Mar 09
Say what you want Sir Alex, I don’t believe you
What a furore, what a circus, what a week.
When the news arrived that Wayne Rooney was on the bench for Tuesday’s match against one of the World’s biggest clubs I have to admit it made me laugh.
Only two weeks previous I’d posted a piece about Sir Alex settling a score with Rooney over his shennanigans back in 2010. The post was met with disbelief and tangible support for a man whose work ethic, goals and apparent remorse has won back the Old Trafford faithful, or at least those who frequent RedRants anyway.
If you haven’t read the post on how I believe Ferguson has positioned himself to finally avenge a demon then feel free to cast your eye over it.
In essence the piece refers to other incidents where players have crossed Sir Alex’s line thus seeing them ultimately head for the exit door. My opinion is Sir Alex will ONE DAY settle the score with Wayne and, no matter how clever his banning of two journalists who wrote about Rooney’s departure this summer from his press conference until they apologise was, there’s no doubt in my mind that Sir Alex took the Rooney incident personally and WILL find his revenge someday, that’s the man he is and he’s proved it. A leopard doesn’t change its spots remember.
According to Sir Alex himself “There is absolutely no issue between Wayne Rooney and I”. That’s a lie.
Think back to Madrid away. Rooney was asked to perform a role out wide on the left, a role he’s been asked to perform before only this time he quite obviously wasn’t happy about it. Rooney strolled through the game with little appetite for it and his attitude was written all over his shrugged shoulders. It may have been an unusual lack of effort from Rooney but Sir Alex won’t afford him the luxury of behaving like this for a single minute of his £250k p/week salary he held the club to ransom for and it was all he needed to look to others in the 2nd leg.
Three weeks later he’s a sub who may arguably have been an un-used sub had the Turkish referee not sent Nani off. Imagine the talk then!?
The discussion raged on Twitter and on RedRants (and no doubt elsewhere) all week but where does all the support for Rooney come from? Are United fans really as fickle as every other football fan? Have we really forgiven him?
Apparently “Rooney was only saying what the rest of us were thinking” back in 2010 according to one RedRants follower – Really? I don’t remember ever thinking United were not ambitious.
According to one RedRants commenter “I think Ferguson is mature enough to bury the hatchet. I don’t see him seeking some kind of revenge or retribution against Rooney for something done years ago. That would be so juvenile” – We’re talking about a man who put his squabble over a horse before the ownership of Manchester United AND refuse to speak to the BBC (costing the club countless £1,000′s in fines) after matches in support of his son.
The greatest manager in history or not, Sir Alex is a ruthless, manipulative, horrible bastard who lets no one step on him, no one cross him and no one forget who’s in charge unless it suits him. In Rooney’s case it suited him to keep his powder dry. We’re heading towards the day that powder is ignited. Maybe it will happen this summer, maybe it won’t, but it will happen sooner or later and until such time as it can’t happen then I’ll never believe it won’t.
In the original post I posed the question “Who would want to buy Wayne Rooney?”. I doubt there’s many suitors banging down the door willing to pay him what he earns at United because in truth he’s not that special. However, the speculation has of course meant there’s now a betting market for Rooney’s next club with Paris St Germain leading the way with bwin at 4.00, City & Real Madrid at 7.00 and 10.00 bar.
Do you think he’ll stay at United for the rest of his career or do you think he’ll leave this summer?
Related items from Red Rants:
The_Philosopher (398)
Redrich (217)
Opti (204)
Moscow (147)
Stephen (145)
Ian, do you really believe Fergie has been plotting for nearly 3 years to drop Rooney for the Real game? Really, if Fergie wanted him out he would have sold him by now, simple mate.
Fergie has no issues with Rooney, he made a massive mistake but he has moved, maybe you should too.
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Not plotting, just biding his time.
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Do you really believe that? Come on Ian, if Fergie ever had a grudge against Rooney he would have sold him.
Do you really think when the draw was made the first thing he though was “Ah ha! Here is my chance of revenge”
That is laughable mate, Rooney was dropped for tactical reasons and in fairness he got it spot on.
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No of course not and you’re right Rooney was dropped for tactical reasons, one of which is ‘can I do without him?’
