Jul 23
Why Moving to Liverpool Won’t Help Heinze
This is outrageous. I am thinking of some harsh words for the Bindippers but I am trying to hold it off for the moment, because, while what they are now in the process of doing maybe deplorable, I want to see this in a more objective manner. Yes, there will be the slight bias, but this is a Man United blog. What the hell do you expect?!
Anyway, read on.
For those, who are wondering what I am talking about let me quote from the report on BBC:
Liverpool boss Rafael Benitez says the club’s lawyers are working on forcing through a £6.8m deal for Manchester United defender Gabriel Heinze. […] Benitez said: “We made an offer which they rejected. The lawyers are working on it now so we have to wait.” […] the Reds have met the fee that would secure the 29-year-old Argentine defender’s release - stated in a letter from United to Heinze’s agent.
According to this, the lawyers claim that United have sent a letter to the agent which says that a certain fee would be good to secure Heinze’s move to Liverpool. But the last I remember, a club can have complete discretion over when to sell a player as long as release clauses are not triggered, or such like. The only clause, i.e., the FIFA clause’s deadline had long elapsed and we are yet to actually hear Heinze say that he does, in fact, want to move. Till then, SAF’s word - that we will not sell Heinze to Liverpool - holds.
But that is not the point of this rant. What I really want to talk about is the move from Heinze’s career perspective. He was reported to have said that he was happy and contented living in Manchester. Of course, moving to Liverpool wouldn’t demand a complete change in location. But if he thinks moving to Liverpool would guarantee more playing time then he would be mistaken.
Had he moved last season, he would have been justified. With hardly much quality on their left wing, Riise could have been moved forward with Heinze playing at left-back instead of Arbeloa. (In fact that’s how they actually played at times last season. With Arbeloa playing left back.) This season, however, they have Voronin, Babel among others to lend quality on the left. Which means, Riise will play more in his customary left-back position. Let’s be honest here: Riise is definitely better all-round than Gaby, and has been Liverpool’s mainstay for a long time. With Heinze’s age, he couldn’t be ‘groomed’ as someone to replace Riise in the long run either.
Plus, with Rafa’s history of rotation, a player would be foolish to expect guaranteed playing time, week-in week-out.
All I see here is his agent having plenty to gain from the move, more than anyone else. United lose a quality left-back. Heinze leaves a club he had well-settled in, for another where he won’t get anymore playing time than he used to at United. Even Liverpool will lose the money they might have well spent on some other player for another position. The agent, of course, will get a cut that will help him buy a house or two and that will be it.
So yes, while Heinze’s move would certainly not endear him to United fans, the lack of playing time at Anfield won’t help him from a personal point of view either. Of course, if he really needs more Spanish speaking players around, he might be better off shoring-up the defence of Madrid, who might certainly need someone to plug the hole left by Roberto Carlos.
Related items from Red Rants:- Why Heinze Won’t Go to Liverpool
- Heinze Has Gotten On My Nerves
- Heinze Set to Leave OT
- Heinze loses arbitration for Liverpool move, what’s next for him and United?
- The Red Hot Roundup: Scholes, Eggy, FIFA, Evra
Tags: Opinions/Columns
July 23rd, 2007 at 10:48
Heinze would easily bench Riise. But I don’t see why Heinze shoud move. For me after watching Copa America he can still bench Evra even. He looked back to his best.
July 23rd, 2007 at 10:51
you’re wrong - Voronin is a striker mate, not a winger!!! Riise is different class going forward but a bit suspect when it comes to defending - Gaby would tighten up that LB position. Rafa always says he wants two quality players fighting for each position - with gaby we would have this.
Re: squad rotation - he doesn’t really tinker with the defence that much to be honest
July 23rd, 2007 at 10:52
It’s only a game, get a fucking life will ya.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:01
At no point has Gabby said he want’s to move to Liverpool. There is just a lot of reading between the lines and extremely shoddy journalism. The BBC’s reporting of ‘Heinze taking United to court’ was based on sheer conjecture. When there are more ‘ifs’ then quotes in an article its best ignored.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:01
I’m a Liverpool supporter but I agree with you totally. Not really sure why the club want Heinze so badly with Riise available. We do need another defender for the quad and in some ways the versatile Heinze fits the bill but not its not worth all this trouble. The bid was good enough and if United won’t sell that should be it. Having said that I’m nt sure it’s Liverpools lawyers involved, Benitez said THE lawyers and I assume that is Heinze’s trying to see if this letter he has allegedly received has any real legal basis. Not worth the aggro anyway.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:01
[Matthew]
Fair enough, but how different is it from Old Trafford where he’s fighting it with Evra? So no new challenge for him, and no regular playing time (assuming these are reasons for him to move.)
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:05
Fizo… why don’t you say what you really feel?
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:06
[Nick]
Probably true. Especially when they use words like “The BBC understands” you know something is amiss. Although, the point I wanted to make was why Heinze’s move to Pool doesn’t make sense even from his own career perspective.
[Keith]
Maybe Heinze might edge out Riise from a purely defensive point of view, but overall Riise is far more robust, and he does trackback better than Evra.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:12
Red Ranter:-That wasn’t a dig at this article, more the countless article’s in our so called press. I think BBC.com has been taken over by them guys at tribalfootball.com.
If Gabby think’s he’s guaranteed football at any club he’s a fool. It’s very disappointing when a player of his standing at the club and with fans isn’t willing to fight for his place. Especially when you compare it to these comments from Evra:
“You play in front of 10,000 people in Monaco and you play in front of 76,000 in Manchester and everyday you have a lot of pressure.
