Jul 22
United scrape past Philly, but Fergie’s comments on Vidic grab headlines
Or should we say his lack of comment? His economy of phrasing ought to get tongues wagging.
When quizzed about speculation regarding Vidic leaving OT, he said, “I can’t clarify it at all.” Journalists pressed further and asked if he was going to play at United this season and he replied, “I believe so.”
By not saying much, he’s not only cast a lot of doubt, he’s essentially confirmed what was till now routine speculation doing the rounds in hushed whispers. It is different if Vidic was vague about his future. Ferguson is usually protective about his players. He was vehement in denial about Ronaldo till the day news of his transfer popped-up as a terse statement on the official website.
Perhaps he’s had enough of his or his agent’s machinations behind the scenes? I can’t say. To the optimists, he’s going to play for us this coming season. At least they’ll believe so.
In the event of his transfer without adequate replacement, it would mean a reliance on an injury-ravaged Ferdinand, a young upcoming Jonny Evans, Wes Brown who has his own injury history to deal with, a stop-gap like O’Shea, and a debutant in Chris Smalling. Not the worst defensive line-up, but the strength of a successful side is in a settled defence.
* * *
Meanwhile, United got another pre-season friendly under its belt. I think this pre-season tour to North America has been pretty good, insofar as the competitive levels of the matches. Both Celtic and Philadelphia Union gave us a good game. And it’s upto us to make good use of it. I’m not reading too much into pre-season though, but I had a few thoughts on it anyway. Rafael when he came on was impressive; Evans looked alright. The midfield seemed to be run over at times, although I felt Cleverley seemed to have an eye for a pass whenever he got the chance. We should see a lot of him this time during the Carling Cup. Maybe even a few appearances in the league. Obertan was frustrating nearly throughout the game despite his goal. Welbeck ran around a lot, put in a good shift, but his first touch was dreadful, finishing poor, and generally happened to make the wrong decision while making a pass. Maybe this is my personal opinion on Welbeck in general—that I don’t think he’ll become a United regular—but he wasn’t all that great yesterday. Macheda seemed to have lost a touch of pace and was out of sorts.
This is one thing we should accept about our strikers—Welbeck and Macheda—in terms of their pecking order: they are going to be below Rooney, Berbatov, Owen, Hernandez and Diouf. Our formation last season favoured more of a single striker (with Rooney up front). At any rate, we are still going to see fierce competition for striker berths at the Carling Cup level. One of Macheda or Welbeck will have to go out on loan. And Ferguson will probably decide which one after this pre-season gets over.
Berbatov was a calming influence and actually led to a more fluid attack when he came on.
And that’s all I have to say about the match.
Your thoughts in the comments welcome.
Related items from Red Rants:- Fergie’s Cleverley About-Face
- Fergie’s Wind Up Act, Levy and Not Much Else
- Teams Start Talking Big As Champions’ League Clash Looms
- Commenting Policy
- Blackburn v Manchester United – Preview
Tags: Daily Roundup · Manchester United Transfer News & Rumours
July 22nd, 2010 at 11:51
Personally I think we should sell Macheda and Welbeck. We could get £10-15 million for the pair which could fund the midfield purchase we need.
Both players are way below the standard required to make the first team and are only going to develop with regular first team games, a luxury we cannot afford to give them. Sending them out on loan doesn’t help.
Do we really need seven strikers in our squad? Especially when we usually only play with one striker.
July 22nd, 2010 at 12:04
I agree, sell Welbeck and Macheda. Berbatov is a great link player and makes things happen. I’ve always thought we should use him as the playmaker and play Rooney, Hernandez, Owen or Diouf up front as required. Spend the cash on a replacement for Hargreaves.
July 22nd, 2010 at 12:09
@colver: I beg to disagree about Wellbeck. I think he has huge potential. Whether he will fulfill it or not we still don’t know. As happens with many young players he could be inconsitent and frustrating at times and excellent at others. But he has pace, strength, skills and a good eye for the goal. I ony saw highlights of yesterday’s game but he was much better than suggested by Red Ranter. For me he is one of the most promising youngsters and needs to be played more regularly to become more consitent.
July 22nd, 2010 at 12:18
Are you barking mad? Sell two of our brightest prospect?
Some fans never cease to amaze me! Now I’m not saying your one of them Colver (thought that comment makes me wonder) but sometimes it looks like some fans just want us to buy, buy, buy just to buy.
The history of Manchester United is about bringing youth through the ranks and I for one would easily let a few trophies go to see a few youths step up! Fact is that we are not a buying team, we have never been. Not under Fergie at least. Please name one season aside from 96/97, 2001/2002 and 2007/2008 where you haven been satisfied with our transfer dealings? No? Didn’t think so.
Personally I want Fergie to give even more youth through and if Feries refusal to spend means young Cleverly gets a chance to shine I’m a happy camper. Having said that I also think that we need to sign a midfielder, and I would be happy if Özil came. But not if it meant that we had to sell our best prospects!
Fact is that what Fergie is doing now is nothing new. He has refused to spend big money several times in the past. When he says that there is no value in the market I believe that is exactly what he thinks. I don’t agree with him. value can be found it you look close enough.
I also think that we do lack money but not so much that it wouldn’t be available if Fergie said he needed it.
July 22nd, 2010 at 12:31
And RR: Welbeck was man of the match last night even if his first touch let him down at times.
Based on this preseason I can’t understand why Macheda is rated highest of the two, because Macheda has been dire in both games while Welbeck has shown some potential especially last night.
July 22nd, 2010 at 12:38
@NorwegianDevil: I think there is a fine line between loyalty and blind faith, I have no belief that Welbeck will make it a first team regular, he looks like Paulo Wanchope, no touch and is very fragile but will be happy to be proven wrong.
July 22nd, 2010 at 13:12
After hearing they are available and in form players, Man City have put in £40mil bids for Robinho and Craig Bellamy
July 22nd, 2010 at 13:17
I see both sides of the argument, 7 strikers is a waste of time. The only way the young players will improve is by playing on a regular basis. Unlike when the class of 92 came through we do not have the quality to support bringing a lot of youngsters through at once. It is a tough one. As for Vidic if he goes he goes, this has been doing the rounds for a long time. If he does go we need to spend to fill the gap especialy with Rio beeing (as I view it now) a 20 games a season player. (Once your back goes it is the beginging of the end you get all sort of nasty little injuries, he could become the new Mr 3 weeks)
Smalling as a regular at our level is a no, no for the next year or two (crazy signing if you ask me) Brown in the middle and O’Shea please no. That leaves Evans.
If Vidic goes we need 2 or 3 (dependant on Hargreaves) quality proven players bringing in to keep our heads above water and as of the 1st of August I will consider the clock to be ticking to bed any new players in for the start of the season especialy when you consider the world cup players on extended leave. This season i think we have to have a strong start to be in contention for the league.
Just a side note on Vidic. The players are at united every day so know more than we do. Do the rats sense a sinking ship. After all many many little cut backs are being made around Old Trafford and Carrington in order to facilitate our massive debts.
Also to many players going in to the season with big fitness question marks hanging over them
Hargreaves
Rio
Anderson
Owen
Neville
The twins are injury prone and i think Rooney needs the presure taking of him and more rest or we will see the same as last season from him ( a player not at his best when we need him)
All in all problems 80 million of investment would not cure. Shame that cool 80 million we bagged went to the banks (by all accounts)
July 22nd, 2010 at 13:46
Da Silva twins were a right handful last night- always going forwards, i said it b4 and i say it again Cleverley is the nxt big thing in the epl, Danny again shown us what he is about and deserved a gl 2 go with assist. Gabby caused alot probs for union and took his gl nicely 2 cap good game, Jonny, Corry and Smalling were solid and the ever-excellent Kuszczak made 2 fantastic saves to keep us in game. Berba and Kiko had good run outs especially Berba who unfortunate hit bar, hard fought win good see.
July 22nd, 2010 at 13:56
We have a fantastic blend of youth and experience, Fergis is a genius- he knows by bleeding the kids in2 the 1st-team step by step he is creating a bunch of warriors hungry for success. Danny, Kiko, Fabs, Rafa, Gabby, Cleverley, Gibbo, Jonny, Corry, Diouf and Javier r just a few of an ever dominate utd future.
July 22nd, 2010 at 14:43
@Stephen: I’ve got my doubts about Welbeck as well, same as I have with all youngsters before they prove me either right or wrong.
Truth is that he hasn’t had a decent run of games yet and that’s why the jury is still out on him. He’s got the potential but needs games to prove himself.
This isn’t about Welbeck though, nor any other youngsters in our squad. It isn’t about blind loyalty to Fergie either because if you read my post carefully you would have noted that I made it perfectly clear that I did not agree with Fergie that there is no value in the market. I believe that value can be found if you look hard enough.
I’m not saying what I’m saying because I’m blindly loyal to SAF, because I’m not. I’m saying what I’m saying because thats the way I want our club to be run. I don’t want us to be a City or a Real Madrid buying every Tom, Dick and Harry for extortionate prizes.
I want us to be Manchester United. I want us to be true to our own history. A history that’s all about giving young players a chance to shine.
It irritates the hell out of me that Pique needed to go back to Barcelona to realize his potential! It bugs me that Tosic and Rossi never got a decent chance to prove that they were good enough. I also hate the fact that Evans is our only home grown talent that has made it since Fletcher several years ago. Thats not our way. Contrary to what people often believe, we have never bought our way to success. Our way is a mix of home grown talent and astute bargain signings. After all, how often have supersignings proved a success for us? I can name only two: Ferdinand and Rooney. Even Van Nistelrooy was unproven before he came to us.
@RedTanRedTan: You say that the reserves today, unlike the class of 92, don’t have the quality to make it? Well I beg to differ. I believe that we today have the best crop of youngsters we’ve had since the Beckhams and Giggs in days of yore. We got a lot of potential stars like Welbeck, Cleverly, Macheda, Corry Evans, Josh King, Morrison, Pogba, Eikrem just to name a few. All with the potential to make it big in the next few years if they are given a chance. If only 2 or 3 of these make it to the big stage we would have saved millions on the market. Not that I care if we save or spend money, but I do care about youth and want us to be more successfull and get at least one youth through the system each year.
It may be that none of the mentioned will make it, but I would hate that we let them go without giving them a chance to prove themselves!
July 22nd, 2010 at 15:36
I agr@NorwegianDevil:
totally agree…people forget these guys are like 18 and 19 years old! I think Welbeck’s issue (first touch and all) is more of a fitness thing…he is not quite as fit as some of the others with the extra bulk…he almost looks like he’s not quite used to his body and often stumbles around and looks awkward…Macheda is very bright on the ball and is quick but maybe not fast…his biggest weakness is mentally he is not always there..he tends to run offside and make some suspect decisions…I was very impressed with Cleverly..he has an eye for a pass and very busy..box to box all over the place…I think if he can stay healthy this will be his breakout year…as for strikers..we have an overload of young strikers…King and Keane are pushing fromthe reserves…times like this i would like to see people like Miki Owen moved on..but I suspect Fergie keeps them around to show the young guys the ropes which totally makes sense…I think our reserves and youth teams are totally stacked with very good talent…I would hate to be a midfilder in the youth team at United because there are so many good ones! Strikers as well….the future is brigt but it can’ get here soon enough!
July 22nd, 2010 at 16:22
@NorwegianDevil: I dont say the youngsters do not have the quality. I say we do not have the quality in other departments to support bringing 4 or 5 youngsters through at the same time. Certainly not with the fitness doubts of several (what would be) key first team players
July 22nd, 2010 at 17:01
Seems like Milner is on the market now (BBC). Since City have bought Silva and Chelsea are after Ramires/Morales, are we the team to get him? For around 20 million I would like Milner as a central midfielder and option on the wing. Anyone
July 22nd, 2010 at 17:39
@[OPTI]Madschester United: City are still after Milner. Forget about him.
July 22nd, 2010 at 17:53
The saying goes if you are good enough you are old enough. Unfortunately none of the youngsters we have are good enough!
Beckham, Scholes and Giggs displaced Kanchelskis, Ince and Sharpe.
Our current midfield is nowhere as good as that and players like Gibson cannot even oust an out-of-form Carrick.
We do not have the luxury of giving players extended runs in the team. No top team in the world does except Arsenal and look how many trophies they’ve won lately.
How it works is that you have to take your first team chances and do well enough to retain your place. Nani is a prime example of how to do that. Also players like Rooney and Ronaldo joined the club and from day one they were a cut above the rest. Yes they were frustrating at times but they also had enough quality to justify continued inclusion.
Unfortunately the loan system does not work and we don’t have a B team like the Spanish leagues. So if a player needs an extended run of games to develop into a good player he is not going to make it at Old Trafford or any other top club.
Instead he will have to drop a level and develop his game in a weaker team.
Also in the 90s the Premiership was much less competitive. Nowadays you have seven or eight teams capable of finishing in the top four. So we cannot afford to carry players who aren’t good enough NOW just because they MAY develop into a good player in a season or two’s time.
If Fergie had that much faith in Welbeck and Macheda why did he buy Berbatov, Diouf and Hernandez for a total outlay of £40 million or so?
Welbeck has a poor touch, lacks confidence and is too gangly and selfish on the ball. He also was on loan last season in a lower league and did very little of note. Frazier Campbell at least banged them in for Wolves but we haven’t regretted selling him as he has done nothing in the Premier League.
Macheda is just average and now that clubs know about him he is unable to get into goalscoring positions so cannot make use of his best attribute-his finishing ability.
These players are young but they have not improving the way things are now. It is sad but the fairest thing would be to let them go.
Rooney, Berbatov and Hernandez are all ahead of them in the pecking order and also Owen when fit. They aren’t going to get regular games unless they make an immediate impact when they do get a start. And they’ve failed to do that yet. Pre-season and reserves games do not count by the way.
July 22nd, 2010 at 18:03
So fergie is planning to send Cleverly and Welbeck on loan!
I can understand Welbeck decision as we alredy have 6 other strikers.
But, why Cleverly?
LINK
July 22nd, 2010 at 18:15
@AndyCR7: only sane reasoning behind this is, some one is coming in to add to the midfield…
July 22nd, 2010 at 18:20
@t_reason: I hope so mate. But, I highly doubt it…
July 22nd, 2010 at 18:50
@Red Ranter: I cannot see him go to city… their midfield:
Yaya Toure, Silva, De Jong, Barry, A Johnson, SWP, Ireland, Kompany, and Viera
Even when they sell SWP and Ireland, he has to compete with Silva, Johnson for wing-play and there is 0% chance he will make it in center midfield against Toure, Viera, and Barry.
July 22nd, 2010 at 18:58
@AndyCR7: Welbeck should go on loan. Cleverly should stay and fight for a place unless we are seeking one more midfielder in the transfer market- miiiiilneeeer?
With Hargo out, our central midfield is:
Scholes, Fletcher, Carrick, Anderson, and Giggs. Any youngster, and especially a player as good as Cleverly, would think they have a chance of breaking through to a semi-regular starting spot…. unless we are bringing in 1 superstar.
Scholes and Giggs are old and will only feature every other week. Fletcher is a starter. Carrick’s and Anderson’s forms are suspect. We need Cleverly to break through or move on and this is his best chance, I reckon.
July 22nd, 2010 at 19:12
Fergie’s new formation
:
EVDS
Rafael-Vidic-Ferdinand-Evra
Vally – Fletcher – Nani
Chicharito-Berba-Rooney.
I like it and I just made it up
July 22nd, 2010 at 19:21
@RedTanRedTan: “Just a side note on Vidic. The players are at united every day so know more than we do. Do the rats sense a sinking ship.”
his wife has been the excuse for leaving for a couple seasons now so… no.
and do you have a source for this?… “After all many many little cut backs are being made around Old Trafford and Carrington in order to facilitate our massive debts.”
i haven’t seen any story’s suggesting cutbacks?
July 22nd, 2010 at 19:30
@[OPTI]Madschester United: thats the beauty of it
let them spend on all the wrong players when they go trophyless for the 48yr in a row is it now? the sultan of swing will find a new hobby.
July 22nd, 2010 at 19:32
@[OPTI]Madschester United: dig it now we just need someone to catch vidas wife cheating on him so he can stay in england.
July 22nd, 2010 at 20:09
I want no part of Milner, he isn’t worth a dime over 10m. Just another overrated and overhyped Englishman. I would rather give cleverly or Anderson a half season to cement their place.
July 22nd, 2010 at 20:31
@gator: have been in the local media and storys coming out of Carrington for example any one out side of the imidiate playing staff no longer gets a breakfast at carrington. Old players and some hospitality speakers no longer get free match day tickets. there have been a few more doing the rounds the press have picked up on a few. We all know about Vidics wife, not to mention his agent will be stiring things up a bit. United are a long way away from being a top wage payer in European football. The ecenomics at united are pretty straight forward these days. Spend as little as possible and gove the banks and uncle malc as much as we can
July 22nd, 2010 at 20:33
I think Milner should stay at Villa for another season. All this hype and talk of huge fees after one good season in the middle of the park and a dodgy world cup
July 22nd, 2010 at 20:37
@gator: I hope shitty miss out on the top 4 again next year amd then spend another 100 million and get 4th the year after, fail in champions leaguqualifying and come 5th that year. the sultun say fuk it and goes leaving them the largest wage bill in Europe and those ridiculace big spot lights they use during evening games
They have the big spot lights in all the land cos city are a massive club
They have the biggest wage bill in all the land cos city are a massive club
July 22nd, 2010 at 21:09
@RedTan: I hope so too mate….
But we might as well face the facts, on paper, they are stronger now than us.
Only for the first 89 minutes!
But seriously, we could do with some juice now.
July 22nd, 2010 at 21:11
The thing about Fergie that bothers me the most is the way he treats us fans with contempt and talking down to us like we are blind ignorant sheep. He has forgotten the reality of who actually pays him and who he really has to answer to at the end of the day. And that day is coming.
July 22nd, 2010 at 21:21
@RedTan: they just seem to be buying players according to rumors of who other teams are going after and are not trying to build a team. I cant help but think they will end up like that.
but i still think we may pick up more help in mid if cleverly is going out and welly then that is cover in mid and on the wing that we will lack.
July 22nd, 2010 at 22:31
@Grognard: I think you ,iss read the situation with fergie. he hates the media and treates all journo and media out lets with contempt and speaks to them like the idiots they are. When we were a PLC he had to becareful of what he said. The wrong word would effect our share price in an instant. With the Glazer ownership he has to be even more care full. As I keep saying, if Fergie said we are skint they are shit. He would have a que of players agents at his door trying to get the players they represent out of umited as soon as possible. bash Glazer not fergie. The man who runs the club is Glazer fergie is an employee and we are better of with him IMHO
July 22nd, 2010 at 22:34
wish I could edit must check rushed posts before pressing send
July 22nd, 2010 at 23:21
@NorwegianDevil: Im not going to say our youngsters are great, and im not going to say they are total shit, because tbh i have nothing to base it on for most of them because all i have seen of them is reserve football which means nothing.
But for the record i actually think we do have a few good kids who could make the grade. I personally like evans, rafael, fabio, and pogba who ive watched a bit and looks a class above the rest in his age group, and strangely enough de laet who has impressed me a lot. These are the only kids i would say will make it for us.
Then there are a lot of the kids in the ifs and maybes category. I would say cleverley, macheda, smalling, hernandez, joshua king, diouf, welbeck, go here. Some of them may make it, but i would bet most of them wont.
But at the end of the day though this is the important bit. If they arent given a chance then it doesnt matter if potentially we have the next lionel messi or the next liam miller on our hands, they will not progress the way they should and wont make it.
This is why i think all this “believe in the kids” stuff coming from fergie is just plain old shit. He said the same last year and yet most of the kids barely got a game.
Last year when we had our defensive crisis, we went with carrick and fletcher at the back rather than having faith with the impressive de laet. I know he played against fulham in the 3-0 defeat but that was a bad day at the office for every player, not just him.
Then theres rafael. I really like him and think right now it should be him or brown at RB all the time (i really dont rate oshea).
Brown though it seems isnt fancied there any more, so rafael should be given a run there. But fergie goes back to his old tested favourites in neville and gives him a new contract. All that does is block rafaels progress while at the same time giving a new contract to a player who got one because of his name and not his ability.
You see fergie can go on about the kids all he likes, but he doesnt fool me, because i can see it all now that as soon as the season starts he will go back to his old tried and tested and start neville, scholes and giggs every game. Now not only do i feel they are past it but they are also blocking the youngsters fergie is prasing 24/7 progress. This is why when he says he likes welbeck, macheda, gibson etc he is talking bull, because as soon as the season starts it will be the return of the oldies yet again. And i would put every penny that they will be given new contracts next season once again.
That is reason 1 why people like myself are crying out for next signings. Because i do not believe he will start to faze out the oldies and try to bring through the new batch who can go on and have good careers for us. Im not even going into whether they are good enough here, just that i doubt they will be even given a chance and this is what pisses me off when fergie uses the kids as an excuse to not buying.
Truth be told i dont want us to go out and throw £50m on one player because thats not what united are about. But in the past we did not hold onto players who were way past their best, and replace them with kids who are either not good enough or not ready yet, and wont be until they are given a good run of games.
Fact is a team like this is crying out for some new blood. A player that if at the very least just lifts the fans morale which is at an all time low right now. I cant tell you what a difference i believe an ozil would do for this team.
Just 1 player like ozil or one of his calibre would raise my spirits and believe we could actually mount a good title challenge, compared to right now where i just dont know what we will do.
July 22nd, 2010 at 23:37
@RedTan: That may be all well and true mate but why do we have to hear time and time again with a big smile on his face as he says it “the glazers are great owners” and “the ronaldo money is there to spend”.
Regardless of whether he decides to speak out against them or not, its comments like that which have annoyed me and the likes of grognard and others, simply because it makes him sound like hes fully behind them which i believe he is, rather than just smiling for the cameras and putting on a show he will tolerate them.
The way i see it, everything right now comes down to fergie. He could change everything in an instant. One rant out to the world about what they are really like, the stadium would be empty and the glazers would be out of here within a few weeks, simply because no matter how much they want to treat us like shit, without us fans the glazers are up shit creek.
I just dont see how anybody can say the glazers are bastards while totally letting fergie off the hook. Does fergie know the real state the club is in?
Of course he bloody does. So how does he think keeping quiet, and sucking up to the glazers and smiling and saying everything is fine is going to help the club. Because the way i see it it is a combination of a few things.
1. Short term all he is thinking about is getting his hands on our 19th prem title and walking into the sunset as the man who toppled liverpool and made us the most successful team in the country.
