Aug 01
Ten Indicators For United’s 08/09 Season
Apologies for the extended period of quiet from my side (note, please, that I am not RR, who has done an admirable job of keeping the site going and everyone interested during what has the most boring, repetitive, inconclusive and tedious close season in living memory). When I say that the cricket has been far more interesting than anything to do with football recently, I think I have said all.
In the continuing absence of any concrete developments from the summer, I want to look back on our staggeringly successful last season and draw out some of the reasons why we were so damn good. These apply both to why we’ve gone from being written off in the summer of ‘06 to the best team in Europe, and also what we did even better in 07/08 to achieve such heights. Then I’m going to darken the tone slightly by picking up three things which could scupper our chances.
THE POSITIVES
1. Squad depth
Last season, with the exception of centre forward, we had high class cover right across the board. Not only high class cover, in fact, but a lot more than 11 players who deserved and were fighting for a first team spot. This allowed us to cope with all the injuries thrown our way; but more importantly, to have genuine flexibility to mix and match our team to suit the exact circumstances.
2. Weakness of our rivals
Arsenal had a great first XI, but as soon as form, fitness and fatigue scratched that surface they were gone. So, this summer they have sold two first team regulars…as much as we now (patronisingly) applaud Wenger, he really is a masochist.
Liverpool had two great players (Torres and Gerrard), one fouling centre back who the press often call great (Carragher), an amusingly foul-mouthed midfielder (Mascherano – thanks again for that red card), a few has-beens (Finnan, Hyppia, Riise), a few might-yet-bes (Babel, that kid they play at right back), and some journeymen / donkeys (Crouch, Kuyt, Pennant, Kewell)….sorry, did I get carried away there? What I meant was that they were entirely reliant (as opposed to over-reliant) on two players.
Chelski were unlucky with injuries, but that said the African Nations was a fairly predictable drain on their resources and Mourinho bought badly last summer (Malouda, Alex, Ben Haim & Pizarro, none of whom were good enough for their first team). And the upheaval of Mourinho’s departure was entirely caused by their owner.
The good thing is that what little activity there has been so far this summer has made Arsenal’s plight worse, kept Liverpool broadly the same (although Keane could be a good signing) and left Chelsea up in the air (what if Drogba and Lampard leave next week, just before the season starts?)
3. The fear factor’s back
In the depths of our three-year slump, the most damaging development was that we had lost the fear factor. Teams used to turn up not shaking in fear and hoping to keep it down to 2-0, but genuinely thinking they could win. So they had a go, and against our weakened team came away with points far too often. Last season they were 1-0 down in the coach on the way to the game again, and it showed.
4. Everyone taking responsibility
In previous times, when we have had to bring in John O’Shea, Darren Fletcher, Ji-Sung Park and co they have played like second stringers. Like good, old-fashioned triers, but ones who know they’re not quite cut out to be in the exalted company they are in. But last season, they were. Anderson and Nani played like present day stars, not ones for the future. Wes Brown was an integral part of our stingiest ever defence, including a quite sensational performance in the second leg against Barcelona. Hargreaves rose above his disappointments to be our most consistent player in the last month of the season. Park, too, played like a man possessed for that month. Even Silvestre came back into the first team against Chelski and gave a good impression of a regular left back.
Not only did we have squad depth, but the quality, maturity and attitude was spot on right through the squad.
5. Confidence in the tough games
Often the difference between a good season and a great season is performance in the so-called “six-pointers”. But since that doesn’t extend to the Champions League, let’s just use the less snappy phrase “games against other elite clubs”. Whereas in some previous seasons this has been our weakness, this time round we were superb, with only the last minute penalty against Chelski blotting our copybook (even that in a game where we played a below-par team):
Chelski: W 2, L 1
Arsenal: W 1, D 1
Liverpool: W 2
Barca: W 1, D 1
Roma: W 3, D 1
Overall: P 13, W 9, D 3, L 1.
6. Suitability for Europe
Our squad and style of play is now much more suited to success in Europe. With the very honourable exception of 1999, it doesn’t often wash in Europe to have a flimsy defence and rely on scoring heavily. Most of the top sides, particularly in Italy, are too good to be overwhelmed defensively, so keeping clean sheets is much more important. Equally, we had the players to make the 4-3-2-1 system work properly against better teams, with plenty of players all over the pitch who could provide solid defence and then switch effortlessly into fluent attack (Evra, Carrick, Rooney and Tevez to name but four).
7. Prospects for the future
Well, with the exception of Ronaldo, this squad has the potential to grow together for the next five or so years. In fact, last year’s squad had a somewhat raw feel to it in midfield and attack at times. Tevez took a while to settle in, Anderson stepped up magnificently but failed to score a single goal, Nani’s decision-making looks like Ronaldo’s did four years ago and Hargreaves was out of sorts until April. We can expect a lot more from these players and others this coming season.
THE NEGATIVES
1. No standout assistant manager
It’s no great secret that we’ve always struggled when Fergie hasn’t had a first class coach working with him. Brian Kidd, Steve McClaren and Carlos Queiroz have all been integral parts of our best sides; their ability to devise cutting-edge training routines and support the squad in a complementary was to Fergie were essential. It doesn’t look like we’re going to start the season with a “specialist” assistant, with various of Fergie’s underlings helping out. That makes me nervous.
2. Reduced return from Ronaldo
No secrets here. With Ronaldo out for the start of the season, and questionably motivated thereafter, we need others to stand up and be counted. Big season for Wayne Rooney, and whichever striker we buy (I’m still confident of Berbatov) needs to hit the ground running. We can’t afford another start like last season.
3. We were lucky with injuries last time round
I mean, I know Vidic was injured for most of the last two months, Scholes missed a lot of games before Christmas and Gary Neville didn’t play at all. But we had most of our key players fit most of the time, and we can’t rely on that again. If Rooney missed injures himself on the first day again, for example, we could be in serious trouble by the time he and Ronaldo return. Equally, our defence wasn’t quite the same without Rio and Vidic at its heart. We have a great squad, but injuries could still screw us.
That’s my lot. Any themes you would draw attention to?
Related items from Red Rants:
- United’s debt situation explained
- United’s £100k+ Christmas party, useless Shorey, Arsenal will stumble and of course, Rooney is better than Kaka
- Manchester United’s Munich tribute on 6 Feb 2008
- Interview with Aon – Manchester United’s future sponsors
- Who is your Manchester United’s Player Of The Month for November?
Tags: Opinions/Columns
August 1st, 2008 at 11:02
For me a big question of this season is simply desire. There are some players I don’t see this being a problem – Rooney, Tevez and Hargo don’t seem to have any issues getting motivated. But some others do concern me, Evra, Rio and to an extent Carrick. We achieved great things last year, but really gave everything on the pitch. Team spirit was something special, and while I trust Fergie, I worry it won’t be easy to recreate that again, after two years winning the league and the CL last year.
Re: Berbatov – does anyone else worry we’ve given up? I mean, community shield is next weekend, and we have a bunch of friendlies before then. Is he going to get a single game to integrate? Tevez far from excelled when he first joined right before the season started last year, and I could see the same from Berba. I think Fergie is being stubborn. If we’re not going to get him within a couple days, look elsewhere.
August 1st, 2008 at 11:05
@Beachryan: I think Spurs are waiting on Arshavin/Pavlyuchenko deal to go through.
August 1st, 2008 at 11:10
@Beachryan: Are you sure Rio was probably our best player last season and Evra was superb, pos agree with Carrick.
August 1st, 2008 at 11:55
@ Redranter – hopefully, but I would have thought having £25m in the bank would help their purchase.
@ Stephen – I agree they were superb, but I just see it in their personalities to get complacent. Happy to be proved wrong!
August 1st, 2008 at 11:59
@Beachryan: I think you will mate, Rio is a different person than he was, I would be more worried about Ronaldo’s commitment and attitude and how that could rub off on Nani and Anderson.
August 1st, 2008 at 12:28
@Stephen: Dont worry about anderson! He is a down to earth lad who is LOYAL! its written on his face! Its them portugese and spanish that i cant trust!
August 1st, 2008 at 12:40
@Beachryan: What is it in Evra’s, Rio’s and Carrick’s personalities that will hinder them from being top motivated again?
August 1st, 2008 at 12:46
They just strike me as those most likely to take their foot off the gas. I hope Fergie won’t let anyone do that, dunno, just my gut feeling!
And yes, Cristiano will defo be a concern, but I don’t think he has as much sway over Nani and Anderson as we fear. Don’t know much of Nani but Ando seems a solid kid.
Fingers crossed it won’t be a problem, just listing my concerns for next season (on top of Penguin’s ‘of course!)
August 1st, 2008 at 13:07
@Stephen: Sometimes I feel the Boss should just call Ronaldo and all others and outright tell them that United will not do any business with Real at any costs! Plain and Simple!! All those harboring any hopes of playing for Real should just step out, and he then just makes them play for Reserves wearing “I Hate Real” jerseys for the rest of their contracts! If they still want to go to Real Circus after that they are welcome to do that.
I wish SAF really had the willpower to do that at least to Ronaldo! He has acted like a complete idiot all this summer. And I wish somebody could just put a huge “NOT OPEN for Real” banner at the gates of OT!!
Of course it is just a fantasy
August 1st, 2008 at 13:29
@jos: I agree mate, it would be wonderful
August 1st, 2008 at 13:48
Random knowledge q: When we won the league and the community shield last season – is that the first time it has happened? I know in the community shield they always talk about the ‘curse’ of not winning hte prem if you win that trophy, would be cool if we were first to win both..
August 1st, 2008 at 13:56
@Beachryan: We did the same in 93/94 and 96/97, and Chelsea did it in 05/06.
So the curse is a bit exaggerated, unless you’re an Arsenal fan….
August 1st, 2008 at 14:05
I actually disagree that Ronaldo will be demotivated next season. He might have become a “team-player”, but that doesn’t mean he plays for the team. He plays for himself and always has done. He is motivated by being a great player, not by being a United player. I think he’ll play better if anything.
August 1st, 2008 at 14:15
Although I have lost respect for Cristiano Ronaldo…
Must admit that he will never play badly and he is an extremely hard worker. That’s why he is the best player in the world, because of his determination.
He has always been that way… Even before he came to Man Utd and I just don’t see that changing.
Altough I would love for him to get out of our club, if he doesn’t he will still be as good as ever…
August 1st, 2008 at 14:33
@MoYa: Wrong! At united! Everyone supplies him with the ball! I dont think that Raul and Van nistelrooy would be happy to do that! And with the added pressure there I doubt if he will ever be so great!
August 1st, 2008 at 14:41
Vote for our boy Giggsy: http://www.goldenfoot.com/T_voting.cfm?
August 1st, 2008 at 14:45
I agree with Red Diablo on that point. He’d play well for us next season, but might not fare so well at Real where it’s every man for himself, and the egos get in the way of true team play. No-one there will accept they have to take a back seat (a la Rooney) for the sake of the team. They are ruthless. There is no arm around the shoulder there if you have a few bad games, no forgiveness for mistakes, no nurturing. United would have been the best place for him to continue his development. I hope he goes, and we get to see if he’s the finished article he thinks he is.
August 1st, 2008 at 15:07
I am sure many are looking forward to ‘Boo’ him. i am not gonna argue if its OK or not
because cause I’m not sure whats right,
but last time I checked ‘he plays his best when he is booed’
August 1st, 2008 at 15:12
@Beachryan: Ok mate, I gotta disagree with you there about the de-motivated players. Evra, Rio and Carrick are all exemplary professionals who would never let the team down in any way, shape or form. Evra has talked abut how lucky he is to play for United (and has even done his homework on our history! What foreign player would do that??!), Carrick has droned on this summer about how coming to us was the best decision he has ever made in his life, and Rio has signed on for the rest of his career. These players are fully commited to United and will give nothing less than 110%. If anything, this years success will drive them on to achieve the same again or even more next season. That is what being a United player is all about. You need hunger and desire to survive at Old Trafford, or else woe betide, Fergie will show you the door a la Beckham, van Nistelrooy and countless others…
@Penguin: Mate I must say that I disagree with you about Hargreaves. He might have had those on-off tendonitis problems throughout the season, but when he did play, notably against Arsenal at the Emirates (where he stifled Fabregás along with Anderson), Liverpool at Anfield and Roma at OT) he did put in excellent performances. He just wasn’t able to steer clear of injury for more than 2-3 games, but granted, he did come into his own in the last month or so of the season.
August 1st, 2008 at 15:16
I don’t think Rio will have any problems getting motivated. There is a reason he was selected our captain last season and as a part time captain for England. I think the new Rio has too much pride to slack off. If any of the lads do indeed slack off I would guess Rio would be one of the first to let them know. As for Evra, he is every bit of a true professional for me. Carrick just doesn’t “look” like he’s always fully motivated, but he will be fighting for a spot just like anyone else in our crowded midfeild andwouldn’t expect him to take anything for granted.
August 1st, 2008 at 15:24
@Beachryan: We have seen absolutely nothing to suggest that Evra or Carrick might be demotivated, and quite the reverse for Rio. I think you’ve just picked up players who seem a bit more relaxed and decided that means uncommitted.
Equally, @others, I’m not worried about Ronaldo per se. He has too much to lose from having a dodgy season (best player in the world tag, CR7 brand, etc). Having a big ego has it’s advantages. I am, though, genuinely worried about the destabilising effect his eventual departure combined with CQ’s will have on Nani, Anderson & co.
August 1st, 2008 at 15:25
@Nino: I didn’t mean to give the impression that Hargreaves was rubbish until April. He did put in some very good performances, but only sporadically. I more meant that he wasn’t an influential member of our team until the late stages – he was more a useful squad player until then.
August 1st, 2008 at 15:54
@Red Diablo:
Fair points you raise. Though the Real Madrid of today is not like the Madrid of before in a sense that the “galactico” era is over. There is now a lot more team play. They certainly have their hierachy problems, but not as bad as before.
They want the best players in the world and I think he would triumph above them all. We both know how individualistic Ronaldo is.
