Aug 05
United beat Posh + Media Froth As Ronaldo Returns (Apparently)
Fergie faced off with Fergie junior, in what looks like an annual affair of family reunions, as United’s boys beat Peterborough 2-0. I must first say a big, big sorry for not being here when the club paid its tribute to one of United’s — and the modern era’s — greatest professionals in Ole Gunnar Solskjaer. I have never hidden my love for players of his kind. And we all know it’s not just the injury time winner against Bayern that makes us love him so much.
But back to yesterday’s game United eased past Peterborough, but not before being given a good workout by the opposition.
I really don’t think I should go into too much detail on pre-season friendlies, but my interest was piqued when I heard the da Silva twins were expected to feature. And it must be said, they didn’t disappoint. Rafael more so.
The right back stormed up and down the wing and threw himself about quite well showing that he wasn’t shy to shirk from challenges. His ambition, moving forward did leave spaces at the back, but then we forget that he’s just 18 and he’ll have lot to learn before making it to the first team. Of course, to gain some perspective, it’s just one pre-season game and whilst he did make a good first impression, we mustn’t be creaming over him.
I have been impressed with Carlos Tevez though. He has been a man on a mission throughout pre-season and I think we will see the real Carlos Tevez this season because he’s had a good rest in the summer. He admitted once that he has been playing continuously for the past two years without much break. And so we think this summer might have done him a world of good.
Rio and Brown were solid while they were there, Possebon showed some good touches, Gibson scored a cracker, and Campbell disappointed.
And that’s all I want to read into yesterday’s friendly.
* * *
Tomorrow we face Juventus at home. It should be a tasty encounter. Also there will be a presentation of the trophies, but such has been the hurt in the summer that all of this will seem like a Pyrrhic victory. The man who helped cause, both, said hurt and ecstasy, Mr. Cristiano Ronaldo reportedly returns to Old Trafford. Now I don’t know if the Guardian took ideas from this post, but I see, at the end of the story a possible dialogue between Ronaldo and Ferguson. It must be said that the “conversation” wasn’t nearly as funny as the one penned by yours truly, but one must concede that hacks from the mainstream media can also have a little fun.
But my concern is not about this alleged idea-stealing — it’s about how they make it sound so dramatic; like Calderon, Ronaldo and Ferguson were going to have some sort of a Mexican standoff. I don’t know how the Telegraph and the Guardian (as examples) infer that there is still a major major doubt about Ronaldo staying, but I suggest everyone to read the piece by Tim Stannard (of the La Liga Loca column in Four Four Two) to get a good (and humorous) perspective on the happenings in the Iberian peninsula.
Yes, I am not having another rant against the evil that’s Madrid.
I am that tired, and I am off for now.
Meanwhile, in my travels around the world wide web, I found something worth sharing with you all. I think it is rather thought provoking in the context of people spending time proving a point on internet chatrooms — i.e., blokes like us. I will leave the image speak for itself.
[source xkcd.com]
Related items from Red Rants:- Possebon Loan ‘Cancelled’; Returns to United?
- All Quiet on the Berba Front and Nothing Else…
- Rants Returns to Regular Service
- Aston Villa v Man Utd: Preview
- United Win and Some Non-game Thoughts
Tags: Daily Roundup
August 5th, 2008 at 10:38
Does anyone think that him staying one more year is a terrible option? I know the argument is that it gives a whole year to find a replacement, and might get us some success today, but it seems to spit in the face of team spirit and respect for the club. For me it’s not even about whether or not he’ll put in good performances (for the record I think he will) it’s more about a shadow hanging over the team, and avoiding a feeling like this summer. We are the best team on the planet at this point in time, but can’t enjoy it because the best player on the planet is being a c*ck. I just can’t help but think, as a fan, I’d be happier if we offload him, bring in some talent and get on with the season. Even if that means we don’t win as much this year.
Is that strange?
August 5th, 2008 at 11:06
I agree. I think the reason he hasn’t been sold is that Utd don’t want it to look like Madrid have bullied them into selling. I think Ronaldo should be sold. Maybe a compromise will be that he is sold at Christmas.
Personally I think he’s made a big mistake. At Madrid, he will be expected to deliver every game. His childish sulks will not be tolerated there. Take the £70M and let him go.
August 5th, 2008 at 11:19
I Don’t think it would be strange beachryan. I feel the same. For the past 2 or so years, every summer break or January transfer window, this painstakingly annoying Ronaldo saga just goes on and on and I’m sick of the whole thing already. I personally feel that it would be better to just let him go and bring in maybe 1 or 2 players. Will we win less trophies without him? Who knows? But I firmly believe that whether he stays or goes we will still be successful. After Beckham left, people said we would not be successful, they said the same thing after Ruud left, and they’ll say the same thing after Ronaldo leaves (Be sure that he WILL leave). But I believe in this club and and I firmly believe that we will prosper without him.
On a side note, I’m not sure about everyone else here but I feel that players like Scholes, Giggs, Solskjaer, just don’t exist amongst the younger generation of footballers in the modern game. You can’t tell the future but, I feel as though young players like Nani, Anderson even Tevez will not stay at United for a very long period of time. Maybe 4-5 years for Nani and Anderson and maybe 4 years for Tevez. I just feel that today players don’t seem to believe in the club they play for, they believe in the club that pays the most.
August 5th, 2008 at 11:50
Also, with their Keane money being spent on Bentley, Spurs are bidding on Arshavin, Corluka, Some 50 year old goal keeper and another young strker. Sounds like they need some money. How does £28 million sound?
get on with it!
August 5th, 2008 at 11:52
@Beachryan: I absolutely share your concern, I think Ruud was a problem in the dressing room towards the end but perhaps Utd just need Real to understand that they cannot have free reign when it comes to signing Utd’s best players.
I also suspect that having him at Utd when he is officially declared the best player in the world is important to Utd’s status as otherwise Calderon could try to claim that the move to Real was what made him the best player in the world.
August 5th, 2008 at 12:01
please get ronaldo out of old trafford as soon as possible. he did a lot for us but i now c what mourinho meant when he called him an immature lad with no respect. i’m so amazed by real-madrid thinking signing ronaldo is a guarentee to winning the ucl, believe me ronaldo can only play best when he is wearing red. He will regret his decision, believe me!
August 5th, 2008 at 12:30
@ DMC – fair enough, and I’d love to think we were f*cking over the Madrid crowd somehow, but I just think it will put a real sour note on the upcoming season. I guess you can’t win really.
Saha to Sunderland…if you were Fergie would you sell or loan til January, with a view to sell then?
Oh and where is Ben Foster?
August 5th, 2008 at 12:55
@Beachryan: I’d certainly sell him straight away, if we can get 8-9 mil for him. It’ll ease the extra expenses for getting Berbetov, and with Berbatov we’ll actually have 3 strikers able to play (plus maybe Campbell as 4th). I think that selling Saha is the clearest sign SAF can give that we’re getting Berbatov, plus the money is decent enough for a player, who’ll most likely be injured at Sunderland as well. Keane’s taking a major risk with this one, but he probably knows.
August 5th, 2008 at 12:56
bens on the sidelines awaiting an appearance. i think he will get another one against juventus
August 5th, 2008 at 12:59
well said thomas. we should get rid of saha. but berbatov, huntelaar or aguero? aguero doesnt seem to wanna come, the tottenham horse s**t board seem determined to keep berbatov, leaving huntelaar who wants to come. my preference is aguero but a would welcome any of them. what do u guys think?
August 5th, 2008 at 13:00
i think what man utd are going 2 do is going to be brill!! Put in a clause in his contract saying he can leave but not until next year and for an agreed price. So if ronaldo f*cks up this season (which he might do) then we can tell him to f*ck off for an obscene amount of money but if he continues to be an immortal di*khead then we can tell r.madrid to f*ck.
August 5th, 2008 at 13:37
I am fearful re: wpoty; we all know that individual honours mean a great deal to our Portugese #7 as it is for any pro. player.
I’m fearful because there could be a cartel going on in which Ronaldo doesn’t get the highest FIFA accolade after his 42 club goals + pre + tournament goals.. this could be the spur for the Portugeezer to move try and wrangle out of Old Trafford.. If Ronaldo doesn’t win then something must be done..
August 5th, 2008 at 13:57
@Beachryan:
TBH I doubt United would say to him he can leave next season if he stays this season as that’s pretty much giving into Real which just defeats the whole point of making the stand.
Also despite what the Spanish Papers want to claim I don’t personally believe Ronaldo needs bribed like that. He isnt going to walk out of the club or refuse to play to be sold. If United choose to sell him he will go, else he will buckle down and play and I am sure Fergie and Gill know that as well
August 5th, 2008 at 14:49
The papers say Rooney may miss the start of the season…WTF?? Due to a virus??!!
Oh Berbatov, where art thou?!
August 5th, 2008 at 15:06
man,just offload the 120k earning slave. He is haunting united’s cohesivness as a team. Get berba or develop/polish frazier into the second Dwight Yorke.
August 5th, 2008 at 15:07
http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_3936685,00.html
Great.
August 5th, 2008 at 15:09
we’re looking like we’re gonna be a few men down come the start of the season -
nani suspended, rooney/carrick virus, anderson olympics, park/manucho knee/metertasel, hargreaves tendonitis, ronny ankle, looks like opening weekend is gonna be
vds,
brown, ferdinand, vidic, evra,
fletcher, oshea, scholes, giggs,
campbell, tevez
and some young players on the bench… worst possible start with injuries after winning the double
August 5th, 2008 at 15:29
Players NOT available for the start of season 08/09:
Wayne Rooney
Owen Hargreaves
Michael Carrick
Cristiano Ronaldo
Anderson
Ji-Sung Park
Louis Saha
Out of this list, there are 5 players who started or played a vital role in the Champions League Final, not to mention over the entire last season. Not to mention, the players we will be relying on in the opening stages of this season includes EVDS, Neville, Giggsy and Scholes, all of whom are supposed to be gradually phased out over this season. To top it off,
the 1st 4 games of this season are going to be:
Portsmouth (Community Shield)
Newcastle (BPL)
Portsmouth (BPL)
Zenit St. Petersburg (UEFA Super Cup)
2 cup games, and 2 important BPL games. Do we have enough manpower to win these ties? With all due respect Sir Alex, kindly open your goddamn eyes !!!
August 5th, 2008 at 15:32
@Viresh: Yeah it’s not the best of signs, but let’s see how things develop. Perhaps it’ll speed up the process of getting Berbatov. We certainly need him more than ever now.
We can probably still beat Newcastle, so that leaves only the Portsmouth game in jeopardy. They’re a strong team, and right now a draw looks appealing. After that we have Nani coming back, and then only the Super Cup against Zenit, before a 2 weeks international break. After that, it’s Liverpool and Chelsea, and we have to have a lot of players ready for that one.
Luckily our defense will be fit and ready, and Tevez looks razor sharp, so we might pull off a couple of wins after all.
It’s weird that noone has asked SAF about possible transfers… he’s always asked that. It seems that this is the right time for that sort of question compared to other times it’s been asked.
August 5th, 2008 at 15:36
@Mihir: I couldn’t care less about the Community Shield and the Super Cup… they’re insignificant matches compared to other tasks of the season. The Super Cup would be nice to win, but if we don’t, it wouldn’t matter.
I’m sure, SAF’s eyes are open, but what can he do? Yes, he can buy Berbatov, but he might not be the one deciding, when that happens.
August 5th, 2008 at 15:37
oh yeah and I forgot Nani in that list who is suspended for the stupid red card he got against West Ham. Berbatov, we couldnt need you more!
August 5th, 2008 at 15:38
well just realised that we’ll be missing nani for the 2 premiership games not the community shield so if hargreaves is fit and giggs is good then i think we’ll be fine and i just read on a website carrick came into training today so i think we should be ok, we just need that striker to ease those doubts…. on a side note we could be on for a 7 trophy haul now that would cement us as footballing gods!!
August 5th, 2008 at 15:39
Yeah, somehow we’ve managed to look pretty threadbare at the start of the year – not ideal! That said, Newcastle are likely to be without both Owen and Viduka, and Portsmouth wihtout Diarra and obvioulsy Muntari left – so we should have some hope! For me as long as the back 4 are fit we have a shot.
In theory we could field a team at Newcastle of:
———vds———-
-Brown-Rio-Vidic-Evra—
—Hargo—-Fletcher—
——-Scholes——-
-Tevez———Giggs–
——-Campbell——–
Which really isn’t terrible. Replace Campbell with a signing and you see what I mean. My big worry is that right after the aformentioned first couple weeks, we have Pool and Chelsea away, and Rooney may not have had time to gel yet, not to mention if Ronaldo has even played by that point. Argh.
August 5th, 2008 at 16:01
I have always been excited about the start of every new season. Now I am not saying that i am not feeling that way this summer, but I cannot for the life of me remember a time when I have felt such an uneasiness about a moment that usually brings the biggest thrill in my life: the start of a new English Premeir League Season! Saying that, I am sure that once things get started all will be fine. Hell, even last year started off not so hot and look what we did. All I am saying is that with the double I should still be riding on the tails of a cloud right now, but I feel as if I have been dragged through a sewer of shit! If it is not Ronaldo, it is injuries, not injuries, then it silence in the transfer market, now viruses and suspensions. Bloody hell, we shouldn’t be loaning anyone out to Darren-he should be loaning out to us. Oh, Frazier Campbell is not United material! Please Fergie, what is the story on Berbs?
August 5th, 2008 at 16:02
If this sudden development is not a sign from the gods saying we should bolster our squad with a striker and a young winger, I don’t know what is!!! Fergie seems to think it’s ok, but it doesn’t look good to almost evryone else; i’m guessing that’s why every manager needs a second, so they can point out things the managers don’t see or miss.
I mean, look at our squad for the opening few, 1 or 2 games,
VDS
Brown——Rio—–Vida——Evra
————-O’shea————–
Fletcher——-Scholes——–Giggs
———-Tevez—————–
————–Campbel———–
with the rest of the bench comprised mainly of youngsters and no striker!!
August 5th, 2008 at 16:03
Mihir
Add to that list Nani, who is suspended for the first two PL games. However, I’m not sure that Hargreaves is definitely out, nor Michael Carrick. This leaves us with a team looking like this for the opener against Newcastle:
VDS – Brown, Rio, Vidic, Evra – Scholes, Hargreaves (Possebon if injured), Carrick (Fletcher if injured) – Giggs, Campbell – Tevez
Subs: Foster, O’Shea, R da Silva, errrrrr……….
Remember our 1-0 month last year? Going to have to be like that again for a while, I reckon….
August 5th, 2008 at 16:20
Possebon does look very comfortable on the ball doesnt he? There is something about Brazilians at United and curly hair and awesome ball control. Rafael and Fabio Da Silva are pretty damn good even at their tender age, and will mature into great players.