2. He knows he will retire soon so isnt concerned in getting into a battle so late in his career.
3. He sided with the glazers from day 1 and never understood the normal fans concerns. The statement he made when they first took over, the day after rioting by fans who had seen their beloved club being taken over by the devil, the man comes out to the world and says “anybody who doesnt like it can go and support chelsea”.
That comment just sickens me to the stomach, and if i had been one of the loyal fans who had been protesting for hours outside OT, trying to make a stand against the glazers, all to hear our own manager say that i would have ripped my season ticket in half.
The bloody idiotic senile twat never saw us normal working class fans concerns from day 1, and deserves no let up from the fans in our attempt to reclaim our club.
If the day comes and i truly pray to god it does, when the glazers leave us i will be in the front of the line outside OT asking for answers from old man fergie. Answers as to why he sided with bastards we all saw from day 1 wanted to tear us apart. Bastards that took the club for every penny we had, whilst our old manager, the working class boy from Govan decided to side with the suits and piss in us fans faces.
Im sorry, most people will say im going a little extreme here but its my opinion and i think im right. Truth be told i really cannot stand the man right now, and if it was up to me i hope when the glazers go we have a clear out and fergie is the first one out to pay for his crimes.
I really feel like writing his name out of the history books for his siding with the devil. The devil that would have no problem tearing us down and reducing us to nothing.
Well fergie if you want to side with cunts who will do that then on your head be it, because quite frankly i have just had a fucking nough.
July 23rd, 2010 at 1:01
@RedTan: Fergie has been with the club for 25 years mate. He built the club that is now considered the richest team in the world (what a laugh). Therefore he is responsible for not allowing these owners to systematically destroy everything this team was before he took over and everything it has become since he took over. His is a position of rare power. The man has been knighted by the Queen and is considered a legend in the game. If he was to turn on his employers and start a coup, the whole of Mncunia including the government would be on his side and in his corner. He could with his influence and power force the Glazer’s to sell even if they sacked him. The Red Knights cause would grow greater in strength and investment if they had a man of Fergie’s influence backing them and there isn’t a fan alive who would take the side of Glazer in this standoff. So you tell me then who has made the errors in judgment here, me or Fergie. From where I stand it sure looks to me that Fergie has made the classic mistake of getting into bed with the enemy and then conforming to that enemies rule and rations. I cannot ever respect him or like him again for this act of treason.
July 23rd, 2010 at 1:16
@tonymontanna4united: You under-estimate SAF’s level of professional commitment. He has always, throughout his managerial career, been the ultimate professional at his job (which, like or not is being a servant to the people that write his paycheck).
He has always been unimpressed by issues that try to detract from a course that he has set, and has always offhandedly dismissed the rantings of those that think they know better.
None of what is going on with him now, is newsworthy, it’s all old hat, mate, and unlikely to change for what ever longevity he may have left!!
You should be thankful that we have such a steady hand on the rudder as the club obviously negotiates rough waters. His skill and experience is second to none (including Mourinho) and I am convinced that he will put winning above all other considerations for this season and any more that he might want to endure.
As far as lying, stretching the truth, misleading the general public – I guess an angelic, honest man wouldn’t do any of that – but then those types are usually not successful football managers!!
July 23rd, 2010 at 1:45
@Grognard: I think you saying that because SAF has had great success building team after team, he has a responsibility to take on the ownership about their finances, is a huge leap of logic, mate.
Ferguson is a football manager and not a financial guru, he is sticking to what he knows and keeping his nose out of other things.
Where he may slip up, though, is if he fails to succeed on the field, then the onus of what may of, or what could have been done to avert failure, could fall on his shoulders. In this respect I think he walks a perilously thin wire.
If there was ever a group of people that could have spoke up against the Galzers, it could have been ex-United greats such as Charlton, Crerand, Cantona. Their influence could have caused a caused a massive fan rebellion that whould make MUST seem like pip-squeaks.
Of course, the man in the middle, with a tough enough job already, has to take on the ownership and be all things to all men.
What will it take for this whining to end. I guess another Championship, or another CL title, or another FA Cup, or another Carling Cup – wait, have I forgotten something.
July 23rd, 2010 at 2:01
@tonymontanna4united: Well said mate, well said.
July 23rd, 2010 at 2:56
@Redrich: I have absolutely no problem with what he does on the pitch mate, afterall he is the best manager ever in the game and i dont think many will dispute that.
Every negative point i made against him is because of his actions or should i say inactions off the pitch.
Now i realise that what goes on on the pitch is what he will get judged for and in most cases it is on the pitch that matters most.
But this is not a normal everyday thing we are seeing off the pitch at our club. I understand that he wants to keep this team moving and winning, and i understand that. Hell the guy nearly took one of the worst united teams i have seen in over 15 years to a fourth title in a row, and that was down to him, as to any other manager that same team would have struggled to get top 4.
So i can understand in some ways, his job is what he does on the pitch, its results and trophies he is paid for and i understand that, but the key thing here to me is that long term this club is in trouble, and at a time when the manager is nearing retirement, it is the club that is going to suffer from his lack of fight against the glazers. Maybe not now, but certainly when he retires, within the next few years.
I mean put it this way, if the glazers manage to take liberties with the greatest manager of all time, the godfather of football, then what hope does the next poor sap of when he comes in. The glazers are going to tear the bloody club apart with a moyes or o’neill in charge (lets face it mourinho wont join with the club in its current state).
Now maybe just maybe if fergie was say in his 50s and had a good 10 years left in the game then i wouldnt be as worried. Afterall as long as we have him the team will always be successful and long term maybe we wouldnt be in the shits. The glazers might take our money, but fergie would always keep the ship steady, even if the ship wasnt sailing as steadily as we wanted.
But that is the big problem, fergie is 68. He doesnt have long left, and if we think its bad now whats it going to be like when he leaves.
This is my biggest gripe about fergie, surely he can see what they glazers are doing to this club, surely he doesnt want to see the club he took 25 years to get to the top get raped and pilledged until it falls to the lowest depths it possibly can.
The manager knows bloody well the ronaldo money isnt there. He knows they have stolen it from him, yet he thinks its ok, ill act like everything is fine and just concentrate on the pitch and try and keep the ship steady.
What he fails to realise however is that everything they are doing off the pitch directly affects everything he does on the pitch, as weve seen with the lack of transfer funds these last 2 seasons.
So maybe he thinks he can keep winning, win the premiership next season, and hey who knows if hes gets very lucky he might win the champions league again.
But what about in 2/3 years time when fergie leaves. What then. A moyes or o’neill will get bloody well eaten alive by the glazers. And why not. They took on the daddy of football and won so what hope do they have.
This is why i have such a problem with ferguson. All he seems to be thinking about is the present and not long term like he always has done. This current squad is pretty ordinary but if were lucky we might win a few trophies. But so what, what about in 3 years time. In 5 or 10 years time, what then.
Those bastards are raping this club and taking us down shit creek and the one man who could make a difference sits there, and treats us like shit by openly supporting them, and calling them great owners.
He just fails to see the bigger picture and for that i will bloody will tell it as i see it because i am sick and fucking tired of the man trying to treat us fans like were brain dead morons who believe whatever comes out of his or the other little puppet gills mouth.
There is a very real real threat this club could go into administration or worse liquidation in the future. We are all putting too much hope into the idea some sugar daddy would come and bail us out in that event. But what if owning football clubs arent the craze in 10 years time. What then?
There is the very real threat this club can go under with the glazers in charge. They dont care about the club, they would gladly strip this club from top to bottom and leave us fans losing a part of our life.
And if that day ever happens, the glazers would be dead men walking. But fergie would be dead to me too, as he would have played just as big a part as the glazers in slowly killing our club.
July 23rd, 2010 at 3:04
@Redrich: Mate cantona has spoken many times of his disgust at what the glazers have done to this club. I remember reading an article not long ago with quotes from him saying if MUST ever wanted someone to spearhead their campaign he would gladly help.
I dont know if he made those quotes recently or in 2005 when the glazers first came in but i remember reading him say them.
But at the end of the day though its hard for them to do anything whilst ferguson so openly supports them.
Hows it going to look if cantona comes out and says “the glazers need to leave” if at the same time fergie comes out with his usual crap like “they are great owners”.
Are the optimistic idiots going to take cantonas word over fergies, especially when cantona is not involved with the club whilst fergie is.
And at the end of the day as long as fergie is happy to them, and publically says he is then they arent going to say a thing, he was their manager for many years afterall.
Its tough though, i do wish we had someone maybe from a pre fergie era who has no real loyalty to him, who would come out and tell it like it is, because we need someone to get the non believers and ever optimists to see the real shit that is happening at the club.
Sadly though with some fans the glazers could do whatever they like and some fans will still pretend everything is ok and its the press and unloyal reds who are just over hyping a story.
God the glazers have got fergie, most of the staff and a good deal of the fans right in their pockets, i bet they never thought it would have been this easy when they bought the club 5 years ago.
They must be literally laughing all the way to the bank.
July 23rd, 2010 at 3:45
@tonymontanna4united: Mate, I agree with that 100%, plus some more about the Glazers.
It’s very clear that they are vampiring United for all their worth. We are the object of the money desire – it sucks big time, and in a fairer world justice would be served.
I just don’t see where Ferguson arrives in this equation. He’s a fucking, football manager, and not a finance broker. The idea that he could twist the arms of his employers, and make hay to the idea that he can spend and do as he wishes, is far from realistic – I for one do not believe SAF has the desire or capability to do such a thing.
July 23rd, 2010 at 4:30
@Redrich: Mate i agree with you to an extent, because as a manager in a normal situation matters off the pitch would have nothing to do with the manager. At the end of the day a manager is judged by what they do on the pitch.
However our situation with the glazers is not your average everyday thing.
I really dont think im over exagerating if i say the glazers are the worst thing that has happened to this club since the munich air disaster.
They are a cancer on this club, and because of bloody loopholes in the system some how the bastards are getting away with raping us and stealing from us.
But what can we do about it? Well theres only really boycotting, and tbh united is such a global brand and so widely supported that unfortunately even if 30,000 fans give up their season tickets, there will be another 30k to fill it. In my opinion those fans are helping to destroy this club and piss in the faces of those who had the balls to give up something they loved.
This to me means boycotting will never work. Its sad but we have to be realistic.
The only way boycotting would ever ever work would be if our manager did what i and most people want him to do, and that is speak out and tell the world exactly what these cunts are doing to our team.
This is where fergie is needed. We are not talking about a normal manager here. Ferguson has more power in his little finger than the rest of the managers in the league do (barring maybe wenger who is possibly on the same level as him).
If he spoke out, people would take notice, there is no mistake about that.
But this is where i cannot understand ferguson. How does he think keeping quiet and praising the glazers will help our club. There is nothing postive about it.
Which leads me to believe that fergie really does think they are good owners. Maybe short sightedness, his fixation on winning title number 19 clouding anything else, or maybe because as i believe he just isnt that clever away from football and probably thinks they arent so bad.
To me it seems obvious he should speak out. I just dont see how he thinks keeping quiet will help anything. As i said before if the glazers can take liberties with fergie and get away with it, what hope does the next manager have? Hes going to get torn apart.
Sadly i just think fergie has no interest in off the pitch battles, and would rather concentrate on on the pitch matters. Short term this doesnt do much. We will still be competing for the honours, probably falling short though in the end.
But this isnt the big picture. Do i care if we win 3 premier league titles and 3 champions league titles in a row (as unlikely as that is with the current squad).
No i dont, because it doesnt take away from the fact that long term this club is in the shits while the glazers were in charge.
Sadly i just thought that our outspoken scot, the man who would take no shit from anyone, would do the right thing and stand up for the common fan, instead of becoming a sell out. Unfortunately looks like im wrong.
Looks though like we dont agree on fergies lack of actions. I personally think he has a duty to safeguard the future of this club and do the right thing and tell the world what these bastards are doing while you dont. I can see your reasons for that, i really can. I realise that short term if fergie spoke out our club would be in the shits for a while but i have always said i will take short term pain for long term gain.
Still i respect your opinion mate, maybe im going a bit over board wanting war and anarchy to get the glazers out, who knows. Atleast we are in agreement that the glazers are the cause of all evil and fergies praise for them is just wrong wrong wrong.
July 23rd, 2010 at 4:44
@tonymontanna4united: You are so right about the Galzers, they have no interest in the future of our club – only the interest of their own pocket book! (remember, they are businessmen).
Whoever the onus of kicking their greedy arse out of here, it’s not on Fergusons shoulders.
He is a huge influence on the club, and he has been a talisman for the United faithful too. But in this respect, he’s gonna keep his nose out of the fire (you should know this by now) and not dabble with stuff he can’t control.
I will be happy to agree with you, but probably it will be with stuff we just don’t agree on.
July 23rd, 2010 at 4:48
@Redrich: It’s not about finances. Fergie needs to step up and be this team’s Lech Walesa and lead a revolt of players, fans, local media and government that will heap such incredible social pressure on the Glazer’s they will have no choice but sell. He alone has the power to band all season ticket holders together and to get them all to boycott the team. There isn’t another manager currently in world football who has the power to do this other than him. This about striking back at the snakes mate by using their pawn. If nobody shows up for their games you don’t think they will sell? I guarantee it. One public statement condemning them and allying himself with the Red Knights or MUST and you will see the Glazer regime crack like a two minute egg. I kid you not. He may be a football manager but he is also a community leader.
July 23rd, 2010 at 4:55
@Redrich: See that’s where we differ Red. It is on Ferguson’s shoulders. He is a strong voice in world football and British hero and icon. He is SIR Alex and he has a voice and presence that will get attention and create action to be taken that will defeat the Glazer’s. But first he has to split from them. He needs to come cean and tell the world what they are up to and then band the whole of Mancunia against them. It can be done but only if he leads it. It is he who has build this team to what it is now, and it is he who can let it crash and burn or save it. It’s up to him. All I know is there will not be one United supporter that will not muster to his call and ready themselves for a mighty revolt against the Glazer vampires. I hope and pray the old man eventually comes to his senses and stops selfishly thinking about padding his legacy and his own bank account with the blood of millions of United supporters who right now either feel confused or like me, betrayed. “Keep his nose out of the fire”? Hell no, he needs to fall on his sword and be a martyr for all to rebel on his behalf.
July 23rd, 2010 at 5:01
@Grognard: If Ferguson is Lech Walensa, they you are Che Guavara, and Malcolm Glazer is Stalin.
If that’s the case, then Walensa comes out trumps. I believe his still alive too.
July 23rd, 2010 at 5:05
@Grognard: I’m not sure who the the Prime Minister of Canada is right now, but tell me why he doesn’t tell his noisy neighbors to the south to go FTS’s??
Life is just full of interesting questions!!
July 23rd, 2010 at 6:50
@Redrich: It’s because he’s to busy being in bed with them.
July 23rd, 2010 at 6:51
@Redrich: You see more pictures or drawings of Che on t-shirts than you see of Lech, now don’t you?
ATTICA ATTICA ATTICA
July 23rd, 2010 at 7:56
I understand both sides of the argument, while I don’t blame SAF completely for the circus, I wish he understood the emotion of the ordinary fan and their bond with the club. Dismissing our efforts to bring in financial stability as mindless fanaticism is just not on. On the one hand, I hate that we are in this position thanks to those greedy C****, on the other, since we are already in the bloody soup, I hope this lack of spending will actually help the club out of financial turmoil. I agree that “no value” is corporate speak for “no funds”. Fergie coming out and speaking against the idiots would be perfect but would it necessarily be in the best interests of the club? I am no brown noser but I really think that as long as the yanks are here, we need Fergie at the helm, at least to keep us afloat!
And tonymontana, I understand your grouse about boycotts and new fans but if I had just moved to Europe and had a chance to see my team play for a whole season, I would jump at it! I know it is wrong in the present circumstances but I would give an arm and a leg to watch them play live even the one time!! Call me short sighted, I am just a silly football fan!
July 23rd, 2010 at 8:46
@Grognard: LOL at that post. So fergie has been knighted by the quees and that makes him all powerfull. This is 2010 mate not 1710. manchester would not revolt. The stadium sould not empty. Fan boys in the US canada and Asia would still by the shirt. The camera phone supporter would sit in the north stand and thousands would flock to old trafford every week. United has two fan bases the fan boys who love the “franchise” and supporters who long for the day the words “football club are back on our crest. The pubs of Salford and Manchester would be full of angry reds, but we are the smallest elemant of Uniteds “capitalist and corporate” business plan. The club do not need us and we now it.
July 23rd, 2010 at 9:05
@tonymontanna4united: I agree with some of your points especialy 1 and 2 and part of 3. Fergie does want number 19 and as I said in a previous post does not want to retire yet and feels he is to old to start again so why rock the apple cart. I partialy agree with point 3 he could have said more when the glazers took us over and his comments about supporting Chelsea where out of order. If you were to ask him now he would probably agree. We all say things in the heat of the moment and tensions were high when we were near rioting out side OT. I did not go to OT for years after Glazer took control.
As for fergie not saying any thing, well. David Gill had his say and look how he turned around on his comments about debt. In Gill and Fergie we have two experienced and more than capable people running the day to day of the club. Who do you think we should replace them with?
You lost me when you called Fergie a “senile old twat” or what ever it was. that shows a complete lack of class and respect. Where would this club be with out the work he has done over the last 24 years
And again if Fergie does what you all want him to do and say the Glazers are a cancer, we have no money blar blar blar. What agent do you think will be first in the very long que of agents demanding a transfer for the players they represent? What good will that do? In business you require the maturity to put the business ahead of personal feeling and do what is good for the business even if that goes against personal feelings and united is a global business
The representatives of united can not just speak to the fans directly, it is not possible as any thing said is printed all over the world to both fans and the business community, who at the moment are keeping this club alive by continuing to support over £700 million of debt.
If you do not like the fact that Fergie is playing the business and media game then fine, but show the man some respect. I would never refer to an old man no matter who he is as a “senile old twat” (or the words to that effect that you use) especially a man who has brought us all ,how much joy over the years?
If you read my previous posts you will see he is not blame free in this matter and in that is possibly a reason as to why he is still here doing the best he can with what he has
July 23rd, 2010 at 9:07
@elvido: Great post mate. true that
July 23rd, 2010 at 9:09
@Grognard: So you are a united supporter. What have you done to be a voice against Glazer (besides your daily fergie bashing)?
July 23rd, 2010 at 12:10
Has anyone forgot or is he not available…there was a guy in Chile world cup team in the middle of the field and at the center of their attack , who also takes their set pieces..He was a very creative player and with some flair which we clearly lack in our midfield now..I would think he might be cheaper than other options and probably would take the occasional bench position and substitution than some of the over-rated over priced super stars
July 23rd, 2010 at 13:24
@Shyam: Alexis Sanchez is your man. He is available I guess and he absolutely loves Utd. Problem is we do not have any money. And he will cost upwards of GBP 20m at the least.
I see people are clamouring for new signings. Names like Ozil and all crop up all the time that will undoubtedly strengthen our team. But I have a question to you all – How will strengthening the team help evict Glazers who are the real problem??? Fergie might actually be doing us all a silent favor by not strengthening the team so that we go down and with us Glazer go down. They may not remain longer if the Utd start losing money. If we move out of top 4, there will be drastic reduction in revenues (and with that profits). Sponsors might withdraw (remember Vodafone!!!) and that will be the real end of Glazers!
If Fergie buys someone and we still remain in top 4 (which means CL money) Glazers will be all too happy to fleece us (with or without Fergie. He is just an employee of MUFC nothing more. And he is very much replacable for the owners.. they dont care) Remember even bigger names than Ferige have been shown the door in US. Steve Jobs was ousted by Apple (that when he was the founder of the company!!!!) Similarly Lee Iacoca was fired by Henry Ford when he had single handedly revived Ford Motor company’s fortunes. Glazers will show SAF the door without blinking another eyelid if he says a word against them. But I suspect Fergie is having his revenge in his own sweet way… By not strengthening the team he is actually doing us all a giant favor. Now the bigger (biggest) question is -
Are we all patient enough to let the man do his job and get the club back to us to whom it belongs!
July 23rd, 2010 at 14:31
@RedTan: Thanks mate, i don’t comment here often and i see that quite a few of you regulars here are lucky enough to get games at OT, was hoping that, that too gets its due appreciation. Just that discussing the Cancer brothers all the time gets to me! Eager to settle down to a good game of premier league football and support the club i love however I can. And from where I live, I can do that only by watching them on TV or buying shirts, thus helping the aforementioned Cancer brothers™.
Sophie’s Choice, innit!
July 23rd, 2010 at 14:35
Watched the pre-season games – zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. Big snore bore! I can’t see anybody coming through for the forward line among the youngsters. Welbeck and Macheda – no conviction whatsoever to go in where it hurts and be determined to get the ball in the net. Welbeck all round lanky loping game is better than Macheda’s which is non existent really. But neither of them have showed they have what it takes to be a top class striker. Same for Obertan – who couldn’t pass a decent ball into the box from the wing if his life depended on it. Cleverley is trying and really does want to make it at United, but needs bulking up a bit I think ala Fletcher. I am not impressed with Smalling, in fact he scares me. If Vidic does go, I think we will be in a lot of trouble at the back. The Da Silva boys have done okay though. Yeah not impressed so far overall, and we are not exactly facing top class opposition are we? We were lucky in the Celtic game, where an ex Man Shitty player could have had a hat trick against us.
July 23rd, 2010 at 14:45
@RedTan: That’s the whole problem though mate – the HOME GROWN fans don’t matter anymore, so you get the ghost town atmosphere at OT except in a lot of the evening games when the weekend travellers can’t attend, being mid week and all. Local fans are at the back of the queue in the clubs considerations, all they care about is getting a bum, any old bum parked on the seats. I’m a local, and have been on the OT terraces with my Dad and Grandad before him, in the days when the place was alive – with local rivalry chanting and barnstorming anthems. Now its like attending the local cemetary. I am not trying to offend you Red Tan – but the away game atmosphere from us fans is so far superior to the little voices from the terraces at OT these days. United are a business now – NOT A CLUB anymore!
July 23rd, 2010 at 14:56
@Stephen – you still around mate – I just got back off my holidays (GF paid for) hahahahaha – so in good humour, well at least for now mate! She may have paid for the holiday, but the whole of the rest of life is my money being thrown about LOL.
July 23rd, 2010 at 15:00
@tonymontanna4united: Hahahahahahaha – mate I see your engines are still revved up and in full throttle against the Red MAFIA management, the Glazer gangsters!
July 23rd, 2010 at 15:00
@CraigMc: Hi mate, you lucky bastard the Mrs paying for you holiday!!!??
I am buying a feckin house which is costing me a fortune mate, you have your good lady better trained than me!!