“When I played for Monaco I was relaxed because I played every game and I was comfortable, but in Manchester it’s difficult and as a game it’s stronger.”
“I worked in the gym everyday. I’m more professional,” he continued.
“If you want to play every game for Manchester United you need to fight with yourself. I’m doing that all the time.
“Six months ago when I wasn’t playing very well I said to myself ‘Pat for next year you need to show your best.’”
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:13
Did you write this to wipe away your tears? If Heinze wudn’t be
guaranteed a 1st team place why would rafa waste his time bidding
for him? Riise isnt even a good LB, he is better as LW, so heinze
can play as LB instead.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:22
I had a very weird dream last night…
I dreamt that Heinze was physically fighting it out with Ronaldo… (was actually funny because in the dream Ronaldo fought like a girl). Their faces all bloodied. Anyway, in the dream I reallised…that’s it then…he’s definitely out…no way SAF will keep him now…damn.
When I woke up, it felt like I just awoke from a major nightmare!
I know its just a dream, but I think this Heinze thing is getting to me. I hope he stays.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:23
I think my dream got Smith and Heinze mixed up over Ronaldo’s girlfriend
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:29
As a Liverpool fan I’m not convinced with Heinze, however Benitez must see him as a better left-back than Riise (no surprises there), he can also do a job at centre-half and would provide back-up for Carragher & Agger. I’d personally be pleased to see him at anfield just to p*ss off old whisky-nose.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:41
For some reason Fergie seems to be rattled at the prospect of
Heinze moving to Anfield… I’m not sure why if Gill in his
infinite wisdom handed him a letter stating that he is
surplus to requirements and could leave the club if a bid in excess of
6 million is received. The letter would not be issued without Fergie
sanctioning it. I’m having a laugh at this whole drawn out
transfer saga. Talk about footy soap opera!
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:45
the guys a wanker, gd ridence i say, he’s demanding first team football if he cant go to liverpool where he’ll be a benchwarmer.jackass.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:47
I think that Heinze just wants
to play for a team that is capable
of challenging in Europe.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:49
I’m surprised that the Liverpool fans haven’t mentioned Aurelio who, before his injury, was really starting to settle and justifying Rafa’s faith in him.
Although he won’t be back for a while when he does I would expect him to keep Riise out of the left back position (most of the time).
However, I believe that Heinze can also play CB. If that’s the case then it makes a little more sense as we are a little short of strength in depth there.
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:51
I am a Liverpool fan and do not want to see Heinze at Anfield. I agree that he couldn’t be granted a permanent place and if he won’t stay and fight for his place at OT then why would he do so at Liverpool? Then we’d surely be in the same position with him stropping about wanting to leave, but at 29-30 years old, we’d be lucky to get 2-3 million for him. It just all seems bizarre and not worth the hassle for this player. I’d much prefer Giorgio Chiellini, although I’m still not sure how much time he would put up with on the bench considering recent comments?
I am also not a fan of Heinze’s temperament. He’s the sort of player who can’t handle a bit of physical contact and complains all the time, a bit like Lehman. I really do not want this sort of player in my team, it just makes you cringe.
Hopefully this is all just press talk as the initial rush of transfer news has died down or its agents trying to force Real Madrid’s hand etc?
July 23rd, 2007 at 11:58
It’s funny because it challenges
the Manc view of pre-eminence.
Nobody wants to go in the opposite
direction. What does that tell you?
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:00
rnter i disagree with u competly heinze is far better at the defnesive game thn risse if he wer to make a move to the scoucers e wud almost certainly be first choise risse wud be preferred to a mor atakin liverpool which benitez dusnt reli employ very much as we hav sin benitez play very defensivly alot of the time, so ur pulin on loose threds ther, secondly heinze hasnt seD nuin bout movin or stayin, fergi has sed he is NOT movin to liverpool so any scoucers out ther dremin it aint gnna happen, the onli team tht he wud get definate football is real MADRID however nuthin has materialised ther and heinze is far frm ther top target, i wudnt be surprised if this wud all blow over and silvestre is the 1 to leave with heinze and evra batlin it out like lst season. LET ME SAY THIS 1 MORE TIME - HEINZE IS NOT GOIN LIVERPOOL NO MATA WT HIS AGENT SES OR LIVERPOOL HIS MOST LIKLIEST DESTINATION IS THE BERNABAU IF THEY MAKE A BID IF NT E IS STAYIN WITH US
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:03
FAO:Shera Singh
Your English is fucking awful. Come
back when you can spell.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:04
steve p ya gayboy united beat liver twice lst season wt wer u reli competin for the champions league??? did u win o ye u lst to the sme experienced team tht knoked the red devils out, ALL I CAN SAY IS THT ALL THE TOP FOOTBALING PUNDITS AND STARS OF THE PST ARE TIPPIN UNITED TO BE THE FORCE ALL OUR PLAYERS HAVE THEIR YOUTH NT TO MENTION THE EXPERICE SO STEVE PEEEEE WAIT TELL U CM AGAINST US IN THE CHAMP LEAGUE THEN ULL KNOW WT TRUE CHAMPIONS RELI R
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:07
I said come back when you can spell
you fucking retard. I can’t be arsed
to read your comments because you
have the mental age of 3 year old
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:09
STEVE YTA GAY FUKER GET UR OWN SCOUCER WEBSITE O YE N GET AN EDUCATION YA DUMB FUK LOL
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:17
If heinze wants to go let him go.manutd need players that are committed 100% not some guy whos actually thinking of joining liverpool.that thought should never cross any of the players minds regardless of who they are.last season we did well without him and if he leaves we will continue to well.gill said we still have money to spend so im sure hes not the only left back in the world.plus hes what 29?