Sir Alex himself hinted that Rafael has shown enough quality to merit a first team place.
Maybe we can use him as a winger
during the opening matches since we are more or less empty on the right unless you count Fletcher. The lad certainly showed enough attacking instincts last night.
August 5th, 2008 at 16:40
@Mihir: I had that thought too.
August 5th, 2008 at 16:48
Shows that maybe offloading Eagles was a bit hasty, IMO. He’s not a world beater, but in our time of need could have done a job, and despite teh twins impressiev debut, I’d still choose him over either. And Fletcher on the wing, tbh.
August 5th, 2008 at 16:57
@Beachryan: I disagree with that – I never saw Eagles put in a worthwhile performance in a competitive game (yes, I do remember that goal against Everton, it doesn’t count as worthwhile).
I reckon there are three or four youngsters who are capable of doing at least as good a job as Eagles.
August 5th, 2008 at 16:57
@Beachryan: I don’t agree mate, it shows our lack of movement in the market a big mistake. I said that a while back we needed more flesh on the bones, and we look a little short of depth.
August 5th, 2008 at 17:01
To everyone complaining about the preseason and using reserves all the time, this is why!! Players like Possebon, Campbell or Gibson may need to step into the first team early doors, and then we’ll be glad they’ve had games with Rio, Tevez, Scholes and the like to prepare them.
Nani can play in the Community Shield and the Super Cup. If Zenit loose Arshavin to Spurs then I think we still have a team available who can beat them, and thats without signing Berbatov, who now more than ever is a must. Or Huntelaar, whoever just someone!
Having to sit out those first 2 prem games is going to be tough for Nani, lets hope its the making of him.
August 5th, 2008 at 17:03
A lot of us have sort of assumed that Ronaldo was going to Madrid at the end of this season for at least a year now so in one sense nothing’s new … EXCEPT … You can’t formalize that sort of thing. Once you do it’s ‘dead man walking’ time. Remember what happened when Fergie announced his retirement a few years ago…
August 5th, 2008 at 17:31
The Tim Stannard article on Marca and the Spanish media was just classic. I’m so glad Fergie and United made them feel so unwelcome and like the total scumbag outsiders they are. After all, they do let journalists into OT and their training grounds. But seeing as Marca and others from Spain cannot really be seen as TRUE journalists, then piss on them.
August 5th, 2008 at 17:38
RR; Your take on the conversation between Fergie and Ronaldo was not just far superior to that hack job in the Guardian, it was far funnier and it actually sounded like the two individuals. I could actually picture those words coming out of Fergie’s mouth. The Guardian’s take was just a boring and as unreadable as their Rumours page where that ass clown always wastes 75% of the time talking unfunny jibberish rather than getting down to the job of giving us some good good rumours. My how journalistic integrity and quality has slipped over the past few years. It’s bad enough hat it has lost all sense of integrity when it comes to covering hard news and politics, but SPORTS? Bloody Hell!
Thank God we have someone like you RR, to help some of us get a better sense of the truths of European sports journalism. 
August 5th, 2008 at 17:42
@edi: Right now I’d accept a skinny kid walking in to OT with a sign on his t-shirt that says STRIKER. That’s how desperate I am and how desperate United should be too.
August 5th, 2008 at 17:47
@antsBoy: Trust me, if you are unfortunate enough to get one of these African or Asian viruses, they can take you for a loop. They are killers (if not literally). You can’t keep anything down, and your best friend becomes the toilet. Living in Vancouver with the high influx of people from Asia coming in and out of the city one occasionally falls prey to one of these bastards and trust me, they can knock you off your feet for three to four weeks. I imagine African strains can be just as potent. Yet another reason to not waste the time and energy of players by having them cross the world to play meaningless fixtures. It’s all about money and licensing. And now we don’t have Rooney yet again for the start of the season. BOLLOCKS!
August 5th, 2008 at 17:48
@Viresh: Too true mate, too true.
August 5th, 2008 at 17:51
em… I don’t see how Ronaldo is a cancer to the team. Not many of the players seem to be paying him much attention and if its a case of his on field talents then there is definately nothing wrong.
August 5th, 2008 at 17:52
@Grognard: The only positive out of this Rooney saga could be we have to step up our interest in Berbatov, or someone else.
We were sitting on our hands or in Fergie and Gill’s case sun lounges thinking what a great season we had while other clubs around us were making their moves, looks a bit concerning to me.
August 5th, 2008 at 18:07
@Mihir: Man, what’s with all the negative energy? If I didn’t know better, I’d say some of you……heck many of you are starting to sound an awful lot like this paranoid bloke who participates on this blog known as the Grognard. Although none of you are coming out and saying things like “Grognard was right”, or “You know I have to admit Grognard was correct” etc etc. But that’s OK. It just makes me feel good to know that some of you are actually coming around to thinking a little bit like me and actually having the balls to challenge the decision making of the Boss and his loyal legion of blind sheep.
No Fergie’s not perfect no matter how much we all love him. He’s either getting a little to lazy in his old age or he’s lost a little bit of that fighting spirit this close to his retirement. NAH! Fergie still has the fire and desire. What he doesn’t have is the money. Blame this calamity and lack of buying players on one entity. THE GLAZER’S. Their debt load is finally starting to kill this team and it starts by reducing our transfer kitty to hardly nothing worth mentioning. We don’t have the money to overpay for a player anymore. And if we get Berbatov it will be because Spurs finally dropped their price a bit and we sold Saha for 80% more money than he’s worth.
I have a funny feeling this is going to be a really dry season when it comes to silverware. In today’s EPL, you cannot afford to drop early season points and expect to catch up. That early schedule, our injury woes and our lack of depth up front and on the wing is going to hurt us big time. And to all you optimists I say, save your wrath for when you can actually prove me wrong. Because from where I’m sitting, things are looking mighty gloomy indeed. Thank God we have a tosser side like Newcastle first up. Maybe that will help us to get off to a positive start before all those killer road games against our top opponents wear us out completely.
I’m currently accepting members to my Club Nagatosis. It sounds like some of you would like to become members. Music to my ears. I love boat rockers and non conformists. We already have enough sheep that will follow the club’s hierarchy blindly and find no fault in anything they do or don’t do for that matter. Let the revolution begin.
I want to be Berbatized. Sooner rather than later or never.
August 5th, 2008 at 18:12
Why do people assume that Fergie and Gill are just sitting on their hands. One of the best things that has come out of the Glazers ownership is no longer does our transfer activity have to be so transparent. As we saw with Vidic, Evra, Nani and Anderson they just happened and the knowledge of them was pretty much on a need to know basis. I’m sure they arent just sitting there doing nothing on the transfer front, but at the same time there’s not that many areas we need to actually improve in, and you don’t want a situation like Chelsea where we have so many players of quality in each position that you cant keep them happy and you also lock out any chance of youth players breaking through so they are looking for the right players for the squad
August 5th, 2008 at 18:17
Can anyone post the link for the Juve match????
August 5th, 2008 at 18:21
@wakey: I think the Ramsey situation sayes something towards that view mate.
August 5th, 2008 at 18:41
@Grognard:
Of course I disagree with the goings on sometimes, and when I do get frustrated about it, this is how it comes out. However, in case I am inducted into your Club Nagatosis, I guess we would have a rather love-hate relationship 
August 5th, 2008 at 18:50
@Stephen: I hope we do step up our interst in berba, cuz I thought we would have signed him in time to debut in the Juve match. Maybe SAF wants his first match to be a cup-winning one against Portsmouth, who knows, but he definitely needs to be here sooner rather than later…
August 5th, 2008 at 18:50
@Stephen: The sun lounger part was funny, but oh so true. I’m talking about a lot of examples of our boss and his minnins being asleep at the wheel or lacking the motivation and money to get things done.
1. Why was Ronaldo not examined by team doctors immediately after the Euros? Infact why wasn’t he examined after the season before the EUROS? The injury to his ankle was picked up late in the season. Why then did it take almost three weeks after the tournament to finally have him get his surgery?
2. I am all for Fergie and Gill getting a much deserved holiday but not at the same time. They have two months in which they can stagger their holidays so that somebody is minding the shop at all times. Their lack of energy, motivation and interest in going after Aaron Ramsey is just unbelievable. Especially if any of you have watched how awesome this kid looks playing for Arsenal. Talk about being lazy and dropping the ball. Fergie sicks Gary Neville on the boy and has him give him a tour of OT. He could have done that with the regular tour package that goes through there on a daily basis. Wenger on the other hand flies the boy and his parents to Switzerland and meets with him and wines and dines them into submission and a contractual agreement. SMART, STYLISH and AGGRESSIVE. United on the other hand acted arrogant, disinterested, old school and bush league.
3. Stop your vacation and nip this Ronaldo thing in the bud before it became out of hand. This soap opera has been a terrible annoyance and heart break to the millions of supporters and above all, it has been a major distraction to the team and opened up many questions about the teams direction and financial stability.
4. Not buying a few very needed players quickly and efficiently instead of dragging your ass to the point of annoyance and incredible frustration . We obviously need help at striker and on the wing, yet the club has been linked with a million players this off season only to see the fact that we are only interested in one player despite the fact that we have three extremely long in the tooth players all playing on their last legs. Who replaces Giggs? Is it Nani? OK, then who backs up Nani? Who replaces Scholes? Is it Anderson? OK, then who backs him up? Neville is back but seriously, why is he bothering? I would never play him over Brown and I certainly would consider Hargo or even Rafael Da Silva over him right now. Let him go and do him as well as all of us a favor. Ronaldo is gone for up to two months. Nani for two vital games and where is Park? Giggs is on his last legs and yet we have not seen fit to buy another WMF/Winger to back up our starters and intern until he is ready to step up. I personally do not think that Sanchez was overpriced based on his skills and overall ability. But do we go after him? NO. Why did we not seriously consider the goal machine Huntelaar? Fine, Fergie prefers Berbatov, but he is playing a dangerous game in pursuing him this way. We can ill afford to be playing games with our ranks so weakened by injury and lack of depth in certain positions?
5. I find the team’s lack of forward thinking and lack of aggressiveness very disturbing. Above all, I am noticing a big change in Fergie’s demeanor. He’s tolerating garbage from players like Ronaldo and he’s standing pat with a team that clearly needs some new blood. This team has never stood on it’s past achievements before. We would win title after title and Fergie would always buy new players and get rid of ones who no longer fit his plans. Now he’s standing back reclining on his sun lounger and acting like the old man who just gorged himself at the Christmas dinner table. He’s acting like somebody that wants to go for his nap time due to too much turkey consumption. Sure I could be wrong, but this team is not being run in the same manner as in the past.
In closing, the loss of Queiroz is going to hurt the team and Fergie is 68 years old. I think finding a solid #2 now better than later is important. I also think we all need to be shown something very positive so that we can dismiss these concerns we have about the team’s debt load. Why not buy some players if you have the money. You never buy players for the sake of buying players but come on, it’s not like we aren’t in need of any. Right now the team lacks the passion on the field and off the field that many of it’s supporters have. I’m not calling for wholesale changes like what’s happening at Spurs. But lets not blind ourselves into believing that we are as good as we think we are and that Chelsea, Arsenal and Liverpool will once again be our bitches. An now we also have to contend with Spurs too. Honestly, United are making it very difficult for me to feel optimistic. Perhaps Scholes and Giggs have dipped themselves in the fountain of youth and their resurgence will carry us through until Ronaldo returns. And what about Ronaldo’s return? What can we expect? Will we get the same old Ronny or an out of shape, out of focus lazy Ronaldo whose spirit and passion is gone? Probably the same Ronny who is not match fit and who scores half the goals he did last season. But I won’t be like the fickle Gooners fans who welcomed back Adebayor with cheers after he scored a penalty. They booed him soundly before he scored by the way. I’m not that fickle and hopefully other United fans will not soon forget or forgive his treachery and lack of loyalty. Man it’s going to be the season from Hell. And we weren’t even allowed to celebrate our Double in style. NUTS!
August 5th, 2008 at 19:00
@wakey: Who the Hell were Nani, Vidic, Evra and Anderson before we bought them? They were under everybody’s radar because that’s where they belong. You cannot go after a blue chip proven player and be silent about it. It’s impossible. We are only interested in one and guess what, the whole world knows about it. So sorry Wakey but Fergie and Gill have been sitting, no lounging on their backs doing dick, while Rome burns. They are acting powerless and unmotivated because frankly, they only have money for one player, and the price for him has to go down because they can’t afford to pay what Spurs want for him right now. What I don’t want is a team that has so many players of quality injured and only scrubs backing them up. I’m not saying go out and by proven world class players to backup our starters. I’m saying buy a top striker because we desperately need on and buy a few very young but talented wingers like a Sanchez or Ninis or Marin who can sit and learn and wait for their chance to challenge for a starting position but who are more than capable like Nani and Anderson of playing vital roles as subs and spot starters. Instead we are give an overdose of Gray’s, Cleverley’s, Gibson’s and Campbell’s who are not United caliber. It’s time to call Fergie and United on their deception and force them to come straight on the team’s lack of financial flexibility and ambition. Sorry, but I call it as I see it and I’m not wearing blinders. We’re broke and we are acting like it. At least Rafa scrambles and has a major fire sale in order to buy Barry and Keane. I’ll give him credit for that.
August 5th, 2008 at 19:02
@Mihir: Hey listen mate, there is nothing wrong with disagreeing with each other as long as we are friendly and respectful about it. I see your side and I think you see mine. The fact that we can disagree and laugh about is the key.
August 5th, 2008 at 19:04
@Gabriel: In the mean time he is not playing for Spurs so he is more and more unfit for a match. It’s total madness.
August 5th, 2008 at 19:20
@Grognard: dude, don’t get me started on the madness involved with eveything Manchester United this summer; we couldn’t celeberate our double, our star player wants out, we’re accused of tapping up, half our 1st team is injured/absent, we can’t acquire our targets anymore.. the list goes on. I just hope it’s Fergie putting up his poker face and behind the scenes, he’s doing something drastic to address these issues.
I’ve never been this pessimistic in last seasons, maybe it’s cuz we won the double and my expectations have been raised
August 5th, 2008 at 19:38
@Grognard: of course grognard, thats how healthy debate works! wheres the fun if everyone keeps agreeing with you?!
August 5th, 2008 at 19:42
hey juve match is today or tomorrow?
