Dec 13
Tottenham v Manchester United – Match Thread
According to my watch, Manchester United take on Tottenham Hotspur at White Hart Lane in about 4.5 hours. I imagine there’s plenty of people here looking to sound off pre and post match, so I’ll stay out of the way after a few links to keep you good company:
- If you can’t watch the game (stream or on tv), you can follow the live blog with Victor here.
- Brian Kingston has written an obituary on Gary Neville’s career (I repeat, his career, not the man himself) – it’s a good read but I wonder if Nev will know when to call it quits considering that the time came and went at the end of last season…
- Looking beyond Tottenham, Al Ahly lost to Pachuca 2-4, so there’s one potential Club World Cup opponent out of the picture.
- No news yet on whether Carrick, Ferdinand or Berbatov will play, although Ronnie is supposed to make an appearance and our troublesome twosome Rooney and Evra will be sitting out due to suspensions. It’s why we have these ’squad players’, you know…
Alright then, my prediction for the game: Tottenham 1-1 United. Over to you.
Related items from Red Rants:- Man Utd v Spurs match thread
- Aston Villa v Manchester United: Preview/Match thread
- United on Top of the league, for now
- Man Utd v QPR: Preview
- Man Utd v Stoke: Preview
Tags: Game Preview
December 13th, 2008 at 14:14
At what time is the match aired??
December 13th, 2008 at 14:25
@Despicable: at 17:30 GMT
Live streams
Glory, glory Man United
December 13th, 2008 at 14:29
Pachuca won the Copa Lib beating Fluminese on penalties so they will be no pushovers. However my hope is that we leave players such as Ronaldo, Berbatov, Carrick and other players who have been struggling with injuries.
I bet Fergie will start with Ronaldo today which is a shame because I really think Ronaldo needs a few weeks off until his injury problems are well and truly behind him.
December 13th, 2008 at 14:31
big game today lads….kinda nervous again
Team should be
VDS
Rafa Rio Vidic Oshea
Fletcher……..Carrick if fit
Nani Anderson Ronaldo
Tevez………. Berbatov if fit…i think!!??
Dont fuck around now Fergie!
December 13th, 2008 at 14:43
I worry that G.Nev (r.i.p) will start. With O’shea bound to start on the left we can’t afford to have no pace at the fullback positions. With that in mind it means Park instead of Nani. Berbatov and Carrick will be fit. I hope Anderson starts to combat the physical presence of Jenas or HUddlestone, and to keep Modric out of the game.
VDS
NEV RIO VIDA SHEA
PARK CARRICK ANDERSON RON
TEVEZ BERBA
Although I’d rather have nani and rafa on and go for it. I wouldn’t be too surprised if Giggs starts instead of ronaldo or berba if not deemed fit.
December 13th, 2008 at 14:47
i am worried about this game, we may struggle but i have a sneaky feeling an own goal may decide things
December 13th, 2008 at 14:48
@Despicable: it’s a 5:30 kick off
December 13th, 2008 at 15:13
C’mon Tevez, this is the stuff you are made for! 2-0 to us
December 13th, 2008 at 15:20
Match links please
December 13th, 2008 at 15:44
arsenal draw AGAIN omg~
December 13th, 2008 at 15:50
Its official now, Arsenal are out of the league race…cant win anything with babies. ComeOn you reds, lets give Levy a lesson or two
December 13th, 2008 at 16:06
arsenal were out of it a long time ago
December 13th, 2008 at 16:08
Let’s not get ahead of ourselves here. A loss or a draw today will virtually see us out of the title race too.
December 13th, 2008 at 16:40
Afternoon Chaps and Chapettes.
Hope you’re all well. I have one of ‘those’ feelings about todays game; I just hope I’m wrong although it seems I’m not the only one a tad cautious.
Not sure on the starting 11 as yet but do have a stream for y’all.
In-browser too; http://www.atdhe.net/live-tv-1431.html
Peas out for now, there’s a right game going on at Anfield at the mo!
December 13th, 2008 at 16:43
Im back! Thanks to Ahmed Bilal for fixing this site problem of getting another artcile. Im not gonna blame RedRanter because I can understand if he is busy. But it would be nice to hear if he is alive or not.
So we play Spurs tonight… Hmm, a happy hunting ground for us in the past. Except for last seasons 1-1 draw we won 6 games in a row there. Scoring 16 goals. Spurs have played better lately, much because of Harry Redknapp. But also because of young Frazier Campbell. He has done brilliantly and his movement, vision and finishing has helped Spurs a lot. I hope he doesnt stay there for more than this season as he looks like the brightest prospect in English football since Wayne Rooney. You go on Fraiz! Oh, and thankfully he wont play today as he is out on loan from us. That will do us good.
How the hell can that happen, I dont know. But we must be much more clinical and have more speed in our build up. Message to striker: YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO SCORE, NOT PASS!!! 
Jeeez! We wont get many chances tonight so it is important that we use those chances we get. If not, it will be a long, long, long Christmas. Scholes is not fit enough to start a game, so Fergie will use him as a sub. With Carrick being a doubt for tonight, I hope(for the teams, and his own, sake) that Anderson starts. He has been our best player lately, and like last seaosn, plays like the best there are when full of confidence. If he si benched tonight, I will personally fly to Manchester and kick Fergies arse. 
If he honestly doesnt start I am convinced he is blind or suffers from age. 
Ronaldo, Rio, Carrick and Berba are all doubts, Rooney and Evra are suspended and we already have Brown, Hargo and Welbeck on the sidelines. This wont be easy for us…
United have dominated most of the games they have played lately. In our last two games our possesion in the end is on an average of 82%. And we only scored 3 goals.
Team prediction:
VDS
Rafael Evans Vidic Oshea
Park Fletcher Anderson Ronaldo(if there is just 1% chance of him being fit, we know he is gonna start)
Tevez Berbatov
Score prediction: 2-0 to United. If we get an early goal I can see us scoring 4-5 goals, but if not then it will be a close affair and we will score on a defelction and a counter attack. Tevez and Berbatov to score.
COME ON YOU REDS!!!
December 13th, 2008 at 16:44
Question. Why is my comment awaiting moderation?
December 13th, 2008 at 17:07
Come on tottenham come on tottenham lets be aving theses northerners
December 13th, 2008 at 17:11
Major butterflies building up to tonights game, has anybody heard of a poss starting line up as yet?
Fingers crossed for an Anderson masterclass tonight!
December 13th, 2008 at 17:16
@m34ch: @m34ch: im keeping mine crossed too, i would like to see nothing more than a classic andershow
December 13th, 2008 at 17:33
A must win today at White Fart Lane. Ask yourselves this question; When was the last time United played an excellent away match against a decent opponent and actually scored three goals or more? Hopefully in three hours you can give the answer as today. But I doubt it. With one striker suspended and the other injured, with Ronaldo hurting and Evra out, it doesn’t look good. Hell all we need to make things complete is for Fergie to start Neville and Park. Sorry for this lads but my prediction today is Manchester Utd 0 @ Tottenham 1. Now it’s up to Fergie to prove me wrong and throw egg in my face.
That’s a bold prediction but I’ll go with it. Chances are the game will end 1-1 or even 0-0 but I have gut feeling Spurs want this one because of the Berbatov loss.
December 13th, 2008 at 17:37
@Mr.Muhozi: I saw his English interview on MUTV yesterday and he really does sound like he’s loving life in Manchester; I hope a goal will act as the catalyst for the lad – because he is awesome. Im also fond of Nani but SAF doesn’t seem to be, I can see Park playing again today – he at least offers some defensive qualities.
Any news on the teams yet anybody? Per chance?
Come on the lads!
December 13th, 2008 at 17:41
thanks ahmed for the update and the porn. That made me chuckle, a lot…
December 13th, 2008 at 17:47
team news?
December 13th, 2008 at 17:52
3 more mins.. come on Hull
December 13th, 2008 at 17:57
Well done Hull!
December 13th, 2008 at 17:59
for a change i think starting park was a good idea, he’ll be up against lennon whos in the form of his life.
bentley doesn’t scare me in the slightest…
December 13th, 2008 at 18:00
Park over Nani again!!! that too at WHL
Nani is gone guys…
December 13th, 2008 at 18:03
@jos: we’ll get creativity from rafa.
its like our winger starting at rightback, and our rightback starting on the wing.
December 13th, 2008 at 18:04
Team news:
GK: VDS
RB: Rafael
CB: Rio
CB: Vidic
LB: Evra
RDM: Park
CM: Carrick
CM: Fletcher
LW: Ronaldo
ST: Tevez
ST: Berbatov
subs: PIG, Evans, Neville, Anderson, Scholes, Giggs, Nani
Where is Fergie?! Im on my way to Manchester!
How dare you bench Andy after the perfomances lately. If we lose, I will blame it on Fergie for not starting Anderson. 
Shy cant he see that the way to break Spurs down is speed?! Middle of the field, wingers and up front. We need pacey players! Instead of Nani: Park. Instead of Anderson: Fletcher. Its a disgrace! Not so optimistic anymore, Fergie really has made a mess of this.
December 13th, 2008 at 18:05
Well done Hull. Pool are a joke…
December 13th, 2008 at 18:07
Evra??
December 13th, 2008 at 18:07
@RedDevilEddy: Relax man. Spurs are a good side and at home and will be fired up for it. It wouldn’t be that wise to go 100% attack at them…And, this way, if things are going badly we have offensive changes on the bench available. With your suggestions, what would we do in the second half to change things if its 0-0? Bring on Park for Nani? Bring on Fletch for Anderson? That doesn’t make much sense now does it….
December 13th, 2008 at 18:10
AND if I’m not mistaken, whats the goal count again this year for Fletch and Anderson….
December 13th, 2008 at 18:11
@mike: 5 yellow cards, banned.
December 13th, 2008 at 18:13
@Drew Vader: drew, its not all about goals, anderson, is a much, much better player then fletcher. Fletcher has only found form last year and hes 24.
December 13th, 2008 at 18:18
@Drew Vader: Good Call Drew, plus Nani is allergic to his own half – Park will at least track back. And like you said, Nani can come on and change a game, Park on the otherhand, not as much an impact. Gutted there’s no Anderson though. Still, same logic applies; we might see him come on and rock it!
Come on the lads!
December 13th, 2008 at 18:22
@dan(u-ol): i know,but evra is in the team sheet u just put?
December 13th, 2008 at 18:22
redevileddy just put***
December 13th, 2008 at 18:31
Hey guys isn’t it ironic. 2 years ago I watched a great game between Hammers and Spurs. There were 2 heros in that game in Berba and Tevez and who would have though that within 2 years these 2 players will be in our team. I hope we have a good game and win it, cause we all know how much we need it.
December 13th, 2008 at 18:32
@dan(u-ol): Who cares how old he is when he found his form? Its about right now and winning today, 12/13/08. And Fletch has been outstanding this year. I like Anderson also, don’t get me wrong, but I could say he has just only found his “form” the last two games…
December 13th, 2008 at 18:33
@Orez: I loved Carlitos celebration in that game. Thats classic stuff…
December 13th, 2008 at 18:37
Plus one for fergie for starting rafael, but minus 1 for dropping nani and minus 5 for dropping Andy.
Anyone who condones Fergie dropping Anderson hasnt been watching the matches. The fact that even Grognard came around to Andy speaks volumes to how the kid has been playing. And what kind of message does that send to Anderson that form alone wont keep in you in the team. I fear this might be my last straw with Fergie. At this point I hope Anderson,Nani, and Tevez move on after this year, cause they dont deserve this mickey mouse bullshit.
I Have tried to be patient with Fergie but I just cant do it anymore. He will have to prove me wrong by the end of the to regain my trust in his judgement.
December 13th, 2008 at 18:37
park taking corners!!!
December 13th, 2008 at 18:38
park taking corners is so lol
December 13th, 2008 at 18:43
@Drew Vader: I think your missing the point of “form”. It makes no sense to bench the in form player, in favor of a player who “was” in form earlier in the year. Plus Anderson has the potential to be great while fletcher has the potential to be a squad player like Oshea. So in my book I would prefer the potential if they are at the moment comparable in ability.
December 13th, 2008 at 18:51
@m34ch: i saw that interview too, half the time it seemed he did not know what he was talking about, but at least he is learning english quite quickly, i just hope he can get a run of games, his form has been great yet fergie seems to prefer to play players he likes over players who are better, park over nani anyone?
December 13th, 2008 at 18:52
Park’s feet, is the place that attacking plays go to die.
December 13th, 2008 at 19:03
@johnsom33: the player will be such a great defensive midfielder if he had some bulk on him, otherwise he pretty useless
great saves by edwin, we need to win back the midfield and everyone on this board barring drew knows what is needed
December 13th, 2008 at 19:05
this is one boring game where’s our drive we need our wingers to do some running and will someone shoot on target….
December 13th, 2008 at 19:12
not a sigle shot……..not even off target
this team needs rooney…..at least he will create something, if not score.
anderson and scholes should come as soon as second half starts
December 13th, 2008 at 19:14
anyone have a working link
December 13th, 2008 at 19:17
guande ramos has got to be the worst manager ever!!! How did he manage to take this spurs team to the bottom of the table???
December 13th, 2008 at 19:21
can anyone cross the ball correctly !
December 13th, 2008 at 19:22
i have no words for this team bring on anderson
December 13th, 2008 at 19:25
im blaming our poor performance on fletcher. he has lost his form and brings nothing to our midfield. andy needs to start now.
this isnt a reaction, i have noticed this for about the last month and this game has all but confirmed it.
Berba-tev partnership really isnt working, both being played out of postion.
December 13th, 2008 at 19:27
Anyone think we miss Rooney and Evra like hell! We’re playing like Chelsea!
December 13th, 2008 at 19:27
my link is dodgy at best. I saw the first 12 minutes, and the last 3 minutes
December 13th, 2008 at 19:28
@jononotbono:http://www.iraqgoals.com/en/ch2.html
December 13th, 2008 at 19:28
Our creativity is very low. I think team figure out an easier way to close Ronaldo. I am also very disappointed by Berba’s game and not because he can’t get to crosses, but because he just doesn’t look like a striker at all. I mean 45 min and not a single shot? He is very low on confidence and courage. I hope they will have more of it in the 2nd half.
December 13th, 2008 at 19:29
@johnsom33: Quality!
Only problem is Park doesn’t have feet. They are stumps. Park is a useless wanker.
December 13th, 2008 at 19:30
@Orez: maybe he should start playing his natural postion, instead of behind the striker!
not his fault Rudolph plays him there.
December 13th, 2008 at 19:32
@Grognard: LOL
December 13th, 2008 at 19:32
Why oshea plays for man utd?why fletch is playing instead of andy?i can understand SAF picks park to protect rafael.what i dont understand is why anyone doesnt shoot?i dont remember the last time i saw united create clearcut chance
December 13th, 2008 at 19:32
@dan(u-ol): Havta agree on Fletch… Carrick is still our best midfield passer barring an in form Scholes. Fletch’s copntribution has been limited…
Also I know that many of you (Craig first) can’t stand Rooney and especially his inability to convert chances. But the fact is that when he plays , we get twic as many chances to score, such is his influence.
One more thing: Ronaldo… Passing??? :
December 13th, 2008 at 19:35
juan Sebastian berbatov
dimitar veron
or am i being to rash and haste
December 13th, 2008 at 19:35
this is the opportunity to close the gap with liverpool and chelsea i get the feeling zola will play a 442 like he did against liverpool and i’ll think that’ll be a draw so a win here is a must change scholes for fletcher or andy for flethcher i think this is the game where nani would be good he’s got pace and he’s been good in the last couple of games…
December 13th, 2008 at 19:36
Purely DISGUSTING.
Fergie should be shot. This team has no idea what they are doing. How Fletcher can be starting over the in form Anderson is beyond me. We have no energy or drive whatsoever. Do you think Andy would offer us some of that. Where is this team’s heart? Why do they continually play Berbatov so high up. Hell even Cantona never played this high up. Ronaldo is extremely quiet and almost looks disinterested. I don’t think it’s an attitude problem. I honestly think he is fighting injuries that have added up on him. Fletcher and Carrick are like watching a couple of old woman take a stroll in Hyde Park. Rafael has looked to cross the ball a few times but nobody but nobody was in the box. Tevez and Berba do not have the ESP to play together yet. We are really missing Rooney’s desire and pace out there. Fuck I really hate the way we are playing this season. I’m so fucking bored I feel like turning of the the tele and just finish reading some book. I don’t need this boredom in my life. What a colossal waste of time. RUBBISH! 
December 13th, 2008 at 19:37
@Mr.Muhozi: I think you are being rash. He hasn’t been great but most of the problem is not due to him. Lack of support and pace by our team is playing right into Spurs hands.
December 13th, 2008 at 19:38
@antsBoy: exactly….we are chelsea in disguise, i just hope we get a mechanical win like them…
December 13th, 2008 at 19:42
something i noticed about ronaldo everytime he get’s the ball he passes it straight off to another united player doesn’t look like he’s willing run much…
December 13th, 2008 at 19:46
that is not a handball
December 13th, 2008 at 19:47
nice ref
December 13th, 2008 at 19:48
@Viz: Exactly! He seems uninterested.
December 13th, 2008 at 19:48
@Mr.Muhozi: Not too sure myself……….
December 13th, 2008 at 19:50
Does anybody also agree that with Berba in the side our counter attacking game is non existant!
December 13th, 2008 at 19:56
if fergie thinks this game needs giggs, then he should start negotiations over a retirement plan
December 13th, 2008 at 19:59
@Mr.Muhozi: Well said mate. They need a kick in the ass more than they need Giggs. I’d bring in Nani and Anderson 10 minutes ago.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:00
@edwin: the ball bounced into him he at no point purposely controlled the ball with his hands, i have seen that happen so many times and its never called, but when ronaldo and united do it, it is a foul
December 13th, 2008 at 20:00
Ahmed; Why is my comment #66 awaiting moderation? I threw a few f bombs in there but since when is that a crime?
December 13th, 2008 at 20:00
great lets slow down the tempo even further with giggs and scholes
TEVEZ is tevez injured of something, thank god im going to miss 7 more matches of this because of a holiday, its just pathetic
December 13th, 2008 at 20:04
@Grognard: i would have bought anderson and nani in the starting line up let alone 10 minutes ago
December 13th, 2008 at 20:05
@Mr.Muhozi: Great point. As if I needed reminding.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:06
OH RIO!!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:07
Say whatever you like, the truth is that Spurs are totally outplayed.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:10
sad thing is, we’re making gomez look good
December 13th, 2008 at 20:12
our corner to goal ratio has to be the lowest in the league!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:13
@Grognard: mate save your f bombs for tonights WOGs lord knows you will need them
December 13th, 2008 at 20:13
wtf we cant simply score!!!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:14
Everybody saw you, Cristiano!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:14
@bildani: if i remember correctly our shot to goal ratio is one of the worst in the champions league this season
December 13th, 2008 at 20:15
apologies to park. at least he is trying…
the likes of Bertaflop and Ronaldo arent even doing that
December 13th, 2008 at 20:18
where is nani
December 13th, 2008 at 20:19
@gator: i believe he is on the bench dreaming of warm weather whilst his agents finds a spanish team who will actually use his talents unlike a certain legendary gaffer
December 13th, 2008 at 20:23
fuuuuuuuuuuck
December 13th, 2008 at 20:24
get the fuck in
December 13th, 2008 at 20:25
Oh, come on! Where’s the good (or should I say “bad”) old Gomez?
December 13th, 2008 at 20:25
how did he save that?!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:26
Ah well, only luck prevented us from winning that. On to Japan!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:26
bullshit fucking 1 nill but for a shite ref
December 13th, 2008 at 20:27
park it and kick us and well lay down
December 13th, 2008 at 20:28
@Mr.Muhozi: I agree but I was making the comment well into the second half.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:28
Giggs has done fuck all since he came on. Atrocious substitution to say the least
December 13th, 2008 at 20:28
fucking BULLSHIT
December 13th, 2008 at 20:29
@Drew Vader: Do you still stand by Fergusons for snubbing Anderson today?
December 13th, 2008 at 20:29
fergi looked like a jackass
fucking smiling and dancing for the crowd fucking put in another sub or yell at someone
December 13th, 2008 at 20:30
what are the odds that Gomez starts to look a like a goalkeeper as soon as we arrive? Bringing Giggs on.. that worked well. It seems he doesn’t even have a first touch anymore.
It’s not the chance of catching Liverpool that has slipped (we’ll get them before the season’s out no worries) It’s Chelsea who we need to be watching, and they can go 2 more clear if they win tomorrow. which they will.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:31
Not a good result, but I have to say we played way better after the subs and had some good moments and didn’t give Spurs anything. They played good too, that’s why don’t want to single out anyone for blame. This is officially finishes our away schedule for the season.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:32
A few conclusions from the match:
1. Berbawhore is a worthless peice of shit
2. Fergie needs to talk to a shrink
3. United are duller than Hull City with the current formation
more later when I can think straight
December 13th, 2008 at 20:33
like every team we face now plays like that
December 13th, 2008 at 20:33
@Mr.Muhozi: Sorry to disappoint you mate but there is going to be no WOG tonight. I’m so fed up and disgusted in this cowardly lion that calls itself United that I am going to give myself a break. Besides, if I started with a WOG, it may be several pages long and so filled with rage and negativity, I am deciding to spare all of you. Frankly, it’s not worth it anymore. Fergie does what he wants and he has created an Italian hybrid of boring and useless proportions. I’m fed up and I’ve had enough. I’ll leave to you and others to offer some tirades. All I know is yet another golden opportunity blown to gain on the leaders.
This team should now be called Devils Without a Clue.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:35
I will tell u all something, it is not berbs fault he is playing crap it is completely the managements fault cos they r playing him out of position. How come for bulgaria, leverkusen, and spurs he leads the line and then he leads the line for us against liverpool all that time ago and since then he has been playing so far back like a midfielder. It is becos the management team were getting boners over his creativity skills and thought we should play him as a link between the mid and forwards and leave tevez or rooney to lead the line. What f***ing bollocks. Play him as the top man and he will score plenty.
Also where the hell do our goals come from in the midfield. Park is defensive, fletcher is defensive and carrick does not bomb forward neither. Where is our ashley young, or gerrard/lampard who can grap the game by the neck and score when the forwards are having an off day. Its just ronaldo that all. F**king crap tactics if u ask me. And as for ronaldo, he aint interested in us no more, hes won his awards ALL FOR HIM, and thats it for him. Why is he anonomous in a game against a poor spurs side. Best player in the world ha, watch tonights game against madrid and see the real best player. This aint an over reaction just tell me why he aint doing it this season when he was last year and dont say its cos of his injury cos messi looked excellent against us when he returned from injury straight away. Yes he still scores against the stokes of this world but the worst bit of business fergie did was keep a player who lost his interest rather than replace him with a player who hasnt achieved it yet and will strive to get to that stage. Right now he is starting 2 remind me of ronaldinho and henry at the end of their careers with arsenal and barca. They won it, now thats it. Rant over.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:35
@gator: It was a hand ball whether you or others want to admit it. Unintentional but still a hand ball. Talk about bias.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:35
I think Berbatov actually played well during the 2nd half..He looked up for it, though he had to track back and create chances, something that we usually depend on Rooney to do (and then slate him if he is unsucessful). Bottomline of today’s performance: we’ve lost our ability of creating clear-cut chances. It’s been a bloody month (Stoke 5-0) since I saw us actually look “dangerous”. We’re huffing and puffing right now to draw or barely win matches. Something is really wrong I say!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:36
No need to despair, Harrys a master at stunting united’s game, at least now well pick up these lost points against pompey and drop em at spurs. its just swings and roundabouts
December 13th, 2008 at 20:37
I cant fight it anymore, Grognard Dark forces are impossible to resist. I hate to admit, but I think he is right about Fergie. I just dont think he is up to it anymore. I will gladly eat each and every one of my words at the end of the season, but Im just not seeing.
The thing that hurts the most is that he is not only throwing away this season but he is also pissing away future seasons by not developing his promising youngsters. Nani is for the off this summer without a doubt, he is way to talented to be playing behind that talentless wonder Some of you refer to as JS Park. Playing Scholes over Andy? I can live with that, atleast Scholes is a legend. But benching Andy after really comming on to a game in favore of the out of form Fletcher just baffles me.
Speaking of baffling, why the hell did Tevez come off? Park should have come off, Tevez is still a better winger than Park. I am starting to think Park has photos of Fergie walking into a gay bar or something, because I cant remember the last time I saw park actually justify his spot in the squad.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:38
@Matthew:
Mate Ronaldo had a decent game. He did move the ball around quickly and had some nice touches, nearly set up a goal several times. I strongly think he is carrying an injury and has thus lost a lot of pace.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:39
@antsBoy:
He had a good game?????????/
What good is a fucking striker if he cant head a ball, cant be bothered to go into the box at all?????
December 13th, 2008 at 20:40
@gator: Ah excuse me, Fergie is jackass. It’s time we all started to come to the conclusion that Fergie is well past it and it was Queiroz that kept this team up the last few seasons. He has no clue of what to do tactically and technically. The same style of play every bloody week and the most mysterious substitutions in world football. I would revel against this man if I had played for him. He punishes good play and rewards mediocrity. Where was Anderson and Nani? The team needs energy and drive and he brings in Giggs and Scholes. God give me strength. I’m sorry but I refuse to support the Boss when he is clearly not at the top of his own game. What the Hell is he thinking. A drunken bastard in the stands could make smarter decisions than him.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:41
@Vivek: I agree, Ronaldo was not anonymous this game. Whenn ever he fails to score people akways assume he was rubbish and that(insert full back) had him in his pocket. Im afraid Ronnie has set the bar so high, that anyless less than breathtaking is considered a flop.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:43
@Grognard: “He punishes good play and rewards mediocrity.”
Well put. Thank you and goodnight everyone.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:43
@Vivek: Berbatov did play well in the second half. Its not like he isn’t bothered to get into the box, did hold up the ball well and distributed it well. Seriously which game were you watching?
December 13th, 2008 at 20:43
@Grognard: Yeah Fergie is past is alright, he should be sent to the stands and be shot
December 13th, 2008 at 20:45
@elsammio99: If Harry is a master at stunting United’s game, does that mean Fergie is an idiot for not knowing how to stunt Spurs game? Personally I give less credit to Harry and more criticism to Fergie. We are total shite and it’s not getting better. Oh but there will be the optimists who will say Yippee, we got a well earned point. All I can say is how many of us have become so conditioned to settle with garbage.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:46
AAAAAAARRRRRRRRRHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!
I CAN’T TAKE THIS SHIT NO MORE…I FEEL I WANT TO SLIT MY WRISTS OR THROAT OR SOMETHING!
We only started playing in the last 10 minutes (panic mode) and by then I were already too frustrated!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:47
@RDJ:
What game were you watching?????He holds the ball up – that is one of the major reasons we have become slow…
Every time Berbawhore gets the ball in a counterattack, he takes his own sweet time to turn , put on a ballet and then tries a clever flick that almost never works. He has single handedly destroyed united’s fearsome counterattack.
I would love to see his pass completion ratio today, must be something like 10%.. Whatever anyone says, any striker who has almost zero shots on goal an entire match is absolutely worthless.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:49
I just saw an interesting statistic. Hull scored twice as many goals away from home as we did, in the same amount of games. We only scored 8 with the rest of top 7 at least 13. The most expensive strike force and we can’t score goals. I am just tired from this kind of crappy performances.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:49
we did not need luck… luck does not complete a pass or split the defense … or keep Berbatov up front.
Sure, we outplayed Spurs but we were piss poor at passing and keeping our own high tempo for any useful amount of time. Every time we had something going either:
1) No one was up front for the cross
2) A poor pass gave the ball away
3) Someone fumbled the ball on a dribble!
ABSOLUTELY OUR WORST ATTACKING PERFORMANCE OF THE YEAR! (wonder if rooney’s absence was the reason or ronaldo’s poor – at least by his standard – game)
December 13th, 2008 at 20:49
@RDJ: @Traverse: Giggs contributed greatly to our last 15 minutes of pressure with his delivery from corners and he nearly scored but for Gomez.
@jos:
“Bertaflop” as you call him at leat looked involved. Though he looked rattled in the first half, he had involvement in many of our attacks. Which was not the case of Tevez. I still stand by saying that Rooney, for all of his temper, is our no.1 striker. As for Ronnie, he picked up his game a bit in the second half, and I cannot fault Park for trying (though he was poor in the first half)
Carrick on the other hand always looked to pass forwards in the center of the pitch, which was congested, and in doing so lost possession a few times.