July 23rd, 2010 at 15:06
@[OPTI]Madschester United: I don’t like it – so you can unmake it up –
.
July 23rd, 2010 at 15:25
@Stephen:
, well it was part of the presents she felt she wanted to cheer me up with when England were booted out the world cup, so not all gloom and doom the England big girls blouses coming home early. Hey good luck with your house hunting and buying, make sure you choose an ALL RED district to live in though eh mate?
July 23rd, 2010 at 16:33
@Redrich: thats deep man
dig it
July 23rd, 2010 at 16:55
apparently we are offering vida 90k gbp a week for 4 yrs to stay!
LINK
July 23rd, 2010 at 17:43
@RedTan: Well that’s pretty cynical mate. Today the Glazer’s put 4000 season tickets up for sale. 4000 People had the baollocks to say HELL NO to those assholes and they never even had a leader to lead them to that decision. Ferguson is not just a football manager in Manchester. He is an icon and community leader. He is so well respected and loved that if he went to the media and said boycott the club to get rid of the Gazer’s, the people would. So you know where you can stick your LOL statement. I believe in the power of persuasion and in the ability for a real leader to rally the troops. If he was on our side in this mess, the club would have already been sold. I am absolutely convinced of that and I do not have to be Salford born and bred to get it. I for one have committed money to MUST and I know of people who have also and who have given up their season tickets. For me they are heroes because they put their money where their mouth is and because they believe in a cause worth fighting for. And all this without a true leader to guide them and speak for them.
July 23rd, 2010 at 18:04
@Grognard: How do you know that would happen. I think, if Fergie went to the media and said boycott Glazers, the Glazers would get rid of him immediately. The players would be forced to play since they are under contract and United would have a horrendous season and no team morale. Vidic and other would likely request to transfer listed. Fan riots would surely ensue but ONLY 4000 out of 50000+ season tickets are still unsold and idiots still pack the stands…
As the team likely would struggle to get 4th, the income for the following season coupled with the annual debt-related payments would not hurt glazers at all. They would just sell OT naming rights and the training ground. If need they would sell star players. Then they would leave with 0 personal losses and RedKnights (who have gone missing) would end up buying the club for 800+ million.
The Glazers don’t give a sh*t. It’s business to them. We are fans and invest emotions and money into our football addiction and the Glazers sit on top of United and are untouchable. Fergie cannot depose of the Glazers, Gill is a puppet, and the players are under contract – I am not sure what you expect could happen but you are far off the mark. Give me ONE example of a sport where the manager/coach comes out against the owner of a club and it ends up for the better.
Glazer’s will sell when they have bled us dry and that will only happen when Old Trafford is called Aon Stadium and Carrington Training ground is owned by some douch-bag Glazers’ holding company that United have to rent annually.
It’s disgusting and pisses us all off, but, I assume, it is all fair play in the business world.
If you want United to succeed now, we need Fergie. We need to compete in EPL and ECC. We need top talent but we cannot compete with RM and City. You know in your heart that ONLY Fergie can squeeze every last ounce of quality from our young and worldclassless squad and only with Fergie will we compete this season.
To suggest Fergie to commit carreer-suicide at this point in history is absurd. We have a chance (again) to secure a record 19th title and I only see City and Chelsea as our main competitors. If we do not win this year, we could be in trouble as city will likely get better, Chelsea will re-invest, and liverpool and arsenal are bound to come back eventually. Of course, what is the chance that Mourinho will come to United after Fergie talks to the media about the truth of the Glazer regime? 0% is my guess.
The best we can do as fans is cheer on the players and manager – they deserve us – and curse Gill and the Glazers – they deserve tar and feathers.
Fergie is doing his best and we all know it.
July 23rd, 2010 at 18:04
@RedTan: No actually mate, it’s time Ferguson showed us the loyal legions of fans worldwide some respect and stopped acting like a senile old fucking twat. TonyMontana4United is right in his assessment and he should be applauded for his courage in making those comments because all though they may be hard for sensitive ears to take, Fergie has done nothing the past two years to make us fans feel good about the club on the pitch or in regards to it’s financial future. He just chooses to lie to us through his wine stained teeth and treat us like belligerent step children.
Honestly mate, when will people like you wake the fuck up and realize that he has sold you and all of us out with his action….or should I say inactions? He has gotten into bed with the enemy and supported them to no end through the media. If he is insincere about his praise towards them then he is truly a poor actor because I see no con job here. And furthermore, I see no purpose or any good coming from his allegiance to these vampires.
No he isn’t senile as he is still the best club manager alive but he is a fucking traitorous cunt who has turned his back on you and all of us with his pact with those devils and the sooner people like you wake up to the facts in this case, the sooner a movement with serious power and intentions can gather speed and power to force the Glazer’s out of OT and they can take their lapdog and cronies with them.
I’m sick to death of the old man playing with our emotions and frustrating us with his disrespect and blatant dishonesty. He should come out and tell it like it is and fall on his sword for the good of the club’s future, not stick around so that he can hold on to any slim chance he still has of a 19th league title and a personal trio of Champions League crowns to enhance his already impressive legend status. He hasn’t got the club for either and by not supporting the takeover bid or the growing groups of anti-Glazer supporters he is steadily distancing himself from our love and respect for his 25 years in charge. In two years he has done a great job of destroy his previous 23 years of work.
Disloyalty and treason are tough words but if you can explain to me in an educated and logical manner what he plans on gaining by allying with Glazer and disrespecting the fans like this, then I am all ears? The one thing I don’t want to hear is all the typical protection of the football club and he is only a football manager bullshit that many love to trot out at times like this. Point is he is much more than a football manager to this team and to this community not to mention the millions of supporters from around the globe that are wondering why this great man has sided with owners who are so evil, corrupt and self serving that words to define the horror of what is happening right now elude me.
“Senile twat” is harsh I admit, but I could think of even harsher words for him, as well cutting words for all the fools who do their daily monkey routine with their hands when they see no evil, smell no evil and say no evil. Being deaf dumb and stupid is not way to get anywhere in life mate and to ignore what Fergie is doing alongside the owners just makes people who don’t get it just that, ignorant apes.
July 23rd, 2010 at 18:04
@[OPTI]Madschester United: PS: This is not directed toward Grognard in particular and I am sorry the post is so long – my emotions got the better of me
July 23rd, 2010 at 18:16
Great news guys, Vidic has aggreed new deal with United…
July 23rd, 2010 at 18:19
@elvido: If the money we are not spending was actually going towards the debt I’d have no problem. The point is though mate that the debt just continues to grow day by day and no attention or attempt by the Glazer’s is being made to lessen it. Instead they continue to take out money for themselves allocated to them as personal service fees and the club is being given very little if anything for club building to ensure a competitive team and a team that must for financial purposes continue to not only be in the Champions League, but go deep into it. Nothing that is happening makes any sense unless one closely analyses the history of the glazer family and it’s business model. They are nothing more than human parasites who cling on to the lifeblood of something they buy without ever using their own money, and they bleed it dry like leeches before leaving it’s dead carcass by the side of the road and then moving on to the next victim. And four years time United will be that carcass. A carcass that will by then be well over 1 billion pounds in debt. And you want to support this regime by personally acting in a selfish manner by paying to see them play or by buying merchandise. Well that’s your prerogative mate but I personally do not agree with it.
Today my heroes are not United players or coaches. It’s those 4000 selfless heroes who gave up their season tickets as a protest to what is happening. It’s the thousands upon thousand of loyal members of MUST who are fighting the anti-Glazer cause who I applaud and support, not fickle and ignorant fans who could care less about this club and it’s future because they need to get their little fix. I may be harsh mate but you are only part of a symptom in todays culture that I cannot understand, condone or respect. I’m sure you are decent bloke and a fine person but to willingly want to fork over money to those sharks just makes me pity you more than be angry with you. You’d give an arm and leg to see them play mate? That’s not necessary. But what you really would be giving up to pay and see them play is your soul. Sorry for the harsh words but supporters like you who allow themselves to be misled and who can only see feeding their addiction as the way to go are rather sad. It’s your right to do as you please but just no this, your attitude is not helping the cause or reducing the debt. You say you do but the fact is you JUST DON’T GET IT.
July 23rd, 2010 at 18:30
@RedTan: How dare you!
First of all, if you were a regular, you’d know that I donated a substantial amount of money (what I could afford) to MUST. I write on here and on my blog about my dissatisfaction and I refuse to buy anything licensed by Manchester united as a personal boycott. And I can say with all honesty that if I were a season ticket holder, I would now be categorized as a former season ticket holder. Now as I live in Vancouver Canada, I ask you, what else would you have me do? And I find your questioning my motives and my sincerity very offensive. Especially from somebody who’s haemorrhoids must be hurting from sitting on the fence while Rome burns. It’s more a case of what are you doing newbie. You are new to this blog. Every regular on this blog knows what I have sacrificed and what I have contributed to the cause.
Mine is a miniscule crusade but at least it’s an effort I am making to show my displeasure, horror and exasperation over what is happening to a team I have supported for over 35 years. So let me turn the tables on you mate and ask you what you have been doing? Hell let me answer that for you. Sweet fuck all. How do I know that? It comes out in your attitude towards me and others who aren’t fence sitters and who have no activist tendencies in their hearts and souls. Just let the fucking team crash and burn while you sit there and get your daily fix of the garbage that is being shovelled at you on a daily basis by Fergie and the rest of the OT faithful. And you question me? That’s rich mate, not to mention blatantly ignorant and awfully presumptuous
July 23rd, 2010 at 18:40
@[OPTI]Madschester United: A revolt that leads to massive boycotts and thousands of empty seats is an untenable business model that needs to be sold before it’s too late. Glazer’s are not stupid. They don’t have to live in Manchester to feel a mighty collapse of their empire. A revolt led by Fergie, the Red Knights and all MUST members and other anti-Glazer supporters would force their hand. Empty stadiums tend to do that but they also send a message to the business world the Glazer’s play in that these are not people to do business with. So selling is vital to them then as they need to rid themselves of that kind of truly negative publicity.
Ah Christ mate, at least i am trying to come up with solutions rtather than just sit on the fence like so many choking my chicken and waiting for the good times to return. I am proactive by nature and I don’t sit back and wait for change, I contribute to it, in my own small way. I was part of the WTO revolts both in Vancouver and Seattle in the early 90’s because I disagreed with their policies. Fortunately I wasn’t arrested but the fact remains, I am a rebel but i am a rebel with a cause. And you can be with me or against me, either way, I will continue to spread my word (or poison as you see it) because I can not sit idly by and watch my team destroy itself from within. You don’t have to agree with me but at least respect my right to do so.
July 23rd, 2010 at 18:42
@[OPTI]Madschester United: I am not about caring about this team’s immediate success on the pitch. I could care less. It’s about saving this club from total ruin. Something so many are just missing despite my countless attempts to educate them on the realities. Quick fixes are no way to solve this team’s greatest problem which is the owners and the debt. And you think I care about the fucking games mate? I could care less as this season means nothing in regards to the big picture.
July 23rd, 2010 at 20:07
The present attitude and BS coming out of OT these days has made cynics out many of us. I’m not sure I can ever really believe anything they say anymore. Take for example the news today that Vidic has “VERBALLY AGREED” to a contract extension and a 90k salary per week. Sounds great doesn’t it? What a relief. but what if it’s all just BS?
What if all this of this is just nothing more than a PR ploy by Gill to make United look like the good guys when it seems that Vidic went against his word and demanded a transfer to Madrid? If that is the scenario that plays itself out then United look the good guys in this and their plan to make Vidic look the traitor and villain has worked like a charm. Lets just say I don’t believe a word coming out of the mouths of Gill or Fergie anymore until I see Vidic sign on the dotted line. Until then I assume he will be going to play for Mourinho at Real Madrid. Sure I am being negative, cynical and pessimistic and that’s exactly the kind of animal that is being created by Manchester united management these days.
I as well as many others have been conditioned to mistrust and not believe anything that the club says anymore. We’ve been burned and hoodwinked before. I refuse to buy in to the statements of liars, even if they once in a while tell the truth. What a great climate for fan support this club has achieved and created. They have mastered the art of taking the fun and joy out of good news because many of us are wondering what the catch is or what the angle is.
July 23rd, 2010 at 20:12
@Grognard: This is my theory on Vidic: the reason the club and he has extended his contract from 2012 to 2014 is to ensure his resale value doesn’t go down. If not this summer, I am pretty sure he’s leaving next season.
July 23rd, 2010 at 20:36
@RedTan: Maybe calling ferguson a senile old twat was wrong of me. Maybe something like “traitorous backstabbing lying old twat” sums him up better, because senile isnt the word for him as senility isnt the reason he has sided with the glazers and spit in the fans faces.
July 23rd, 2010 at 20:49
@CraigMc: Too right i am mate. Good to see you back by the way.
July 23rd, 2010 at 21:00
@Grognard: Comment 69, amen to that brother. Beautifully put mate, im glad atleast there is someone else who feels the same way as me on the subject of boycott, fergies inactions against the glazers and all things united and ferguson.
Also my respect goes out to you aswell mate for donating your hard earned cash to MUST to support the cause. I also made a donation via their website. It wasnt much but it was as much as i could afford right now, and i guess every little helps. I just hope your contribution and mine and the 4,000+ brave soles who made a stand one day see their decision to protest was not in vain.
July 23rd, 2010 at 21:04
@AndyCR7: I wont be celebrating until i see it in black and white that vidic has announced himself hes signing a new contract. I wouldnt trust a traitorous bastard like gill as far as i could bloody throw him. Good news though if its true, but ill wait until i hear from vida before i am happy.
July 23rd, 2010 at 21:12
@[OPTI]Madschester United: Mate i can promise you if fergie came out and told the world exactly what the glazers were like, the stadium would be empty, im 100% sure of that.
Even if we still had idiotic day trippers who still wanted to come in and watch they would probably get rumbled outside the stadium by the other fans, because they would be judged unloyal anyway for not listening to the manager.
At the end of the day it wouldnt matter if they sacked fergie, the truth would be out anyway and the world of football would be fully behind the supporters and the manager. Hell if the glazers sacked him, it would just play into our hands even more.
I just dont see how the glazers could hold out for long with the stadium empty. I would give them a few weeks, they would put the club up for sale, and we could get a takeover and start again.
But theres no point in discussing it really. Fergie has picked his side and got into bed with the devil. As far as im concerned hes pissed in my face for the last bloody time, and ive seen him for who he is.
For that i will not apologise when i go into one and the insults come out. Compared to what hes done to us fans, a few insults hurled his way is nothing.
July 23rd, 2010 at 23:01
@tonymontanna4united:
1. RedKnight are pussies and have been scared off by the Glazers — where are they now?
2. With all this Red and Gold campaign and unrest from supporters, I was shocked to see that only 4000 season tickets were abandoned — I am sure I saw more than 4000 red and gold scarves. Fergie leaving riding the media wave of disgust against the Glazers would drop attendance to maybe 50K — thats what we have at crap carling cup games.
3. Why not riot now? Glazers are bleeding us dry whether Fergie says so or not. Please bring on a riot and empty the stadium. The Glazers would hate that equally with and without Fergie around.
Fergie is doing what is best for the club — keep the team on top amidst a financial crisis and shortage of transfer funds.
July 23rd, 2010 at 23:10
Here is an article that makes TWO huge mistakes but is otherwise worthy of OPTI praise:
Mistakes:
1. Rich dividends and preseason are oxymorons regarding Berba — you’ll surely agree with me there.
2. Our midfield is weak yet author glances over that with high hopes of super season from Carrick, Anderson, and Scholes while neglecting Hargo’s pending retirement party — you’ll probably agree here as well.
Other than that i agree with his stands on GK, Def, and Attack. Rant on!
http://www.epltalk.com/current-man-united-squad-is-good-enough-no-need-to-buy/22468
July 24th, 2010 at 0:40
@CraigMc: You dont offend me at all, as what you did was agree with me when I repeatedly said united is a business not a football club. I was also going to games in 80s
July 24th, 2010 at 0:41
@tonymontanna4united: no class or respect, I feels sorry for you
July 24th, 2010 at 0:51
@Grognard: rattled your cage did i. I have done plenty on the anti glazer and green and gold front from my manchester base, What I question is why you fail to get it and blame Fergie for every thing. horse spunk aside he has not done much wrong other than being an employee. You have this crazy idea that if he spoke up the premier league, UK government not to mention the EU and the world wide banks would change business laws in order to facilitate geting the Glazers out. he is a football manger and a bloody good one at that end of. He manages a team with the resorces he has.
But the grass is always greener, so who do you think should take over from him and who do you think should play for us when most player desert the sinking ship when Fergie as you want says “we have no money it is all doom”
Love your attack on me, most amusing. The term newbie being used made me so mad I went to bed lol. He is new and he dares to question me onoz
July 24th, 2010 at 1:04
@RedTan: Oh right – but it started like the beginning nineties for me as a nipper, but my family are a whole line of Man United fans. Yeah our club are not really a club anymore as we used to know it!
July 24th, 2010 at 1:05
@[OPTI]Madschester United: 1. The red knights bid was doomed to failure from the start because the glazers were never going to sell, mainly because they would only accept a totally ridiculous offer (my guess upwards of £2bn). And why not, how much cash are they going to take out of this club in the next 10 years? I would bet it will be the usual.
About £10m+, plus the majority of the cash we receive for the sales of any players. Plus the cash from our extra sponsorship deals. How much is this then? It could be anything from £20-50m, but over the next few years that will rise and rise. And when theyve sold all our star names, the naming rights to old trafford and maybe even the stadium then they will contemplate selling. And at that point they may very well get £1bn.
And all of this when they never even used a penny of their own money to buy us. Sad really. But not at all surprising. There was nothing the RKs could do because when the owners knew they were onto too much of a good thing to want to sell. Unless someone made a massive offer which was never going to happen in this current climate.
2. Mate i dont know if you live in england, or indeed manchester. But i can tell you as a born and bred manc ferguson is not just a football manager, he is revered as a god, a man of the people in the red half of manchester. I can assure you if ferguson was to go to the worlds media and say “the glazers are bleeding us dry”, there would be absolutely no where near 50,000 people attending the games and this is what you and others dont understand.
People take notice of ferguson. The man is the godfather of football, and has more power in his little finger than the rest of the premier leagues managers by far. If he kicked up a stink the world would listen.
Hell the players would listen. Do you think the likes of fletcher, giggs, scholes, o’shea, neville would even think of playing for the team again. The oldies control the dressing room, they would back their manager, and soon the players would strike, probably like the france world cup situation but worse.
But they arent the main people in this. The fans would listen if their manager declared a state of emergency. I dont know if you ever saw the footage but the day the glazers bought the club, and came to tour the stadium there were riots outside old trafford. The glazers had to be driven out in the back of a police van for their own safety.
Now do you think if our manager came out and confirmed the fans fears, things wouldnt kick off again. Of course they would, the fans just simply wouldnt turn up.
Anyone that did would probably have to have police usher them in for security reasons. I think you under estimate the power of the common fan mate. The fact is fergie could bring the glazers regime crashing down within a matter of weeks.
But hey lets go along the dooms day idea. Some players get restless and want to leave, the fans boycott, the club suffers. It is short term pain for long term gain.
I just dont understand why the fans cant see this. There is no bloody future with the glazers in charge, so if it means a few players kick up a fuss and leave to get this plan rolling then so be it. The club can start again and move in the right direction for a change under new ownership.
3. People like you and me and a large maority can see the glazers are bleeding us dry, but some people are retarded and refuse to see how off field matters affect us on the field so stand back and ignore this whole thing.
If ferguson spoke out it would get those morons off their ass and unite the fans as one. You would be very surprised mate to read alot of the fans still dont have a problem with the glazers. Its maybe 70:30 against the glazers, but we need something that will get every bloody fan in britian and in most of the whole off their ass and boycotting merchandise as well as tickets.
Ferguson is the only man who has the power to do that which is my point.
July 24th, 2010 at 1:07
@[OPTI]Madschester United: Yeah but those 4000 had the balls to follow through on their not giving any more money to the Glazers stance. The weak balled ones copped out – they couldn’t cut it in the end!
July 24th, 2010 at 1:19
@CraigMc: it was a bold and goodminded effort but it was doomed to fail, there were always going to be scabs in the seats that left.
it did send a message though. i just dont think well see the back of the glazers till someone puts up stupid money for the club and there is no guarantee that they will be better for the club than glazers.
It would be awesome if someone came in with a offer to buy a minority share for 600-700m and knocked out the debt and in that had a small stake for fans that wanted a vote or two in the boardroom.
untill were rich eh…
July 24th, 2010 at 1:20
@[OPTI]Madschester United:
“Fergie is doing what is best for the club — keep the team on top amidst a financial crisis and shortage of transfer funds”.
Ok thats all well and good but what happens when ferguson retires huh, what then?
Let me say this, ferguson is not going to be here forever. He has maybe 3 years left in charge, but this is my whole bloody point. Short term maybe things arent so so bad, but what about long term. What happens in 3 years when giggs, scholes, neville, and edwin need replacing. Or if rooney decides hes had enough and wants to leave and we need some major transfer funds to build the team again?
If they didnt give ferguson that cash, why is the next manager going to be supported huh.
But even worse than on field matters i worry about off the pitch. If the glazers are pinching money off us now with ferguson in charge, then what the hell are they going to do to the club when hes gone and we have say moyes in charge (forget jose he wont join with us in our current state).
You see its all very well to say ferguson isnt concentrating with events off the pitch because he wants to keep us winning off it, but that is only a short term solution.
Maybe if the manager was in his 50s it would work, but the fact is he is very close to retirement, and his obsession with winning just a few more trophies is blinding him to our long term plight.
But hey maybe some fans will say everything is ok now, its not that bad. This is where they miss the entire fucking point.
In their current state the glazers will take this club a fucking part when ferguson steps aside. I mean for gods sake they are practically raping this club now with ferguson around, what are they going to do when hes gone.
Im sorry but this is why i get so abusive towards the manager. He is not looking at the big picture. There is a very real possibility once he leaves this whole pack of cards coming tumbling down. People are thinking we are in the shits now, well the one man that has kept us even in spitting distance of the titles and from going bust down the crapper is ferguson.
He has kept it all together as best he could, because he refuses to speak out against the glazers and thinks its best to go along with the business as usual line. Now i think thats wrong and he should speak out, he is doing nothing but harm by ignoring the situation and praising the owners to the media.
He can say its business as usual all he wants, and short term it probably is. We will still be in contention for the premiership maybe (the competition is awful this year) and the domestic cups, and with a bit of luck might do well in europe.
But so what. So what if we win 3 prem titles in a row and top that up by winning a champions league and a few domestic cups. It doesnt take away from the fact that this club is in the shits and will only get worse once ferguson departs.
