson and Nani have a mixture of good and bad and haven’t found the consistency.
Giggs and Scholes at their stage in their career are consistently average and for Fergie that is good enough.
Fergie in his old age is not prepared to risk playing Anderson and Gibson because at their age they will occasionally have a bad game.
As for Carrick, he is a complete disgrace. Not United quality
September 17th, 2009 at 16:14
ye agree with the article about neville, he is past it and it believ SAF will slowly fade him out with rafel taking up the mantle. Giggs still has it and along with scholes i believe they both have alot they give to the squad. In my opinion SAF will know when the time is right with those two, but sadly but surely they will both be faded out in the next 2 seasons. overall we have a great squad while I hope to see some new faces in january or in the summer. Agree with Clover on most of his points but not about carrick he brings consistency and i think he will get better when he is played with a defensive midfielder like Hargreaves
September 17th, 2009 at 16:39
Rooney LEFT ISOLATED ?????? I think you’ll find Rooney isolated himself RedRanter – on the left wing
.
September 17th, 2009 at 16:42
@brad: Carrick consistent? What exactly does he do mate, because I am mystified?
September 17th, 2009 at 16:46
Is it just me, or does scholesy NEVER LEARN? In the Besiktas game, it hadn’t been going but for a few minutes before Scolesy slid in again with one of his notorious ruthless and thoughtless tackles on an opponent. I thought here goes – Mr Red Card waiting to happen. Why does he find it so difficult to tackle normally with out sliding in on his arse?
September 17th, 2009 at 16:50
RedRanter – did you really say you wouldn’t mind a Scholes of the standard of the Spurs game???? I seem to recall he didn’t play a FULL game bro!
September 17th, 2009 at 16:58
@Craig Mc: When you play 4-3-3/4-5-1 you will always isolate Rooney.
@Craig Mc: He played well till the tackle. I’m referring to his performance until the red card. It’s adequate — not top draw — but since he’s a squad player, I can take 25 such performances. I doubt he’ll be able to do so however.
September 17th, 2009 at 17:03
@Craig Mc: I wouldn’t say Carrick brings consistency but more like stability…when last season started everyone was moaning how Carrick was once again “not united material” but then he got injured, our midfield struggled like hell and all were moaning how we are missing Carrick who on returning played really well for us till bar the UEFA CL final and we have been repeating this cycle for the 3 years since he arrived…Fergie likes tried and tested English midfielders and there isnt anyone else out there now who is good enough for the top level…as for Silva, it seems he wants to move to us and if we can afford him its a top drawer signing but it will signal the end of Tosic’s career with us…I cant understand why Fergie doesnt pick Fabio who played well at the start of the season at RB and keeps on with Neville who now seems to play at a snails pace these days
September 17th, 2009 at 17:29
@brad: Mate the thing about carrick is, to me i think weve seen the best of him tbh, but as i say this is just my opinion. Its a wild thing to say that a player is more or less finished with us at his age when hes what, 28 i think, but for me the reason i say he is finished is not because his legs are gone or anything like that, to me its because of his attitude.
Hes been here 3 years now, brought in at a time when we were really struggling without the premiership for 4 years and hes put into a team that goes on to do very well for itself, winning the prem every year hes been here and reaching 2 champs league finals winning one of them.
If were being honest when carrick joined he would probably never have thought in a million years that come 3 years time he would end up with 3 prem medals, a champions league medal and a world championship medal in his cabinet.
Alot of people i have heard have said carrick has played a big part in us becoming the major force we are right now, but im sorry to say for me carrick has always been a big game bottler and i put alot of the credit for our fantastic few years on the head of our departed number 7 ronaldo. Thats not to say nobody else played a part in it because of course this is a team game but i have to say from my opinion carrick barely imposed hiself in europe full stop except for roma 06/07 and in the prem has also failed to proove his worth against top oppisition.