As for Nani, the only explanation I have is that he must be having some off-field issues. Either that or indeed Grognard has been right about Fergie all along…
December 13th, 2008 at 20:51
@Nico QB:
What about Fletch mate? He couldnt hit an elephant with a 6 yard pass
December 13th, 2008 at 20:51
@johnsom33: Welcome to the Dark Side. You will find that the view form here is much more clearer and much more passionate. All us evil dark lords hope we are wrong by the end of the season but trust me, unfortunately our negativity and mistrust will be vindicated. United will be lucky to win the League Cup this season and that is all. It’s just not our season and the Glazer’s need to start to serious look at possibly questioning the future of Fergie at the club. Many players are going through the motions and have tuned him out. No drive, no passion and above all, no creative imagination and poor poor composure in good scoring moments. That all comes down to poor coaching and preparation. Then to add salt to the wound he makes unbelievably knuckle headed tactical moves and substitutions.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:52
Why the hell did not Scholes start? Would have made all the difference!!!!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:52
BERBATOV IS A WASTE OF MONEY IMO
FERGUSON HAS GONE SENILE!
Fergie’s stubborness to continue with Berbatov and thus playing everybody else out of their natural positions is hurting the team and frustrating the hell out of me. Let’s not get started on his silly substitutions.
I did not bother reading anyone’s comments on this thread before this, I just want to vent my frustrations.
So, if anyone feel to try to convince me otherwise regarding my opinion above, I’ll say this in advance so as not to offend anyone personally…”Fuck you all, I’m not interested!”
December 13th, 2008 at 20:53
I think the tactic was all right except for Fletcher… keep Andy in!
Tevez must have been injured else giggs for tevez makes no sense.
Scholes I cannot get enough of.
Do we need Ole Gunnar Solskjær or what! We had no impact player on the bench today!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:53
@Vivek: Well what do you expect him to do when he receives the ball? Take on the whole opposition all by himself? He isn’t feckin superman for crying out loud! The whole team was shite today.
December 13th, 2008 at 20:53
@Grognard:
Can I please join the Dark side my Master….The Force is beckoning…
Seriously, I now worry for a 2nd place finish in the league. At this rate I am even starting to get worried abt Villa
December 13th, 2008 at 20:53
Here’s a miracle: Chelsea lose tomorrow and I will be OK until next round!
December 13th, 2008 at 20:54
@RDJ:
What I expect from berbawhore is a quick release when he gets the ball ona counterattack, he just goes on a mazy circle instead
December 13th, 2008 at 20:59
@Vivek: Quick release to whom? It’s not like as if there were two or three players in goal scoring positions when he received the ball. Berbatov DID distribute the ball well. Tell me one instance where he played the wrong ball?
December 13th, 2008 at 21:03
@Vivek: What kind of fan are you to be throwing insults to a player of your own team? I’m well known to be the harshest critic of Tevez, and yet I never resort to denigrating him through insults. I justify my critics by asking about what was the player’s contribution to the game.
You say our attack always fizzles out with Berba? I say the same thing but for Tevez – seroiusly he can’t pass- though I’d love him to put up the kind of performance he displayed on his 4 goal day. Berba was clearly rattled in the first hal playing against his old team. He picked up his performance in the second half – and I’m not alone to see that.
But truly, the erason we didn’t perform today was because many of our players only chose to perform in one half only: Ronaldo – second, Park – second, Carrick – first, Fletcher – neither…
December 13th, 2008 at 21:04
@Nico QB: Everyone keep clamouring for Nani, but the few times Fergie has given him time on the field, he hasn’t exactly given Fergie any reason why he should be played, has he?
@Vivek: No offense, I know you’re pissed with the draw and all but its kinda sad and immature when we start calling our OWN players names.
@Madschester United: Lol, we can hope, but I see a draw at best. Which will be good too.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:05
@RDJ:
Please watch the match again if u can and see the number of times Berba gives the ball into a Spurs player’s feet. If u want specifics, near the beginning of the 2nd half there was a brilliant move with Ronaldo and Carrick (I think) with one-touch football, and berba puts it waaaaay ahead of tevez, there was another occasion in the 2nd half when Ronaldo and Park were breaking either side of Berba, when he collected a ball from defense, and he took his own sweet time to go all that way to the defensive third with the ball, and the played a square pass.
There were several such occasions. I stick by my conclusion. Berba has destroyed our fluid counterattacks. He would be brilliant in a side like Arsenal, full of players with great close control, who can find a way thru the middle of the park. Then all his cute flicks and turns would result in something. Unfortunately, we are team that thrives on pace to get behind defenses, and Berba is simply not suited to that.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:06
To all idiots who are bashing SAF, just STFU. Old man has done enough for us, to let him do what he wants for couple of seasons. Complaining about his subs and decisions is all good, but calling him senile and all is just retarded. We are in the middle of the season with great squad and not such a bad situation, but all of you fuckheads complaining like there is no tomorrow. I know we are having a bad run, cause I have been watching every single game, but can all of you just keep your cool. In the end this was a hard game, against a strong team away from home, So the result is not the end of the world. I was mad on his subs during this game, but it almost paid off. As I said before we controlled the game, so stop jumping on the band wagon, that couple of idiots created.
P.S. Grognard I know you are a man in his late thirties, but from your comments I would have thought a teenage girl. Get a grip man!!!
December 13th, 2008 at 21:06
@Karl: That’s OK mate. I feel your frustration. Sometimes we just need to twist off and get a little pissed off.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:07
@Nico QB: I agree some people expect too much from Berbatov. If he plays off the shoulder of the last defender, people say he’s lazy. If he drops deep and takes part in build up play, people says he’s not on the opposition box trying to score goals. Jeez……..
December 13th, 2008 at 21:07
@Rd:
Sorry abt the names….I really like Berba as a player, I think he’s a great player. Just not the right player we needed. Its just that I feel betrayed by the fact that the brilliant attacking combination of last year seems to have been destroyed by Berba’s arrival….
December 13th, 2008 at 21:08
@Vivek: You are welcome to join the Dark Side and study my dark arts until you to can spout poison and negativity with the best of us. Welcome young apprentice.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:10
@Madschester United: What’s really upsetting is we are going to Japan just at the right time to make total fools of ourselves and do embarrass European football and the EPL. As if Fergie will take of the reigns and let the boys play. The Cowardly Lion will 0-0 them all to death.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:12
@Vivek: I’m not saying his passes weren’t intercepted. Sure sometimes his passes were either a bit too heavy or too short. But that does not mean that his intentions were wrong. There is nothing wrong with his decision making and he did play all the right passes. You can believe whatever you want to believe. But calling names on our own players doesn’t go down well with a lot here including me.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:12
@RDJ: Good point, quick release to whom? There is nobody around or in an advantageous position to release the ball to. His teammates are all just standing around . There is no movement to our team. Watch Hoffenheim tomorrow morning if you get that game in your area and watch how a team can play with pace, movement and interchanging play.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:13
vivek, just watch ronaldo, he is not busting a gut for us cos he doesnt seem to care. His free kicks from 40 plus yards out are just an example of his selfishness. Yes he had a great season last year but thats in the past now, stop thinking you will score everytime you shoot. If he misses he is like oh well. Thats not good enough, let someone else take the kicks and set up some1 to score from the headers, u will only score those free kicks once in about 100. Trust me he has had it all too soon and i just see his career going down from now on. Its just my opinion but watch messi and compare them. I know who is the better player and im not just coming to the decision this year, compare the 2 in the game against barca last year. Ronaldo was overshadowed in both games but a half fit messi. I will watch the game tonight and just see him tear madrid apart.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:15
@Vivek: Berbatv is well known to be one of the best “passing forwards” in the modern game. The only moot point ot be considered is that recently his goal tally doesnt really makes him look like a forward.
It’s easy to criticize Berba’s assing after one game (and even then I though that he passed reasonably well).
December 13th, 2008 at 21:15
@RDJ:
Could you quote a single occasion where berba was involved in a United counterattack? I certainly dont seem to recall any. Like I said, I got a little carried away with the names calling, and I apologize for that, but I certainly stick by my view that Berba i snot suited to our style.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:18
@Orez: hear, hear! In Ferguson, I trust!
December 13th, 2008 at 21:19
@Matthew:
I am with you on the freekicks, he should let others take them. And you may be right about Messi. But Ronaldo was definitely not disinterested, he was involved in most of our attacks in the first half and was trying reasonably hard in the second. Not saying he had a great game or that he should be worshipped just because he had a great season last year, but he defintely wasnt our worst player today
December 13th, 2008 at 21:19
@Rd: RD and Nico, he’s upset mate and he has the right to call anybody on the team whatever he feels like. The one thing we don’t do on this blog is call each other names. Players are fair game. For example, I feel like calling our little south Korean Just Shit Park. So sue me. Fuck all the political correctness. Our team is playing like shit and some of us fans feel like venting our frustration. Who should we vent it towards? Spurs, our supporters, the television crew, the weatherman? None of them. The ones that deserve our wrath are our under performing players and our over the hill stubborn as a mule manager who needs to bloody well wake up and check his pulse for any action.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:19
@Orez: btw: get ready for a storm from the Prince(s) of Darkness…
To think anyone knows more than Ferguson about footbaal is laughable
December 13th, 2008 at 21:20
@Vivek: Yeah, but what’s the use of all the counter-attacking football when teams come and park the bus? That’s why we have Berba – to give us an extra dimension in attack rather than just two hobbits. Agreed right not we’re shite, but I believe Berba can fit into this team, it’s just that everyone around him keeps rotating every week making it difficult for us to play fluid football. He was the single point of many attacking moves today and in the 2nd half especially he took it on himself to create chances. He was in the box for a couple of occasions in the first half and we all saw what happened..crosses flying hopefully over or too long.
We’re like a machine that is not oiled right now, but you can’t blame a new part for the overall poor performance.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:21
@Vivek: I think he is injured… and what is up with his hand… it bothered him all first half
December 13th, 2008 at 21:21
@Vivek: Read post numbers 137 and 147 from myself and Grognard. If we are to counter attack, there should be movement up front. Other players should find themselves some space if they are to receive the ball. That wasn’t the case today. The only thing Berbatov could do was to hold up the ball and release it to a suitable player. Oh and can you name me an instant where our counter attack was ruined by a wrong pass by Berbatov? None. Because there wasn’t any real counter attacking moves because THE WHOLE TEAM WAS SHITE!!!!
December 13th, 2008 at 21:23
@antsBoy:
Spurs did not park the bus today, they had a good go….
December 13th, 2008 at 21:23
@Vivek: That sounds more like a condemnation of our team than Berba mate. The fact that we can’t play in the middle of the park like Arsenal when we have the players to do so is more disconcerting than blaming Berba when the rest of the team isn’t on the same page with his vision. He wasn’t great today but then again, everyone was clueless and lacking precision. Ronaldo, Tevez, Carrick, Fletcher and Park all made terrible passes at times when a good pass could have created a chance. This entire team is dysfunctional, not just one player.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:24
@Grognard: what’s wrong with taking off the reigns and let the younger players play in the WCC… I think we will easily make the final and perhabs win it… Not making the final would be embarrassing. Winning is not important in my book
December 13th, 2008 at 21:25
Thanks Grognard.
I read a comment which I hope is not directed at me for calling SAF senile, if so, please refer to the last paragraph of comment#131.
To the side that proclaims that “we’re in a good position…blah…blah…blah”, please spare a moment’s thought to everyone spending their hard-earned cash, their good health and their valuable time to buy tickets in order to sit out in the rain to watch the team perform so badly. Why bother if the only thing that matter is the trophy at the end of the season. I guess we should all just show up at the trophy ceremony and not bother filling up the stadiums?
I watched the game on the telly with my wife today. Half the game we spoke about the different hair-do’s of the players (more specifically how come Ronaldo’s spikes always stays up even though it rains so hard and his hair is all wet?). THAT is how interesting the game was. WTF do I care about hair?
December 13th, 2008 at 21:26
@Rd: About Nani – I know this has been discussed to the death – ask Craig – but maybe he needs games to get going.
The Giggs of old was one player who was known to need a few games (and a few could sometimes add up to 7,8,9 regular games) to get into his stride. Maybe Nani needs regular games too, whch he’s not been having lately. Right now Park has been having more minutes than I ever thought he would. Then it may also be the cause of Wes Brown’s injury – Rafael starting makes our right flank weaker – we saw a few mistakes from the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtle at the start of the game…
December 13th, 2008 at 21:26
@Grognard: Our fluid game play was hampered by a soggy pitch… it poured all game. Not that is an excuse for not winning but would explain our inability for Carrick and Fletcher and Berba/Ronnie/Tevez to make passes stick.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:27
@Karl: that is why you don’t watch footbal with the wives… the game was interesting despite 0-0
December 13th, 2008 at 21:28
@Orez: And who the fuck are you to tell me that I should get a grip? Get off your high moral horse. I’m 49 and I’ll fucking say whatever I fucking well feel like saying about any player or any manager. What I don’t like doing is getting lambasted by politically correct ass clowns like yourself who show up once in a blue moon on this site and start spouting their pc garbage. Perhaps you should go to the Man Utd official blog site where everything is moderated to perfection and not a negative word is heard about you angels in red. This here is a rant site and rants can be positive as well as negative. If you suffer from a less thicker skin than most of us, I suggest you go elsewhere to better protect your virgin attitude and beliefs. I for one will say what I please about Manchester United thank you very much.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:29
@Vivek: That’s not what I meant..It was a general statement to explain why it’s a given that we need someone like Berba in our team. Now, today is just an example of the way we’ve been playing recently…piss poor..can’t blame him for that.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:31
@Vivek: They don’t play much better when Berbais not playing mate. Forget useless Carling Cup games. They don’t count. I recall several games where we played very well and Berba was outstanding. People forget those games when a bad performance comes up.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:33
@Vivek: Can you recall a single counter attack by anyone for that matter? I can’t. See the tactics are the problem here. From now on we should just refer to Manchester United as the Azzuri.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:38
@Madschester United: Relax mate. I’m just a supporter and even though I don’t know as much about football as Ferguson, does that mean I have no right to criticize when he is doing a good job. I’m just feeling disgruntled and I need to vent. Perhaps you should stick a sock in it and save your venom for the team rather than a fellow supporter. If we all thought the same way we should be a group of trained monkeys at a circus. We all have a right tour own opinion. Lets try not to get personal. I’ve got nothing against you mate and your unbreakable devotion to the Boss. Perhaps you could show me the same courtesy for having a different opinion, right or wrong.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:39
I know i aint imagining this shit every weekend….Fergie keeps on fuckin up. simple as that.
How could he put giggs on replace TEVEZas a striker….or anywhere for that matter? i MEAN WERE MENT TO BE LOOKING FOR A GOAL N HE TAKES OFF A STRIKER FPR A PAST IT WINGER.!!?????
part from that freekick n a couple corners He did NOTHING! i mean how is he comin on gon find us a goal? the man has no pace or strength. he cnt influence games anymore. With 20 mins to go you need a player with drive power and determination. All giggs brings is this overly ponderous, painfuly slow play. i was close to throwing up whne i saw him comin on
More contraversialy i felt the same seeing Scholes….as undoubtedly good as he is, he is also over the hill. His passing is great but his legs are gone. In games vs gd opposition like today scholesy is limited i feel. What good is his passing if he A) cant find any space B) Has anyone providing movement.How the fuck could he bench Anderson AGAIN, THE boy is back on form dominating the park, sliding deadly through balls n everything n he stuck on the fukin bench. Fergies lost the fucking plot he really has.
wHRat a toothless team we had on on the end, were making it easy for oposition teams. so fuckin frustrating man im goin fukin nuts, EVERY weekend this season Fergie has had this influence on me AND THE GAME.
……I mean He summed it all up 2 mins from the end….ud never have seen fergie smiling crackin jokes when his sides just missed out on V.IMPORTANT 3 points! Hes aged and has mellowed out way to much as a result…..im sure this is rubbing off on the players, i mean we all have seen a distinct lack of desire recently havent we? so much walking round as if nothin fuckin matters to them. its a joke.
Frank Rijkard sounds good to me.. Fuck anyone out there that wants to argue with me either, i know what im seing out there and its shite.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:41
@antsBoy: The problem is Fergie has him playing to high up and so he really can’t help us much when the opposing team parks the bus. The tactics are what is hurting Berbatov’’s game, not Berbatov himself. Watch a few Tottenham games from last year on tape if you have them. Ramos never ever had him play so high up. Berbatov needs to be planted in the box, not at the center circle.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:45
I have said this b4 but united this year remind me of barca last year. They need a mini clear out and i dont like saying this but maybe a new younger manager coming in. Look at barca this year, they are 10 times the team they were last year cos they cut the squad down, trimmed the crap and built on from there. I would say we have atleast 5 players that are no longer good enough for this team and need to be leave to allow some of the good youngsters we have to take their place.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:45
@antsBoy: quote: what’s the use of all the counter-attacking football when teams come and park the bus?
Exactly.
And funny too – let’s remember that at some point our Berbaroo seemed to click – the first game against celtic me thinks.
I’m starting more and more to think that Unietd should cash in on Ronaldo after this season. We’re not getting the most out of Rooney, plus we’ve somewhat compromised with my beloved 4-4-2. Yes, I know, Europe, blah de blah, but with the coming of Tosic and Llajic – players who I bet will not have the same ego of Ronnie – but then again who does – while still bringing more than Park offensively.
@Vivek: But at some point even big teams like Spurs or Villa choose to revert to parking the bus.. And let’s be frank most of the time there’s more chance of minnws and midtable teams parking the bus or choosing a defensive approach rather than giving a fair shot to te game.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:45
@Vivek: Actually, if you remember, Berba has been involved in quite a few counter-attacking moves…it was all when Rooney was in hot form and we had a string of good games. Take our opener against West Brom for example…
December 13th, 2008 at 21:46
Grognard, comment 171 of yours is what i have been saying for weeks, Thank God some1 else is saying what i said.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:47
@Nico QB: But the fact is, the first part of our season was really tough, Fergie can’t keep taking chances with Nani and keep telling himself, oh well he was average in this game, but I’m sure he’ll improve in the next game, then the next game comes and he’s average again, then Fergie tells himself the same thing. Fergie probably wanted something proven instead of experimenting with Nani to see if a run of games will help Him, thats probably why he went with the old guard. With the hard away fixtures outta the way, maybe he’ll start getting more games now.
@Grognard: Park was shite today??? What games were you watching? If your own way of venting your anger is calling players “Berbawhore or Looney” then good for you. I just think it sounds a little childish imo. I’m not against anyone venting their frustrations.
@Orez: To be fair, he’s no different from 7 out of 10 posters on this blog. You should come on here more often after a bad result.
On the game, I’m more disappointed with the performance than with the result. They still held us to a draw at home last season when we were on form. So I wasn’t really expecting anything besides a draw, but not a goalless one though.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:48
@Vivek: Very true. They parked the bus in the last ten minutes but before that, they were equal if not better than us. What really gets me is that they were missing both their starting central defenders early in the game and tactically we never ever took advantage of that. How we couldn’t take advantage of such a mismatch especially with our crosses and corners befuddles me. Far too much faith and loyalty is being shown to Fergie. Perhaps the man does deserve it for 19 fantastic years. But his twentieth season has left a lot to be desired and an incredible inflexibility to change things up tactically. Question him? Damn right I will. Even the most pedestrian fan can see that something is broken here. Do I have to trust Captain Smith entirely when he sails us through a formation of icebergs? Captain Smith was the very experienced and accomplished skipper of the Titanic for those who didn’t know that. And nobody dared question him when he increased the speed of the ship and decided to not take the warnings seriously. I’m not being arrogant here. Fergie is.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:50
@Madschester United: Listen mate, I hope you are right and we win everything. I just don’t see it however. I am a realist, not an optimist. I see things as broken and changes have to be made in order for that to happen. Perhaps Tosic will help but I think we are struggling at more than just finding a player to play well on the left side. The whole engine needs lubricating and a tune up.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:52
@realred: I feel your pain
)
@Grognard: Fully agree with comment #171
@Madschester United: My wife love’s football. And yes it was interesting (if you want to be technical)…but not in a good way (eg. most interesting part was to see how Fergie is fucking up lately).
Everybody say we must respect – and be gratefull for Fergie – because of the past teams’ successes. Agree. Therefore, it is just fair that he take the responsibility of the current team’s bad displays. We might be getting the points, but in no way is this crap entertaining. (And we want to criticise Mourinho?
December 13th, 2008 at 21:55
@realred: quote: part from that freekick n a couple corners – that’s more opportunitites to score in 15 min than Tevez created in 65 min.
How useful is drive and determination if it gets you nowhere in the game? In the last fifteen minutes it was clear that we were going to have most of the possession and get set pieces. Tevez is pretty much useless on set pieces, I hope you realize that. And we were rather unlucky not to score on at leat one of those Giggs, corners/ free kicks.
Look, I also think that Giggs is past it, but I don’t like it when a player is singled out more because of his previous bad performances than the one he delivered on the day.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:56
Rafael was a liability today. He has a great future but he is not ready to be a regular first team player.
December 13th, 2008 at 21:58
@Karl: Excellent excellent point Karl. So many forget about the entertainment value and treating the paying fans with respect. The other problem is we aren’t always winning despite boring the world to sleep. Too many 0-0 of late and a lack of offensive ambition and enterprise. I have lost my temper with Fergie because I know he is better than this. I understand this approach from time to time in the Champions League but there is no excuse for boring us to death in the EPL. That’s just nt the United way. Historically and especially under Feegie, we have always shown up for every EPL game with an offensive plan and a desire to get three points as convincingly as possible. I don’t see that with the team this year. And i don’t see the frustration or anger within Fergie like I used to when the team played poorly. He may still care but his body language and his actions tell and entirely different story. And for those of you out there who can’t see that, then I have nothing more to say because my complaint and argument is not with you lot.
This has to be the most frustrating season I have experienced as a Manchester United supporter. Oh we have had poorer seasons but less was expected of the team in those years. The sky was the limit with this team and the potential for not only wining but entertaining the masses was great. What an incredible letdown and feeling of betrayal I feel today. I’m just totally gutted by the lack of heart desire and imagination displayed by my beloved Red Devils. More like Pink Angels
December 13th, 2008 at 22:02
giggs was almost un noticable for his cameo today Nico. As funny as it looked, Parks delivery from corners was workin just fine. All im syain is with 20 mins to go why bring on a player that uyou know isnt going to add very much if anything at all?!
If a chance had dropped to someone in the box i know who id rather it fell to between Giggs and Tevez…
December 13th, 2008 at 22:05
@frankie: Oh my
The surprising posts just keep pouring in. How was he a liability today??? He kept players quiet for most of the match and it was only during the last 15minutes that he started to look like he was getting tired. He had a good game today, he just still needs to work on his defensive positioning, far from being a liability.
…And they were no where close to being almost equal to or better than us, we dominated the game, but as usual, it was the same story so far this season. MISSED CHANCES.
@Matthew: Its weird isn’t it? If I remember correctly RR has a topic about what happened to Barca the season after they won the CL and he was wondering if we would go down the same path.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:05
@Madschester United: Mate, over the past forty year I have sen dozens and dozens of matches involving United that were played in pouring rain and even snow on pitches that were an absolute disgrace compared to todays grounds. And I saw United score three, four and five goals many times. The pitch is not the problem, it’s the team philosophy as prescribed by the Cowardly Lion that is at fault here. It’s time to take the shackles of the team and let them express themselves. And it’s high time some butt kicking occurred and the hairdryer came out for a surprise attack in the dressing room. This team and the manager are in need of a swift kick in the backside and a shock to the senses.
Truthfully, it’s very possible Fergie could turn the whole thing around in the second half, but I doubt it. One thing going for us in the second half will be the schedule. Last year’s top nine clubs will all be playing us at OT. So a point today isn’t tragic, but our attitude is truly tragic and a shame for all those who are spoilt and used to attacking football.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:07
@Grognard: Lol @ the last part. No offense and this isn’t a dig, but really how many years have you been a supporter, if this is your most frustrating season as a United supporter???
December 13th, 2008 at 22:07
@Nico QB: I agree. I thought we looked more dangerous on corners and freekicks once Giggs came on. Everyone here would be singing his praises today, had it not been for Gomes’ superman save off his freekick.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:07
@Nico QB: How can you say that Tevez is useless at freekicks/corners? Have you seen his displays at West Ham and in Brazil? Besides, the main reason he was so bad today is because unfortunately, he CANNOT play up top (neither can Rooney for that matter – neither in Fergie’s opinion can Berba).
December 13th, 2008 at 22:10
@Matthew: Thats a valid and insightful comparison. They do seem like they are stagnant and regressing rather than progressing. It is time for a mini fire sale but who would be the players you would get rid of in order to help this team change it’s look and approach. Giggs, Scholes and Neville are the obvious ones, but who else?
December 13th, 2008 at 22:12
@Nico QB: Jeez Louise!
Tottenham did not show up and park the bus. They attacked and better than us. It was only the last five to ten minutes when they got cautious and even then, they never had ten men behind the ball. Parking the bus was not what kept us from scoring today I’m afraid.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:14
@Matthew: @Matthew: Problem is that the number of people who do agree with you and I get awfully quite when we could use their support against the PC police.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:15
@Grognard There is a negative comment and there is crying like a bitch, which you were doing. “politically correct”? I don’t give a shit about this kind of staff, but respectful is another story. I never said that you can’t say what you want, I just implied that the staff you are saying is something that a little girl would have done. Couple of weeks ago you were saying that people should show you more respect cause you are old and all, well for your years you don’t show much patience, do you. Let me also say that I have been reading your comments for a long time and most of the time I thought highly of them and that’s why I tried to put it mildly before, but the way you panic is just disgraceful and that’s why I am telling you “get a grip!!!”. When I read the type of comment that you make on forums of our rivals, I laugh how pathetic they are. What do you know that SAF doesn’t? We might not agree with him, but we should trust him, considering that it wasn’t that far away that we won double. In any way if you and your “sisters” wonna cry, I don’t give a shit. I just wanted to make sure to state, that not everyone agrees with you and thinks that way and, I hope there are many who still have some trust in our great manager.
P.S. Can someone please teach me how I can make my comments red, so its easier for people to see the reply. Thanks.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:16
@Grognard: bicep ball
December 13th, 2008 at 22:17
Parking the bus seems to be the excuse of the day lately.
Not only is it a bad excuse (due to our quality), but also today it was irrelevant.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:19
@Rd: I never ever used the terms Berbawhore and Looney ever and you are accusing the wrong person mate. Get your fact s straight. Having said that, if I do want to call players names, I will and frankly I don’t give a rats ass how childish it seems to you. When someone has an angry rant he doesn’t always sound like a Rhodes Scholar. We are talking about football here, not about family or friends. So please spare me the self righteous indignation.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:23
fergie is just too sentimental…….you can imagine him today lookin at thye bench…..giggs and scholes or anderson and nani……he chose poorly.
Thers no doubting a coach with less obligationsto certain players will do a better job manaing the team than weve seen this season.
dont get me wrong im a big fergie lover….after last season i thot the man could do no wrong! was so happy, proud for the man but this aint the same fergie…the team is being held back, in many diffrent areas.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:25
@realred: quote: Parks delivery from corners was workin just fine – did you watch the same game as I was watching? Park’s delivery on corners were piss poor, he couldn’t lift the ball enough to get past the near post defenders – see I’m justifying my answer.
@Karl: Oh, how I wish we had the Carlos Tevez from West Ham or even better, from Brazil. But that’s the same as asking for the Nani from the end of last season or the Giggs from two-three seasons back. You should look at things how they are now.
And just one more thing, if Tevez can’t play up top (your words) where does that leave him? Still you’re underrating Rooney – I get frustrated as anybody by his temper and his finishing but he is the player making our attack click – he creates and gets in dangerous positions.
Also I think that considering that Tevez was starting today, he should defintiely have started Ando, as those two seem to click…
Oh well that’s it for me today, I always seem to post more after a bad result…
December 13th, 2008 at 22:26
@Rd: I have supported the team since 1977 when I fiorst got a good look at them in their FA Cup win over Liverpool. Living in Canada, we never got English football televised over here except for the FA Cup final. Still I supported the team and read about them until about 1982 when they started to show a package of games on Saturdays. During the 80’s the team wasn’t great but they at least tried to entertain. I never had high expectations for them then. I have watched the team religiously ever since 1990. In the past 15 seasons I have missed very few matches. So when I show concern over this year’s team it’s with experience and valid objectivity. This team is probably the most talented team on paper that we have ever fielded. Yet we are playing like one of the five worst United teams that Fergie has had in twenty years. I don’t come to my decisions without thinking things out and I do believe that I have enough knowledge of the game after forty years of watching it to safely make some observations and criticisms. Although with some on this blog, having an independent mind is strictly verboten. And yes this has been my most frustrating season as a supporter and also the most boring by far.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:27
@realred: I think the bench was also a concern…no striker (not even a youngster to make a name for himself).
December 13th, 2008 at 22:30
@Grognard: Where did I accuse you of anything?, I wasn’t even talking to you in the first instance and yet you chose to reply to my post. I’m not on any high horse. Just like you feel its your right to rant and whine like the world has come to and end and Man United have gotten relegated after each bad result, I thinks its my right to decide and post my opinion if I agree with your rant or not.