I ask myself (if I was Fergie)….is it the right thing to do in 2010 keeping Rooney and paying him what he demanded whilst making myself look a right twat? the answer is yes as discussed in original post. Only Berba, Owen and Macheda therefore Rooney was important hence why he had the nerve to belittle SIR Alex in front of the world.
Has his football been of the quality required since 2010? Yes.
Will I settle the score one day? Yes.
It’s nothing to do with individual matches it’s just Rooney is nowhere near as important as he was THEN or SINCE. SAF’s created the situation where – IF HE WANTED TO – he could bring ONE player in this summer and he could let Rooney go – IF THERE’S ANYONE WILLING TO BUY HIM.
That’s it mate, no specific matches or plans just an ongoing desire let him go sooner or later. It’s only an opinion but it’s one that no one can disprove except for Sir Alex himself and I don’t believe a word he says so saying he’ll be at United in the summer isn’t necessarily trustworthy. I’m not telling you your opinion is wrong I’m just telling you what mine is, if you can’t see ANY justification that’s fine, it won’t be the first time we’ve disagreed amicably.
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Actually, I want to reword that. It wasn’t ‘can I do without him’ it was more like ‘I think I can do without him for this one’ ‘I think I have others capable of doing the job I need doing’
Can you imagine asking himself that question over the last 3 years? The answer would always have been NO.
But the truth is Rooney’s presence is not so required as it has been and therefore that strengthens my point tbf.
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@Ian: I can see what you are saying, but to say his football has dropped since 2010 isn’t correct, last season he scored 34 goals.
I also think this decision has also to do with Lewandowski, Fergie is very keen to sign him and to balance the books maybe someone has to leave.
Also if RvP does get injured, who would you rather replace him with, Welbeck or Rooney, the answer is simple, Rooney is a better finisher.
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@Ian: Stephen. I haven’t suggested his football has dropped, I’m suggesting SAF has improved the squad to a point where Rooney is no longer as important as he was in 2010. It’s took him a while but ironically the one player of quality he has drafted in after Rooney’s questioning of him is RvP and he’s usurped Rooney….I love that
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Last I checked, this is a manager that is about to land this club it’s 13th EPL title. I need not remind you or any other United fan just how successful this club has been since he assumed the reigns. This man has made United fans greedy. Yes greedy. He has delivered so much silverware that the expectation is that United must win every season. What this success under Sir Alex means to me is that he has earned the RIGHT not to be 2nd guessed by fans. Rooney is just one of many players in a squad that is full of talent. His record against top teams in Europe is average at best and the decision to leave him on the bench was an tactically correct one.It was working until the Nani red card.
In my world and in the world of those that understand that there can only be one boss you don’t question the leader, particularly when he has led you to so many victories. You definitely don’t question the leader when all you have in your arsenal is a computer and football knowledge gained from watching from the stands not on the training field.
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@richard: There is much to admire about Fergie but really that is just stating the obvious. Why have a football blog and discussion if everything is perfect? I think it’s wrong to criticise Ian for having an opinion.
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Thanks Moscow, without outspoken people like me and you we’d be talking about……nothing!
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@Moscow: And it just so happens to be a great opinion.
I love people who see things that other people don’t see.
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I still believe him as he been more experience in dealing with players than your age. I think he will want to used rooney in a second half as he is at full strength when he come on the pitch to win the game but unfortunately we one man short.
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Read your your lines over again: “Think back to Madrid away. Rooney was asked to perform a role out wide on the left, a role he’s been asked to perform before only this time he quite obviously wasn’t happy about it. Rooney strolled through the game with little appetite for it and his attitude was written all over his shrugged shoulders.”
Dont you think this and a few others Rooney has shown in recent past deserve an article from our office as well. Same Rooney moves on and rants “i will play any position for coach/team ABC.
Whether he goes or stays United will shine.
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He’s been given more credit than questioning over the last 2yrs, this bit of criticism is well overdue!
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I’ve said this a while back, but in my opinion Rooney had to continue as our lone striker after the 09-10 season when he was being spoken in the same breath as Messi and Ronaldo. Despite what many people think I believe that was his best position, he made his name as a striker and playing on the shoulder he would not have lost his turn of pace until he hit 30. We should have assembled a world class 3 man midfield behind him, Chelsea and Bayern overpowered our midfield that season, and Barcelona the season before that.