But i have to call carricks character into question getting back to my original point. It may just be me but i feel under the impression that the number of trophies he has won with the team in a relative short space of time have gone to his head and he now looks a shadow of the player he was at spurs and even of the last 2 years.
Now i see him he seems to simply plod along, no real effort, not the look of a man desperate to win. Simply i wonder if the man feels hes won enough now and feels a sense of satisfaction that is causing the player not to want to push on and win the trophies over and over like u can see with people like giggs, evra, scholes, rooney etc.
Im not singling him out its just imo every player has his best period and sometimes trophies can go to players heads. It happened with yorke and he was gotten rid of, fergie saw he had lost his passion so he was out, and i wonder if carrick is the same. Thats not to say he goes out partying and drinking cos im sure he doesnt i just wonder if hes fallen into a state of being over comfortable with what hes got and has lost the desire to go on and win it again. Every player has their time when they give their best and then simply can give no more and for me we have seen the best of carrick already and its best to offload him for a younger hungrier player, sneijder would have been a great choice.
But this is just my opinion and im sure it will cause a lot of controversy but to be honest its my opinion and its what i believe none the less.
September 17th, 2009 at 17:39
@Red Ranter: Please don’t try and kid a kidder RedRanter
. It is not the system with Rooney, it is that he is the biggest wanderer on the pitch than the loniest nomad to be found on earth. He should stay where he was appointed to play, and then our wingers wouldn’t be interfered with in trying to do their jobs, and they might have a striker to give the ball to in and around the box!
I knew what you meant about Scholesy RR, I was just teasing you about that one
.
September 17th, 2009 at 17:49
Man Pity fans on tv message board – quote – “We were not going to play our GALACTICOS against Man United anyway.” There delusion knows no bounds. Let me rephrase that CORRECTLY for them. “We cannot play our REJECTICOS against THE CHAMPIONS, because Lunatic Adebeyor is rightly banned, Tevez can’t face playing a game and not lining up with the team in red, Robinho loves to take a few weeks off every now and again – he isn’t much interested in playing for us as Barca beckons. Wright Phillips and Bellamy are injury proners.”
Man City’s NOT WANTED ONES (REJECTICOS):-
.
Tevez – ousted by Man United
Adebeyor – ousted by Arsenal
Bellamy – ousted by every club he ever played for
Wright Phillips – ousted by Chelski
Barry – rejected by L’Pool, so only had the option of the Pities.
Toure – rejected because Le Arse couldn’t be arsed to keep him.
Is that everbody then – did I miss any of the REJECTICOS out
September 17th, 2009 at 17:50
@Craig Mc: He’s been alright for England when played with a proper striker. He has been a wanderer, but he’s done it much less this season when he’s with a partner. When played up on his own, he gets isolated and frustrated. Ferguson knows this, yet he persists.
Of course, if it’s anyone but Nani it’s the player’s fault but if it’s Nani it’s the manager’s fault.
September 17th, 2009 at 17:56
@Red Ranter: You are suddenly getting VERY KNOWLEDGE – ible about Lil Man RedRanter – SHAME IT TOOK YOU SO LONG to realise eh?
September 17th, 2009 at 17:58
I’m a little confused here. I thought I read on a few sites before the season started that Scholes came out and said that this was going to be his final season? Now Fergie is talking about inflicting more of the Ginger Sleeping Pill on all of us for seasons to come? HELL NO!
Message to Paul Scholes from Grognard. RETIRE ASAP! And I’m not asking nicely. Just do it and rid us of your perpetual back passes and awful tackles and snails pace. Sometimes athletes need to look at themselves in the mirror and realize that the time has come for them to retire and to allow the development of other players to take precedence over their own selfish ambitions. You had many a great season for this club but you have done nothing over the past two seasons except hold back players like Anderson and Carrick. You have far exceeded the expiry date on your career and it’s time for you to take your ginger colored ass and go on a permanent vacation. And while you are at it, why not take Gary Neville along with you. See ya and thanks for the service and the memories. Call before you come by again.