@Orez: I can’t begin to describe how much I agree with this comment. Get your coat ready for the barrage of counter-post you’re gonna get.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:32
There was niothing wrong with the team’s performance until those 2 crazy crazy subsitutions!!!….
IMO Scholes should have started with Carrick with Anderson coming in later..Giggs for Park would have made more sense…Tevez-Berba-ronaldo combo was the only way we could score today and Fergie breaks that off..
what was he thinking???
One positive is that…i found out that Berba can play aggresively and show some desire…i want this Berba for other games too…It baffles me when everyone is bashing Berba’s performance today…he was way better today!!!!
but we had a way defensive midfield to start with…
December 13th, 2008 at 22:33
@Orez: You have made this a very personal attack on me. That is out of line. Keep your thoughts and views of individuals on this blog to yourself. Disagreeing on a point is fine but calling me names or insulting me or poking fun at me is just as juvenile as what you are accusing me of being. So to fall in to your trap I will end this by telling you that i do lack patience. Especially for ass clowns and fucking assholes like yourself who feel it’s their duty in life to tell off complete strangers who don’t share their conservative mindset. Go fuck yourself and your unfriendly attitude to a fellow member of this blog
December 13th, 2008 at 22:33
Karl Good point, but I guess we didn’t have anyone, who could have changed the game.
P.S. I learned how to link
December 13th, 2008 at 22:34
@Grognard: Thats your opinion, but I can bet my left arm that if we were to take a poll of most frustrating season since 1977, this wouldn’t even come anywhere close to the top 5, so its kinda laughable that you see it as the most frustrating season. But like I said, its your opinion and you’re allowed to have it. Maybe most frustrating season under Fergie(though I doubt it), but far from being the most frustrating season in 31 years.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:34
@gator: “bicep ball”???? What the heck does that mean?
December 13th, 2008 at 22:34
@Nico QB: That is the problem with our current team imo. Imbalance. Tevez and Rooney are both players that plays in the position that SAF is wanting to deploy Berbatov.
I am not under-estimating Rooney. Ask anyone on this site, I am one of the most staunch Rooney supporters. Fact is, he CANNOT play up top. It is like having a Ferarri and doing your shopping with it. Sure it can be done, but that is an insult to the Ferrari’s performance ability and quite frankly, it sucks at it. You mention about “now”. I wish that ‘now’ we had the Rooney that played for Everton.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:36
@realred: Watch out mate. Some assholes on this blog won’t let you say anything negative about Fergie. You could get your knuckles rapped.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:38
@Grognard: bicep not hand
December 13th, 2008 at 22:39
@Orez: click the grey arrow next to somones name and you will reply to that post.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:40
@Rd: “@Grognard: Park was shite today??? What games were you watching? If your own way of venting your anger is calling players “Berbawhore or Looney” then good for you. I just think it sounds a little childish imo. I’m not against anyone venting their frustrations.” #178. Forgive me if I am misunderstanding but I never called those two players those names. I did call Park a name. Sorry if i’m feeling a bit confused here mate.
And you can agree with Orez all you like. Go ahead, get personal. Show your class.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:42
@gator: Ah I get it, but it’s still called a hand ball.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:44
Grognard you ask me who we should get rid of, well the obvious is nev, giggsy and scholes. I also just dont see the point with park. Yeah he had a good game 2day but what does he do. He doesnt score, he cant pass more than 10 yards, all he does is run. I just feel nani does the left mid side well enough plus this tosic fella coming in so he would be 3rd choice on that left side so i think he should be gone. He did a decent job but his time is up. The other player we should get rid of is o’shea, how the hell does he even get in our squad. He is just crap. All he does is make 2 yard passes and even some of them miss their intended target. He just needs to go. Also van der sar before he signed his contract extension i would have sold too. That is it. 5 players we need out. I dont even think much money is needed to replace them as some of the younger lads just come straight in and replace them. Simpson can return from his loan to provide more competition for the rb slot. Possebon slots straight into scholes position, tosic goes where park was, and fabio or possibly a new signing can go to replace o’shea. Campbell and wellbeck provide the competion upfront aswell. All in all a perfect young hungry squad. Just wish fergie saw it like this.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:45
messi needs to grow his hair back out he has an oddly shaped head and the hair masked it.
wonder if its from the steroids they gave him to grow when he was a kid haha
December 13th, 2008 at 22:48
There’s a lot of hate and animosity being shown towards me here all because I choose to voice my opinion on Manchester United. And while this happens our moderator is off doing whatever. So for all of you who feel like it’s their mission in life to attack me because I share different feelings on a subject, be my guest. It just shows your lack of class and your intolerance to others. You don’t want to play by the rules set up on this blog, knock yourselves out. I have nothing more to say and frankly I am sick and fucking tired of the continual personal attacks against me due to my albeit controversial views and opinions. Like we all have to be a bunch of trained yes men and smirking chimps. I’m fucking angry at some of you but I am especially angry at the lack of support by many of you who I consider friends and who I am always supportive of. It’s amazing how sometimes supportive voices are not heard when injustice arises. Today I have had my fill of abuse and lack of support from those who have not had a problem with me in the past. And the fact that this site was left alone without a moderator has me mad as Hell.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:48
GUYS, PLEASE DON’T GET PERSONAL.
Most people are frustrated which makes a good foundation for fights. We can vent our frustrations wihtout getting personal. I’ve learnt that it just makes things worse and the frustration lasts longer. This is a rant site, so anyone’s entitled to any opinion.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:50
@realred: I agree that he is sentimental sometimes, but I think that today’s decision was based on his judgment. I believe that he actually thought that old timers will bring more to the game, then Nani and Andesron. I don’t agree with him, but I think that we played better after the subs. Would we have done better with young guys, we might have, but I don’t know. The fact is, that if Giggs’s free kick would have gone in, most of the complainers would have been hailing “genius SAF”, but it didn’t and the insults starting. I do believe that any scumbag who dares to insult SAF on any ManUtd blogs should be crucified. Criticizing and not agreeing is all good, but I think that SAF gets enough insults from our rivals.
P.S. Thanks gator
December 13th, 2008 at 22:52
@Grognard: I hear you. In fact, I agree with you. I guess that makes me a “sister”?
December 13th, 2008 at 22:55
@Grognard: cmon grog dont get pissed people say shit on these boards cuz they dont have the balls to say it to people in person. you cant take it personally because its not said in person. I have friends that actually go on boards just to fuck with people and piss them off.
fuckem and click over to the barca fakemadrid match its just now half time.
December 13th, 2008 at 22:55
@Orez: My grandfather was a wonderful man (god bless his soul). In his seventies though, he started becoming senile. For starters, he started repeating the same stories over and over again. Can you imagine how that must have felt, listening to the same stories everynight before you go to sleep? I can still recall all his stories word for word.
In our manager I see the same happening…
December 13th, 2008 at 22:58
I kinda disagree with Matthew that the players he mentioned should be disposed off. They’ve been great contributors to the team so far. Not so much this year but lets give them some more time. I’m even givin’ Berba a chance for crying out loud.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:05
@Karl:
I dont think he is going senile but more just content with what he has and the fight is not there
December 13th, 2008 at 23:07
@Karl: 1st I apologize for getting personal. It was unnecessary and uncalled for. The reason I singled out Grognard was, because I saw him as someone with respect and influence on this forum and I didn’t want him to lead “knee jerk” reaction. I was wrong and apologize. I do agree, that someone who insults people online is just a coward, who can’t do it in real life.
@Karl: Do you really believe that the SAF is going senile and there in nobody in ManUtd, who can finish it. I just don’t understand how you can think that way. I am a realist and comments like that I see as an insult and not as “logical assumption”. as you can see I am not trying to defend the way we played today and if you read my previous comments you will see that I was as dissatisfied as many of you. I just thought that the negativity was overwhelming and tried to go against it, to “cheer up” or something of that sort.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:07
Nico; as far as i can remember one of his corners resulted in ronaldo’s non goal and a few other similar situations!?! We were just unlucky from corners today, few inches either way we wuda nicked one of then.
Im just prayin evry week that Fergie gets back to business n picks the right team. Why does he feel park needs to play just now? I mean how much better is todays team with ANderson in for Park making up a midfield 3 of Fletch, Carrick & Ando………?????????????
SIMPLE.
The decision making is atroscious.
Off topic- The Sunderland game, With nani clearly lacking match fitness annd everything that comes with that He should have used the easy home fixture vs a weak, broken team to ease the boy back into action.
Instead he persists with the ‘worlds most defensive’ winger only to throw young Nani into the deep end VS Alborg the other day! Oh wait…only to drop him again..!?? Its so stop start for the lad its no wonder his performances aint been great. Really think the criticism he gets in unwarrented….just dnt wana see him goin down same wanky path as ronaldo, wanting away from the club that is. Really think Nani could become a superior player sometime in the future…just gota give him time!
My hate for ronaldo grows each game…soft as shit arrogant cunt. im sorry but i cant/wont forget last summer
December 13th, 2008 at 23:08
@gator: Good point. My grandfather also went through that phase just before it hit him
In seriousness though, I hear what you are saying.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:10
Karl: Sure iv used that “Senile” reference recently myself mate. You spk the truth
December 13th, 2008 at 23:15
@Orez: Please don’t get me wrong. I’m not trying to become personal with you. But, why do people always claim to be realists? (I know Grognard and some other also claim that sometimes). What is reality? It’s nothing more than just the opinion of the observer.
In my opinion, SAF is going senile. I might be wrong, and in no way is it medically proven, but in my opinion (or reality) he is. I am very disrespectful to voice it in public though. I admit that. But what do you expect from me? I am frustrated.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:20
…daft old senile cunt. he better wake up & soon!!
December 13th, 2008 at 23:28
WOW!! Is it me or have our performances taken a dive this season? Didn’t Fergie say we would see a marked improvement from the squad this season? Didn’t Fergie say that by October, we would have hit top gear? Didn’t Fergie say that we were just unlucky in front of goal? I’m finding it hard not to be pessimistic when we are not even playing well. It’s not about the results, but simply our performances. Not to talk about all those predictions and prophecies by Fergie unfortunately failing to come to fruition.
Earlier this season, we were creating chances and missing loads and instead of Fergie to address it then, he chose to ignore it and claim we were unlucky. Now we can’t even create chances, or even convert the few ones we get. Why is this team – the same one which conquered the PL and Europe last year – unable to create decent chances at will? Why do we look like a team that lack chemistry and basic skill sets such as 1-2 passing, accurate set-pieces, crossing and possession play? Why do we look like we are unmotivated and not hungry enough for three points? Why do we look like we are huffing and puffing our way to draws, wins and losses?
If someone can answer those questions, I will be glad. Because my answer is Fergie and his band of dimwits he calls the coaching staff.
If it’s not clear that something is wrong with our squad that originates from poor management, coaching and training, then maybe some have to look closer. The tactics have been awful, the substitutions worse and the attitude of Fergie even more appalling. When was the last time you saw Fergie all giddy after losing two crucial points? Today he was busy prancing about the touchline entertaining the Tottenham fans when we were losing the opportunity to close the gap at the top of the table… wasn’t it him who said this was a very crucial game? Then why was he so happy at not only a disappointing result but a poor performance? Therein lies the cancer eating away at this team.
I will still be optimistic, as United have proven time and again that you can never doubt their ability to conquer all, despite setbacks. However, we are currently looking incoherent and clueless as to how to create and convert genuine chances, especially against opposition that defend in numbers. It has become a recurring theme this season and I bet u Tottenham won’t be the last team to employ this tactic against us. What makes me afraid is that if we can’t find a way out of this mess, we might be looking at a lot of draws and losses, which might result in a loss of silverware.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:30
barca pen
December 13th, 2008 at 23:30
Freakin WordPress deleting my comments..
WOW!! Is it me or have our performances taken a dive this season? Didn’t Fergie say we would see a marked improvement from the squad this season? Didn’t Fergie say that by October, we would have hit top gear? Didn’t Fergie say that we were just unlucky in front of goal? I’m finding it hard not to be pessimistic when we are not even playing well. It’s not about the results, but simply our performances. Not to talk about all those predictions and prophecies by Fergie unfortunately failing to come to fruition.
Earlier this season, we were creating chances and missing loads and instead of Fergie to address it then, he chose to ignore it and claim we were unlucky. Now we can’t even create chances, or even convert the few ones we get. Why is this team – the same one which conquered the PL and Europe last year – unable to create decent chances at will? Why do we look like a team that lack chemistry and basic skill sets such as 1-2 passing, accurate set-pieces, crossing and possession play? Why do we look like we are unmotivated and not hungry enough for three points? Why do we look like we are huffing and puffing our way to draws, wins and losses?
If someone can answer those questions, I will be glad. Because my answer is Fergie and his band of dimwits he calls the coaching staff.
If it’s not clear that something is wrong with our squad that originates from poor management, coaching and training, then maybe some have to look closer. The tactics have been awful, the substitutions worse and the attitude of Fergie even more appalling. When was the last time you saw Fergie all giddy after losing two crucial points? Today he was busy prancing about the touchline entertaining the Tottenham fans when we were losing the opportunity to close the gap at the top of the table… wasn’t it him who said this was a very crucial game? Then why was he so happy at not only a disappointing result but a poor performance? Therein lies the cancer eating away at this team.
I will still be optimistic, as United have proven time and again that you can never doubt their ability to conquer all, despite setbacks. However, we are currently looking incoherent and clueless as to how to create and convert genuine chances, especially against opposition that defend in numbers. It has become a recurring theme this season and I bet u Tottenham won’t be the last team to employ this tactic against us. What makes me afraid is that if we can’t find a way out of this mess, we might be looking at a lot of draws and losses, which might result in a loss of silverware.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:30
@Karl: To answer your 1st question. By realism I mean that I can’t believe that a multimillion pound organization like ManUtd will leave someone “senile” in one of the most important positions, considering that the only reason would be the respect for the individual.Do I think that he lost some of his football wisdom? may be. But he lost a lot in his adaptability. Before if something wasn’t working, he would fix it in short time, but he is having trouble now. But while our rivals give their managers years to try to sort out problems, without any success, we call for his head in the middle of the season. I am just saying we should give the old man more time to try to fix it and have a little more faith. With a very hard schedule we are only 6 points behind the leaders, with game in hand. It’s not good and, the way we played was, really bad for the past couple of months and I am as unhappy as you, but it’s too early to call for SAF’s head.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:30
blocked
December 13th, 2008 at 23:32
@realred: I feel the same re Ronaldo.
In his defense though, I think today’s match was a much better display from him (personality-wise). He even indicated to the ref that the one incident was not a foul (pretty unusual). And, no diving!
December 13th, 2008 at 23:36
@Orez: You must mis-understand me. I’m not calling for his head. I’m calling for him to ‘wake-up’. If this means employing a better no.2, then so be it…just wake the F up.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:43
@Orez: Regarding your ‘realism’ point of reference…
Maybe the owners want the public to see that ManUtd is ’stable’, hench the reason for SAF becoming untouchable…as I said, it depends from what viewpoint you see it.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:48
Guys, I’m off to bed now. I actually feel much more calmer now. Still feel bad over our performance, but a lot more calmer. Thanks.
December 13th, 2008 at 23:50
why are all my comments awaiting moderation?
December 13th, 2008 at 23:52
@Karl: I agree with you on #2 and “calling for head” wasn’t directed against you. I agree with many others who ask for more chances for Nani and Anderson, but I honestly trust him. I hope that the Club World Cup will be a good occasion to put everyone back to form.
P.S. At least we are not in Real’s place. 12 points I believe is the difference now
December 14th, 2008 at 0:26
Lads, Ive read some of the earlier comments(thank God this site is back to life!) and I see some pessimistic views. But let me make it a good day(night?) for you. We have now played all the teams that finished in the top 10 last season away from home. And our record is this:
Only difference is the teams and the goal difference. This season it is: 8-6 to us. In 2007/08 it was 12-9. Its only a matter of one more goal last season. We are in the exact same position! If this doesnt remove some of the pessismism, nothing will. Just remember this…
Pompey: 1-0 win
Liverpool: 2-1 loss.
Chelski: 1-1 draw
Blackburn: 2-0 win.
Everton: 1-1 draw.
Arsenal: 2-1 loss.
Aston Villa: 0-0 draw
Shitty: 1-0 win
Spurs: 0-0 draw.
Stats say: 3 wins, 4 draws and 2 losses. Together it is 13 points of a possible 27. Last season we also picked up 13 of the possible 27. Last season it was:
Pompey: 1-1 draw
Liverpool: 1-0 win
Chelski: 2-1 loss.
Blackburn: 1-1 draw.
Everton: 1-0 win.
Arsenal: 2-2 draw.
Aston Villa: 4-1 win.
Shitty: 1-0 loss.
Spurs: 1-1 draw.
So again it is 3 wins, 4 draws and 2 losses. Not to bad innit?
December 14th, 2008 at 0:43
Guys, we are in a briliant situations. The hardest team we are gonna face away from Old Trafford in teh Prem for the rest of the campaign is possibly Boro in April. Rest of the teams are: Newcastle, Stoke, Hull, Wigan, Fulham, West Ham, West Brom, Sunderland and Bolton. I can see us winning some games on the trot there. And for home games? Yeah, we will face teams like Arsenal, Chelski, Villa, Liverpool and Shitty, but at Old Trafford we are unbeatable. I can still see us winning the league, we are still only 6 points behind with a game in hand. Chelski will travel to Anfield, Old Trafford, Villa Park and Emirates in 2009, and they will face tough oppositon. They might be strong away from Stamford Bridge, but they have only faces teams like Stoke, West Brom and Blackburn. The only “good” team they have faced away from home is probably Shitty. And they suck! Liverpool will lose points, we all know that. Despite the press and commentators believe this is their year, lets not forget that they have drawn 2-2 with Hull, 0-0 vs Stoke and Fulham, and nearly lost against Boro at Anfield. They took on a weakened Chelski side and, short said, they will slip up. Its just as obvious as a pig eating filthy stuff. So, guys cheer up. Our hardest part of the season is over. Grog, myself and so many others have said that if anythign was going to ruin our title possibilities it was the first half of the season. We have driven through with glamour and class!
We have done the exact same thing as last season, only with a better defensive record(Believe it or not!). We have been unlucky against Liverpool, Chelski, Spurs and Arsenal. We wasted some big chances against Villa, Everton and Arsenal, and our all in all play has been terrific. I am happy, cheerful and elighted with the progress this team has had this year. Now our players can lower thier shoulders and not worry as much or feel the pressure. We have seen obvious faults in this team. Like so many other times. Its just that last season it came in different parts or times. Because our hard games were split in different months, or periods. But this seaosn we have faced tough opposition away from home every week. That is why we think this team is not good enough, the bad games has just not come in long enough times between. Im positive we will win at least 5/6 games left in the season. Brown will be back, Wazza will be back, Ronaldo will be back, Berbatov will find his feet, Scholes is getting back from inury and Anderson has just hit top form. Good times ahead? Im certain! 
December 14th, 2008 at 0:53
Im going to talk about our season, because it obviously is very important to all our lives. Now, lets sum up our season!
We are in the 1/8 finals of the Champions League, semi finals of the Carling Cup, face Soton away from home in the FA cup, we are 6 points behind the leaders in the Prem with 1 game less played, all of our away games has been vs teams ending in 10+ position last season, Ronaldo is getting back from injury, Rooney is incosistent(again), our defense has gotten a new master, Rafael. Evra, Vidic and Rio are still brilliant, Carrick can use his left foot too, Berbatov is not the player we thoguht he was, at least not used how we thought/dreamt, Tevez is not a “super-sub”, we lack a real finisher. And the thing that has become most obvious for all to see: We have no left winger. Park is a RDM, for crying out loud! Nani has clearly lost all trust from Fergie. Giggs is a CM, although not a good one. Rooney should always play as a CF, not a LW or ST, and Evra cannot cross. We cant do anything about it, except pray and see what happends. I hope Fergie decides to play Nani more often now and he shows us all what a United left winger should be able to do. Tosic is for the future, Nani should play better. Our season has not been so bad, has it? Comparing to last season, we now have 32 points from 16 games. Last season? 36 from 16. And then we faced much, much easier opposition. Bright times are ahead, we will show the world who we are. Again…
Glory, Glory Man United! Glory, Glory Man United! Glory, Glory Man United, as the reds keep marching on, on, on!
December 14th, 2008 at 0:57
I know I have not been commenting a lot lately, but Ive been busy with my girlfriend, parties and training. Might be for some time ahead too, but I will spend more time here than Ive done the last three days. Im very cheerful! Life couldnt be better!
I luv it! 
UNITED!!!
December 14th, 2008 at 1:01
Just rad that the January transfer window has been extended from January 31st, to February 2nd. More time to buy players!
If we get a deadline day in February like the on we got in September, I will luv it! 
Wonder if my heart can take it though… 
In teh coming weeks we will see if the money on Dimi was well spent. Im not convinced so far, 
, but who knows? He might prove to be a gold! He was expensive, but I trust him in finding his old form. He will be vital!
December 14th, 2008 at 1:09
@Orez: dude… how can someone lose wisdom with age?
Isn’t the definition of wisdom related to experience?
Also: Grognard and Orez, when you disagree or rant or whathever you call it you need to so with respect. It does not matter if you are angry over the match as neither of us had anything to do with the results. Be respectful and keep the cuss-words for your local pub or real friends – they don’t belong in this blog (according to me) for the fact that they diminish the quality of the opinions that contain them.
Lastly: If someone seriously thinks this is the worst season in recent history (last 15 plus years) and Fergie should get the sack, please list your reasons, because I surely would like to see them… even if I cannot believe that they exist.
Don’t forget: United for richer and poorer, through sickness and health.I hereby pronounce you the best football club in the world!
December 14th, 2008 at 1:10
ok that last part was lame.
December 14th, 2008 at 1:15
@Rd: i was also thinking the exact same thing. we are going down the same path as barca did…
winning league twice and also winning champions league in same year (which by the way is only achieved by us and barca in last 15-20 years) just replace ronaldinho with ronaldo, messi with rooney, eto’o with tevez and henry with berba…
ronaldo’s(ronaldinho’s) portugal(brazil) going out in quarter final of Euro(World) Cup with ronaldo(ronaldinho’s) getting criticized for it..
good thing is, our dressing room is not as bad as theirs because fergie can handle big egos better than rijkaard…
i can see us having bad EPL run but a better CL performance this year, than selling ronaldo,nani and tevez next year and build a new team around rooney with welbeck(bojan) also coming along with fergie still in charge(or may be mourinho/o’neill)…
now a lot of people will bash me for comparing rooney with messi, but i think in terms of contribution to the team, both are same. they score same amount of goals every season, according to me rooney assists more, and both remain injured more often than not….
December 14th, 2008 at 1:17
huh no cuss words ? life would be too bland
December 14th, 2008 at 1:19
One thing our team needs to work on. Corner kicks. They were fairly good today, at least when you think it was Park and Giggs taking them.
But we had 16 corners, so we should score more. We get an average of 9 corners a game in the past 8 games(league and cup), but havent scored a single one. We have switcher corner takers, all from Park to Nani. Rooney, Giggs, Anderson, Nani, Park and Ronaldo. Our corner takers. Im gonna make this simple.
Ronaldo- great in the air, we need him in the box for corners, He is always a weapon.
Rooney- Should be in the “rebound room”. On 30 yards, so he can smash volleys on goal when cleared. As long as he hits the target from those, it bound to be a scoring opportunity.
Anderson- Can take corners, but they move quite slow. Accurate, but not with the pace needed from corners. He is possibly on of the best options to take corners, because of his accurate passes and lack of heading ability. Should take more corners.
Giggs- He just chips them in! That never works. With headers like Ronaldo, Rio, Brown, Vidic and Berbatov in the box, we cannot “chip” them in. We need pace, so we only need a touch to smack tehm home. Giggs` corners are either loo short, too long or too weak. Gets them right 1 out of 60, and not good enough.
Park- Cant cross, cant pass, doesnt have any power… Id rather have VDS take our corners.
Nani- Best possible option for me. He cant head the ball, so he is not needed in the middle. A good crosser, seems to create trouble every time he takes a cross. If he just got the chance more ofte, we would probably score at least 1 goal from corner each game.
And last, the player I think should take the corners when Nani isnt around. Michaerl Carrick! He might be tall, but he is not a good header. His passes are great, and accurate. He has taken some corners for us during the 2 years he has been with us and I remember two goals we have scored from his corners: Vidic vs Spurs(2007) and Ronaldo vs Villa(2007). He and Giggs took our corners in the latter stages of 2006/07 and he got some assists from crosses/corners. I think our list of corner takers should be like this:
1. Nani
2. Carrick
3. Anderson
4. Hargreaves
5. Giggs
December 14th, 2008 at 1:43
Ehh, just found out why Foster hasnt been playing this week. Apparantley he is out for a month with a thumb injury.
Poor, poor Ben. Brilliant keeper, most unlucky person in the world(behind Louis Saha and Donald Duck 
)
December 14th, 2008 at 2:03
Where is everybody?
December 14th, 2008 at 2:15
@RedDevilEddy: At last some positive comments. Totally agree with you.
@Madschester United: I think SAF got a little more defensive then he used to be. His last couple of choices made that impression on me, that’s why I say he somewhat “lost wisdom”, meaning he is afraid to take risks. In this case the age might not be the best thing, cause with age you want more stability IMO.
December 14th, 2008 at 4:07
0-0 against Tottenham away is not a disaster but it is symptomatic of our season so far. Our home record is good but away we are so cautious, lacking in imagination and just seem unable to break teams down. Ferguson also seems to insist on putting on Giggs and Scholes as though he does not trust more dynamic performers like Anderson and Nani.
We are also over reliant on Ronaldo and it is showing this season with Ronaldo out of sorts because of injury. You could see today that Ronaldo had no confidence and I believe that is because everything hurts and he is subconsciously worried about aggravating his existing injuries. As the saying goes once bitten, twice shy. He needs his confidence, his arrogance, his fearlessness back and for that to happen he first off needs to get 100% fit and injury free and that means resting him.
I know people have mixed opinions about Rooney but without him we are far weaker team. His aggression for all its dark side does give us more of a cutting edge and purpose. Tevez and Berbatov were completely impotent today. Ok maybe we’d still have failed to score but we create a lot mor chances with Rooney playing.
I know people rave about Berbatov the passing striker and I think Ferguson is still having this pipe dream of playing Rooney as a number 9 and Berbatov as a number 10. Rooney can do a good job there on the rare occasions when he is on a scoring spree, but most of the time he is wasted there as he is too wasteful. Ronaldo doesn’t seem to be as goal hungry or getting into dangerous positions this season, so really we need Berbatov in the box….we have enough creative players to give him the service
December 14th, 2008 at 5:07
@antsBoy: what the fuck is the extra dimension everyone keeps harping about??? We still dont score??? thre is no fucking extra dimension… fact is whatever dimensions htere were are also gone… we now play very boring fucking italian football…
berbaflop has scored only 2 goals in 4-0 and 5-0 wins… where was he against the likes of Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool, Spurs, Villa???????? What is he doing on the park if not even trying to score??????????? Fucking piece of shit of a player. at least last year we were scoring bucketloads. This year we’ve just added the flopster to the team and suddenly we cant score to save our lives!!!
December 14th, 2008 at 7:17
So Fergie is senile, Berbatov is worthless, Park is useless, Giggs didn’t provide anything as a sub and no one mentions Carrick’s utter profligacy in possession? I must have been watching an entirely different match.
Instead of having a competition to see who can be the most outraged United supporter, why don’t you take a deep breath? We lost. It has been maddening that we haven’t scored. But in the past several games we’ve only been inches away from scoring on dozens of occasions. From Giggs free kick, to Ferdinand’s header, to Vidic’s turn, to Park’s turn to Ronaldo’s set piece, we were within inches of goals on five occasions that I remember, muchless others I forgot. It’s simply a confidence issue. You can tell this because of the lack of touch on the final pass. Every last touch is heavy. Their legs stiffen when they see the daylight. This isn’t though a lack of effort or desire, it’s just a nervousness that comes from the urgency of goal draughts. Our form, I believe, has been excellent lately, aside from in the final 10% of the pitch. We’ve dominated possession, pinned teams back, been absolutely miserly in defense and distributed some beautiful cross-field passes, switching fields with ease. There has been so much to be happy with that I hesitate to be too hard on the lads for failing to score. They’ve done everything else superbly.
I think this is just one of those times where it shows how spoiled we are to be United supporters. We believe that goals are a birthright and that a United match without a goal is symptomatic of senility, mediocrity, and apathy. I believe that is just the nature of the game. It is tremendously difficult to score goals and sometimes the well simply dries up. But these things never last for long and those that were screaming about an irreversible drought will quickly change their tune. The goals will come, the tactics will show their wisdom, and the acquisitions will bear fruit.