Going slightly off topic, I’ve never bought into the argument that our defence is not good enough, it has always been about the midfield letting the opposition run at our defenders one-on-one. Even Mourinho with his galacticos employs two holding midfielders, and despite having suicidal defensive pairing Pepe and Ramos, they have managed to beat Barcelona 3 times this season.
Coming to the Rooney issue, yes he can do a bit of a job in midfield or out on the wing, but if we hadn’t abused his versatility I doubt we would even need RVP right now, who is now our best player. Hindsight is a wonderful thing to have, but I think this issue goes back as far as 2009 when we were schooled by Barca. Buy some bloody central midfielders with defensive and attacking capabilities, only Carrick would get into any of the top European XIs.
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It’s quite astonishing how people claim we have the FA in our pockets. You’d think maybe we’d make sure we don’t draw PL opposition in every single round of the FA Cup?
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I can see where you’re coming from with regards to Sir Alex banishing some demons however. I genuinely feel this was purely a tactical move which paid off MASSIVELY up until the red card which still pains me to think about. Truth of the situation is, Welbeck did a better job of closing down Alonso than Rooney did over the two legs and with a goal to boot! Rooney questioned our ambition during that transfer saga and we went out and bought Young, Dave, PJ and most recently RVP so he can’t complain. Besides, he didn’t actually have a decent game against Norwich to warrant a place in the starting XI for that match.
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Ian: you can bark all you want about Ferguson getting even with him, but Rooney’s football is not good, hasn’t been that good for 2-3 seasons and it’s getting worse.
Fergie wants what we all want – a great squad to do great things and if Rooney was clicking, he would have been included in Tuesday’s game and Welbeck would have had his place on the bench. What tactical reason, other than him not being on his game, would have Welbeck usurp him? Why does Danny (him of 1 goal all season), all of a sudden, sit Wayne’s butt down in a monster game like that? How about the fact that with Rooney in we cant hold possession because he give the ball away all the time, or the fact that he cant keep his head in it for the full 90!
Ferguson wanted the CL badly this year and would’ve plead with Roy Keane to strap on the boots if he felt it made a difference. No, this is purely tactical and the tactic is, “Play your best players”.
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@Redrich: play your best players? really?
welbeck over rooney and chicha???
the only reason for these massive welbeck favors is him being SAF’s illegitimate child. there are no footballing reasons whatsoever whatever he might suggest or imply. welbeck is the worst striker i’ve seen in our colors, ever.
if we wanted to play our best players then it should have been chicha leading with rooney, rvp and kagawa behind in floating roles. carrick and cleverly behind in defensive roles. yes no wingers as our wingers have been fucking shit all season.
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@jos: When Welbeck is picked over Rooney, Rooney has a big problem.
Regardless of your preference, Ferguson selected the team he did.
Maybe you have a better eye for form than he does, Jos – then again, maybe you don’t.
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@Redrich: noi dont. but still, welbeck has something on saf. maybe a voodoo doll??? who knows. nobody else in the whole world would select welbs over rooney in any fucking position on the field.
the only thing welbeck does better than rooney is not score a goal!
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I agree entirely Rich.
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in all fairness, anyone who didn’t see the tactical approach against leaving Rooney out knows nothing about the beautiful game.against a team like Madrid, you don’t have the luxury of loosing possession all the time, something Rooney does every 3 out of 5 times he get the ball.
2. you don’t need a player who sulks and forget all about the team tactics, recall this was UCL and not EPL where its an open minded game.
3.we watch these players on match day, SAF watches and speaks to them 7 days a week, so he knows who is in the right shape and who is not. we thus deserve no right to judge his decission unless we are aware why he chose to do what he did.
Lastly i guess non of us was complaining about the decision to leave Rooney out until that fucker CUyNeT gave Nani red.
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@Jay Jay: JayWire?
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thats what happens when you play people who can score.
suck on that
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@jos: That goal by Chicharito was one of my favorite goals this seaosn. Absolutely sublime, cheeky, and vital!!! Chicharito is just genius!!!
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@jos: What happens when you have players who can’t field mid
Thanks to De Gea we still get a chance at SB…
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Terrible midfield performance YET AGAIN. Cleverley possibly put in the worst midfield performance of the last 10 years.
Rooney shifted out wide, Carrick trying to protect the defence on his own, and Valencia… shamed the No 7 shirt this evening, what an embarassing showing. Shameful.