But he fails to see this, he just fails to see the big bloody picture as do most fans and that is why we will be in the absolute shits, 10 times worse than it is now in a few years time when the manager steps down, and sadly he nor a large majority of the fans around the world can see that.
July 24th, 2010 at 1:33
@RedTan: I think youve addressed this to the wrong person my friend, think it should say “to Mr Alex Ferguson” in front of the no class or respect comment, because he is the man that has had no class and absolutely not a bloody drop of respect for the supporters for a long time now. Sadly some people like yourself just dont see that, and for that i pity you. I think in a few years time when we see the real damage the glazers have done to this club, and the manager is out of the picture sunbathing in france you will be sitting there wishing saint ferguson had had the balls to say what the majority of us fans have wanted him to say for years now.
So in response to your comment, why should i show any class and respect to a man that has spit in the common fans face. That has got into bed with the devil, and publically supported them. Why do pro glazer supporters get such a rough ride and yet the biggest pro glazer idiot is our own manager, and he gets totally let off because of what he has done in the past.
But still i make this clear to people like you once and for all. I have respect for ferguson the manager and what he does on the pitch, but ferguson the person is a right bloody two faced idiot and i make no apologies for saying that. Compared to what ferguson has done to the common fan, my few swear words at him are nothing more than he deseerves, but some fans will just never see past what they want to believe. They dont see that while the ferguson on the pitch is a genius, the ferguson off the pitch is a right bloody two faced bastard, and a bastard that has shown his back to the fans, and deserves nothing but negative comments against him.
Its my opinion and one i am entitled to, and one i believe i correct. I have seen what ferguson the person is really like, and if you want to still support him whilst he continues to praise the devil and let them pillage and rape our club while he sits back and does nothing, then my friend it is i who feels sorry for you.
July 24th, 2010 at 1:38
@CraigMc: Exactly mate, my respect goes out to those 4,000 people who did the right thing and gave up something they loved because they wanted to make a stand, and were sick and tired of these cunts destorying our club. Respect to everyone who is making a stand, if not with season tickets then with merchandise. Its going to be a long haul if we are to succeed in winning the club back, but all i know is the scabs that were all to happy to take someone elses tickets are complete utter bastards, and are only playing a part in destroying the club further.
July 24th, 2010 at 1:44
@gator: The glazers need 76k sell out crowds each and every week to make any sort of profit for themselves. Now that 4,000 empty seats might only become 2,000 in a few weeks time but its still 2000 people who had enough. And if next season we fall further away from the league, and go down the “no value” and “the squad is good enough as it is” route then even more people will give up their seat.
It is going to be slow but we all knew this was going to be a long haul, in the end though i am positive even the optimists and the sheeple will finally have enough and do the right thing and boycott until the glazers are gone.
Because as i have said time and time again there is no long term future with the glazers in charge, and once ferguson leaves in 2-3 years things will only get worse. So if it means 1 year of empty stadiums (im sure it would be less than that) to make them sell then so be it. I would still be here supporting the team, just i would be a whole lot happier because i would know we actually have a future now to look forward to, even if it took a few years to get us back to where we once were.
I think some of these fans fail to see just how badly up shit creek we really are with a future of the glazers to look forward to. For some i guess it will only be when its too late they make a stand.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:04
@Red Ranter: Good point. He could still go this summer but the asking price just went up 50%.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:05
@tonymontanna4united: Beautiful mate, BEAUTIFUL.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:09
@tonymontanna4united: Word for daytripper fans is SCABS. You know what unions do to them. Well United supporters are a union and so SCABS MUST DIE!
July 24th, 2010 at 3:15
@[OPTI]Madschester United: 4000 season ticket holders is a lot of money out of the Glazer’s pockets and that number will continue to grow every season Glazer is still around. The National Socialist Democratic Party (NAZI PARTY) also started with a few dozen supporters when they decided to make Hitler their leader and voice. We all know how fast and how big that party grew to with word of mouth and growing discontent amongst Germans towards the old republic. In no way am I comparing policies with the two. I am just showing that the largest movements and protests grow out of a few committed individuals who believe in a cause and are courageous enough to make a sacrifice and to give of their time effort and intellect. So make fun of them but lets face it mate, they did a Hell of a lot more than you did. Even I and I at least donated my money to MUST. You are either with the cause or you are part of the problem.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:19
@RedTan: I think youneed to relax and shut it with the personal jabs mate. This blog is about making our feelings known and debating them, not messing around with people by insulting their views. He can call Fergie or anyone involved with the team any fucking thing he feels like calling him. He has the freedom and right to express his opinion and you are not the thought police or the politically correct right telling him he can’t. Disagree all you want and express your views which you have and which we respect but disagree with. Just keep from getting personal. Fergie is considered public domain on here and is free for all kinds of written abuse. If you have a problem with that go to the censored United pages where everybody acts like Glazer lapdog kissing Fergie’s ass and seeing no wrong.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:19
@tonymontanna4united: Lets remember that this, for most, is suppose to be a R&R activity and not a political pursuit or a extention of their everyday work week.
It’s very unlikely that the stadium will empty out as long as United is winning – and this is something we all want,… right?
If and, perhaps when, this team starts to stink up the place, the enjoyment will cease, and the need to spend money on it will become compromised.
With the lack of new signings and the current policy of trying to make do with the young-ens and the oldies, that scenario is not that far-fetched.
Fans are fans, are fans. They are fickle and they are mostly ignorant to the realities of what goes on in a club. They don’t want to trouble themselves with the details – they just want to cheer on a winning team.
Don’t be surprised by the current lack of commitment to our future – Oh, and don’t be surprised when they stay away in droves, when the team struggles.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:22
@RedTan: No mate, it is you that doesn’t get it. Forgive me if I just shit on your viewpoint because you are out to lunch on all this and I for one don’t appreciate being baited into an argument. I congratulate you for also donating of your hard earned money to the cause but now you must actually consider what your cause is? If your cause is anti-Glazer, then you are against Fergie because Fergie is against you. I mean mate, how stupid can you get? SERIOUSLY
July 24th, 2010 at 3:27
@RedTan: Who do you think should take over for him? Obviously a newbie on here because every regular on this blog knows the man I want is Mourinho. But I also have pointed out many times that I want Fergie to stay on with the club as manager for as long as the Glazer’s around. A shakeup while Glazer is running things is tantamount to a complete disaster. My complaint is not with Fergie as a manager of this team, it’s as a person and as a man with honesty and integrity. His alliance with the owners is what makes me hate his guts when once I loved the man from a distance. I feel completely betrayed by him and i want him out but I can wait until new owners show up and clean house. Then I’d love to see him get what he deserves. A nice boot shined up real good, turned sideways and rammed up his candy ass. But for now I am patient. Still, doesn’t mean i have to like all his Glazerisms.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:29
@Grognard: NO GROGNARD, being anti-Glazer does not mean mean being anti-Ferguson.
Too simplistic, too ill-logical, and too Grognard crazy!!
July 24th, 2010 at 3:30
@tonymontanna4united: It’s like we are speaking to a legion of muppets mate. It’s like trying to find a moral and unselfish Republican that doesn’t live the life of a hypocrite. FUCK sometimes I just hate ignorance and stupidity.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:31
@tonymontanna4united: United fans are not UNITED.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:34
@tonymontanna4united: NO CLASS RED NOSED BASTARD FARTBAG. AKA “Typical Fergie”
July 24th, 2010 at 3:40
@Redrich: YESSSSS REDRICH. Sorry I disagree. My long long rants are far from illogical and they bring up strong and very valid points as well as evidence to show his complicity in all this. So back at you mate. I’m sick and fucking tired of you referring to the most literate and scholastic of all these members as illogical. Consider that as arrogant as you like. I speak the truth. Educate intelligent people don’t like to be referred to as simplistic, illogical and crazy when they bring up very strong and passionate points. Even if they do so with a little venom and anger. You don’t agree, fine mate, I respect that. Leave it at that and spare me the insults OK. The two things I am not are simplistic and illogical. Crazy I grant you that as I tend to go a little ballistic from time to time, but never ever question my intelligence. That is when I no longer respect you or respect your viewpoint. And as of right now, I may be disagreeing with you a lot but i have always considered you intelligent and respectful of others. So turning on me like this is pissing me off and is not appreciated especially since your views on my beliefs stink of bullshit and pent up animosity. I expect more from you.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:41
@Grognard: Very thoughtful of you, mate. Seems like you have devolved into a childhood rant worthy of a 5 year old.
I’m sure that when things start not to go your way, you’ll take your ‘puter and go play on another blog.
BOO HOO HOO.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:47
@Redrich: R&R?
This club is an addiction and a way of life for many. It’s staple and a needed escape from the pressures and realities of life. This club has history and pedigree and has made all of us proud. Proud enough to fight for it’s right to survive. Who fuck cares if this club wins this season? I care if it’s in the prem five seasons from now. Jeez Red an intelligent person like you should be a little more on the ball when it comes to the ramifications of what Glazer is doing to this team. An my bitch with Fergie is he’s letting him do it as long as he can stick around and win #19. Now how fucking pathetic is that id the team collapses like Leeds Utd. in 3 to 5 years? Some of you people are clueless when it comes to the machinations of big business, especially big business run by greedy manipulative Americans. Just gobsmacked by your denial and naiveté. 
July 24th, 2010 at 3:49
@tonymontanna4united: 40% of match-day revenue come from executive seating plans, which constitute 11% of all OT capacity (8,500 premium seats) — if you wanna hit Glazers pockets, stop the executive seating. 4000 general seats is pennies to the glazers… especially since turnover has increased in the past year. LINKY. Most of the increase in turnover is from commercial and TV revenue, which the fans have little impact upon. Without a reliable Red Knights backing the fan-group MUST, the Glazers have nothing to fear and no reason to sell.
Btw, isn’t it entirely possible that Fergie signed a non-disclosure agreement with Glazers when they took over? They must have him by the balls or maybe their business practice is not so bad. Another thing to ponder, with all the United folks employed (coaches, maintenance, accountants, etc) and so on, how come no one comes out as our Deepthroat informant and leaks to the press? Surely, rape and pillaging of the club must be leaked… unless it is not so bad from a business sense.
We all must realize that none of us are financial experts – we wouldn’t be ranting if we were – even less an expert in global footynomics…. I trust Fergie over any of us, even RR (no offense). At least he has been a manager for 25+ years and run his horse-business for a good many years. Don’t forget that the main negative news about the Glazer regime has come from the cowardly lions of the Red Knights who obviously need to spread fear in the fan henhouse to cause trouble to Glazer regime…
I am sure if the sky was falling, Fergie would be screaming for the Glazers’ heads… until then I support Fergie and the team and hope we get our 19th title this season to knock Liverpool of their fu**ing perch!
July 24th, 2010 at 3:50
@Redrich: Stop sounding like a condescending goon who thinks he knows better than others and actually practice a little of what you preach. Did I start name calling and insults with you? So who the fuck is the baby? Fucking grow up, act your fucking age and act like gentleman when people challenge your beliefs. You are not right all the time. Neither am I. But we have a right to voice our beliefs without others making fun of us or insulting us. Take it like man or piss off.
You just got a little too personal with that fucking bullshit.
July 24th, 2010 at 3:55
@Redrich: I agree that anti-Glazers does not equal anti-Fergie. Would you guys even dislike the Glazer’s if they did not bring the enormous debt?
July 24th, 2010 at 3:58
@Grognard: @Grognard: You just insulted RedTan here, and then claim that no one should insult any poster? I am sure RedRanter will deal with any insults properly albeit with delay. Just relax everyone… don’t let the Glazer’s dark side get the better of you all… it’s the Glazers, not us!
July 24th, 2010 at 4:02
@Grognard: I care that they win, this season and all seasons, I care that I enjoy my United experience and I care that a pompous Canadian is trying to destroy the legacy of a true Footballing great.
Get a real argument, get a real life!!
July 24th, 2010 at 4:39
@Grognard: I completely understand that I don’t get what you are going through because I have not been a supporter for as long as you have, not watched games at OT or have the opportunity to experience the United atmosphere in any way! You are very right in saying that if i do contribute in the present circumstances, I will only be helping the C****. But you need to understand that sometimes football fans are short sighted, I am just expressing my feelings about having a chance to watch them live and forgive me if the elation overshadowed the surrounding circumstances
! Either ways this argument is too theoretical because by the time I am in a position to be there to watch a game, Fergie would have retired and I’ll be walking in to a Post-Glazer catastrophe. All I can do from here is promise not to buy any official merchandise and sign up for any campaign to get rid of the cancer! But FFS leave Fergie out of this, the only reason you have anything to be proud of about the club has been thanks to him over the last two decades!
July 24th, 2010 at 4:40
@Grognard: Don’t give me this gentleman, bullshit. You want to take off gloves – lets do it!
Always finding a sly angle for your argument, eh?
Frankly, I don’t see anything that you say as a genuine comment anymore, mate, it’s all become a justification of a previous mis-calculated thought. It happens time and time again, until you are really just arguing nonsense with yourself.
Carry on, by all means, you have the right to free speech. However the rhetoric has become deafening, and I can’t hear you anymore!!
July 24th, 2010 at 4:52
And Grognard mate, there is no need to get so peeved at everything that goes against your “logic”. If I bought one of the disowned tickets, i would be a scab and by extension i should DIE. I have my reasons about wanting to watch the team play and if they don’t agree with yours, tough luck, there is no need to get abusive. I am no brown noser and just love watching the team on the pitch play good football. Maybe my IQ, or lack of it as you insist does not allow me to understand the finer nuances of finances and politics, but I know when there is redirected rage. If you have a problem with the Glazers that you would like to settle physically, you know where to go. Just don’t get ticked off at everyone who disagrees with your viewpoint.
July 24th, 2010 at 5:17
@elvido: With United in USA it really is the only chance I would EVER get to watch Scholes, Giggsy, and Fergie live and in action but I decided to not shell out 130 dollars per ticket for my brother and I and to watch them on telly. I have to admit that 130 is too much for preseason but it hurts to be so close to them, yet they might as well be in China as the experience is the same on TV.
I don’t hate you for buying tickets for a game when you buy no Merchandise from the SuperStore and are not a season ticket holder… if I was rich, I would fly across the Atlantic and get my brother, wife, and I some decent seats (near the Sikh fans
) and enjoy Scholes, Giggs, and Fergie in action before they retire. Good luck at the game, I surely will be watching it…
July 24th, 2010 at 5:45
PS: Shitty lost today in their preseason friendly to Sporting Lisbon …. 2-0. Yannick Djalo scoring some nice goals.
July 24th, 2010 at 7:07
@Redrich: Oh spare me with such melodramatic diarrhea. That’s even beneath you. Fucking pathetic. That’s the best you can do?
July 24th, 2010 at 7:11
@elvido: I understand that mate but as a fan of this club for 35 years you have to forgive me if I am not as tolerant of the short term or short sighted fix. I may not be around in 35 years from now but I would hope and pray this team’s legacy is still as great and that the next 35 years are not spent in some football purgatory that was brought on by the Glazer’s short sighted fans who never had the strength to stay away for the good of the team. Do what you want mate but I personally hope you dig deep and find the strength to say no to Glazer in the only way you can, denying them money.
July 24th, 2010 at 7:12
@Grognard: I think you have no idea, do you??
July 24th, 2010 at 7:27
@Redrich: Like I said earlier, spare me. You have nothing to say except put me down and you can’t even make a valid argument against my thinking anymore because you are so full anger vitriol. You are nothing but jealous bitter and lethargic old fart who has no passion for the fight and who likes to attack Glazer by punching the air in front of him. You may sick you pathetic hypocritical coward. At least I have the balls and courage to come on here and speak my mind whether you agree with it or not. You can’t even come up with a paragraph anymore to defend you stance against me. All that comes from your sad brain is poison comments designed to insult me and put down my considerably higher intellect (and I really don’t care right now if that comes across as arrogant or conceited).
To think I once actually considered you one of the brighter contributors on this blog and a voice of reason. Now your reason for speaking is beyond me. You have nothing to say other than Grognard is crazy, Grognard is simplistic and Grognard is illogical. YAH RIGHT! Even my hardest critics can see through that bullshit and see that you aren’t Mr. Spock when it comes to wisdom and logic mate and you have nowhere near the intellectual capacity to get into a war of words with me. Shut you pie hole and know your fucking role as the Granddaddy of this blog who comes up with a wise old quips once in a while that we find humorous. As far as offering more than that, you are overrated and uninspiring so watch who you put down mate because as much as I have enemies on this blog, I also have supporters and those supporters sure know the difference between my logical, intelligent and complex arguments and you nasty, hateful and bitter attempts to silence me. News for you asshole, you failed. So get in line with the others on here who hate my guts and do us all a favour. Ignore me and i’ll do the same to you. As far as you are concerned, that won’t be to difficult. Have a nice day.
July 24th, 2010 at 7:28
@Redrich: You would know all about being a clueless wonder and a pillock of society.
July 24th, 2010 at 7:47
@Grognard: @Grognard: You are dead to me, mate. A plonker of the first order who has the gall to besmirch a United legend with lies, suspicion and fantasy.
Everything about you is a subjective supposition that never can never stand on its own feet. Great at making up lies, but lacking when it comes to predicting the truth.
You are a sham and a phony, you seem to rely upon negative vibes for your impetus, and a young willing audience to swallow your distasteful medicine.
You are part of problem – certainly not part of the solution!!
July 24th, 2010 at 7:51
@Redrich: You know what your main problem is dumbass? You don’t know when you are overmatched. Secondly, you infringe on my most righteous of rights. My freedom of speech and my freedom to express my feelings about something that is dear to me. Whether you agree with me or not doesn’t mean a flying fuck to me asshole. What matters to me is that I speak my mind and tell it as I see it for THOSE WHO WANT TO READ IT. Again I repeat, FOR THOSE WHO WANT TO READ IT. For numpties, pacifists, pussies, ignorant morons and idiots I would suggest to just avoid me like the plague. Why is that so hard for you to register in your Pinky sized rodent brain?
You have no fucking respect for Red Ranter or the purpose of this blog which is to allow people the right to RANT and speak their mind about Manchester United. Who the fuck made you Head Groundskeeper and top kopper? Fuck you and the horse you rode in on you sycophantic control freak. You are not in charge here and you do not make the rules on this blog nor have the right to tell people what they can and cannot say.
What you can do in a civilized manner(not me at this present time) is disagree with comments and be polite about it. Did I have problem the other day when RedFan skewered my point of view? No, because he did it with control and lacked the insults and putdowns that he later used today. Oh well, he tried and I applaud him for that. I realize that I am not everyone’s cup of tea, but that does not mean I should not have the right to speak my mind. I only get abusive like I am now when people insult me first. This isn’t some cheerio, goody two shoes I love United no matter what blog. If you need that kind sweetness may I suggest a gallon of sucrose ingested quickly or google the official Man Utd website.
I speak my mind and from where I am standing I feel I speak the truth. And i admit that times I can be wrong and go overboard. But that is my right and you and everyone else on here has the right to do the same thing. I’ll be damned if I allow a no action, sad sack conformist hypocrite like you to stop me. One day you are echoing my exact feelings and the next day your Dementia or bipolar disorder kicks in and you have a problem with the same things you agreed with or were spouting the other day. Seriously, check with your doctor about your meds. I swear to God you are Schizo or an ugly bitter undersexed woman. Which RedRich will show up today? The pro-Grognard/anti-Glazer one or the Anti-Grognard one? Make up your mind you confused little man.
July 24th, 2010 at 7:55
@Redrich: And as usual you support your accusation with vitriol and childish one liners. Please mate, Go fucking take a long walk of a long pier. Fuck you and the shemale you rode in on. You were dead to me a long time ago. In fact your probably close to death anyway because you sound like a senile old man. No wonder you support Fergie. The two of you deserve each other.
Consider this our final chapter. I’m done with you. Feel free to have the last word. I really don’t care and above all, I’m not exactly expecting Shakespeare or anything with wit or cunning parody. Hey, but knock yourself out trying OK Red. Sayonara.
July 24th, 2010 at 8:05
@Grognard: Bite me!!
July 24th, 2010 at 9:20
Grog- if you dish it out,you gotta take it as well mate…
July 24th, 2010 at 9:30
Wow! “It’s like watching Oscar Wilde and Noël Coward in the third grade.” to borrow a quote. If someone did read this blog, you wouldn’t know that we all in fact are passionate supporters of the same club!
July 24th, 2010 at 9:32
I was wondering how many of the regulars here have season tickets and how many of them have given it up Pro-Glazers. I am not looking to start another pecking contest, this is just old fashioned curiosity…. Either ways good for you, as long as we all agree that we love United to death!
July 24th, 2010 at 9:34
sorry “post-glazers”* not pro…
July 24th, 2010 at 10:11
The Vidic contract is a classic Ronaldo. Didn’t we extend his contract the season before he left? Oh well I hope we do not sell Vidic for a penny less than £30 million.
The Glazer-Ferguson rants are unproductive. Nothing will change anytime soon and nothing you or I can do will make any difference. All we can do is sit back and try and enjoy watching the team play and forget about the unsavoury off the pitch situation. Who knows perhaps with this lack of transfer activity we will see some exciting youngsters come through? Im not betting on it because I think the current crop of youngsters is utter crap but I could be pleasantly surprised.
And at least my favourite trio Nani Valencia and Rooney still form our attack.
July 24th, 2010 at 10:12
Whatever about Welbeck, I don’t think United should sell Macheda. He does have the potential to be class and maybe one we regret if we let go. I’m happy to see Welbeck go as he doesn’t offer us anything different to the strikers we have who, in truth, are better. Happy enough with strike force as a whole. Delighted about Vidic. This was crucial.
July 24th, 2010 at 10:29
Chelsea look like signing Ramires and Luiz for a combined outlay of close to £50 million. So looks like they have a good chance of retaining the title especially if Drogba keeps up his form.
July 24th, 2010 at 10:43
@colver: We nned to invest on the playing staff, as well as move out some the dead wood. We now seem to be more interest in quantity rather than quality which for me is the wrong wat round.
We over rotate due to the size of the squad, also cater somewhat around who we play, Chelsea, Barca ect all had settled sides last season and all were succcesful.
July 24th, 2010 at 10:51
@Tom: They both ideally need to go on a season loan to a premiership club, to really see if either of the can cut it.
I am not a Welbeck fan and feel Macheda last season regressed but if the both went out and and gained experience then next season we would be in a btter position to see if they actually can cut it.