August 1st, 2008 at 16:08
Good point. But if he doesn’t perform like he did last year, every year, he will get slated. Will be interesting to see. “Individualistic” is one of the nicest things I’ve heard a Red call Ronnie in while!!!!!”
August 1st, 2008 at 16:40
It seems to me that Fergie’s comments that “it is difficult to know where a player will be in two
weeks time” and that “he would not like to talk about what is likely to happen in this club” is
a heavy hint that he is giving up in trying to keep Ronaldo
http://sport.setanta.com/en/Sport/News/Football/2008/08/01/Premier-League-Ferguson-on-loyalty/
August 1st, 2008 at 17:38
@frankie: I don’t think it has anything to do with Ronaldo specifically, but players in general.
I doubt, he’s giving up on keeping Ronaldo.
August 1st, 2008 at 17:40
@MoYa: Up until now he has never had the negative emotions to challenge his professional work ethic. Not getting his way may actually alter his mind set and cause him to not give 100%. That’s only normal and despite everything, he is not a machine but a human being with flawed values. I do worry how well he will commit to the team and how he will go in to situations where he may be at risk of being fouled hard. Will he have the same gusto? But my biggest concern is that not only will we miss him for a fair amount of early games, but when he comes back, he will not be match fit and he will not be 100% fit from his injury. It may take as much as another 5 to 10 games before we see the Ronaldo of old. Does United have what it takes to wait that long?
Penguin talks about about Liverpool being a two man team but in my opinion United are a one man team. Now before everybody jumps down my throat, let me explain. Yes we have a far superior side to Liverpool and probably Arsenal and Chelsea to even without Ronaldo but lets not forget that he scored 42 goals last season and 31 of our 80 EPL goals. I’d say he is a significant part if not incredibly vital part of our team’s engine. Without him I think we start to show the signs of a team that’s good but wanting. Perhaps Berbatov can help in that area but I still feel that our style and influence on the team is catered to Ronaldo and everything positive passes through him in our attacking approach to the game. I’m honestly shaking at the thought of how bad we may look without him and especially without him and Nani for the first two games of the season. Every point is valuable and so losing a few games early could come back and haunt us. No Ronaldo for several games and no Nani for two games concerns me greatly and I don’t see Fergie putting enough concern in that fact by buying yet one more RMF/RW player for added insurance. Buy Sanchez for crying out loud. Just pay the money and get him. Buy him now rather than next year and let him get the experience that Nani got last year. For all our depth, we do not have the quality to replace Ronaldo for a long stretch of games and I can just see us now trying to break down defenses that play ten men behind the ball without our top surgeon in place to start dissecting those defenses. Sure I’m being negative, but mark my words, six games in to the season you all will be too. I just have a bad feeling about this. Ronaldo’s surgery should have happened 3 weeks before it actually did. What the Hell were they thinking?
August 1st, 2008 at 17:43
@frankie: from the quote it looks more like he was talking about the possibility of Solskjaer taking over from him when he retires, which he said before would be in 2 years time.
also van der vaat for £7million? where were we!!
August 1st, 2008 at 17:49
@frankie: Fergie has gone out on a limb to tell everyone that Ronaldo is going nowhere. From what I have seen over 25 years is that he is a man of his word and he is not one to back down, give in or compromise his beliefs or his values and if Ronaldo thinks he can waltz in to the Boss’ office next week and demand a transfer, he better be prepared for the hairdryer and a possible boot to the nether regions. But I don’t think that is going to happen. The article from yesterday quoting Ronaldo has already been dismissed as BS by Ronaldo’s agent and I think Ronaldo has resigned himself to the fact that he’s not going anywhere. What may exist right now is his insecurity and fear of what to expect from the Boss, his teammates and of course the supporters of the club. Not unlike what happened to him after the last World Cup. Fergie does not lose battles like these and even though I would prefer he sold the player and replaced him with a player like Aguero, that’s not going to happen. Not on Sir Alex Ferguson’s watch. The man is a stubborn old Scotsman and Caesar to his team. Some pleb like Ronaldo is not going to beat Caesar in a battle of wits and determination. Fergie will throw him to the lions before he lets him win this battle of wills.
August 1st, 2008 at 17:50
@Grognard: You may be right, but bear in mind two things:
a) Last season, our entire team was set up to maximise Ronaldo’s impact. This is not a bad thing – he was so hot it would have been silly to do anything else.
b) We never had to cope without Ronaldo for a long stretch last season, so we don’t know what a non-Ronaldo team looks like or how it would do.
It’s never going to be as good, but it may not be as bad as you think. If Ronaldo hadn’t scored all those goals, someone else would have been in the team and we’d have been trying something different – who knows whether that something different would have worked.
I’m not saying you’re wrong – I worry about that sort of thing too – just that you’re being pessimistic. Surely Fergie had a Plan B for last season if one of those bad tackles had taken Ronaldo’s leg off?
August 1st, 2008 at 17:51
@Grognard: And that’s why we love him. Fergie, that is. What a legend.
August 1st, 2008 at 17:56
@Traverse: Obviously Fergie does not feel we need anyone for that position. I think he is content with Scholes and is happy with the progress of Anderson. For me, Anderson has to show a lot more finesse and scoring ability before I crown him Scholes heir but then again, I don’t see him in practice everyday and of course Fergie knows better than all of us what is going on and who is doing what. What I do not understand is why we are not trying to sign a RMF/RW like Sanchez? Along with Berbatov that is what we need, regardless of whether Ronaldo stays or leaves. I am still not sure about Nani and lets face it, Giggs is past his best and Park is very limited offensively. We need another understudy like a Sanchez, a Marin or Ninis to come to the team and grow like Ronaldo did. Don’t wait until Giggs retires to look for that player if that player is available now. Especially with our present injury and suspension problems this early in the year. I just don’t get it.
August 1st, 2008 at 17:57
Ronaldo is staying, he doesn’t want to, Fergie knows he will be only @ United for another couple of seasons, so he probably is looking afer himself, Ok don’t blame him, but if/when he reitres in two years then his successer does already has a problem on his hands.
August 1st, 2008 at 17:59
@Grognard: Lee Martin, anyone?
August 1st, 2008 at 18:11
@Penguin: Let s put it this way, how badly did United look early last year without Rooney? No matter how hard they try and no matter what Fergie draws up on the chalkboard, the team does not play well when Rooney is not in the lineup. The same can be said for Ronaldo. And it’s not an easy thing to do this changing things up and retraining the lads to play a different style and put emphasis on different things when Ronaldo is not in the lineup. Massive changes in philosophy and style take weeks and weeks to implement properly and I don’t think United have the time to test the waters. They need an influx of world class talent like Berbatov and another play making winger like a Sanchez to cover up the lack of domination we offer when Ronaldo is in the lineup with Rooney. My God, what happens if we lose Rooney to an injury?
The only time I ever really have a right to question Fergie is when he isn’t thinking ahead of things in case of injuries. He blew it big time last year when he let Rossi go. He did this after Rooney had already injured himself. How on Earth could he have put so much trust and faith in Louis Saha staying healthy? He flat out blew it and for large parts of last year we were playing with only two forwards and Welbeck on the bench. Injuries today are at epidemic proportions because tackling and marking is far more severe and determined than in past generations. Players are faster than they were and the faster you go, the more pain that will come out of a collision or bad tackle. We were very very lucky last year when it comes to our injuries. I doubt we will get off so lucky this year. We already have taken a massive hit early on before we even played one game with Ronaldo’s delayed surgery. You wrote about our depth last year being great except for up front. I agree but a year changes everything. Scholes and Giggs are a year older and we still stuck with two forwards and Saha. Forgive me for saying this but am I missing something here? Where the Hell is the urgency at OT to cover their asses? An injury to either Tevez or Rooney and to either Nani or Giggs and we can kiss our title hopes away. It’s that simple. This team is not set up for worst case scenarios. Is that being overly optimistic and positive, or naive and blind?
August 1st, 2008 at 18:13
@Penguin: You have got to be kidding me mate? Lee Martin. What the Hell is a Lee Martin? I’m not about to bank our safety on a bloody British reservist. I don’t think so. United are a world class team and thus even their backups need to be close to International class in ability. Not reserve class.
August 1st, 2008 at 18:35
@Grognard: Listen mate! I disagree on one point! When Rooney did not play last year! We lost our plan AND HAD NO PLAN B! But if we get Berba! We will have a PLAN B and even though Rooney’s absence will hurt(HOPEFULLY THERE WILL BE NO ABSENCE THIS YEAR
) but i dont think that we wont be able not to win matches without him! IF we have a plan B including a NO.9 Striker!
August 1st, 2008 at 18:39
@MoYa: True mate! But you forget that Madrid will always be Madrid! I mean they sacked Capello when they finally won a title after 3 years! And if that doesnt happen then there is always their funking cunt fans! I mean they Boo’ed Higuain! The guy that won them the title due to his super sub goals! I bet a poor run and they will blast ronaldo! And thus the board will get involved as well! Do you know whatever happens they can never sack raul? Even though he is mostly out of the spanish national team! that tells you of the hieracrchy there!
August 1st, 2008 at 18:59
I’ve been sayin it for ages, we need an extra WF/SMF in our team. What if giggs or nani pick up a knock? we’re screwed!! Why wait till nxt yr to get giggsy’s replacement, when we can get him now and give him a year to adapt, hence reducing the added pressure to perform?
As per the striker situation, we should get it over with; Berba, Huntelaar, Benzema, I don’t care at this point. I just want the team to start gettin used to playing effectively without ronaldo as he will be out for a big part of the season. These few upcomin matches against stronger teams like juve and espanyol would have been a good dress-rehearsal for that new strike partnership and system.
I’m not one to critisize Fergie, as he may already be making moves behind the scenes, but some alacrity is needed, cuz we can’t afford to be testing out new play come beginning of the season, it’s too risky!!!
August 1st, 2008 at 19:11
If you only read the comments to gauge hopes for next season, you’d believe that the sky is falling.
August 1st, 2008 at 19:15
@MUFC Fan in America: HAHA! Dont worry! Have some hope! Hope after we get BERBA that is!
August 1st, 2008 at 19:48
@Red Diablo: No matter how good Berba is, he is not the same as Rooney when it comes to influence on a game. But the two of them on at the same time leaves me with some hope. But hey, lets sign him first before we place him in our starting 11. That’s also part of my point. Just pay the pricks 28 million and lets get on with it. Plan B is vital and I hope the team is practicing and adapting to a system without Ronaldo as we speak. It’s vital.
August 1st, 2008 at 19:50
@Red Diablo: They ultimate act of stupidy was sacking Jupp Heynckes after he brought them a Champions League trophy. They don’t deserve a loyal following and certainly people outside of Madrid should hate them for their negative influence on the business practices in the game today.
August 1st, 2008 at 19:51
@Gabriel: You are a wise man Gabriel. In fact, anybody who agrees with me is a wise man.
August 1st, 2008 at 19:56
@Grognard: “What the hell is a Lee Martin” hahahahaha Ive never heard anyone else say that but me. People always look at me crazy too. On that same note tho I agree with you, Lee Martin is no one to get excited about.
August 1st, 2008 at 20:04
Go over to the Sun and have a read at Fergie’s latest tirade. He’s all pissed over today’s players lacking loyalty and saying that the era of the players who spend ten years or more with the club is a thing of the past. I agree to a point with the gaffer, especially when it comes to the traitor Ronaldo but I’m sorry, this is a two way street. For all the players who have betrayed us and walked away, there have been many who have been unceremoniously shown the exit from OT well before their time. Sorry Fergie but if it’s loyalty you require, how about showing the same to David Beckham, Roy Keane, Ruud van Nistelrooy, Paul Ince, and others. None of these players wanted to leave. They just had a difference of opinion with you. Apparently your pride and intolerance for that is a greater show of disloyalty than what Ronaldo has been up to this Summer. Funny, he wants to leave and has stated so. The others didn’t want to leave but were given the boot.
Like I said, loyalty is a two way street and it should not only be shown to the servants who question nothing and keep their mouths shut like Scholes and Giggs. Some people are more extroverted and require venting their frustrations if they feel unjustly treated. Fergie can’t deal with that and thus we end up losing players who were the heart and soul of club when they were here. I’m sorry but I don’t get this hypocrisy one bit. And I don’t want excuses thrown out at me regarding the actions of these players. The bottom line is all of them were loyal to the team and had no intention of leaving the team. I understand when a player can no longer give his best and then wanting to get rid of him, but not while still in their prime. I love Fergie but obviusly their are rules and then there are Fergie rules and loyalty is defined by his dictionary and not mine.
August 1st, 2008 at 20:04
@Grognard: No team is set up for worst case scenarios. You cannot have a happy squad if it includes enough players to cope with the worst injury crisis. Players won’t play enough football and will become unsettled quickly. The idea of having a top quality replacement in every position is not realistic. Ronaldo’s injury situation is awkward. He will leave a large void at the start of the season, but he will be back for the majority of it. You don’t bring in a player just to fill a void in your team for a month or two. When ronaldo returns, where does that leave the new player? Whether you like it or not, nani has been brought in by fergie to replace giggs as the team’s first choice left winger for the foreseeable future. The new player isn’t going to take his place, that stops his development. If park was not good enough as a backup then he wouldn’t be in the squad. He wouldn’t be at united.At this moment in time we have ronaldo, nani, park and giggs as wingers. Obviously, ronaldo is a first choice pick. We should see a lot more of nani this season down the left hand side. Giggs and park, at the very least, are backup. That’s what they are there for. Bringing in a player who is good enough to be a regular starter is not the right move. Either they bring a halt to nani’s development or they are used as backup for nani and become unhappy themselves. Either way, they also mean much less games for giggs and park, meaning more unhappy players and it means having giggs and park in the squad is pointless.
August 1st, 2008 at 20:13
Well, keane was past his best. Ince didn’t want to play the way fergie asked him to. Beckham wanted to leave and is the most overrated player i have ever seen. Van nistelrooy wanted to leave.
August 1st, 2008 at 20:30
@tevez: Have you had a look at chelsea’s squad or some other big european teams, they are mostly fortified with first-rate back-up. I understand we have Ronnie, Park, Nani and Giggs, but with ronnie out for a cuple of weeks, what if nani or giggs pick up a knock in those first few games? We’re left with just two designated players in that position. It’s all just worst-case scenario, and we have to be prepared.