August 5th, 2008 at 19:53
@Gabriel: Gee, I forgot all about the tapping up accusations from Levy, good point. It’s been absolute misery which makes me ask one major question in all this mess. Why has United done nothing to put our minds at ease or show a statement of intent instead of going all stealth on us and letting us swim in our pool of self pity? Does a team that makes millions off it’s legions of supporters not owe those supporters something for their patronage and loyalty? Why put us through the ringer like this. Why not clean up a lot of the misconceptions and rumors that have been flying and put our fans at ease instead of always giving news conferences where you either avoid the question or give vague answers. Like today. “Ronaldo will be with us this season for sure” or something very similar to that. Does that mean he will be sold next season? I can understand the quietness regarding Berbatov because that needs to be handled with care but come on, please let us know why you seem to be content on starting the season with no new blood and half the team on the trainers table? Inquiring minds want to know…..
August 5th, 2008 at 19:54
@Mihir: True but then again, I could get used to everyone agreeing with ME. Yes, I’d rather like that I think.
August 5th, 2008 at 20:25
You guys hear about the new rule regarding referees? Apparently, the FA is takin a page from Rugby’s books; They are instating a rule which requires only team captains eligible to speak/complain to the referee during games!! That’s not bad news for United, as our players (bar rooney
) are not aggressivee towards refs. Can’t say the same for chelsea and mascherano though, hopefully they’ll get enough players booked to decrease their chances of a title challenge 
August 5th, 2008 at 20:33
@Grognard: since when are you as good as Alex Ferguson at judging talent. When Scholes and Beckham were breaking through they weren’t the world beaters that they became after gaining lower league experience and a year in the reserves. I hate to think what you would have been like when SAF put all of his faith in kids. You yourself said that you have to watch a player over a period of time to judge them and have had many disputes with people over them prematurely judging players. I respect your opinion but how many times have you actually seen Campbell play a competitive game at the height of fitness? You can have your opinions but the one thing that I can’t stand is a hypocrite.
August 5th, 2008 at 21:23
@Grognard: Hey dude! You mind wanna being a little optimistic?
I got the answers!
1. Do you really think that Ronaldo was going to have an operation before the EUROS? In the season when he was Iron HOT? And by the way after the Euros, his ego was too much! You forget that he really needed that break! He was one of the top starters in United’s season! And also in the Portugal matches!
2. What on earth was Aaron Ramsey going to do after coming to United! Sure he would have been a bright one for the future! But do you really think that he would have broken into United’s first team of Anderson, Hargreaves, Scholes, Carrick and EVEN Fletcher? He went to Arsenal because he saw a chance of first team Football! And if you think about it, Possebon isnt so bad either? So would he have tolerated being NO.6 in the midfield?
3. You forget that whether Fergie or Gill were at vacation or not! They did every thing to stop this Saga! THAT IS that they complained to FIFA and then to UEFA as well! What more could they do? If these organizations werent hell bent to be predujuced against English Football then Madrid may have gotten a hefty Ban. Even if Fergie had said that Ronaldo is staying, which he has by the way, do you really think that that would stop Madrid from using Marca and AS to publish everyday that ronaldo is coming?
4. & 5. TOMAS HELP ME OUT! LETS FINISH THIS GROGNOFICATION! By the way! I got no anwers to this!
August 5th, 2008 at 21:37
If something is not broken, don’t fix it. We just had a great season and I can read lot of complaints about the management over the summer. We boasted a great attacking football and showed the meaning to the beautiful game. Last season we spent millions on 4 players, why do we need to spend big again? The boss promised us a player and he is on his way and why do we need all the best talents in the world.
We sit in some corner of the world and can type anything we want and who knows exactly what is happening in the meeting between SAF, Gill and the owners. I am sure SAF has a limited budget and he has identified his target and he will get it.
At some point in a season every team will have injury crisis – for us it is too soon. We can’t replace all the injured players with super stars.
How much silverware we won’t last season – oh, is SAF really old and lazy? – I don’t think so.
August 5th, 2008 at 21:56
Calm down, Chicken Littles….The side might be a bit light, might be, for the first two games of the season max. But Carrick could potentially be back, and i know the report said wayne might be out for two weeks, but wayne has always made quick recoveries from injury. And i dont know, I just wouldnt be surprised if he is determined enough to make himself fit for the first game of the season, he wont want to miss out and let carlos have all the fun. In that span its newcastle and pompey, and i think the lads available have more than enough quality to grab at the very minimum 3 points there, which would be higher than was gained in the first two games last year.
Then Nani comes back, Andersonsonson will be closer to returning, Park’s knee might feel a little better, ditto for Hargo…things then start to look a lot brighter.
And even if all of the worst is to believed and if the sky really is falling, this meaning the first two games are without rooney and carrick and we have to start with cambell up front with tevez….we still have fucking nemanja in the back. Right next to him is Rio. Evra is the best left back in the league. Van der Sar is a wall. And Wesly is hitting his peak. How can you worry when you have that foundation? Things will be ok….In Vidic I Trust
August 5th, 2008 at 22:17
@samphraim: i stopped reading after your first sentence. cast your mind back to our treble winning season, our greatest season ever, in that summer, fergie made 4 low key signings, 3 of them turned out to be flops and 1 became an egg headed squad player, so we didnt really add to the team. the team did winn the league that season, but flopped at everything else. what im getting at is that we need to build on our laurels by signing or bringing in players from our youth/reserves.
August 5th, 2008 at 22:19
@Liam: I’m not a hypocrite and I don’t judge players better than Fergie. I’m just offering my opinion. If you can’t handle that without jumping down my neck that’s your problem. I find it funny though that I’m not the only voice spouting doom and gloom lately but it’s still me who receives all the hate mail. Some people are just so nice and a bove all, so incredibly fair.
August 5th, 2008 at 22:39
@Grognard: HAHA! Good one! Actually I only try to show that I am optimistic! But dont worry maybe this virus to Rooney would be a blessing in disguise and maybe an eye opener for Fergie to really go after Berbatov! But do you know I think that we wont sign anyone! Because Berbatov is going to Barca! Lets hope that God is seriously with us!
August 5th, 2008 at 22:41
@Red Diablo: What a load of horse swoggle. First off read my post again. I never claimed that they should have operated on Ronaldo before the EUROS. I claimed that they knew of his injury before the EUROS. BIG FUCKING DIFFERENCE. Secondly, because of that knowledge, the operation on his ankle should have been scheduled a day or two after his exit out of the tournament. So clean your reading glasses next time you incorrectly read my posts. STRIKE ONE
Secondly, you have no fucking idea what Aaron Ramsey and his family would have chosen had they met first hand with the boss and allowed Fergie to convince the boy that he has a long and bright future playing for the best team in the world and a team that sees an opening for him as a starter in a couple of years. He would have stresses patience and a chance to learn and mature under the tutelage of greats like Giggs and Scholes instead of playing in the wilderness at the Emirates with nobody to look up to and to emulate and learn from but Wenger alone. It’s all about salesmanship and giving a damn as well as the old fashioned effort. Ramsey is only 16. his parents and him would have made a more informed opinion rather than allowing themselves to be seduced by the Voyeur in Switzerland. It was a bush league attempt and a half hearted effort to sign the one golden boy in British football and Fergie blew big time. If you can’t wrap your head around that then that’s not my problem nor is it my fault. STRIKE TWO
Fergie and Gill both deserve their time off and I have no problem with that but they do have a responsibility to the club and it’s millions of supporters to rush back in the case of an emergency. Fair enough, it was tough to have any kind of conversation with Ronaldo while he was at the EUROS but the moment the tourney ended he should have forced the prick into his office and laid down the law. He eventually flew very covertly to Portugal to meet with him and it seems he made his case but we fans are still the ones mystified by all this because we are being kept in the black. Couldn’t he do a better job of explaining the situation and easing our anxiety over this instead of letting all of us all stir in our sweat? The whole mess has been handled poorly and has ruined what should have been a two month long party. And now he continues to be vague when it comes to exactly what went on with Ronaldo today. You know why? Because Ronaldo was not even in England. Ronaldo snubbed the Boss yet one more time. It’s just Fergie’s stubborness that was quoted today. He’s awfully sure of himself because he is hiding behind that useless contract but what if Ronaldo decides he’s not reporting to the team at all? What then? Perhaps that won’t happen but what if it does? The whole affair has been handled poorly and disgracefully because both parties forget who the fuck really pays their wages. So as I see it, it’s your case that’s weak and I’m sorry to inform you but you’ve been GROGNIFIED. Go beg Tomas for some help. Pretty sad I think!
August 5th, 2008 at 22:43
@samphraim: How on Earth can you say nothing is broken? 50% of our starters are injured and we are as thin as a sheet of ice at striker and on the wing and optimistic, naive individuals like you continue to play the positive vibes card. And nobody is saying to replace all those players with superstars. Read the posts we write more carefully. Christ, give me strength.
August 5th, 2008 at 22:46
@Red Diablo: I thought God was Fergie to people like yourself? After all, in your books he can do no wrong. That sounds awfully godlike to me.
August 5th, 2008 at 22:50
@Drew Vader: Honestly mate, how many table spoons of sugar do you put in your tea or coffee,12? That sweet as hell optimism is making my Type two Diabetes jump to Type one from just reading it. Awfully optimistic and incredibly unrealistic. To be honest, I am a glass half empty type of bloke. I can see you are the opposite side of that coin.
August 5th, 2008 at 23:23
Despite our shortages in attack, we can thank our lucky stars that our defence remains intact. An injury to Rio (God forbid) would really fuck us up right about now. If we can continue to keep clean sheets and keep goals out, I think we’ll still have enough to grab one or two goals down the other end. It might be a bit like the start of last season until we get some players back, but we’ll have to live with that. A Berbatov tonic would help though.
August 5th, 2008 at 23:26
@Grognard: LoL GROG!!! that was a roast
!!! seriously though, there is some need for concern considering our defeciencies in the squad. Fergie did promise us something, and I hope he delivers, but at the mo, it’s looking dim.
To all those overly optimistic sheep, if we don’t voice our concerns, who will? If we do not call the manager and players up, do you think they’ll have that motivation to succeed? If we are not clear about our expectations, will the manager/club/players strive to achieve them and more?
Great clubs are built on continued success, and that continued success is brought upon by the continous escalating expectations of the fans/board!! If you can’t see that the squad is light of quality players in the striking/wing positions, then maybe you need to take off those red-tinted glasses we all love to wear and take a good hard look!!!
August 5th, 2008 at 23:35
@Grognard: By the same strength we don’t know for sure who is or isn’t going to be ready for the start of the season, and you’re a bloody fear mongerer! Our defence is strong! Too strong for Newcastle or Portsmouth or Zenit. A side featuring Gibson and Campbell and a whole bunch of other youngsters played a full strength Portsmouth off the park for most of the Nigeria game….
Half full my friend, Half full
Even if we sign Berba or Huntelaar is their really enough time to get to know our way of playing before the big kick off?!
August 5th, 2008 at 23:43
@Grognard:
Why do you pick an issue and go after it without any evidence. First you did it with Ronaldo, now its with the debt. As you have had it explained to you OVER AND OVER again the debt isnt an issue because in reality there is no debt. Its a debt on paper but the money is there to pay it off. Yes the downturn in world markets will mean that the return on investing this money elsewhere rather than pay off the debt wont be making the same level of return it was but the margins in the first place wouldnt have been so tight so that a downturn would instantly make the return less than the intrest payments otherwise it wouldnt have been worth the risk
August 5th, 2008 at 23:53
@Grognard: You write as if you know how Ramsey’s parents would’ve decided. How the hell would you know for sure that they would’ve chosen Utd instead of Arsenal. Reports claimed that he was to be loaned to Cardiff for a season. Maybe thats the reason why he chose Arsenal. Fergie would never have been able to promise him first team football.Had he promised that would’ve been an outright lie.Everyone would’ve known that.Utd would’ve groomed him better but he wanted first team action straight away. At this point we can never give him that.What did the trick for Wenger was that he can promise him first team football, even though Ramsey is not going to be regular starter. I of course agree that SAF should’ve treated the matter better. But it wouldn’t have made any difference.
You get really pissed even when someone questions your opinion. I’ve read so many times with you saying that many people her cannot stand proper arguments and they get bloody pissed. But you are no exception. Whatever you’ve ranted here is not fact. Its only your point of view. So when someone questions your view on something, you get bloody pissed. Now I’m not here supporting Red Diablo or someone else. So don’t go ahead asking me to mind my business.
I’m here to argue so if you want lets argue.
August 5th, 2008 at 23:54
@Grognard:
1) Maybe if they could do it again they would have scheduled him for the op immediately but you don’t rush into operations. They probably wanted to see how it reacted to rest to get a clear picture of the situation
2) He didn’t snub Fergie as he wasn’t due back today. He is due to see the Doctor at the end of the week and his return date decided then
August 6th, 2008 at 0:00
@Grognard:
We need a new striker yes and Fergies said that himself and has said its something he is working on. But the midfield issue is not a real issue, its one that due to circumstances has become one but its temporary. People like Rossi and Pique have failed to break through due to the starting line up being too strong and now you are calling on United to make signings for what would be temp cover that will end up just restricting others chances of getting on the bench or even in the reserves. You are calling on united to basically panic buy which would just be idiotic
August 6th, 2008 at 0:23
@Gabriel: So well said mate. You are right, wee need some voices who don’t bend over and take it like willing sheep. It’s also heart warming to find another lad on this blog who will occasionally agree with me and back me up against some of the hate Grognard mongers I attract. Like I said earlier, I’m not the only one who has these views but I seem to be the only one who has been targeted for criticism. People need to know there has to be a little balance when it comes to views. Perhaps I am the loudest of the critics but still, it’s good to have an ally once in a while. Cheers!
Also, I cook a mean roast don’t I?
August 6th, 2008 at 0:26
@Mihir: Carrick is available and i haven’t seen anything to the contrary that says Hargreaves won’t be available either…@Stephen: Fergie was on vacation and if i remember when he was asked after he got back why he didn’t talk to Ronaldo earlier, he said he wasn’t gonna interrupt his vacation for anything, so i didn’t expect him to do the same over Ramsey
God, you guys on here are soo depressing, its just appalling.
@Red Diablo: Thank you, finally a light in the midst of all the depressing postings that is going on here. I really wonder what all these doom and gloomers were saying when we sold Ruud and brought in only Carrick? Probably relegation beckons and all that rubbish.@dan(u-ol): The difference is that the 08 squad is a lot more complete than the ‘99 squad…@Gabriel: So you really think Fergie or someone from the club is reading this? Grog can’t shout as much as he wants, Fergie or Gill can’t hear you, they’ll make a move whenever they feel its right, we fans will just have to wait.
@Grognard: Its his opinion, just like you like you and your other depressants like to see only whats broken, he can still see the positives, so its very rude to call his post horsewoggle
August 6th, 2008 at 0:29
@Traverse: What a load of rubbish. What’s your mouth pal when you start calling a person a fear mongerer. You may it sound like I’m some cyber troll who invades a blog just to upset the balance. Your comment is extremely rude and insensitive towards my freedom of speech. What am I to do lie and be dishonest about my feelings in order to not corrupt you virgin ears? Grow a pair and stop beings such a wallflower. Just call me a ying to your yang and leave it at that. I’m just a concerned fan who is voicing his opinion. If you can’t deal with my thoughts, ignore them and move on. I think that’s valid and friendly adivice.