July 24th, 2010 at 11:08
@Grognard: Just out of interest what do you do for a living? It is clear you understand little of business and like many on here have a clear lack of class or respect. It is a shame. As they say “those that argue on the internet, even the winners are losers”
July 24th, 2010 at 11:15
20,000 season tickets to go on open sale. No word on corporate hospitality as of yet but in an economy heading for a double dip recession I would imagine they are down on previous seasons as well.
We are making our voices heard Green and Gold all the way fergie keeps managing, the players keep playing and we will do what we do and some of you transfer Muppet’s can keep on dreaming
Also Vidic has a greed a 90k a week deal according to a Mr D Gill
July 24th, 2010 at 11:19
Yaya Toure has revealed how he snubbed Sir Alex Ferguson and Manchester United to join their arch rivals City
If true I wonder if has anything to do with the 200k a week they are paying the greedy c*nt
July 24th, 2010 at 11:21
oops 4,000 tickets my bad
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1297207/Glazers-urged-quit-Manchester-United-season-ticket-sales-slump.html
July 24th, 2010 at 11:37
With the recent anti Fergie vibe which has been of late he is my take.
I love the manager for everything he has done for the club, he has made Manchester United I am grateful for it. I was still a child when he took over but remember watching us under Atkinson, Terry/Colin Gibson, Alan Brazil lumbering around the pitch then drinking 15 pints of lager in the bars around Manchester after.
Fergie came in changed the entire ethos of the club, stricked diets and got rid of the drinking culture of the club. It did take him time but when we got there we really did arrive and we have maintaned this success for an incredible amount of time, almost unpreidented.
Fergie has done himself also no favours with the supporters with his siding with Glazers and I for one feel this has tarnished his tenure at the club.
But calling “a senile old twat” and words to that affect are totallly out of order, United fans were well known for being respectful, especially to the greatest manager in the modern game. And calling for him to be sacked is also ridiculas and laughable, he will never be dismissed and never should be.
I do understand some fans anger towards Fergie but the real hate should be with the Glazers, I will stand by the manager but not agree with his actions but without him we wuld really be fucked.
July 24th, 2010 at 11:44
@RedTan: Greedy cunt, they are going to have fun with the egos and wages there, serves them right.
July 24th, 2010 at 12:24
4,000 Season tickets on general sale can not be underestimated. We used to have a 60,000 name 10 year wait for a season ticket. That’s a swing of 64,000 against the Glazers Virus! Their plans for the club are based on selling out Old Trafford with season tickets, and upping the prices. That’s the ONLY way they can stay solvent. If shirt sales continue to be non existent in comparison to previous launches they are going to have to start thinking of a point where they call it quits and run like the chickenshit loan sharks they are.
July 24th, 2010 at 12:34
@Traverse: One of those tickets is hopefully my old one!
July 24th, 2010 at 12:53
WOW!!! Long time no comment… glad to see some things haven’t changed, eh groggy?
The glazers have really got to some of us with their vampiric ownership of our club, and for that they deserved to be staked, as well as Fergie, Gill and co who chose to sleep with the devil. However, seeing as the club’s hierarchy have laid their bed, all they can do is try and steer the ship through the storm as well as they can; and that’s by communicating a picture of serenity behind the scenes and ensuring victory on the pitch.
The glazers are a cancer we unfortunately cannot get rid off easily, but what we can do is to support the team, manager and help them continue the winning habits they have cultivated the past few years. Mass protests and vilifications are okay but we have to draw a line when it gets to be detrimental to the teams’ success.
Btw, groggy, on this ‘freedom of speech’ thing you always seem to bring up; doesn’t it work both ways? If you’re free to say what you want/feel, surely someone else is free to say that what ur saying is rubbish/brilliant?
July 24th, 2010 at 15:31
Stephen the problem is that most of the quantity you speak of are youngsters. Off the top of my head the only experienced squad players we have are Berbatov, Park, Anderson (if you are of the opinion he isn’t going to get much better), Brown and O’Shea. While I wouldn’t object to selling Berbatov and Park and Anderson and raising £30 million for a quality midfielder. We need the defenders because we seem plagued each season by defensive injuries.
Personally I think we need to cull the youngsters who aren’t good enough and concentrate our attentions on the few that actually have a chance of breaking through.
July 24th, 2010 at 17:05
@Stephen: Mate the “senile old twat” remark was taken way out of context. I admit i made that comment but at the time i was feeling very heated and frustrated and tbh i am still am at ferguson because i feel 100% he has let the supporters down.
But i will make this clear so that some people can fully understand what i am saying. I am pissed off at ferguson the person. To me ferguson the person is a lying backstabbing bugger who has sided against the supporters and for that he deserves every bit of criticism i and a few others throw at him.
But this is the key point. Whilst i am not very fond of ferguson the person, i still respect ferguson the manager, and this is the difference. I admire everything ferguson has done for this club and all on the pitch matters, because lets face it his record speaks for itself and without him we would not be where we are today.
But there is a difference between what someone is good at and how they are as a person. You can be a great manager, or great footballer or whatever but be a cunt of a person, and in this case it is ferguson the person i am swearing at, putting down, and not as a manager and thats the point that needs to be made so people can see my side.
I am not saying ferguson should get the sack, i am not disputing his record or what he has done for this club, i am just annoyed at how the man off the pitch has done more harm than good by publically siding with the glazers. And for that i feel i am damn well entitled to show a little anger and hostility towards him.
Afterall the man is supporting a family i would say the majority of united fans want gone. He has publically said and i quote “they are great owners” and “i have no problem with them”.
When he says this, he publically supports their regime.
He publically supports
1. The glazers dipping into our transfer funds and using it for themselves
2. Putting season ticket prices up 50% in 5 years pricing a large majority of loyal local united fans from attending games they have been to for many many years.
3. Putting the club anywhere from £700m to £1bn in debt. All of which is money they used to buy us, not a penny that is actually ours.
4. Putting our long term future at risk because the owners he so loyally supports will happily tear this club apart for every penny they can get.
5. Bringing out a new bond issue which states the stadium and training ground can be seized in the event the bond is not successfully paid.
6. Leaving many millions of fans around the world generally worried if they will have a club left to support in 10 years time.
Now thats not opinion there, that is fact. If ferguson so publically supports the glazers, then he supports their regime, and he supports what they have done to the club and what they are doing. If he didnt he would speak out against them wouldnt he?
The truth is the minute ferguson got into bed with glazer he picked his side. There is only them or us and he picked them, and publically supported them. Now i dont know how some of you on here expect people like me to react. Why does ferguson (the person again i have to point out) not deserve atleast some negative criticism against him if he fully supports their plans and what they want to do to the club.
I mean we can all see the glazers are evil, and will happily tear our club apart, so why cant ferguson? Thats the point i make here.
I just think sometimes people think you cant say a bad word against the manager because if you do then your disrespecting all he has done for us on the pitch. Once again i say to those people, there is a big difference here between slating ferguson the manager and ferguson the person. I hope i have made some of you see that with this post.
Sorry for going on but i think this point needed to be made, to show i am not disrespecting ferguson the way some people think i am.
July 24th, 2010 at 17:10
@Jeet: I agree. And I can take it. But it’s how you define dishing it out. I have no problem with people who disagree with me or who challenge me. I just get very upset and strike back viciously to those who get personal and start slinging insults. That’s when I break the rules. RedRich and I got along very well on this blog for a very long time before he grew a vagina and started PMSing all over this blog. When people get personal with me they break a cardinal rule of this blog and and they strip all of us of the right to speak freely about anything to do with Man Utd. Thought police are the pricks of the internet mate and one should be much more worried about them than me.
When you get ass clowns on here telling you you have no right to put down a player or insult Fergie, then you get fascist little Austrian corporals thinking it’s their duty in life to protect the likes of Fergie (who needs no protecting from the likes of fandom) from the likes of me. Which of course is totally ridiculous. To those who cannot handle what I write, I suggest ignoring me. I’m not looking to make friends (although I appreciate the ones I have both on and offline). I am on a crusade spreading my word of revolt against the Glazer’s and all their minions. For some people the presence of Fergie on that list is hard to take or just plain intolerable. Well it’s even harder for me to take but it’s hard to go against the evidence that he keeps presenting us. Yet some on here feel he deserves a free pass for his treachery. I don’t see it that way. For me he is guilty as sin and the worst kind of traitor. The kind we all trusted, looked up to and admired for lifting this team out of the quagmire of the mid 80’s and back to the top of the pack for twenty odd years.
It’s tough to turn on a man who has done what he has done. But look at the facts and you will see that all through the fans revolt and green and gold campaign as well as the initial fan breakaway from the club when Glazer’s first took over, he was always siding with his American bosses. His actions in the transfer market and his petulance towards fans through the media have all shown us his true colours and his allegiance. But some on here will have you believe that I am the enemy for indicating or pointing out all this misdemeanours or actual crimes. They would accuse me of blasphemy and actually challenge my allegiance to United, as if I wouldn’t prefer Fergie being on our side and coming out against the Glazer’s for their extortionist policies and actions against the better interests of this club. Fact is he hasn’t and he has sided time after time with the Glazer’s questioning us and claiming that he cannot understand why fans are so against owners who let him do his job without interference. Who the Hell is he kidding mate? The fact people can be so stupid and ignorant over the facts is amazing to me. But then again an entire nation of over 300 million people voted for George W. Bush not once but twice. And after he destroyed the country’s soul and moral fibre not to mention it’s economy his followers today are looking to lay the blame on his successor.
I plead to you and to all of you to just look at the facts. Forget what you may think of me and how I deliver the message. Look at the facts and you will see owners who are extortionists stealing from this club in the and money is leaving this club in a similar manner and speed as oil is leaking out in into the Gulf of Mexico. Look at the actions and inactions of both Ferguson and Gill and their constant lies to us over their lack of spending as well as their contempt towards the Red Knights and the green and gold campaign. Ask yourself why they would want to ally themselves with owners who have created such a growing debt and why they don’t challenge them over their failing business model and plan for this club? As far as I can see it’s because they are in total support of the Glazer’s or that they are naive complete morons incapable of understanding the most basic of business concepts or con jobs. But some on here would have you believe I am the enemy.
July 24th, 2010 at 17:12
@elvido: Try telling my opponent that. He has gone as far as to challenge my allegiance and call me a traitor for exposing the truth. And if it’s not true then Fergie, Gill and company have some serious explaining to do, don’t you think?
July 24th, 2010 at 17:14
@elvido: I love United to the death but I also will fight for it against the corrupt overlords who are running it now. If that means going against a legend who looks to have turned on everything he has built and all those who bowed to him like a God for 25 years, then so be it.
July 24th, 2010 at 17:15
@colver: Last season’s defensive problems were somewhat unprecedented, we have O’Shea, Brown, Rio, Evans, Fabio, Rafael, Rio, Vida, Smalling, G Red, Evra and De Laet which amount to twelve first team defenders for me that far too many.
Up front we have Rooney, Welbeck, Owen, Berba, Macheda, Hernandez and Diouf which again amount to seven strikers sometimes for one spot.
Where we lack is in the centre of the park, Carrick has ability but no agression and if he were Spanish he would probably be in their national side, Anderson is awful, Fletch is a great lad but far from World Class and Scholes is no getting any younger, I will not count Hargo.
In short we are well stocked in many departments but in the engine room we do not have enough gas, and this is where we will fall short, sell Berba, O’Shea, Diouf, Obertan, maybe Wes and as a Manc that is hard to say, Welbeck and lets bring in two top centre mids, this is sensible business for me. I heard Villa will try and buy Flamini for £4m, jeez that is a steal for me and would make a massive difference to us, we could get that for Welbeck or even O’Shea.
July 24th, 2010 at 17:17
@colver: That’s exactly what it is. It’s designed to get more value out of him for a sale. Red Ranter hit it right on the nail. I still se him going this summer but for 50% more than what he was originally going for. It’s actually a smart piece of business for United and would be great if we knew that any money coming from a sale went back to buying players. But we all know from the Ronaldo fiasco what happens to any money that comes in from player sales.
July 24th, 2010 at 17:23
@RedTan: To quote my former friend RedRich, “BITE ME”
asshole. I gave you respect and credit the first time you replied to me because you kept it clean and cordial. But now all you are doing is showing me no class and showing disrespect. Again, remember what Red Ranter told you to do if you couldn’t get in line. I defended you to him because I felt you kept your comments clean. Now you are just acting like a malodorous rump so I’ll kindly ask you to fuck off to some other blog that loves ass kissing politically correct conformists who act like prissy girls when confronted with controversy. RedFan? More like YellowStreak or PinkAss. Sod off back to where you came from you whiny little turd.
July 24th, 2010 at 17:24
@tonymontanna4united: Mate get one thing I have a lot of time for you bro, but this you are either in or your out mentality is wrong.
Fergie runs the side, not the club yes he has more influence than many managers but he does not hold the purse strings the Glazers do. Fergie has sided with the Glazers for for me his own reasons, simple to “knock Liverpool off their fecking perch” with 19 titles.
One thing the Yanks are not going anywhere, so with Fergie gone who is there???? That wanker Mourinho will never get the job while Bobby Charlton is at United, who else could we trust with the playing staff and the budget we have?
Fergie does things I do not agree with but he has created United, the Glazers are the ones tearing it down their is a difference.
July 24th, 2010 at 17:27
@Traverse: This is the price the Glazers are paying for not making any marquee signing. Quality pays for itself. if they had signed a top player they would have shut the protesters and sell much more tickets. The Glazers do not understand that you have to buy top class to both win things and put bums on seats.
July 24th, 2010 at 17:46
Also I do not know a succesful person who is a nice guy, that is life I am afraid, nice guys finish last and winners don’t care about what people think about them, they just want to win.
July 24th, 2010 at 18:06
@Stephen: I agree with that mate, as i said yesterday one of the big problems with ferguson is he is 68 now, and not still in his 50s with another 10+ years ahead. The guy is near the end of his career, and i can fully understand and appreciate that the man wants to get that 19th premiership title and another champions league if possible.
My problem with all that is 2 things.
1. The glazers are now not supporting us well enough in the transfer market, thus meaning fergies dreams of another title success look less likely as each summer goes by. Surely ferguson can see the squad is not good enough right now to allow him to win that 19th title he so craves. Surely he can see the squad is in need of some major transfers to keep us in the hunt for the major prizes.
I can totally buy that ferguson is trying to concentrate on onfield matters and just concentrating on winning another title, but if the glazers arent giving him the cash to have a genuine chance in succeeding in his quest, then isnt that a concern he should be addressing. Shouldnt he be demanding more cash so he can keep the team winning?
2. His short sightedness is actually what is hurting the club more than anything else. As i said before he obviously wants to go out on top with that 19th title, and i dont blame him. But can he not see the club is in a total bloody mess right now. Who knows, maybe we will do better than expected and win the league, and ferguson gets his hands on that precious title for maybe the last time. But it still doesnt take away from the fact that long term with the glazers in charge the clubs future looks bleak, and that is a concern he should be thinking of ahead of short term and winning that title.
I personally just feel he is setting his successor up for an even bigger fall by supporting the glazers and allowing them to do their thing, and yet still get praised for it.
I appreciate at the end of the day he is a football manager and not a financial analyst, but he knows damn well the glazers have pocketed the ronaldo money. He will know damn well that these stories on the glazers and their debts are true and not just rumours. He knows that the glazers would gladly destroy everything ferguson has taken 25 years to build for a few extra bucks.
He knows this and yet he does nothing. Totally ignores it and concentrates on the here and now. And maybe if he was 55 right now we could ride out the storm and not have to worry. But its the fact that ferguson is retiring soon that makes this situation so much worse because right now ferguson is the glue holding this whole thing together. When he leaves though, it could all come crashing down, and long term that is the concern of many many fans he is totally ignoring.
Forget short term success and concentrating on the football side of things, off the pitch things are only going to get worse, and ferguson ignoring that in the hope he can enjoy a few more glory days is wrong wrong wrong. It is long term he should be concerned about and thats my point.
I guess were just gonna have to agree to disagree on the whole ferguson topic mate. I have alot of time and repect for you myself mate but on this i guess we wont feel the same. But still i respect your opinion and atleast you make some good points to back up your arguments when disagreeing with me.
July 24th, 2010 at 18:10
@Stephen: “The real hate should be with the Glazer” But then you say we should show Ferguson more respect. I respect your opinions greatly mate so please forgive me if you have me incredibly confused. How am I suppose to hate the Emperor but give Darth Vader a free pass as his henchman? Vader has shown his allegiance for decades and has killed and ruled with tyranny all those years in the name of the Empire. Sorry for the Star Wars analogy but I just find it amazing how many people can actually see how Fergie has wrongfully allied himself with the scum of the earth and yet so many give him a free pass.
I too loved the man to death. I admired everything about him and I often would go to war against others who belittled or insulted him. His record speaks for itself and there is no doubt hat he will go down as the greatest club manager of all time, even despite his present treason and treachery. It sickens me to see him allying himself with those scumbags and it confuses me and amazes me that he would risk shatteringhis legacy and his reputation and connection to the legions of fans by siding with the Glazer’s.
I don’t like the message I feel compelled to spread. I’d rather talk football and tactics. But I am one of the few on this blog that is looking at the big picture and the future with little concern over our present roster and chances for the upcoming season. So many seem only concerned with that and I personally find that incredibly annoying short sighted and incredibly naive. Fergie deserves respect when he starts earning it again. Yesterday is gone, the present is here and the future is ahead and that is what should concern us. So as much as we can respect the Gaffer for his past accomplishments, we need to address and question his present actions and how those actions will affect this club’s future. And to think about the shit storm I have created and the enemies I have made for speaking logically and forcefully about these major questions, I just have to wonder if it’s worth it at the end of the day when I just get personally flayed by hateful vitriol from those who are just clueless followers. It’s all so hurtful and very frustrating mate.
July 24th, 2010 at 18:16
@Gabriel: No they are not free to say what they want when it comes to insulting me mate. Ask Red Ranter about that. Insulting the team, owners, player or manager is absolutely allowed on this blog. Personal insults to each other is not. And when I start throwing personal insults at members of this blog, it’s only after they have started it first. That doesn’t make me right but then again I have nobody to defend me but myself. Disagree with me and bring up valid counterpoints and I have no problem with that. But disrespect me, swear at me or insult me and that crosses the line for me as well as this blog. Freedom of speech is fine for those who are considered public domain. I am not considered public domain nor are you or any other member of this fine blog. We need to respect and tolerate each other’s views on here and debate like gentlemen without getting personal. I’d honestly love to be able to practice more of what I preach but some on here make it impossible. We all look at things differently and that’s what should make this blog great. That and the fact that at the end of the day, we are all devoted loyal Man Utd fans. That seems lost on certain people who have called me a traitor and a Judas because I challenge the Glazer’s and their henchman Fergie.
July 24th, 2010 at 18:34
@tonymontanna4united: That’s just too logical and intelligent for the likes of many fans on here mate. Denial is a river that runs through Egypt in many of their minds and people like you and I that try to speak sense and show the facts are called crazy, senseless, illogical, asinine disloyal etc etc. I wonder after a while what the point is to all of this and whether you and I aren’t beating our heads against a brick wall of ignorance, hate and apathy.
I’m totally disgusted and ashamed of some of the people on here who have questioned my allegiance to the team after the close to four years I have been on here and the 35+ years I have been a loyal supporter of the club. They love United but they will not unite with us against a dreaded menace and enemy of the team. Instead they stick their heads in the sand and think back on the past and play the denial card while pointing at you and me as a couple of Judases. I for one am getting fed up with it and am considering quitting this blog because I just cannot get people to see my way of thinking or at least get them to accept my right to speak against the current regime and for radical change. The fact I love United and sacrifice myself both financially and emotionally is lost on these Pavlovian conformist clowns.
I am very busy these days with my business venture and yet I find the time to come on here and push the cause or just debate footy. Do I really need this? Not really. It’s people like you that actually make coming on here tolerable still. I’m just not sure you are enough of a reason to stick it out. Being hated and despised is not an easy thing to live with and truthfully, it’s not something I deal with in my life, other than this blog.
The views and impressions many have made of me on this blog are so inaccurate and so ridiculous that it boggles my mind that they would think me so radically different than the way I am in person. Some even question my education or work experience not understanding just how educated and experienced in business, politics and teaching that I am. Yet they do because their anger towards me blinds them form the fact that I write with intelligence and speak out from experience and knowledge. Yet some ass clowns call me illogical or stupid. I am neither. Yes I am arrogant and prideful and even conceited at times when a moron challenges me. Those are my crimes. Those and the truth. I care not for their love but I think after four years i deserve their respect and the right freely express myself, don’t you think?
July 24th, 2010 at 18:38
@frankie: See that’s where you are wrong mate. Respectfully, I disagree with you because I for one and many wearing the green and gold are not concerned with new signings. They are thinking about the club five years from now and trying to prevent another Leeds United style financial collapse. Winning now and getting players is so not part of the big picture. It’s all about the financial stability and continued success of the team.
July 24th, 2010 at 18:40
@Stephen: I guess that means I am a loser mate because I care greatly about what people think of me. It’s not about liking me but all about misreading or misinterpreting me and my message. And i have known many people in powerful positions mate and some of them are very nice, decent and giving people. And yes, there are evil bastards I know to who have a lot of money. But those extremes also exist within people who have no money and power. Good and evil exist everywhere.
July 24th, 2010 at 18:47
@tonymontanna4united: I look at the team similar to the running of a high class 4 star restaurant. For years it has attracted customers because it offered great menu choices beautifully prepared and presented with a smile and service second to none. Then one day the business is sold to some unscrupulous tight fisted cheapskates who still demand the same profit return but who cut the food costs by 50%, fire expensive chefs and hire inexpensive ones and what you see is a high class place offering a severely diminished product. The problem though is they don’t understand where the falloff in business is coming from and they cannot see why the customers don’t come or why they complain. The menu is 30% smaller and the product is not of the same high quality. But they claim and argue that nothing has changed, except the increase in prices. I see this scenario played out all the time and yet, so many make this mistake when they take over a thriving business. Greed doesn’t teach them the old adage that to make money, you have to spend money. And at the core, that is what is wrong with the club besides it’s ridiculously high debt.
July 24th, 2010 at 18:50
@Grognard: “I write with intelligence and speak out from experience and knowledge.”
Em, let me see now, would this be what you’re talking about.
@Grognard: “NO CLASS RED NOSED BASTARD FARTBAG. AKA “Typical Fergie””
July 24th, 2010 at 19:14
@tonymontanna4united: they dont need that to remain profitable… they can sell carrington… they can sell the roony vida evra they could sell OT or at least make it AON stadium. this is the long road that they have planned. lesser of two evils is to watch the kids play with roony and vida for a couple seasons and see where they get.
July 24th, 2010 at 19:23
Stephen the problem is who do you let go?