Also, we know Giggs might retire end of this season. Why not get the player who’s gonna fill that space left by giggs now rather than when giggs leaves? The lad would be quite young, and would have enuff time to adjust to our game/lifestyle without the added pressure of top-level consistent performances, plus he would get a decent amount of games under his belt, just like Nani last season. After all, Fergie already said giggs would play a considerably less amount of games than previous seasons.
It’s all about thinking about the future and being prepared for whatever happens. Luck, some people say helps teams win competitions; I say it is preparation meets opportunity. Everyone at the start of the new season have the same opportunity, but only the best prepared prevail at the end. I think we should be well-prepared, teams are gunning for us this season, and we have to show-up at every game!!
August 1st, 2008 at 20:38
@Grognard: Excuse me! but its the same arrogance and pride that makes FERGIE, Fergie! I mean his stricts means have been one of the most pivotal points for our success! Reality check without his anger, arrogance and ignorance! Fergie is simply not Fergie! And dont forget Cantona! Fergie didnt always have his way with him! Thats why i like berba! Even though he is like cantona, Moody! He has an angelic first touch!
Oh and not to forget with their coach! They also sold Makelele! One of their leading figures at that time! I think their captain he was at that time! As this happened, Madrid bought Beckham and Zidane said “What use of painting your rolls royce golden when you have sold your engine!” Sums it up for me! Madrid are and always will be cunts!
August 1st, 2008 at 20:39
Grognard
reading your posts you at times you crack me up, tell me this then how come portugal still have not won a trophy. come on ronaldo is that good why as he not got a european medal. man utd as a team last season were fantastic and do not take away anything the other players done last season, what about barcelona a few years ago what if ronaldinho eto’o and messi did not play would they have won. what about henry in arsenals 2004 title victory would they have won anything.
August 1st, 2008 at 20:43
@Grognard: Hey thats what i am trying to say! After this season i think that the money we get from the slave next year (PROBABLY) will be more than enough to get Ribery!
Anyway about the rooney thing! You are true! But all i was trying to say is that the matches we lost WITHOUT rooney was because we didnt have a PLAN B! And if we have a Fit NO. 9 then we will atleast have that plan B!
August 1st, 2008 at 20:49
@Grognard: What did Fergie ever do to slave boy to piss him off to madrid?
August 1st, 2008 at 20:51
Chelsea are the closest team to having first-rate backup in every position, and i put that down to abramovich’s money. I can’t see another team in the world with a stronger squad than ours.
‘I understand we have Ronnie, Park, Nani and Giggs, but with ronnie out for a cuple of weeks, what if nani or giggs pick up a knock in those first few games? We’re left with just two designated players in that position. It’s all just worst-case scenario, and we have to be prepared.’
No we don’t. We have enough players in that position already. Until they return from injury, we’ll just have to cope.
Nani is the replacement for giggs in terms of a first-choice player. Unless ronaldo leaves, we don’t need another player worthy of a first choice position. If sanchez is good enough to become a first team regular, there’s no need to bring him in. When giggs retires, someone more in the park mould should be brought in, as they are adequate cover but are not first choice picks.
August 1st, 2008 at 20:52
I am pleased to see a few people on here are seeing the need for us to invest in another winger. I pointed this out a few weeks ago and people thought that we were not that much in need to sign one. I can see that as first choice we have ronaldo and nani/giggs and park is a very able back up, but i still feel we need a winger. Do you realisee that apart from ronaldo we haven’t had a second choice right midfielder in years. People can fill in there yes, but it is not their natural position. We have ronaldo obviously, but then we have had fletcher play there (better suited to centre mid), park (naturally an attacking midfielder). Nani is apparently better right footed but has still played on the left for years and switching him would not necessarily be the best option. So i ask you when ronaldo will be out for months who to play on the right. Assumin nani plays on the left side which he is better on who do we play on the right. I would feel worried playing fletcher there for the first few games. I think that we need to invest in a young winger who we can mould. Like nani but on the right side. We all know roanldo will not be here in the next few years, so get his replacement in now so he is learns. There are however not many young wingers to purchase that i like. I would like us to buy a right sided ashley young but is there any one like him out there. Maybe we should look in another continent like africa or argentina to search. I know that grognard named a few wingers who play in germany who he was impressed with.
August 1st, 2008 at 20:55
Chaps, we are playing live right now!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/7533717.stm
we just scored a sweet 2nd goal
August 1st, 2008 at 21:02
@Matthew: Dude we need to look no further than RIBERY!!! and we would even have the money after slave boy leaves! all the money to tempt
Bayern with!
August 1st, 2008 at 21:16
Red Diablo completely agree with you mate, i think that if ronaldo leaves then ribery is definitely the player we need as his replacement whatever the money is. I heard earlier in the summer after the euros that after interest from chelsea they said that they would definitely consider a bid in the region of £30 mil. I however do not think that ronaldo will leave. I know he wants to but fergie looks like he won’t sell him. Keep hearing that he wants to keep him for another year but i cannot see the point in letting his value go down and keeping him for another year. On another topic i am watching the milk cup game and am wondering what everyones opinion is of brandao is it (portugese black lad) i think.
Also red diablo just wondering if ronnie stays who you want as a winger as i cannot see ribery happy being 2nd choice.
August 1st, 2008 at 21:20
Hey isnt Park in the Olympics too?, so that means we only have Giggs and Nani as wingers!!!
Hargreaves can play there for a while but isnt a really good idea, we do need a new SMF, Swiensteiger is the player of my choice, Fergie is being stuborn and ignorant I hope he knows what hes doing, Im not one to forget all the things he have given us through the years, but it just worries me that he might have lost it.
August 1st, 2008 at 21:28
@@Matthew: umm! If we have ronaldo, i dont think that we would need another winger! I mean he hasnt got such a glorious injury record!
August 1st, 2008 at 21:40
But ronaldo is out until october and who knows how long it will take till he gets back to full fitness. I think we need a young winger who can be an under study to him as we don’t have one.
August 1st, 2008 at 21:56
stupid bitch called us man u
(watching milk cup)
August 1st, 2008 at 22:01
dan(u-ol) have you been watching alot of this cup. Just wanted to know your opinions on brandao, macheda and petrucci. Do you think they can make it.
August 1st, 2008 at 22:31
@dan(u-ol): Mate wat’s the result?
August 1st, 2008 at 22:37
@Matthew: unfortunately no, i havent been watching the competition until today, but i have been kept up to date with it on the bbc 606 boards. there are 2 young players(whos names i cant spell) that are ment to be promising talents, they’re in the england youth squads also. i saw all three of those players tonight though, macheda is a poacher, he has a nice height and will get goals. i can tell by the goal he scored today, it was quality. petrucci looks like he will get alot of assists and a fair share of goals, a true second striker i guess. and i didnt see much of the other lad, but he looked like a beast to be honest, in the tevez mold. Macheda might get a chance in the future, but most likely he and the rest of them will be sold, thats just the way we are now with the youth.
August 1st, 2008 at 22:38
@Krishnan: 3-0 united.
August 1st, 2008 at 22:45
@Grognard: OK mate, let’s try this again.
holds up large sign with SARCASM written on it
Lee Martin, anyone?
adds laughing emoticon to re-inforce said sign
August 1st, 2008 at 22:49
Iv been watching a bit of the milk cup aswell(livin in ireland its the only bit of football i can get to watch) and i have to say iv been mighty impressed with one of the young lads called Oliver Norwood. Hes a MF player who has a good touch, great passing and isnt half bad at set pieces either. He just scored a cracker of a free kick in the final. Could be 1 for the future! Brandao, Macheda and Petrucci have all played well from wat iv seen of them. Macheda finished the cup wit 6 goals and brando and petrucci scored a few as well.
August 1st, 2008 at 23:03
Matthew
you said we dont have an up and coming winger heard if the name nani. I realy think tevez is going to have a monster season and if they anyone thinks rooney and tevez are not good enough upfront for united then they should be send to the looney bin.
August 1st, 2008 at 23:18
@Grognard: Sorry, but these sound a bit contradictory:
Sounds like praise to me – it’s certainly written as though you approve.
….What? So just because someone wants to stay, they should be allowed to? This is a professional football team, not an old boys club. You get your place in the squad on merit alone. If you’re good enough to be in the squad, you get your place in the team, again on merit alone. Let’s look at these four:
Beckham – Two main faults by the time he left. The first was switching his primary allegiance to Brand Beckham – every spare moment he spent promoting Brand Beckham, causing a huge media circus to follow everywhere. Great for shirt sales, much less good for team morale when everyone feels like a sideshow in the Life of Beckham.
But also, and most people forget this, Beckham’s performances on the field had slipped to the point where he was no longer first choice. He had decided (note, not told by Fergie – decided himself) that he wanted to be a central midfield player. You rarely saw him with chalk on his boots, getting to the by-line and whipping in those deadly crosses. He hung back to play champagne diagonal balls, lurked to try long range pot shots and tried to play intricate balls through the middle. He was so taken in by his hype that he forgot what he was good at. And in the big games that season, Solskjaer played instead of him on the right side and played bloody well. Maybe didn’t deserve to be in the squad, maybe didn’t deserve to be in the team – so Fergie got rid.
Keane – Keano was a shadow of his former self by the time he was shown the door. Injury prone, a bit slow and without the energy to play box-to-box. We had to play a totally different formation to accomodate him in the team. Not only that, but he was raging against the dying of the light in a spectacular way. Grievances with other members of the squad were aired in public, and it’s not only Fergie who views that as a betrayal of the whole squad. Maybe didn’t deserve to be in the squad, maybe didn’t deserve to be in the team – so Fergie got rid.
And actually to keep Keano for as long as he did was an act of blind loyalty for Fergie, one which in retrospect delayed the regeneration.
Ruud – by the time Fergie dropped him for the Carling Cup final, Ruud had begun to view the entire team as a mechanism for providing him with goals. He scored a hell of a lot of them, but there was no room for anyone else. He would, ironically, be the ideal signing now – but as the last piece of the puzzle, who knows he is coming into a damn good team and is there to enhance what we already have. NOT to be the centrepiece, the main main, which is what he saw himself as by the end.
As for the squad angle, he responded to getting dropped by sulking and demanding to play again. Not by working his socks off in training, or playing like a man possessed whenever he got a chance, but by whinging that it was his divine right to be in the side. It isn’t, it wasn’t, it never will be for anyone. Maybe didn’t deserve to be in the squad, maybe didn’t deserve to be in the team – so Fergie got rid.
Ince – actually, Ince was still worth his place in the team. But he bought into his own hype, the famous “Guv’nor” image which he still likes to cultivate today. He stopped taking criticism, and started to see himself as bigger than the team. He could have looked ten yards to the side of him to see Keano. Set yourself up as a rival to Fergie? You’re gone, and so you should be. Be as arrogant as you like on the pitch, but off it you’re a member of a club and a team – that has been a consistent principle and is one that we should all support.
If you want examples of loyalty, look at Robson, McClair and Solskjaer. Robson was toxic after one too many managerial failures – Fergie took him back into the fold and got him a well-paid job as an ambassador. McClair gave nearly a decade to United, and is an integral part of the backroom staff. Solskjaer gave us his whole career, and will have a job for life. Micky Phelan, even, accepted his demise with grace and is a fixture behind the scenes.
Fergie has proved again and again that he knows when to say “thanks for the memories, but see you later”. He is the best in the business at that, without question. Blind loyalty is an appalling quality in a manager.
People change. Teams move on. Get over it.
August 1st, 2008 at 23:30
@Grognard: agree with you about needing cover at right wing, although Hargo played well on the right wing when called on
August 1st, 2008 at 23:48
@micheal: Because it is a team game and not an individual one. I can’t believe you don’t get that. No player, not Pele, not Maradona, Beckenbauer, Cruyff etc ever won a trophy by himself. So really, have some logic behind your point because we are talking about a team game.
And I’m glad I amuse you.
August 1st, 2008 at 23:50
@Red Diablo: Nothing. He was just seduced by the dark side of the force.
August 1st, 2008 at 23:52
@Red Diablo: You are getting all worked up over Ribery and for no reason. He’s going nowhere. Bayern are very pleased with him and he is loving it at the club and life in Munich as well. Unless something really drastic happens under Klinsmann, don’t expect him to want to leave that Utopia.
August 1st, 2008 at 23:55
@Penguin: I know it was sarcasm mare. I just replied with my form of dry wit by asking WHAT, not who is a Lee Martin. Somewhere in all that you must have taken me far too serious.
August 2nd, 2008 at 0:26
@Penguin: I’m not sure what you are going on about me contradicting myself. I praised Fergie in the way he takes command of a situation and never lets a player get the better of him. Fine great, but I also think by keeping Ronaldo here he is hurting the team even though he will win the battle of wills with Portuguese Dancing Muppet. Just because he is right to react that way and to show his power and strength does not mean it’s entirely positive for Manchester United. I see the pro’s and the cons in this mess. Yes we need to send a message to Real that we are not like other clubs and we will not be intimidated or coerced into acting against our best wishes. Fine, mission accomplished (I think). But now what? Now we have a disgruntled cunt who want s to be elsewhere and who has shown very little maturity or professionalism in the past two months. Is that what we want on our team. Do we really need his poisoned attitude infection other gullible and easily seduced young players that speak his language and share his cultural way of thinking? I don’t think so.
I have seen first hand what happens when you keep a bad influence around in a work environment and how bad his attitude can rub off on others. Ronaldo is not a machine who can turn off his wishes and dreams now that he is not going to get his way. He’s a human being (I think) who is going to be bitter, angry and very hurt over what he will see as a betrayal by our team for his five years of stellar service.