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:18
Shera, stop embarrassing Sikh’s all around your world with your bad spelling and grammar. Listen to the good man advising you and at least use some sort of spell checker. And mind your manners too.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:19
it’s funny really, you manc scum call scousers thick!!! My five-year-old daughter can spell and type better than Shera
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:27
[Shera]
While we appreciate both criticism or applause for our posts, I am afraid, I will have to say this for certain (and I have said it to you in the previous post). Please, please post in, should I say, proper English and not in abbreviated words. I did read your first comment, but it was way too tiresome. I am afraid I’ll have to agree to that part of what Steve had to say.
About your first comment, Rafa WILL rotate his players. Even Gerrard doesn’t play every game. So Heinze’s place would be far from certain in Liverpool.
And yes, I know Heinze didn’t say anything about moving. I did mention that in my article.
And I suggest you don’t respond to the odd cry about Europe and such like from Liverpool fans. You end up flaming each other, which I really won’t appreciate in the comments section.
[Steve]
Yes, bad grammar and all that. But you sure did ask for it anyway with your comment didn’t you?
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:28
Dear Shera Singh
Not only are you a member of the
Sunshine Variety club, but everybody
knows that typing in capitals is a
substitute for having a small penis.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:44
You know what, just wait and see…no point talking about it until it happens.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:52
Brilliant blog mate! Keep up the great work! I believe Heinze should stay, purely because he IS a quality player and there aren’t many left backs around right now who would adequately replace him (unless the bindippers want to do a straight swap for riise - which i certainly would have no problem with!). We need competition and cover for places, especially if we are going for an all out assault on trophies, and Heinze’s experience and ruggedness may be crucial in Europe (29 is not too old!). He would also help Tevez settle in quickly at OT (assuming the transfer goes through and he is still there by then).
July 23rd, 2007 at 13:22
I’m confused…Is this a ‘Manchester United FC’ or a ‘Liverpool FC’ blog site?
July 23rd, 2007 at 13:23
To be honest, I thought we were buying him for central defensive cover as a replacement for Hyypia (Newcastle will go in for him again), we already have two suitable left backs in Riise and Aurelio, with Arbeloa if the worst comes to the worst, but I agree that he probably won’t get any more of a chance to play than he did at Utd. That’s why I figured it was b*llocks that we’d gone in for Chiellini - there are other areas we can cover first before left-back in terms of transfers.
July 23rd, 2007 at 13:24
At last, some civilized Man U supporters who you can actually talk to without having your head bit off for no reason (except for Shera Singh for obvious reasons)!!!
I believe Heinze isn’t really a need, maybe Rafa wants someone as a stop gap in the knowledge of Aurelio being injured….just like Pellegrino was (Oh Dear).
If we do get him it won’t be the end of the world, same as if we don’t get him. I’m sure there’s another one out there available who Rafa has his eye on.
Until anything happens, there’s not much point in worrying about the matter.
July 23rd, 2007 at 13:31
nani score on his debut.3-0 in 33 min for man u
July 23rd, 2007 at 13:34
It’s a Man Utd site talking about a matter that also involves Liverpool. Are you always so easily confused?
July 23rd, 2007 at 13:44
unlike Riise, Heinze and Arbeloa can also play central defender so Rafa can shapeshift his backline during games without having to make substitutions… we know he does this in attack… now he’d like more options at the back…
July 23rd, 2007 at 14:01
[karl]
It does turn into a Liverpool FC site on occasions, especially when you have Liverpool on the headline.
[To the Liverpool fans] Most of you say that Rafa is buying Heinze for defensive cover, either at the centre of defence or at left back. That’s exactly my point, meaning Heinze won’t get regular playing time even at Anfield. Not a good career move. If he leaves, it would make more sense for him to move to Spain.
July 23rd, 2007 at 14:07
@Andy, I guess I am.
Especially considering that 90%+ of the comments comes from Liverpool supporters.
That being said, you’re more than welcome here, as long as we can keep it civil.
(unlike the 2 guys - whose names I will not mention).
July 23rd, 2007 at 14:09
Am I being forward in welcoming them RR?
July 23rd, 2007 at 14:11
I think that what attract Heinze to Liverpool is the ‘promise’ of playing Center Back
July 23rd, 2007 at 14:13
Heinze is very poor going forward, can’t cross, can’t dribble, looks to have lost a yard of pace
since his injury and more or less gets a nose bleed every time he crosses the half-way line.
Which means he is ideally suited to Rafa’s boring ’s**t on a stick’ football and surplus to
requirements at MUFC. I’ve no problem with selling our rivals players who are not good enough
to hold down a place at United. Sellng Veron to Chelsea was an excellent bit of business, this
is more of the same.
I reckon this whole fuss about fergie refusing to allow Heinze leave is just a ploy to extract
another million or so from Gillet and co. Rafa’s been spending money like it’s going out of
fashion, if the likes of Atletico and Ajax are gonna rip him off, no harm United having a piece
of the action too.
July 23rd, 2007 at 14:23
Dear Mick from London
Selling Veron to Chelsea was an ‘excellent bit of busines’?
Which planet are you from? How does spending 28.1 Million on a
player, who was then sold on for 13 Million 2 years later translate
as ‘excellent buisness’?
For the record, we dont want him for his football ability, we want
him ONLY to piss off that red-nosed miserable twat of manager
of yours.