The only players with any market value are Rooney, Vidic, Evra, Nani and Valencia. And I do not want to release any of those players.
Aside from those guys the only players who could raise £10 million are Berbatov, Carrick, Anderson and possibly Park and Brown.
Selling Berbatov would leave us with only one experienced first team striker-Rooney. Forget Owen he is injury prone. Im not prepared to gamble on a forward quartet of Rooney, Hernandez, Welbeck and Macheda and Diouf.
However I do think that we should let Welbeck and Diouf go and concentrate our attentions on Macheda who at least has the physicality and finishing ability to make it. Welbeck reminds me of Henry-he will be a late bloomer if at all and is better developing his career elsewhere. As for Diouf, he is not the next Solksjaer and will go the same way as Manucho. But selling Welbeck only raises £5 million.
It is difficult to sell Park because he is versatile, the consumate squad player and his experience is useful in Europe. Not to mention he had a better World Cup than the entire English midfield.
We all know Anderson is rubbish. But the only clubs interested in him are French clubs that would struggle to put together £10 million for him. Better to give him another season, more games and hope it will raise his transfer value sufficiently to get a decent fee for him.
Carrick had an awful season last year and shouldn’t start for Manchester United. But with Scholes and Giggs retiring next season and our tendency to play a three man midfield it is difficult to let him go as his experience is still useful.
Gibson has little transfer value and in the Bayern second leg showed that he could be a useful squad player and maybe develop into the next Fletcher.
Moreover with rumours of English player quotas coming in we need to keep midfielders like Gibson and Carrick.
Personally I think the need for a midfielder is so great that I would happily sell Brown, Welbeck and Anderson to raise £20-25 million.
Then Id give Macheda and Hernandez plenty of games to see if they are capable of replacing Berbatov and if not sell Berbatov and Macheda next season and use the cash to buy a striker.
July 24th, 2010 at 19:23
@Grognard: the customers are still buying whatever they sell man and they are raking it in hand over fist instead of thinking of united as a single 4 star spot they think of it as a franchise like mcdonalds and would you rather own antoine’s in new orleans or the entire mcdonalds franchise? Now id rather have antoine’s but if were talking bread here there is nothing bigger than mcd’s sad facts of life brother.
United is an international brand whether it is run like it or not. The glazers are able to run it like one. I just wish they didnt have to use debt to purchase it. They need to let someone come in and knock that debt out and give them a seat at the table. this would kill off alot of the “wasted” cash flow and free up cash for transfers. like it or not they have the club cash flow humming too bad its humming right back out to interest payments
July 24th, 2010 at 19:27
United bring veteran striker out of retirement
LINK
July 24th, 2010 at 19:32
@Redrich: That’s retaliatory childishness on my part that was brought on by childish insults and accusations from you. I’m not proud of it but then again, you have an awful lot to be ashamed of on your side. I am more than man enough to admit that i can lower myself down to the level of my enemy and fight in the mud. Like a few other sin the past, you brought out the worst in me. But I stick by my position and fight like a rabid dog against you or anybody else who cannot respect my right to free speech on this blog and who show such a lack of tolerance for views they don’t share. Sad thing is on your good days you actually agree with most of the things I say. It’s just that you are blindly holding on to this romantic notion of Fergie and are unwilling to hear a disparaging word against him. Even if those words are true. That’s your cross to bare. I’m done fighting and arguing with you. It’s not good for either of us and it is terrible for this blog and for Red Ranter who doesn’t deserve this. So give your hatred towards me a rest and i’ll do the same.
July 24th, 2010 at 19:33
@colver: You can’t afford to let anyone go when you are not replacing them with others or even worse, others who aren’t as good.
July 24th, 2010 at 19:36
@gator: But the day those loans are called in by the banks, is the day when all I am saying will become reality. The glazer’s will default, pay the small personal penalty and leave United crumbling in the wind. This present business model is working for them because they can extort profits freely and not pay off the debt. They will do that until D-Day. From that point on this club is totally fucked unless some idiot is ambitious enough to buy the club and pay off the debt. I’m not holding my breath. Just go read up on the glazer’s to find out how many of their shopping malls are now closed and imitating ghost towns. Meanwhile they live on borrowed money, extorted money and time in their lavish beach side Florida mansions. It’s truly disgusting.
July 24th, 2010 at 19:37
@Grognard: the nazi party took hold so fast bc the large uneducated pop of germany at the time was easily swayed by a speaker with an unwavering vision of german supremacy even when confronted with logical evidence to the contrary. They were subsequently lead to their own demise…again. And if i remember correctly the Americans embarrassed him so bad that he killed himself. not exactly the type of historical reference that you should aspire to.
July 24th, 2010 at 19:41
@Grognard: the interest payment are being met easily and the bank would not call the loan bc it would mean less money for them if it were paid off now. as it stands they make a killing off the loan every year.
July 24th, 2010 at 19:50
37.
OFF TOPIC : I’ve been to a lot of other forums lately and Ravel Morrison is someone who is being talked about very differently…what i mean is just about everyone agrees the lad is as good a talent as anyone coming through the ranks at the academy but most of em tend to think his attitude is goin to let him down….I’m not from Manchester so I’ve got no idea about this attitude thing but could the Manchester lads on this forum please shed some light on this?…and tell me just HOW good is he?…anyone seen him during the academy games?
July 24th, 2010 at 19:51
@Grognard: Well mate you got my respect, but im sure you knew that already. I always find your posts a joy to read, whether long or short, and i think on the whole a number of people on this blog appreciate them and appreciate the fact you have taken the time to write such well thought out articles.
The problem with people like you and me is that we call things exactly as we see them, and sadly most people just dont like that and think its just a small minority spouting bollocks.
The truth is nobody outside of old trafford really knows the full details of whats going down with the glazers, transfer funds etc but some people can make an educated guess and see the shit that go is going down because we can see the signs and refuse to be told lie after lie from within united without making some kind of stand.
Its not their fault though really, its just its easier to believe everything is ok rather than face the truth and see the fans have a fight on their hands. Hell sometimes i wish i was one of the ever optimists, it would be a lot easier on me, but i am what i am and i will never change for nobody at the end of the day.
On the whole though compared to the people i am used to blogging with (or did in the past) i find the bloggers here pretty decent, at least to me. Just wish a few of them would wake the fuck up and see what is happening before it is too late.
July 24th, 2010 at 19:57
@tonymontanna4united: @Grognard: Boys I don’t agree with you but appreciate your passion without that we are not United, I understand where you are coming from but for me life isn’t that simple there is a slightness of grey in the black and whiteness of life, ps Grog Empire Strikes Back is the greatest Star Wars film ever!!
Have a good one boys.
July 24th, 2010 at 20:07
@gator: Sorry mate youve lost me. They dont need what to remain profitable. If you talking about ticket sales then im not sure i would agree with that. I think having a full house is integral to their plans and to keep a hold of this club.
Lose the crowd and theres just no way you will ever be making enough money to make some decent cash.
Now if as i think your saying the glazers decided they didnt need the fans and instead decided to sell the stadium, carrington and the players to make some cash back for them then your right they probably could do that, and once again your probably right they planned this from day 1.
How would be combat this, well tbh i dont know. Theres not alot we could do now, since the bond issue was released and listed the stadium and carrington in their plans. Before that bond was issued was the time we needed to take action. Ferguson should have spoke out then but he didnt and now it looks like there is very little we can do.
The only thing i could think is somehow if FIFA or the government got involved, but thats not going to happen is it.
Truth is right now we are in the shits. There is not much we can do right now. I still say despite the risk boycotting is the only way the glazers will take notice.
I dont know but even if the glazers did decide to sell the stadium, players i still dont think the amount made there would match what they could make if they accepted a takeover bid right now. £1.5bn in cold hard cash is more than they would make from selling the stadium, training ground, players (i would expect) and tbh with an empty stadium i think they wouldnt be arsed and would admit defeat and accept an offer from the Red Knights or some other consortium.
At the end of the day though its going to be a long battle, but truth is they have done us and they have done us good. Its going to be incredibly hard to get out of this mess, that is if we get out of this mess at all. Thats the pessimist but also the realist talking there, i just hope and pray my worst fears never ever come to fruition.
July 24th, 2010 at 20:46
@rooney_thebestest: Well i have to say ive only watched the kid about once, year before last in a reserve cup game to chelsea i think it was and he was only 15 at the time and was the best united player on the pitch.
Its funny you ask how good he is, because strangely enough some asked that on a website i was reading just this week and someone posted a link to a newspaper that had run an article on him. Apparently they spoke to someone who was a scout or coach at the youth level and he said hes the most talented local lad hes seen since ryan giggs. Apparently said talent wise theres a very good chance he could be as good as ryan was at 17/18 when he made his debut, only problem was keeping his head down and concentrating on his football.
I think he was probably going a bit over board on the ryan giggs comparison but everyone who has watched him says he has the talent to be a first teamer within the next 3 years, he just needs his head sorted out.
Apparently hes been messing around with twats in gangs and that sort of shit, and they are afraid if he doesnt keep his head down then his career will go tits up before its even started.
I hope thats not the case, because despite the fact us english have a habit of over hyping every kid on the block, everything ive read about him people are generally getting very excited about him.
If thats true i just hope he sorts his head out and gets away from the gangsta lifestyle and concentrates on his football. If he pisses away his obvious talent not only is he a bloody idiot but its also a crying shame.
Hope he goes on and lived up to the hype, but at 16 i think he is now in most cases its too early to tell how good they will become unless they are an exceptional talent. But unless its the usual over hyping it seems everyone in the know at united thinks hes an exceptional talent.
Make of that what you will my friend. Hope thats helped.
July 24th, 2010 at 22:02
@Grognard: I have never agreed with you about Ferguson, and by the way, disparaging opinions about him do not offend me nor do I disagree with a lot of them.
But I will not sit quiet here and allow a free pass to someone who feels that they can slander him with lies, innuendo, and baby-talk.
I guess you can now move the focus of your witch-hunt to me – and if this gives you joy, fine. I will remain to haunt you whenever your blather gets out of control.
Get used to it.
July 24th, 2010 at 22:32
@gator: Mate, you are talking to a former high school history teacher who majored in European history. Germany took to Hitler because of the price they had to pay due to the Versailles Treaty they signed after their surrender in World War 1. Are you aware that a loaf of bread in Germany in 1929 cost a small fortune. Hundreds of dollars in fact. Millions of Germans were starving , out of work and completely desolate. Because of that treaty the nation lost it’s pride, it’s self esteem and above all it’s power in world affairs. Hitler unfortunately brought forth a model for changing things, improving their economy and then eventually taking back what they believed was theirs before he got greedy and tried to take over the world. Had the allies treated the defeated Germans differently and not let them pay dearly for a war that really wasn’t their fault, they would no t have grown so desperate, so angry and so bitter. And the Americans did fuck all to him. He committed suicide to avoid being taken prisoner by his truest and most dangerous foe, Stalin’s Russia.
I don’t like my passion and my crusade to be compared to Hitler but I do like to point out that he too started with relatively few eager comrades and attentive followers. But discontent, poverty and his strong message eventually made those numbers grow from dozens to millions. I do not expect my message to go past a few dozen but all I am doing on this blog is taking advantage of my right to free speech and expression and telling it as I see it and as I believe it is. Sure I might be wrong, but until somebody stops insulting me and putting me down and can actually make a valid argument against my claims, I will continue to offer this opinion. I don’t do it to piss people off. I honestly care about this team and I think the Glazer’s are greedy evil cunts who have done an reprehensible thing by somehow seducing our manager as one of their allies. Something that doesn’t sit well with me but something that seems to go over the heads of so many onhere that it amazes me and offends me all in one.
July 24th, 2010 at 22:35
@gator: Lets see if the loan is paid off in five years mate. I could care less if they make the interest payments. That’s like buying a Grande Mocha frappe at Starbucks and drinking up only the whipping cream on the top. Forgive me for the analogy as I am presently drinking one and it is damned good and refreshing on this hot afternoon.
July 24th, 2010 at 22:43
@tonymontanna4united: People get offended my informed or intelligent opinions. We both have many facts to present and we can easily build accurate and speculative assessments or determinations form them but when people question your loyalty, sanity and logic when all we do is come across in an educated and logical well versed manner, it’s very off putting and highly insulting. When they trod on our right to offer our opinion while offering very little themselves, that is when I lose it.
Redrich currently has me on his black list and that’s fine. The truth is after all the arguing name calling and accusation flying tirades between us, I still actually respect the man and at the end of the day I really don’t mean most of my insults towards him. He just brought me down to an unflattering level where I turn into a defensive street fighter and for that I am not proud. But none of that would happen if he just disagreed with me in a respectful manner rather than put me down as a person and challenge my intelligence and my moral fibre. And this goes for anybody else who has gone to war with me. I am not a bad guy and I am actually quite friendly and very popular in my circle of friends and relatives. I just react terribly to name calling and people insulting me and challenging my right to speak my mind. If they would stop that and just let me be, I’d be highly appreciative. I might even mellow out more when it comes to that ponce Fergie. Well maybe not that far.
July 24th, 2010 at 22:45
@Stephen: Empire Strikes Back is legend mate. And I appreciate the comment. I totally respect your right to disagree and your perspective is very correct, life is filled with plenty of grey in between. Well said.
July 24th, 2010 at 22:54
@Redrich: No Red, I have had several hours to think back on our attempt at a verbal Stallingrad and for my part in it I offer my humblest apologies. When all is said and done i didn’t mean 80% of what I said to you last night. I think you are good man with a strong sense of right and wrong and a strong core of values. What upsets me is that you do not see the same in me and trust me, it exists. Perhaps I am being overly belligerent towards Fergie but it is due to personal hurt. Mate he has truly injured me because truly loved and respected the man. But I cannot see how what he is doing is anything but treason.
So help me I’d love to be proven wrong and perhaps one day I will. And if that day comes (fat chance in my opinion), I’ll get up on this forum and offer my humblest and sincerest apology to him and to you and everyone else who refuse to see the bad in him. But let me ask you on the slimmest chance I am right, what are you prepared to do? In the past i have been proven right about numerous things and yet very few people who challenged me a year or two ago have never gotten up and apologized or admitted being wrong. For as strong and determined as I am, I am also humble enough to admit being wrong. And although I do not think I am wrong about Fergie or the Glazer’s, I was wrong to fight back at you with the venom and low grade childishness that I displayed. So I am sorry and if you still feel I am a cancer and not worth debating or conversing with, I’ll respect that. All I ask you to do is to kindly respect my right to offer my opinions without belittling them or insulting my intelligence. A man of my experience and education does not take well to that kind of mockery. So I am offering an olive branch of peace mate. Sorry for my part in all this. My witch hunt directed to you will officially cease now.
July 25th, 2010 at 3:19
OK, so we’re talking under a white flag.
My opinion of you, up until a few months ago, has always been that you had a very keen understanding of this game, the players that play in it and the politics that surround it. A man with a vital need for the truth and a soul that had the capacity to invigorate our conversations with sharp observation and a sense of propriety.
I have always backed you when the inevitable shit hit the fan (when drones cruised through this site), and I have been one of your strongest advocates when it comes to freedom of opinion.
I was also one of the first people on this blog to suggest that Ferguson’s silence over the lack of transfer money, was not helping the ultimate cause. If he did speak up, the cause of the RK’s would have had a huge momentum.
But the fact is, he chose not to. I am not supportive of it, but I do respect the mans decision to protect his own interests – similar to the way I used to respect your belief that an opinion was simply a given right.
The freedom of speech is only free when the subject matter is not slathered in un-truths and rhetorical slander that cannot be defended on.
You have taken it upon yourself to make up shit and use slim possibilities about him to further your own cause on this site. Your language and your childish epitaphs have slurred him in the eyes of many very susceptible folks – mostly those who are influenced by your stature here.
You have earned your credibility – I just wish you’d use it with more responsibility.
I do not enjoy what we’re going through right now (in fact I wish all that has been said could be erased) but I have reacted with my heart and not my ego. The man that manages our club has led us for donkeys years, he has been supremely successful, he has always put club over country and club over self.
I believe that he he’s earned the right to more respect than the thoughtless (and childish) comments of you and your kindergarten flock.
Like I’ve said, I’m pretty much done with any more thoughts you want to add. You’ve made yourself crystal clear and I’m truly against you.
I’m not trying to silence your opinion as much as making you understand that, for me, it’s not acceptable.
July 25th, 2010 at 7:15
@Redrich: You know Red that was very eloquent, heartfelt and honest and I respect that. And you know something, at the risk of sounding like Robin from the old Batman tv series I have to say “Gosh you know when you put it that, I guess you’re right.”
The fact is Fergie has been running this show for as you put it, donkey years. He does deserve the benefit of the doubt up to the point but where I do disagree with you is on certain key points and comments you made.
First, although I do offer slim possibilities from time to time, I never make up shit. I take exception to that. I have never come on here and intentionally lied to make a point. Like I said, I might bring up some slim possibilities based on actions and truths but i never make up things for the sake of sensationalism or to further my case. I am not the National Inquirer mate and that was never ever my purpose or goal.
Secondly, I respectfully reserve to the right to use extreme language when I am provoked or mad at something Fergie or the Glazer’s do. Heck man they make me mad and frustrated. I need to lash out. But to call my rants epitaphs and to mock my feelings on this subject childish, illogical and crazy etc is not called for and it’s incredibly disrespectful to me, especially since your opening paragraph makes me up to be the exact opposite of that. I didn’t all of a sudden lose my marbles mate. I have looked at the situation and analyzed the evidence and come to a conclusion not only about the Glazer’s but those allied with them. And you cannot ignore the fact that Fergie has willing and knowingly gone on record and backed his employers 100% while mocking the green and gold campaign and the Red Knights in the process.
Now for such an intelligent man as you Red, I do not understand how you can turn your back on these FACTS, and then still have faith in the man and trust the man to be doing the right thing even though evidence of United’s ultimate ruin pours out through leaked or released documents or documentaries
nearly every week. If it was just the lies and manipulations of us and the media regarding transfer targets I’d say nothing because I can see why he does it up to a point. He needs to keep up a tight ship and have his players believing in him and in themselves. By whining and complaining that there is no money he hurts the team’s morale. I get that. But the dishonesty of it all and the lack of sincerity when he has come out and backed the Glazer’s coupled with that is just more than I can take mate.
You see, a major reason for my condemnation and war against Fergie has to do with what was once a deep love, trust and admiration from afar that I had for the man. A great legend and a man one should seemingly always admire and hold in the highest regard. But he has turned his back on the fans and on this club with his actions Red. I am confused, hurt and dismayed by his actions because they don’t make sense to me. I think the problem is I give him more credit for being smarter than he is. I would think he had the intelligence and the IQ to see exactly what the Glazer’s are and to be in a better position than I to evaluate the situation which by now has been publicly exposed as a mess headed for a disaster. Now knowing these facts Red, not made up shit as you accused me of, how can you or I or anyone not question his role or his lack of action against this regime?
To just quietly go about one’s business and manage the remains of what was once a great football team. while everything else around you burns and crumbles isn’t exactly logical or proper tactical action don’t you think? I am pleading with you to either understand and agree with me or rather than condemn these feelings to please give me a logical or well educated guess as to why he is allowing this to happen. At this time Sir Alex needs to be much more than just a football man. He needs to be the leader of an entire community and an institution and he instead has turned his back and mocked many of us.
Yes I have been very harsh, rude and cynical when it comes to him, but it comes out of a real shock and sincere feeling of betrayal. That is something you have never acknowledged or respected about my rants and my crusade. I just wished you could truly understand how it hurts me and pains me to the core to speak of the man with the anger and ferocity that I have. I feel like a scorned woman and I am bitter and angry. And rather than getting a shoulder to cry on after I have spilled the beans on my husband’s infidelity, you and others mock me, insult me and tell me I am the whore and a bitch (not direct quotes, just an analogy).
It’s not about you agreeing with me but it is about you understanding my point of view and my anger and respecting it and where it’s coming from. It’s not coming from a deep and dark place. It’s not a self serving tool that I am using to build a name or reputation. It’s sign of revolt, anger and a call to arms for those out there who see things the same way and who believe in the same cause and what they see as the truth.
I deeply feel hurt by your comments about me being childish and I have to say Red with all due respect, I take great exception to your direct jab at people who agree with me or respect my opinion by referring to them as a “Kindergarten Flock”. You are a man who talks of respect and yet you show members on this blog who choose to respectfully disagree with you and agree with me no respect with a backhanded comment like that. It’s beneath you mate. Just keep this between you and me.
Again, even if you can not come to see my point of view with a little more clarity, I hope you can come to respect me and allow me my freedom to rant as I do you. I am ashamed and take no pride in the nasty and yes, childish things I said to you yesterday as I was fighting back for my life. Last night you came close than anyone else ever has on this blog of making me give up and quit. Why? Because I felt if I had so lost a person like your’s respect and admiration, then I am truly hopeless and lost on this blog and what is the purpose of continuing? I respect and value your opinion and so your cutting words directed at me hurt deeply. They hurt deeply because they were untrue mate. You just have me all wrong. Yes i am emotional, I tend to swear ten times more on here then what I do in real life and I have been on a man possessed crusade of revenge against a man I used to admire greatly, that being Fergie. I will attempt to curb my hostility considerably but I will continue to ask the pertinent questions of the gaffer. As Desi used to say to Lucy, he “Has a lot of splaining to do”. I’m hoping one day he does come out and not only explains himself, but turns on those bastards and begins to lead this club out of the vortex it has found itself in.
As for you Red, I am deeply sorry for my part in this unpleasant episode and I do want respect, cordiality and peace between us again.
July 25th, 2010 at 9:54
The Red Knights look to be at it again. More talk with little walk. But Ilove the last paragraph of the article that speaks of Valencia’s commitment to the team and that he wants to stay with the club for ten or fifteen years and has no interest in Madrid or Barcelona. I love that, but then again, he’s not good enough for Madrid or Barcelona. Still, I applaud his loyalty and commitment to the club. Certainly someone who is not on my hit list.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1297390/Glazers-feeling-heat-fans-shun-tickets-millionaires-ready-pounce.html
July 25th, 2010 at 13:28
I dont see the Glazers going for another five to ten years. That is how long it will take for us to drop out of the top four and run out of players to sell to balance the books.
Even if we lose Vidic and even when Van der Sar, Scholes and Giggs retire we will still be on a par with Arsenal and Tottenham and ahead of Liverpool. City and Chelsea can fight it out for the title to their content but we will be sitting pretty at 3rd or 4th place. Arsenal have their own problems and Tottenham still arent attracting world class players. Meanwhile we will still have Rooney, Valencia, Nani, Fletcher, Evans, O’Shea and co.