I have said all along that if it was only Real Madrid causing this problem and not Ronaldo as well, I would want Fergie to throw the book at them and really let them have it. But Ronaldo is part of this mess and his desires are pretty damned obvious right now. I look at it like this, if my wife doesn’t love me anymore and has met somebody else she desires more, am I supposed to tie her up and tell her she needs to abide by our marriage contract or am I supposed to let her go. Or better yet, do I destroy the person who has stolen he heart? It’s an interesting dilemma but there is only one correct answer despite what we all would like to see. The correct answer is you let he go because there is nothing worse than a marriage with no love and a person being held against their wishes. So sure Ronaldo has a contract and he has violated our trust and our faith in him by wanting to break that contract. Sure I am angry as Hell but do I say fuck no you can’t go? No, I fleece Real Madrid for more money than they want to spend and a player or two and I say thank you very much, have a nice fucking day.
Ronaldo is going to end up being a cancer to this team if we hang on to him, mark my words. Still, I do respect and admire Fergie standing up to him and Real Madrid but in the long term, that may end up being a mistake. And yet, by clearly stating to the Real’s of the world that we are bigger than you and you will not push us around, you are sending a message to the whole footballing community that from now on, trying to tap up players from United will not work. That’s all fine and dandy if we knew Fergie was going to be around for another two decades, but he is not. Will his successor have such a thick skin and stubborn streak? Somehow I doubt it. Therefore, selling Ronaldo is probably the best thing to do. Man is it ever a sorted and confusing soap opera with many ethical and philosophical questions to be answered and considered.
As for your argument about Beckham, RVN, Keane and Ince, I see your point but you completely missed mine. My point was that he was being a hypocrite by treating these players differently than Ronaldo, whose crime is far worse than theirs. I don’t really care if you think they were wrong in their actions because that is debatable. I for one have no problem with RVN or Becks but I disagreed with what Keane did on live tv. And i disagree that Beckhams form had deteriorated greatly. He had a few games where he was off a bit and Fergie used that against him to make a point. Beckham showed what he was made of coming off the bench in the CL home clash 2nd leg against Real to score two big goals for us which showed his commitment and pride. And RVN was just totally disrespected. He had a training ground feud with Ronaldo who is known for his selfish play and RVN is paid to score goals. If Ronaldo isn’t going to bother to get him the ball, then it makes RVN’s job pointless. Benching him for the Carling Cup final was a slap in his face considering the number of goals and dedication he had shown to the club up to that point. It was after that when his attitude totally went off the reservation. Fergie picks his favorites and he protects them like fine jewels but if you are one of those unlucky to not be on his favorites list, heaven help you. When the day comes you will get the boot, not matter how much you have given to the team. So I’m sorry but I won’t get over it. To be honest, I’m a little bitter and still angry over it because I detest unfairness and betrayal. Even if it comes from a man I love like Fergie. And make no mistake, I love him and respect him greatly. But that doesn’t mean I can’t be disappointed in him or question him. Hell my father got the same too. Why should Fergie get better treatment than my beloved father?
August 2nd, 2008 at 0:48
@Matthew: So hypothetically, if Ronaldo stays fit for most of the season, what will be the role of this “undertsudy” winger? Just sit on the bench and wait his turn? I really doubt you’ll find a player willing to do that in this age of football.
August 2nd, 2008 at 2:23
The Daily Mail are reporting that United have rebuffed an approach for Fletcher from Birmingham….. that’s an odd one. Fletch isn’t first team week in week out, but Birmingham? He’s better than that! Everton atleast!
August 2nd, 2008 at 3:28
@Grognard: I agree almost to the heart of your issue! Which is, as I see it, it’s inevitable that ones opinion, loyalty, and acumen to foresee future events is not the measure of your success. The future is always fluid – how you divert those waters is key. The idea that some kind of esteem can be gained from being “right” is flat out Victorian.
SAF has always used the moment to put us in an advantageous position – whether that is in his comments to the press or on the sidelines with his demonstrative performances. He clearly has only one thing in mind – MUFC.
You seem perfectly right about most individual events that you comment on although your consistency is clearly inconsistent!!
Good on you!
August 2nd, 2008 at 4:00
@Grognard: you are very conviniently forgetting something about taht carling cup and RVN. I quite remember SAF explaining dropping RVN and employing Saha that night for the final and the reason he gave was it was Saha’s cup! He had scored I think 6 goals en route to the final and he completely deserved to play the final. It would have been really unfair on saha to have benched him for the final after what he had done (as it was unfair to drop park in the CL this term after his exploits in semis but it is another thing). Anyway RVN didnt like it and it was his problem not SAF’s! I think all SAF cares for is attitude on the pitch and in training. Outside of it he doesnt care. The reason Ronaldo is still tolerated is he is a model professional. And Grog if your worst fears become materialised and if ronaldo doesnt give his 100%, SAF wont think twice before shipping him out even in the Jan window!!! He knows what he is doing. And most of his decisions have been very good for united (especially the RVN’s ouster one! We have won 2 PLs and a CL after that). I’d take whatever decision boss makes on Ronaldo and get on with it as it would be the best possible and in best interests of the team. We can keep here debating about all these things based on newspapers but only SAF knows all the hard realities and lets just trust him on this.
August 2nd, 2008 at 4:02
@Red Rich: If I come across a little inconsistent at times it’s because my emotions are being played with by the players, Man Utd and most of all, the media. I don’t know whether I’m coming or going or what to think most of the time. One day you hear one thing and the next day it’s the opposite. Some clarity in these matters would help me finally take a definitive side in all this. One thing I can say for sure is that no matter what happens with Ronaldo, Berbatov etc, I know this, RONALDO IS DEAD TO ME! On that one point I think you and everyone else can agree that I have been consistent on.
August 2nd, 2008 at 4:14
@jos: Fair enough but I think I also remember RVN stating the thing that pissed him off the most was not even getting a chance to play in the game. The best goal scorer in Europe at the time and he is benched completely for a Cup Final? Ridiculous! It was a clear statement of intent by Fergie regardless of Saha. RVN was in his doghouse and there he would remain until he was dealt. A sad way of thanking a player for his contributions and effort on behalf of the team I think. None of us really know the whole story and there could be a lot more to all these stories than what we see or what is reported. But seeing as the clubs feel it necessary to keep all it’s supporters in the dark (despite the fact we pay their wages), then I guess it’s only fair if we make up our own minds based on the evidence at hand. And for me Fergie is guilty of mistreating this players at the end of their Man Utd careers. Earlier I was told to live with it. Why the Hell should I? Do I not have a right to be upset when a couple of my favorite players are shipped off for God knows what reasons? I don’t now nor have I ever supported Man Utd because they are managed by Sir Alex Ferguson. I chose to support this club being a foreign supporter due to having watched the team play over the years and having been attracted to the play of certain players as well as the team in general. And this started before Fergie showed up. It’s players who make this game, not bureaucrats or coaches. Players are what we all pay in our way to watch every weekend. Getting rid of a player without trying to first work things out is not only disrespectful of the player, it’s a gross sign of inconsideration for the many fans who support the team and who especially support the player as a favorite son. Sorry for this rant but I believe loyalty is a two way street and it’s time Fergie showed to players who don’t always tow the line and willingly bend over for a good hard spanking when needed. It’s about respecting people. Man what I would give for RVN patrolling the 18 yard box for us right now.
August 2nd, 2008 at 4:18
@jos: It’s not RVN’s fault we never won as many EPL’s and the CL with him. The team around him then was thinner and not as well equipped. but we still delivered one EPL title , one FA Cup and League Cup while he was a on our team so I wouldn’t exactly call him Michael Ballack either. And he delivered in spades two years ago for Real. Last year he was injured a lot and still scored a bunch of goals. I think the criticism of the team’s performance while he was here is a team criticism and not a slight on him. He did his job.
August 2nd, 2008 at 4:20
this is really funny! best story of the summer so far!!!
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_3897393,00.html
August 2nd, 2008 at 4:23
@Grognard: I didnt say it was RVN’s fault. I think I mentioned once I started following Utd because of him (I started following football only in 2001 when I moved to Europe as my home country is not so football mad)!!! So I am big fan of his, even today. But the simple fact is his ouster hasnt affected united!!! Even without him we have won a lot and have had one of our most successful seasons last year.
August 2nd, 2008 at 5:25
@Grognard: It’s not a knock on you, mate, I find your honesty refreshing. After all who wouldn’t think that CR is less than a worm right now – I mean, I thought he’d be gone 2 weeks ago, dead stop! But if the prospect of him staying, winning games for us and helping us have another great season is in the prospect – I’m in, long live the slave!!
Our ecstasy at the end of last season was probably derived from a whole bunch of that kind of hypocrisy and I say bring it on!
August 2nd, 2008 at 5:57
@jos: I know what you mean but does it have to affect United to mean something or to be wrong. He was treated poorly and thats that. How the team performed is irrelevant. I love Fergie but his Medieval outlook on life reminds a bit of Henry VIII dealing with the Pope (Real Madrid) and his wives (Becks, Ince, RVN, Keane). Heis a stubborn old gaffer and he shows little mercy and takes no prisoners. I do agree thought that if Ronaldo returns and his effort is not 100%, he better be fully healed because he will need all his moves and flexibility in his whole body to avoid all the boots that will be kicked at him. and I wonder if that hair gel is flammable under extreme hairdryer treatment?
August 2nd, 2008 at 6:03
@Red Rich: I’ll get off Ronaldo’s back the day he comes out and verbally pledges his career to United. Since that day will not come, I’m not to scared of having to forgive him. I want the team to do well and win but at what a price? Sometimes a team needs to have a bad spell in order to attend to some personnel house cleaning. If it means we will be better for year s to come, I’ll sacrifice the short term for that peace and future utopia. I don’t think winning right now with Ronaldo is best for us if he’s just going to demand the same move next summer. Man this is really a pickle United find themselves in.
August 2nd, 2008 at 6:36
@Grognard: So you’d be satisfied if he comes out and pledges his career with united. Does it mean this kind of circus would not happen again next year if he again has a great year with us. And does it mean he wont have a change of mind again? Come on Grog, lets just accept that plyers are in general just mercenaries. The likes of Scholes and Giggs and Neville (a loyal player who you have no faith now as from your earlier posts) are few and far between, and it just happened that utd were incredibly lucky to have them. I have no problems with having mercenaries in the team if they can help us win something. I am still not sold on the likes of Rooney, Rio etc as the same loyal players as Giggs/Scholes (partly because they moved from their home clubs to us to win something and lets say in worst case if utd were to be relegated to mid-table mediocracy when fergie leaves, I am not so sure if these players would still remain at club… i might be wrong though and we’ll only know this in 10 years time). Anyway I think this is not the first time Fergie is in this kind of a situation (player to poach/ player being poached) so he can deal with it now. Our worries will start once the great man himself leaves!!!
August 2nd, 2008 at 8:20
@Grognard: HEHEHE! I hope Yoda aka Fergie trains him to bring him back to the path of light!
August 2nd, 2008 at 8:22
@Grognard: Hmm. I guess a bid of 60 Million would be enough!
And we can do two things! Either we can hope that something does go wrong there! Or, we can play the madrid game! Fergie saying that! We use MENS and Sun as our car! And every day a player and former legends coming out to say how good ribery would be at united! 
August 2nd, 2008 at 10:11
@Red Diablo: by the way RD, i think that you’ll find that i had my avatar before you!
August 2nd, 2008 at 10:12
@Red Diablo: by the way RD, i think that you’ll find that i had my avatar before you!
August 2nd, 2008 at 11:09
@phoenix red: @phoenix red: SHARONG IS CARING!
August 2nd, 2008 at 11:10
@phoenix red: Sharing IS CARING!
August 2nd, 2008 at 13:21
Links for todays game????
August 2nd, 2008 at 14:43
what time is the kick off scheduled for fellas? and can someone put up that justin
tv link?
August 2nd, 2008 at 14:56
Match starts at 15:00 BST, strangely not working on mutv online at the moment..argh..
I see Berba played yesterday in Spurs win over Celtic, and played well aparently. Argh.
August 2nd, 2008 at 15:06
Please lads a link!!!!
August 2nd, 2008 at 15:48
http://www.justin.tv/narkitu_internacional
or
http://www.justin.tv/widgets/jtv_live.r8448.swf?channel=mstv3
August 2nd, 2008 at 15:51
never mind the 2nd one, its dead
August 2nd, 2008 at 15:51
Great half from United, just needed a finish. Scholes should have scored maybe 3, chipped onto the post early. Tevez has been an absolute monster, playing out of his skin today. Second best player on the park IMO has been Danny Simpson, been bombing forward, and owned anything on his wing. He looks a lot bigger than last year too, clearly hitting hte gym. Looks a real prospect.
Anyone know where Rooney and Carrick are?
August 2nd, 2008 at 15:54
Ignore the 2nd comment, It’s working now.. sorry must be my connection
August 2nd, 2008 at 16:31
OLE OLE OLE!!! A Legend!!!
August 2nd, 2008 at 16:40
Solskjaer=magic
August 2nd, 2008 at 16:44
CAMBELL good finish
August 2nd, 2008 at 16:44
Oh man what a great play!!
August 2nd, 2008 at 17:09
who needs berbatov when we have campbell lol.
August 2nd, 2008 at 17:10
I believe Rooney and Carrick picked up viruses in Africa. I know they said they would be fit for today, but it looks like SAF didnt want to risk it. Plus, we played well without them, and they only make our side better.
August 2nd, 2008 at 17:19
hehe yea dan…it was a good finish…one thing I dont question is the lads pace…hes easily our fastest player…would be a good player to bring on at 70 mins against tired defenders
August 2nd, 2008 at 17:22
whats the score guys
August 2nd, 2008 at 17:26
1-0
August 2nd, 2008 at 17:58
Pretty impressive performance from the team today, with scholes proving once again why he is still Fergie’s first choice at 33; the guy is class!!!
There was however an issue I had touched on earlier which was evident in this match; Our lack of designated WF/SMF cover. We had four WF/SMF’s last season; Giggs, Nani, Ronnie, Park, with fletcher and hargo randomly comin out of their natural position(CMF) to fill in when we had injuries/other circumstances; and to be honest, neither of them can be considered a first choice WF/SMF or play those positions consistently.
However, right now, we only have two fit designated WF/SMF’s in Nani and Giggs. What if one of them picked up knocks, we’ll be left with only one plus maybe Fletcher. is that goin to be good enuff for top opposition? Besides, by Fergies’ admission, Giggs is goin to play a considerable less amount of games than he did last season and might be retiring at the end of this, so why not get his replacement to fill that quartet we have, now, rather than when he leaves?