The rest of your comment was total wank as well. How much have you
spent on transfers compared to Liverpool? You mug
July 23rd, 2007 at 14:28
Steve P. I agree Mick’s Maths isn’t great is it. Spending money like it’s going out of fashion? 43 million spent assuming Leiva deal happens and 20million clawed back whilst united are committed to over 60 million this summer already and have only raised 5 mill? Not sure who that means has spent the most but I’ve got a fair idea!
July 23rd, 2007 at 14:59
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QA70lOLn1hA
to the guy who says heinze cant dribble or go forward watch this clip (the bit against arsenal)
July 23rd, 2007 at 15:26
Where does it say I’m from London?
Of course, getting 13 million for veron was great business. When you make one of your rivals waste
a big chunk of their summer’s spending on a player who goes on to be a total flop, that can only
be a good thing.
And if Liverpool want to waste several million quid, to sign one of our rejects just to annoy our
manager, they can go right ahead, nothing would please me more.
And it wouldn’t surprise me one bit, any manager who’s willing to pay 26 million quid on the 9th
highest scorer in La Liga clearly has more money than sense. I see it as our duty to rip off the
gullible fool…
To the guy who uses youtube clips to assess a player’s quality. You’re kidding, right?
July 23rd, 2007 at 18:40
Mick did you watch Argentina play in the Copa America? If you did you would have seen that he is actually good at attacking and crossing, he got three assists in it, plus he scores goals. He’s better than Evra and if we sell him for 7m then we won’t be ‘ripping them off’ because he’s worth more than that.
July 23rd, 2007 at 20:04
i guess i missed the party
Well For me gabby Stays At Manutd full stop if he goes i’ll be saddest person alive (Ok that went a bit far) And livepool freaks plz he’s not going there u know the past player who went faced the critisism all there life so he aint coming there
But i guess madrid might fancy him
anyways lets wait for a week more he’ll be back at carrington and well see what happens
July 23rd, 2007 at 20:10
“There is no change in the situation,” Sir Alex said. “He won’t be going to Liverpool as far as I’m concerned. I think the matter should rest there.
http://www.manutd.com/default.sps?pagegid={B4CEE8FA-9A47-47BC-B069-3F7A2F35DB70}&newsid=447119
July 23rd, 2007 at 21:19
Oh God! Jeez! I over sleep 1 day and there’s a bookload of comments.Anyway I heard that Gabby isn’t going anywhere and I don’t expect him to be going anywhere soon concidering he won’t be in for much if he does move.
July 23rd, 2007 at 21:49
u lot r all pwopa funny wer typin on a blog u nutters nt on a grammer examination dumb fuks so i can type wtever i like on this site however i wnt to, and baln no joke but forget bein an embarasment cus we all no y ur emabaresed if ur nme is reli balan. WTA LOSER
July 23rd, 2007 at 21:58
[Shera]
I am sorry, but in case you think you can type just about anything on this site you are greatly mistaken. If you cannot do a simple thing as to write proper words (I am sure it’s not too much of a pain) I will be forced to delete your comments. For the last time, please write proper words otherwise I WILL delete your comments. I will have to be fair. I do delete comments on a daily basis that contain irrelevant or badly spelt words. The only reason your comments have stayed is that you have been fairly regular. The point is I don’t understand why you can’t seem to understand this when I asked you several times politely. Fuck the grammar, but using text messaging language inhibits readability. And if you want to put your points across you need it to be readable at least.
Anyway, I need to draw a line somewhere and I think if you don’t mend your ways then I guess I will be forced to delete your comments. I hope we be civil about this and understand my concern.
July 23rd, 2007 at 23:10
Gabby wants to join Liverpool for the simple reason
that Liverpool is a far superior club that Man Utd.
Can’t blame him for wanting to join the most successul
club in English history.
July 23rd, 2007 at 23:28
Shera,what’s the point of writing in tex? You are pissing people off and making a dumb fuck of yourself. People have simply asked you to write properly but you blow up. Take a little advice:- spell up or fuck off-:just a sugestion.
July 24th, 2007 at 0:23
[Davo]
Fair enough, just get me his quotes (and the website link to the article) you found Gabby actually saying he wants to move. Then we’ll get down to why he wants to move.
July 24th, 2007 at 0:43
Why do Liverpool fans continue to say United spend more on players I have had to spell it out to them to show how United spend less than them on SL about 20 times but here we go again… United have 25m a year set aside for transfers with the teams accomplishments i.e. prize money adding to that. We made money last season in the transfer market by selling Ruud and Obi Mikel and only bringing in Carrick. We also won won the premiership which gives an extra 20m at least to spend so we have only spent 45m give or take in the last year on players.
Liverpool on the other hand spent probably upwards of 35m before this Summer’s spending spree (Bellamy, Kuyt, Gonzalez, Pennant, Agger, Arbeloa and Mascherano) then go out and spend another probably 45m on 3 players (Torres, Babel and Leiva) and make back about 15m on Bellamy and Cisse.
Net spending since last Summer: United:45m ‘Pool:65m
Bindippers lose this argument I think
July 24th, 2007 at 0:48
Back to the article…Heinze hasn’t actually said he wanted to leave in fact the last time I think he was quoted he said that his live was perfect in Manchester and that it would take a super club like Real or Barca to make him leave. Don’t mistake an agent’s comment for a player’s.
July 24th, 2007 at 2:48
Man, Sir Laxative Ferguson must be so angry he’ll probably pull over on the hard shoulder of a motorway and empty his bowels. The benobo monkey faced alcholic is getting bitchslapped by Rafa — get ready for more you Salford Slummers.