August 6th, 2008 at 0:29
We only have a lack of depth at striker. We have four wingers who are capable of playing in the first team, so we certainly do not lack depth there. You do not buy a player just to cover injuries for a month. That is a waste. We had a very strong squad last year so when it comes to strengthening now fergie has to be careful about who and how many he brings in. I believe we will sign berbatov. After that, no-one else should come in, as it would mean too many players. To anyone who is worried about VDS, neville, scholes and giggs not being able to cope at the start of the season – How??? It’s the start of the season, you talk as if these players are frail old men. They will be nice and sharp for the season opening. I expect giggs to be able to do a job early on. Sure, his quality has most definitely went downhill but he will still be fit and raring to go. He is still good enough to play for the first team. Scholes is still our best midfielder by some distance.
Also, do you really think fergie gives a damn about keeping the fans informed on club issues like the ronaldo sittuation? No. It really doesn’t matter if we are kept in the dark. It’s the same with berbatov. Fergie is not going to rush a deal for the player just to please a bunch of paranoid supporters who are completely insignificant in the whole thing.
August 6th, 2008 at 0:32
@wakey: I’m not even going to respond to your condescending and insulting accusations. Just try reading my mind and you’ll get the jest of what I’m thinking. I there is one person that knows his stuff and generally backs it up with facts it’s me. That’s not to say that I cannot express my feelings even if they are based on gut instinct and the evidence that is at hand. So get over yourself and your and your smarter than Einstein BS. As if you work in the OT accounting department. You know as much as I do, so stop preaching.
August 6th, 2008 at 0:38
@tevez: Exactly my point(though i didn’t agree when you said the same thing on Ronaldo), we can voice and rant all we want, no one at MUFC gives a rat ass and they’re never gonna read this, Fergie will buy a player when he wants, all we can do is wait and speculate and then go into a frenzy about whether we’re in debt or not.
I’d have liked to read this blog at the beginning of last season, just to see what people here were saying…
August 6th, 2008 at 0:44
@Krishnan: I don’t know how the parents would have reacted but I have confidence that with a 100% effort and Ferguson’s charm and salesmanship that we would have had a much better chance to sign the player. If we still lost than you wouldn’t have heard a peep out of me. It’s all about lack of effort that bugs me. And don’t challenge me to an argument mate because trust me you don’t have the wit nor the vocabulary to defeat me. And that’s not intended to insult you it’s just that I speak from history and the many who have challenges me in my professional and personal life. I’m not trying to pick a fight and i am more than willing to debate in a friendly and polite manner. There are many who can attest to that. It’s the ones who argue with me and disagree in a rude or condescending manner and who enforce their way of acting on me by telling me how to think that gets my dander up. I have no issue with you whatsoever so lets keep it that way and I have no problem with you disagreeing with me. But what do you expect me to do after you have disagreed with me? Do you want me to bend over and allow you to spank as a reward? I am set o my way of thinking as you are in yours so we need to get our points across and both of us have to live with the other’s disagreeing point of view. Simple policy I think. And where may I ask did I tell you directly to mind your own business? Stop putting words in my mouth and misinterpreting my meaning.
August 6th, 2008 at 0:46
@wakey: He was due back today and in fact I just watched the SkySports telecast make that exact point and then wonder why he did not show up. All the major papers and media outlets made a point of today being judgment day. And as usual the coward doesn’t show up. He likes to fight his battles through the use of his family mouthpieces.
August 6th, 2008 at 0:52
I still say anything ronaldo says to us doesn’t matter. He is obviously a prick who is getting too big for his boots, but he is a great player who has good friends in the squad, therefore i see no harm in trying to hold onto him as the only negative is some fans will be (understandably) annoyed. In the end, that doesn’t matter. After a few goals supporters will get behind him again anyway. Everyone is adamant they will never forgive him and all that, but i just find it hard to imagine fans not being happy with a player banging the goals in. It won’t happen. I think during the season he will be fully focused on his football. He will work hard and maintain his great form. As long as that’s the case i’ll be happy to see him here, as i don’t see any indication of his ego affecting team morale.
August 6th, 2008 at 0:54
@wakey: No I am not asking for signings that are of a temporary nature. Jesus Christ I am fed up with guys like you who plainly cannot read. I have stated many many many times that we need a striker and we need to sign an excellent young but able to play now winger who can learn from Giggs and others much like Nani did last year. We are going to be losing Giggs and Sacholes soon so we need to look now for establishing depth and future quality at that position. Ronaldo and Nani is not good enough. We need a quality young player who can play understudy to both of those players and spell them off every so often. So stop directing my words into things that strengthen your case because that is unfair and incredibly low. You will not win this argument so give it a rest. Neither of us win here. We just agree to disagree so stop misquoting me and making me out to be an idiot when I am not. And I suggest you not call me an idiot anymore either. Try to play by the rules in this blog, even if it’s hard to do sometimes.
August 6th, 2008 at 0:58
@Rd: Boo fucking hoo. My hard bleeds. Oh we’re too fucking depressing. What are you going to do, slit your wrists? Deal with it. Put some perspective on things. AL we are talking about is fucking football, not if your wife is fooling around you. You have no idea what depressing pal, trust me. This is just debate over a bloody sport so if you are having a problem with it, go see your vicar. Grow the fuck up and stop being such a ball bay. OOOH BOO HOO HOO YOUR SO DEPRESSING!
August 6th, 2008 at 1:03
@tevez: I’ll say it one more time. I want a winger for when Giggs is retired and I would like him now so he can be taught properly by the master himself and slowly weened into the post. Waiting for Giggs to retire is not as good an option in my opinion. Especially when a great talent like Sanchez is out there right now. The player would also be very useful during this period without Ronaldo and Park and without Nani for two games, but that would just be a bonus. And all though Giggs, Scholes, Neville and EVDS are not frail old men, they are old and they only have so much more time left to offer us at their best. Wake up to that and register it. It’s a fact. We need an injection of some more new and young world class blood. Players like Possebon, and the twins are a great start. Lets continue with that.
August 6th, 2008 at 1:04
@wakey: Nobody is saying we should panic buy. Fergie stated at the beginning of the summer that we were goin after one or two signings, I’m pretty sure he was talking about a striker and Tevez/Young winger. It is obvious we need a proven striker, and I initially we could have risked not gettin one, but this viral infection to rooney is a sign from the gods tellin SAF that anything can happen, these players are not invincible, hence, the team needs to be well re-enforced for our double title defence.
I’m glad that you at least recognise the need for a striker, but there is also a need for a young winger who would replace Nani when he in turn replaces Giggs. Right now, we have very few natural wingers capable of coping with the amount of games we have this season. With us usually playing a ‘wide’ counter-attack style of play, we need all our wingers fit (and don’t mention fletcher or hargreaves as they are not natural wingers and cannot play consistently in consecutive games in that position). Right now, we have Nani and Giggs, with Park and Ronnie set to come back later; combined with the fact that SAF said he would play Giggs less this season, why don’t we get a young winger who would come in like Nani did last season and be an understudy to giggs and also, more importantly, provide cover for those extra matches we have this season.
If giggs is gonna be faced out this season, and nani taking his place, why not get nani’s replacement now, especially with our other wingers injured. That will at least give him more playing time and enable us to consistently play our wide counter-attack system rather than hinder it while trying to accomodate CMF’s like Hargo and Fletch(they’re good, but not wingers).
I’ve said it before luck is preparation meets opportunity; every team has the opportunity at the start of the season, but only the best prepared prevail at the end. Last season, we were prepared, following our loss in the CL semi’s. This season, we have a more gruelling and tougher schedule, so why not prepare for it like we did last season?
August 6th, 2008 at 1:09
@Grognard: We don’t need a quality young winger to play understudy to nani and ronaldo. I’m assuming by quality young winger you mean someone like sanchez who is touted as a future first team player. Ronaldo and nani are to be first choice wingers for the long term and so having a young player who is expected to develop to the same level cannot be compensated for. It would go the same way as rossi and pique. The timing does not suit and so there will not be a chance for the player to gain a first team spot. Nani and anderson were brought in because the time was right for giggs and scholes to be replaced. The same cannot be said here. Nani and ronaldo are still young, and so when giggs retires a suitable replacement would be someone closer to park, in the sense that they will not hold down a regular spot but are good enough to step in.
August 6th, 2008 at 1:10
@Rd: So why don’t we all just shut the fuck up and stop voicing our opinions. We do so that each other hears what we have to say. If any dead head here honestly thought the heads at OT were rerading our posts, I’d say he needed to go get his head examined. Seriously, grab some perspective. When I say something like “Fergie, make a deal already”, I’m not actually expecting him to read that. It’s a form of expressing one’s thought’s. Anybody with a decent education and command of the Queen’s English would be able to understand that and get my drift. So please stop with the nonsense and finger pointing as if you are talking to me like I’m some kind of delusional idiot. If all we should do is stay silent and wait until Fergie does something than why don’t you have the balls to tell RR to close his blog since it obviously is not needed. Here’s a clue. This blog is about sharing ideas and thoughts about our favorite team. These ideas and thoughts can both be positive and negative. Is that clear to you or do you need pictures too?
August 6th, 2008 at 1:15
@tevez: I see what you are saying about Ronaldo and I’ll even agree with you up to a point. But hear me out. What if he comes back and is clearly not giving 100% and is acting all moody and upsetting the whole training ground and dressing room environment? You may think that won’t happen and it probably won’t but one thing he has shown me in the past two months is he is very self centered and and very unprofessional in his way of dealing with things. The first day he dogs it on the pitch I can see Rooney all over his ass. And he can thank his bloody stars Keano is no longer around or he would probably need a plastic surgeon when it’s all said and done. he worries me with his attitude greatly, but I do have faith that Fergie will get him in line. On that we can agree.
August 6th, 2008 at 1:15
@Grognard: Once again you are the one who cannot heed your own words. You whine on about your ‘freedom of speech’, yet call me rude and insensitive and tell me to grow a pair for daring to say something as drastic as lighten up!
Your aren’t lying or being dishonest, and nobody suggested you were being. What you are doing however is stomping your feet like a 12 year old who dropped their ice cream in to a puddle, and moaning about debt that you have no evidence to hold your argument together.
I’d try and ignore you (and have done to a large extent), but it’s every other comment on here!
August 6th, 2008 at 1:20
@tevez: I disagree. First off, Ronaldo will be gone in a year or two. There is no way in Hell that he will be here for his entire contract. You can quote me on that one. Nani is not a certainty by no means. He is very talented but he is moody, temperamental and lacks the smarts to think like a team player. Sure he can grow into that but many players have failed in this area and he may be another. I personally believe he will be a success but I think we need insurance just in case. And like I said, Ronaldo is not hear forever. Sanchez is young enough hat sitting and only playing the role as a sub or spoit starter for a season or two should be OK. If Nani and Ronaldo could do that, so can Sanchez. Look at Pato and Bojan. They had all the talent in the world but they too had to sit back and wait. It’s only natural.
August 6th, 2008 at 1:26
@Traverse: You are not talking football man, you are attacking my personality so learn to accept a bit of your own medicine. And I’m sure your scroll button on your mouse works well enough to avoid my rants. Deal with it. If you stop to read them it’s because your dark side is compelling you or because you find me that bloody entertaining.
Seriously though, I’m getting tired of yours and some others abuse. Stop making this personal and stick to disagreeing about football. Putting me down for the number of times I comment is hurtful and totally unnecessary. Forgive me for having passion and love for my team and wanting to partake in some good old fashioned debate and conversation on a blog. I didn’t think I had a limit or quota on how much I can contribute. Sorry for inconveniencing you. 
August 6th, 2008 at 1:28
Yes, if ronaldo is not putting in the effort and he’s generally being a spoilt prick once the football gets underway, then that’s a fairly huge problem. I don’t think this will be the case though. He is an excellent player and i do think he loves playing, so when he comes back i expect him to perform. In terms of team harmony, i’ve only ever heard positives from teammates regarding his personality and obviously his play.
I agree with you. If he performs, i see no problems. If he doesn’t, well, we’re kind of fucked really…
August 6th, 2008 at 1:43
@Grognard: Ah, but that’s different. That’s a replacement for ronaldo, not giggs. Nani is not a certainty, but neither is sanchez so he is not guaranteed insurance if nani fails. Also, fergie would have known about sanchez last year and he opted to sign nani, which would show that perhaps fergie, as well as queiroz and the scouting team, came to the conclusion that nani has more potential than sanchez.
I agree ronaldo will be gone within the next two years, at which point having sanchez ready to replace him would be great ( and one of the best ideas, behind buying a super talent eg. messi, aguero) and so with a view to doing that bringing him in now would be wise. The idea of replacing giggs with sanchez is different and is something i don’t agree with. If sanchez is brought in to replace ronaldo then giggs will still need to be replaced in the squad, and i stand by my opinion that he should be replaced by someone who would remain more of a squad player like park.
August 6th, 2008 at 1:44
@Rd: as far as I can remember everyone was very optimistic about the new season last year. It’s ironic that we have the same squad as then and this season we are apparently going to struggle this season. Now that I think back the only doubts were whether Rooney and Tevez could play in the same team.
@Gabriel: what you are basically saying is that we need a replacment for a replacement. It is just silly considering by the time we play ‘Pool we will basically have a full strength team. Evra can play left wing and if we get desperate the twins can play on either wing and without much defensive responsibility. We have Campbell who is good enough to cover for Rooney against Pompey and Newcastle and there is a good chance Fergie will buy a player before the end of the window
@Grognard: the reason people target you is because you throw a hissy fit every time you don’t agree with somebody. You talk about free speech but whenever somebody says something that you don’t agree with you tell them to shut up. I’m not going to comment about this again and its finished as far as I’m concerned because I’m just sick of arguing with you
August 6th, 2008 at 1:50
@Gabriel: Liam put that well. You do not buy a replacement for a replacement. I like that. Much clearer than how i put it.
August 6th, 2008 at 2:15
@Grognard: “You are not talking football man, you are attacking my personality”. Insane. I was talking about football. You then targeted me. Grow Up.
End.
August 6th, 2008 at 2:18
@Liam: @tevez: I’m not saying we should get a 1st team player, rather a player who can be weened slowly into the team while at the same time providing some cover at those risky times with injuries/suspensions etc. As at the moment we have no young wing prospects that are capable of making that jump into the first team anytime in the nxt yr when we loose one of our wingers. If we get this kid, he can learn a lot from Giggs and co, like Nani did last year. We are going to be losing Giggs soon so we need to look now for establishing depth and future quality at that position.