September 17th, 2009 at 18:09
@Craig Mc: I agree. Rooney has a habit when he is playing up front and by himself of beginning to wander and try everything he can to get close to the ball. So he leaves his lone striker position and likes to wander over tot he wings in hopes he can have a touch of the ball. What bothers me is that Fergie doesn’t limit this in him and scream at him to stay in the middle.
Why we show so many teams so much respect and why we fear them by taking our team and setting up in ultra defensive and super cautious formations is beyond me? Rooney should never ever ever be up front alone. Has Fergie learned nothing from Senior Capello on how to properly utilize the Roon? Play him with an adequate partner and keep him in the middle and he will score goals.
Why we played like pussies against a useless Turkish club is beyond me? Rooney may have been wrong in the way he reacted to being substituted but personally, I felt he earned the moment to rant and get all pissed off because of the useless tactics that forced him to go at it alone for 60 minutes for what reason? We scored after we put two strikers in the game. Had we started like that, we would have won 3-0 or 4-0. It’s not like Besiktas scared us with any world class players or a competent midfield. So why play in fear? Why respect the opposition so much? Why not scare the whole of Europe by going into a hostile place like that and putting on a clinic of attacking football to send a proper message to the rest of the Champions League that United can and will function without Ronaldo? Instead we just confirmed to the whole of Europe that we are absolutely nothing without him.
September 17th, 2009 at 18:10
@Craig Mc: Carrick is consistently ordinary and bland.
September 17th, 2009 at 18:12
@Craig Mc: And had he received yet another yellow and been sent off against Besiktas, you know what his punishment would have been? He’d get to start the next five games after he returned from suspension.
Lets see what happens to Nani the next time he gets a red card. We will probably never see him again.
September 17th, 2009 at 18:18
@Matt: The biggest problem with Carrick is he is not a fast learner and he doesn’t take or learn things from his great performances. Great players often reflect and remember what it was that made them great in a game and they work hard to keep that going. Carrick will have a game where he moves quicker, makes more dynamic passes and decisions and is just more aggressive, and then will return in his next game and go hide in a hole and hardly be heard from. This lack of taking the bull by the horns and really stamping a place for himself has kept him from fully developing his arsenal. The talent is there, the mentality and the commitment isn’t. Frankly, he hasn’t got the heart and the desire to up his game on a consistent level. This is nothing new. This can be said of about 30 percent of all players with great talent. Good but not good enough. He’s far from rubbish but he’s also far from world class and my point has always been, shouldn’t United of all teams be employing world class players in the midfield?
September 17th, 2009 at 18:24
@Craig Mc: I can count at least a dozen times in the Besiktas game where Nani or Valencia or Evra were in a an advantageous position to cross the ball into the box but there was nobody home. Rooney had gone walkabout and was last seen somewhere near Galatasaray Stadium. But the problem here is Fergie. It’s Fergie who allows him to get away with his wandering minstrel show. It’s Fergie who is responsible in putting the reigns on him and putting a leash on him and telling him to stay in a certain area and behave. The problem is poor Wayne is afraid of the darkness that is Besiktas Stadium and hates being left alone. It makes him sad and eventually it made him angry and so he threw his bottle and soother down to the turf when he got subbed off. Poor little guy!
September 17th, 2009 at 18:31
@Craig Mc: Tevez is a CLASS “A” coward of the highest order. He loves to talk the talk and threaten boldly with his 3′2″ frame but he is just a bloody chicken shit. I was certain he would find a way to miss the game at Old Trafford because it would take bollocks the size of baseballs to be able to walk into that park after what he said and to face 70,000 fans screaming his name in hatred. I just think his injury is very convenient indeed. I also find it funny that it was determined back in Argentina that he would not be fit for the game. That right there is a red flag for me that tells me it was a political decision to spare Tevez the wrath of all United fans on the day. I bet you he doesn’t even show up to the stadium. I’ll also bet you he will be ready to go in the return match at Shitty Stadium. Gutless coward and ugly little monkey.