July 24th, 2007 at 9:02
Pablo in simple English what did that mean i guess ur speaking cockney or Northern Britain slang and its all blown over me head
July 24th, 2007 at 9:02
Whisky-nose is really shi**in himself now, he’s trying to accuse Liverpool of tapping Heinze up.
www.eatsleepsport.com/news_details.aspx?story_id=600449&l_id=1&t_id=44
He’s not only scared of how strong Liverpool’s squad is becoming, he’s scared of losing face….Quote “there’s no way Heinze will be giong to Liverpool”
FIVE.
July 24th, 2007 at 10:22
@DaveL22
I doubt our manager is scared. I think he just don’t like Liverpool.
Why try to read a lot into something when it’s so obvious?
If you check all the forums at round about this time of year, for the last couple of years, you will notice a peculiar thing:
A) Liverpool have the “best” squad
B) Liverpool bought the best players (all unknowns so btw)
C) Liverpool got rid of the deadweight (btw, the same players they bought the year before)
D) This will be Liverpool’s season
E) Liverpool is better than Manchester United
Same thing, over and over and over and over again.
Come end of each season…YOU CAN’T EVEN BEAT US.
However, I give you guys 10/10 for persistence though.
“What is man without his hope?”
July 24th, 2007 at 12:14
We don’t need to beat UNITED to win the premiership!! we’ll just have to out-perform United against the other 18 teams.
A man without hope is hopeless!!
July 24th, 2007 at 12:29
@ Karl. BTW I never said Liverpool had the best squad, just one that is becoming stronger.
July 24th, 2007 at 12:38
If heinze wants to leave us to join Liverpool then he can go as far as I am concerned and we can watch Roo and Ron screw him over.
But on the contrary I dont think he does and this will not happen, only a mad man would swap a MAN U
shirt for a scouse shirt. Soon as fergie sits with Heinze it will be all sorted.
Cant stand agents.
And finally liverpool are not great, they were great 20yrs ago! There must have benn some glitch in the matrix when the won the CL recently, but I think most teams can do well if there not involved on the title race, resting players all the time, as Arsenal have shown recently aswell reaching CL final 05/06
July 24th, 2007 at 12:52
Mmmm… Reasoning with scousers about football. A thankless and pointless task.
And one which inevitably degenerates into pointless blather about trophies won well over a decade ago.
Evra is a far better player than Heinze, who won his place on merit, has been one of our best players
in pre-season and is prepared to fight for his place without throwing toys out of the pram if he
doesn’t get picked (i.e. FA Cup Final).
We have plenty of top class cover all across our back line, there really isn’t any point worrying
about a 29 year-old, second-choice fullback who hasn’t been the same since he had his knee re-built.
Obviously hatred for Liverpool is what prevents Fergie from conceding on this one and, to an extent,
I feel the same.
But when all is said and done, he’s no great loss.Be off with you Heinze, you won’t be missed.
July 24th, 2007 at 13:05
Just to avoid disappointment……
18 Leagues, 5 European Cups, 7 Fa Cups, 7 League Cups, 3 UEFA Cups.
Football wasn’t invented in 1992.
July 24th, 2007 at 13:09
When was the last time you won one of theose 18 leagues? Just curious… can u just enlighten us please dave!!
July 24th, 2007 at 13:30
Football wasm’t invented in 1992 but, unfoirtunately for you chumps, it didn’t end there either.
July 24th, 2007 at 14:20
just to put the shoe on the other foot, if man utd wanted a liverpool player (very very few fit into this category - namely gerrard, torres, riise) and pursued him, how would benitez and all you scousers react??
July 24th, 2007 at 14:22
Nino
It would never happen, because our players feel a sence of loyalty
to the supporters
July 24th, 2007 at 14:25
“our players feel a sense of loyalty to the supporters” LMFAO!!!
Yeah, so long as that “sense of loyalty” is backed up by death-threats to friends and family, ’cause
that’s the only reason your club captain isn’t earning his living in West London.
July 24th, 2007 at 14:25
to DaveL22, we are only 2 titles behind you (which will certainly be made up over the next couple of seasons no doubt) and have won more FA cups. granted, we have only won two european cups compared to your five, but so have clubs like barca, juve, inter, porto… are you saying they are not super-clubs/european giants? as for the league and uefa cups, need i say more??
July 24th, 2007 at 14:29
You dont believe that do you sad twat? Stop reading the Sun.
If you could read, The big man himself stated in his book
that was all bollocks, A couple of kids burnt his shirt (not the
same as death threats). Besides he didnt go anyway - because of
sence of loyalty to the fans
July 24th, 2007 at 14:31
Great teams win the european cup. Thats why you have
same pedagree as as Nottingham Forest
July 24th, 2007 at 14:41
When was the last Liverpool showed some pedagree to win a league after 38 games.
July 24th, 2007 at 14:41
yes you may have won the cup in 2005, and come close this year, but only after putting all your eggs in one basket once you were out of contention for all the other competitions by christmas. in that regard, man utd, and even chelsea, could be considered far superior to you as they were both in contention for all the major honours until the very end of the season. note that a supposedly ‘fresh’ liverpool team needed extra time and penalties to squeeze past a jaded chelski team who played far more games than you, shows the gulf in class. anyway, i dont want to get drawn into an pointless argument about each others pedigree as the point of this thread was about gabriel heinze’s transfer situation.