Nani came in last season and took his time to adjust to the team/lifestyle plus he provided the much needed cover last season, so now that Giggs is on the brink plus Ronnie’s injury, why not do the same. It was pretty evident today that we had no cover for our wingers, besides, we all know ManUtd thrive on quick counter attack play and Fletcher, hargreaves and park just don’t cut it in that department. Why aren’t we looking to bring in a young wing maestro who will do what Nani did last season; provide cover and complete the quartet of wingers when giggs leaves end of this season?
This is an issue that seems trivial when compared to our need for a No.9, but I think come nxt season, when the tough games start comin one after the other early on (have a look at our schedule), plus with Ronnie out with injury, it would be pretty obvious that the cover we have right now in our WF/SMF department is just not satisfactory!! there are a lot of youngsters out there who Fergie might be considering, why not bring them in now rather than when it is too late and we’re struggling to impose our crushing counter-attack play. It is better to be safe than sorry, besides, the young lad would be able to adjust/adapt at his own pace and also figure in a decent amount of games without the added pressure of expected consistent performance.
What do you guys think?
August 2nd, 2008 at 18:16
Play Campbell as a winger. He’s got the pace and he should be able to use it to get forward. What he does as soon as he gets there is anybody’s guess. Brown can’t cross for his life and yet he is a danger in attack. So if Campbell can just take the ball forward fast, there is no need for extra cover on the wings.
August 2nd, 2008 at 18:54
Not enough strikers or left wingers
August 2nd, 2008 at 18:55
Not enough strikers & left wingers
August 2nd, 2008 at 19:04
Tevez is looking red-hot. Last season he said he was only playing at 70-80% and it certainly looks like he’s been working on his conditioning and fitness this pre-season. He looks a yard quicker and more explosive than before. Without wanting to be accused of ridiculous hyperbole, he looked like a cross between Messi and Rooney at times today. I’m really looking forward to seeing how he progresses this coming season – apparently he’s been working on his finishing all summer too. If we get Berbatov, an attacking trident of Tevez-Berbatov-Rooney should be brilliant even in Ronaldo’s absence.
August 2nd, 2008 at 19:18
@RedAddict: It might just be, might just, that anyone of us has yet to see the full potential of Carlitos.
I remember a few years back, when he was still plying his trade in Argentina, people talked of him as the next world beater a la Ronaldo. While he has been world class, it might just be that his transfer imbroglio might have caused him to affect him mentally and playing at a level which is not truly his!!
August 2nd, 2008 at 19:24
Thnx for the memories OLE!
Ole! Ole! Ole!
August 2nd, 2008 at 19:41
@RedAddict: true true.. Tevez has looked a shade faster and sharper!!! I think players like that need to be challenged, and he is definitely being challenged in ManUtd!! He, Rooney, and whatever striker we get are gonna rock the world for yrs to come, that’s why I would prefer a young striker, so they can stay together and have that continuity…
August 2nd, 2008 at 20:33
ole was class!!! not played for a year and to create chances like that!! if his knee was goood he’d be the best impact player this year. pure class!!! surpried no one has already pointed this out!!!
August 2nd, 2008 at 21:13
i said this would happen to tevez months ago. me grognard argued over it with me being the victor of course
, trust me lads, not only will tevez be quicker and sharper, his goal tally should increase also. 
August 2nd, 2008 at 21:34
looks like the boss is hopefull abt manucho oand we are keeping campbell
August 2nd, 2008 at 21:38
hopfully we will see a better tevez this year he had great close control last yr wit another m of pace and improved accuracy he will be nuts.
He isnt in the olympic squad for the argys is he?
August 2nd, 2008 at 21:46
QUESTION: Why have we not heard about Fabio and Rafael’s July transfers?
(check out this interview from fifa… note the part with Ronaldo telling them that Utd is the place to be… http://www.fifa.com/u17worldcup/news/newsid=579269.html)
August 2nd, 2008 at 21:58
i go on holiday…. no sky sports no paper niet… i think as im coming back oh.. you know utd might have actually signed someone ( this thought pops into my head as i drive past Old Trafford, with a sea of red walking past… it dawns on me it was Ole’s Testimonial.. i hope it was as good as he deserved.) anyway.. so i get back and whats happened? nothing.. bar Eagles has ahem spread his wings and fucked off (at last).. but bar that diddly fucking squat.. i thought that with keane gone to shitspool then we would have got berba in the bag but no.. all the headlines are still about some shitty little cricket match between some shit englishmen who sound like they carn’t bowl for toffee and some s.africans who sounded like they were having an easy time… please utd give me some sane sports news for once!
August 2nd, 2008 at 22:38
@gator: wow so campbell will be getting a key role, i hope he shines, i would give my left nut(you know what i mean
) to see him come good for the team.
August 2nd, 2008 at 23:31
Just got in from the match. The one thing that was blindingly obvious from seeing them up close and personal (stretford end, get in) is that we completely lacked width. no attacking wingers. It didn’t help every time Evra went on the overlap Nani used him as a decoy. Simpson was brilliant. no need to buy a right back when g.nev goes.
also, I picked up a new interesting chant…..
seeya ronaldo,
seeya ronaldo,
hes of to real madrid
for an extra couple’a quid
August 3rd, 2008 at 0:05
@Keith Kaira II: You’re kidding right? I agree about lacking wingers, but maybe if we’d played Hargreaves, he’d have covered that position very well.
@gator: From that link, does anyone besides me think that Fergie has given up on Berbatov(or buying any new striker)?
August 3rd, 2008 at 0:08
@Traverse: I thought I was the only one that realised that.. we have few options with regards to width. We currently have, Giggs, Nani, Ronaldo, Park, with Fletch and Hargo (both CMF’s) sometimes filling in when we decide to be defensive. But typically, we are always on the offensive and Fletch/Hargo (both CMF’s) cannot perform consistently well in a counter-attack minded formation playing the WF/SMF position. So, right now out of those four designated WF/SMF’s we only have two fit ones(Giggs, Nani), and with Giggs set to play a considerable less amount of games this season (Fergie’s admission), that means we will have only one regular WF/SMF for the beginning of the season plus Fletcher/Giggs . What if one of them even got injured? That doesn’t seem to be promising given the tough games we have early on (have a look at our schedule).
Now, last season, we brought in Nani to be Giggs successor but he also provided much needed cover for those extra games in the season, which prevented our first-choice WF/SMF from burnout. Why aren’t we doing the same this season? With Giggs probably set to retire this season and Nani being promoted to Ist-choice, why don’t we get a young prodigy who will come in as mainly an understudy this year (rather like Nani did last yr) so as to complete that quartet when Giggs leaves? with Ronnie being out for two-three months, the lad would play a handful of games and will also have the chance to gradually adjust to the style/lifestyle of the team/premiership without that added pressure, and, more importantly, be ready to perform when golden boy Giggsy departs this season!!
It’s just a pre-caution, but I say better be safe than sorry; this season, every team we play against would be gunning for us, plus there’s our exhaustive schedule and player injuries; I’ll just rather be prepared than regret the fact that we chose to wait in our pursuit of an extra WF/SMF.
What do you think?
August 3rd, 2008 at 1:16
@Gabriel: I think that was Fergies plan for Ramsey, and he didn’t have a plan B, much like the Berbatov situation.
August 3rd, 2008 at 1:54
@Traverse: well, we lost ramsey to arsenal, so he should get someone else, maybe Menez, Sanchez, whoever, but just before it’s too late!!
August 3rd, 2008 at 2:11
It’s nice to hear that Simmo looked sharp. Does anyone know about his ability to play on the left. It would be nice to know that he could fill in on the left if Silly flies back to France. I agree about the need for an extra winger. I don’t see why a relatively small amount, say 5 million quid, can’t be allocated for a squad player who adds depth. There are plenty of seasoned vets who wouldn’t mind the occasional cameo for Red Glory.
I can’t believe it is August and still no significant additions. The Community Shield is in less than 10 days!!! I’m really hoping to see some fireworks in the transfer market next week. Is Arshavin the key to Berbatov? What is Fergie’s plan B? I wish Manucho at least had a work permit to slightly alleviate the situation. Apart from a serious promotion for Welbeck, Campbell is the only legitimate back-up we have at Forward. That’s worrying. I guess hold the breath for one more week and hope everything pans out. I’m very interested to see Berbatov’s affect. I think his arrival could be a serious boost for Rooney. This is his chance to shine in what is his acknowledged prefered role. Coupled with the continued improvement of Tevez and of course his slavjesty, we will be a potent offensive mix.
August 3rd, 2008 at 5:11
how about ashley young as winger? Granted he has shone in a less talented team, but he is pure quality when it comes to crosses, runs, corners, free-kicks et al. Question is, will he agree to a little less playing time than he would get at Villa?
August 3rd, 2008 at 5:27
@Mihir-
Ashley Young would definitely fit the bill, although his price tag would surely be at least 15 million, considering he is an English player transferring between Premiership teams. I don’t think that is in the expenditures for this window. I liked Blackburn’s move for Villanueva. Why not take a punt on a possible unpolished gem form across the Atlantic. If he doesn’t pan out and isn’t a geezer we would be able to re-coup most if not all and some extra.
August 3rd, 2008 at 6:22
QUESTION: Why have we not heard about Fabio and Rafael’s July transfers – are they at UTD now?
(check out this interview from fifa… note the part with Ronaldo telling them that Utd is the place to be… http://www.fifa.com/u17worldcup/news/newsid=579269.html)
Also, if we got them… why does BBC not list them as INs?
August 3rd, 2008 at 8:19
nah not ashley young…If we are going to buy any english player then it should be joe cole
or arg i dono
August 3rd, 2008 at 10:23
did anyone notice the new kit letters and numbers that were worn during solskjaer’s testimonial against espanyol? are those the new european numbers to replace the silver ones we wore last year?
August 3rd, 2008 at 13:29
i think u guys are forgetting, last season nani headbutted someone, and so still has to miss the first 2 league games of the season, so just giggs left eh?
August 3rd, 2008 at 13:42
Interestingly, Rudd has come out and said Ronaldo isn’t coming, because United don’t want him to, and everyone needs to stop going on about it and concentrate on preparations for the season.
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_3905325,00.html
August 3rd, 2008 at 16:44
Tevez should indeed be much improved next season. But throughout his career he’s only averaged a goal every three games and that is not enough. Rooney is not much better so as usual we will be reliant on Ronaldo for goals.
As best team in the world our transfer activity this summer has been disappointing. Ramsey and Dos Santos would have been great additions…im guessing they just wanted first team football. Berbatov would have completed us nicely. But we didn’t land any of them!
We have Campbell back but id rather see him on loan at Hull. We need a proven top-level striker.
August 3rd, 2008 at 17:32
grogard, do you know anything about a player named nelson valdes, the reason i ask you is because he plays in the german league. im watching him now against spurs and he just looks so amazing
August 3rd, 2008 at 17:48
@gator: Reading from that web, I can say that Saha is totally not in the boss’s plans and hopefully we’ll get some money off-loading him.
August 3rd, 2008 at 18:23
@Jezta: I can’t see the point of selling him, Ok he is always injured but we do not have anyone else of that ilk, we are obviously skint ehich is a worry to say the least!
August 3rd, 2008 at 18:31
Ps Campbell’s praise is a smoke screen, he is trying to get the Berbatov figure down.
August 3rd, 2008 at 19:59
F spurs man I think were fine. if we arent we can get somone in jan I say let
them try to keep him happy and then take him for a cut price in jan or get somone
better.
and keep saha i hope he stays unless we get somone proven.
high hopes for campbell/manucho thogh (fingers crossed)
August 3rd, 2008 at 20:00
Yeah? @Stephen: Lets see!
August 3rd, 2008 at 20:01
I think that we should be worried about Chelsea! Beating Milan 5-0 is no joke!
August 3rd, 2008 at 20:17
We badly need a striker, Manucho and Campbell are not the ticket, Huntelaar, is in Sunderland sign him Fergie!
August 3rd, 2008 at 20:40
@Stephen: ‘Striker? Hello! Berbatov or Benzema! Those are the only two that should matter!
August 3rd, 2008 at 20:49
@Red Diablo: We will not get Benzema, I think he is good, it depends on Spurs with regards to Berbatov. We are having a Mexican stand off @ the moment, Huntelaar would be great for us, no doubt.
August 3rd, 2008 at 20:54
@Stephen: You kidding? Huntelaar will slow us down! Like RVN! Berbatov is a MUST!
August 3rd, 2008 at 21:06
@Red Diablo: Er RVN did do quite well for us!
August 3rd, 2008 at 21:18
@Stephen: Yeah? And where was the free flowing football when RVN was here? Face it ! Huntelaar would slow our attacks down!
August 3rd, 2008 at 21:58
@IBleedRed: Nice! Hmm! But guys lets think of Ribery and Ashley Cole AFTER slave boy has left! Right now we need A GOD DAMN STRIKER! And Fergie is doing NO good to do such a thing! Guys i HATE to say this! But I think that Rooney will have to sacrifice himself AGAIN! How can Fergie even do such a thing? I mean if I were Fergie i would seriously sign a NO.9 Striker the First Day! Only for the sake of Rooney that is! I mean he keeps on making a sacrifice? That is plain wrong! Unless Fergie signs a striker!(I don’t know when! I have been waiting for a month for something like this!) I would not be so certain of our attack power!
August 3rd, 2008 at 22:10
@Red Diablo: That was because we didn’t have pacy wingers… We had David Beckham. But look how RVN plays for Holland.He plays up front on his own and does not stay in the box for crosses to whipped to him. I believe that is a myth. He does hold up the ball well and is a neat finisher. Last season when some of the chances were begged to be put away, Tevez and Rooney fluffed them. RVN would have finished them easily and he would’ve helped us immensely against teams like Blackburn, Middlesbrough etc., where there are many bodies at the back. Berbatov is also slow when you compare our striking trinity, but he’s got the ability to hold up the ball, draw defenders and create spaces and chances for others. His first touch is also great.