Losing Fergie will be a massive blow. Even though Ive lost respect for the guy there is still no-one better at navigating their way through a Premier League season.
But I think there are only two things in the near term that will push us out of the top four is selling Rooney and even with our financial problems that is difficult to imagine.Alternatively Liverpool getting out of their own American mess and becoming a force, and Arsenal replacing Wenger with a boss who will splash the cash, and Tottenham finally attracting world class players.
All those things will take quite a long while to happen.
So we might as well just sit it out. As they say Time is a Great Healer. And nothing you or I or anyone can do will make a difference.
No-one is seriously going to buy the club so long as the Glazers are still finding it profitable to stay on.
July 25th, 2010 at 13:55
@colver: What up with you Colver? Shitty and Chelsea can fight it out for the title year on year, and that sits well with you? Not me mate, I will hate every time any silverware goes to the Tea Towel wearing mob over at Shiity, never mind seeing them winning the title. Sounds like you are prepared to be happy IF United just about remain in top 4 – or am I misreading you here. I am not happy now, and I won’t be happy with anything UNited have to offer in that kind of scenario – Oh how the mighty have fallen Colver mi man!
July 25th, 2010 at 14:30
@Gabriel: Mate what’s detrimental to the teams success is the Glazer’s ownership and their pillaging us of all our income, so that we can’t now strengthen and keep up with other top teams, and who have now saddled us with their own PIK debts no matter how many lies Gill and Fergie feed us to the contrary. But I know that you know that already Gabriel!
July 25th, 2010 at 14:35
@RedTan: Word is that it is more like 8,000 to 10,000 not sold because United are refusing to say how many of the premier tickets (corporate) remain unsold, and the corporate is 40% of their income! We will find out when the financial figures come out soon.
July 25th, 2010 at 14:40
@Grognard: Guess lies by omission is as bad as lying to your face! I understand your passion mate and i am glad to see someone making sure the anti-glazer rhetoric does not peter down. Hope we do we get out of the quicksand soon enough! I may not agree with everything you have to say but I understand your passion completely! As far as SAF’s concerned, I am just praying the Glazers are out before he is, the alternative is just too uncomfortable to comprehend! Right now, its Rock – Us – Hard place…
July 25th, 2010 at 14:43
@Stephen: Talking about dead wood – think RIO who in my opinion is crocked and we will not get a lot of games out of him. Think Red Nev, Scholesy, Giggsy, Wes Brown Mr tendinitis is a goner, and others who are constantly injured but on very large salaries – whopping ones in fact. They have been, most of them fantastic servants, but there has to be an end to everlasting loyalty to the old boys at some point. Or am I being too harsh eh?
July 25th, 2010 at 14:58
@elvido: Quote from you – “I love watching the team on the pitch play good football.” So does everyone else Elvido, but it seldom happens at OT these days – we have endured only a few top class football matches the last two seasons, but lots of SNOOZE football and silent terraces a good proportion of the time, and yes I was there mate. Still everyone’s interpretation of good football differs, so it’s a goose/gander thing – right?
July 25th, 2010 at 15:13
CraigMc if you read carefully I was just predicting the future and making the observation that nothing is likely to change in the next five years.
I like to believe in fan power and all that. But the reality is that it is only when the results go downhill that there is a hope the Glazers will sell out. And I was observing that their business model works as long as we stay in the top four.
Because believe me the Glazers didn’t take over United to win trophies. They did it to make money. And the way the league is structured a top four place is quite sufficient to achieve that objective.
We drop out of the top four and after a fire sale the Glazers will sail away their boats full of booty.
Pessimistic maybe. But these guys are pros and know exactly what they are doing and we are just a cash cow to them
July 25th, 2010 at 15:19
Liverpool is actually a great structure to look at.
Before Benitez left they were gambling signicant sums of money on rubbish youngsters. The same sort of false economy we are indulging in.
When Fergie retires we will hire a manager as inept as Benitez and the results will start to drop off.
Once we drop out of the top four big players will get restless.
It will be interesting to see how long Liverpool’s owners stick around. And that will give us a better indication how the Glazer saga will play out.
It really makes me sad that clubs with massive histories like Liverpool and Manchester United have been completely ruined by irresponsible American financiers.
While the successful and soon to be successful clubs have sold out to billionaires.
I really do not like the way the Premier League is financed. It would be perfectly easy to put a ban on foreign ownership (albeit not EU ownership) and I think it would be better for the long term future of the game
July 25th, 2010 at 15:25
@Redrich: Your interpretation of commitment Rich is obviously different to mine. The fans who are boycotting games at OT, and Merchandise etc are doing it because they ARE COMMITTED to the clubs long term future. They are doing what they can to state their case that the Glazers put nothing in, and are taking everything out. Also regarding your comment about fans running when the team go down, well United had packed stadiums every week when they won nothing for 26 years, so I hardly think that comment holds. Fans are walking now because Glazer’s have made us a franchise and we have lost every thing we, and our families before us loved about Manchester United as it used to be and all it stood for. Loyal Fans don’t matter anymore, just their money and that increasingly so, and to Owners who care nothing for the history and family gathering we as a club used to be reknowned for. For me Rich they can stick there franchise and all that goes with it up their arse – full on. I am not having a go at you personally, just differing in the way I see things – that’s fandom!
July 25th, 2010 at 17:03
@colver: The secret is teams owned by committee. Mainly the fans. Madrid and Barcelona seem to do quite well being run like this. The fans get a say and have the democratic right to buy into the club. The team can go out and get in debt but the difference is that because there are no rich owners sucking the teams dry every year, the money is put towards player development and club building and so the profits and proceeds that come from success quickly pay off debts and they move forward. There isn’t sense of panic or financial stress in Madrid ever. Barca had some tough times about a decade ago but that was eventually taken care of with the arrival of Ronaldinho. United never benefit these days from the arrival of a player who is a saviour. All the money they make goes directly to the Glazer’s and it makes me sick. What makes me even sicker is that it isn’t going towards paying off the debt. What makes me even sicker than that is that Fergie stands by and allows it to happen while his team gets older and rougher around the edges and he does nothing to inject quality to it. These are disturbing times we are living in and it has become very difficult to be a fan of this team under this present regime.
July 25th, 2010 at 17:23
@elvido: I appreciate that mate. Like I have said so many times before, nobody has to agree with me or they can agree with part of my message, but they at least have to take the message seriously and wake up and see what is happening to their team and stop stressing about short term fixes like players. So much of the angst I am reading is that Glazer is keeping Fergie from improving the team and I just lose it and get so frustrated with this group of fans. It’s about so much more than just winning games this season and injecting new blood amongst the squad. Glazer could free up 100 million right now and give it to Fergie for players and I would still be on this crusade of mine trying to inform and educate people on the dangers and peril this team is facing as an organization and complete entity. Glazer is destroying this team and in five years this club will end up like Pompey but even worse. More like Leeds United.
As much as I am down on Fergie for siding with these clowns I thank God he is still managing the club through this period of turmoil because he is the best manager in the world and only he can keep this ship from sinking in terms of the team’s play on the pitch. No I doubt he can win the League with this roster but he should get us into 4th. And we should hopefully be strong enough next year to be a top four team again, but then Giggs, Scholes, Neville and EVDS will be gone and he will have to finally rely on the young players. Perhaps they will be mature enough and above all, good enough to take up the challenge, but personally, I don’t think they will be. And so without some quality new signings like a Schneijder or an Ozil or even a Benzema and Neuer, the team will continue to get worse and worse. That is why Fergie has to be around to help this team compete and to prevent it from becoming relegation meat.
If Fergie were to leave now this team would surely collapse as no quality manager would have the stupidity to accept the job knowing he will not get any transfer kitty worth spitting at in order to buy players. Mourinho is who I want to take over for Fergie but not until this club is sold and the debt is being properly taken care of. It’s vital for him to stay on as he is the only captain alive right now who can guide this ship properly. But even he cannot keep it from hitting icebergs when D-Day comes and the bond issue repayment deadline arrives. On that day we shall see the Glazer’s default the repayment, pay a small personal fine and then fuck off back to Florida while they have left United shattered and broken like driftwood on the shore. The only thing that can prevent this from happening is a sale to other owners.
That is why I fight and write with passion to get people to see that any financial support for this team now is not helping the team. It all goes to the Glazer’s. Any personal desire to see the team win while ignoring the big picture is selling out to the Glazer’s. And yes, if only Fergie could also see the reality for what it is. If he could stop being so naive and step up and challenge these owners for their treachery and extortion, then the rest of Mancunia would join those 4 to 10 thousand fans who have given back their season tickets as well as the green and gold fans who have refused to pay for ticket or at least stopped buy officially licensed stuff from United. It always has to start small but if we all band together like a truly UNITED community, we can all destroy Glazer before he destroys our team. Whether I am right about Fergie is debatable but it is clear that he will not be helping us in our crusade to oust the owners. Fine, at least he will keep the team from totally collapsing. So we need to get louder and nastier with Glazer lads. We need to fight them fast and hard and not allow them to live out the duration of the bond loan because if we do, no buyers will be stupid enough to save us that day and it will be too late.
July 25th, 2010 at 17:26
@colver: Fan power is everything mate. It has the potential to destroy the Glazer’s plans and force them to sell. We must all have the courage and the selflessness to do what needs to be done. I rant and write as well as donate money to MUST, others have given up their tickets and even more have stopped buying licensed items. It’s all helping but we need to increase the pressure and the stress on the Glazer scum. “Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war”. We need to go to war to save our beloved club. United we stand but United we fall, if we sit back and just worry about weekly results.
July 25th, 2010 at 17:56
RedRich – when I said won nothing for 26 years – I meant the Championship trophy, now PL trophy – oh heck you know what I mean
.
July 25th, 2010 at 18:39
@Grognard: I think at this stage there is no real point to continuing this.
Our opinions differ widely on this – both about the topic at hand and how your continued vendetta is perceived.
Lets shut up shop and find a new place to do our business!!
July 25th, 2010 at 18:52
@CraigMc: My comment was really just a sad realization of how most of todays fans react.
I would imagine that would exclude most present company, and If I could boycott something I would.
Remember, I’m as anti-Glazer as they come. I want to see them off as badly as you.
Hey, how was free vacation? – jammy bastard!!
July 25th, 2010 at 20:20
@tonymontanna4united: I agree but am less pissed at the glazers, if only because they legally entitled to do all of the things we are witnessing PLUSS more that we fear. I am more pissed at the former owners who literally SOLD OUT to the glazers. this is the worst thin you can be in life a SELLOUT. these folk should be found and flogged. the glazers paid over the odds for the club to these assholes. The reason we are in debt now is because those sellouts wanted so much money. they let the glazers pay for the club with borrowed money and they took that borrowed money and bought their own mansions. i am pissed at them and i dont know why more people havent gotten mad at them. if they wouldnt have sold out then we the glazers didnt force anyone to sell. these assholes did it for monetary gain. and all the money they made was directly put on the United books as debt. thats where all the money is in their pockets.
July 25th, 2010 at 20:24
@Grognard: and you probably had to take out a loan to purchase it as well, how much are they in Canada these days 20 Canadian?
starbucks is as bad as the glazers at raising prices
July 25th, 2010 at 20:28
funny stuff citeh have to sell 12 players or pay them while they are ineligible to play
LINK
Bellamy is a cunt but could be a bargain. we could pick him up for pennies and put him on a billboard that reads WELCOME TO THE CHAMPIONS LEAGUE!
July 25th, 2010 at 20:50
@gator: I’d rather have De Jong or Kompany, or Richards. Bellamy is not worthy of red
July 25th, 2010 at 21:27
@Redrich: I just vented my spleen to you mate and tried as best as I could to explain my side in as sophisticated and civilized a manner as I could with valid reason and examples for my position and all you can say is that? Fair enough. All I can say is that I tried a Hell of a lot harder to bury the hatchet and at least explain myself than you have. I can live with that and feel proud of my stance, my crusade and my attempts to mend broken bridges with you. I’m saddened that you hold a grudge and that you don’t want to let bygones be bygones. Good luck to you mate and I wish you well.
July 25th, 2010 at 21:32
@gator: $5.00 Canadian not counting tax. A great drink but I remember the days when you could by just decent coffee for 10 cents.
July 25th, 2010 at 21:41
@Grognard: To be fair, your spleen is generally well vented.
July 25th, 2010 at 22:03
@gator: I cant stand the cunts that sold their shares to the glazers (magnier and mcmanus i think they were called), but at the end of the day the glazers paid them probably twice what they had bought them for so were always going to sell.
Unfortunately im not too clued up on the previous ownership model but from what i know it was a ferguson who asked them to buy shares in us in the early 90s because he wasnt a big fan of martin edwards and his family. Then as the story goes ferguson and magnier/mcmanus had a row over something stupid like horse racing and they fell out, then sold their shares to the glazers.
We also had quite a fan fans who owned shares in the club (about 10% i think it was) but unfortunately once glazer bought out the magnier/mcmanus shares the fans had to sell their shares in the club, thus giving glazer full control.
Now i dont want to go into another ferguson rant again because i know people on here are annoyed about that, but at the end of the day it was all because of a pathetic falling out, and gill changing his tune which in the end allowed the glazers in to do their thing.
As you say though somehow every bloody thing they are doing is legal, boggles the mind. But whilst i hate the bastards that sold out, thats in the past, im not bothered about how the glazers got in, just bothered about how we get them out.
Because the sooner the cunts are out the sooner we can get back to being top of the tree. I have said for a long while now were it not for the glazers we would be dominating football for atleast another 20 years, because the structure of the club is good, and off the pitch we make more money than anyone. Under normal circumstances that money would go back into the club but we all can see thats not happening right now.
So thank you magnier, mcmanus, the fucking FA for somehow allowing them to pass the fit and proper persons test, thanks a fucking lot.
July 25th, 2010 at 22:06
@gator: Nah mate, were better than going for citys rejects. I have concerns about this club enough without going and taking players they deem not good enough for them. If they aint good enough for shitty, then they shouldnt be anywhere near good enough for us, thats what i say but with the clubs standard declining each and every day i wouldnt be surprised if we made a move for someone on their list going very very cheap.
July 25th, 2010 at 22:11
@tonymontanna4united: thats what gets my goat that they were allowed to take that much money from united when they left. make no mistake the debt didnt come out of thin air those cunts took the cash with them when they left. they still have it if they didnt spend it all
July 25th, 2010 at 22:23
@tonymontanna4united: shitty dont know who are their rejects and who is good belly… i hate his ass but he was playing out of his skin for them last year and was a real fighter and played with passion. and now they have no room for him. i soooooo hope that their new mercenaries flop or are too lightweight for the prem and they let that list of players go that pulled good shifts for them. they are showing their true colors now and they said we treated tevez bad
milner should think twice.
but this also shows that uniteds recent transfer spending of late may be more well thought out than we knew as the new rules allow you an unlimited number of under 21yro players and the homegrown rule is 8 of your 25 man roster must have played in England or Wales for three seasons before their 21st birthday. kiko will be “homegrown” next year, how old is obertan?
if they dont make it with us this will up their value in the prem. hahah those glazers sure know how to pinch a penny. they have got some scott blood in them i bet.
July 25th, 2010 at 22:28
@Redrich: I suppose what I should have said is that poured out my heart felt honesty to you and tried to make my case so that you could better understand where my anger and frustration is coming from. I didn’t expect you to change your viewpoint but I did feel that you could at least be a little more understanding and tolerant of my position.
July 25th, 2010 at 23:14
@gator: True mate, shitty right now just dont have a fucking clue. They are bringing in every tom dick and harry that has a jot of talent, and in many cases bringing in players that arent even better than what theyve got.
They spent what was it £19m on some serbian left back who lazio bought for 500k just 2 years ago. They are just pathetic and i hate everything they and their bastard owners are doing to the game. Dont get me wrong i would prefer their sheikhs over our deadbeat thiefing bastard owners, but city are against everything football is about, and they way they have been throwing money about at average players is just pathetic.
I was reading somewhere that yaya toure stands to earn close to £100m over the next 5 years. I mean for gods sake hes a good player but at the end of the day hes a DM, he is isnt going to get you off your seat in amazement.
But you know its funny i was watching something called premiership years this week (its basically a season review for the premeriship). They were showing chelsea in 2003/04 to today and it struck me that although i hate them, tbh when roman came in even though they had shit loads of cash, most of their buys were quite decent priced, and for players with potential rather then genuine world class.
They bought a lot of potential players like drogba, cech, robben, joe cole, glen johnson, wayne bridge etc. Even they werent pissing money away like city did.
Even they didnt throw 200k a players at try and buy the likes of kaka for £80m. Chelsea in many ways at the time i felt were destroying football, but although i hate them tbh alot of their buys were quite well priced and sensible. The fact they bought a lot of potential players rather than genuine top class players reminded me of the sort of business we used to do.
City have just gone above and beyond though. I really just hate those cunts with a passion. Shitty city, the team that were just so well suited being a lowly crappy team, and now theyre the richest team in the world. God i would have wished it on anyone but them.
July 25th, 2010 at 23:21
@gator: Bellamys not a bad player, but hes just such a cunt of a person and a mercenary too as his CV shows. He seems well suited for city, who are just a such a classless cunt of a club the way they think they can do what they like just cos theyve got a few quid all of a sudden.
With all this “8 home grown player” ruling coming in i still think they will be ok. Theyve still got onohua and richards who i dont think they will sell for the very reason they go down as home grown.
But correct me if im wrong but the likes of shay given, kolo toure, wayne bridge, adam johnson, bellamy will all go down as homegrown players because theyve been in england since the age of 21, so despite the fact city didnt bring them through they will be ok.
I dont know though, i dont understand this rule fully tbh and cant be arsed looking it up as i know we are more than fine and complying with this rule. Part of the reason i think the likes of giggs, scholes and neville will be held onto for another couple of years is because of this rule.
Still not sure who the hell teams like arsenal are going to comply with this rule, unless they decide to call up countless kids from their reserves to meet guidelines.
July 26th, 2010 at 1:07
Whoops.
1/. United lose to Kansas City 2-1.
2/. KC played the last 50 mins with 10 men.
3/. United’s only goal was a penalty.
4/. Scholes and Giggs play a full 90 mins.
The details of how our youngsters faired, is even more grim than the the game summary.
Shocking, actually!!
July 26th, 2010 at 1:15
@Redrich: Very shocking indeed. Only Obertan and Rafael were decent… Fergie did not look happy.
At least I did not pay 130 dollars for that crap!
Perhaps we underestimated the Wizards of Kansas, but it is still a friendly. Even Man City lost to NY Red Bulls
July 26th, 2010 at 1:18
@[OPTI]Madschester United: In Addendum:
Chelsea lose 3-1 to Ajax with Turnbull doing his best Foster impressions (videolink)
http://sports.yahoo.com/soccer/blog/sow_experts/post/Ross-Turnbull-s-goof-up-not-helping-his-case-to-?urn=sow-257889
July 26th, 2010 at 1:21
Well I wish I could apologise publically to the American public, for the biggest load of SHITE I am sure they have ever had to watch, and at the same time having had to pay so much fucking money for. A total half arsed, futile debacle of a performance and against 10 men for most of the game. The wizards put in far more effort than our sad lot. A lot of Americans had travelled a long way, at great cost to watch a pathetic display of nothingness. I am sorry, but I am sick of this shit that Fergie is allowing his team to dish up and then coming up with all sorts of excuses. I am very embarrassed and feel so bad for the American public, and I hope they NEVER go to the trouble of ever forking out money to watch the load of shit they were suffered to watch tonight. As far as I am concerned you can get rid of nearly all of them on that team tonight, and our TWO old men put in more effort put together than all those yound WILL NEVER WIN NOTHING kids. They will NEVER make it, and I am sick to death of watching tripe. Rant over! FUCK!
July 26th, 2010 at 1:29
@[OPTI]Madschester United: $130, is that really what they charged for a ticket??
I’m gob-smacked. There must be a lot a very rich (or stupid) people down in the heartland!!
July 26th, 2010 at 1:30
@tonymontanna4united: i think the rule is the player must have played at least 3 seasons in england or whales BEFORE their 21st bday to be homegrown. but yea bellamys a cunt for sure. just dumb the way they are pissing money away with no thought of building a team just get whoever is hot in the media. i can see the shiek gettin bored of it all after the team fails to win silver
July 26th, 2010 at 1:40
@Redrich: Worst thing was this was with a very strong team team as well, most of the youngsters only came on in the last 15 mins. Starting the game we had scholes, giggs, evans, rafael, berbatov and nani all of which you would call as first team players.
Nice to see gibson looks a typical modern day united midfielder. If theres not a team mate within 2 yards of you lump it back to the goal keeper. Nice work gibbo, your gonna be a top midfielder son
Man this team is in such need of some new blood, its just pathetic ferguson is happy with the team as it is. I realise we are skint but for fucks sake get rid of some of the deadwood and weve got some money to throw around. Carrick and gibson alone would fetch atleast £15m.
If ferguson thinks he going to win anything major with this present team he is seriously deluded. We couldnt even manager more than 3 passes in the midfield against the mighty kansas city, so what the fuck are we gonna be like most weeks in the premiership and champions league.
Its just pathetic to think that right now we dont have 1 bloody world class midfielder in our team, and i include the widemen in that. Nani being the only one who looks like he has the potential to become one.
A sad indication of our modern day squad, especially when just 10 years we had the best midfield 4 possibly ever seen in keano, scholes, giggsy and becks. Sad, just sad.
July 26th, 2010 at 1:46
@CraigMc: Nicely put mate, i have said for as long as i can remember there is only maybe a quartet of players in our supposed “great youth set up” that have anywhere near the class to step up.
To me its only rafael, fabio and evans who looks anything special. There are too many ifs and maybes with the rest of the youngsters and most if not all of macheda/welbeck/smalling/hernandez/de laet/cleverley etc who wont make it. As for gibson, honestly who the hell this guy is anywhere near our squad i dont know. Hes 23 now for gods sake, seriously this guy isnt even premiership class, and this is supposed to be one of the promising players we are promoting. If so doesnt look like we have a very promising future.
At the end of the day im all for giving the youth its chance, but when on the whole its not good enough then its a waste. Ferguson will do what he did last season and go with his tried and tested of giggs,scholes, neville because at the end of the day he has little faith in the same youth he publically praises.
Its all just an excuse to use to cover up the fact we are fucking skint.
July 26th, 2010 at 1:49
@tonymontanna4united: I so agree with most of that.
These youngsters are so not United quality I’m shocked they are even in the squad.
The MF is one thing, but Diouf, Wellbeck, Macheda show absolutely no striking instincts at all.
Frankly, I’ve seen better finishing watching the school kids play down at the park!!