July 24th, 2007 at 14:44
Hino - You are really scaping the barrel now mate. Bottom line is…
We now have the money to compete with you & Chelsea in trasfer
market, and youre worried. I dont blame you
July 24th, 2007 at 14:54
don’t know who this steve p is but he talks sense.
i’d pay serious money to get on alex red face’s
nerves. riise is rubbish, steve’s mum would give
him a run for his money
July 24th, 2007 at 14:59
no we are not at all worried in the slightest. i believe it is you scousers who should be, as benitez has proven time and time again that he doesn’t have a damn clue about transfer dealings, buying average, sometimes costly flops such as morientes, kromkamp, josemi, garcia, just like his predecessor…the list goes on…. arming him with a war chest will only make matters worse as he will waste large amounts of cash on unproven talents from spain, his favourite hunting ground. looking at his transfer patterns, he goes for quantity rather than quality, spending £6-7m each on three players for example, and then moving them on after one season e.g. bellamy, whereas man utd do the opposite and are willing to spend £18m on one player, who will be a mainstay of the team for many years to come e.g. hargreaves/carrick. if you had bought the likes of etoo, villa, gattuso, instead of babel, voronin, benayoun etc then maybe we might have batted an eyelid. as good as your recent purchases are, they are hardly leaving utd or chelski quaking in their boots…..
July 24th, 2007 at 15:03
4 Nino,
I was saying fcuk all about any other club. Just stating that Liverpool are….and you can qoute me on this fact if you so wish “THE Most Successful British Club in Football History”.
4 Mick….No it didn’t end in 1992. We won trophies in 2001, 2003, 2005, 2006.
5X.
July 24th, 2007 at 15:17
Dear Nino
All that effort - and all you can come up with is a total load of
wank.
Firstly Garcia was a quality player, I know you guys arent
normally involved in the Champions league after the 2nd round,
had you been, or if you actully knew anything at all aobut football
you would recognise his contribution to LFC. Josemi yes, Kromkamp yes,
BUT they both cost FUCK ALL anyway.
United on the other hand:
VERON 28 MILLION (Appauling peice of business - 13 Million LOSS
Carrick 18 Million ( Not fit to wipe of the residue of Alonso bell ens)
Saha - 12 Million (Total Shit)
Allan ‘the Toe Punt’ Smith 10 Million (no need to even make a comment)
I could go on - but dont think I need to
Benitez transfer policy has resolved around BUDGET available
Man utd policy is spend on loads of shit - in the hope soome might stick
July 24th, 2007 at 15:20
If Heinze really want to move to Liverpool, he will definitely go in January.
Pity though. He’s amazing. But, like Mick said, we’ll cope just fine.
July 24th, 2007 at 15:31
Dear Steve P
Your list is not quite complete. You forgot about:
Fletcher - Free (made a complete cock of ‘SG the great’ and the entire Liverpool midfield)
O’shea - Free (Showed Liverpool’s strikers how the job should be done)
I’m sorry to have started this crap, but can we focus on Heinze?
July 24th, 2007 at 15:35
HA HA - DO ME A FAVOUR
There’s a very good reason why those two players were free my man
Its because they both are fucking useless - surley you know that??
Dont you?
Really? Dont you?
July 24th, 2007 at 15:38
If you want to foc
July 24th, 2007 at 15:39
Steve P, to rephrase you…
On you assumtion that they are “fucking useless” and given they did that which I mentioned,
Then what does that say about Liverpool?
July 24th, 2007 at 15:55
Karl
When you say “lets focus on Heinze” - what you actully mean is
I am not winning this argument, can we chamge the subject please.
They are fucking useless - you know it - I know it.
Why dont you just add Kieron Richardson to the list and be done
with it
July 24th, 2007 at 16:01
Steve P, you still don’t reallise it, therefore I’ll spell it out to you:
what YOU are then actually saying is “Liverpool is fucking useless - you know it - I know it.
Shame
July 24th, 2007 at 16:03
Seeing that you’re not in the 21st century yet (seems like you’re reminiscing about the trophies you won in yonder years), Kieron does not play for ManUnited anymore, he plies his trade at Sunderland.
July 24th, 2007 at 16:08
Steve, do yourself a favour and don’t try to put meaning to my words. You can’t even understand what you yourself are saying.
July 24th, 2007 at 16:08
4 Karl,
That’s the basis of the whole debate….Whisky-Nose said….”Gabriel Heinze will not be joining Liverpool as far as I’m concerned.”
There is nothing the scottish Pr*ck can do to stop him, and why would he want to stop a player leaving when his agent has been told to “find another club”.
If Whisky-nose doesn’t think Liverpool are a threat, and Heinze isn’t good enough for United what is the fcucking problem!!
July 24th, 2007 at 16:11
DaveL22
SAF never said he did not want Heinze. He insisted that Heinze’s agent asked for a transfer, but he has not heard anything from Heinze yet. SAF wants him, he is good enough for the club, but if Heinze want to go, then he can go, providing the club can meet the evaluation, and of course, its not Liverpool.
July 24th, 2007 at 16:13
Why should he strenghten his competition?
July 24th, 2007 at 16:21
My understanding of the situation is that Heinze is not happy playing second fiddle to Evra. He or his agent approached the club to clarify the situation and was told that if the player wasn’t happy he should find another club, one that would match Manu’s valuation for the player.
He has done that ….Liverpool and now Fergie has turned turk and said well anyone other than Liverpool. What is he scared of????
July 24th, 2007 at 16:30
Everyone seems to be forgeting Eric Djemba-jemba, the next Cantona!
Must be a piss head n all or summit. Who does he play for now,
£7 million later? Everyone makes rubbish signings, ours have been
low key ‘cos of budget, neither Alex Red Whiskey Nose Face or Rafa
have spent very little on a world class player
(freebies don’t count). If anyone mention Flecther being better
than any Liverpool midfielder above the age of 7 then I’m not
playing anymore….