August 3rd, 2008 at 22:15
@Grognard: You take of buying Sanchez? I’m not sure if we are even going to get Berbatov!
August 3rd, 2008 at 22:24
@Krishnan: Berbatov is in the mould of Cantona! And i dont think that that type of player woul do any harm to our FLUID attacks!
August 3rd, 2008 at 22:28
@Red Diablo: I agree with the Berbatov part. But I’m questioning your perception of RVN’s game.
August 3rd, 2008 at 22:32
@Krishnan: Berbatov is not slow. I don’t know where everyone gets this from?!
Watch this from 3mins onward, his second fav goal (couldn’t find a better version) class AND speed. I really hope we sign him. Doesn’t look like he’d slow us down one jot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWIErqmz6Bk
August 3rd, 2008 at 22:33
@Red Diablo: that is a Milan team with Pato and Ronaldinho at the Olympics. I didnt see the game though…did Kaka play?
I think a possible solution is a 4-3-3 with Rooney, Tevez and a new striker up front with Anderson playing LCM , Hargo at RCM and Scholes/Carrick in the CM. This would allow Rooney and Tevez to drop back and play their game with Andy and Hargo providing the width. I think that Andy could be good cover at LM when there is no place for him in the center.
Do suspensions carry over from one season to another? I ask this because Ronaldo was on a suspension after the Milan semi-final and he played in our first group game last season
August 3rd, 2008 at 22:36
@Traverse: Mate read my comment properly. I never said Berbatov is slow. I said that he is slow when compared to our holy trinity (Rooney, Tevez and Ronaldo(i don’t think he’s holy anymore))… I love his style and I have seen his sudden outbursts of speed also.
August 3rd, 2008 at 22:42
@Liam: 4-3-3? You’re having a laugh! Can we SIGN A STRIKER FIRST? please!
August 3rd, 2008 at 22:54
@Liam: Suspensions carry in the Premier League, but not in the Champions League. Nani will be banned for the first two games of the season, but everybody will be eligible for the Champions League opener (not sure about Drogba, though – red card, not an accumulation of yellows)
August 3rd, 2008 at 23:24
@Red Diablo: I don’t know what else the Lyon Chief can say to make it anymore blatantly obvious that he’s not parting with Benzema and if his hands are forced, for not anything less than £50m. I remember him saying £50m would only get Benzema’s ear(or something along those lines). The player doesn’t want England, he wants Spain and the club is not selling, so Benzema is out and we United fans should stop dreaming about him…
Its becoming obvious that Fergie never had a plan B and i don’t think we’re signing anyone which is a little disappointing since Fergie himself was the one talking about not getting complacent. We NEED a striker and non- experienced players like Campbell and Manucho won’t cut it for us. I really hope Fergie does something and fast…
August 4th, 2008 at 1:10
I keep running across articles linking Simmo with a season-long loan move to Blackburn. What does everyone think? Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe his main competition is Ooijer. I do remember Emerton playing there a few times last season, but with Bentley’s departure I would expect him to be needed more freguently as a midfielder. Ooijer is no spring chicken, and Blackburn have one of if not the smallest squads, so I think Danny will get plenty of 1st team opportunities. Anything less than 20 starts is unacceptable. Simmo has been one of the top performers this pre-season and I hope we see continued growth at Blackburn.
Anyone know how the rules work in regards to a loan player making appearances against his own team. I remember there being some controversy a few years back when Howard was on loan but didn’t start against us. I would assume it is up to the club who has loaned out the player, but not sure.
THE REDS GO MARCHING ON
August 4th, 2008 at 1:11
Chelsea- “Milan”: 5-0
AC Milan’s line-up:
Kalac at goal
Bonera, Maldini, Simic, and Favalli
Zambrotta, Gattuso, Flamini, and Jankulovski
Pirlo
Ambrosini
Chelsea’s Line up:
Cech
Ivanovic, Alex, Terry, A. Cole
Ballack, Mikel, Lampard
Wright-Philips, Anelka, Malouda.
No wonder… ambrosini up front?
August 4th, 2008 at 1:23
Berba is in the post, he just got a bit lost in the sorting room…. i hope.
oh and that Spurs Chairman is a grade A TWAT. all that bullshit about reporting clubs for tapping up, we didn’t say shit, liverpool blabbed, and they get their man? wtf? i hope spurs get the drop.
August 4th, 2008 at 1:36
@Will: yeah, i hope so too, maybe menez is in there too, cuz after watchin ole’s testimonial, we do need him!!
August 4th, 2008 at 2:06
@Red Diablo: I like Sanchez a lot but he’s a winger/WMF so even though we need him now and especially the future, we need to get a striker. If it’s not Berbatov it better be Huntelaar.
August 4th, 2008 at 2:08
Disregard this if somebody already posted this but Wesley Sneijder apparently tore his knee up real bad the other day. Serves him right for snubbing a move to United. His loss will make Real want Ronaldo even more now. Good Grief!!
August 4th, 2008 at 2:09
BBC website seems to indicate Ferguson is giving a chance to Campbell.
“We do not have any strikers apart from Wayne Rooney and Carlos Tevez and Frazier plays in that area.
“He is quick and determined and he can do very well in the game. Fraizer’s future is here,” said Ferguson.
This is crazy. Ferguson is basically indicating Campbell is now our third striker to take Saha’s place. Note that Ferguson did not mention Saha in the quote……
Ronaldo was our third striker last season. He’s out the first couple of months and we need him on the wing.
For me Campbell would be much better off at Hull on loan. He’d get a ton of games (unlike Rossi at newcastle) and he’d sharpen up playing against top class defenders.
We need a replacement for Saha who is proven top class who we can rely on whatever the occasion. Berbatov would have been ideal but if we cannot get him there are other options.
August 4th, 2008 at 2:17
@dan(u-ol): Actually it’s Nelson Valdez. He’s from Paraguay and all though he has some quickness and skill, I think he is a terrible shooter of the ball and he lacks composure in the box. He’s 26 or 26 now and so he is not a prospect but he is a fairly dependable player coming off the bench. I wouldn’t get too excited about him as he has never been able to crack the starting lineup either at Dortmund or at Bremen for any length of time. Everybody can have a great game in a meaningless pre season match and ook like a world beater. Although he can be streaky good, he’s far from accomplished.
August 4th, 2008 at 2:21
can we all just forget about huntelar? He is simply not good enough. he isnt even in the same class as berbatov. and I say give Cambell a chance, just not at the expense of not signing Berbatov.
August 4th, 2008 at 2:21
@dan(u-ol): It’s pre season Dan. I wouldn’t anoint him King Carlos quite yet. God how some of you make much ado about nothing. Pre season games are about as interesting and stimulating as watching wet wallpaper dry. I refuse to watch these games as they are zero indication of the team’s potential or a true indicator of player’s regular season potential. Tevez smells Berbatov and so he is working his socks off to impress the boss because he knows he’s the odd man out in the lineup should Berbatov arrive. In that scenario I would be the one who won the argument Danny boy. Lets wait until the season starts before we start declaring ourselves winner.
August 4th, 2008 at 2:26
RUUD TELLS IT LIKE IT IS: An article from the Sun where RVN basically tells the naive and powerless Ronaldo what his chances are of getting his way and his dream move to Real Mediocrity.
“CRISTIANO RONALDO can forget coming out on top in this week’s showdown with Alex Ferguson.
The warning to the Manchester United star came from old boy Ruud van Nistelrooy.
Real Madrid striker Van Nistelrooy, 32, had his own crunch talks with the United manager before finally being sold two years ago.
And he does not expect Fergie to back down when Ronaldo, 23, tries to get the OK to join the Spanish giants.
Van Nistelrooy told Five Live’s Sportsweek: “In those meetings, if he wants to keep the player he’ll do everything he can to do so — and he’ll probably succeed as well.
“What he is doing is in the interests of Manchester United. That’s what he always thinks of.
“Nobody is bigger than the club and it’s true. Will Ronaldo stay at United? I think so.”
August 4th, 2008 at 2:28
@johnsom33: How about you forget about Huntelaar and let poor delusional idiots like myself rant on about his overrated and highly unimpressive skills and statistics. After all, you would know.
August 4th, 2008 at 2:36
@ Beachryan:
I don’t think the team will have problems motivating the big defense we have attained. Considering the Nevster is back, that would put the back four consisting of Neville, Rio, Vida, Evra. Now, that sounds nice, but what makes me smile are those waiting to take those four places away from these probable starters. Players such as Brown, O’Shea, Silvestre, Simpson all have shown they have what it takes to act as fill ins able to give the necessary rest to starters. Wes has proved he can start game in game out without rest. The midfield on our team will not have a problem motivating themselves for the same reason. We have proven talent and more of it waiting on the bench. The team can afford to rotate fifty percent of the team every game to keep the fresh legs at a maximum. I am looking forward to seeing the full strength of the team. It was nice to see Van Der Sar back thsi weekend. But I think Kuszczak should be given more games under his belt. Not to give him some confidence, but to allow the rest of the team to grow in their trust to him. He has what the team needs in talent. Berba will be an expensive piece of work. Maybe worth the money, but only time will tell.
August 4th, 2008 at 3:55
Now it has been confirmed by Fergie himself. My logical side said that Grogs was probably right and we wouldn’t be buying this summer. But I couldn’t let myself believe it until I heard it from SAF, because of all that it would imply. I seriously hope I am wrong about this but it doesn’t look likely.
This is Bad News Bears kids. Especially with Van Basten stating again today that there have been ZERO offers on Huntlear. I can understand that we won’t get bent over the barrel and get a good shagging over Berbatov. But Holy sh!t people. We are the EUROPEAN CHAMPIONS!!! And all we get is………wait for it…..Frazier Motherfu@*ing Campbell?
Ba dum Pa 
What a joke. Someone in the front office is sick in the head or some kind of savaunt. What happend to all of the loot we procured when we won all of that shiny silverware? What about the promises of not sitting on our laurels and spending big? I am getting the feeling that people must have when they find out that the relationship with thier girl isn’t ‘quite’ what they thought it was.
August 4th, 2008 at 6:23
@colvers :you guys play too much FM08… ALL news and event at Utd has to do with (as someone mentioned before) negiotiate prizes of players. If Ferguson says, “Campell will cover for Rooney and Tevez”, it really means, Spurs lower the prize of Berba or we will leave spurs and spend our millions somewhere else… Chill out about the transfers… As if Ferguson does not have plans A, B, C, D, E,… ad infinium – there is more to manager than what FM2008 allows and Ferguson is very good at playing the real version of FM.
If no-one, besides Rafael and his brother (his name escapes me now) arrive here before two weeks/beginning of season, then you may return to your “anger” and “despair” comments because then someone at Utd is sleeping at the wheels.
What a coup it could be to get Berba for 20 mils considering keane was 20! Or what about getting Cruz for 12? Ferguson will pull something out of his hat very soon… let him work his magic!
August 4th, 2008 at 7:27
@Mads in USA: I almost agree with you.
But we should remember that the season starts before the end of August, and in our current form (with Anderson, Nani, Ronaldo not available), we might want to close the deal for Berbatov sooner rather than later.
Oh, and we really shouldn’t buy Cruz. He’s useless at any price.
August 4th, 2008 at 8:34
@ManUtd10Titles: The money is going to pay off a massive debt by the Glazer’s. I still think we will get Berbatov. Fergie is just playing mind games. Rather than look eager and aggressive he is using a different tactic. He will let Berbatov convince Spurs to let him go much like Bary is doing with Villa. Levy has no choice but to deal him. I don’t like it when players play these kind of games when they have signed contracts but what are team’s supposed to do? I seriously doubt that Levy will do to Berbatov what Fergie is planning for Ronaldo. The situation is quite different as Berby made a formal request to be moved last year. Fergie is just waiting for Spurs to commit money towards Arshavin and possibly Pavlyuchenko. Once they are committed to eith or both of these players Berbatov will become ours. Still, I don’t understand why Fergie feels we have no weaknesses? Frazier fucking Campbell? Are you fucking kidding me? I’ll settle for him as a #4 striker. I don’t get why nobody isn’t interested in Huntelaar? And I don’t want to hear any bullshit about him not being good enough because that’s just so off the bloody reservation it’s not even funny. Mystifying!!
August 4th, 2008 at 9:09
@Grognard: Yes, the money is going to pay off some of the debts, and that’s very fair. We scored a lot of cash, and a hell lot more than the £27 mil, we’re buying Berbatov for. Add to the money won, the money from a few sales (Pique most notably, of course) and we have money to pay off a good chunck of the debt.
About Huntelaar. It really is weird that no club has put in an offer for this lad. I think it may be because clubs think, he’s too expensive. Ajax will probably hold out for £20 mil, and that’s a lot of money. There are not many clubs that can afford such a purchase that are also looking for strikers, so it may be connected to that someway.
We are looking, but of course we haven’t put in a bid, because we want Berbatov. Barca aren’t looking, and neither are AC Milan or Inter. Juventus could be asking, but they’ve still got Del Piero, Trez and Iaquinta. Chelsea have more than enough, and so have Arsenal (who probably wouldn’t go that high anyway). Liverpool signed Keane, and Spurs are in for the Russians. City signed Jo, and Bayern want Gomez.
It doens’t leave many clubs left. I think, he could be SAF’s plan B, but then again, I don’t think he’ll need to initiate it, since Berbatov is quite likely to come here imo.
August 4th, 2008 at 9:30
If we don’t get Berbatov and we haven’t bought in any form of replacement, then In my view we can kiss goodbye to the league. We are so in need of a striker and this to me could be our problem next season.
I don’t subscribe to the school of thought that Huntelaar will slow us down to me thats just lazy thinking because of his similarities to Ruud, how is Berbatov any quicker with his play?
August 4th, 2008 at 9:58
@Stephen: Why does no-one seem to be concerned about our need for an extra WF/SMF? Was I the only one who noticed our lack of width after Nani left the pitch? Giggs doesn’t play WF anymore, he’s now an AMF; fletcher, hargo are CMFs; Ronaldo and Park are injured; what wingers do we have left?