It’s gonna be like we were acquiring another youngster; I’m not demanding a David Silva or Frank Ribery; he has to be young, ready to play if called on and have the potential to develop into a star.
August 6th, 2008 at 2:21
@Grognard: There you go again. I never asked you to agree with me. I gave a lot of points in my argument which were valid. You come up with one point saying that with SAF’s charm he would have been able to sign the kid. And to add that you say that I can’t beat you in argument. Bullshit. Let people look at my post and then yours and let us see whose one holds weight and is valid.
And also if you can read properly I accepted there was a lack of effort in from Utd.
August 6th, 2008 at 2:23
@Grognard: I can’t be bothered to reply to such an intelligent post…clearly you’ve shown those vocabulary skills you were talking about earlier, kudos! But anyway, ranting over and over, typing in caps as much does not change anything…you’ll just have to wait, but if you’d have read my post, you’d have seen the crux of my post was in reply in grogified user number 2 Gabriel, who said something about voicing out opinions and keeping the manager and others on their toes, my point was that whatever you rave and rant about on here from dusk to dawn clearly has no effect whatsoever on Fergie’s decisions, hope you get it now… No offense, but your posts are really sad, i hope the way you post and the manner with which you address people doesn’t reflect what kinda person you are in real life, if not i feel for people close to you. Judging from your posts it seems you’d be the one slashing your wrists and probably tying a noose if Fergie doesn’t sign anyone
@Gabriel: Ever thought maybe Fergie might be waiting to see how some youngsters turn out before splashing money on a “Nani replacement”
August 6th, 2008 at 2:50
My thoughts.
1. If we cannot get Berbatov and are unwilling to buy Huntelaar or someone like that instead then RONALDO not Campbell for me is our third striker.
2. That could leave us a bit short on the wings as Giggs cannot play every game and Park is injured a fair deal.
3. Therefore a third winger is needed. Ramsey or Dos Santos would have been perfect but we screwed up on those deals. Also they will have a season to settle so that when Giggs retires and Ronaldo leaves it won’t be such a problem.
4. If we do not go with this then I think Hargreaves should play on the right when Ronaldo is out or is made to play up front when we have injuries.
5. We should also look into giving Anderson a few run outs on the left. We seem to have made him our midfield enforcer but that could be limiting his development especially as he was supposed to be an attacking midfielder.
August 6th, 2008 at 3:14
@colver: Ramsey is a central midfielder and we never showed any interest in dos santos. Ronaldo won’t play up front too much as that limits the team’s penetration. He is the main runner from deep and his drive and explosive running is important to our play.
Anderson has played there before and could probably do a good job for us there but only as cover when nothing else is available. He is not our midfield enforcer, he is a central midfielder of the attacking variety and this is the position he plays for us. He has been brought in to replace scholes in the team. He is an attacking midfielder playing in an attacking midfield position so i do not see howhis development is being hindered.
August 6th, 2008 at 3:24
@Rd: Now i’m ‘grogified user number 2′
lol!!! mate, i was just voicing my opinions and they coincided with Grognards, no need to patronise!! Besides, this is supposed to be a ManUtd blog; I know Fergie doesn’t read it, but as a fan, I think i’m obliged to air my opinions, even if it’s not as part of the 76,000 chanting at OT or in a newspaper or TV phone-in. I wish i could communicate my views through those channels but I can’t, so I opt for a United Blog, where United fans can discuss all things Unite, positive or negative. If i’m at fault, lemme kno…
On the winger case, how many young wingers do we have in the reserves? Lee martin? Gimme a break, he might be good, but at 21, if he hasn’t reached a certain level, he’s never gonna cut it for United (he is the same age as nani). Apart from him, I see no one who could push for a place in the 1st team setup this comin year…
August 6th, 2008 at 3:44
I wonder how many guys on here (especially Mr G) actually have watched the pre-season games? While not a true indication of what the season will go these games are a good indication of what kind of form the players are in. I’ve heard rave reviews about Tevez but has anybody not noticed that Scholes is in sublime form? The team is also playing some neat football which is nice to watch even if the opposition hasn’t been top notch. I didn’t watch the Posh encounter but it seems that the doom and gloom stems from the fact that we haven’t made any high profile signings. The team is intact (despite injuries and the Ronaldo fiasco) with some exciting prospective talent coming though like Possebon, Cleverly and the Silva twins. If Ronaldo does play I think the striker panic is a moot point because Mr R is basically a striker posing as a winger…if he doesn’t I’m optimistic that btwn Tevez, Giggs, Nani, Campbell (maybe Manucho if he gets clearance) we’ll get some goals…
August 6th, 2008 at 5:23
@tevez: No, it just means that it was easier to scout Nani in Argentina than to go all the way to Argentina to scout Sanchez. And all though Messi or Aguero would be ideal, I think they are unrealistic targets and I think it will get progressively more difficult to buy great players from abroad as the day gets closer when Fergie retires. Players want to play for us because of Fergie’s legacy of success. When he goes there will be a curtain of uncertainty surrounding the team. I mean how do you replace the great man?
August 6th, 2008 at 5:25
@Traverse: “What you are doing however is stomping your feet like a 12 year old who dropped their ice cream in to a puddle, and moaning about debt that you have no evidence to hold your argument together”. “I’d try and ignore you (and have done to a large extent), but it’s every other comment on here!”
Sorry pal but call that an attack on me and it has nothing to do with football. Bite me! FINISHED!
August 6th, 2008 at 5:34
@Liam: That’s not true. I only throw a hissy fit when assholes get personal with me or when they stop talking football and start telling me how I should think and how I should act. Find one quote where I have told somebody to shut up that wasn’t attacking me personally. Come on, I dare you! You think you are tired of this. Fuck, I’m so fed up with the bunch of you always letting me have it over my views just because you see me as the villain. I doubt many of you would be so bold if RR was actually around to monitor this garbage but it’s obvious the guy is busy with other things because he would tell us both to stop right now. So you know what, I’ll help him out. I’ll stop because this is not worth it. What the fuck do I care what you think of me and why do I give a damn? I just think back to his cartoon in his post today that says it all. Why I allow myself to get sucked in by fascists on a blog is beyond me. I finished with arguing. If you and others don’t like or agree with what I say from now on, I couldn’t give a fuck. Pathetic little people who have to control the minds and freedom of others. This is the last time I argue with anyone on this blog. Like Ronaldo, my detractors are dead to me. I will just ignore them and nothing they say that;s negative will be replied so have your fun if you get your jollies with that kind of stuff. Truly pathetic.
August 6th, 2008 at 5:35
@Krishnan: OK you win. Now go have a beer and do your girlfriend.
August 6th, 2008 at 5:40
@Rd: Not very nice and rather mean spirited. But that’s OK. You’re not worth the effort. I’m turning over a new leaf and you are one that’s not worth the effort because you have made things personal. Your jibes about my personal like are out of line. I’d caution you to remember RR’s policy about personal attacks. Have a nice day.
August 6th, 2008 at 5:56
@Gabriel: If all the people on this blog were as liberal minded and as fair as you, there would be no problems. To some here we are expected to be a form of cheerleaders who sing and chant and offer our stupid predictions base on only positive energy and happy demeanor. And if you are not one of the “Happy people” Gabriel, you are considered a harbinger of bad karma and fear monger. A black cloud that must be eradicated by the use of their only deadly weapon, their pea sized an right wing conservative hatred to alternative thinking. If it was up to some of the ass clowns, you and I would be burned at the sake for witchcraft. They are nothing more than cyber hooligans and you should never underestimate the hatred of a closed minded individual who doesn’t like it when you rock their little insignificant world.
You don’t need to justify yourself mate and you see things in a very open and logical way. You are every bit the fan they are and in fact you are better because you are not a blind sheep that stupidly follows the trail all the way to the meat packing plant. Consider yourself a rebel stallion that roams in the hills and pisses on all the conformists not because they conform, but because they shun people like us who don’t.
I for one am overjoyed that an intelligent like minded United fan is on this blog and so you and I can at least exchange thoughts on our favorite subject. And as for the hate mongers, I don’t hate them. I pity them and I just plan to ignore them before they piss me off to the point where Red Ranter has no choice but to boot me off. There are other pleasant and decent blokes on this blog to converse with so I want to stick around. I hope you do. Now I must go because I have to stir my cauldron. Cheers!
August 6th, 2008 at 6:11
@Don: Trust me Mr D, the doom and gloom has more to do with the Ronaldo situation and our financial uncertainty, which of course shows itself to be precarious by the lack of spending we are doing. And I have only been able to watch one pre season game so I realize that is not much of a gauge to judge anybody on but I will go out on a limb and say, that we still need a world class striker ans some foreign youth with skill and flair on the wing to cover both Nani and Ronaldo. I don’t think I am being unreasonable in my request.
And frankly if you saw positives in the way we play in that Posh game then you are truly a very optimistic guy. Other than the twins and Tevez I saw a team that wasn’t Coca Cola league capable. But I also know that was a C team and it was a pre season game so I don’t really put a lot of stock in it. What I ma most concerned is our injuries and our early schedule being so severe that we could be ten points behind before we are at full strength. One thing I do know about Chelsea is that they are fantastic front runners. They are not Arsenal. If they get ahead of us by more than 5 points, they will be hard to catch. Perhaps we will look a lot better by the time we play Newcastle. But we really need Berbatov now more than ever. If we can get Berbatov and survive the first month without too much damage and points lost, then I will be very optimistic when Ronaldo returns and we then turn it up a gear for the League and CL. If I’m being negative it’s not my heart but my mind. My heart hopes and wishes for the best. But my mind tells me things based on evidence and observation as well as experience from watching and analyzing this game for over 30 years. I won’t dismiss my mind or my gut instincts because frankly, they haven’t betrayed me much in 49 years of life. United is a great team but they do have issues that are not being dealt with to my satisfaction. I don’t profess to know more than Fergie but that should not mean that blokes like myself and Gabriel should not question things and wonder if there is something wrong. God gave us a mind and sense to observe our surroundings. What I see coming out of OT is making me sick to the stomach. Hopefully it’s only a 24 hour flu.
Sorry for the long rant but it wasn’t aimed at you but everyone who seems to have a problem with my thoughts. And that wasn’t arguing, that was explaining.
August 6th, 2008 at 6:25
@Grognard: “I just think back to his cartoon in his post today that says it all. Why I allow myself to get sucked in by fascists on a blog is beyond me.”
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahha, When ever red ranter gets quiet I can always count on Grogs to amuse me. I love it when he gets frustrated. Keep it up, you almost single handedly carry this site.
August 6th, 2008 at 7:43
Ok, I’ve decided to break my silence now that the arguments have run its course. My opinion? Most of you, and I say this with much pain, have either been over-sensitive or have whined like small children. I am pretty sure the one’s I am referring to know who they are. And I am disappointed extremely.
It’s more so especially considering I put that cartoon up and no one, I repeat, no one (including the commenter who pointed it out) has managed to get the point.
Oh well, tomorrow’s another day, and I hope some of you learn to find the fine line between banter and reasonably logical arguments. And sometimes, one can learn to grow a thick skin and ignore sly digs too. There is no loss in dignity if you lose a war in the comment section of a blog — and if you think your ego gets a battering then you are terribly mistaken.
FFS!
August 6th, 2008 at 8:56
we should start looking at ronaldo replacments (messi) or sanchez also sign berbatov we need to get new players quick if i was SAF i would say to madrid 70mil next year for ron then get messi sign tevez and get huntelaar any money spare look fo giggs,scholes,ferdinand replacments. team in 5 years foster,rafael,richards,vidic,fabio
messi, possebon,anderson,nani
tevez,rooney
August 6th, 2008 at 9:22
@Red Ranter: You are absolutely right and I should know better. I got sucked in yet again. But watch me from now on. I’m not an elephant and my skin is not thick. I do get hurt easily even if it’s by people I don’t know or even care to know. Still, I come on this blog with good intentions to share my passion for the game and for United and instead I am continually deluged with hatred and a lack of tolerance that would make a 3rd world dictator shiver. I am not a computer geek and I don’t prescribe to the computer culture that the cartoon targets. I am just a supporter trying to have conversations and debates on a site without constantly being attacked for my views and then being called over sensitive, thin skinned, and idiot and a hypocrite. Frankly it’s not worth it and it’s hurting my mental health because unlike some of the jerks on this site, I am older and I come from a generation that treats people with more respect. Just because we hide behind a computer does not mean we need to separate ourselves from our humanity and our common decency. No one has a right to call me an idiot or a hypocrite without getting to know me. Agree with me or disagree with me, but don’t make it personal and don’t talk to me like I have to conform to a specific mindset. I play to my own drummer and I think and act according to my mindset and my moral and ethical code. And I’ll be damned if I will sit here and tolerate people’s abuse of myself and my beliefs just because they suffer from such mental illness that they cannot handle a little bad news or negativity sometimes.
One remark especially upset me today and I think it’s worth noting. “No offense, but your posts are really sad, i hope the way you post and the manner with which you address people doesn’t reflect what kinda person you are in real life, if not i feel for people close to you. Judging from your posts it seems you’d be the one slashing your wrists and probably tying a noose if Fergie doesn’t sign anyone.”
I’m supposed to ignore that kind of a cruel tirade on my being without telling that person where he can stick his backhanded comment on my personal life and I’m expected to have a thick skin too. Well, I’m sorry but I don’t think so. That comment was extremely hurtful and incredibly rude and callous. It had nothing to do with football and less to do with disagreeing with my theories. It was putting me down and degrading me as a human being. Yet I am expected to put up with it and I am now being called a whining child because of it. Well perhaps I am but I often wonder what the Hell is going to become of all of us when we let people openly bully and forcibly run somebody out of town only because the rest are to blind and ignorant to see the injustice and the cruelty of simple words. It amazes me that others never came to my defense over such a terrible and mean spirited attack. Obviously many do not see the harm in demeaning another fellow blogger by questioning his character and and the strength of his relationships and friendships.
I am not leaving this blog but I will no longer bother to offer as much as I used to nor will I respond to any of the cruel and unfair replies. My love for the game and for United keeps me from leaving all together. Frankly, I don’t have the guts because I love conversing about the team and the game. But clearly I am not welcome or appreciated by many for my contributions and the the ones that do appreciate what I bring are not loud enough to back me up in times like these. That’s fine too. I can fight my own battles.