December 14th, 2008 at 9:07
Our problem is that our final ball, pass, shot, etc… was not good enough. To ronnie, who i sincerely think is worthy of the ballon d’or was frustrated, and it showed in his play and re: dawson (embarassing). There was a moment where the count (who i thought was our best attacking threat, which does not say much), exchanged with ronnie and tevez, yet ronnie’s final ball was behind a clean through dracula ready to bite. These key moments need to be better. Tevez, i love his work rate, dedication,love of the game, lack of ronnie and rooneyesque bullshit, but he is not worth 30 mill, nor is he what the club needs right now.
Nani, its time to shit or get off the pot mate, fergie needs to give him games, not subs, and he needs to take advantage. Remember when ronaldo was about as effective as a 40 year old fatouche with no viagra! he needed and took the time to develop his game.
giggs (you are a legend), but should only be used as an impact sub. But where fergie is slipping is when it comes to anderson. This kid is class, he needs a decent runout, games, and development. HE ALSO NEEDS TO WORK ON HIS ENGLISH, the language barrier is too big an obstacle at the mo. believe me he will explode, the potential is there.
Carrick was carrick, ie. the most consistent footballer on the planet, not always world class, but never shite, he deserves his slot at the moment.
Our midfield (especially in europe) is suffering from missing hargo, we need his cojones, not to mention his set pieces. Fletcher had a great start but give ando a go.
However, tottenham defended well, gave us no time on the ball, and had a decent go of it, fair play to them and houdini.
I miss carlos and don’t feel that phelan is up to the task. Also, wat does everyone think of signing ashley young? he’d be expensive (english), but dedicated,settled, and he is on fire right now.
December 14th, 2008 at 9:13
one more thing, park is a squad player.defensively he is not a bad choice, but tottenham did not come out to play, they came to defend. And in situations like that park lacks creativity and ability. not first team materials and he never will be, Nani has the potential and should play although i question his overall effectiveness.
I hope that we come good because Fergie’s united has always had a slow a start and peaked towards the end of the season when it matters.
December 14th, 2008 at 9:58
@Patrick: More of that over sweetened load of optimistic noise and I may go into a Diabetic coma from so much sugar content. Stop preaching to us about how we should feel mate. Let us express our anger, frustration impatience or just general intolerance of the way the team has played for half a bloody season.
Today I was called a little girl, intolerant and above all impatient as if I had just blown my stack because of one poor game. I blew my stack because of 25+ games in all competitions where the team has stunk 90% of the time. And yet people like you say it’s part of the game and the team will snap out of it, the goals will come yadda yadda yadda. Christ, that kind of patience and laze fare attitude makes me want to just want to puke, not to mention bore me to death.
Fair enough, you are entitled to feel the way you do, but stop questioning others if their requirements and feelings about our season are albeit unreasonable, demented and basically different. Stick to talking about the team and not making judgments on some of us supporters or you will get this kind of reply from people like me who don’t appreciate thought police on this blog. Basically, you think what you want to think mate, and leave others to think the way they want to. It’s ok to disagree with a view but to put someone down because their view is different, well that’s just rude. If guys like me annoy the Hell out of you and a few others, why punish yourselves? Go to that Splenda induced cavity creator called ManUtd.com where you will get nothing but positive energy and positive vibes and where never a negative word is heard, because the team’s official moderator won’t allow it. A perfect place for conservative thinkers who like to rule the world.
December 14th, 2008 at 10:05
@jos: I think what is meant by extra dimension is multiple styles of play that change the shape and attacking approach. For example, continental style which moves the ball slowly and up the middle, old school British football that uses wide men and crosses, the direct approach which uses long balls etc. And a team knows if they have the capacity to change their style based on the kind of talent they have.
United have players who can play a wide variety of styles. What we are not good at though, is strong in the air, so cancel out the wide crosses as much as possible. We are a team with great speed yet this season we are not utilizing that style much. Perhaps that is a “dimension” worth using. Basically we are playing like a one trick pony and we have become predictable and easy to defense against. And above all, we are managed by a stubborn old coot who refuse to change tactics in a game and just works with the same old approach for 90 minutes. I for one am at a loss to understand why we were able to work three different styles last season but this season, we use the same old slow plodding attack through the middle?
December 14th, 2008 at 10:07
@Orez: Positive comments come from all of us when there is something positive to talk about. If you expect positive comments all the time may I suggest church.
December 14th, 2008 at 10:12
@Madschester United: Cuss words are not outlawed on this blog and this blog is for ranting. Ranting by nature isn’t a sunny walk in the park with your grandmother. I agree that we should not be cussing each other on this blog but you are also fairly new to this blog to be telling me how to act after I have been on this blog for two years and have contributed thousands of times. Sometimes tempers get ruffled and it’s unfortunate but in most cases apologies or misunderstandings are corrected and life moves on. But this is not a holier than thou gentleman’s club where language, dress code and a stiff upper lip is mandatory. So stop preaching to some of us mate and just worry about your behavior and let others as well as Red Ranter worry about the rest of us classless and unruly peasants who just can’t control our emotions or language.
Remember, your role on this blog is not to police it or to talk down to me or others over our behavior.
December 14th, 2008 at 10:15
@RedDevilEddy: Frankly mate they need to work on about two dozen different things, not just corner kicks. This engine is broken and is in need of a new transmission and drive shaft.
December 14th, 2008 at 10:19
@colver: Before the game I predicted 1-0 for Spurs or 0-0. Why was I so close? Simple, the team has become so predictable and so unimaginative, I am always expecting 1 or less goals a game on the road. An explosion for us these days in the EPL would be 2-0.
And I expect nothing but excuses and jet lag from the Japan fiasco that is coming. This team is not half way through the year and they look hurt, exhausted and confused. Two bad the EPL isn’t like Germany because they could really go for a 45 winter break, don’t you think? Give Fergie some classroom time to figure things out and perhaps wake up to his own failings and hire a new #2 and a player or two. But then again I’m talking about Fergie. Stubborn and in his own little world.
December 14th, 2008 at 10:35
@jos: I agree with what Grognard says about extra dimensions, so I won’t repeat it to you. The problem right now is we have the right players but who play in the wrong positions. Sadly, Berba is the easy scapegoat cos he’s the “new” player. Look at Tevez, did he do anything useful? Ronaldo decided to show up for the second half only. The same players who were part of our amazing attack last season has problems now, and hence our overall poor performance. It’s not due to only one man.
December 14th, 2008 at 10:41
I really hope Rooney doesn’t get a ban for his alleged stamp, especially after the Allborg player himself has come out and said Rooney doesn’t deserve it (Kudos to him for that!). Yesterday, it was evident that our team misses the creative force of Wayne Rooney. He just makes things happen! Where all the default Rooney bashers on this site? Don’t you think so too? I don’t wanna start calling your names and get you out!
December 14th, 2008 at 11:02
@Grognard: They need to work on a lot of things. I know. Finishing, crosses, defensive errors, mdifield play, leadership…. There is too much. But it is also so easy to fix! I just dotn get why they dont.
Finishing could be dealt with easily as Berba is a brilliant finisher. One of the best there is. BUt it looks like Fergie is more interested in him getting assists than goals. H isnt in the area as much as he should, and he makes to many stupid passes when in a scoring positions. Rooney, Tevez, Ronaldo, Anderson… They could all do with some shooting practice.
Crossing. Lets not even get onto that.
Evra is a good crosser when given room. But he wants to take men on now, something that has hurt some of his wing play. Rafael is a brilliant crosser, but he wont get many assists with Park, Rooney, Tevez and Fletcher being the men on the reciving end. Ronaldo got into lots of goalscroing positions in the box, and scored on a few headers. But this season he hasnt scored a single. Either its because of Berba arrival, a new role, lack of confidence/lack of will, injury problems or just frustration, I dont know. All I know is that this guy has got to sort it out. And quick!
Midfield- I know, we gotta rotate our midfield. We have Scholes, Carrick, Anderson, Fletcher, Giggs, Possebon. We cannot leave them all out every week. We have 6 midfielders, and its only 2 who are gonna start. Now, I can understand Scholes. He has brilliant positioning and his passes are unreal. He can change a game in a flash. More often or not, its one of his moves that open a defense completely. Carrick can do sooo much, although he is really inconsistent. He doesnt have a drive forward, but when he does(which is rarely) he might score a goal or two. He is a brilliant passer, but I dont understand why we should play him when Scholes is. Neither is quick, they are both incredible passers, great positioning, score some goals with long-range screamers, great on the ground and can see things that are difficult to teh blind eye. But to play both is just stupid! In CM we need two different players who can do different thigns for this side. Now, our succes for the many season was two deifferent midfielders. Keane and Scholes. One midfielder moving forward and helping the attack, the other staying back and waiting to stop counter attacks. Scholes rarely moves forward, or makes a pass to the strikers. Fletcher does. But he lack speed and vision. Can somebody please tell me 2 things Fletcher bring to our play that Anderson doesnt?
He is faster, better passer, better vision, better dibbling, can tackle and likes to move forward. Giggs is just old and shouldnt be a CM. After this weeks two matches, I am convinced. Fergie should make him LM again. Honestly, he isnt much slower than Park. So in midfield we should choose two players that bring different things to our game. Solution is: Anderson and Carrick/Scholes. Anderson brings speed to our game, plays passes forward, while Scholes/Carrick can slow the tempo down and roll the ball around when we lead.
Leadership- This might not be something obvious to some of you, but a regular leadership is important. Gary Neville is our captain right now, but he is behind Rafael in the pecking order. Should he be captain if he isnt a first choice and wont play more than 20 games a season? I think not. Giggs wont play as many games either, as he is into his 35s. Let me put up our captain in the previous 7 games.
vs Spurs: Rio
vs Aalborg: Neville
vs Sunderland: Rio
vs Rovers: Neville
vs Shitty: Rio
vs Villareal: Rio
vs Aston Villa: Giggs
We can see that only once we have played with the same captain two games in a row. And that captain being Rio. People may disagree with me, but the captain is very important to the team. Giggs is not a true captain, and Neville wont play so many games, so I think it is obvious that Rio should be named permanent captain right away. Im saying this for the good of the team: Make Rio Ferdinand parmanent captain!
December 14th, 2008 at 11:06
@antsBoy: What we lacked yesterday was a player that could speed up the tempo, as it was obvious Spurs couldnt live with us when we played fast football and looked to score. Ergo: Andesron Abreu de Luis Oliveira.
Why Fergie didnt put him on is something I will never understand. Unless he was happy witha draw, there is no logic possibility.
December 14th, 2008 at 11:58
Ahh man I just woke up from a horrid nightmare! We drew FC Porto in the Champions League 2nd round and they completely battered us 6-2 on aggregate; 3-1 at their place and 3-0 at ours.
December 14th, 2008 at 12:21
WOW!! Is it me or have our performances taken a dive this season? Didn’t Fergie say we would see a marked improvement from the squad this season? Didn’t Fergie say that by October, we would have hit top gear? Didn’t Fergie say that we were just unlucky in front of goal and with time we would convert those chances? Well, none of those prophecies/promises have come to fruition and I’m finding it hard not to be pessimistic when we are not even playing well. It’s not about the results, but simply our performances.
Earlier this season, we were creating chances and missing loads and instead of Fergie to address it then, he chose to ignore it and claim we were unlucky. Now we can’t even create chances, or even convert the few ones we get. Why is this team – the same one which conquered the PL and Europe last year – unable to create decent chances at will? Why do we look like a team that lack chemistry and basic skill sets such as 1-2 passing, accurate set-pieces, crossing and possession play? Why do we look like we are unmotivated and not hungry enough for three points? Why do we look like we are huffing and puffing our way to draws, wins and losses?
If someone can answer those questions, I will be glad. Because my answer is Fergie and his band of dimwits he calls the coaching staff.
If it’s not clear that something is wrong with our squad that originates from poor management, coaching and training, then maybe some have to look closer. The tactics have been awful, the substitutions worse and the attitude of Fergie even more appalling. When was the last time you saw Fergie all giddy when losing two crucial points? Today he was busy prancing about the touchline entertaining the Tottenham fans when we were losing the opportunity to close the gap at the top of the table… wasn’t it him who said this was a very crucial game? Then why was he so looking so happy at not only a disappointing result but a poor performance? Therein lies the cancer eating away at this team.
I will still be optimistic, as United have proven time and again they have the ability to conquer all, despite any setbacks. However, we are currently looking incoherent and clueless as to how to create and convert genuine chances, especially against opposition that defend in numbers. It has become a recurring theme this season and I bet you Tottenham won’t be the last team to employ this tactic against us. What makes me afraid is that if we can’t find a way out of this mess, we might be looking at a lot of draws and losses, which might result in a loss of potential silverware come end of the season.
December 14th, 2008 at 12:31
anyone else think fletcher is back to his old self?
December 14th, 2008 at 12:59
seems to be that we’re back to 2004/2005 and 2005/2006 – transitioning from one great team to another. Maybe we’ll turn it all around and romp home with the title by the end of the season with all the home fixtures, or maybe we’ll come out of this stronger next year. Who knows? Definitely not the most frustrating season, I think 05/06 was worse. It was so bad that I had to start a blog
December 14th, 2008 at 13:08
Fletecher is not a bad player but he is one paced and predictable. I also cannot understand why Anderson is not playing and ditto about Nani. He could be exasperating but he can also make things happen. Finally, it is not good enought to say that Berba is playing out of position. He has to raise his game.
December 14th, 2008 at 13:39
@frankie: berba is suppose to lead the line, not play like rooney. he is subtle, knows when to run and pass, rooney and tevez run about the place like mad men.
when rooneys is played out of postion, its “not his fault,” when berba is, he’s shite and shouldnt be starting. scapegoat if you ask me.
December 14th, 2008 at 14:05
Everyone as i said yesterday and countless times before, we right now are like barca last year, in need of a mini clear out, cutting the fat and leaving the rest before adding more players to our squad. The worst bit of business we did was not selling ronaldo. He was a key player for us last year but he is the kind of player who has to be happy if he is to play well. Come off it we all know he wanted to leave and still does. Well fine then let him f**k off and play for the joke of a club i witnessed yesterday get outclassed by an excellent barca side. Real have no hope of winning anything, if ronaldo wants to go there then fine go play there. £70million for him could have brought us 3 or 4 new players. The way i see it we should have dealt. Brought in diarra (rated as better than essien at lyon) who would have dominated the midfield for us like hargo is meant to do and also got in some cash. Ronaldo has achieved it all in his mind and is no longer fired up to repeat it again. Some people are like that, instead of wanting to achieve it all again, they think ive done it lets move on. If thats his attitude and i think it is then go away. Lets get ribery in who hasnt achieved it all yet and mostly looks like a good lad who will want to win it again and again. Barca this summer realised their squad had to many bad players who had achieved it all but werent hungry for it any more. Ronaldo is like ronaldinho, he needs a new challenge elsewhere. Lets re evaluate the squad and cut out the players who dont want to be here. At least 6 players need to be cut out now, they are mostly older players who need to be replaced by the younger players. These are players like nev, vds, giggs, probably scholes and park and o’shea. Then we also have the players that i think should be in the last chance saloon. Players like nani, kusczak (or whatever hes called), hargreaves, and fletcher who yes has been good earlier on but has faded of late and does not have the talent to ever be 1st team. These players need a warning and need to be given a final year to prove they are worthy or be replaced. I think though fergie will make minimal changes and when i hear nev and giggs may be getting 2 year extensions it makes me think fergie is going crazy. To get to our best we need to get rid of the following and replace them with others:
nev out for rafael/brown/simpson in
vds out with kuszcak last chance/foster 1st choice but a new keeper may need to be brought in later. Adler or neuer i think they are called would be perfect.
O’shea well the less said about him the better. Fabio can replace him.
Giggs and scholes can be replaced by the brilliant looking possebon. How the f**k does gibson get in the squad and go on the world championships games instead of him.
park can be replaced by tosic. Nani is in the last chance saloon, possibly replaced by ashley young, or even ben arfa who is excellent. Why do we have players like park in the squad when we could have players like ben arfa ffs.
Campbell and wellbeck need to be given games. Why are we so scared to drop the big name strikers. If they dont perform then fine they get dropped. We didnt even have a striker on the bench ffs against spurs. How can we not even have a striker on the bench.
As you can see that is a number of players that may need to be sold to bring the squad back to standard. But look at barca they did it this summer and look at them now, plus they had more players to get rid of then us. Its just a few players that need to go in my opinion but i doubt fergie will cut them loose cos he seems to love the osheas and parks of this world.
December 14th, 2008 at 14:38
Lads, Ive read some of the earlier comments(thank God this site is back to life!) and I see some pessimistic views. But let me make it a good day(night?) for you. We have now played all the teams that finished in the top 10 last season away from home. And our record is this:
Pompey: 1-0 win
Liverpool: 2-1 loss.
Chelski: 1-1 draw
Blackburn: 2-0 win.
Everton: 1-1 draw.
Arsenal: 2-1 loss.
Aston Villa: 0-0 draw
Shitty: 1-0 win
Spurs: 0-0 draw.
Stats say: 3 wins, 4 draws and 2 losses. Together it is 13 points of a possible 27. Last season we also picked up 13 of the possible 27. Last season it was:
Pompey: 1-1 draw
Liverpool: 1-0 win
Chelski: 2-1 loss.
Blackburn: 1-1 draw.
Everton: 1-0 win.
Arsenal: 2-2 draw.
Aston Villa: 4-1 win.
Shitty: 1-0 loss.
Spurs: 1-1 draw.
So again it is 3 wins, 4 draws and 2 losses. Not to bad innit? Only difference is the teams and the goal difference. This season it is: 8-6 to us. In 2007/08 it was 12-9. Its only a matter of one more goal last season. We are in the exact same position! If this doesnt remove some of the pessismism, nothing will. Just remember this…
December 14th, 2008 at 15:01
OREZ- He may indeed have thought that BUT…. he was wrong
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/soccer/wires/12/14/2080.ap.soc.man.united.tosic.0214/index.html
…interesting, wonder how much we offered him!?
December 14th, 2008 at 15:45
@RedDevilEddy: Awesome post dude! The facts are always better to bank on rather than just “feeling”. Brilliant.
December 14th, 2008 at 15:55
Eddy those are nicely chosen stats. But you could say by the same token that our impressive home record this season is because we have had easy home games the majority against teams that finished in the bottom half last season.
You are also assuming that we will not get worse in the second half of the season and we will do a LOT better in the reverse fixtures against the top 10 teams and improve our away record against bottom half teams. But I see a team that is already tired and running out of ideas and I am not convinced we will be able to make a big push in the second half of the season when we’ll be having big games twice a week.
Fergie needs to make some key decisions:
1. Take a reserve team to the World Club cup and give the first team players a week off to go on holiday, go to a spa, whatever they neeed to be fresh. In particular players like Gibson, Possebon Manucho, Welbeck, Evans, Neville, Nani, Evra (suspended in the EPL anyway so no harm done) and Tevez could use games and could be rested on their return to get over jet lag. A team dominated by those players would be more than good enough to win the competition without breaking a sweat. Id leave EVDS, Ronaldo, Carrick, Anderson (he’s already been to the Olympics), Berbatov (didn’t look match fit on saturday), Rooney (im worried about an international incident if he stamps on players from every continent) at home.
2. Ferguson needs a better rotation policy. Starting Ronaldo every game is not good because the boy is obviously still struggling with injuries and playing through pain. Carrick and Berbatov were also rushed back from injury. Meanwhile players like Anderson, Tevez and Nani who are fresh and injury free start every game on the bench. Play the freshest team we have and we will be rewarded with more dynamic performances
3. KISS keep it simple stupid. Whether because of Queiroz leaving, the arrival of Berbatov, or Ronaldo struggling to recapture the form of last season….the system isn’t working so well. We should go for a straightforward 4-4-2 with Nani and Ronaldo on the wings Berbatov as a main striker and Rooney playing a little deeper and Carrick/Fletcher playing alongside Anderson/Scholes….i.e. a defensive midfielder alongside an attacking midfielder. Or my preference would be 4-3-3 with Ronaldo and Rooney either side of Berbatov and a midfield of Anderson, Fletcher and Carrick. Either way I want Berbatov leading the line and I want him to score a minimum of 15 goals in the second half of the season in all competitions.
December 14th, 2008 at 15:59
God owen is exactly what you call a predator. 1 chance and 1 goal. Man our attack has just been crap all year, if the reports are true and we can really get him for £5m then i would definitely make the bid. I know people will be saying, how will he get a game if tevez cant well thats easy, owen actually scores goals unlike it seems the other 3 dont. Lets rotate the strikers more and play the players who deserve their spot from perfromances not because of their name. Owen would have been in double figures the number of chances he would have put away for us. His injury record is not great which would be the only negative about him. And for such a small amount of money he would definitely be worth the money. Come on fergie stop pissing around and just get us someone who can actually put the ball in the god damn net.
December 14th, 2008 at 16:11
@Grognard: I’m not telling you how to feel, Dr. Phil. No one here is censoring you. I know you’re feeling all sensitive about some rough treatment you must have received from someone else on this board, but I simply called your crying wolf after every draw a bunch of bullshit. If you took such offense to me saying, “why don’t you take a deep breath” that it inspired you to write a 3 paragraph post about how I make you want to puke then so be it. Puke.
I may be overly optimistic about the side, but considering we won the double last year I figure optimism is in order. It sounds roundly foolish to yell about how the sky is falling and how inept the side is when only six months ago we were raising the two most prestigious trophies in club soccer and have only added to the club since. So forgive me if I don’t choose to view everything as a pile of shit, but I actually like the way the club has been playing, finishing aside. I used to run a blog, called redsunite.com, where I engaged in my fair share of pessimism and doubting, so I can’t be called a starry-eyed yes-man to the United cause. I call it as I see it on most occasions. But I figured in a room full of doubting and cynicism a little bit of positivity was in order.
But apparently there is no room for that, for now I have been asked to leave for ManUtd.com, a site for “conservative thinkers who want to rule the world.” You’re quite reactionary at times and are quick to skip everything between A and Z in your reasoning. Perhaps if you can’t bear to hear anything positive said about the squad than you should go to a This is Anfield, where not a positive word will be spoken of United. You’ll be right in your element
December 14th, 2008 at 16:37
@Matthew: Dude, I doubt it’s as easy as that. Ypu forget 1 little (big) fact. Barca also replaced their manager. Luckily it worked out for them.
December 14th, 2008 at 16:55
@Grognard: Why do you allow ‘optimistic’ people to get under your skin?
I’ve noticed that on this rant site, people are quick to draw a distinction between ‘optimistic’ supporters, and ‘pessimistic’ supporters. The difference between the 2?
Pessimistic supporters – rant about their frustrations with the team/performance (especially after a bad performance)
Optimistic supporters – rant about their frustrations with the pessimistic supporters (especially after a bad performance).
As you can see, both do exactly the same (get rid of frustrations), but each directing it at a different party. I would not like to go into a debate with anyone as to which is right/wrong, as both have their ups/downs. Point is, if the optimist was really that optimistic, what then drive him/her to a site filled with pessimistic views, knowing the amount of negativity on that site after a bad performance? (Is it maybe a divine instruction taken upon oneself to teach others to be more tolerant? I doubt it, becuase then the tolerance would also extend to the pessimist’s performance on this blog). As you mentioned, there’s always ManUtd.com. I believe it is just pessimism disguised as optimism. So, whether we like it or not, we are all pessimistic to some degree on this site. Why should we not be? Our team is hurt, and we care about it.
December 14th, 2008 at 16:57
Karl, lets face it this club has too many players that are too old, past it or are just not good enough. Neville and giggs definitely are not good enough anymore, so how come i keep hearing that they are getting new contracts. That is just wrong cos they are holding back the developments of certain players. Scholes can no longer last 90mins and in reality he should only be used sparingly and never starting games, only maybe against lower opposition. Scholes can get an extra year because of his incredible football brain and so he doesnt need the pace. Van der sar probably is good enough to warrant his extra year contract but he has to finish next year before he becomes too bad but he should be rotated with foster and kuszczak is just crap and should be sold. Park and oshea are also terrible. Forget “they are good squad players” cos they are not good enough to be involved in our squad. Park seems to be 1st choice left winger this year which is just terrible. He is no where near good enough, nani should be 1st choice and park needs to be sold cos he offers nothing except alot of running. Oshea is quite possibly the worst player i have seen. Why are these players not left out or sold and replaced with some of our excellent youngsters?
December 14th, 2008 at 17:08
@Matthew: I’m not disagreement with you. I’m just saying that I doubt it’s that easy. There is also the element of chemistry. This season’s addition (in my opinion) is proof of that. Adding an excellent player to an excellent squad (PL/CL champions) does not guarantee you excellence.
December 14th, 2008 at 17:35
If Nani had half the workrate and football brain of Park then he would be in the first team. For a team that is often criticized for its lack of imagination in the final third, Park is one of the few players in the side that makes incisive runs into space. I’ll be the first to concede that his skill level is inferior, but he can’t be doubted for his understanding of the game. His movements ask questions of defenses, while Nani is a ballstopper, whose movement on the pitch consists of locating himself at the top corner of the 18 yard box, dancing a bit, then banging the ball off the shins of the opposition. Either that or he breaks out his patented stepover, dribble to the right and crank it over the crossbar. I know that he played better football than this last season, but this year he has been a black hole.
December 14th, 2008 at 17:42
@Patrick: Totally agree mate. I can’t believe that some people are still bashing up Park after his performance yesterday, not just on this site but other forums as well. It’s clear that sometimes plain old-fashioned work-rate and determination can be much better than all tricks and no output. But since he’s branded “BORING”, there’s no pleasing some people who want that extra bit of flair no matter what. His has his weaknesses though, which makes me wish we could get a hybrid of Nani and Park. We could call him Naark.
December 14th, 2008 at 17:49
scum are down 1nil
December 14th, 2008 at 17:54
@Patrick: Agree. I also believe his performance will reach and exceed last season’s heights IF he get more game-time. This is a gripe I’ve had with Fergie since forever. Some people always get the opportunity to hit form, whilst others must hope and pray that the moment they get called upon, they can prove they need a starting eleven berth.
December 14th, 2008 at 18:01
Oh by the way, we’re gonna play Gamba Osaka in Japan for the semis. They beat Adelaide United 1-0. We’re gonna be like the away team playing against Gamba in front of their vociferous crowd. I fear for our chances of getting to the final now!
December 14th, 2008 at 18:06
Also, Nani’s problem I believe is due to the tactical instruction given to him. He is required to play as a forward like Ronaldo. For this reason, he always seem to want to get into a goal-scoring position first and foremost, and cross/pass secondary. He needs confidence first to emulate Ronaldo. On Wednesday, you can see he had a clear instruction to provide and he did it very well (just like it seems Ronaldo had instruction yesterday to stay on the wings). I think he need a couple of games where he just cross/pass, with no pressure on scoring.
With Berba (no pun intended towards Berba) in the team, Ronaldo does not play the role of play-maker. It appears that SAF wants things to flow through Berbatov.
December 14th, 2008 at 18:11
@Patrick: You missed my point as so many of the optimistic members of the thought police do. My point was simple, there is absolutely nothing wrong with being optimistic, and your reasons for optimism are valid and strong. However, when you start telling others that the way they are thinking is wrong or that something is wrong with them and that their angle on things is full of shiot, then expect a reaction. For example, calling me Dr. Phil was not necessary. I’m not bald nor am I as dull and full of shit as him. But then how would you know this. You are a newbie on this blog and you come on here and start telling people like me who have contributed thousands of times to watch how they say things and what they say as well.
I didn’t order you to go to Man Utd.com, I suggested it for your own mental health. Because it’s clear to me from just two paragraphs of yours that you are a conservative thinking individual who doesn’t appreciate negativity or points of view that differ with yours too radically. ManUtd.com is just the kind of right wing positive thinking community that you may appreciate more. Negativity is not condoned there. So never feel like I am forcing you there. In actuality, your closed minded personality that likes to control other’s freedom of expression will naturally guide you there eventually I think. In the mean time, if staying here and insulting long time members who don’t always think like you is fine. Perhaps you will even offer some interesting thoughts of your own on football and Manchester United without insulting people in the process. I look forward to those contributions.
December 14th, 2008 at 18:23
@Karl: Karl that is not true although I can see why you might think so. Read what they say. It’s not there optimism about United that bothers me. Not in the least. What bothers me is in their need to be optimistic they feel the need to attack those who don’t share their view. THat’s when I completely lose it. I have no problem with anyone coming on and disagreeing with one of my negative rants. Give a reason and tell me why you think the opposite, but don’t call me names or don’t put my way of thinking down just because I don’t see things that way. Yesterday I was called a little girl, and impatient prick and basically unstable because I was disgusted by United first half of the season. Those entries were out of line and you know this. If I say Fergie needs to be sacked (which I didn’t by the way) then disagree with me and tell me why. But don’t call me a moron and a person incapable of reasoning and logic in your rebuttal. That’s where I get all hot under the collar.