July 24th, 2007 at 16:35
“We now have the money to compete with you & Chelsea in trasfer(sic) market”
And this, my friends, is why it is utterly pointless to discuss football with scousers.
Since he took over at Liverpool, Benitez has spent between 20 and 30 million (depending on sources)
more than SAF in the same period of time. This summer is no different to last summer and the summer
before that. Rafa has spent huge sums of money in an attempt to catch up with United and Chelsea
and is no closer now than he ever has been.
Last summer, just like this summer, the press and the message-boards were full of triumphalist
scousers bleating that the title was within their grasp. The thing is, LFC been further off the pace
in the league with each season that goes by under Benitez. This is the naked emperor which none of
you scousers will acknowledge. Even Foolier was able to win the odd cup competition, for crying out
loud!
As for the Heinze scenario, Liverpool are one of the few teams in the league who stand a reasonable
change of taking points off United, if we don’t play to our potential. Fergie clearly thinks that
Heinze, our second-choice left full-back, will give Liverpool a better option than they have already
and increase their chance of nicking a point or two of us, over the course of the season.
This is why he wants to stop the transfer going ahead. It’s really quite simple.
July 24th, 2007 at 17:50
How i love liverpool fans!talk so much shite before the season starts but you all know that your team is way behind us.just coz u bought the most prolific striker from spain who scored an outstanding 14 goals in the league does not mean you can compete with united.not even close.benayoun?what kind of a signing is that.strength in depth?u all make me sick.just wait for the season to start!and your shite team is lagging behind the mighty manchester united.i have never read such a load of shite in my life
July 24th, 2007 at 18:43
I think Torres finished 9th in the scoring charts in Spain last year scoring 14 from about 35 meanwhile our 3rd or 4th choice striker averaged more than 1 every 2 games with a team that were in the Italian relegation zone. At least Torres had some decent players playing with him(Maxi, Aguero) and Atletico are laughing straight to the bank with the money. The man has never even played in Europe ffs.
July 24th, 2007 at 19:50
Steve P
Garcia a quality player? Agreed, he’s perhaps not as shite as the rest of them, and popped up with a goal here and then, but if he was so good, why was there no attempt made to persuade him to stay at Anfield? He lost the ball too many times and was a lightweight not suited to the prem.
Saha is twice the player that your one-dimensional “strikers” crouch, kuyt et al will ever be; and thats only when he’s half fit!
Carrick was part of one of the best, if not the best, midfield pairing in the prem last season and was a key factor in our successful title bid (sorry, its been quite a while since you guys have been involved in one…)
Like karl correctly states in post #78, a makeshift midfield pairing of giggs (a winger for god’s sake!) and the much maligned fletcher powered us to 2nd place in 05/06, over…wait for it….Liverpool and the mighty Stevie G and Alonso!
I could go and name more of Benitez’s average flops, but the season will have started by the time i’ll have finished.
Just to clarify the point of this entire thread, has Heinze actually stated HIMSELF that he wants to come to Liverpool????????? Anyone??????
July 24th, 2007 at 23:35
Alright guys enough of that. I guess I should have a post with Liverpool in the headline once every month just to get those scousers in and boost my comment count, without adding much value to the discussion, and to have some punching match in the comments section.
Anyway, my dear Pool supporters, thanks for visiting. We enjoyed the party. Time’s up. So, unless you have anything constructive to say about issues regarding United (which I believe you don’t) off with you.
July 24th, 2007 at 23:52
red ranter, im just wondering, what is the highest number of comments you have gotten from one post?
July 25th, 2007 at 1:19
come on people put this in context! if stevie g’s agent told rafa he wants a transfer and it was manu meeting the asking price. do think for one minute rafa or the bindipper fans would allow it? i dont thinks so. we dont sell players to liverpool and vice versa. steve p! you seem to of forgot that if it was for man u securing a place in europe and get far in the compertions over the years third rate teams like liverpool would not get the oppurtunity to play in europe! so give it a rest you scouse moron.!
July 25th, 2007 at 9:06
These Scousers are delusional. Most successful club in European history LOL. Ever head of REAL Madrid?
And while you are at it when did you win your last league title?
Heinze will be making a step down. If he ever makes the forbidden trip. But I back him not to.
July 25th, 2007 at 10:34
4 Keith Moses Kaira ii
Sorry mate, I can’t find any comment that says Liverpool are the most successful club in Europe, you must be on hallucinagenics…..
July 25th, 2007 at 13:47
Scousers got a lot to prove before they can say Liverpool are the most successful club in Europe. First of all, win the EPL title next season, which i doubt they will be able to do it etiher. btw the last time they won it, 1990? it was not even called English Premiership that time. and yes, if heinze ever joins liverpool, it will be his biggest mistake of his life.
July 25th, 2007 at 14:09
Alvin….
you are just another confused manc, as i previouslt said no-one in the thread has claimed Liverpool are the most successful team in europe.
in quote 80 I stated the FACT that Liverpool are the most successful club in British Football.
PEASE NOT THE WORD FACT, if you don’t understand use Wikipedia
July 25th, 2007 at 22:29
This is an article from last year on SL in which a ‘Pool fan talks about the upcoming season,kinda puts things in perspective
http://soccerlens.com/liverpool-20062007-season-preview/1318491.html
while we’re at it why not some more ‘Pool bashing articles
http://soccerlens.com/diver-gerrard-is-a-hypocrite/2244513.html
http://soccerlens.com/lucky-liverpool/1223/
(the last one is a defence of ‘Pool by one of their own fans but I put it in because I think it’s pretty good.)
July 25th, 2007 at 23:36
Heh!