To Johnsom33, it has never been my intention to get frustrated nor to amuse anyone. To quote Joe Pesci, “I’m not a clown and I am not here to amuse”. And it has never been my intention to carry the site even though I realize I do post an awful lot. To those who think I’m a loser, I say to you, perhaps I am but all I know is I am a man who’s currently living with a disability and awaiting surgery for his back. My condition does not allow me to work so I spend a lot of my free time on the computer and I’m always checking in to the blog as right now, United is one of my biggest passions and interests. I’m not asking for pity nor do I ask for understanding. I’m just clarifying to some who I am and what I am going through so that insulting comments like the one RD gave me are put into a proper context. Some people should be ashamed of themselves and I too am ashamed for allowing myself to yet again get dragged into an argument that started yet again over people’s need to bully and tell others what they should be like and how they should act. If I was positive, I will say that many on this site have placed me in a very foul mood and I wonder really, if it’s worth all the pain? Because in the end, even this long heart felt rant is going to be dissected and shit upon by many of you and by RR himself because nobody seems to get it.
I have finally realized after months and months of getting my head bashed in verbally, that one cannot hold an honest and friendly debate on this site because everybody knows everything and too many of you seem to think that we all must be sheep ready to cheer and praise United without ever criticizing them. Truthfully, I am tired of the Mancunian Inquisition and so I refuse to ever fight or argue with any of you who don’t see eye with my views. And your unwillingness to just debate me and disagree with me in a friendly way is so abstract and foreign in many of you that I doubt I will reply to many at all. For the several of you out there that are a pleasure to converse with (and you know who you are) fear not, as I will be happy to reply to your theories and concerns, even if they are contrary to mine. Until then, it’s good night to all, and may we all get a long tomorrow. (I’m so sure, like totally you know) Sorry for the Valley Girl speak. I couldn’t help myself.
August 6th, 2008 at 9:39
@Red Ranter: Well Put! and@Grognard: Take it easy mate! You got high blood pressure or something?
August 6th, 2008 at 9:50
What the fuck is wrong with you people lol, i have nice sleep for about nine hours, i come back and all hell breaks loose! You people need to learn to chill out, if someone has a different view to yours dont go in guns blazing, just discuss it i mean, isnt it ironic that you guys have a day like this, when that cartoon is up? c’mon argue as much you want but dont try a bring people down if they dont agree with you, respect their opinion(even if it is pure shite
)
August 6th, 2008 at 10:08
@Grognard:
So you know better than the Glazers and Finacial Experts do you Grog. No you don’t. Its common business practice to have loans against a company and investing the money to pay that loan off elsewhere to make a return that more than covers the interest payments
@Grognard:
So because the media outlets decided that was the case it must be right must it? No it doesn’t. United didnt say he was due back, they have stated he isnt due back until AFTER his doctors appointment in Holland this week where the outcome will decide when he is due back to training
@Grognard: @Gabriel:
You are calling for panic buys though, you are calling for Fergie to buy players for the sake of buying players rather than them being the the right players. Whats the point in paying over the odds for a player who at this point would be 3rd choice on either wing. Unless your chelsea with finite resources you don’t go out to waste money but want a deal that makes sense, its why united arent doing what you want them to do and throwing stupid amounts for Berba because for every million over the odds they pay thats a million less that they have to spend on someone else later on. I’m sure if theres a young winger out there with potential who is at a club that are willing to sell him and sell him for a reasonable figure then they would buy him. We need a striker now and if one isnt bought before the transfer window closes that will be disappointing but a winger can certainly wait till the right deal comes around, as can a scholes replacement (in fact a Scholes replacement I don’t think is even needed)
Oh and I didnt call you an idiot, I said it would be idiotic for the club to panic buy just because we have a couple of injuries at this very moment as panic buying is never ends well.
@Grognard:
You take almost every comment that doesnt agree with you as a personal attack. You go through the posts picking out random words and twist it into an attack on you. Then you complain about it while attacking people in the same way you complained about
August 6th, 2008 at 10:08
@Grognard: I was indeed surprised by the personal digs that have been thrown around today, and the personal jibe at you that pointed out was indeed mean, but the fact is that you have been no different. One of your comments to Krishnan was: “And don’t challenge me to an argument mate because trust me you don’t have the wit nor the vocabulary to defeat me”
How is this any different than the issues you have raised about not judging people personally and keeping things restricted to football?
My point is, as RR has mentioned, none of the people involved in today’s melee have been saints, and hence it doesn’t make sense defending any of the bloggers out here against anyone else.
August 6th, 2008 at 10:32
In an attempt to quell all this drama, I’m going to put down on electronic paper some of my ideas/thoughts/ramblings about the youth. First, I wish to pose a question. I’m hoping someone can clarify British rules in regards to recruiting players for the Academy. Do specific guidelines exist capping the number of foreign players? I’ve also heard that certain quotas exist regarding local talent, but in all honesty I’m a bit in the dark. I’m hoping someone can shine a light.
I think it is fair to say that the hype surrounding the twins has reached near fever pitch. I also think it is fair to say that this response is justifiable. To think that our starting fullbacks in a couple years could very well be full Brazilian internationals is an intoxicating thought. I don’t hesitate to say that the most exciting fullbacks over the past 10 years or so have been Brazilian. Their (Brazilian) defensive prowess may be questioned at times, but in terms of sheer technique, ability to get forward, shooting, crossing…you get the picture. I know some people may say that it is far to early, and they are right, but I for one think the twins have already shown enough to be deemed the most exciting prospects at the club. I exclude Andy and Nani as I feel they have already demonstrated the ability to play with the big boys. The only other Reserve player that I rate highly is Rodrigo. I think the comparisons made between him and Scholesy are much more warranted than between Andy and Scholes. Anderson has yet to show an ability to shoot long range (or close range for that matter), a skill which Paul has displayed numerous times over the years. Another glaring contrast is in tackling. Paul is one of the greats, but his tackling has always been…how do I put it gently…TERRIBLE. Anderson on the other hand has been pleasantly adept at the slide. Back to Rodrigo, in the Reserve matches I have watched he has consistently been in the running for MOM. He is composed on the ball, rarely gives it away, and has an eye for the cracker, traits much more in line with the ginger prince. I suppose I should also mention Campbell in the same breath as Rodrigo, but I am a bit hesitant. Whereas the aforementioned players (twins and Rodrigo) will push for starting berths in years to come if they stick around, I’m not convinced Campbell will ever be able to lead the line. Touch is something you have or don’t have. It’s as simple as that. The boy has excellent speed and his finishing seems fine, but I’ve seen a fair share of first touches that were straight out of the pub leagues. I love having him as a peripheral player that can come in during an injury crisis, (which seems to be a running problem at the club,) but I think it is laughable to suggest he is a legitimate 3rd striker at Manchester United. Hopefully in a few weeks, Campbell and Manucho will be battling it out for the 4th spot behind Rooney, Tevez, and Berbatov. For my own mental health, I’ve decided it is simply a matter of time until he joins. I’ve come to enjoy watching Spurs play over the years, mainly because I love it when they beat Chelski or Arse’nal. During that time, Berbatov has convinced me that he is one the best players in the world. His ability is breathtaking. When we get him, this summer of crap will finally be flushed. I seriously get goosebumps thinking about him linking up with Rooney or Tevez, or even at the same time which just might be an indication of the Apocalypse. It is going to blow the trousers off of many teams in this league.
That’s my longest post yet. Hope it saves from ennui!
August 6th, 2008 at 10:56
So this has become a blog for debating how other people are wrong, has it?
I have deliberately not involved myself in this, because frankly, it’s way out of hand. But I feel, it’s time we got some overall perspective on this. I don’t take sides… I merely try to make an objective comment (as if that’s possible).
Grognard is a sensitive contributor to this site, but that’s what I like about him. He’s shows his feelings, when he comments. That doesn’t mean, he thinks he knows more than the people in the club or people employed to run the club. It means, he hopes for the best. And when things look shaky to the Grogster, he voices his opinion on it. The debates get heated, because things might not look as shaky to others (like me).
The way Grognard writes can be seen as if he thinks he knows better. He doesn’t write “in my opinion” as much as others, but as he always claims, it can never be anything other than his opinion, even if he doesn’t write so. That’s a very important step in the direction of understanding him imo.
Putting up personal attacks like the one about slidding the wrists or claiming to be smarter and more knowledgable than others and that sort of thing is simply not cool. It doesn’t matter who voices these things, they do not belong here.
I’ve had my own disputes with Grognard, but the only thing I’ve ever been really annoyed by is that he sometimes disregards other people’s opinions and claims he knows more, because he does watch a lot of football from certain leagues that some might not follow. As RR says, even people not watching these leagues are entitled to an opinion about them and the players in them, but Grognard sometimes doesn’t agree with this, and that has angered me a few times.
Other than that, most of his comments are simply out of frustration of what he sees as dire straits for the club these days. Some (as me) may not see these worrying tendencies, but then we should argue in stead of claiming that he doesn’t know anything about finances or whatever it may be. Argue your way out of it, and don’t do it based on other people’s comments. Gather your own information and make an opinion based on that… that’s my opinion. In my world, the best way to debate is to have knowledge to back up an argument. If people go into an argument without knowledge about the subject, it becomes a mud slinging contest in a matter of seconds, because people simply want to be right. Of course, as I wrote, people are more than welcome to voice an opinion without actual knowledge… they should just be ready to be asked to clearify. If you can’t clearify, then shut up and accept “defeat” or go find that knowledge you need and reply.
August 6th, 2008 at 11:12
@Tomas:
The Clarify bit though is the part that Grog falls down on everytime. He makes comments on rumours without taking any time to actually find out the source and the accuracy and even at times seems to ignore the facts so he can rant like a crazy man. If you ask him to clarify he just keeps spewing the same deluded beliefs without backing it up with anything. As such you cant debate with him as “he is always right even when the facts don’t back him up”. If he wants to rant then fine but he crosses the line all too often in that his his rants are little more than flames and trolling as he is basically making up things to rant about rather than ranting on actual events.
August 6th, 2008 at 11:38
@IBleedRed: Good post, and good on you for trying to move the post on from that infernal bickering.
I’m interested too in your views of our squad players, given that I rarely am able to watch reserve matches. Your description of Campbell reminds me of Diego Forlan….
As for the regs surrounding academy players, I wrote an article on this a while back here, and there is more in a Brian McClair interview which I link to in my article.
Happy to continue the discussion here.
And if you’ve watched a lot of reserve games, have you seen much of Danny Welbeck?
One last tip on writing long posts (and it was a very good post) – try and break them up into shorter paragraphs, it’ll make it a lot easier for people to digest and so a lot more people will read the whole thing.
August 6th, 2008 at 11:45
Can anyone imagine how heated this place would have been in the summer of 2006? Hehe.
It’s not the end of the world – so we’re starting the season a bit undermanned, so what, happens all the time. Maybe Fergie really has gone to every effort to get in Berba, but it just hasn’t worked out. Maybe Fergie also knows more than we do about the Ronaldo situation, and a year from now we’ll all fondly remember his ‘white uniform’ joke. Who knows. Not us.
As a fan we’re more than entitled to bitch all we want, that’s fine and healthy. Do I wish there was an exciting new signing playing tonight against Juve? Absolutely. Will I still watch and support the team with Dong Fanzhou leading the line? Yeah, I will.
We may have been the best team in Europe last year, but we can’t just go out and buy everyone we want, because it unsettles the team and is unecessary. I strongly believe we need a striker, but that’s it for me. Now that Ronaldo is staying, you can’t brign in a winger to play the first 2 months of the season than sit and watch the rest. Maybe you can do that in January once we know how the CL/FA/Carling cup runs have gone, but you don’t do it now. And you certianly don’t do it with a world class talent. It’s wasteful. Similarly, I think we all agree Berba would be a wonderful fit, but the fact is he’s relatively old, not on an incredibyl long contract and is unsettled. Therefore we shouldn’t get dragged over the coals for him. Hell, if he wants it so bad, get a transfer request in please. Then we can talk.
More important things – last preseason match, what team do you see starting?
——–Kuszcak———
-Wes—Rio–Vidic–Evra-
—Fletcher-Scholes—–
-Nani———–Gibson–
——–Tevez———–
——Campbell———-
?
August 6th, 2008 at 11:50
@wakey: That may be, but then it’s our job to inform him about the sources and argue, why it’s bullshit. We shouldn’t write that he’s this and that because he believes in the stories, he read. It’s his right to believe in the stories, and argue with him or not.
He may be stubborn, but he never refuses to argue, and he often put up solid arguments for his views… even if they are based on gossip that we may find rediculous. It is possible to put up plausible arguments based on almost any kind of information, but it is also possible to put up solid contraring arguments almost everytime.
Grognard – this summer – has chosen to react to almost every negative rumour out there, and it has made him look paranoid like a motherfucker. It has also made him hate our best player, and that’s his issue to deal with. He may be paranoid, but it’s his right to be.
The problem with the Internet is that it’s so easy spewing rediculously insulting comments without being held responsible for them. People use the Internet to act out their internal badass, and some people don’t deal with that well. Grognard is from a different generation, and in his younger days, every form of communication was verbal and not written (sorry Grognard, I’m making you look a 100 years old, which is obviously not the case). Being from that time (which I almost am myself), you’re not raised with these insults that are today considered normal. It’s a different language on the Internet, and even though a person like Grognard can probably say to himself that he shouldn’t react so much, it’s difficult when it’s not in your blood to do otherwise.
People don’t talk “Internet” IRL, and that is a tough barrier to get by, if your mind is set otherwise.
August 6th, 2008 at 11:56
@Beachryan:
I think Edwin will start, Foster on at Half time. I also wouldn’t be too surprised to see Rafael playing instead of Wes unless Neville is fit. With Nev’s fitness still in doubt and after his impressive first game it might be useful to see him again as we may need him as backup to wes.
Giggs will surely start on the left. Campbell will start up top as he needs the games. Fergie also didnt rule Hargreaves out on Monday so maybe Scholes and Hargo in the centre
August 6th, 2008 at 11:57
@most people, Please stop:
a) bickering
b) responding to bickering
c) discussing who is to blame for starting/contributing to bickering
d) conducting deep-seated cultural analyses regarding the tendency to bicker and the practice of bickering.
The vast majority of people here want to discuss football without having to sift through 10 bicker-posts for every one with real football content in. How many newcomers to this blog would read the comments to this post and think “I want to be involved in this blog”?
Apologies for commenting on the bickering, this will be my only post on the subject.
August 6th, 2008 at 12:26
@Penguin: You’re absolutely right. My conduction of a deap-seated cultural analysis was merely an effort to calm people down and to make people realise that there’re always two sides to every story/debate.
I could be pissed at you for being condescending about my comments, but I’ll let it go.
August 6th, 2008 at 12:37
@Tomas: Yeah you are right! CAN ANYONE GIVE A STREAM FOR THE JUVE MATCH? Hopefully tonight will be the night when Fergie’s eyes open that Rooney and the first team and crying out for a NEW no.9!
And and to GROGNARD! No hard feelings mate! Just chill!
Oh and @Tomas: So you both are 40?