I am a die hard Liberal and I just hate people who try to bully others and force them to think and act like them. It’s my personal pet peeve #1. I am very opinionated on this blog and I do realize that I come across as a bit too negative in my views on football but then again, that’s not a crime. I am often very positive but people seem to forget those many moment where I praise the team or players or when I’m just joking around with certain members. It’s always a newbie on this blog who comes in and tries to take it over by setting his own form of martial justice. Putting down the negative comments and calling individuals names. I’m sorry but it just makes me crazy and I have a hard time controlling my range when they do this. Hell I get just as mad if they were attacking you or someone else on the blog. It’s just wrong to get personal but I will fight fire with fire when it comes to these kinds of individuals. They need to less personal and more respectful of people regardless of their views on the game or team.
December 14th, 2008 at 18:33
@Patrick: On this I have to agree with you a bit although my buddy Craig will kill me. I don’t like Park because he has no skill but he has got positional sense which is important. Nani has struggled in his play and your description of his play was funny yet accurate. However, a player like Nani is a confidence player. A fragile Latin personality that needs time and games to find his form and confidence in a manner that would please us as well as Fergie. I don’t think he will ever improve on this team because his confidence is constantly being played with and because he doesn’t get enough games in a row to built on some momentum and positives. A player like that needs five or six games in a row to find his touch, feel and mojo, for lack of a better word. By playing him one game and benching him the next three, you will get nothing from him. And regardless of Park’s work ethic and footballing brain, his lack of skill is glaring at times and therefore, I feel it’s necessary to give Nani a long run to see if he will stick with the team or whether he should be sold. Park is always useful in a utility role and his quickness and defensive capabilities have their value, but Nani is either the future at left wing or he must be sold. Fergie needs to find out one way or the other, and it might as well be now.
December 14th, 2008 at 18:41
@antsBoy: Different strokes for different folks mate. Park may be your cup of tea but he is not mine or a number of others. And that does not mean you are wrong. Work rate, defensive ability and attitude is important and Park has plenty of that. What he doesn’t have is offensive skills that are United class. And when the team is struggling to score goals or even create them, I find it a mystery why the Boss would start such a player over a player who with all his flaws has got imagination and offensive ability to turn a game on it’s head.
I am not a big fan of the classic old blue collar mentality towards work ethic. I am a proponent of skill and vision. Skill, finesse, vision is the reason I watch the game, not watching uncoordinated players run a hundred mile an hour while possessing two left feet and no skill. It’s just not my cup of tea. I suppose that is why I love Cantona as much as I do and why I love Keane. Keane was a blue collar player but a player who also possessed vision and skill when needed. Unfortunately Park with all his blue collar attitude, continually frustrates me and others with his inability to make a cross, a pass or take a shot that makes a difference.
I’d love him to prove me wrong but I rather doubt it.
December 14th, 2008 at 18:54
Chelsea have let us off the hook. Thank fuck for that. Bring on Osaka!
December 14th, 2008 at 18:54
the big four = the 4 flops! all of the big four drawn
December 14th, 2008 at 18:56
@Grognard: I adressed my comment to you because of you being in the host-seat, but it is not directed at you (if you know what I mean).
December 14th, 2008 at 18:58
@ROOOONEY: Actually, Villa drew.
Arsenal are not a part of the big 4 you know. So, are you guys still dissapointed with the weekend? We are finished with all of our hardest games this season, and all the other rivals draw against worse teams. We beat Hull 4-3 at our place. We beat West Ham 2-0 at our place. This season will be the best ever!!! 
December 14th, 2008 at 18:58
@antsBoy: But you know, all of Asia love United.
They will probably cheer for us. 
December 14th, 2008 at 19:15
@RedDevil: I am still worried. United have always had a history of losing to poor teams
Besides, it’s not the points that I’m worried about, it’s the performance.
December 14th, 2008 at 19:24
@Karl: The performance should be good. I think some of our players(Ronaldo, Berbatov, Nani) really wants to win this trophy. I remember back in June, players were talking about this tournament already then! Maybe our players wants to win it so much that they have had their eyes on it for a long time. Its not an excuse, but it mi9ght be true. Me, Im looking forward to it. Just dont know how to watch the games, they begin 10:30 UK time.
Im at school then…
December 14th, 2008 at 19:24
@Grognard: “Instead of having a competition to see who can be the most outraged United supporter, why don’t you take a deep breath?”
This was the line that made you draw these conclusions: “Because it’s clear to me from just two paragraphs of yours that you are a conservative thinking individual who doesn’t appreciate negativity or points of view that differ with yours too radically. ManUtd.com is just the kind of right wing positive thinking community that you may appreciate more. Negativity is not condoned there. So never feel like I am forcing you there. In actuality, your closed minded personality that likes to control other’s freedom of expression will naturally guide you there eventually I think.”
Easy, fella. I disagreed with you. I wasn’t trying to deny you your first amendment rights.
Grognard: “What bothers me is in their need to be optimistic they feel the need to attack those who don’t share their view.”
Read above comment. You called me a mind-controlling facist. Hypocrisy? You know nothing of my political persuasion and certainly don’t know enough about me to assume that I am an enemy of the first amendment.
Reread my first post, #262 or something, and explain to me where, exactly, I suggested that you COULDN’T express your views. I simply disagreed with them. Playing the political persecution card is ridiculous and every bit as stifling as the benign comments I made about your viewpoint. Every disagreement is NOT an attempt to silence dissenting opinion. I don’t have the desire or the power to do so, so save that shit for daily kos.
For the record, I have a long track record of supporting liberal candidates, human rights, constitutional rights and progressive causes. Everytime someone on the left said something I disagreed with and suggested he spoke otherwise I am not suggesting he should have his freedom of speech revoked, simply that he change his tune. If you can’t see this distinction you have lost your way.
December 14th, 2008 at 19:25
BTW. What do you guys think about this goal?
December 14th, 2008 at 19:30
@Karl: Actually I’m one of the optimistic ones and I rant at the pessimistic supporters who feel the need to post knee- jerk reactions after matches like “OMG, we’re soo shite!”, “Fergie should be shot”, “Giggs should never play again”. I’m up for pessimistic criticism of the team just not the thoughtless reaction from some fans after matches.
@Patrick: You’re being faaar to sensible.
@RedDevilEddy: Are you sure??? I can’t find it anywhere else, not on the United website and not in the physio room either.
December 14th, 2008 at 19:39
@Rd: That is what it said on an article about Uniteds FIFA CWC, that Foster wont travel with the squad. I dont remember which one though…
December 14th, 2008 at 19:44
Apparently foster may be injured and miss the games in japan. If that is true can we still bring some1 else or is the squad now announced so cant be changed. On another note on the squad list to go to this competition, how the hell does gibson get in the squad ahead of possebon. Also manucho is not involved. It is things like this that really piss me off. Why risk injuries to the likes of rooney for a relatively unimportant competition and against opposition that our reserves would probably beat. But back to my 1st point on gibson, what the hell is fergie doing bring him and no possebon. Possebon is 10 times the player gibbo will ever be. Its little decisions like this that sometimes leave me wondering about fergies state of mind, and i really dont like thinking that cos he is a legend for us.
December 14th, 2008 at 19:48
Well Hammers did us a favor and it was a good game too. After reading some other staff I see the point of other people. I guess the problem for most is not the lost points but out unimaginative play. That’s a problem for me too, but I am not sure in regards the reason. I thought that it might be due to bad form of several key players, but then staff like this happens it’s correct to question the formation and tactics. Ronaldo’s problem is due to injuries IMO, he might not be happy but he is a professional and I believe he gives his best every game. Rooney is as always , so nothing to add here. Tevez is low on confidence and so is Berba. I am happy with the defense, but the midfield has it’s own issues too… I am going to play football now, so will continue later.
December 14th, 2008 at 20:07
Who else is gonna watch Milan vs Juventus tonight? Looks like becoming a great game of football, these teams are in form and have scored an average of 3 goals in each game during the last 7 years. “Experts” on TV promise goals, so I will defo watch it. I think Juve are gonna win 3-2.
December 14th, 2008 at 20:19
@RedDevil: Good point there mate, of all the top three, our game was the hardest, our overall game is not bad, we are controlling games but not punishing teams.
Theres just two questions that I would raise with Sir Alex, what does he see in a hard working but frustratingly average attacking Ji Sung Park and how come Anderson gets a man of the match billing in most of the tabloids after the Allborg game, but still finds himself on the bench as Fletcher runs about like a whirlwind in the middle of the park without actually doing anything, his performances are all bluff and bluster, with no real substance, and the same goes for Giggs, no substance.
Tottenham played like the away team yesterday, we should have left Tevez on, changed Nani for Park, Anderson for Fletcher and went for them full throttle, they would have buckled under the pressure but SAF insists on playimg some players that carry no attacking threat, which means the opposition can concentrate on our players that do.
And for those people who are always bashing Wayne Rooney let me tell you once again, despite his faults and lack of goals at times, it is Wazza that makes our team tick, Ronaldo might give us the edge, but Rooney makes us tick and we are at our most dangerous when both are in the team.
December 14th, 2008 at 21:36
What a game!!! Juve lead Milan by 3-1 at half time. Its begs the question. Will there ever be a 3-1 scoreline at half time between to Premier League giants? My hear says yes, but my brain says no. I love the Prem, but after watching United play another 0-0, watching goals fly in like that make me think about how great this league really is.
December 14th, 2008 at 21:44
@Karl: I totally agree. Do I want us to win a championship while playing like the worst Italian teams in history? Style, substance and entertainment is paramount to a team with an attacking history and tradition.
December 14th, 2008 at 22:07
@Patrick: I am more than aware that I called you names but I never started the problem, you did. You did with your self righteous exploration of my personality and your own version of Dr. Phil that told me to get a grip etc. And how wrong you are mate. I am so hard core Liberal I could come close to being Socialist. I hate Republican’s and right wing agendas with a passion and I hate their attempt to police people’s lives and welfare with their warped values, morals and political correctness.
I’ll say this once more and please try to register it inside your brain this time. I have no problem with positive thinking or with people who disagree with my views or points on Manchester United. What I get all hot and bothered about is when people like you show up out of nowhere and start telling people you don’t see eye to eye with them personally and that there is something wrong with them and that they need to chill out. That they are being disrespectful of players and managers etc is some kind of moral crime that cannot and will not be tolerated. That is not for you to say. You can disagree with my views but you cannot insult me in the that manner. Debate, make your point and show me why I may be wrong, but do not police my mind or my emotions or lack of patience. It’s not your business to do that and I for one find that kind of behavior rude and offensive. And unlike some others, I will challenge and fight whomever speaks to me in that way.
You and I have gotten off to a wrong foot and for that I do regret my part. But the fact that you seem incapable of seeing how wrong you are disturbs me to no end. I know I can be very opinionated and a bit of an overbearing SOB at times but it’s only because I care and have a 40 year passion and love affair with Manchester United. If you could respect that about me and others, you could learn tolerate the differences in our outlook. I am not always negative but my negativity is famous because I express myself boldly and with passion. I’ve never heard of you before yesterday and yet you are quick to judge me as right wing conservative as I was quick to do the same thing to you. In that we are both wrong and for that part I apologize. In truth I am a bleeding heart who cares about people and injustice and is not self centered. Where I am right wing is in my desire for Manchester United to reach perfection and total utopia. Unrealistic but they came close in 99 and last season. I expect a lot from that team and when they don’t deliver for half a season, I have the right as a paying fan to question and criticize. I spend a lot of money on pay tv, merchandise etc on this team and I want value for my money. It doesn’t come to me easily. That’s something Fergie seems to have forgotten in these recessionary times. That people want value for their buck. 0-0 and at least 15 boring results this year have me feeling totally ripped off compared to last year for example.
I hope you can understand a little bit more of where I am coming from. I don’t like anger or animosity towards fellow members. I do like passionate debate, but lets make things less personal unless we are talking about pleasant things. There is no need for either of us to start accusing, labeling and calling each other names. I hope we can come to a peace treaty because anger and animosity is such a wasted of energy and emotion.
December 14th, 2008 at 22:10
@Orez: Don’t kid yourself. That is three times now that the leaders have opened the door to us and we have closed it on ourselves. Had we won all three game we would be in first place. Add to that the lack of entertainment value and blokes like me are questioning why we waste two valuable hours at least per week?
December 14th, 2008 at 22:12
@RedDevilEddy: It’s still satanic football because it’s Italian. You couldn’t force me to watch a Serie A game. Everything that is wrong with the modern game today has been spawned in Italy.
December 14th, 2008 at 22:17
@299 patrick Big thumbs up to you mate. For more reasons than one. The problem with the type of above mentioned guy is that they will vigourously attack others views for not being in line with their opinion but with their emotions, at this stage if you put forward your point, they will resort to mudslinging and tantrums and finally start crying murder. They would not debate in disagreement but accuse you of stiffling their voice, bullying, personal attack,and that you are telling them how to think etc . So there is no argueing with them, or atleast the point of it. I have nothing against their persona, but these people make immensly negative fans who come to message boards and spill their demented minds on it abusing the manager and players, calling them senile and whores, but want no heat for it, ( even sarcasm is like hot needle in the balls for some). All in the name of free speech. Ps. Some guy was calling himself obama a few days ago so there you go. seems more like hillary sarah palin to me.
now watch him dance.
December 14th, 2008 at 22:24
@Matthew: Emmm, maybe because in the last 2 times both players have being fielded, Gibson was better. Possebon was average in the B’burn match while Gibson had a good game and yet Gibson was the one being played out of position, I don’t get your 10x the player Gibson will ever be comment cus there isn’t much better them right now, though Gibson is older. Maybe you should think well about decisions before jumping on Fergie??? And on Rooney, it might be pointless to you, but how do you know Fergie feels the same way?? Judging by the fact that Fergie is taking along all the available first teamers we have, surely it shows that he wants this trophy. Though imo, I’d have left one of our first choice defensive partnership and Berbatov too.
December 14th, 2008 at 22:28
@RedDevilEddy: Okay I just saw it on the United website, and Ben Amos is being drafted to replace him, but it says “slight” injury, so hopefully it shouldn’t be up to a month. I really have high hopes for him and its really sad he’s had awful luck with injuries.
December 14th, 2008 at 23:10
Rd, gibson was crap at wolves last year and he has looked crap in the games he has played this year despite that being a low amount. Possebon however has been ripping the reserve teams apart and never seems to waste the ball. He played a few games earlier on in the season against the likes of newcastle and pompey and in the carling cup and put in a few good performances there. I tell you gibson will never be a united player. How old is he now, 22, he is the next eagles he will be playing in the championship next year. Possebon is a prem player, and i cant believe mate that you cant see the difference between the 2. And as for rooney coming along, well is it worth it him getting injured for some cup that really doesnt matter. Sure i would like to win it but the prem and champs league is more important so why are we risking tiredness and possible injury to play in a competition that isnt that important and against crap teams too.
December 14th, 2008 at 23:28
@R: Fuck you!
December 15th, 2008 at 0:28
@Grognard: While I am certainly done arguing with you over whether or not my comments were out of line, I am not done discussing football with you. There is an interesting article in the Guardian about Barcelona’s goal scoring supremacy of late and I thought you might be interested.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2008/dec/12/barcelona-la-liga-messi-sid-lowe
December 15th, 2008 at 1:00
@Grognard: Well, Juve won 4-2 in the end. Had they not scored that last goal I would have won £200. Shit!
Fooking italian footy! I usually dont watch italian games, nor bet, but its been a goal-poor weekend in hte Prem, and the commentators and experts promised me goals, so I decided to watch it. Great game, I must say. But I still hate italian footy.
December 15th, 2008 at 1:20
@Patrick:
“Motivation became a problem after winning the Champions League”……..this is exactly our problem at the moment……..
this team needs to be shaken to the core, so that we can come back strong like barca..
December 15th, 2008 at 1:32
I wanna put an end to the stupid people that are talking about Chelskis amazing away record. What the fuck is up with those guys? They have played terrible and are very predictable. I put up some stats of our away games yesterday, and its showed how difficult our oppositions away form home had been. Now look at Chelski:
Wigan 0-1 Chelski
Shitty 1-3 Chelski
Pompey 0-4 Chelski
Stoke 0-2 Chelski
Boro 0-5 Chelski
Hull 0-3 Chelski
Rovers 0-2 Stalins bitches
West Brom 0-3 Stamford Cock army
Bolton 0-2 Chelski
The 3 away wins we have had this season is against the exact opposition that Chelski have won against. Pompey(1-0), Rovers(2-0) and Shitty(1-0). That is the only oppositions we have both faced away form home. Look at the other teams. None of them can expect to end in the top 10 this season. Even Rovers, Pompey and Shitty are nearly in teh relegation scrap this season! Away heroes my arse!
Their home games against Liverpool, United, Arsenal, Spurs and West Ham have ended with only 3 points of 15. Who is in trouble collecting points this season? We are in a really good position, believe it or not! Liverpool have faced West Ham, Hull, Stoke and Fulham, but have gotten only 4 of 12 points. They have met really easy opposition, except for us and Chelski. THey beat us thanks to an own goal and a mistake by Giggs/lucky shot, and they beat Chelski thanks to a deflected shot. They are not title challangers, for fucks sake! 
They will travel to the Emirates next week, and to Old Trafford in 2009. They have met easy oppositions, and they have shown abvious faults in their game. This season is gonna be the best ever, maybe it will be 3 teams fighting for the title on the 38th match day. 
Sweeeeeet!!!
BTW. In the Champions League, where Chelski have met difficult opposition away from home, they have collected 2 of 9 points. See what difficult away games can do to one. We are in an exellent position and I am 1000% sure we will win the Premier League.
December 15th, 2008 at 1:34
Why the hell is every comment I write that is over 2 paragraphes awaiting moderations!
Its annoying…
December 15th, 2008 at 1:36
@vikas: I agree with that to an extent. I’m not opposed to selling a player who seems untouchable just to shake up the squad. I’m also not opposed to sitting players on principle. I don’t think it would be wise to sell for the sake of selling, just because we’re in a rut. We have alot of world-class talent in the side, even if they do need a bit of motivating.
With all that said, I don’t think that we can be faulted for a lack of effort. While certain players–namely Ronaldo–haven’t quite seemed up for it lately, we’ve been utterly dominate in possession of late, just failing to finish on dozens of chances. I don’t know what you can do to motivate a striker to score. Of course they want to score. First, they’re strikers, it’s in their blood. Second, scoring a goal is a euphoric feeling that is addictive. Third, no one likes or feels indifferent about losing. Fourth, they are all professionals. I don’t think they lack motivation, just confidence and, perhaps, a bit of focus and composure.
December 15th, 2008 at 1:37
@Patrick:
Nice article, Barcelona’s form has been intimidating so far. I’ve always admired their football philosophy and when it works they are a beautiful side to watch. I had my doubts about Guardiola taking over but he has done a great job reigning in some of those massive egos. Don’t think I’ve ever seen Henry work this hard
Doubt he’ll ever hit the form of his best days at Arsenal again, but he’s starting to click with Messi and Eto’o and even at 80% he makes up an absolutely frightening front line with them.
@RedDevilEddy:
Thanks for the comparison to last year. Fortunately for us, this is turning into a pretty strange season with all of the big four dropping points left and right. If it hadn’t been for that we would have looked a lot worse, even though we’re on pretty much the same course as last season. Old Trafford is still a fortress and with things still so close in the league, our ridiculous away schedule may turn out to be a blessing in disguise.
December 15th, 2008 at 1:43
@YDR: I wanna put an end to the stupid people that are talking about Chelskis amazing away record. What the fuck is up with those guys? They have played terrible and are very predictable. I put up some stats of our away games yesterday, and its showed how difficult our oppositions away form home had been. Now look at Chelski:
Wigan 0-1 Chelski
Shitty 1-3 Chelski
Pompey 0-4 Chelski
Stoke 0-2 Chelski
Boro 0-5 Chelski
Hull 0-3 Chelski
Rovers 0-2 Stalins bitches
West Brom 0-3 Stamford Cock army
Bolton 0-2 Chelski
The 3 away wins we have had this season is against the exact opposition that Chelski have won against. Pompey(1-0), Rovers(2-0) and Shitty(1-0). That is the only oppositions we have both faced away form home. Look at the other teams. None of them can expect to end in the top 10 this season. Even Rovers, Pompey and Shitty are nearly in teh relegation scrap this season! Away heroes my arse! Their home games against Liverpool, United, Arsenal, Spurs and West Ham have ended with only 3 points of 15. Who is in trouble collecting points this season? We are in a really good position, believe it or not! Liverpool have faced West Ham, Hull, Stoke and Fulham, but have gotten only 4 of 12 points. They have met really easy opposition, except for us and Chelski. THey beat us thanks to an own goal and a mistake by Giggs/lucky shot, and they beat Chelski thanks to a deflected shot. They are not title challangers, for fucks sake! They will travel to the Emirates next week, and to Old Trafford in 2009. They have met easy oppositions, and they have shown abvious faults in their game. This season is gonna be the best ever, maybe it will be 3 teams fighting for the title on the 38th match day. Sweeeeeet!!!
BTW. In the Champions League, where Chelski have met difficult opposition away from home, they have collected 2 of 9 points. See what difficult away games can do to one. We are in an exellent position and I am 1000% sure we will win the Premier League.
December 15th, 2008 at 1:46
Sorry, 4-0 win over Pompey was in Carling Cup. Nontheless, we are in the best position. We usually play our best football during the winter/spring and if we do it again this season, silverwear is coming to Old Trafford.
December 15th, 2008 at 1:59
@RedDevilEddy:
I honestly don’t think Liverpool will still be in it by the end of the season. They’ve been riding their luck too often this season and once we get to the latter stages of the CL, Benitez is bound to start over-rotating his squad again. Arsenal will have to fight for their top four spot unless Wenger spends big in january (never going to happen). He has replaced the players that left over the summer with some very mediocre ones in my opinion. So that just leaves Chelsea. Their home record has been pretty poor since their unbeaten streak was ended, and like you said, they haven’t had a tough time on the road yet. So, even though we haven’t been prolific, I’m very optimistic about us winning that third consecutive title. I don’t see us going all the way in the CL though, if I’m not mistaking no team has managed to win it twice in a row since they changed the format, and if Barcelona manage to keep up their current form I don’t see anyone in Europe capable of stopping them.
December 15th, 2008 at 2:08
I really liked the Barcelona article. I would really like us to play 4-3-3. If Barcelona can do it with Henry, Etoo, Messi…we can do it with Rooney, Berbatov and Ronaldo. That system may be playing Rooney a bit out of position but it would bring the best out of Berbatov and Ronaldo ensuring they have plenty of support and giving Anderson license to push forward as Carrick and Fletcher would both be able to cope with defensive responsibilities. Really we could use another attacking midfielder as Possebon is not quite ready and Hargreaves is out this season but other than that we are set.
December 15th, 2008 at 3:15
@Patrick: I thank you for that. I am not a Barcelona fan but the way they are playing the game this season is a true delight. Actually it’s kind of ironic that United are playing the way Barca played last season. Barca of course sacked the manager and made some key changes in players but mostly in philosophy. I’m not advocating that of course but a change in playing philosophy would be nice because we do have a very talented side.
December 15th, 2008 at 3:19
@vikas: I think you bring up a key point. Motivation is poor and Fergie looks to us on the outside looking in like he has mellowed with age. I miss the days of rants of rage, kicking boots at players and bringing out the old hairdryer. Athletes do occasionally need a kick in the ass to get them motivated and hungry. I also think that he needs to play the proper lineup and stick with it so that they become familiar with each other. Rotating never did a world of good for Rafa. A starting eleven that plays half a dozen meaningful games together in a row, will start to play better and there will be better understanding and instinctive play. Don’t you think?
December 15th, 2008 at 3:23
@RedDevilEddy: For all my negativity this first half, I have often placed much of the blame on an absolutely brutal and unfair first half schedule. I’ve never seen anything like it in any sport ever. Playing the other top nine clubs on the road in the first half and having to play several of them right after a Champions League clash,just bloody diabolical.
The second half should be much better for us. The tough games will be at home and the road games should be easier. Still, there is a lot that needs ironing out with the squad before they can take advantage of the second half.
December 15th, 2008 at 4:53
well… might be a bit late but….. i only got to see the match on MOTD sat down to watch it.. thinking.. where are the goals… saw dickheaddawson go off and thought this can only mean more goals… yet to my dismay.. i see yet another dizzzzzmal performance that made a league 2 side look more up for it… bloody rubbish.. i say again berba!?! £30mil! we well and truly got done on that piece of shit… tevez was lack luster.. but most of all WHY THE FUCK DOES PARK GET PLAYED AHEAD OF NANI!!!!!! and ronaldo your a twat who should of got sent off for that petulence… carn’t even take a good tackle nowadays…. and fergie for the love of god don’t ever wear that stupid beenie again ever!! now we know where mcClaren got his fashion sense from.
come on guys really. step it up… about 12 gears, that, or bench berbashite
December 15th, 2008 at 7:25
@316 same to you. Bitch.
December 15th, 2008 at 7:50
Hey does anybody know why RVN is not playing these days?
December 15th, 2008 at 8:35
@AndyCR7: He’s injured for the rest of the season. Knee problem I think.
December 15th, 2008 at 8:36
Grognard you are not a saint. Get a life old man. You know nothing about soccer. You only a specialist on pressing panic button. In Fergie we trust! Manchester United Forever.
December 15th, 2008 at 10:17
A very disappointing display. With the players available and the right mentality it should have been a win.
Passing it around for 80 minutes with no great threat on goal was bizarre to say the least, did they not want to win? Reminded me a bit of Lyon last year.
No movement, no speed, no one to pass to.
Too many weedy minded players on the pitch at the same time, Park, Carrick, Fletcher…they don’t have an ounce of aggression in them.
I would have preferred to see them lump it forward after 60 minutes instead of the same contented possession. It was like watching robots, tired personality-less robots. The Spurs defence isn’t exactly brimming with confidence at the moment.
How did we expect to score? By what route?
I hope something can ignite the flame in this squad.
There’s nothing dreadful about losing away to Spurs but it was the way United played and the feeling that it could have been so different that was incredibly frustrating.
Unlike a few years ago when the team didn’t get past the group stages in the Champions League, when there was no one else to pick from. Now there’s Anderson sitting on the bench…there’s Nani sitting on the bench.
The attacking line is blunt without the midfield helping it, these are passing players not Emile Heskey. Still, they weren’t very good…all the forwards have been unsatisfactory this season…even before the arrival of Berba, when he was injured, and when he was in the team.
It’s a general problem not one players fault… Tevez didn’t offer more than Berbatov on Saturday, but it seems Berbatov’s price tag is making people impatient with him.
Maybe Zaki would be a better weapon for a flat-footed United at the moment, but I would prefer Berbatov and a faster more positive minded midfield to support him.
December 15th, 2008 at 10:26
Martin, I’m not even going to bother with an insignificant little ass nugget like yourself. You’re not worth the effort or the grief.
December 15th, 2008 at 10:28
@R: Real mature Stone Cold. Did you get a tutor to help you write that Shakespeare?
December 15th, 2008 at 10:29
@AndyCR7: He’s injured and out for the season.
December 15th, 2008 at 10:45
The Sun says Tosic might have fallen through: (from F365)
They report that you Serbian winger Zoran Tosic has turned down their initial contract offer, putting his £3million move from Partizan Belgrade in doubt.
In fact, they don’t just report, they have quotes from the man himself to back it up:
“United’s offer does not coincide with my demands” Tosic said.
“But we agreed to stay in touch and I believe that everything will be fine in the end.”
Don’t know how I feel about it – I mean he was kind of out of the blue to start with, if he is now playing hardball negotiations…just sounds a bit greedy to me, and that his talen isn’t there to back it up.
December 15th, 2008 at 11:08
@337 Nope. Done away with the tutor, was too bloody harsh on people for my liking!
December 15th, 2008 at 14:42
Spurs there for the taking, double their possession and Ferdinand’s 2 efforts on goal probably the highest number? When we were crying out for pace, on came 2 players. The young Giggs would have shredded their right side, the older one dithers and dallies, occasionally threading a decent pass. Anderson had played well in mid-week and surely the game cried out for his forward thinking. I’m extremely sad that Nani hasn’t been given the run of games that Park has. They have only further proved what has always been obvious about Park whereas we know that Nani has potential but he’s not getting nearly enough game time. Add Gibson’s preference to Possebon and I do feel a huge well of pent-up frustration. The only real happiness this year has come from young Rafael, and I can scarcely believe Fergie is actually playing him. Want to be positive but hate this slow slow football – and don’t get me started on bleeding back passes to the goalkeeper.
December 15th, 2008 at 14:44
So our offense is clearly the issue this season, and undoubtedly bringing in the Berb has been part of that. However, given that he is so clearly dripping in ability, it seems bizarre that we can’t fit him in. The main problems I see at the moment are:
1. Rooney, Tevez and Berbatov avoid the box like plague. All 3 see more comfortable coming back to the centre circle than plunging forward towards the opposition keeper.
2. Last season Ronaldo was at his best when he was cutting in from the wings, and taking up positions central on the edge of the box. This season Berba is there, with two defenders, so there’s no space.