We play a wide counter attack diven play and with no wingers that would not be possible; the game was so flat after Nani left the pitch. this is urgent, maybe not as much as the need for a striker, but still important if we want to fight of our rivals ‘improved’ advances.
August 4th, 2008 at 10:04
@Gabriel: Good point mate I think Fergie wants to play 4-3-3 of 4-5-1 next season with Ronaldo one side and Rooney/Tevez the other and Berbatov though the centre. This would include a midfiels 3, not ideal in my view, being a 4-4-2 man but I can understand his feelings on playing that system, as most top teams do and try to contain the midfield like Chelsea. We do have Park, Nani, Ronaldo, Giggs and pos Hagreaves who could play there, we are also a little short @ CB.
August 4th, 2008 at 10:04
being an Indian….cudnt stop myself from posting it here
********************************
LONDON: Anil Ambani may soon be wearing the black and white Newcastle United jersey. Reliance Communications is in talks to take over the Premier League club from UK billionnaire Mike Ashley for an estimated £260 million ($514 million ), a British newspaper report said.
But Mr Ambani is facing competition from Singapore-based global investment company Profitable Group, which has former England footballer Steve McMahon as a director , News of the World reported on Sunday.
“Both Reliance and Profitable are ready to pay £260 million to own the Magpies outright and are determined to spend more than £100 million on transfers to bolster the team, managed by Kevin Keegan,” it said.
Mr Ashley—who bought Newcastle in July 2007 for £130 million and immediately pumped in another £80 million to wipe out debtwas not able to offer the kind of money required to sign top players so as to make a serious bid for the English Premier League (EPL) title. “He has made it clear he will not sanction the kind of huge signings which might help challenge for a Champions League place (that takes a top four finish in EPL),” the report said.
According to the Sunday tabloid, Mr Ambani has been in negotiations with Mr Ashley for several weeks, and has made it perfectly clear he will rival Chelsea owner Roman Abramovich in the spending stakes. And, it added, India’s second richest man— who has a personal fortune of £21 billion against Mr Abramovich’s £11 billion— is willing to sanction £150 million for players as per his inner circle, it said.
TOON ARMY
Newcastle United was founded in 1892 after the merger of two local clubs, Newcastle East End & Newcastle West End.
They have won First Division Championship four times and the FA Cup six times, though their last league success was in 1927.
http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/Anil_Ambani_looks_to_buy-out_Newcastle_United/articleshow/3323301.cms
August 4th, 2008 at 10:11
@bond: Er?
August 4th, 2008 at 10:17
@Stephen: Well, 4-4-2 in the prem, 4-5-1/4-3-3 in CL, i’m ok with. That still doesn’t deter the fact that we need cover in the WF/SMF department. I reckon we should get Menez, as he reminds me so much of Ronnie, although he is already 21. What wing players do you reckon we should consider?
August 4th, 2008 at 10:23
@Gabriel: and Stephen. I think, our squad is designed to be flexible. We can play through the middle, but we can also play over the wings. Our game interchanges a lot. You shouldn’t forget that we have backs running the wings as well.
Yes, at times our play goes through the middle, but it’s only because we have the players to do so. Tevez, Rooney, Ronaldo, Nani all work fine on little space. Their quick feet and good passing makes us able to play on little space. Of course, we want the wings to be used as well, and they will. Maybe not so much in the first couple of matches, because we’re without Ronaldo and Nani, but our play through the middle will carry us through that.
You also have to remember that Ronaldo’s game has never been running the wing. He always get in and around the box, and the crosses from his wing will mostly come from the back overlapping.
We cannot go out and buy a winger just because we seem short in the beginning of the season. Where would that leave him, when everyone is fit. A squad should be able to cope with injuries and suspensions, and it doesn’t make it any different that they happen to appear for the first matches. We lost Rooney and Ronaldo in the beginning of last season and still ended up champions because of our strong squad.
Now, I can easily see SAF employing Hargo on the right and Giggs on the left, if we don’t get Berbatov for the first match. Rooney and Tevez will still torment the defenses. If we do manage to sign Berbatov, it’s obvious that a 4-3-3 with him up front and Rooney and Tevez just behind making the runs around him.
August 4th, 2008 at 10:29
@Tomas: I agree, but the whole set up of the side is reliant on getting Berbatov, still think if is looking that Spurs do not want to sell unless for a ridiculious fee then we need to explore different avenues. We need a striker and if not Berbatov then we need someone else, simple, unless Saha can be fit for a continued perios of time which is unlikely.
August 4th, 2008 at 10:41
Re: Berba – I’m with Stephen and others, Fergie’s comments about Frazier Campbell are just there to reinforce that we don’t ‘need’ him and hopefully make Spurs think they’ll have an unsettled player this year on the bench if they don’t sell. I don’t see it working, personally. The more I think about having Berba, Rooney and Tevez all playing together the more mouth-watering it sounds. Especially having seen Tevez gathering steam this pre-season…he looks truly on form. Let’s hope David Gill is busy this week. I like the look of Campbell and don’t really see a massive difference between him and someone like Walcott – both were pretty tidy in the championship and are lightning fast, but neither has been given a shot at hte big time.
What do you guys think about the RB situation? For me Danny Simpson has been the best at that position during pre-season. Neville, as much as I love him, hasn’t done much to impress, and Brown was never designed to be a RB, though defensively he’s very sure. For the smaller teams I think we need Evra and Simmo bombing up the flanks – even morso if we lack two fit wide players as most have pointed out above. Should be interesting to see if Fergie actually bloods a youth team player this year.
Also, I can’t find anything on Saha – where is he? I didn’t think he was hurt (though I should probably assume he always is until proof of the contrary) and expected to see him in preseason. I’ve not even seen him on the bench?
August 4th, 2008 at 10:51
@Beachryan: I think Saha has broken a nail, so will be out for 19 weeks!!
I think Fergie wants him out, and thats why we have not seen much of him.
With the RB/LB we do have the twins, and maybe they will be brought in gradually this season, pos league cup.
I do think that the Campbell praise is fergie creating a smoke screen for Spurs saying we don’t desperately need him (which we do) but we need to move fast, the community shield is next week, then the season starts, would nice for him to bed in.
We should have a back up, Huntelaar, would be great because the Dippers and Chelsea do look good pre season, and have invested.
We won the EC, on pens and league on the last day, Chelsea have bought well and have now a half decent manager, we have stood still which could be costly.
Robbie Keane and Torres will make Liverpool better, and Arsenal Ok not bought much this season but are always decent and a year on.
August 4th, 2008 at 11:16
@Beachryan: I reckon SAF is holding saha till we get the striker we want (Berba), then he’ll let him go. That’ll give us five strikers, Tevez, Rooney, Berba, Campbell, Manucho. That’s more than enuff options.
As per our defence, we got that covered, cuz the CB’s would play consistently thru the season, with Evans filling in randomly; Simpson, Brown and Gary fightin for the RB position and Evra, Silvestre, O’shea on the left. The key to our tight defence last yr was consistency, and I don’t see that changing this yr.
As per our wide players, I don’t think we have any youth ones left, there are rumours that Fergie might release lee martin to birmingham, so, I reckon he should get a young prodigy, what’s the worst that could happen, he provides us with cover and develops into another ronnie!!!
August 4th, 2008 at 11:47
@ Gabriel – Yeah you’re probably right re: Saha. It still frustrates me, cause on his day he really is a world beater. Just that his day comes as frequently as Feb 29th…
Interesting stuff coming out after Sneijder got crocked (by a very Vieira like tackle from Diaby – coincidentally also escaping a booking or even a whistle) from Real that they now need Ronaldo, I have to agree with them to an extent. If it pushes their hand for a the big bid I’m all for it, dying to get this saga done and dusted. Hell, if he turns into the greatest thing since sliced bread I still won’t care, he doesn’t want to wear the red and so he shouldn’t have to. I just want a lot of green in return
August 4th, 2008 at 11:58
@Beachryan: According to German paper, Bild, Real have now signed van der Vaart. I suppose they were always going to do this, but it probably softens the blow of Scheijder’s injury a bit for the fans. They’ll be looking for one more major deal for their attacking line-up, though.
August 4th, 2008 at 12:00
@Gabriel: Guys! Are you even sure that we are going to GET berbatov? I’m not pretty sure there!
August 4th, 2008 at 12:14
@Beachryan: Madrid can put in wateva bid they want, Utd are still not gonna sell Ronaldo this season. it’s become a matter of pride and power; Real madrid started this smear campaign with the purpose of trying to devalue our double, refute our claim as the richest club in the world by chasing and trying to acquire our star player and also demean the club. United are not gonna take that lightly!! we just won the double – something they haven’t won in ages, if ever- and we are the richest club in the world and the most popular too, so why should we bend over fo our inferiors? People seem to be forgetting we are on top and if our own fans can’t recognise what Real, Blatter are attempting to do, they better wake up.
if ronnie doesn’t want to wear the red shirt, fine. But we let him go on our own terms, after all, he did sign a lucrative 5-yr contract last yr. Where was his ‘dream’ then? if he knew he always wanted to join real, why didn’t he refuse the contract then, so it’ll be easier for him to leave now?
This unfortunate injury to sneijder doesn’t change how things stand from united’s point of view, if anything, it will hasten real madrid’s attempt to capture van der vaart and maybe villa as they have lost their primary playmaker!!
August 4th, 2008 at 12:29
@Red Diablo: We might not get huntelaar, but we’re definitely gettin a player in before the deadline is reached… hopefully
August 4th, 2008 at 12:33
@Gabriel: Fergie wants Berbatov, he won’t go for Huntelaar. I love him to death but he does get very focussed on the player rather than the position. We should have had a back up plan, and go with that if plan A goes, well way of the pear.
We need a target up front, Rooney, Tevez are great but not a classic number 9, which is essential.
August 4th, 2008 at 12:37
@Gabriel: Hopefully? Umm we have been saying that for the past month! @Stephen: I agree Fergie wants Berbatov! I only ask WHEN THE Hell IS HE GONNA GET HIM?
August 4th, 2008 at 12:40
meh, it seems we are a bit lite on the wingers side as well..park and ronaldo are injured which leaves giggs and nani to cover for at least a month which is a bit iffy..but if we do get berbatov we can afford to play rooney left wing..he spends a lot of time there anyways…
and about huntelaar..he hasnt played anywhere else but in the eridivise….he is unproven and hence no guarntee that he would turn out to be a kezman
August 4th, 2008 at 12:43
@RMJ: Oh YEAH! Sacrifice Rooney again! I mean Tevez is faster! Has more dribbles so why not play him their?
August 4th, 2008 at 12:43
When bar Anderson and Nani are our transfers not long winded affairs! Hargo, Rio, Tevez, Rooney, Carrick were all long drawn out sarga’s and we still paid big money, we need Berbatov so just fucking sign him!
August 4th, 2008 at 12:54
@Red Diablo: Actually Rooney would be the faster one over distance. Tevez is faster and more explosive over short distances. However, neither should be deplored as left winger in a 4-4-2, but both could do a decent job in the 4-3-3 supporting Berbatov.
August 4th, 2008 at 12:59
@Stephen: There’s a very good reason why the transfers are long winded affairs. We’re buying the best players off teams that are just below our level. How are they ever to reach our level, when they sell their best players?
In the end, they sell because they have to, but it usually takes time for these clubs to realize this, hence the long time. Obviously, they also want as much money, as they can possibly get, and since it’s Man Utd. buying, they expect big money – and they usually get them as well.
Unfortunately, buying the best can’t be done swiftly, and you’ll probably have to wait another fortnight to see Berbatov here. Eventually he will end up here, though, since he wants to leave and it’s only a matter of reaching an agreement between the clubs.
August 4th, 2008 at 13:02
@Tomas: I think we will play 4-3-3- next season if we get Berbatov, with Rooney and Ronaldo either side of Berbatov and Tevez fighting them both for a place. Hargo, Carrick, Anderson/Scholes in CM, looks good to me, but still the squad a little bare of quality in my view, with back ups in O’Shea, Silvestre, Fletcher and Park.
Anothe fortnight is not ideal as we would have played our first league game by then!
August 4th, 2008 at 13:27
@Stephen: Yeah! We need Berbatov! FAST! The deadline should be right after the coomunity shield!
August 4th, 2008 at 13:39
@Stephen: I think, the tactics of next season will look a lot like the previous. 4-4-2 when playing lesser teams and 4-3-3 against good oppositions in the league and in the CL in general. That’s why we have so many dynamic players, who can play different positions. When Berbatov is signed, we’ll be suited to play in any way needed, and he’ll turn out to be priceless in our campaign, simply because he provides us with new alternatives that we didn’t have last season. His arrival will also keep the other strikers fit and fresh for the entire season. Saha’s injuries are not only a problem in terms of our style being more static – they also mean less rest for some of our key players. Rooney, Ronaldo and Tevez will probably play a little fewer matches (1-5 fewer maybe), and that’s enough to get the best of them the entire season, when they play. This is very good news, and for me the main reason why we need a striker.
We coped well with injuries and suspensions last season with only Rooney and Tevez, but if they have to play the same amount of matches again, they’ll be worn down. That won’t happen with an additional striker. SAF knows this, and that’s why he’s going for Berbatov, who will not only provide cover, but will also add extra dimensions to the play. It’s a very clever signing (when he arrives, hopefully).
To me, the arrival of Berbatov will ensure that we’re still the ones to beat. We are already, of course, but he’ll keep it going for us.
August 4th, 2008 at 14:15
@Stephen: I meant berba, sorry!! huntelaar doesn’t provide the options berba would, but if it became desperate, then i wouldn’t mind him!!!
August 4th, 2008 at 14:32
@Tomas: true, true.. berba does bring in a certain versatility doesn’t he? He can play point man, supporting striker, Forward. He will prove invaluable to our campaign this season (if signed) as he would add that extra dimension and more importantly allow Rooney and Tevez to play their preffered roles(SS) more often. His ability to bring people into play, combined with his majestic first touch is what i’m looking forward to the most. Also, he is tall enuff to head some of the crosses Evra and co whip in, plus he is definitely very clinical in his finishing too.
like you said, this is a very intelligent signing, and fergie knows that; i just hope his mind games work against levy and we get berba as soon as possible, cuz i don’t want him to come when we’re into the season as he’ll be under too much pressure to perform without the luxury of establishing any slight chemistry with his team-mates.