September 17th, 2009 at 20:48
@Grognard: What also worries me is our defence. It looks a bit flakey at times. Up against a decent side instead of half-wits we would have been punished. I can’t for the life of me think why Berba isn’t starting nearly every match. I fear on Sunday it will be back to Giggs played as a second striker behind Rooney.
Shitty will probably try and park the bus with Quasimodo up front trying to hit us on the break.
September 17th, 2009 at 20:48
Let’s keep using the term REJECTICOS until one of the theifing bastard newspapers starts using too.
September 17th, 2009 at 21:05
If fergie’s tactics against shit teams like Besiktas is by playing a lone striker, I expect him to play 10-0-0 against teams like barca specially after what they did to us in Rome.
Fergie is not playing 4-3-3 because to play like this you nide to 3 strikers have the freedom to move in the last third not wingers playing alongside their respective fullbacks. he is playing 4-5-1 with three DM’s, what a way to represent a team reached last CL final and won it the year before.
we need to play our way the UNITED WAY, we need to play with the mentality of outscoring the opposition, not trying not to lose and try to grasp a fortunate lone goal.
Shame on you Fergie.
September 17th, 2009 at 21:10
@Traverse: Problem is we’ve got a few too many GERIATRICOS in our team.
September 17th, 2009 at 21:12
I think this is Scholes’ last “real” season where he gets a moderate amount of playing time. He is obviously past his prime, but i still think that he can be an important part of the team this year, especially in mentoring Anderson or Possebon (now that he is back) into becoming world class midfielders with a world class attitude (hopefully); Scholes is a role model to these youngsters who think that their name alone will get them on the team sheet.
Next year, however, i think he should have a limited playing role, maybe he can team up with Solskjær as a coach with the reserves.
September 17th, 2009 at 21:39
Bloody hell watching the reserves is like watching OUR 1st team Mini Me’s. They are every bit as laboured and snail paced as we are in our CL games. Total boring shit! Macheda and Welbeck have ZERO chance with a capital Z of getting back into our 1st team. They have about as much enthusiasm for playing, as a bunch of lemons with the juice squoze out. What Ole Gunner is thinking of not giving this lot a right ole BOLLOCKING I don’t know! They were playing our arch enemies, scouse GITS L’pool, and they had no taste for THE FIGHT at all. Bunch of can’t be arsed, none energy expending bozo’s.
Exception goes to Richie Delaet, who is so far superior to the rest, it isn’t even funny. He is far too good for the reserves. Shame on them for letting the scousers beat them, and looking like our lot couldn’t care. I’m disgusted
. 
.
September 17th, 2009 at 22:41
@Cyclops-Red: Quasimodo is supposed to be absent. Still, I am sick and bloody tired of the defensive fearful posture this team takes for every game other than the ones against true minnows. We are at home and we should come out for this game with our razors sharpened and really ready to give them a right thrashing, but instead we will defend and try to beat them on counters. That’s just not Man Utd football and it’s not the reason I became a fan of this club some 34 years ago. I don’t care if we lose 3-4, I want us to come out and take the game to them. Who the Hell are Man City? A bunch of pretenders wearing dresses and ugly mofo’s too to boot. Respect them? Christ, I wouldn’t waste spit on them.
September 17th, 2009 at 22:44
@Craig Mc: I have to tell you mate, for me anyways, it’s not a fun time to be a United supporter. Just too many things being done the wrong way. You would swear there was some kind of regime change in the managing of the team but of course that isn’t the case. I just do not like the look or style of our football team right now.
September 17th, 2009 at 22:59
Gah!!!
http://www.dirtytackle.net/2009/04/berbatov-isthe-continental-20/
September 17th, 2009 at 23:30
@NicoQB: Berba is being used and abused.