August 6th, 2008 at 12:38
back to the football, eh guys? Ok our team setup for tonite, what do you think it will be? with half the 1st team crocked, will the gaffer put out a full-strength side for Juve, when we have a cup final against Portsmouth on sunday and the opening game nxt saturday?
August 6th, 2008 at 12:39
@Red Ranter: Dont put these multi dimensional,rocket science cartoons in here ever again.
Do ya hear me.
August 6th, 2008 at 12:41
I think that the first team will be…. Subs are in the brackets!
——————————-EVDS(Foster)——————————–
Neville(R. Da Silva)—–Rio—————Vidic————Evra(The other Da Silva)
————————Flecther————Scholes——————————–
Nani—————————————————————–Giggs(Gibson)
———————————-Tevez——————————————-
———————————Campbell——————————————
August 6th, 2008 at 12:49
at what timn3e is the match ? UK time ??can somebdy help me with links as well ? am so desperate to see the reds back in action
August 6th, 2008 at 12:49
@Red Diablo: No, I’m just 30, but when I was a kid, there was nothing called Internet. As a matter of fact, we got our first computer, when I was around 10, and it sucked big time. Well not at the time, of course, but today it’s a relic of the past
– so I’ve seen both worlds as well.
I think, tonight’s lineup will be something like:
TK
Brown Rio Vidic (if fit?) Evra
Nani Fletcher Scholes Giggs
Campbell Tevez
So not that different from yours, really. But I do think that if the backline is fit, it’s time to start playing them. After all, it’s better to win the Community Shield than to loose it. Plus we may depend on them in the start of the season again, so it’ll be nice, if they’re ready to go come the first match against Newcastle.
August 6th, 2008 at 13:28
@Red Diablo: @Tomas: yeah, solid formation!! I don’t think he’ll risk playin them the whole game though; that is our strongest squad due to injuries, so he’ll let them rest as we have Portsmouth and Newcastle comin soon. Don’t you reckon that will be a wise option?
August 6th, 2008 at 13:42
@Tomas:
What you mean Vidic(if fit?) You hear something I’ve missed?
We loose any defenders especially Rio and Vidic and a tough start to the season is going to look like a fecking nightmare considering the injuries.
Solid enough team selection though.
@everyone: United we stand
August 6th, 2008 at 13:51
@scoop: No no, I didn’t hear anything about Vidic. He just wasn’t in the squad for the last game. Probably needed the rest. I think, he’s fine.
August 6th, 2008 at 13:58
@Tomas:
Phew!! Panic over.
August 6th, 2008 at 14:29
Not sure when this interview was so sorry if its old news but how relaxed does Fergie look considering all thats on his plate.
Either he’s got supreme confidence in the squad available or he know’s something we don’t!
Im not for doubting him Ive done that before in the past and got my fingers burn’t Fergies got it sorted.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/m/man_utd/7543747.stm
August 6th, 2008 at 15:06
@Grognard: I was dreaming when i talked about landing messi or aguero.
I disagree about scouting. Fergie would have known all about sanchez last year. We will ofcourse scout south america. We bought forlan from independiente. Sure, it didn’t work out but it shows we were looking. We have brought in possebon and the da silva twins from brazil, and the manager knew all about anderson and had followed him throughout his time at gremio. I do not think there are many places in the world where top teams do not have scouts and contacts, but certainly south america is not one of them with the amount of talent they produce. We have been linked with a host of other players from there too, with falcao and sanchez being recent rumours. His agent said that united bid for him about two months ago now, but did not match udinese’s valuation. He played in argentina last year and we seem to be interested in him, so i think it is likely that united have been watching him.
I still don’t think there’s anything wrong with the funds. I still think we’ll buy berbatov. The loan is being managed properly and all the people in the know came out early on and said money would be available to strengthen the team. The reason that i believe that our transfer kitty is healthy is because while it is quite clear that we have bid for berbatov and that fergie targeted a striker signing for this summer, we still went out early on and were prepared to pay 5 million for ramsey. It annoys me that he is not at united, but it shows that we are not short of cash. We would have paid the 5 million for him and then still went after berbatov now. If we were struggling for funds and had identified the need for a striker, would we have tried to sign ramsey? No. Also, if we did bid for sanchez then that also shows that we were not shy to spend if the right deal for the right player was there. Fergie identified the need for a striker early, but we continued to look into the possibility of other deals which would not be a back-up incase the berbatov deal fails, as sanchez and ramsey are not strikers. These players would have came in as well as a striker. Therefore, i think we have the money to spare.
Regarding my stance on anderson, when i say he is the replacement for scholes, i mean in terms of his position on the pitch. He will play in central midfield alongside a more disciplined holding player, with license to go forward as scholes has had throughout his career. In terms of playing styles, he is very different to scholes. I would compare his style of play more to that of steven gerrard – driven, energetic and inspirational. Scholes is more intelligent and skillful, with the closest player to him in the premiership being fabregas. I agree that possebon’s playing style is closer to scholes. He is neat and tidy on the ball, hardly ever giving it away. A future combination of him and anderson would be complimentary in styles.
August 6th, 2008 at 15:44
@tevez: Possebon in my view if you had to compare is nearer Carrick than Scholes.
We will now always probably play a three man cent midfield rather than a natrual 4-4-2.
I do not see your reasons behind “kitty is healthy” because we have made a bid for Berbatov? We have not signed him. With regards to Ramsey we really did not try our hardest to sign him, saying that it shows we are “not short of cash” is fallacy, as again we did not secure the player.
We are in debt, that is real, one day all banks the Glaziers have borrowed from, will ask us to repay the principal amount which currently stands at £666m.
The spending on players in my view will have to stop, or be more frugal, as we need to stop piling up more debt. We will continue to up season tickets (mine @ 7% or so this season) Keep the marketing or brand awareness of the club ( South Africa/Asia tours)
Most of all we need to keep winning, but if we can’t spend like before which is posibly the problem in my view, then we could be in big trouble long term.
August 6th, 2008 at 16:02
Is anyone else worried about Nani and Anderson and dreaded second season syndrome?
They both had great seasons last season especially impressed with Anderson myself but this season I would imagine Giggs and Scholes to be playing less and less which is going to heap alot of pressure on these yound lads.
If they don’t crack on from last year we could find ourselves squad wise in a bit of bother. Especially as well if Ronaldo throws a hissy fit because he’s somewhere where he doesnt want to be and doesnt get stuck in.
I hope we get Berb sorted!
August 6th, 2008 at 16:38
@Tomas: Good formataion! Dont worry! Youre not old!
I mean I am only half your age + 1 Yr! That means I am sixteen! HAHAHA!
@ANYONE: Can anyone post the streaming link for the Juve Match? Thanks a bunch!
August 6th, 2008 at 16:39
@scoop: I would not say they had great seasons last year, but promising ones, we do get (me especially) carried away sometimes.
They were good and especially Anderson against Arsenal/Liverpool and Nani league cup agianst Arsenal, but both players do need to improve on their consistency.
Nani was quite fustrating in games and Anderson did look lostin some games especially in Europe, but hopefully they both have the best in front of them
August 6th, 2008 at 16:48
@Stephen: link for the 666m figure? Mark my words one way or another the debt will be managed. Last season we spent about 60m (excluding the Tevez permanent fee) on players which at the time everyone said that we wouldn’t have to spend for another couple of seasons. All we need is a back up striker who we can depend on when our 2 30m strikers aren’t working.
@Gabriel I agree we could do with a backup player on the wings but only if they can play on both wings or can cover as a full back. Drenthe off Madrid would be good but no way in hell will Real do business with us now
Its wierd how Fabio is regarded as the more promising of the 2 twins and has suddenly become the “other Da Silva twin”
August 6th, 2008 at 16:49
@Stephen:
Fair point mate it is easy to get carried away promising would be a better description.
I just hope they keep moving in the right direction and like you say try and get a bit of consistency.
Nani did do my head in a few times last year but like you say hopefully for the both of them big futures ahead at OT.
On another point has anyone seen Fergies interview on the beeb website. How relaxed does the man look!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/m/man_utd/7543747.stm
@Red Ranter:
How do I load a picture up beside my name?
August 6th, 2008 at 17:08
@Grognard: If you remember I was one of those who called for you to keep posting more when you went missing for a while, a month back. The truth here is that nearly all the people read your posts. You’ve been a wonderful and passionate contributor. Every blog needs someone like that. I personally love your arguements but sometimes when people question your opinion you get pissed. I think thats what made people have a go at you. You’ve always maintained in your posts that you are level headed, so let this go and please keep posting as much as you’ve been.
Can someone post the link for today’s match??
August 6th, 2008 at 17:15
http://soccernet.espn.go.com/news/story?id=560425&sec=england&cc=5901
Fergie says we may not buy anyone this summer….I’ll be a man about it…Apologies to Grognard.
August 6th, 2008 at 17:19
@Liam: “Mark my words one way or another the debt will be managed” How do you know that?
They are reliant on season ticket sales which have gone up, and we were forced to buy cup games with them, and champions league football for revenew, if we don’t have any success life could become uncomfortable.
Fergie will leave in 2 years then we will have a new manager in charge, god knows who, and how do we know that he will guarentee the success we we have become over the last 15 or so years?
The Glaziers are not fans, they are business people, and it is not hobby like Abramovich. They want to make money, and won’t keep spending vast sums every season.
August 6th, 2008 at 17:20
@Stephen: Yeah probably closer to carrick than scholes, but he’s closer to scholes than anderson is, which was my point.
The kitty is healthy as the intentions are to bring in a forward and if we were strapped for cash we would not attempt to bring in a young midfielder for 5 million. We did not sign him but it was fergie’s intention to sign him. If we were worried about how much money we had to bid for a striker we would not use some of it to bid for ramsey would we?
August 6th, 2008 at 17:29
If you’re looking for something distracting and United related to occupy your time, try this:
http://www.skysports.com/fun_games/missingmen/0,20922,15135_3935628,00.html
Took me 6 minutes to get all 11.
August 6th, 2008 at 17:50
@tevez: You never know mate, but the lack of transfer activity is a worry mate, it will be interesrting if we do get Berbatov, if we do great!! if we don’t then we have problems.
August 6th, 2008 at 17:50
@Brian Lomax: I think this is SAF’s way of beating the Spurs into submission concerning the sale of Berbatov. And given how much Ramos seems to want one of (if not both) Arshavin and Pavlyuchenko, I think Levy will be forced to give in and sell the Deadly Angel for a very reasonable price. Have some faith, everyone, have some faith!
August 6th, 2008 at 18:04
@Stephen: Actually, if we don’t then we have rooney and tevez who we won the league with last year so not really a huge problem.
August 6th, 2008 at 18:06
@tevez: What happens if one or even worse both get long term injuries?
We are short, well in both sense of the words up front and we should not kid ourselves.
August 6th, 2008 at 18:08
@Stephen:
Fergie talked to Ramsey and his Family on the phone and Ramsey was given a tour of the club by the club captain. This isn’t exactly not trying, maybe he could have flown back to meet him personally but Fergie wasn’t at the Euros so he couldnt compete with Wenger on that if that was the deciding factor. What infact was probably the main factor was the first team opportunities, something which our bid made it clear he wasn’t getting this season.
As for the debt, yes the banks will want it back at some point but the money is there and while the money may not be able to be liquid immediately when the banks want it (or which is more likely when the loans are due to be repayed) the money can be made liquid
August 6th, 2008 at 18:11
@Tomas: In the past you and I have had some heated debates regarding football and we certainly don’t always agree with each other. Therefore, it is very important to point that out and then thank you for your posts supporting my right to express my feelings. Unlike some others, you actually get it and you do appreciate other viewpoints as well as people’s rights to speak their minds without being attacked. I greatly appreciate your comments and as far as some of the criticisms, I have accepted those in the way they were intended and I will work on my weaknesses. It certainly is difficult to debate with an individual who talks about Huntelaar and calls him shite while having watched him once. I on the other hand have made the point many times that I have seen him play over 50 times. From where I come from that clearly places me in the know and my experience in knowing that player I have always assumed should count for something. Obviously I put the true definition of the word debate to it’s test. Still, I am wrong when I overpower some people who come to a gunfight with a stick. And then you have individuals like Wakey who clearly don’t register anything you say to them because they are so set in their own opinion that they completely dismiss things you tell them as rumors, innuendo and total crap.
I try very hard to base my feelings on logical thought and in most case viable and proper truths. I never quote sites like Tribal Football or even NewsNow without mentioning the fact it’s probably bullshit and I am certainly not a rookie when it comes to financial dealings. I have worked as an executive assistant to the Minister of Labor in Alberta Canada where I dealt with far more complex money management issues as well as Unions so understanding the mess the Glazer’s find themselves in, is not rocket science to me. So of course I get hot under the collar when people who have zero experience in these matters and who don’t have my years of experience talk to me and tell me I am full of shit. And when Wakey actually thinks that he has won a debate with me without giving me a well thought out argument, only rants on how much smarter he is, then I just have to laugh. I laugh , oh how I laugh. Let him believe if it helps him sleep better. After all, the proof is in the pudding. Never underestimate people’s delusions of grandeur. God knows I’ve had a few of my own.
Right now my frustration is at an all time high because I am not sure I can continue on here without being allowed or tolerated in being myself. Putting shackles on my passions, my beliefs and my way of communicating is really not very fair to me as I have never intentionally attacked anyone who never attacked me first. For those that I have attacked without realizing it, I offer my apologies. I’m not perfect or infallible. I completely admit to being an elitist on certain things but it’s only because I honestly believe I know a lot about certain issues pertaining to the great game. I have closely watched and monitored the game for 30 years, have hundreds of books, yearbooks etc and thousands and thousands of hours of games on tape and dvd. I do consider myself a student of the game even though I sucked playing it when I was younger. I really should have more passion for US football, basketball and golf as I was very good at all three. So unfortunately I do have a problem when someone argues a point with me and cannot back it up with hard facts. I’m wrong in letting him have it but I’m right in the fact that it is an unfair battle to begin with.
Contrary to what many might think, I am very friendly to many on this site even if we disagree on a point. I have always stated that it really has more to do with how a person disagrees with me rather than if they do. I don’t like it when it becomes personal and when somebody enforces themselves on me by saying this is how it will be and this is how I should think. People always calling me negative and then some telling me I am fear or hate monger crosses the line with me. At least there are those and Tomas you are one of them, that presents an alternative argument that whether I agree with it or not, at east has merit and on occasion actually helps me rethink my stance. I respect that and above all, I appreciate that you respect my stance too, even if you don’t agree with it. So thanks again for the fair support you showed today. It shows your class and you fairness and you’ll always have my respect regardless of whether we agree on things or not. Apologies for the long post. Cheers mate.