August 4th, 2008 at 14:48
@Gabriel: I think Huntelaar would score more goals than Berbatov, but obviosly does not have his all round game. Berba’s touch and guile is class and The Hunter well just puts the ball in the onion bag. I would ideally love them both with Rooney and Tevez rotating with each player, well I can dream!
August 4th, 2008 at 15:14
@Stephen: we all can dream, mate! but i think Fergie is grooming Campbell to occupy that huntelaar role, we know he has the pace, and he scores wherever he plays, so I think a bit of bulking up, improved positional play and improved finishing – traits ole can teach him – then he and probably manucho would be fighting for that 4th spot soon.
August 4th, 2008 at 15:20
@Gabriel: It will be intersting if Campbell can get a run in the side. This will obviously depend on Berbatov and Ronaldo. I heard the greasy one is back in Manchester tommorrow to force his move through, lets see but if I were him I wouldn’t be packing my bags yet a while.
I do think Fergie is stalling his invitable departure, due to his retirement plans which I understand, but will cause his replacement a few problems.
We do need to sort the Berbatov’s situation out, personalyy I feel sorry for the player, he is in limbo which must be awful for the lad.
August 4th, 2008 at 15:40
@Stephen: berba is not really in limbo, he knows that United are definitely gonna get him. Tottenham are trying to drive a hard bargain and the least he culd do or them is allow them to make as much money from the deal as possible!! Fergie already said it, they put a bid in and were confident of gettin their man, he wouldn’t say that if his mind wasn’t made up already! Money is not an object, but fergie doesn’t want tottenham to think they can get awy with extortion after they did it with carrick two seasons ago!!
the only qualms I have with this is berba will have little or no time to establish any chemistry with his new team-mates before the season begins…
..and Ronaldo’s not goin anywhere, that was decided ages ago!!
August 4th, 2008 at 15:45
@Gabriel: You are more confident than I am mate, I must say!
I think money is a problrm, if not why have we not bought him already? I agree we are trying to get the price down and Spurs the price up but I am worried because he could be the differnce for us next season.
August 4th, 2008 at 16:15
@Stephen: Money is definitely not a problem!! it’s just that ManUtd refuse to be bullied into paying an exaggerated price like we did two yrs ago for carrick and liverpool did recently for keane. Besides, after levy’s rant, there is a bit off a mexican standoff at the mo, but it is obvious berba is not in Ramos’s plans and they need that money to invest in acquiring the players that are in his plans.
So don’t worry mate, berba is gonna scorin and makin assists in front of the stretford end, sooner rather than later!!!
August 4th, 2008 at 16:50
@Gabriel: I don’t think Berba has been in Ramos’s plans since he has arrived, Spurs know he is going but they don’t want to sell him to us!
We must try and get the deal done ASAP, as I would love him to play in the Shield as I am going! but looks unlikely.
I agree there is a stand off and who blinks first looses, but we need to buy him and I think Spurs need to sell, not for the money but for squad harmony, and I think Ramos wants the two Russians, and probably also wants a settled squad.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:03
@bond: What’s being Indian got to do with you posting information on Newcastle Utd on a Manchester Utd blog? It’s not like we would even care if Newcastle Utd ceased to exist tomorrow. JEEZ!
August 4th, 2008 at 17:08
@Beachryan: YUP! I said it yesterday. I think this may force Real to finally make a formal bid for Ronaldo after tomorrows verdict in the Fergie/Ronaldo meeting. And sorry but 68 million is not enough. If they want him so bad it will take 70 million and Sergio Ramos. Why should we knuckle down to them. We are not the desperate ones all of a sudden. Although they will sign van der Vaart which will ease their pain considerably.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:14
@Gabriel: What exactly is “on our own terms” mean? Remember, Fergie said he is not for sale AT ANY PRICE. For Fergie to buckle down and sell him would make him a bull shit artist and a hypocrite. He is making a stand (that I do and do not agree with) and I don’t see all the profits from the China Olympics changing his mind. And if the Glazer’s step in and agree to the deal, you will also see the departure of Fergie along with Ronaldo. It’s just not going to happen although I would love to see the last of Ronaldo in Man Utd red. I’m still convinced if we keep him he will be a cancer in the dressing room and I seriously doubt his immaturity will allow him to give his all for the team no matter how dedicated he is to being the best. If he doesn’t move to Real, in many ways his spirit and his heart will be broken. Do we want that playing for us? I think not.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:15
the da silva twin are in tonight squad.hopefully they will play.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:16
http://www.myp2p.eu/broadcast.php?matchid=16097&part=sports link
for the game tonight
August 4th, 2008 at 17:17
@Grognard: I think the are too scared to bid as like us I think they are skint!
They are trying for us/Ronaldo to fall out so they can try and get him on the well er cheap. Fergie knows this hence he has been talking up Ronaldo, saying there is no problem between him and the club.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:19
@bond @Stephen and @Grognard:
Bond, while I don’t get the point of you posting that excerpt on Newcastle (unless of course you want to discuss about the takeover as such — which you haven’t because you just copy pasted stuff), you are free to post anything here. As long as it’s footy related (well actually even non-footy related stuff can be posted and has been posted on here before.)
And Grogs, I don’t think I’ve made rules on what not to post here as long as there is no personal attack. I’ve allowed freestyle ranting here… from even discussing movies, to games to lcd projection tvs to general football. So I am really confused about the eye rolling. Were you offended?
August 4th, 2008 at 17:22
Madrid signed Van der vaart for £8m
That’s a steal if you ask me.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:23
@Stephen:
I think the are too scared to bid as like us I think they are skint!
You actually buy the theory that we’re broke?
August 4th, 2008 at 17:24
@Tomas: This thing about tactics and formations is actually very silly. In50 odd games Fergie will utilize anywhere to from 4 to 6 different kinds of formation depending on his team’s injury concerns and the quality and style of the opposition. I for one don’t concern myself with such trivialities as I find them meaningless over such a long and drawn out season. He has a large squad and many options before him. Lets just wait to see what kind of formations we play rather than trying to predict the impossible. Formations in a season under Fergie remind me of cloud patterns on a slightly overcast day. They are constantly moving and changing.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:25
@Red Ranter: Er why was I mentioned RR?
August 4th, 2008 at 17:27
@Grognard:
LOL… i was thinkin the same thing when I read his post.. was a bit of a weird one, so I jus left it alone 
August 4th, 2008 at 17:31
@Red Ranter: I don’t think its a theory it is fact. We are in debt, and I know its manageable, but surely we can’t keep spending massive money every season, we posted was it £59.9m profit this year and I am sure next year it will be higher, but I think the spending will be slow down at best. Season ticket prices are rising, it is a shrewd move by the Glazers who bought the club and shifted the liabilities back to the fans.
They are servicing the interest payments comfortably now but if the club hits a sticky patch and lose out on the titles, the picture will not be so rosy. As far as I am concerned, It is still a shaky financial situation for me.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:38
Simpson has gone to Blackburn on loan for a year, good move for him and us, will be intersting to see how he gets on.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:38
@Stephen: Yes, but we’re not skint as you put it.@Stephen: Because you “er-ed”
And about that, it was just a word of advice, not a dressing down.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:40
@Grognard:
Formations in a season under Fergie remind me of cloud patterns on a slightly overcast day. They are constantly moving and changing.
Well put.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:40
@Red Ranter: No I wasn’t offended at all. I rolled my eyes out of confusion or just trying to figure out the relevance? It’s not like any of us here care about Newcastle’s history. That’s why I also used the question mark smirk smiley as well. We may talk about a lot of topics here that aren’t always about United but we rarely offer a history lesson on another EPL team now do we. It just seemed really strange and completely out of place. And forgive me for not understanding his first comment about Indian. What on Earth that had to do with anything and for his reasons is besides me. I was just baffled and confused by it.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:41
@Grognard: “on our own terms”. I meant when he was provin more of a hindrance to the team as opposed to an aid/advantage. if like you speculated, his spirit was broken and he became a cancer to the dressing room, obviously then ManUtd would let him go like they did former players who did the same. As of right now, he’s not going, and if he was to go, it will be if and when we want him to, just like Heinze, Ruud and Becks!!!
August 4th, 2008 at 17:45
@Stephen: I agree 100%. They made a profit this year but if they don’t progress as far in Europe this year that profit will go out the window. If we don’t win trophies for a season or two things could get very tense indeed. All the more reason to sell Ronaldo and buy three or four player to add quality to the team in depth. I for one would be more than happy to get Ramos and have the money to buy a Sanchez and a Huntelaar while letting Ronaldo go. But that’s just me. I’m sure others don’t agree and that’s fine too.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:46
@Red Ranter: I was a little confused with the comment and its relavance.
August 4th, 2008 at 17:51
@Grognard: I think people have to understand that, when Fergies leaves in two or so years time we have to bring in a new manager. We have no idea who that could be, and if he does a bad job, and we don’t win anything for a period of time then we could have problems.
If we fall out of the top four, I know currently that is very unlikely and no Champions league football that could be very costly, I am not saying now but if the new manager finds taking over in Fergies shadow too much and the club slides like Leeds, fiancially we could be in trouble.
August 4th, 2008 at 18:22
VDV for UKP 10m!!!!!
And we have had prices like 18m for Barry, 18m for Carrick & 20m for Keane!!! how ridiculous really!
How the hell are Real so lucky!!!!
August 4th, 2008 at 18:35
@grog-Just as u get excited when we talk abt German fotball / Canadian Sports, I cudnt stop myself from posting it..as simple as that… India is a country where cricket is everything and if somebdy like Ambani takes over Newcastle , then this cricket craze will gradually comedown and football will start getting more attention…
@redranter-thanks for ur comments…i was tooo excited after readin tat..and since it was from a locla news paper ,thought of sharing the info wid everyone here…
August 4th, 2008 at 19:31
@Stephen: I totally agree. Sometimes the team acts like it’s mindset is designed around Ferguson being around forever.
August 4th, 2008 at 19:39
@bond: Mate I had no idea what you were talking about nor do I know what cricket has to do with any of this? I wasn’t trying to be rude. I was just confused regarding the relevance to what we were talking about and the relevance regarding Man Utd? If there is an increased popularity for the sport in India because one millionaire from that country owns a sad side like Newcastle, all the power to you. Trust me when I say if a Canadian bought Newcastle no Canadians would really give a damn. It’s not like India owns Newcastle, it’s one millionaire. Much ado about nothing I’m afraid. Still, if that makes you happy and makes you and others optimistic about the game’s popularity in your homeland, I certainly wish you luck and I hope it does well. But it will never supplant cricket as #1.
August 4th, 2008 at 19:43
@Grognard: I disagree that formations shouldn’t be an issue. They always are. I did write, if you read my whole comment, that our system is very interchangeable, and it always will be with our type of players, who never stand still.
But the formation is especially important for the midfield constellation, because it shows our attitude to the game. And last season he played either with 2 or 3 central midfielders, depending on the type of game and opposition.
So the formations tells a lot about our attitude, and I’d never disregard that.
My point was also that with Berbatov, SAF can now use either formation to its full extend, because the squad will be better equipped to do so.
August 4th, 2008 at 19:53
http://fr.justin.tv/mstv3 this is the link to watch the game tonight.it will start at 8.1 of the twins is playing the RB
August 4th, 2008 at 22:26
@ebrahim: Wow THOSE twins are THE BOMB! I dont think we need a Daniel Alves! I would really like that Fergie like Neville and scholes and giggs gives these two twins a chance! Atleast the Right one! Raphael that is! I mean he looked like an Evra playing on the right! And his defending wasnt that bad either!
August 4th, 2008 at 22:58
@Tomas: What on Earth is a midfield constellation?
Formations are important. What I was saying is that United do not use just one formation and so trying to guess what formation they will use for the season is kind of useless, don’t you think? And yes a formation says a lot about our attitude. All the more reason for Fergie to alter formation from game to game so that teams do not clue in on our way of thinking and our approach to a game. But 4-5-1 does not mean defensive, as we are more than capable of using our flanks like no other team and making a 4-5-1 look more like a 4-3-3. Formations are important but strategy and tactics used in unison with formations is the real key, along with players form and desire.
August 4th, 2008 at 23:04
@Red Diablo: The twins look good but Rafael although he attacked well and showed good ball skills seemed to react slowly to changes of possession and in the EPL he would find himself exposed and out of position unless he learns to hustle and get back to defend. When he did find himself back to defend, he did a good job and he seemed composed. They are both so young though and they have lots to learn. I do wish they were a tad taller too. And yes, we don’t need an Alves in two years time, that’s for sure. For now though we will make do with the more than capable Wes Brown.
August 5th, 2008 at 2:11
we desperately need a striker.(not sure bout huntelaar)
if ronaldo rely wants t go, fuck him, dares no point havin d whingy prick in d team if goes away sulking 4 a season.
cant see nev gettin back in d team ova brown, he was top class last year.
v.worried bout chelski(deco robihno??)
August 5th, 2008 at 4:43
Manchester United >> Real Madrid.
We should NOT allow them to even think they are a great club and on par with us.
We should spit on their offers and laugh at their failures.
We should not accept their money as they are tainted with inferiority
Hold your noses high and accept that they are jealous of our success!
Remember, there are ENORMOUS amount of money in commercialization of football teams. Look at the frequent trips top european teams take to USA, China, India, and Africa. This is to grow “fan” (ahem, money) bases.
If Utd had been “allowed” to fanfare their amazing double across England and the world, the remaining clubs would lose momentum in those regions and that means lost money. Hence, Madrid bastards make sure that ALL the news is about “problems” and a single player (no mentioning of the team).
NEVER let us allow ANYONE to push us around! We are United!
Glory Glory Man United!
PS: Ferguson is completely right in 99% of what he does (signing Veron!) – the man is GENIUS! Look at how he sacrificed games at end of this season to win both league and CL! GENIOUS!
August 5th, 2008 at 4:59
btw: Veron was in the 1% of mistakes that Ferguson commits…