1st Link: To be fair, hindsight is 20/20. Plenty United fans didn’t expect us to play so well.
2nd Link: Yes true. I hate the pretentiousness of some players. Henry is another case in point.
3rd Link: Good post.
But I guess in my article here I tried to avoid Pool bashing (apart from the opening lines) and talked from Heinze’s career perspective. Alas, you can’t avoid that, can you? You will always get the odd people unwilling to see through the bias and read the post for what it’s worth. Oh well…
July 26th, 2007 at 8:22
oh oh… Liam are the gloves coming off now?
July 26th, 2007 at 8:24
@ Davel 22, When was your last league title? Not almost 20 years ago? Yet you think being the most successfull club in “history makes you lot special at this moment in time?
Have you ever realised football is actually played in the present and not the past? And presently you are pretty unsuccessful domestically. Even Blackburn has more EPL’s than you. The “giants” of Britain. …………….
July 26th, 2007 at 8:25
I wrote a short article for Soccerlens regarding “Hypocrisy” of United. (Saw a couple of forum threads on Soccerlens that I didn’t like.)
Perhaps we can take it there if Ahmed decide to publish it.
July 26th, 2007 at 8:28
@Red Ranter,
“To be fair, hindsight is 20/20.”
Thats the whole point. They annot hide behind hindsight EVERY season.
July 26th, 2007 at 8:35
[karl]
Of course, Liverpool’s pre-season predictions are always like that. So much so that it’s become a joke for the last 17 years! So I guess we can just as well ignore their ‘claims of glory’.
About the article, you could publish it wherever, ask Ahmed. If he thinks it would better serve at SL then so be it. Or if he thinks it would suit RR then post it here.
July 26th, 2007 at 10:03
4 Keith Moses Kaira II
you’ve just contradicted yourelf there mate…..you whine on that history doesn’t matter then make a historical quote about Blackburn….Nice one just shows what a thick c**t you are!!
It doesn’t matter what the league is called be it the League championship , the Barclays Premiership, the EPL, Liverpool have still won the English top flight more times than Man united or any other club in the country.. and I wont even start on Europe!!! Keep trying you may soon be as successful as Liverpool. Til then LIVERPOOL FC IS THE MOST SUCCESSFUL CLUB IN ENGLISH FOOTBALL
July 26th, 2007 at 10:12
Dave!
Forget about the history. At this moment in time, not 20 years ago,
WE ARE THE REIGNING CHAMPIONS AND THE BIGGEST CLUB IN THIS COUNTRY, ARGUABLY IN THE WORLD. WE ARE THE NO.1 CLUB AT THE MOMENT.
And you will not get Heinze, so end of!!
July 26th, 2007 at 11:16
Real Madrid may have a point to argue there, but I concede, Man Utd. are the current champions (but that’s history too)and the biggest club in England (although size of club wasn’t really the debate).
I think the thread started off talking about Heinze, I can’t really remeber, i was directed here from another site.
I agree again, it doesn’t look at the moment like Heinze will come to Liverpool, although with lawyers and courts involved who can tell. The only information we get is from the press, and they portray THE TRUTH as they see it, or just make it up instead.
Unless the player himself actually makes a statement regarding his position at Man U or the intrest shown by Liverpool we’re all non-the-wiser.
I’ve enjoyed the banter on the forum and will depart to a site where I can talk about our history to others who appreciate it.
We’ll just have to wait and see what the new season brings with a bit of luck we’ll make it 19.
July 26th, 2007 at 12:24
@DaveL22
Heinze has not yet personally spoken about it.
Apparently SAF requires him to make a commitment (or so I’ve heard), but this means we should hear from him any time soon about what he feel his plans are.
Perhaps he’ll want to go to Liverpool, but SAF will not allow that, so should he want to go, the earliest he can be expected at Anfield will be in January. The reason being, he can buy out his contract then…however I speak under correction.
July 26th, 2007 at 15:53
CONSPIRACY THEORY!!!
——————–
Heinze is a brilliant footballer. He is one of the best left-backs in the PL.
I belive that £6m is a reasonable price. In fact, I think it is a bit of a steal for a player of his calibre.
Am I the only one that suspect this, or do you guys agree that it seems a bit strange that only Liverpool made a formal offer for his services?
Thinking about it last night, I figured that there are a lot of teams looking for good defenders.
Newcastle for starters…what about Madrid? I mean, really now, Heinze would be able to walk into almost any team in the PL…he could even walk into most teams in Europe… Why is there only 1 bid from Liverpool?
It can either be:
a) The price is too much - This will mean Liverpool are stressing over an over-priced player??? Doubt Benitez is that stupdid???
b) The player/agent don’t really want a move - which means they’re pushing for salary increase
c) Heinze really want to join Liverpool - Why then
1) have he not come out publicly himself?
2) if they’ve been pushing this for about a year and a half now, then he must have wanted to go 6months after he signed a contract. This must mean he is an lifelong Liverpool supporter, or something. Why then did he sign for arch-rivals United?
No matter which way you look at it, something is not right.
I think it’s about more salary
July 26th, 2007 at 23:02
He probably doesn’t even want to move at all, he said he just wanted to know if he’s going to be playing much, and if not he might have to leave, which seems fair enough…
July 27th, 2007 at 7:38
The playing more part is also confusing. Why then move to Liverpool when everybody knows Rafa has a rotational policy which means no one plays regularly? It does not make sense to me.
July 27th, 2007 at 15:01
Heinze has employed a Lawyer to sot his move to liverpool out.
http://www.redissue.co.uk/news/loadnews.asp?cid=TMNW&id=345257