3. Park, for all his effort, doesn’t actually produce anything other than being in great positions. Which would be fine if he could finish/cross/pass, but just being somewhere is not helpful.
4. Rooney and Tevez have been very inconsistent.
5. When we have looked vunerable, it seems ot be a result of Ronaldo/Nani not tracking on the wings and offerign support to the full back.
So, for at least a game (maybe Japan?) I’d like to see Fergie try something completely new:
————EVDS————-
-Raf—-Rio——Vidic–Evra-
——-Carrick-Feltch/Ando—
—Tevez—Berbatov–Rooney–
————Ronaldo———-
Now I know Ronnie doesn’t have much experience playing as a CF, and that this is a position where ‘feeling’ the last man and making intelligent runs is key, btu lord knows none of other forwards do that anyway. Rooney and Tevez will both put in a shift defensively, and both are creative enough to create. Rooney isn’t a terrible crosser, though Tevez is limited. Berbatov can then sit in his little hole without marginalising anyone, and act as a foil around which the others buzz about. Plus it gets the 4 most talented players on the pitch together, which should really come good at some point. And even if it doesn’t, it’s not like it could produce less attackign intent than the last few games…
December 15th, 2008 at 15:10
Grognard, I’m not even going to bother with an insignificant old ass nugget like yourself. You’re not worth fucking.
:
December 15th, 2008 at 15:29
Grognard:You are right I have to agree with you we miss Queiroz;
orez: Dude Fergie never won the premiership in the RECENT PAST without Carlos Quieroz for ex: 2003,he was the assistant,2004 went to madrid and we lost,2005-2006 returne to united the very next year we went on to WIN the EPL for two consecutive years..I reiterate my point we miss QUIEROZ….i have to agree with GROGGY!!!
December 15th, 2008 at 15:51
We are four points worse off then we were this time last season, we are not playing great but teams do seem to play for the draw against us more than last season, but are are also not opening them up enough.
We lack creativity in the centre of the park, and goals from the centre also, Liverpool have Gerrard Chelsea have Lampard.
Berba isn’t setting the world alight but neither is Ronaldo who to me is looking to fall out with Fergie, almost every week with his pechalent behaviour.
We don’t in my view miss CQ, do we miss McClaren also? Giigs and Scholes did well when they came on on Sat, but that is the first time for a while Giggs has made a difference when comming on.
Park is a great lad lots of energy but no quality and would not get in any of the other top 4 teams, but I believe Fergie plays him to protect Rafael.
Fletch is also a great worker but no quality and also would not get near any of the other top 4 sides.
And finally can we all just get along we might not agree with each other but we must tolerate and respect each other opinions, the site is called Red Rants and people should be aloud to do just that.
December 15th, 2008 at 16:44
Well that’s surprising:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/m/man_utd/7784101.stm
December 15th, 2008 at 17:16
Well, this is even more surprising!!! and brilliant
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_4650581,00.html
December 15th, 2008 at 17:34
@Beachryan: It’s about time the FA realise that they and the media are doing everything to to help undermine English football’s best ambassodor (United). I mean, some of the stuff they come up with is ridiculous… the villifying of our stars, esp Rooney and Ronnie, then the Evra rubbish
The alleged Rooney ’stamp’ was not a even a big deal until the media blew it out of proportion, in the process, making United look bad.
I just hope Uefa see sense and not respond to the media’s call for a Rooney ban.
December 15th, 2008 at 17:37
@antsBoy: haha
just as I was typing that plea… Glad to see the media don’t have as much influence over UEFA as I thought 
Bring on the Knockout stages of the CL!! 
December 15th, 2008 at 17:57
Bloody hell, Christmas came 10 days early…
Rooney and Ronaldo excused for nothingness, what’s next, our appeal on Evra’s ban to work?
December 15th, 2008 at 18:36
Ronnie for violent conduct??????????? How about John Pantsil for bringing the game into disrepute for his pathetic comedy sniper from the stands moment, fucking cunting joke!!!!
December 15th, 2008 at 18:40
@Martin: Highly original. Copying my statement for a reply due to the inability of your own Neanderthal mind’s to properly formulate a thought yet alone put it down in paper. Poor little insignificant panty waste. He has come out of nowhere to a new blog and he’s trying to make a name for himself. A new challenge for the little punk that got kicked off the school ground because everyone got tired of his bullying tactics. Now he has come to Red Rants and he plans on making his name. Too bad his mommy still has to help him spell it and potty train him.
Grow up you piece of trailer trash. You low class gutter snipe. You don’t come on to a blog and start to insult people and expect them to take it lightly because you want to make a name for yourself. The moderator of this blog is on holidays or you would certainly have been warned by now. This blog has rules. If you don’t like what I have to say, ignore it and move on. You don’t know me and you have no reason to serve up your poison due to the fact my thoughts aren’t simpatico with yours or because my age is such an issue. But then would I expect anything to be truly wired properly upstairs in that bone head of yours. Fuck you and the horse you rode in on you antagonistic little dog’s pizzle.
December 15th, 2008 at 18:41
@R: Was your tutor as harsh with you as you are with me?
December 15th, 2008 at 18:47
@redrock 21: Queiroz may not be the answer for us as future manager of the club. God knows he failed with a stacked Real side and he’s presently struggling with a talented Portuguese national team, but as a #2, he was outstanding. The team came prepared and hungry. Tactically they also seemed able to change styles of play within a game. Something I haven’t noticed our team this season doing. I’m not so sure that he would be the motivational kick in the ass the lads need. Like Barcelona last year, what ends up happening is a team stops to listen and tunes out a coach after they have been together for too long a time. That means that the team needs to be tweaked with some new player coming and old players leaving. A new fresh atmosphere seemed to work over there. They also got a new manager but I am not advocating that. What I am saying is that the team has gone stale. It needs to be freshened up. Nothing to radical, just subtle.
December 15th, 2008 at 18:55
@ Grognard – I’ve been thinking that maybe this Club World Cup could be that kickstart. Maybe it’s optimistic, but this trip will do several things:
1. Act as a break point in a tired-looking season
2. Show the team how much they’re appreciated, all over the world
3. Hopefully get a pretty rare trophy
4. Just make us pause, get away from daily grind and hopefully have a little fun
December 15th, 2008 at 20:25
@redrock 21: I know that we miss him, but nobody knows to what extent. You see SAF won a treble with a crappy #2 as McLaren. I mean this guy is one of the worst I have ever seen. This is not to say that you are wrong, It’s just that, when you make an argument and use statistic to prove it, don’t use half of the info or the ones that help you.
@RedDevilEddy: Thanks for good posts man, cause I totally agree with you. What a lot of people don’t think about is that it’s possible that our harsh schedule is a bigger part of a problem that we think. Is that the case? I don’t know, but it can, after all we didn’t have an easy match for some time. Strong away games and a Sunderlans SuperBus in the last month. Also the World cup doesn’t seem to be a big deal. I mean we gonna play just 2 games at best.
December 15th, 2008 at 21:28
@Grognard: The sarcasm was that my “tutor” wanted me to twist in the knife a bit more on the comments section, so I had to fire him due to my “peace loving” nature.
Anyway unfinished business on some other day…..
December 15th, 2008 at 21:49
@Grognard: Grog, mate, I know you. Not in person, but I know you are better than this. I want the best for this site, just like you do, and you are mature enough to not bother with such comments. I know he doesnt follow the rules, but when an immature prick comes and breaks them, you should not act like him. Act like the person you are, the one who wants the best for this site. Remember, there are some kids reading here.
Make RedRanter proud, and show that you are better than falling for his teases. I am a nautral in this case, I dont want to be involed. But I want the best for this site as I spend a lot of time here. So please look at this as a positive comment for you, and not a negative.
Cheers.
December 15th, 2008 at 21:55
@Martin: People on this site are allowed to say tehir opinions. As long as they dont critise another human being. You, my friend, did. If someone says Ronaldo is playing badly and should be rested for 2-3 games, then that is his opinion. Maybe another doesnt disagree with that, but that is also his opinion. To say that a man, that has followed football since the 1960s, watching talents like Cantona, Beckham, Charlton and Best come in and out the door, does not know football is a grief insult. And to say that someone is an old man? Well, that is just disrespectful and immature. If you are someone that critisises people, and dont allow other people to have their own opinions you have nothing to do here. Either behave, or get lost.
December 15th, 2008 at 21:58
@R: I know Grog told you to fuck off, but what shuold you do in a situation like that? Tell him to fuck off too? No, you are going to move on and not care. It may hurt you, but Ive heard many people tell me to fuck off, and I am still alive. If you go on without responding to such stupid comments, you come out as the bigger man and with your dignity.
Just an option.
Cheers mate.
December 15th, 2008 at 22:11
@Orez: I jsut want people to open their eyes and see that we are in a brilliant position to win the Premier League again.
Optimism is very important, very underrated in fact. Optimism brings confidence, and therefor more will and greater desire. What does this team lack? Skills? Ronaldo, Rooney, Tevez, Berbatov, Anderson, Nani, Rafael… Eh, I guess not. Vision? Rooney, Anderson, Scholes, Carrick, Ronaldo, Berba. Young, fast players? Rafael, Anderson, Ronaldo, Rooney, Tevez, Nani, Possebon, Welbeck. Old, experienced players? Giggs, Rio, Neville, Scholes, VDS, Hargreaves… We have it all! But why wont it work out? One word: Confidence! 
Ronaldo, last season, perfomed week in, week out(well, most of the time). This summer was ruined by the Real saga, his injury and his motivation to win the Ballon DoR. Last thing may not sound like a bad thing, but it is. When he returned from injury, there were still some fans booing him. Press wanted to critisise him in everything and when he doesnt score a goal in each game, people start bashing him about not wanting to play for our club. 
HE IS ONLY HUMAN!!! Damn… I think the fans will play an important part for Ronny to get back to old form. It might make us sound shallow, but we want the best for the team right? Cheer on him, scream out when his name is pronounced before the match, wear his shirt, kiss him, everything that can make him happy. His arrogance may be annoying, but that is what won us the double last season. Cheerio… 
Gonna come with more points as time go on. Tired now…
December 15th, 2008 at 22:19
@the three Rs: Spurs were nowhere near for the taking, at home, been on form, brimming with confidence, gotten good results against the other big 3. They were nowhere close to being for the taken. Probably the only club that was there for the taking and we failed to do so was Everton.
@Matthew: The fact is that, the tournament is NOW and not in the future, so I see no reason why Fergie should pick Possebon ahead of Gibson when Gibson is more on- form than Possebon right now. Compare the 2 since Possebon came back from injury, he’s been average at best in the reserves, and the few times Gibson has played, he hasn’t been that bad. Surely, Possebon has miles more potential than Gibson, but thats not what we need going into a tourney right now. So imo Fergie’s decision makes sense.
December 15th, 2008 at 22:50
@Rd: You can guarantee, even if they were there for the taking, the ineptitude of our strikers would have still come up with nothing – O where have all the shots on goal gone – long time passing
. Ronaldo’s goal should have stood, because it was UNintentional, and only intentional handball is penalised. O where have all the good ref’s gone, long time passing – 
.
December 15th, 2008 at 22:57
@Orez: Its just a big bunch of excuses mate. It isn’t down to the hard matches, but more to the fact our strikers have had chance, after chance, after chance, and let them go begging
. We were ahead in some of these away games, and still LOST, because we are poor at closing down games – sorry but its true Bro.
December 15th, 2008 at 23:05
@Beachryan: Club World cup
. Looney, I want to be world beater 
, like this pathetic meaningless competition really is worth losing 10 days for. If Looney wants to truly be world cup winner, try doing it for England. I’m dead against losing 10 days during PL season, and something should be done about it. Never mind the fictitiousness of being trans world champions if we win this, its a joke to make money – end of. We should trying being champions over some of the so called lower PL clubs first, because its laughable in present circumstances, the way we are doing, to start to rejoice over the possibility of beating two teams I have never heard of in this fiasco in Japan.
December 15th, 2008 at 23:31
@Beachryan: I agree. It’s important for United to not only win this but to show the world what kind of football we play. I hope they do well.
December 15th, 2008 at 23:39
Rd, you make a decent case and of course you are entitled to your opinion and im not going to disagree with you mate but i would have to say that i would prefer a possebon in my team than gibson. Maybe it wont make such a difference anyway as it sounds like we will be playing a pretty strong team anyway so probably gibson wont get much games anyway.
December 15th, 2008 at 23:53
@RedDevilEddy: It’s not you who was attacked mate. In fact my friends on this blog should have come to my defense rather than tell me I’m better than this. The truth is I come from a different generation where internet babble and insults are common place but it’s not something normal to me and I don’t stand for it.
When people insult me on line, I unfortunately take it to heart, and even though I hate myself for doing it, when I get baited, I retaliate out of self preservation. Honestly my heart and soul can’t take it. I’m a little too sensitive for my own good. I must have said to people on this blog over 100 times in the past that I don’t mind anyone disagreeing with my views and even giving valid reason for me being wrong. But I’ll be damned if I allow people to vilify me and make me out to be some unreasonable, scatter brained, shoot from the seat of my pants miserable old bastard. I only cures and call someone names if he has done it to me first. Tit for tat you might say. And even worse, I have come to the defense of others on this site when they have been mistreated. Who came to my defense the last three days? Nobody. And truly, I’m just old school and traditional enough to be hurt by it. It feels like you are have a few ales at the pub with a couple of mates and then three hooligans grab me, beat the crap out of me and my mates just watch.
What really gets me is I wasn’t the only one being negative. Others were calling Fergie senile and far worse things than I was. Did they get this crap thrown at them? NO. Yes it’s pathetic that I’m kind of feeling sorry for myself but being referred to as an old man and a right wing bastard when I’m hard core left wing and very liberal really upset me. They called me impatient and in that they are correct. I hate to wait for things to happen, but last time I heard, that wasn’t a crime.
Red Ranter is not around to moderate and some new guys have taken advantage of this to let me have it because I rub them the wrong way. They don’t debate with me and tell me that they think the opposite. No, instead they are reduced to name calling and character assassination to make their case because they clearly don’t possess the intellectual capacity to debate with me. Instead it’s “United forever”, “Fergie forever”, like some trained seal act. A bunch of conformist yes men who like to bully others into submission. Well, it’s not going to work with me. I am the Prince of Fucking Darkness and although I may be a bit too sensitive, I have a much stronger constitution than they may think. I’ll outlast all of them on this blog unless my friends on this blog vacate me yet again when I’m in need of a bit of support. Then I might just feel myself cast out to sea on a lifeboat.
As for making this site the best it can be, or RR proud, I think that’s more his responsibility. And he hasn’t been around for a while.
December 15th, 2008 at 23:56
@RedDevilEddy: A lot of wisdom for someone so young. Perhaps I’ll borrow some of it in the future. And thank you sincerely for the support mate. It means a lot.
December 15th, 2008 at 23:58
@Matthew: They both offer positives. Gibson has a great shot and seems a little better defensively but Possebon is so Scholes-like on the ball and is very composed for his age. I too prefer Possebon for those reasons.
December 16th, 2008 at 0:04
@Grognard: I support you m8! I just havent been around so much the latest days. Didnt see it before 3 hours ago, I think. But I talk to you more, becuase I believe you are an intelligent person that wont be fished in by stupid pricks. Thta is why I went to you first. You got friends Grog, I will never let you get hung.
December 16th, 2008 at 0:35
yeah grog dont worry about it mate, you got more mates and people who respect you on here than most so if push comes to shove and you need some support there will be people there backing you, but yeah i know what you mean when someone insults you online it does make you extremely pissed off. Sometimes you just feel like tracking them down and telling them to insult you face to face to see how brave that person is when they arent hiding behind a computer screen. But seriously mate i know its hard but just try to ignore them. Maybe these people are attacking you cos they want a response from you and they will then gain recognition as being the person who had a right go at the legendary grognard. People like me and RedDevilEddy respect you alot mate, your a more experienced person who has seen it all with this team and with life in general so your opinion is quite important. Me and eddy are just teenagers so we have alot more to see and live that you have been through already so you have our respect. Just dont let these pricks get you down mate.
December 16th, 2008 at 1:25
do you ever post new entries redranter?
December 16th, 2008 at 1:34
@RedDevilEddy: Thanks mate. Good to know one has some bro’s on this blog for moral support. And the support goes both ways too.
December 16th, 2008 at 1:40
@Matthew: Thanks mate. You are so right. They just bring out the worst in you and you really would love to see the cowards come out from behind the computer and say those thing to me face to face. And although i don’t brag about this, I am one big (tall and heavy) mofo who
Thanks again for your support. it means a lot because I guess I’m just too sensitive these days.
has fought many a douchbag in the past and who intimidates very easily in person. That may sound like bragging but it isn’t, it’s the truth. And yet, I am not a trouble maker or a person who seeks out fights or who gets drunk and ornery. But sometimes your reputation and character as well as your honor is challenged by surfing blog trolls who have nothing better to do than attack people like snakes in the grass. It’s low and it’s the sad and pathetic act of cowards.
December 16th, 2008 at 1:41
@Grognard: Just out of curiosity, what is your beef with Zlatan? I know you hate Serie A, but you cant honestly tell me he is overrated. I have been a big fan of his for a few years now, and at the moment he is arguably one of the 2 best strikers in the world, the other being Eto’o. I know he is an asshole and prolly a terrible teammate, but his talent is undeniable.
December 16th, 2008 at 1:49
@Martin: If you dont have anything constructive to bring to the table, then please post elsewhere.
December 16th, 2008 at 4:34
@johnsom33: I don’t have a problem with Ibrahimovich other than the fact I feel he is a soft player who is woefully inconsistent. When the going gets tough, I feel he disappears. Great finesse skill but soft in my opinion. And he is known to be selfish so why would anyone want to play with a guy like that? And sorry, as good as he can be sometimes, he is woefully overrated. It’s not like he is scoring 30 goals a year or even 20.
December 16th, 2008 at 8:46
Grog you are lying to yourself if you think putting 100000 words on this blog gives you licence to diss others. Your rants are so boring and not analytical. Did you notice the drizzle, the wet pitch. How many teams can play well in wet turf, unless it’s Chelski of the Mourinho era. Did you watch the Spurs v Man u game, I wonder? You can’t even analyse a game with an open mind, serve for your fits. You need to climb down from that high horse of yours. Have a great day old man. In Fergie we trust, Manchester forever!
December 16th, 2008 at 8:49
Is Zlatan not a lot like Berbatov?
@Grognard: I know you were being treated unfairly and I for one should have been a bit more vocal of that injustice. But sometimes, a person have to ignore some posts. I could see that some people tried to provoke me as well, but I just decided to ignore it, and now, I can’t even remember who they were.
You respond to every post (which is a sign of respect as well). People use that to provoke you. Sometimes, the best form of insult is to ignore someone by not even bother to reply to them.
As I said, some take their frustrations out on the team, others take it out on other fans, because quite honestly, they feel that they can’t touch the team, but they can get a response from bloggers. They just as frustrated, otherwise they would not pop up here. (Like seeks Like). Pessimism/optimism are just excuses.
December 16th, 2008 at 9:35
Things seem topsy turvy in the land of red ranters on my visit after several days.
@Grognard: Grog I think you get targeted more cuz you post here more than anyone else does, and you also respond to posts the most. Alas, you would just have to ignore some of the buffoonery that would come your way!! And don’t worry about support…the infantry might be late, but it’ll be there!
December 16th, 2008 at 10:24
@Martin: Who are you?, I have never seen you on this site before and maybe mate you should respect other bloggers who have been on this site a lot longer than you.
December 16th, 2008 at 10:39
@Martin: You really are a cunt, arent you. Why cant you put it in your big head? If you are here to critisise others, you should just fook off. Im not one for using bad words or critising people, non of us here are. We keep a clean and safe community so that everybody should say their opinion without being afraid to get critisised. And who the hell are you? Ive never seen you on this site before, and when you come in the first thing you do is to tell people they are old, should get a life and climb down from the big horse. I think you are the one who should get a life and dont act so arrogant. You say you support United? Then act like a true United supporter! We stand UNITED!
Damn, some people are stupid…
December 16th, 2008 at 11:13
@Martin:
Please analyse the match for us, I’m interested in your opinion
Other than the rain and Spurs, why did United have so little chances? It does rain a lot in Manchester so the team has plenty of practice in those conditions.
December 16th, 2008 at 11:33
@ Grognard :
I post seldom, partly because I have a terribly slow net connection in my room. But then, I read each and every comment around here, by subscribing to them via mail. I just want to let you know that you are the most intelligent blogger around here. Your posts are filled with passion for United. I can see that and so can a lot of others around here. Yes, your posts may sound negative, but they still make sense if only people could see where you come from. You have grown up to see United play wonderful football and when suddenly we play bad footer for half a season for no apparent lack of hair dryer treatment then its obvious that long standing supporters like you will be unhappy.
@ Martin, I do not understand why you want to come over here, an extremely happy community, and try to provoke people. State your comments as your opinion will you, and not jabbing another blogger in the ribs?
December 16th, 2008 at 11:53
It’s going to be really interesting to see how Berbatov reacts to all this bad press he’s getting. He seems to me quite a proud man, and arrogant, so I would hope he would realise it’s not good enough.
Here’s the bit I don’t understand: if you’re Berbatov, and you’re trying to prove your worth to fans and the manager, and presumably you’re fit, why don’t you put in a bit more effort, even just temporarily, until everyone realises that you’re worthwhile? I mean I can’t honestly believe the man would kill himself if he ran a little bit more. Even if it’s just absolutely busting a lung to get into the box. Fine, maybe you don’t get your head to it, but just being in there upsets defenders and might create something for someone else.
I stand by my previous post, that the answer lies in moving Ronaldo into a furthest forward, CF role, and playing Berba behind him.
December 16th, 2008 at 12:11
@Beachryan: Mate it is a bit square pegs on round holes, putting Berba in the hole, Rooney and Carlos out wide with only two natural midfielders and Ronnie up front.
December 16th, 2008 at 12:48
@ Stephen – I sort of agree, though think if you look at their attributes, and the way we play, it wouldn’t be any more square pegs than it is now.
At present we play:
Park out wide – He can’t cross, can’t beat a man and isn’t that fast.
Ronaldo out wide – Admittedly, he’s rather good
Berbatov ‘up front’ – But he never actually gets into the box
Rooney ‘up front’ – Again, doesn’t like the box (city goal aside) and is a terrible finisher
Tevez ‘up front’ – Take Rooney but even worse finisher
Nani – Great winger, pure and simple. If we want width, he’s the best option.
Giggs – No idea what he’s good for, kind of a mildly interested AMF, with poor pass completion % but decent vision.
We don’t have the players to work a 4-4-2, as we don’t have box predators, so even if crosses were coming in, there’d be no-one there to get on the end of them. It’s how we used to play a few years ago, so not sure where it went, but it’s well and truly dead.
We have a good 4-3-3 system for tough opponents, but against weak, deep sitting defensive sides it basically means we just pack the middle even more. Especially as 2 of the front 3 tend to be Rooney and Park, who again like to be outside of the box.
What I propose is a bit more like the xmas tree, but not quite. I think it takes advantage of our squad better than them in a 442. I mean, we call Rooney a CF, but he’s really a SS. Ditto Tevez. And watching Berbatov this season, in my opinion he is too. So we have no CF. But we do have a 6′1″, two footed, lightning quick, great leaping best finisher at the club, who is being marginalised out on the wing. So I thin a 4-3-3 or a 4-2-1-3 is the best way to utilise our squad:
————–VDS————-
–Rafa–Rio—–Vidic—Evra–
——–Carrick-Fletch——–
———–Berbatov———–
——Rooney——–Tevez—–
————Ronaldo———–
The width would come from the full backs (both of whom love to get forward) with the two midfielders providing a shield. Berbatov can sit in his little pocket unimpeeded, connecting play. Rooney Tevez and Ronaldo do their usual thing of intermixing and buzzing about.
Anyway, that’s the only way I see us moving forward as long as Berbatov and Rooney refuse to stay forward. Because at the moment, teams know that we’ll jame up the edge of the penalty area, with Park, Rooney and Tevez as the ‘target’ men in the box. Which doesn’t intimidate big CBs at all.
December 16th, 2008 at 13:01
@Beachryan: Ithink you are over loading the forwards too much mate, we can’t play them all and one needs to fall out.
If we play a 4-3-3- we need three centrel midfield players, Carrick, Anderson and ideally Hargreaves. Then play Rooney, Ronaldo and pos Berba as the angel on top of the tree?
With all forwards playing we would concede too may goals, and yes maybe play that at home against some of the weaker sides but I would like some cintinuity with our team and formation.
We lack real quality in the centre of midfield bar Carrick and maybe with Scholes back he might offer some of that but not for 90 mins. Fletcher is playing as well as his ability allows him, but he is not a top four starting player regardless of his endeavers and work rate. Park is simply also not good enough, but I believe a 4-3-3- is worth a lookk maybe like this?
VDS
Rafael Rio Vida Evra
Scholes Carrick Andy
Roonie Rooney
Berba
It loads our midfield and gives R/R the licence to get in behind and Berba to drop, also gives us the insurance policy of weight in midfield, and easy to switch to a 4-4-2 when needed.
Sorry for the poor English but at work and have to do the end of years to rush through for the accountant!!
December 16th, 2008 at 13:02
@Beachryan: I thought Berba should a lot more intent in the second half the other day. I thought he was unsettled initially with the fans booing him in the first half – every time he got the ball. His passing was poor too in the first half. But I thought there was a marked change in the second half.
Also Ronaldo I thought, was not upto his usual standards in the first half. But then, as soon as Giggs came on and Ronaldo was given license to go up front, I thought he was good. In the CF position. I really, think we should emnploy this, with Rooney, Ronaldo behind Berba. Berba should lead the line with Rooney and Ronaldo behind him. That should see us reverting back to last seasons formation minus Tev. What say you?
December 16th, 2008 at 13:06
@Beachryan: I also doubt if Ronaldo can play up front as a leading man.
@Stephen: Scholes Andy and Carrick in the midfield? Dont you think thats a little too attacking?
Andy likes to surge forward, Carrick has potential but screens and ball well. Scholes too is attack minded. So I think, the defence will be hard pressed. I think we should have Fletch and Carrick in the middle with Andy. Hargo in for Fletch when he is fit.
December 16th, 2008 at 13:10
Martin, you claim your a united fan and yet you still refer to us as “manu”. Anybody who knows anything about our great club knows that its only outside fans who call us manu, and no proper united fan will ever mention us as manu. We are man utd, united, the reds etc but we never are manu. If you went to a match and shouted out “come on manu” in the stadium, the fans would know you were a bandwaggon fan and probably only been to see them once before. Please if you didnt know then fine, but we are not manu so dont call us that again ok.
December 16th, 2008 at 13:12
And as soon as Tosic signs, although it looks like his deal is in trouble, I would like to see him in action. If he is first team material.
@Beachryan: Spot on about Park though. I think Park alone has missed atleast 5-6 oppurtunities which a better winger could have put into the net. He cannot finish if his life depends on it. He either waits too long on the ball, shoots wide or staright to the keeper, when it would have been a goal anywhere else. I simply do not understand how he is allowed to get away with golden misses like that. Off the top of my head I can come up with atleast two chances which any other guy would have buried into the net.
December 16th, 2008 at 13:15
@UnitedUnited: Scholes is too attack minded? not anymore mate, at 34 he does not get as close to the box anymore.
December 16th, 2008 at 13:37
It seems to me as a stated in a previous post that Ronaldo seems to be looking to fall out with Fergie.
I know it sounds odd and maybe its me as I have been at a bottom of a bottle for the past week with Xmas and footy, and my alcholed saturated paranoid brain has been working overtime.
Tottenham – Pathetic and petulant kick at Dawson
Sunderland – Subbed himself when Fergie was bringing on a sub at that point.
Citeh – Sent off
Villarreal – Got invoved with various issues, but was clattered numerously.
Aston Villa – Got involved with their supporters.
These are our recent games and his form has dipped somewhat maybe down to the team, Fergie himself, and to me he is still wanting to move move on with Jan comming up is he trying to fall out with Fergie like Becks, Stam, RVN ect?
The list is endless with the players Saffy has fallen out with!! and then they are sold, but this could be me and it all could be coinsidental.
December 16th, 2008 at 13:43
@Martin: Im afraid you have come to the wrong blog, No one knows who you are or where you come from but your are swiftly becoming unwelcome. I suggest you change your attitude before RedRanter comes back, because at the moment you are on a fast track to getting banned.
December 16th, 2008 at 13:46
@RedDevilEddy: Matey don’t fall down to his level he is not worth it, in Grog we trust!
December 16th, 2008 at 13:48
@Stephen:
Maybe you are reading too much into it. But another perspective can be : Fergie is giving him too much of a free rein. This is debatable but, we havent seen a player of Ronaldo’s calibre since Cantona left. Scholes, Giggs, becks, RVN were all very good but none of them were ” the best player in the world”. So I guess, his arrogance needs to be curbed by SAF.
Scholes isnt as attack minded as he was but, he doesnt defend as much too does he?