September 17th, 2009 at 23:43
@Grognard: Quasi’s body double AKA Bellamy should be available minus the golf club.
September 18th, 2009 at 1:34
@Grognard: Nah, we’ll play 4-4-2 on Sunday, with Evra and O’Shea staying at home (I hope) to protect against their fairly good breakaway offense.
I think without Robinho and Tevez and Adeboy it’s gonna be like playing a full fledged Everton of a couple years ago. Tricky to break down, and stubborn even if we get a goal of two up.
Throw in the derby factor and this could be a volatile confrontation, lots of cards, maybe a red or two (thankfully Scholes is already suspended) so Rooney and Vidic better watch their step.
I like the idea of playing Anderson and Fletch in the middle, with Nani and Park on the flanks. Obviously Rooney and the Berbs to attack with Owen getting his 15 minutes at the end on the game.
Predict 2-1 United.
September 18th, 2009 at 1:36
@Cyclops-Red: …and at 32m he deserves it.
September 18th, 2009 at 1:56
@Grognard: It’s amazing how a misfiring MF affects the whole team! You watch the workmanlike, unsophistication of a MF unit and you don’t see anything spectacular, but when playing as a tight unit they influence the style and ease in which you transition the ball to the nth degree.
As our MF has gone from one trial to another our viewing pleasure has become a trial unto itself. Stranded forwards with nowhere to go but toward the ball, and marooned center backs exposed by the errant pass in an excruciatingly slow build up!!
There has be a time when this ends and when we play that old style that SAF has made us so accustomed to, but when and how, and why wasn’t this addressed during the summer, has to be key questions for all United fans to ask right now!
September 18th, 2009 at 2:35
RR.
It’s an interesting point you raise because there are two fairly reasonable sides to the argument with Scholes/Giggs and to a lesser extent Neville.
You would imagine that the most effective way to motivate a squad of players is by making it clear that the individuals that performs the best during a game and during practice will be those selected for the team. It creates a healthy rivalry amongst the competing players and rewards performance over other issues.
In the case of Scholes and Giggs, you would have imagined that, by now, they would be ready for the knackers yard, and the youngsters you have lined up behind them, would excel in all areas but experience. However we have two Eveready bunnies here and there seems no end to their competitiveness and high level of performance, and so if the youngsters can’t push their way past, then so be it!!
That being said, what the heck are you doing with the development of your youngsters (and your future)??
It’s a tough call, because we play and win games in the moment. You would always select a team that has the best oppotunity to win the game. And at the moment the stubbornness of these players to hang it up, will contribute to our success at the moment!
But the future for of team and our youngsters is mired with questions that can only answered in the future!
Go figure, we’re in the midst of a season now, and I want to see victory in every game. A better time for this discussion is in the summer when the moment is the future!
September 18th, 2009 at 3:06
@Grognard: Well lets all save our phlegm from this point on.
September 18th, 2009 at 4:42
@Redrich: oooo i like that formation… hope we see ando and fletch mid pair i still want to give valincia a chance but park didnt look terrible last game when he came on… but we have to i mean have to get a good look at fletch and ando midfield.
September 18th, 2009 at 6:13
Fergie looking forward to extending Ginger ninja’s contract!..
September 18th, 2009 at 6:26
@Redrich: Its all about buying the right players to fill the holes mate. Right now we have a lot of pedestrian players in our first eleven and that just doesn’t cut it. Man Utd should have a world class player at every position or at least close to that. Why should we be any different than Barca or Madrid in that area?
September 18th, 2009 at 6:28
@Redrich: My tv screen is not going to be happy but fortunately I have the Windex ready too.
September 18th, 2009 at 6:51
@Grognard: If you have an LCD, I suggest a very large piece of plastic wrap placed across the entire screen.
In the meantime, fill the spittoons!!