August 6th, 2008 at 18:20
@Brian Lomax:
As others have said I wouldn’t read a massive amount into it. If you look desperate for a player you add millions to everyone’s price tag. Many of our targets already have price tags that tbh are on the high side without adding more to it needlessly. Also with Spurs still throwing a hissy fit over the ‘tapping’ up it probably makes sense to play transfers down.
There is the Manucho issue too. Its another option for us (Not ideal mind you) if he gets his work permit and as fergie says the squad is a pretty strong one so theres no point in looking to desperate
August 6th, 2008 at 18:21
@tevez: Some good points. Surely United do have a scouting system in South America but unfortunately teams like Barca and Real have far greater and much more influence in that region of the world. It’s actually fighting a losing battle but if we can occasionally spring a Da Silva, Possebon or Anderson out of there, it is certainly worth their effort. As you know I have reservations about signing any player from that region because my paranoid heart refuses to believe that they won’t eventually tire of life in Northern England and won’t want to move to a dream side in Spain. It’s the risk that United and Fergie seem to be willing to take but proof is there this off season that it may be a mistake. Ronaldo may be from Portugal but his motivations and upbringing mirrors those of Brazilians in language and culture. The thought that an English side can honestly defeat a Spanish side for the hearts and minds of very easily seduced young Spanish or Portuguese players is naive at best. But I’d love nothing more than to see Nani, Anderson, the twins and Possebon prove me wrong. I know that in the age of the mercenary it is very unrealistic to expect players to stay with a club for very long. That is why I feel we should possibly be looking for players who are a little older. By the time the twins and Possebon as well as Nani and Ronaldo reach their prime, they will probably be off to Spain. Those teams will benefit from them at their highest form. It’s a risk and I think and believe that my argument and concerns are valid ones, yet I do concede that I could also be a bit too cautious and paranoid. But certainly Ronaldo’s actions this summer have given me reason to be concerned. Still, I’d love an Aguero or a Sanchez on our side.
August 6th, 2008 at 18:28
@Krishnan: Thanks for the support and I’ll try and work on my weaknesses. I appreciate the fair appraisal.
August 6th, 2008 at 18:30
@Brian Lomax: Many thanks Brian. I appreciate that. And sorry if I have offended you in the past.
August 6th, 2008 at 18:31
@scoop: in fact, i expect Nani and Ando to grow massively as players this season. Nani was brilliant at the Euros and this season, as they get more outings, we will actually see how good they are and can be!
One person who WILL be affected by second season syndrome is Ronaldo, its virtually impossible to repeat on his last season’s heroics, atleast goal-scoring wise. But as its apparent that he will be staying here at OT, he will have as much of a task proving himself to the fans and critics as he had to after 2006 WC incident
August 6th, 2008 at 18:32
@Stephen: Well said. Do you realize that had I said the very same thing (and I actually have many times) a fire storm would erupt and I would get everyone’s tempers boiling. Fortunately you don’t bring out the worst in some. Consider yourself fortunate.
August 6th, 2008 at 18:41
@tevez: Unless we get an injury to one of them if not both. Then we would be in a world of shite and the transfer window closed. It’s insanity to go into this season without another proven class striker. I’ve got to believe that it just won’t happen. We have to get Berbatov. He is vital to our team’s future success and security. Rooney and Tevez cannot go it alone. Without Ronaldo we are not prolific enough as goal scoring team and both those forwards for all their quality and brilliance simply don’t score enough for my liking. When Ronaldo is around, then it’s not that vital, but without him we will be in dire straits. We need another striker and another striker who offers a variation as well as deviation on what we are presently doing. Somebody with aerial presence and a hunger for the 18 yard box. Berbatov is not my ideal choice but he will certainly do. And honestly, does Fergie think that stupid little mind games are going to work with Levy? Anybody with an IQ higher than Beckham’s can tell that is an amateurish way of getting Levy to act sooner rather than later. I just hope he has a Plan B if Berbatov doesn’t work out in the final our of the transfer deadline. He probably does but he sure know how to put many of his supporters through the ringer in the process.
August 6th, 2008 at 18:49
@Grognard: @Grognard: ” I have worked as an executive assistant to the Minister of Labor in Alberta Canada where I dealt with far more complex money management issues as well as Unions so understanding the mess the Glazer’s find themselves in, is not rocket science to me.”
What “mess” are you talking about? I trust you when you say that you have more financial expeirence than me, and because of that I am shocked you keep going on and on about the debt. You said so yourself that United are hated for there success, and while we are winning the media have to attack us somewhere. SO the debt is an easy target.
We can all agree that the Glazers are not fans of the beautiful game or United but business men. From there vast wealth I assume they are pretty good ones at that. The british media speak of them and there debt as if they are teenage girls who are in over there heads with credit card debt.
Forgive me for being naive, but I have a hard time the Glazers secured a loan of that size without doing there due diligence on United and everything else football. I also have a hard time believing the banks would just hand them a loan of that size unless they were presented with a detailed and convincing plan on repayment.
Now obviously this is just my opinion and I have no facts or numbers to support this, But I now challenge you to explain what you are seeing to to think that something has gone horribly wrong? I personally dont believe a lack of transfer activity is an indication either. Fergie wants Berbatov, but as a matter of principle he isnt going to pay the outrageous sum of 30 million.
August 6th, 2008 at 18:57
I expect anderson to stay long term, ronaldo to leave either next summer or the summer after, and then that would leave me clueless about nani as he is best friends with ronaldo. Ronnie leaving may well affect nani. I expect tevez to stay for about 5 years and then ask to go back to boca, even if madrid come in for him before then. Hopefully possebon and the twins grow to love the club. Same with nani and anderson. In the end, it is always a gamble but madrid aren’t exactly going to be coming in for all our players. They have a great squad themselves with plenty of young talent, and in the end it’s not just the south americans at our club who will develop into great players. There will always be a constant stream of brazilians coming through for madrid to snap up. Also, the trend of bringing in portuguese and brazilian players is already underway here. We have a fair few of them now, and i think that can only help in convincing other prospects in south america now that united is a great place to be. If our young brazilians are successful here you may well see more of them wanting to play here. Also, ronaldo i take as a special case – he is at one of the top teams in the world and he thinks he is better than the club. He thinks he is bigger. He is a prick. The majority of south american players who come here and do well will stay.
August 6th, 2008 at 19:15
@Grognard: But we’ve got campbell and manucho…
…ok we need another striker. I also agree that berbatov is not ideal (says my head, not my heart) and while a huntelaar-type player would be more suitable and complimentary to the forwards we’ve got, i still feel someone like samuel eto’o would be better.
August 6th, 2008 at 20:30
@johnsom33: The Glazer’s simply over extended themselves at a time when they got fair interest rates. With the dive of the American dollar and the loss of many of their assets in other investment circles due to America’s faltering economy, the Glazer’s have been hit hard and are feeling the pinch. Add to that the fact that they are fish out of water doing business in the UK and owning a team in a sport where they can’t possibly understand all the machinations and complexities involved. Yes I think they are committed to the team but they are first and foremost businessmen and they will not continue to handle such a massive debt unless they can cut team spending and a turn in the economy helps them with their own personal economic portfolio. They are not the first millionaires to be zapped by the changing and volatile economic and world climate presently being bullied and driven by oil. They are not oil men or I would have more faith in their capacity to outperform their debt.
I am more than willing to admit that I could be wrong about this. I obviously do not have a key to their offices and I am not privileged to see their books but I do see and recognize the signs of financial stress and restraint. If I’m proven wrong then I will be the first to come out and say that my paranoia got the better of me. But why not also consider the possibility that although slim, that I might actually be on to something, rather than completely dismissing my comments as delusional and misinformed rants? Just maybe my experience and gut instinct is correct on this. I dealt with many corporations in Alberta that claimed to be under stable financial ground only to find out after they were sacking 50% of their workforce that things were indeed not as wonderful as they claimed. United are not in that kind of trouble but they will have to deal with that awful debt. I think that will lead them to have tighter purse strings when it comes to buying players and I also think that it may eventually force the sale of Ronaldo by next summer because frankly, they could need the money. If not to pay of debt, to be their upcoming transfer kitty because the Glazer’s will not release more funds from their own purse. I also feel that it may lead Fergie to retire quicker than he has even declared. Why should he hang around if he isn’t going to be given the money to build the team he feels is needed to compete at the very top? Who know? I’m just stating my opinion for those who want to hear it. For those who don’t, just dismiss it and move on.
August 6th, 2008 at 20:42
@Grognard: I don’t think there is a lot wrong with what you say. But there may be faults in how you put it. You and I say the same things at times, but get different reactions. It’s how you frame your thoughts into writing that makes a difference, I think. You have a penchant for the extremes, either we are going under and broke, or we are the greatest since sliced bread. Again there is little wrong in saying what you say, but then since you put things in that way you are always going to get people who’ll feel put off. I know you like to be accepted (everyone does). I’d be lying if I said I don’t care what people think of how or what I write, because at the end of the day that’s precisely why someone would inhabit the comment threads for a good part of their day.
But from experience, everything in moderation helps more than you think. Yes free speech is everything, but then, calling the Pope Hitler’s second coming in the Vatican is also free speech and bad timing.
August 6th, 2008 at 20:48
@johnsom33: Johnson33, the banks give out loans to thousands of companies everyday and half of those companies are going to default on those loans. It’s the risk of doing business and that is why interest rates are so high. So just because loans were given does not mean that the Glazer’s are going to be able to live up to their bargain.
Bottom line is that United as an organization, an asset and successful footballing franchise are worth a ton of money regardless of the stability of the present owners. One thing a group like the Glazer’s know in the world of big business is that when possible, you never use your own money. Instead you borrow against it. So in a worse case scenario the Glazer’s would be forced to pay the loan out of their own pockets. But that won’t happen either. They are too smart for that. They will sell the team at an inflated price to cover the debt and to make a profit before that ever happens. But what does that mean for the team? It is possible but unlikely that we end up in a similar boat like Liverpool. Where the Glazer’s want to sell and some Arab consortium from Dubai comes in and offers to buy. Again, who knows. All I know is we are fielding a team full of injuries and very thin up front and on the wings. And we have a manager in all his wisdom that thinks we are fine. He talks like a champion which he is but he is also way to over confident. It’s as if we won the EPL buy 15 points and won the Champions League final by a score of 6-0. We barely won both and almost ended up with nothing at all. If that is not reason enough to try to improve by adding some (not a lot) of new blood, then I am sadly out of place in this world.
August 6th, 2008 at 20:54
@tevez: You are probably right on all counts. And I’ll even add that I truly believe that Ronaldo loves thclub as well and has a lot of respect and love for his teammates and Fergie too. But United is not strong enough or culturally relevant enough to keep a person away from a team and country that offers him more in the way of his culture, family tie, and religion. Spain will always be the driving destination of players who speak those two languages, regardless of their love and respect for our club. We just don’t have the cultural, religious and personal things that can tie a player to us unless of course they come from the UK and other countries that have more in common with the English way of life, language and customs. These players are called mercenaries but honestly, once they make it to Barca or Real, very few leave. They only leave when they are not being used or if they have been disrespected by the club. Ronaldinho is an example of that.
And I wouldn’t have much complaint if we got Etoo.
August 6th, 2008 at 21:18
@Red Ranter: Understood but then again, being anything but honest and true to one’s self is also criminal. If I was to change the way I write to appease the pc crowd I would be doing an incredible injustice to myself because I would not be writing as myself but as someone who is being careful and concerned with others thoughts. Yes I want to be accepted and liked but why does my differing view on something mean that I have to be attacked. Really, at the end of the day if you and I disagree on a player, does that make the world stop? Do we both avoid eating dinner and go and sulk in our rooms? Of course not. Too many people have a complex (and I am occasionally guilty of this as well) where they want others to agree with them and they get upset when they don’t. Yes I’m guilty of this but only in those cases mentioned where I have knowledge and experience about a team or player that others don’t have because I have watched the for man many hours. Some cannot simply handle the fact that they have been bettered in a debate because i had more facts and i could back up my claims with evidence and experienced man hours of watching the team, the player and reading about both. That’s fair competition and I was taught and trained to be like this in school. It should not come as surprise to many but I was on my junior high and senior high debate teams. I was far from a geek but I still had the gift of the gab.
For one who has the gift of the gab and who has had moderate success in my professional life (before my disability) and has many good and close friends, it amazes me and totally depresses me the kind of negativity my views get on this site. I have never written anything nor have I ever devulged anything of my personality and personal life that allows a person to say something like the following;
“No offense, but your posts are really sad, i hope the way you post and the manner with which you address people doesn’t reflect what kinda person you are in real life, if not i feel for people close to you. Judging from your posts it seems you’d be the one slashing your wrists and probably tying a noose if Fergie doesn’t sign anyone.”
And what bothers me even more is that they got away with it. And then you wonder why I get so paranoid and defensive. Because any human being with a heart and a soul would take such comments as a stab in the back and and an insult worthy of a fist fight.
I’m just explaining to you that I am not always guilty here and quite often I do not and should not deserve the kind of uncalled for, personal and judgmental attacks that have been leveled upon me by ignorant and very small and pathetic people who have nothing better to do than to attack a fellow blogger. Rather than correcting the way I write, perhaps they should correct their reading comprehension and their ability to respond in a respectful manner. Even if they vehemently disagree. It’s all about manners and respect for someone’s right to express their feelings, no matter how controversial or radical they may be. Instead, I have to deal with the high court of asshole opinion that declares I be placed in a Gulag where I won’t trouble their virgin minds any longer.
At a time when one of the great writers for freedom, reform and democracy Alexander Solzhenitsyn has passed away, I think it’s important to put a little proper perspective on the importance and relevance of Manchester United blog into context. Why should be people be so upset over the rants of a football blogger when people die and suffer everyday due to the cruelties of individuals who have no sense of tolerance, respect or belief in freedom of action and expression. Am I really worth all that hate and disdain in the overall picture. I’m just as bloody football fan and this is a rant site for that purpose. Lets stop sniping and just accept people for their differing opinions, whether they are right or wrong.
August 6th, 2008 at 21:39
Yes you have unfairly been targeted but you must accept that you haven’t been exactly a saint here either. You may call it retaliatory but a wrong is a wrong.
Feel free to express yourselves, but if you are controversial you will have to learn to grow a thick skin. I will try as much as I can to protect the wronged as I have done in the past, but there is only so much I can do.
And regarding the negativity you are getting here, trust me, try going to some other United forums — it’s a lot worse. And you might actually get a coronary attack.
August 6th, 2008 at 21:57
Comment deleted. Ishaq you have been warned.
August 6th, 2008 at 22:54
@Grognard: Is it common for banks to loan out over a 1 billion US? Ill admit that this is when my ignorance comes into play. I really dont know the answer. I just figured with numbers that high the banks would make sure the money would come back.
August 7th, 2008 at 7:28
@Grognard: Cheers mate. Just wantto keep the site in a decent tone