December 16th, 2008 at 13:53
@UnitedUnited: You maybe right mate, but I think Scholes can be used as a deep lying playmaker with Andy to get forward and Carrick to sit and screen the defence, as well as tick the game over.
I must admit when we signed Veron I thought we had signed one of the best players in the world, but wasn’t to be, but Fergie playing him off a main striker and right mid probably didn’t help!
December 16th, 2008 at 13:58
Ben Foster has broke a finger in training….
December 16th, 2008 at 14:41
@Beachryan: “we do have a 6?1?, two footed, lightning quick, great leaping best finisher at the club, who is being marginalized out on the wing”.. well said mate. Quite my sentiments.
).
striker, but I am in favour of giving him more limelight within the box. I’ve stated this b4, that Ronaldo does not have the free license to roam and license to shoot as he did in the last season, and that is impacting his performances. He can cross all day if he likes, but then who’s gonna put them into the net?? (Berbatov hardly visits the box these days, Looney can try but he won’t be able to finish, and Tevez wouldn’t be able to reach em!) Think his limitation to flanks gets him frustrated many times (I’d like to optimistically take this as the reason for his recent attitude and form
Ronnie needs to be in & around the box, cutting in from wide positions. And then the confidence and the goals would come. And by heavens do we need em!
December 16th, 2008 at 14:47
@Beachryan: “we do have a 6?1?, two footed, lightning quick, great leaping best finisher at the club, who is being marginalized out on the wing”.. well said mate. Quite my sentiments.
I’m not saying we play him as a leading striker, but I am in favour of giving him more limelight within the box. I’ve stated this b4, that Ronaldo does not have the free license to roam and license to shoot as he did in the last season, and that is impacting his performances. He can cross all day if he likes, but then who’s gonna put them into the net?? (Berbatov hardly visits the box these days, Looney can try but he won’t be able to finish, and Tevez wouldn’t be able to reach em!) Think his limitation to flanks gets him frustrated many times (I’d like to optimistically take this as the reason for his recent attitude and form
).
Ronnie needs to be in & around the box, cutting in from wide positions. And then the confidence and the goals would come. And by heavens do we need em!
December 16th, 2008 at 15:08
Paul Ince got the sack for Blackburn…
December 16th, 2008 at 15:36
MArtin: Dude get the f out of this blog u prick..U really are getting onto people’s nerves here..this is a site where people are free to express their opinion so if you cant take it then Fuck off mate!!!just leave us the fuck alone u little twat..
December 16th, 2008 at 15:43
Why are my comments waiting moderation?
December 16th, 2008 at 16:30
@Stephen: That’s my FIFA 09 Formation, Baby! We run shit.
December 16th, 2008 at 16:36
@Patrick: Quality
, it might be worth another go as Scholes hasn’t got the legs anymore, Carrick can screen the back four and Andy can do all the leg work and get forward. It would free up the two R’s to really do what they want, and Berba can hold the line but also drop in to allow the other two boys to run through, maybe worth a punt.
December 16th, 2008 at 16:52
I like the idea of 4-3-3’s and 4-1-2-1-2’s, but it leaves you susceptible to counterattacks on the wing and decreases your ability to get your fullbacks forward because it is difficult to cover for them effectively in formations that clog the center of the pitch. Furthermore, considering that Rafael, while the lad clearly has a future as bright as the sun, is only 18, to leave him on an island with both attacking and defensive responsibilities with little cover would be irresponsible and bad for his development.
The 4-4-2 is the formation of choice for most teams because it provides the most balance and strength, both going forward and in defense. Additionally, given our admitted inability to score when given the opportunity, moving to a more attack-oriented formation is a risky maneuver. It isn’t for a lack of chances that we’ve failed to score of late. We’ve dominated possession and pinned teams back for long durations with nothing to show for it. I don’t think that moving a winger into the front line would really make any difference. And besides, Ronaldo is pretty much a third attacker as is. He has very little defensive responsibility and isn’t too diligent in his efforts to get back.
These are the questions that lay before us, as I see them:
-Who do we play in the hole, Berbatov or Rooney? Do we place the bigger target man, Berbatov, in the hole, robbing Rooney of his mobility and movement in order to keep a predatory striker up front? Do we place Rooney in the hole and take away a fine target for direct aerial attacking in order to place Berbatov, who leads the team in assists, in the poachers role? Or do we allow both of them to move freely, while risking the chance that the 6 yard box may be vacant at crucial moments?
-What are our expectations for our holding midfielders? Do we expect them to get forward very often? Do we want them penetrating back lines? Do we expect their first responsibility to be defensive, protecting the back four? How do we get more goals, or any goals, out of the position? Considering our miserly defense, couldn’t it be expected that they could take more chances going forward and supplement the attack more regularly to provide more bodies in the box for those crosses that seem to find no one?
-Once we answer that question, what first team pairing fulfills that role?
-Who should be our first team left winger, Park or Nani? Nani has loads of potential and given regular first team opportunities may show returns on the promise he exhibited last year. He is a fine crosser of the ball, but as we have mentioned, no on in our side can get on crosses, so what is the point? He lacks the experience and football intelligence to make the runs that ask questions of defenses as regularly as Park does. Park, while clearly inferior in skill, size and athleticism, has a much greater work rate than Nani and makes the best runs in the side. His feet and size let him down quite often, but he certainly opens up defenses through his motor. He is not nearly the ball-stopper that Nani is, so the offense maintains better continuity when he is on the pitch.
That’s all….
December 16th, 2008 at 17:07
@Patrick: I agree on most points especially with regards to Rafael and the fact that he needs cover, but 4-3-3 or whatever people want to call it does allow your fullbacks to get forward as you have no natural width?
I am a 4-4-2 man like most United fans as that is what we have been brought up with, Park currently is a Fergie Favorite, with Nani redundant to the sidelines as he is a little erracitc and Park is a safer bet as he gives us cover but for the lack of a better word he gives us fuck all going forward. The other opion is to give Carlos a run on the left as he works his arse off and gives us something going forward? I know this again is square pegs in round holes, but we don’t have a natural left sided midfielder as Giggsy now does not have the legs, and we have three right midfielders not including Hargo competing for the right birth.
Or Another option is to give Andy a go on the left like Fergie did with Becks and Fletch who were both centre mids, (I know Beckham stayed out there due to his crossing ability), when they were younger to protect them a bit, and to give them first team action, the lad has a left foot which would give us a bit of balance out there.
December 16th, 2008 at 17:22
@Stephen: It’s not that I think Rafael couldn’t get forward in a 4-3-3, it’s that we would be vulnerable on the counterattack. Given that we can’t score goals lately, one counterattacking goal against will probably make the difference between 3 points or 1, or 1 point or 0.
I like the idea of Tevez on the wing, giving up on crosses aside from when our fullbacks overlap. If we could get Rooney, Berba, Ronaldo and Tevez in a free-form, short passing offensive attack with minimal crossing and an emphasis on interchanging parts I would love to see that. Aside from Berbatov, who lacks the motor to be effective on the wing, all of those parts are largely interchangeable. Placing Tevez on the wing would provide United with the ability to defend from the front, with Rooney and Tevez’s workrate providing United with the ability to regain possession in attacking positions.
December 16th, 2008 at 17:41
@Patrick: I agree, it is as I said square pegs, but it would bring back the flexibility we had from last season with the interchanging of positions which would create space for really all the forwards that will hopefully bring us more goals.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:13
@Karl: You are absolutely right mate. Thanks for that. I obviously cannot meet certain people face to face or I promise you they would piss their pants and the term old man would change to I’m sorry Sir. Red Ranter not being around has cause these trolls to latch on to the blog the way parasites do to bigger fish in the ocean. I will take your advice as the last thing I need or want is an ongoing monologue with a complete Neanderthal or two.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:14
@Rahul: I could use a little air support too thanks.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:23
@Martin: is a arsenalogist he is just trying to agrivate us bc his club and manager sux.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:23
@UnitedUnited: Thanks so much for the kind words. You put things very well. Yes I blog a lot and yes I do come across negative much of the time, but I’m sure other regulars like yourself have read positive comments from me many many times as well, humorous ones. The problem with some people is they fel threatened when others intimidate them intellectually. Because they are incapable of forming thought and expressing it the same way or as often, they lash out at those who can. Martin is an example of a modern day French Revolutionary who dreams of being Robespierre. He worries about me and my influence on this blog while dreaming of taking it over with his presence and putting my contributions on the chopping block. Little does he know that these actions will cause his own demise form this blog once Red Ranter returns. I’d suggest to him to get a grip, grow up and learn some manners, or else. Thanks again for the support from you and others. It means an awful lot to know that ones blog mates support my contributions and my knowledge. Greatly appreciated.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:26
@Beachryan: It’s going to be difficult because like Stephen’s term about square pegs, Berbatov’s square peg style is trying to fit in where all the other ones are round. Fergie has him playing to high up and that is literally killing his game. I feel for him because he is a class player through and through.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:32
@Stephen: I agree 100% with that formation. Beachryan had some interesting ideas but I do fear our defensive capabilities would have suffered greatly. One of our three big forwards (not counting Ronaldo) is going to have to accept a role coming off the bench. With that said, I like your formation and that one works very well for me. The only change I would make is Hargo for Scholes when he returns.
The key element is that Berbatov has to be played up top and kept there with very little tracking back. He can hold up longer direct balls to him and Rooney and Ronaldo can interweave and use their considerable talents and speed to support him. The speed of our fullbacks overlapping could really make this formation sing.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:36
@UnitedUnited: I’m trying to understand why a virtually unheard of Serbian kid would even challenge the pay structure offered to him by a club like United? It kind of makes me think he has the soul of a mercenary and the first chance he gets, he will jump to the team of his choice, once he has built a reputation for himself with us. Nice looking player but I question his commitment already.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:37
@Grognard: “The problem with some people is they fel threatened when others intimidate them intellectually. Because they are incapable of forming thought and expressing it the same way or as often, they lash out at those who can.”
“I obviously cannot meet certain people face to face or I promise you they would piss their pants and the term old man would change to I’m sorry Sir.”
“They just bring out the worst in you and you really would love to see the cowards come out from behind the computer and say those thing to me face to face. And although i don’t brag about this, I am one big (tall and heavy) mofo who
has fought many a douchbag in the past and who intimidates very easily in person. That may sound like bragging but it isn’t, it’s the truth. And yet, I am not a trouble maker or a person who seeks out fights or who gets drunk and ornery. But sometimes your reputation and character as well as your honor is challenged by surfing blog trolls who have nothing better to do than attack people like snakes in the grass. It’s low and it’s the sad and pathetic act of cowards.”
“Grow up you piece of trailer trash. You low class gutter snipe. You don’t come on to a blog and start to insult people and expect them to take it lightly because you want to make a name for yourself. The moderator of this blog is on holidays or you would certainly have been warned by now. This blog has rules. If you don’t like what I have to say, ignore it and move on. You don’t know me and you have no reason to serve up your poison due to the fact my thoughts aren’t simpatico with yours or because my age is such an issue. But then would I expect anything to be truly wired properly upstairs in that bone head of yours. Fuck you and the horse you rode in on you antagonistic little dog’s pizzle.”
If anyone is bringing down the level of discourse on this blog it is you. Relax, mate.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:37
@Stephen: I agree. In fact his bread and butter play the past three years has been the vaunted back pass.
December 16th, 2008 at 19:43
@Stephen: You could be right but my theory is that he just has a very immature way of dealing with physical pain and frustration. He has been knocked around this season like no year before and he is hurting. I also think he is hurting over the way he has been treated by many fans (guys like him and myself are often very sensitive and we are prone to lashing out at others when we are abused) as well, he has been very frustrated with his own play. All these combined have had him turn on himself and the whole world. Hopefully he will get his head turned around soon or perhaps he is limiting his days with us and he doesn’t even realize it. His presence on the field seems to dictate our style of play. And right now we are not playing well because he is not playing well and is being physically marked out of games. Is it too bold a statement to say that when a team reaches this point, a fresh approach is needed and perhaps a fresh look with different players. Barca had to get rid of Ronaldinho in order to wake up. Perhaps United need to do the unthinkable also. I certainly don’t want to see him go, but would it be better for the team? What do you and others think?
December 16th, 2008 at 19:53
To lose Ronaldo would be penny-wise, pound foolish. Considering we have almost no aerial threats in our front six, rendering crosses pretty futile, getting rid of our most creative player and best playmaker on a team that is dependent upon breaking down opposition defenses off the dribble would be unwise. I understand that it worked for Barcelona, but they have Henry, Messi, and Eto’o, all of whom are capable of breaking down back lines on their own. Without Ronaldo we would be left with Rooney and the presently well out of form Nani. Everything would have to come through passing, which would make our inept offense even worse.
December 16th, 2008 at 20:35
@Patrick: Patrick, I thought you and I were beyond this point. Everyone of those quotes attribute to me were retaliatory in manner. I never start that kind of stuff but quite often I finish it. It’s my defense mechanism and although I am not proud of it, I occasionally use it because frankly, some people deserve it when they snipe at me out of nowhere.
My biggest gripes are not with you. I thought we had buried the hatchet and moved on. My gripe was with two others. So why not make peace with me? You might find that I’m not such a bad bloke after all? It’s hard to relax when I am baited into a confrontation and then I am blamed for all of it. Not fair, not even close. Especially when I never started the proceedings. Read other the thoughts of other long time members. They don’t seem to have a problem with me and they all are supportive of me. Why? Because they know over the past two years that I am not the trouble maker or the one that ever starts a fight. My problem is my pride and rage often never allows me to walk away and ignore the occasional troll who come on here just to pick a fight. This is a very peaceful and very happy and friendly community on Red Rants. Bullies and trolls are not welcome. Although you and I got off to a start, I noticed that you do have an interest in talking football. So lets talk football shall we. Whether we agree on points is not important. It’s sharing ideas thoughts, complaints and joy that matters. Don’t you agree? The less baiting and name calling on the blog, the better we all are. I’m no saint, I never claim to be, but I am also not an instigator of hate and bile. Being negative, impatient and discouraged by my team from time to time is certainly not a crime and certainly within mine and everyone’s rights. Why you seem to be having a problem with me is beyond me because like I said before, all my words of anger were made in retaliation. I am not the instigator, and that is very important here. Cheers!
December 16th, 2008 at 20:47
@Patrick: I don’t want to lose Ronaldo. But if our style of play is stagnating because of him, if his attitude is poisoning the dressing room, then perhaps it has to be looked at. Last Summer 90% of Mancunia wanted him gone. Again, I don’t want him gone, but remember that if we were to sell him, the money we would get would be a significant amount. Should The Glazer’s keep their grubby paws off it, the players we could buy would help turn the teams style of play and attitude around. Even with a healthy, happy Ronaldo, I feel that perhaps the opposition is catching up to us and has figured out a few methods to slow us down and minimize the amount of quality chances we get. Add to that our poor finishing of late and what you have is a team that’s temporarily out of whack. Patience may very well cure the problem. As you know, patience is not my strong point but, we’ll wait and see. In past years I’ve always had faith in Fergie even though it’s normal to often question some of his technical and tactical choices. But as he nears the age of 70, I wonder if he is still up for the challenge. Only time will tell whether I am right or whether I am wrong.
By the way, as you are new to the blog, if you are directing your comments to specific individual, before you begin typing in the box, click on the gray arrow next to his name and you will get his name show up in red next to your comment. If of course your comment is for all, then just continue as you have. I just thought I would help you with that.
December 16th, 2008 at 21:26
Feed the scousers, let them know its Chrsitmas time!
December 16th, 2008 at 21:36
@Grognard: Honeslty Grog, you cant mean that Ronaldo should leave.
He is getting critised for things that no-other person in the world would be critisised for. He just came back from a really bad injury, and he has gotten lots of knocks after he started hitting top form. Against Villa he got a bruised ankle, against Villareal he got studs flied in at full speed in his knee, against Shitty he was abused by Richards and against Sunderland he got a hip injury that took Rooney 3 weeks to recover from, while he only got 6 days. 
I cant remember the last game I saw when Ronaldo didnt get injured or got a knock. Its a disgrace… I dont think its so much Berbas fault anymore, as they both showed at the start of the season(West Brom, Aalborg, Celtic and West Ham) that they work really well together. Its just that Berba has been played “out of position” and Ronaldo has gotten injured approximately every other game. And, we have faceddifficult oppositions. I cant remember Ronny playing well against Spurs, Villa or Everton last season. Nor the games against Arsenal away(even though he scored), Rovers or Pompey. Maybe it is true Ronaldo is only great against medicore teams, and that is what has made him play so “badly” this season. The teams…
December 16th, 2008 at 21:37
@RedDevilEddy: how did you get anderson to score from a corner?
December 16th, 2008 at 21:52
@dan(u-ol): First I made Andy take the corner. Then I had to find the oerdect spot to aim at, before I had to choose the correct power and swerve. Believe me, I tried to score with him from the corner at least 5 times. But when I lead and dominate, I feel I have the right to shoot without any worries. You gotta try it out lots of times, it aint easy.
I score one with Nani once, from the other side, but it went via the goalies head. 
December 16th, 2008 at 21:57
@RedDevilEddy: I agree with you mate. As you know I am one of the vocal pro Ronaldo members. He’s one of my favorite footballers and I would be gutted if he left. However, one has to be able to make sense of all this negative body language from him. Also, would his leaving and then reinforcing the team with some talented new blood make this team better for years to come? We have become far to predictable so I am just floating the idea out there for debate. For the record, I do not want us to lose Ronaldo. Players like him come around once every thirty years. I do disagree with the notion that Ronaldo plays poorly against good teams. He gets far more attention and world class defending and marking when he faces a great club. It’s up to others on the team to pick up the slack when he is being double marked and hacked down. Right now we have a bunch of ball watchers who are waiting to see Ronaldo do something special. And it’s been difficult for him this year for all the reasons I have given earlier. As Rooney and Berbatov and others pick it up a bit more, and as Ronaldo starts to improve more from all his physical aches and pains, then I think we will see the real United. But then again, that may not happen. Not if he continues to get hacked down every game. How much can his body take? How much more can he take before his emotions totally get the better of him and he snaps? What this team needs on the pitch more than anything is a policeman like Keane. Someone who will send a message to opponents who try to hurt our lads. And we presently don’t have that. We have become a soft team without a physical or intimidating presence like our great sides in the 90’s. Back then the Guvner, Keane, Bruce and others would never let opponents get away with that kind of assault and battery on Cantona or other stars. Above all, Fergie wouldn’t stand for it. Controlled retaliation was part of the British game back then but the game has become so technical that emotions are secondary to function. I’m not advocating dirty play, but a team needs players who will send a quick and direct message to violators. God knows the referees in this league are muppets.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:10
I was watching Football Fone-In on FSC last night and their guest was Robbie Earle. He said he believes the reason for Berbatov’s fall-off in form was due to the fact that he spent last year moping around White Hart Lane. He suggested that when you are moping, your form drops off. Therefore, he said it was just a matter of time until he was able to regain his prior form since, as he believes, it takes months to gain top form in modern football.
With that said, I think the same thing could be said for Ronaldo. His time spent moping around has seriously plagued his play of late. I don’t know what we can do with him, for he is virtually irreplaceable. But if his demeanor doesn’t improve quickly, Sir Alex will have to decide whether his relationship with the side is reconcilable. I know he has carried several knocks and really received some rough treatment this year, but he seems less patient with all of it because of his slight displeasure with still being at Old Trafford. Alot of this is speculation, of course, because I don’t know the lad so I can’t say if he is truly unhappy. But every physical cue he gives suggests that he may be eying an exit eventually.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:13
@RedDevilEddy: Further to the topic of protecting Ronaldo with a policman, I just read that Mark van Bommel is interested in joining one of the Big Four in England. Long noted for being a superior defensive midfielder and above all, a very physical hard player, van Bommel is just what we need to police the pitch and ofer the defensive protection we need. Bayern look ready to let him go at the end of the season because they are buying the Ukranian Tymoschuk who is younger and also very good as a DMF. van Bommel is not everyone’s cup of tea but his grit and graft on the pitch along with his no nonsense attitude would send a quick message to opponents who feel they have the freedom to cripple our stars. MVB is hated in Germany by the rest of the teams and their supporters because he is a no nonsense sheriff out on the pitch. He also has a great long distance shot, is a good header and a very good passer. He would be a good answer for us for a few years.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:21
@Grognard: Agree with your last post. Fletcher is the closest thing we have to a midfield enforcer and the lad weights next to nothing. He just wins balls on sheer grit and determination, but I can’t believe he is too intimidating. I thought Hargreaves might have been able to fill that void, but lord knows he can’t stay on the pitch.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:24
@Grognard: I would rather have De Rossi, Gattusso or even our own Hargo instead of MVB. Its not that I think he is a bad player, its just that I think those three are much better suited for United. Ive watched MvB before, and his play doesnt impress me. Good long-range shot, yeah. Tough tackler, yeah. But I dont like the fella. Maybe its just me…
December 16th, 2008 at 22:25
A couple questions of those of you from England:
1) Why isn’t there a more thorough compendium of statistics for football. It seems as though there are categories that could be compiled that are not. Additionally, where do you go to find statistics on the web?
2) I have always enjoyed the fact that football commentators are somewhat anonymous. I just saw Robbie Earle for the first time in my life last night and I’ve probably heard him call 50 games. It’s such stark contrast with American sports where the commentators are just as much celebrities as the players themselves. I was wondering if it has always been this way, and why?
December 16th, 2008 at 22:27
@Patrick: I agree with you on the form issue. When your attitude is all out of whack and you have been pouting for a long time, it’s tough to turn it up a notch automatically and go out and perform. Berbatov has struggled to find intensity in his game and for me he has been far too tentative. Always looking to pass rather than shoot. His confidence is not yet there but playing him so high up is not going to bring that confidence out.
As for Ronaldo, yes he seems to be crying and bitching about everything and it’s only a matter of time before members of the team just say enough and tell him to grow up. Once that happens, the end will come sooner than later. He has been mistreated by opponent player, fans and even our own supporters. His temper and his patience has reached the boiling point and he will snap. His emotional Latin personality will only take so much. What is very surprising is how Fergie deals with him. The kid gloves approach is not like him. All our great players in the past have received his wrath when they were acting poorly or jeopardizing the team. Cantona, Keane, Hughes, Ince, Beckham, Bruce, RVN, Heinze, Giggs etc have all felt his anger and the hairdryer. Some like Becks have felt the boot. But none of them had such a fragile personality and temper like Ronaldo. And none of them threatened to quit and demand a move to Real like he did over the Summer. When Beckham, Heinze and RVN pissed off the boss, he shipped them off to Madrid. He wasn’t knuckling down to their demands, he was letting diminishing assets go. With Ronaldo he seems very reluctant to let the lad go. Almost afraid to upset him or get him thinking of leaving. I’m not saying that’s what is happening, but as outsider looking in, it’s hard to read it any other way. It appears that Ronaldo has our team by the balls and we are afraid of him squeezing too tightly. What he needs as well as Rooney is some good old fashioned disciplining. Sit him down for a few games and scream a bit at them and let them know who is in charge and what they are doing on the pitch will no longer be tolerated. In that way he will regain the respect of the locker room as well as send a signal to all that it’s time to wake up and start playing harder. No more free passes.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:32
@Patrick: I think we can catergorise Anderson as a midfield enforcer as well. He is a good tackler, energetic, hard and can dominate games when given the chance. I think he is like Fletcher, only better, taller, faster, stroner. Okey, not taller, but better, faster and stronger. Plus, more skillful and better passing range.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:34
@Patrick: Excellent points. Germany has a couple of outstanding databases for statistical and historical information on players, teams and the leagues. As I am one who appreciates the past, I have often borrowed this in for from Germany and created my own teams and leagues in past versions of Pro Evolution Soccer. Just a fun pastime and hobby but I was always very frustrated with what little information is available for England. For years I loved the commentary of John Motson and I only got to see what he looked like last year. The best site I have found is http://www.soccerbase.com It’s far from perfect but it goes back years so that one can see results and even lineups for games. It’s very difficult though to find statistical information on players other than how many goals they have scored and games played.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:35
@Grognard: Agree with everything! Couldnt have placed it better myself.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:36
@Grognard: When Hillary Clinton was nominated as Secretary of State, a lot of people suggested that this was a bad move because Barack Obama had hired someone he couldn’t fire. I think the same thing could be said of Ronaldo these days. He is the prototypical modern athlete who is fully aware of his worth and wields his power in destructive ways at times. He knows that he is in a win-win. He is the best player in the squad on most days and if he is allowed to leave he will only cement his legendary status by inevitably lifting the form of whatever club he joins. He is unlike Becks, RVN and Heinze in that his game is more multi-dimensional. There are no replacement cogs for a player of his quality. His leaving would precipitate a rebuilding process for the club, the same could not be said for the aforementioned players.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:39
@Grognard: Yeah, I’ve been there before. Appreciate the post.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:39
@Patrick: Hargo is a ball winner and a pest but he is not an enforcer. I have watched him play ever since he was seventeen and he just doesn’t get physical. In fact, I think he has only had one red card in his entire career. A clean player who would rather use cunning and speed to get the ball. Van Bommel on the other hand can get very nasty and that is why he leads every league he is ever in with yellow cards. He is a no nonsense type player who is also very vocal and a leader. It’s rare when a German team, especially Bayern choose a foreign player as their captain. That is the reason for it.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:51
@Patrick: Very true. Fergie made the mistake a few years back in building our whole attack around Ronaldo. I understand that. Being Canadian and having been brought up with hockey, basketball and American football, I can remember teams building their attack around a specific player. I also remember some players realizing that and holding the team hostage come contract renewal time. The one that I am reminded the most is when Emmitt Smith refused to play at the beginning of the 1993 season for the Dallas Cowboys. The Cowboys offense was loaded with stars but the offense was designed to go through Emmitt. A large dose of Smith a game and the chances were very high Dallas would win. Jimmy Johnson was good coach but his one dimensional thinking hurt the team for the first two games of that year because Smith didn’t play. The Cowboys with all that talent, looked useless. Once Smith returned, everything fell into place and they went on to win the league and Super Bowl. Look at the Bulls with Jordan. Unitl Pippen showed up they were one dimensional as Hell , but in their case and in the case of the Cleveland Cavaliers with LeBron James, you have to use your star because the rest of the players around them just aren’t that good.
Fergie should use the model Glen Sather used for hockey’s last great dynasty, the 1980’s Edmonton Oilers. They had the great Wayne Gretzky but the coach built a team that could play very well without Gretzky. Multiple formations and styles of play allowed the team to show great flexibility. So when Gretzky was traded for scrap players and a lot of money, Edmonton felt the shock but within a year they once again won the Stanley Cup.
United are far from being a one man team but when the system of play constantly emphasizes that one player rather than being a free form style that promotes individuality and encourages others to contribute more, then you will eventually get bogged down. For us to play great football, Ronaldo has to be 100% fit and in form. Since that’s clearly not the case, we are struggling. Fergie needs to change things and free up others to express themselves more.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:53
@RedDevilEddy: I’m not disagreeing with you however, Gattuso and DeRossi have not shown any interest in coming here to play. And as for Hargo, the jury is still out on whether he recovers well enough to claim his starting spot.
December 16th, 2008 at 22:58
@Patrick: Obama wanted individuals who could challenge him and who would not be afraid to speak up. No coach or manager should ever allow players that same kind of privilege. If they did, the game would be in anarchy. You see Hillary is in many circles the equal to Obama in everything except position. Ronaldo is not the equal of Ferguson in power or influence. He is just a glorified pawn for the boss to move around. Once Ronaldo realizes that, the sooner he will grow up. I somehow doubt that will ever happen however. Fergie has given him a very long rope to hang himself.
December 16th, 2008 at 23:00
@RedDevilEddy: Actually the guy for me besides Hargo would be Marco Senna. He possesses a physical side to his game that is attractive and as desirable as he other skills.
December 16th, 2008 at 23:33
@Grognard: I think you are greatly underestimating the power of Ronaldo’s hand. He is a king maker. He single-handedly carried the side last season. I can’t think of many players capable of that. He had as many goals as our strike duo combined. Adding that to any side immediately elevates any club to elite status. Being able to 40 goals from a “winger” is insane. It adds the extra dimension to an attack that separates exceptional clubs from good ones. Considering his recent track record–United won the double and he won the Ballon D’or–he is beyond being managed in a typical style. If Ferguson was to sit Ronaldo and the side dropped points there would be a mutiny amongst supporters and ownership alike. With today’s modern athlete, some of them, sadly, are simply above the law. Their status and skill level outweigh whatever ills their personalities bring. This can be seen in all modern sports. The only time in which players are truly subordinate to their coach/manager is in a situation in which the manager has the full-throated, unyielding support of ownership. But since Ferguson seems to be nearing an exit from managing, I believe his hand is a bit more tenuous than it would have been a few years ago.