July 26th, 2010 at 1:53
@gator: Ok thanks for clearing that up for mate.
As for city and their sheikh, i really hope that is the case. Not just because i cannot stand the thought of shitty ever winning something major for the first time in decades, but also because the way they are throwing money around is just pathetic and at the end of the day will be the death of football.
I really fear that in a few years time all 20 teams in the prem will have a rich sugar daddy of their own, and it will be the team who has the richest owner that wins the trophies. Its a lifetime ago it feels that football was all about what went on on the pitch. Now with the glazers and their shit aswell as the sugar daddies coming in it seems its all about off the pitch.
Man i wish we could just go back to the days when footie was about footie and the best teams won. Not the teams with the most mercaneries in it. I really wish i would have been born 20 years earlier so i could have been alive to see the total football era in the 70s and 80s. The 90s were still a great time to be a football fan, especially a united fan, but it seems nowadays football is heading down the fucking toilet.
July 26th, 2010 at 3:36
One of the best season 2009-10 reviews I have seen:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raC62oHy8Yg
Enjoy!
July 26th, 2010 at 4:00
@tonymontanna4united: To be honest, United had not won the title for 26 years until Fergie won it in 1992… it was not until we secured some key signings (aka Money) that we became competitive. Once we were established again and with our large fan base we were rolling in money and it is really money and Fergie that has kept United as strong as they have been in last 2 decades. I think we will see what Fergie can truly do with these relatively cheap transfers now that Glazers threw our money out of the window…
Then Chelsea came with their new money and caused disorder but we all must agree that Rooney, Nani, Hargo, Ronaldo, and Anderson (~100 million in player transfer over 3 years) were important in winning back the title from Chelsea and then Ronaldo became God — that is, we kept winning titles.
Now city’s sheik and greedy american business (Glazers and Gillet) are changing the money landscape again. Big loans and debt payments are stifling United and Liverpool abilities – mostly Liverpool’s – and bringing City from midtable to title contenders… all because of money, or a lack thereof.
With Fergie, anything is possible but we have spent a total of 40 million over the past two seasons — half of what Ronaldo cost Madrid, roughly what Barca paid for Villa, and less than City’s Silva and Adebayor. We are seriously in a pinch at the world stage of football. Can Fergie unleash a new class of fledgelings unto the premier league? Unlikely, given the increase in competition around the Premier League. Can we get by with what we got? It depends on what we are willing to accept as “getting by” — is challenging for the title good enough? If so, we can do that for the next couple years with the current squad. Can we dominate the EPL as we have done — not bloody likely!
I hope we can get a couple Ronaldoesque players out of our current youngsters Rafael, Obertan, and Smallings are looking decent so far. Nevertheless, if we have the loan payments hanging over us for more than 5 years and we are unable to spend more than 20-25 million per year on players of true class, I think we will begin to struggle keeping up pace with City and Chelsea — maybe even Arsenal.
Fergie is a wizard in the Premier League and has proven this time and time again but he is not God. We need to get rid of the Glazer in the next couple years or we are in for serious trouble.
Good luck and goodnight.
Don’t let the bed bugs bite.
f they do, do a poo,
Put it in a cornish stew.
Into the ambulance, dring, dring, dring,
Fish Trousers Elephant
In Peking
Saw a Busy bee,
diddle diddle dee,
Daddy’s an accountant,
just like me.
Good night. God bless.
July 26th, 2010 at 4:02
@[OPTI]Madschester United: Fergie shouldn’t be happy. His best laid plans are for mice, not men. A exhibition game loss is far from a low point but still, having an hour advantage against an MLS minnow and losing 1-2, well it just doesn’t get much better than this now does it?
Seriously, maybe now we can see exactly what i have been predicting all along. Our kids are worthless and useless and once again unto the breech with the old timers for Fergie. Wear them out before the season even starts by playing them 90 minutes each. Really smart. Oh well, I’d go on and on about what a disgrace they were but that would mean two things. That I give a damn and that I actually wasted my time to watch this debacle. I did neither. Today you saw a microcosm of what is wrong with this club on the pitch. The youth not being good enough and the team having to depend on the antiques to come through and even they cannot do it any longer. I believe there was a band by the same name. DIRE STRAITS. 
July 26th, 2010 at 4:17
@[OPTI]Madschester United: Mate im not naive enough to say money didnt help us and at times we spent shit loads of it, because im honest and i know we have spent alot of money to stay ahead of the rest.
But the difference here with us and city is even in the 80s we were still a top club. A massive underachieveing club granted, but still a top top club that was getting in attendances of 50k+ week in week out.
When ferguson came in he spent alot of money in the late 80s, early 90s which set us up. The likes of paul ince for £1m in 1989, pallister for £2m i think it was in 1990, bruce for £2m in 1990 was alot of money in those days. Of course we then added to that with the signings of cantona and keane, in keanes case for £3m a then british record.
So yes we spent money, but the fact was we were always a top club, and spending money was always going to happen because of our size.
Then after title success after title success, attendances went up. New sponsorship deals were announced, and after a few successful years obviously income went up.
See the thing with us was despite the fact we spent alot of money, it was only from what we made. When we went out and got ruud for £19m, veron for £28m we were league champions for about the 7th time in 9 years. We had earned every penny we spent.
But this is my issue with city. They have always been shitty city. They havent won a cup in 4 decades and yet now because of a sugar daddy are chucking cash around like theres no tomorrow.
Im not saying i have a problem with clubs spending money, as long as its what they earn or deserve to be spending, and to me city will always be the little brother struggling to stay in the league, and no amount of money will change my opinion of them.
If they are a big club, then spend it by all means, but city aint a big club and thus to me dont deserve this financial support from their sugar daddy owner.
We spent shit loads to be the best, yet it was just money we earned and had a right to spend. And yet i was reading something this week that said since 1992 we are 5th on the list of highest spenders behind city, chelsea, spurs and the scousers.
Make of that what you will. Still to me city are everything i hate in football. Its not so much they have the cash, just the way they will throw it at every player who can kick a ball. Least when we were spending money back in the pre glazer days we only wanted the best.
July 26th, 2010 at 4:52
Gibson is not good enough, Macheda has no pace for the premier league and looks like Wellbeck may follow Campbell. I thought Rafa had a bad game and a defense without either Rio or Vida will be cattle feed in the league! De Laet may become another O’Shea which is either a good or bad thing depending on the injuries. If the lack of quality was just the money, that’s one thing but we didn’t go for the likes Sneijder when he went to Inter when we could afford a Smalling for 2/3 of that price. oh well, hindsight, 20/20 and all that…. I comfort myself with the thought that Fergie’s not spending so that we have some sort of a transfer budget when we get a new coach in. But the way things are looking now, Mourinho may not be as enthusiastic about taking this penniless project on. Heck, the likes of Ireland and Rodwell have more potential than any of our youngsters!
July 26th, 2010 at 8:49
Fergie better get used to losing, because with what he has bought, and what he is trying to bring through – he deserves it. Does he not recognise talent from duds anymore – because I sure do wonder. I hope to God I am wrong, I never wanted to be so wrong, but sitting up into the wee small hours watching that dollop of dross – well I hope the Americans don’t come out to support us anymore if we show our faces back across the Atlantic. When you fork out the kind of money they had to pay for tickets, you expect a spectacle of really good football. They got a spectacle alright, which told them that Man UNited are all about name only now, and no product of any worth to have to pay so much bloody money for. I am sick of hearing Fergie say I am happy with my squad. After the game in interview he was more or less saying he just wanted to forget this as quickly as possible, yeah well good for you Fergie, but what about the fans who travelled all over USA and payed thru the nose to watch a team of kick and rush lower PL league style football? What about that – does he care, I doubt it. The defence especially smalling was DIRE. They couldn’t play the ball out of defence but kept kicking it wildly, booting it upfield to the opposition. Smalling is bloody awful, I wish I could see at least some prosect with him, but I can’t. Our MF is still total shite, with no prospects coming through at all. I hope the American ALL STARS give Fergie and his team the thorough HAMMERING they deserve to wake the Management and coaches up! I’m incensed for the Man Utd supporting USA fans.
July 26th, 2010 at 11:15
@CraigMc: I agre with that, they way he keeps hammering on about how happ he is the squad proves to me that he clearly isn’t happy. And really how could he be? The midfield is poor, Smalling for £10m looks like a lot of money in my eyes, how could we spend so much money on a player he has played so little, he only played 13 times for Fulham. Lets hope he is as good “value” as Anderson and Berba, fuck me.
July 26th, 2010 at 11:36
For long time I am just reading around and I am really finding it difficult to digest that how things ca actually change!!! I mean the time when we should be talking about team and new season every one fighting each other on ownership issue. I am saying that we fans are MAD but then its clearly suggest that the current state of the team and off feild matters.
Its really sad to this though. I mean all the people who come out say keep off field and on field matter seperated, manager is all about the performance on the field needs to understand one thing that when you want to talk on this point eventualy you have to really understand that ts the ownership and allied matters that affects the team performance more than anything else.
By the way I am only having to ask one thing here may be little odd I accept BUT PLEASE ALL YOU TELL ME ONE THING,
AM I THE ONLY ONE WHO THINKS THAT UNITED SHOULD BE DUMPED OUT OF TOP FOUR THIS YEAR ITSELF????
July 26th, 2010 at 11:57
All of our problems last night stemmed from a Goalkeeper who wasn’t shouting at his defence, and a CM partnership of Giggs and Scholes. How many times has that combo worked for us in the last 5 years in the middle of the park? They spent most of the night passing to each other. The defence looked like it didn’t know where to be, and that stems from the Keeper. VDS shouts at them the whole match, and they know where to be. Foster for example never did, and mistakes always happened against him. Amos needs to take control a bit more.
But everyone saying we’re going to have a bad season based on that performance, must then also agree that Citeh are going to get relegated, and Sunderland or Spurs will win the Prem!
You bring Rooney, Hernandez, Vidic, Ferdinand, VDS, Carrick, Anderson, Owen and Hargreaves back into that squad and we’re alright. Trouble is Hargreaves is made of glass, Carrick seems tohave lost it and Anderson still isn’t doing it – leaving us short of creativity in midfield .
July 26th, 2010 at 12:28
@Onkar: We will finish in the top 4, but not the top one and that really is all that matters. The Glazer business model is only built on us having Champions League football, which lacks ambition and spending.
July 26th, 2010 at 12:53
@Onkar: What’s your question Onkar – SHOULD be dumped or WIII THEY be dumped??? I personally don’t think United’s 25 team squad are good enough. They weren’t good enough last season IMO and if they are this season, it will be nothing short of a feckin miracle!
July 26th, 2010 at 12:56
@Stephen: Mate you think Anderson and Berba have been good value for the farcical amounts we spent on them? I’m not quite sure what you are saying!
July 26th, 2010 at 13:08
Nani was saying that he has played most of last season continually with a broken toe, and he is still playing with the same broken toe now. If we had any strikers he would have had 2 assists, and his header was the only shot on target in this game. After only having 7 days training he did okay broken toe and all. Scolesy and Giggs did work hard, but they are not tacklers are they. No MF controllers whatsoever. Will we get what the fans have been crying for – a box to box ball winning MF who can create, and a titan in MF who can run the show. We also need that top class striker we have been praying for – will we get it, will we fuck! I mean 10 million for Smalling, or 12 million for Ozil, well anybody who had a brain would have known who to buy. I’ll say it again, and you all read into it what you like – anybody who had a brain would know!
July 26th, 2010 at 13:20
@CraigMc: I was taking the piss mate, they were silly money.
July 26th, 2010 at 13:49
@CraigMc: Nani is your player of the season already mate isn’t he?
July 26th, 2010 at 14:21
@elvido: Mourinho would not take this job on unless the Glazer’s are gone or unless he is guaranteed a workable transfer budget each year of his contract. He’s not an idiot and only an idiot would take over this team under Glazer. We really should thank our lucky skies Fergie hasn’t retired because despite his allegiance to those scum, the team is in better shape on the pitch with him than without him.
July 26th, 2010 at 14:27
@Onkar: At this point I cannot actually see how it would be beneficial to the club other than it would reduce the revenue of the Glazer’s. If it forced them to sell, I’d be pleased as punch for such a meltdown. But knowing those greedy sadistic bastards, they’d hold onto the team anyway simply because all their businesses Stateside are struggling so that United is their only real positive revenue stream. A sad state of affairs to be sure. I personally would vote for the Glazer’s being whacked over our failure to make the top 4.
July 26th, 2010 at 14:43
http://www.sport.co.uk/news/Football/41252/Ferguson_praises_scouting_department_for_unearthing_starlet.aspx
I just have to choke back the anger and laugh at this quote from Fergie praising his scouts for saving the club so much money by finding Hernandez before the World Cup. Is he fucking having a laugh?
It’s these same muppets who discovered stiffs like Smalling, Tosic, Obertan and others. And what about the money you saved by not being smart enough to buy a Schneijder or Ozil well before they had breakout seasons or the numerous chances you had to buy Benzema or others before bigger teams got them and made their price go up. It’s all so ridiculous really. I’ll always go back to my anger and rage last year when Madrid was having a fire sale and was willing to give away players like Schneijder, Huntelaar, van der Vaart, Drenthe and others for nothing and that we could have had one or two literally included in the Ronaldo deal.
I am still adamant in my belief that Madrid would have given us either Schneijder or Huntelaar for nothing as well as the 80 million for Ronaldo if we had just had the nerve to demand it. Madrid and Perez had such a boner for Ronny that they would have done almost anything to get him at that point. Asking for one or two bench players would not have scuppered the deal. But that’s the problem in a nutshell. Not only do we not have a good scouting system, but we do not recognize a lot of talent quickly enough and we do not show any imagination or creativity in negotiations with other teams. I suppose the reason i say that is because having been brought up in North America I am witness to many highly creative swaps, trades and sales for player talent between two or even three teams on a regular basis. Sales for players or trades for players where money and talent is involved together is common place and often a third team is included in a deal to satisfy the needs of all teams involved. Football suffers from a lack of imagination in this regards. And Gill and Fergie are completely clueless when it comes to adding some creativity and timeliness to their player searches.
July 26th, 2010 at 14:56
@Grognard: And our chief scout is…………….His brother so no suprise there, I have to agree with that post firstly he hasn’t even played for us yet and could prove to be a flop and secondly finding players isn’t that what scout do?
July 26th, 2010 at 15:46
@Stephen: I don’t even blame our scouts for some of the players we have selected who look like stiffs. Where I have a problem is in the lack of proper judgement and foresight to pay 13 million for a stiff like Smalling when just a little more could have gotten us a far superior player and a much needed creative element in Wesley Schneijder. That same 13 million right now may have even gotten us a player of the calibre of Ozil. Instead of targeting truly great young prospects that may cost between 10 to 15 million to buy like a Kroos, Ozil, Neuer, Rodwell, Sanchez, we sit on our duffs and select speculative talent with no real track record or pedigree and then we hope they pan out. There is a group of people who are not doing their job well enough. The whole brain trust at OT have shit for brains when it comes to talent scouting. Much is being said about Hernandez but he has yet to do anything for our club and so for me the jury is still out. I have serious doubts over a Mexican player being able to assimilate to the English game and culture. Time will tell the real story but I have no faith in what this club is doing right now but I do have faith in Fergie’s ability to take this ragtag bunch and make them somewhat competitive. In terms of getting results the Gaffer knows his business. picking out and judging talent is another story. People need to remember that players like Ronaldo, Rooney and even Cantona were gifted to us. It wasn’t out of any kind shrewd or wily talent search or awareness that these players were found and eventually bought. The luckily fell into our laps. Fergie’s been living off this luck for 15 years.
July 26th, 2010 at 16:32
Looks liek Fergie has been spending too much time with Arsene. Trying to take in “potential” a@Traverse: Thing is like the Scousers we are going to be in a position of having a very good first XI but piss poor subs. And if we remove Giggsy ans Scholes from the first XI then our center of mid is not even as good as theirs! If we are going to take the potential route, that means selling on most of them for a profit (hopefully), sounds very familiar this….. This whole thing just gets my effin goat! F***** Glazers!
July 26th, 2010 at 16:42
@Grognard: I agree with the majority of that bar obviously the last part, you don’t win what Fergie has won simply through luck.
Our transfer policy over that period has been somewhat odd, £18.6m for Carrick was expensive, £18.6m for Anderson, £30.06m for Berba, £10m for Samlling, £17m for Nani and even £12.6m for Ronaldo at the time was very high.
Coupled with almost giving Beckham, Forlan, Phil Neville, Nicky Butt, Pique away actually giving Bathez, Saha away very odd.
July 26th, 2010 at 18:39
@Grognard: Dude, mate, groggy, have you gone mad?
You still repeat your adage about trading Ronaldo for Sneijder/Robben + cash. That ship sailed more than a year ago. We are not liverpool who live off their past glories and “could’ve-beens.” We are Manchester United. Stop watching those old Ronaldo movie, they just build up sadness and despair – how could something so beautiful (his playing style/skills) leave Old Trafford… life goes on.
And what’s up with you saying Fergie has had 15 years of luck? In sports, luck is by definition a rare event and when you are consistently lucky, you are actually very very good. Fergie is the best and you know it deep down so let’s all jump off his balls.
How do you know Smallings, Obertan, and Hernandez do not turn out to be super-stars — is your crystal better than mine? Remember, we all had given up on Nani (except for the Craigster), yet he is now one of our better players. I, personally, am rather fond of Smallings and Hernandez and, I think, Obertan can really improve this season.
Grognard, TonyMontana and others can you name ONE thing that is positive about United today? Just one thing.
July 26th, 2010 at 18:47
@Grognard: Since Madrid offered 80 million for Ronaldo, surely we would not have gotten Ronaldo = Robben + Sneijder + 80 million. More like Ronaldo = Robben + Sneijder + 40 million and you may say, GREAT! let’s do it. Except, both players demand large salaries (90K+) and that is a major stumbling block and why we are seeking younger “potential” players.
I am sure Fergie know what he is doing and not signing Robben and Sneijder was either a request from Gill+Glazers or because Fergie needed 80 million over the next couple season (of which we at least still have 80 million left considering 20 million per season).
With Fergie in charge, I can relax. If Glazers are in charge of transfers, we are screwed.
July 26th, 2010 at 20:08
@[OPTI]Madschester United: Can I name one thing thing that is positive about United today?
OK, I got one. Vidic agreed to a new contract extension. 
And no mate I haven’t gone mad. I’m not pondering or thinking back at Ronaldo as a player. My point was that we should have done better than just get 80 million for him in the deal. Schneijder was dirt cheap back then but our manager in his infinite wisdom did not see him as being good enough. I guess we can accurately say he dropped the ball on that one. As for Fergie’s luck, I am only referring to his successful signings of great players. He has signed some legitimate players where he has to take great credit for. Keane, RVN, Vidic Rio etc. But he has also been incredibly lucky when it came to signing Cantona and Ronaldo who are without a doubt the two greatest United players of the Ferguson generation. I’m sure you know the story behind the signing of both of them. It had nothing to do with Fergie’s ability to judge talent. It was being lucky and being at the right place at the right time.
July 26th, 2010 at 20:11
Berbatov to tear up the premier league this season! you heard it from me first!
July 26th, 2010 at 20:25
@[OPTI]Madschester United: I totally disagree with most of that. Florentino Perez was absolutely determined and obsessed with getting his man. He wanted Ronaldo at all costs and had even come out and said at one point that Madrid might offer 100 million to get him. What Fergie and gill should have done in that situation knowing full hand that they had a desperate man on their hands who was feeling great pressure to deliver Ronaldo, was to ask for 100 million or 80 million and Schneijder or Robben. Perez would have said no initially but if we played hardball in negotiations and acted more like the Lyon GM in transfer negotiations, I believe we would have gotten him and the money. This makes me think that even Fergie didn’t know that the Glazer’s would steal the money from under him and leave him with very little to team build. This is all speculation on my part but the thought here is that a team like Madrid which is so power hungry and greedy would pay above and beyond to get a player they covet so much. It’s similar to all those times Fergie paid above an beyond a player’s actual value because he wanted him badly enough. Berbatov, Veron and Rio are prime examples of that.
July 26th, 2010 at 20:46
@Grognard: I am not sure what you mean by saying Fergie’s ability to see talent had nothing to do with him signing Cantona and Ronaldo? Cantona had scored 10 goals in 20 games for Leeds the previous season, including a hat-trick against Liverpool in a charity shield match. Ronaldo might have been a gamble if that is what you mean.
Regardless, both players became great EXACTLY because of Ferguson. His man-management skills created Ronaldo from a bag of tricks into world class superstar and made Cantona king.
July 26th, 2010 at 23:08
@Grognard: Ill give you cantona but not Ronaldo. United and a host of other top clubs were scouting him. Its a myth that Fergie saw Ronaldo in that friendly and then decided to sign him. He was planning on signing him the following season, but Ronaldos performance that day coupled with the fact the other top clubs were starting to sniff around forced fergies hand earlier than he wanted.
@[OPTI]Madschester United: Fergies no doubt deserves credit for being part of Ronaldo’s development, but People get carried away and act like Ronaldo would never be shit with out fergie. Fergie deserves credit for shielding him from criticism and letting him grow as a player. But Ronaldo deserves the majority of the credit cause he works his ass off. People love to talk about his off the pitch antics, but from a professional standpoint he is all business. going by what the coaching staf at Sporting said, and what United have said he has always been the first to training and always the last to leave.
So dont get me wrong, fergie was a big part of giving Ronaldo the room and time to grow, but Ronaldo became the player he is today because of his incredible work ethic.
July 27th, 2010 at 0:40
@[OPTI]Madschester United: It’s like this. The Gm of Leeds United called up Fergie and asked to meet him at a place for lunch to talk a possible transfer for one of our own players at the time (my memory fails me as to who it was and I refuse to touch Fergie’s biography on my bookshelf to find out). When the player was brought up Fergie said a flat no but in a sarcastic manner countered back and said to the guy would you be willing to sell Cantona. He fully expected the man to roll his eyes and tell him to sod off but the guy looked at him, paused and said that he would get back to him on that. Fergie then excused himself for a bit as he had to meet somebody for a brief bit on some business but told the guy not to leave as he would be right back. When he returned the guy told him felt there was a strong possibility to get Eric as they would be willing to sell. Fergie was shocked and almost gobsmacked but played it with a straight face and told him to get his people to contact the United GM at the time (I believe that was Martin Edwards and finalize the details.
Now if that isn’t a bit of good luck, I don’t know what is. It’s not that Fergie didn’t know anything about the player. It’s that he didn’t believe Leeds were stupid enough to let him go and he never met with the man for the purpose of making a d