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@Moscow: Yup, yup, and yup.
Game of two halves. First half were were superb… Chelsea was made to look like Cheltenham. In the 2nd half, we were FC of Manchester.
Terrible pathetic 2nd half. Only Chicharito, Nani, Carrick, Rafael and De Gea should be satisfied. Valencia and Cleverley hit new lows. Valencia in particular was embarrassing: couldn’t control the ball, cross, or beat anyone.
Nani was great but went off injured. Carrick was massive and almost held alone against an entire Chelsea midfield. We were outplayed in the 2nd half as we couldn’t hold possession with Rooney, Cleverley, Valencia spilling the ball constantly. It was a horror show in the second half.
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@Opti: I thought we were poor after the first 10 minutes to be honest.
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@Moscow: To be very frank Man Utd after the 2 goals became complacent and clumsy in possession. Cleverly, Kagawa and even Carrick gave the ball away on numerous times. Chelsea could have easily got a goal before if not for their hesitant decision making. Ferdinand was solid and nullified Ba. Evans struggled in one on one situations and that is where their second goal came and almost a third by Mata if not for that incredible instinctive save. But I am looking at the sliver linings as we possibly got away with our worst performance this season and we are still in FA Cup. But Valencia has to do a lot of self introspection as his long list of bad performances continues and I fear that he may be on transfer list this summer. Opponents seem to have learnt his weaknesses and even a mediocre left back is no more afraid of his pace as he knows that he only needs to run back and stand in front of him and that is where he starts to struggle to cross the ball or dribble his way to the penalty area. It is still a dream to see United play the possession game not the usual Tiki-Taka game but slick one touch passing game akin to what Bayern does.
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The players around Kagawa aren’t suited to his style of play. And since we can’t sell the rest of the squad, he has to go.
I am now convinced that besides Nani and RVP, this team has zero technical ability in attack.
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@Moscow: Take it easy. Kagawa hasn’t even been here for one season and you expect him to fit in perfectly??? His role is complex and requires massaging. Kagawa is Class!!
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@Moscow: It’s Berba all over. Players with skill and who prefer pass and move, one touch football will never succeed here.
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manhandled in midfield 5 fouls for us vs 12 fouls and 3 yellows for them tells the tail. unfortunatly it is a sad tail and weve heard it too many times. we need someone in midfield who will not be bullied. anytime we get pushed around a bit and the ref doesnt stop it we dont know what to do.
so as the scum fans and ours unite against chelski their players get pissed and start to bully us. and thats when we folded. smh
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I can see Rooney in a Blue shirt, better in a blue shirt apparently because he and Cleverly chose blue over red when they passed the ball.
From “gutsy hero” to “failing wanker”, Rooney has slid down the slope of no return. Better he become the poster boy for times past in this blog. “Don’t forget this and don’t forget that his stats over the last 8 years prove he’s a quality player”.
Rooney is now a memory. He’s an idea that was pure and golden when we were all naive enough to believe that his aggression was going to neutralize his lack of real talent.
I am no longer a believer. Rooney’s day is done, and if United are to move on, the sooner that day comes, the better.
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I’m with Ian here. A leopard never changes its spots. It does not make Fergie a lesser man or less worthy as one of the greatest managers in football history. He is a man who remembers and bears grudges. We have countless examples like his handling of the BBC, numerous incidences with referees and managers like the FSW. That is the make of the man. You cross him once (especially in the public domain ) and he never forgets. It is also what makes him such a great man manager who is able to control a dressing room of multi-millionairs. I for one believe Rooney ‘was’ indispensible during the 2010 saga and Fergie had to bite his tongue and swallow his pride in order to accomodate Rooney’s nonsense. However Rooney is clearly not performing well or near his peak since the arrival of RVP and he is no longer the top dog. He is now dispensible.
Is it really pay back time for Rooney for that 2010 incident? I believe it does play into Fergie’s thinking and the boss will not hesitate to sell him if the price is right from another club this coming summer. Fergie would never consider such possibility for players who have been loyal and fit into the Fergie type of player like Giggy and Scholesy.
My last take is if Rooney was sold, there is already someone lined up who is cheaper in wages, younger, and hungerier for success by the name of Lewandowsky.
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Was I still wrong to write stuff like this?
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