December 17th, 2008 at 0:50
@Patrick: No disagreement about Ronaldo’s ability and credentials. But a king maker? Perhaps on other teams but not on this one. Fergie was already a King before Ronny showed up. Ronny’s numbers have been remarkable and insane and I agree that we are crap without him. But I am not advocating that we get rid of him and move on without getting something back in return. Ronaldo will go for a minimum of 50 million and as much as 70 mil. With that kind of money United could buy two or three world class players and strengthen the overall depth and dimension of the team. Rather than always running the offense through Ronaldo, adding a replacement and possibly a defensive midfield enforcer and an attacking midfielder would make this team much more dynamic. Now having said that, I am well known on here for being the first to forgive Ronaldo and to back him ever since his apology. I love the player and i want him to stay. I want him to regain his mojo and play better than before, but I also want United to play with less emphasis on just him. We need to bring in the others on this team and demand more from them. And we need to stop playing with so much caution and trepidation. Once we regain our confidence and everyone is healthy, this team is better than anyone else. The question is when is this going to happen? I hope sooner than later. I also think that Fergie needs to calm both Ronaldo and Rooney down and get them focused on football and not opponents attempts to get them off their game.
December 17th, 2008 at 0:58
@Grognard: O dear Grog Bro, I hope they don’t do well
. To me this competition is and always will be meaningless 
.
Why is everybody having a go at Martin?. He doesn’t know the public relations on this blog, but he is new, and to threaten him with the conform or get out clause – mmmmmmmm – not good form m’thinks. I know Grog is more than capable of dealing with things, and I think he can more than fight his corner. He doesn’t need all us all fighting his corner. Give Martin a chance to feel his way around here
.
December 17th, 2008 at 1:01
What’s all this “your comment is awaiting moderation” crap on this blog lately, whoever is moderating while RR is away, is not doing too magnificent a job I would say!!!. Still whatever turns you on eh???.
December 17th, 2008 at 1:05
Nani, Nani, Nani, Nani, Nani, Nani, NANI.
. Come on Little man Nani, kick some arse, especially Fergie’s, or tell himj to take a hike, and get you off to Spain with Ronnie yo mate 
. Even as planned 
.
December 17th, 2008 at 1:11
@Stephen: Amen Bro – why indeed?. Awaiting moderation, is becoming the main topic of conversation of this blog lately – CRAP. WHEN did it become not ok to give ones honest opinion?. Who the heck is running the show now – it has become BORING.
RR, please come back mate, we miss you.
December 17th, 2008 at 2:33
I’ve always said that if we got rid of Ronaldo and bought Maxi Rodriguez and Sergio Aguero we wouldn’t skip a beat and may even be better but the chances of something like that happening are slim to none unfortunately
December 17th, 2008 at 2:37
also I see we aren’t going to appeal Evra’s ban. I think it could be the smartest move because if we appealed I think he would’ve missed the Chelsea game
December 17th, 2008 at 8:24
Damn, its quiet here….
Anybody gonna watch the game tomorrow? What channel is it on?
December 17th, 2008 at 8:55
@RedDevilEddy: God knows when they’ll show it and on which channel… don’t think many channels are bothered with the club world cup.
I hope someone does.
December 17th, 2008 at 9:17
Is this still a United blog or has it turned to an anti United blog???
December 17th, 2008 at 9:47
@Craig Mc: Jee mate, it doesn’t bother you when a troll shows up who has nothing to offer except put me down and call me names? I may be able to defend myself but as we know, RR frowns on that kind of stuff. Having my buddies on this site put this bloke in his place is appreciated so that he realizes that he should stick to talking football here and not sniping at people. I know you hate it when RR moderates and stops a good feud but I for one don’t need to be called names and have my character and intelligence assassinated by a newbie who knows nothing about me.
December 17th, 2008 at 10:11
@Rahul: The games are being shown on MUTV LIVE at 12.30am so I understand.
December 17th, 2008 at 10:18
Hi guys, long time. I am just wondering if RR is dead or terribly ill. The blog has stagnated and there isnt much to talk about. Anyone with an idea of what might have happened to him. Dont tell me he has given up blogging
December 17th, 2008 at 10:20
@Grognard: I didn’t say your mates shouldn’t support you Grog, I just said I don’t think the answer is to kick someone of the blog, when they have only just arrived, and not had time to know the internal politics. I do agree that nobody should be hurling personal insults at anybody else, but should be DIRECTING conversation towards discussing Manchester United.
.
December 17th, 2008 at 10:28
Yea Craig, bad news bro, just read quotes fromthe old man saying giggs is starting tomo. along with scholes and G.nev.
Ronaldo is also meant to be starting which suggests to me Nani is gonna be benched again??!!!!!!
CAN YOU IMAGINE!???????
I HOPE TO FUCK IM WRONG COZ IM GETING SERIOUSLY DISTRESSED BOUT THIS SHIT
December 17th, 2008 at 10:30
Does anyone actually care about this tournament?
December 17th, 2008 at 10:41
@Patrick: Ha Ha Robbie Earle goes to my gym, he is still in better shape than me and is over ten years older!!
December 17th, 2008 at 10:41
Games are being shown on Five in the UK, tomororw is on at 10:30. I’m going to have to avoid the internet all day and Sky+ it when I get home
December 17th, 2008 at 10:42
@Stephen: Well I care jack s*** about the tournament, but I wanna watch the games. Out of sheer curiosity at least.
December 17th, 2008 at 10:45
@Rahul: I can’t due to work, we should just put out a reserve team with fringe players and kids.
December 17th, 2008 at 10:51
@Stephen: Well I hope Possebon plays, and Nani as well.. but I’m afraid.. It may not go down that way…
Fergie will start some big guns..
I pray to God no one gets injured or anything out there.
December 17th, 2008 at 11:17
@Stephen: I do. Every game can help our team. Confidence is equally important as skills, and we lack confidence in the last third. I feel the team are afraid of taking risks and losing the ball, and therefor only go for the easy and simple solution. Which is very predictable. I think if we go to Japan and there we will be given room to try out more thigns that are usual for Manchester United. Shooting from 20 yards, haeding the ball otwards goal, trying out a very unpredictable pass, even dribble past more players(Ronaldo). This tournament doesnt bother me too much, but its a chance for our team to try out a better style of play without any risks. We wont drop points in the title race if we dont win, and its really not such a bog tournament. BUt I like the sound of:
Good, eh?
Champions of Manchester!
Champions of England!
Champions of Europe!
Champions of the world!
December 17th, 2008 at 11:18
@Rahul: Rodrigo is not in the squad. Gibson is…
December 17th, 2008 at 11:21
never mind…
December 17th, 2008 at 11:24
Berbatov is sick(got a virus in Japan) and Rooney is injured.
That means our two first choice strikers are injured. Wazza is only out for a short time, while Berba is unknown. Hopefully no-one else gets injured or gets an illness. Maybe its the sushi?
December 17th, 2008 at 11:25
I don’t get why everyone is so excited about Possebon. I’ve seen him everytime he’s played for the first team and he’s solid, decent and promising. No more than that. He’s not like Rossi – lighting up the reserves and creating goals left right and centre. Hell he’s not even like big Dave Jones, who did do that a few years ago. I mean I dig that he’s young and Brazilian, and one day might be rather good, but I’ve not seen compelling evidence that he’s anywhere near ready to slot in.
Gibson is clealy being put in the ole shop window, and hopefully we’ll make some money off him. He’s at the right age to start his proper first team career, and I wouldn’t rate him above Fletch, so not sure what place he has with us. So give him some games, a chance to show he’s good enough and if not show the world how much he’s worth. Happy days.
Is Wellbeck still injured? And Manucho isn’t out there right? I’d imagine team will be:
————VDS————-
–Gary–Evans–Vida–Evra—
——-Carrick-Scholes——
———-Giggsy————
—-Tevez——–Ronaldo—-
———-Rooney————
Just going on what Fergie has said so far. With Fletch/Ando/Nani all coming on as subs when the old men get tired.
December 17th, 2008 at 11:30
not posted in a while, been a bit held up by work but i have been reading all posts in here. Really got nasty btw grog and martin. @martin,if you got nothing to do, dont do it here.
I think the team will regret not taking full advantage and winning games against villa and spurs,if we would have won these 2 matches,then that would have been our turning point.all i see nowadays is complacency and luck of real desire. we getting comfortable with draws. sorry to say these but we dont have crativity no more. its a shame to see with all that talent on the pitch.
no one really cares bout the world club cup i know i dont. it will slow us down and before we get rolling again we’ll have already waved the season bye bye to chelsea(hope i really live to eat my words) let fergy play the young turks giving the 1st teamers tym to rest and re think about what they want.
peas out.
December 17th, 2008 at 11:31
@RedDevilEddy: Very good mate
December 17th, 2008 at 11:39
Andrew Arshavi…. Sorry, I mean Andrei Arshavin wants to come to United!
Hopefully Fergie opens his checkbook, because this lad is what we need. And we dont need to change our formation. He could play on the left wing, and Ronny on the right, and we wouldnt have to change our formation because our wingers usually cut inside anyway. We dont play with two wingers, rather one RAM and one LAM, with two DMs and two strikers. I would love Andrei at our club, he would make the difference in games against the likes of Chelski, Arsenal, Liverpool, Shitty and Aston Villa. To have Arshavin, Ronaldo, Rooney and Berba as out top 4 players… Need to clean my keyboard 
Sounds better than Park, Ronaldo, Rooney and Berba. Fergie ahs lost faith in Nani, so Park is the obvious first choice. Tosics deal might fall through as he doesnt agree on the salary we want to give him. Who else here would take Arshavin over Park? I would, Grog would, Fergie(hopefully) would, all supporters exept the Koreans would! Sign him Fergie!!! Please!!! If Sheva and Diarra are worth £30 million, Arshavin at £21 million would be a steal! I dunno the exapt price tag on him, but their boss said £20 million was the least they would accept. So I think £21 mill is good, for a player that has the vision of no-others. The perfect playmaker in my eyes…
December 17th, 2008 at 11:40
Why is every fucking comment I make awaiting moderation?!
There is nothing innapropriate in what I say! 
December 17th, 2008 at 11:42
Andrew Arshavi…. Sorry, I mean Andrei Arshavin wants to come to United! Hopefully Fergie opens his checkbook, because this lad is what we need. And we dont need to change our formation. He could play on the left wing, and Ronny on the right, and we wouldnt have to change our formation because our wingers usually cut inside anyway. We dont play with two wingers, rather one RAM and one LAM, with two DMs and two strikers. I would love Andrei at our club, he would make the difference in games against the likes of Chelski, Arsenal, Liverpool, Shitty and Aston Villa. To have Arshavin, Ronaldo, Rooney and Berba as out top 4 players… Need to clean my keyboard.
Sounds better than Park, Ronaldo, Rooney and Berba. Fergie ahs lost faith in Nani, so Park is the obvious first choice. Tosics deal might fall through as he doesnt agree on the salary we want to give him. Who else here would take Arshavin over Park? I would, Grog would, Fergie(hopefully) would, all supporters exept the Koreans would! Sign him Fergie!!! Please!!! If Sheva and Diarra are worth £30 million, Arshavin at £21 million would be a steal! I dunno the exapt price tag on him, but their boss said £20 million was the least they would accept. So I think £21 mill is good, for a player that has the vision of no-others. The perfect playmaker in my eyes…
December 17th, 2008 at 12:04
@RedDevilEddy: I didnt know he was not included in the squad! Thnks for the update.
I would also love to take Arshavin over Park. But I don’t trust Fergie with this one. Plus it seems we’ve already spent most of our available transfer kitty on a certain Bulgarian recluse.
December 17th, 2008 at 12:18
@Grognard: I totally agree with your points about the midfield and we certainly missed a trick when we decided not to sign Senna, he would have been a really sensible signing for us.
December 17th, 2008 at 12:20
@Stephen: Senna, Gattuso, Essien… We had the chance to sign them all, but didnt. Can anybody please tell me why?
December 17th, 2008 at 12:33
@RedDevilEddy: Not sure about Guttuso mate there were only rumours, but Chelsea out bid us for Essien and would have paid more than whatever we would have offered at that time, and Senna we made an offer for both Hargo and him, and with the long protracted talks with Bayern Fergie felt he was messing Senna about and decided to wait for Hargo.
December 17th, 2008 at 12:53
………….. We need a new article….
Where is RedRanter. Im beggining to think he has died or sumthing! I hope not, but its not only that we havent seen any articles from him in 2 weeks, but he hasnt commented or said anything either. I understand it if he has a busy life, but it would cost him anything to just come here and write: “I am fine, but I am not able to do anythign for the moment bacause Ive got lot of work”. Only takes 23 seconds! Hopefully he will be back soon, or this blog will be dead…. 
December 17th, 2008 at 13:50
Berbatov is out of the semi’s of the WCC with a nasty Japanese virus, Rooney picked up a knock in training but may be fit, Scholes and Giggs to start. If we win, we play a team from Equador..
December 17th, 2008 at 13:52
Our hard man is Nemanja – I wouldn’t argue with him. A defender doesn’t have the same effect as a midfielder however. I think Andy has a certain hardness, takes a lot of shaking off the ball (combination of strength and skill) and has some good attitude. To me, he should be playing whenever fitness allows, alongside Carrick. He can beat players with speed and with skill and will get into the box. I am certain a goal is near. After improving, I think Fletcher has hit his plateau and has stopped making the runs into the box that invite passes and produce goals. He gets in the way more than wins tackles. Park occasionally goes on the outside when right wing but always cuts inside when on the left. As a full back you just show him the outside and he’s stuffed. Nani can go outside on either flank but needs to do it more regularly so that coming inside has a surprise element to it. Sadly, very sadly in my opinion, he is not getting any game time and so has floundered. The departure of CQ has removed the lines of CLEAR communication with certain players. Ronnie needs a father figure – I suspect his own dad would have had input over recent times. A good dad does not always say yes and appreciates the need for tough love on occasions. He needs help through this period – he is clearly struggling. Fergie seems to be giving him too much rope and it can only cause jealousy and resentment if favouritism is practised. Grog, like you, I’m the wrong side of 50 and appreciate the need for the Boss to be just that, even though like you I am an ardent socialist. Firm discipline is not bullying and perceived weakness will always be walked over. We need Ronnie and more than ever I feel he needs us – but it is doing him a great injustice to allow him to dictate at Old Trafford. Rooney of course also needs managing but that’s for another time. Happy Christmas to all you United nuts. Guess there must be a few more Brazil nuts around these days. Sorry!
December 17th, 2008 at 14:08
If you hate Real Madrid, clap your hands!If you think theyre a bunch of shit, clap you hands!
Oh, Caldron, the old man who is stupid like a cockroach, if you hate him like I do, then clap your hands!
Cunts…. The whole club, country and the people involved! Seriously, how come the press aint getting tired of this? Its annoying, and frankly, its never anything new!
December 17th, 2008 at 14:10
If you hate Real Madrid, clap your hands!
If you think theyre a bunch of shit, clap you hands!
Oh, Caldron, the old man who is stupid like a cockroach, if you hate him like I do, then clap your hands!
Cunts…. The whole club, country and the people involved! Seriously, how come the press aint getting tired of this? Its annoying, and frankly, its never anything new!
December 17th, 2008 at 15:28
@RedDevilEddy: ashravin sounds like the real deal to, 2 come and inspire passion and grit in the team. I think addition of berbetov has played a big part in the way our team is playing of late. so relaxed,no urgency..rem attitude is infectous.
RR had not said something in quiet a long while and its worrying.
December 17th, 2008 at 15:41
@man utd jaluo: “ashravin sounds like the real deal to, 2 come and inspire passion and grit in the team.” Er he is a skillful player class no doubt, not a player I would associate with grit.
December 17th, 2008 at 15:55
@RedDevilEddy: am sure clapping my hands,thats loads of crap.though i think selling of ronaldo would be for the good of the team.
@Stephen: i meant in the sense that he’ll bring in new passion and desire. what berba was supposed to ignite but failed.
December 17th, 2008 at 16:08
If Man United is looking for a creative attacking midfielder, i think this is the right time to do it..Arshavin is available, news are out that Van der vaart is unsettled in Madrid and if the news about Ronaldo is true i hope we get Sneijder in exchange..three quality players who can give that creative edge which is missing in the centre of the park..Carrick or Anderson can complete the central midfield pair..I do not want any more strikers or wingers (coz Van der vaart,Arshavin and to some extent Sneijder can play on the wing)..The main point is we should not wait till that point (Scholes retire) to get our man coz at that time United will be held out on a ransom (Bayern with Hargo,Tottenham with Carrick & Berbatov)..
Fergie please…act now or atleast this summer!!!
December 17th, 2008 at 16:10
@Shyam: Couldnt agree more. But I still doubt that Ronaldo will move to Real next summer. He wont leave until Fergie retiers. Its just some shit made up from the Daily Mail
December 17th, 2008 at 16:42
@realred: Nothing about Fergie’s SHITE team picking amazes me any more mate. He could ballz up the whole season for us, but we’ll have to wait and see Bro
.
December 17th, 2008 at 16:45
@Stephen: Stephen mi man, how come your not out in JAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA – PAN?. Surely your air hostess GF could have wnagled you a ticket Bro
.
December 17th, 2008 at 16:47
Stephen – your not out in Jaaaaaaaaaaaaa – Pan, why mate?.
, the GF could have wangled you a ticket, being Air Hostess and all.
December 17th, 2008 at 16:47
If you are looking for some things to talk about in absence of a blog post, here goes:
Fergie has suggested that Brown and Neville are out of a job at United. It finally seems as though he recognizes that a new era is upon us–well, at least at right back. Here it is.
The Premiership is considering “Premier League TV.” It seems to be a fall back plan if the recession drives down the price of bids for broadcasting rights. Here it is.
No disrespect to the authors of this blog, but Scott and Republik of Mancunia won best British football blog of the year over at soccer lens. If you’ve never been, you should certainly go. Scott puts in a tremendous amount of work. The Republik of Mancunia. One of the nominees that came in second is EPL Talk, which I strongly endorse as well.
The BBC has a nice story documenting Manchester United’s bizarre experience in Japan thus far.
Yet another publication is forecasting that Ronaldo will leave for Madrid in the summer. This one seems to be circulating like wildfire.
Sam Allardyce is in at Blackburn the day after he said he would much prefer the Sunderland job.
For the Berbatov bashers among you, the Guardian’s Rob Smyth compares him to Veron.
In a story that any football fan can feel good about, Arsenal’s Eduardo returned from his absolutely horrific injury last year. Good to see the lad healthy.
United will not appeal Evra’s ban despite Fergie calling it “the worst decision he has ever known” and other United higher-ups stating that they believe Evra when he says he never touched anyone. Strange not to appeal, then. Must have to do with upcoming fixtures.
I’m done.
December 17th, 2008 at 16:58
@Patrick: How can you say Ronaldo “single-handedly” carried the side last season? When we had players like Rio bossing the defense? Don’t you think Ronaldo’s goals would have been negated if we didn’t have a world-class defender in Rio to also carry the defense? Ronaldo was a huge contributing factor, but to say he “single-handedly” carried the side is a bit ridiculous and OTT imo.
@Martin: Look, your team in on top of the table and your title reign didn’t actually end in November this year, you’re still competing, be happy and scurry off to RAWK.
December 17th, 2008 at 16:58
@ Shyam – The thing about Arshavin/VDV/Sneijder is that we don’t play a system that would accommodate them. We’d have to completely change it to fit them in, unless you put them on the left wing which isn’t really their speciality. We don’t play with an attacking midfielder (actually we seem to play with two Berba and Rooney, but I kid…) our two central midfielders are more like defensive midfielders, sitting back and protecting the defense and letting the other front 4 do the attacking duties.
I like all of them as players, but don’t think we need them unless we change the system.
December 17th, 2008 at 17:03
@Shyam: Nothing will surprise me anymore. Injuries and lack of form or not, besides looking at the training pics, theres nothing else that really shows he really wants to be here.
@Stephen: I’m probably alone, but yes I do, of course everyone doesn’t care about it until (if) we lose and then it’ll be back to “oh we’re so shite, we couldn’t beat some team from Japan”, “Fergie f**ked up the team again”, “sack Phelan” and bla bla bla.
@the three Rs: Hmmm, I wonder, Vidic as the captain for a few games?? How’d that work out?
December 17th, 2008 at 17:26
@Rd: I don’t mean to suggest that we wouldn’t have won a match, but we certainly wouldn’t have been lifting any silver without him. While other players certainly figured large in our success last year, it was his play and his play alone, IMO, that separated us from the rest of England and Europe. The rest of the squad made us a top club, he made us the best.
December 17th, 2008 at 17:30
@Nelson Otieno: I remember him telling me a few months ago that he would be taking a nice vacation around Christmas. With that said, I thought he would have left the site with someone to monitor and manage it in his absence.
December 17th, 2008 at 17:34
@realred: This is a big event for the club and the Boss realizes that the 3 older players will never have another opportunity to play in such a tournament. He will play them for the first game and whoever plays well enough will start the final. He already has come out and declared Rafael his first choice at RB (the Guardian) and that he would start the final. You know Fergie and his rewards for loyalty towards the old guard.
December 17th, 2008 at 17:36
@Stephen: The Japanese do. They are making all the money for it while we will suffer jet lag and fatigue for a month due to it. Sorry for sounding negative but even Capello has warned that this could hurt our title chances. He suffered the same thing while managing in Italy.
December 17th, 2008 at 17:47
@RedDevilEddy: Arshavin is just naming elite teams he would play for. Nothing in what he says impresses me as a real statement of intent to play for us. He’ll probably end up at Chelsea even if Roman has said there would be no more purchases in January. That rule would be broken for his countries best player for sure. United should try to get him if only to keep him out of the clutches of Chelsea. He would help our team in a creative ways but he also would help the team by picking up the tempo. Arshavin doesn’t like to play a system where we circle the wagons and just wait. He likes fast paced counter attacking football and he and Ronaldo would be dynamic together on opposite wings. But Fergie won’t go for him. He’s rather waste half the amount on a no name Serbian kid who is playing God in contract negotiations instead. On the left side I rate Arshavin second only to Franck Ribery. Getting him will be a coup for any team.
December 17th, 2008 at 17:52
@RedDevilEddy: It’s just a glitch that was created by accident when Ahmed added the last thread. There is nothing to it and when he reads these comments or when RR returns, it will be taken care of. No need to get upset about it. It happened to me last week and ever since, has stopped. I’m sure it’s just a programming glitch.
December 17th, 2008 at 17:54
@Patrick: That I agree with because theres a whole world of difference between what you just said which is- he made us a better team and contributed to our success and saying that he single- handedly carried the team last season.
December 17th, 2008 at 17:55
@RedDevilEddy: You can also add Ribery, Arshavin, van der Vaart and a few other big name midfielders who we could have signed had we shown a little ambition in that area. And need I say the chance we blew at getting Huntelaar up front will haunt me for years.
December 17th, 2008 at 17:59
@RedDevilEddy: I am 90% sure he has gone overseas to visit family and friends. He may not have taken a laptop with him or he may just have said he needed time away from everything so he could relax and decompress. With that said, I think he probably didn’t say anything because had he told everyone that he would be away, there would have been anarchy on this site. As it turned out, there were a few skirmishes. It’s too bad Ahmed is too busy running his own blog or his ability and knowledge to run this one would be more than welcome until the Red Ranter returns. HINT! HINT! We need another thread there mate. Things are slowing up again.
December 17th, 2008 at 18:06
I am here. Updated blog. Two things everyone may want to read:
1. Reasons for being away.
2. Another interesting piece.
December 17th, 2008 at 18:07
@the three Rs: WOE there mate. I’m on the wrong side of 40, not 50. Although there is nothing wrong with that, no need to add ten years to my burnt out and abused carcass.
And yes Fergie needs to instill a little bit of his old school discipline when it comes to Ronaldo and Rooney. After all, he has both players under contract and so if they don;t like his discipline, that’s just too bad. There is nothing they can do about it. Problem is, he doesn’t seem to want to go down that road. Also, it’s easy for me and others to state that they need discipline and that Fergie needs to show an iron hand but none of us are privileged to be behind the closed doors at OT or at training to really see what is going on. Bottom line is we just have no idea what to think. And it is frustrating as Hell because all our judgments, right or wrong, are made with very little if any inside information. We literally are on the outside looking in.
December 17th, 2008 at 18:18
@Shyam: Fergie has warned us many times that the Claderon nonsense will not end. Real Madrid and Marca their official media pussies will continue to unsettle the player as well as us with rumors of Ronaldo imminent departure. It’s all BULLSHIT. To all of you, stop reading it or buying in to it. It’s rubbish. Nothing has changed. Ronaldo’s form has suffered due to injuries and not being in the best of shape to start the season. It has frustrated him and even if he is frustrated with the supporters, he is going nowhere unless Fergie declares he is going. And we all know Fergie’s position on that. So from the Prince of Fucking Darkness I offer a little bit of positive light and express to you all my confidence that Ronaldo will be with us for this season and next. After that, I say good bye to him and thank you very much. As for Senior Calderon, I say desperate times call for very desperate measures. This is a man fighting for his professional life. He’s on his last legs at the Bernebau and he probably won’t be around after this season after the members vote him out. And who knows if his successor even wants Ronaldo. It was the pursuit of Ronaldo and not taking care of off season needs that has destabilized their team. Schuster was first to go, Calderon will be next.
December 17th, 2008 at 18:21
Well, if we beat Gamba, we’ll face Quito… If we lose, we’ll play Pachuca for 3rd (although I’d rather not think about that).
I just can’t believe that I have to wake up at 3:30AM to see it, if there are any links online. Otherwise I might watch it on tapedelay on TV at 6PM in the evening.
If anyone else has any experience with tape delayed games, here’s my question: Do you watch it with the knowledge of the final result in mind, or just keep yourself in the dark and watch as if it is live? I usually try to do the latter.
December 17th, 2008 at 18:26
@Red Ranter: Welcome back mate. Trust me, you have been missed.
December 17th, 2008 at 18:53
@Rd: Fair point, mate.
I suppose that this blogs proclivity towards exaggeration is rubbing off on me. 
December 17th, 2008 at 18:55
@Red Ranter: YEEEY!!! You are back again mate! Long time, no hear. Missed you mate!
Things have been kinda boring and sometimes out of control, but Ive kept it cool. Just wanna keep RedRants RedRants. 
December 17th, 2008 at 19:49
@Rd: I think you got it wrong buddy!!..We have Berba drifting behind due to the lack of midfield penetration through the center…Actually we really need one of those players…Our system last year worked on a fluid attacking system which included clever inter play and movement on and off the ball…At present we brought in Berbatov to act as a pivotal point for all the movement(havent work the same way yet)…atleast in my perspective!!..
But we still opted for the 4-4-2 formation and guess what…we exposed our on limitation that we dont have a good attacking midfield who can create the game through the center of the park…all our plays are coming through wings where ppl are double marked…This is forcing attackers like Rooney and Berbatov to come back and create the game more from the center of the park which leaves a big hole in the box…
If Fergie is planning to continue with the same tactic we badly need either of those 3 players…Three of them fit nicely in the system and provide that extra edge (long distance shooting and creativity) in the center of the park which is sorely missing in the current squad ….and our opponents are aware of it too..
Teams now know that if they shut down the play from wings United is struggling…they do it with 8-9 ppl behind the ball and hope for the rub of the green their way.They have nothing to lose ..either a point or 3 points..win-win situation ..purely from a statistic point of view.!!
December 17th, 2008 at 20:40
Apologies, Grognard. The extra years I’ve naughtily attributed to you must be down to your mature writing style as well as your knowledge of footy past and across swathes of Europe. An insider’s view of the club would indeed be fascinating but it’s an insider’s view of Fergie’s head that would be most revealing at the moment, I think. Agreed, he has a few of that rare breed, one-club players, nearing the end of their playing lives and he obviously wants to treat them respectfully. In the past, sentimentality has rarely obscured his overview so I hope team selections can be objectively made; but I fear they have not been of late. The one thing I’m hanging on to is his spoken regard for young Rafael, backed up by his selection. I desperately want Anderson to be afforded the same opportunity but fear his Scottishness gives Fletcher an unfair advantage, even if perhaps only subconsciously.
December 17th, 2008 at 21:21
@the three Rs: wow that was good now pass that shit over here
December 17th, 2008 at 22:47
@the three Rs: I honestly don’t think Fletcher’s heritage plays any role in Fergies decision. I really feel he rewards loyalty and commitment to the club. One of the reasons Anderson may not be starting all the time since his last few outstanding efforts may go back to his media quote of always dreaming of playing for Inter. This kind of crap does not sit well with Fergie. Players like Fletcher, Neville, Giggs, Scholes and Park keep their mouths shut and that is why they play often. Anderson and Tevez proved just the past few weeks that a spurt of great form will not ensure you anything with Fergie, whereby loyalty and devotion to the team will get you far. At least that’s what it seems like to me.
And yes, wouldn’t an insiders view of Fergie’s mind be great. Instead of all the bull that’s delivered to the media, an honest interpretation of everything he is doing and thinking would be great.