September 18th, 2009 at 7:26
@Grognard: I hate to say it, but with our policy of not buying if it’s “not a good value”, we can hardly be put in that same category, can we??
September 18th, 2009 at 10:52
I agree Grognard. Roy Keane was the first to notice Ferguson’s tendency to tolerate mediocrity and it got him chucked out of the club. Our midfield has been our achilles heel for the last five years and nothing ever changes.
September 18th, 2009 at 10:56
Also I keep hearing these comments indicating David Silva would be open to a move. I say we sign him up!
September 18th, 2009 at 16:30
@Redrich: I’m drinking lots of fluids to built up a strong reserve of ammunition.
September 18th, 2009 at 16:33
@Redrich: We have passed on so many great players who were good value it’s almost laughable now to think of it. My goodness we could have cleaned up on just Real Madrid’s Dutchmen
alone and we would have been a much better team. Wesley Sneijder for one has fit in beautifully at Inter. How I would have preferred him to any of our current midfielders playing along with Fletcher and hopefully one day Hargo.
September 18th, 2009 at 16:51
@colver: And yet we have won all those trophies. It’s hard to make a case against a team and a manager when he does things wrong and still keeps winning. But this year I am certain that it’s all going to finally blow up in Fergie’s face as he has finally lost the security blanket he was carrying around so confidently for six years. Ronaldo is gone and gone too are our chances for serious trophies.
I think what really bothers me is that for two decades under Fergie we were the envy of the world in terms of our success and the way we played. Now I feel we are still respected but much more so for past accomplishments. I seriously wonder how many foreign stars look at our team and the way we rotate players and the tactics we use and they say to themselves, no way am I going there if they come knocking. Fergie is hurting us not just on the field but in our future attempts to attract big name stars.
Many might think I am overreacting but it is plain as day to me that after twenty years of watching this man manage and this team play a certain way, that things have changed drastically and I for one am not happy about those changes. My feeling has always been, if it’s not broken, don’t fix it. If Fergie was truly concerned about the legacy and future of the team after he retires, he wouldn’t turn the the whole thing upside down and create chaos before he retired. All for one reason too. To guarantee his own legacy and to try to win one more European Cup by playing an unattractive but tried and true style of football that has been successful in the past but that has been scourge of football. And all I can say to him over that is SHAME ON HIM. The man has literally sold his soul for that one European glory as well as passing Liverpool in domestic titles. And yet, how he expects to accomplish this after losing Ronaldo and not spending a dime to replace him is beyond me?
September 18th, 2009 at 17:01
@colver: I have been reading those quotes to and I for one would be in heaven if we signed such a great player who possesses all the need skills that we have been missing in our midfield. Versatile, able to play on the left side or in the middle, he possess great instinct and vision and is a tremendous passer of the ball who has the skill to deliver long hard passes, through balls or finesse passes and lobs that break down defensive walls. He also scores goals and possess a great shot and the aggressiveness to enter the box and try to get on the end of something. Personally, I think he is exactly what the doctor ordered.
But instead of him, the stronger rumor that is circulating is Fergie’s desire to buy Luis Fabiano from Sevilla. Nothing against Fabiano as he has shown himself to be the real deal of late, especially with Brazil, but is Fabiano what we really need? I think not. Right now we have three outstanding forwards in Rooney, Berbatov and Owen and two of them are struggling for playing time. Add tot hat mix Macheda who will also need to be given some time to play in the future to encourage and promote his growth and confidence. Where in all that does a Fabiano fit in and why isn’t it obvious and as clear as day to Fergie that midfield is where our needs are? Millions of fans can not be wrong. There is a large group of supporters throughout the world who have bitched and complained very loudly over our inadequacies in midfield. But the Gaffer thinks we all have shit for brains. Sure in Fergie we should trust but is it also possible that he is dead wrong and we are right? It wouldn’t be the first time. Food for thought.